The Weight Loss Lie Dave Asprey Says Is Keeping You Stuck

Summary

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Podcast Summary: "The Weight Loss Lie Dave Asprey Says Is Keeping You Stuck"

Biohack-it with Iman Hasan
Guest: Dave Asprey
Release Date: January 8, 2026

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Episode Theme & Overview

This episode features biohacker and entrepreneur Dave Asprey, discussing why traditional weight loss advice—“eat less and work out more”—is a harmful myth, alongside insights on biohacking, personal transformation, nervous system regulation, relationships, supplements, and the future of longevity. Asprey vulnerably shares his experience with obesity, family betrayal, and his own journey rewiring the mind and body using unconventional and cutting-edge methods. The conversation is peppered with practical tips, cautionary tales, and memorable anecdotes about everything from supplements to psychedelics, all delivered in his characteristically candid and irreverent style.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. The Weight Loss Lie & Dave’s Backstory (00:00–04:12)

• Challenging Weight Loss Dogma:
  • Dave denounces the common advice “eat less and work out more,” sharing that despite eating less and exercising intensely, he remained overweight.
    • "Eat less and work out more. It's bad advice. I eat the least of any of my friends and I work out more than all of them... and I'm still fat." (00:00–00:12)
  • He describes being diagnosed with arthritis at 14 and struggling with his weight despite extreme dedication.
    • “...I went to the gym 90 minutes a day, six days a week... never lost an inch and I never lost a pound.” (03:02–03:19)
• The Turning Point:
  • After repeated injuries and frustration, Dave realizes the advice isn’t working, and calls out the “mean-spirited lie” of calorie restriction and over-exercise.
• Self-Compassion:
  • Dave’s mantra: “Don’t be a jerk to yourself.”
  • He shares that he no longer has a “mean voice” in his head thanks to neurofeedback and deep work on his nervous system.

2. The Biology of Stress and Energy Regulation (05:30–07:49)

• The Role of Mitochondria & Nervous System:
  • Explains how the body's response to stress isn’t just psychological—biological energy balance is key.
  • Breathwork, environment optimization, and vagal nerve stimulation are recommended to regulate the nervous system.
    • “You won't be in fight or flight if your body does a great job of making energy.” (06:17–06:21)
    • Simple exercise: “Breathe in for four seconds and then breathe out for eight... [it] will surprisingly shift things.” (07:29–07:39)

3. Psychedelics and Altered States for Growth (07:49–12:50)

• Early Adoption & Caution:
  • Dave recounts his journey with holotropic breathwork and ayahuasca, emphasizing intentionality and the risks of casual or repeated use.
    • “It’s a sacred medicine and has a very big dark side.” (09:47–09:52)
  • He ranks neurofeedback and breathwork above psychedelics for personal development.
    • “Neurofeedback and breath work would be my top two; psychedelics would be the third...” (10:54–10:58)
• The Importance of Integration:
  • Emphasizes that transformation requires integrating lessons learned from altered states, not repeated ceremonies.
    • “If you do plant medicine and you don't write it down or talk to someone and do the integration work, well, your mitochondrial intelligence gets all the knowledge, but it has the ability to make you forget stuff.” (12:50–13:21)

4. Personal Transformation & Relationships (14:18–19:24)

• Impact on Family & Boundaries:
  • Dave shares how personal growth can strain relationships, recounting family betrayal and the necessity of strong boundaries.
    • “I straight up divorced my sister. Like my only sibling, tried to steal one of my companies, full on white collar crime... I’m not angry, I’m holding boundaries.” (15:31–16:39)
• Intuition and Polarity:
  • Discussion on masculine/feminine polarity—men create safety, women bring peace.
  • Recommends Kasia Urbaniak’s A Woman’s Guide to Power for understanding women’s needs and societal conditioning. (22:21–23:15)
• Dating and Energy:
  • Dave on relationships: “It’s very easy for me to date because I have a well regulated nervous system.” (18:04–18:11)
  • He values being single and having boundaries; says detachment from fear of being alone leads to healthier choices.

5. Motivation, Freedom, and the Myth of Willpower (24:25–28:17)

• Freedom vs. Control:
  • Dave reframes his journey as one centered on freedom, not strict discipline. Describes overcoming OCD, chronic fatigue, and oppositional defiant disorder.
  • Realizes happiness isn’t in external achievements—money, fame, marriage—but internal work.
• Laziness as an Advantage:
  • Advocates for “practicing extreme laziness” to save energy, arguing innovation is driven by the desire to reduce effort.
    • “All innovation in the world has been, I don’t want to wash my clothes by hand. I’ll make a dishwasher... that's interesting. That’s a problem. I can solve that problem. So my discipline comes entirely from wanting to save energy.” (27:00–28:17)

6. Supplements, Nutrition, & Biohacking Industry Critique (29:49–38:47)

• Essentials for Mitochondrial Health:
  • Emphasizes two foundational supplements for everyone: a mix of fat-soluble vitamins (A, D, K, E) and a broad-spectrum minerals supplement.
    • “If you don’t have those, your mitochondria won’t work and neither will thousands of other things in your body.” (29:55–30:12)
  • Advocates personalized supplementation based on blood tests and genetics.
• Ingredient Quality & Gripes:
  • Warns about supplement quality—avoiding titanium dioxide, artificial colorings, synthetic vitamin forms (e.g., folic acid, beta carotene).
    • “Beta carotene is stupid. You want to take real vitamin A, which is called retinol, because most people can't convert beta carotene into vitamin A.” (37:16–37:28)
    • “Folic acid, we should ban that stuff. It is the worst thing ever…” (37:38–37:43)
• Critiques of the Biohacking Industry:
  • Proud of biohacking’s growth but critical of divisiveness, exclusionary marketing (“biohacking is just for men/rich people”), and poor science.
    • “Women are better biohackers than men. And then they say, there aren’t that many female biohackers. I’m like, have you listened to my show?” (40:13–40:24)

7. Cutting-Edge Longevity and "Cheating" Death (41:10–44:07)

• Gene Therapy, Stem Cells, and Reversal Experiments:
  • Dave discusses his use of gene therapies (Follistatin, VEGF, Clotho) and advanced stem cell procedures.
    • “I had every joint in my body... injected with stem cells taken from my bone marrow and fat. That was brutal. Now I go out of the US...” (42:11–42:13)
  • Shares openly about fat removal surgery after weight loss, dismissing accusations of “cheating.”
    • “Do you drive to work? You're cheating. You should walk. Shame, shame, shame. Like, come on, guys.” (43:53–44:07)

8. Women’s Health & Aging Innovations (45:16–46:52)

• Rapamycin, Metformin, and Alternative Interventions:
  • Dave is skeptical of longevity drugs like rapamycin and metformin, citing lack of sufficient evidence, preferring novel interventions like ovarian tissue banking for women.
    • “If I was a woman and... young, I would want to... put it in a tissue bank, frozen. And then when perimenopause starts, reimplant that back in your ovaries...” (45:41–45:57)
  • Explores the unique role of ovarian mitochondria in female intuition.

9. Ancient Wisdom vs. Western Science (48:12–50:57)

• Ayurveda and Esoteric Traditions:
  • Argues for respecting 5,000 years of wisdom from ancient systems like Ayurveda, credits eastern and shamanic teachings for breakthroughs.
    • “Ayurveda will kick your ass. There's 5,000 years of wisdom there and not everything makes sense to us because we see things through a very western linear approach.” (48:22–48:42)

10. Cultivating Conscious Relationships & Community (52:10–56:08)

• Loneliness and Discernment:
  • Advises listeners to “get really comfortable being lonely” as a prerequisite for finding healthy relationships, warning that fear leads to toxic connections.
    • “It's fear of being alone that makes you choose people who are not the wrong people.” (52:36–52:41)
  • Detecting envy in relationships: Look for subtle energetic cues when you share successes.

11. Influences & Leadership Philosophy (56:08–58:23)

• Inspirations:
  • Draws inspiration from historical figures like Ben Franklin, Royal Rife, Jack Welch, and especially Elon Musk’s ruthless organizational methods.
    • “His perspective on how do you make a company efficient is freaking brilliant. ...like watching a samurai at work.” (57:49–57:59)
• Psychedelics for Business Leaders:
  • Mentions how leaders, like Musk, may use psychedelics for creative decision-making.

12. Advice on Psychedelics and Sexuality as Altered States (60:18–65:44)

• Choosing the Right Psychedelic:
  • Recommends starting with mushrooms or MDMA (depending on intent), progressing to LSD, DMT, or ayahuasca only when “called.”
    • “For a lot of people... mushrooms or MDMA depending on your goals... after you've done those... then smoking some DMT is probably a good idea.” (60:27–61:22)
• Sex as a Gateway to Altered States:
  • Elevates tantric/conscious sex as a powerful, often-overlooked tool for transformation.
    • “There is very few things on earth that will get you more into your body than a good orgasm.” (63:06–63:10)
  • Discusses the physiological benefits and nuances of sexuality for men and women, and the shame that surrounds it.
    • “For men, ejaculating frequently does cause problems. ...for women, right, orgasms don't diminish you at all. They actually power you up.” (64:06–64:41)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “Eat less and work out more. It's bad advice.” — Dave Asprey (00:00)
• “Having judgment about supplements is dumb.” — Dave Asprey (33:59)
• “Don't be a jerk to yourself.” — Dave Asprey (04:12)
• “Biohacking is just a Trojan horse to get people to pay attention to longevity and consciousness work.” — Dave Asprey (13:30)
• “Women are better biohackers than men.” — Dave Asprey (40:13)
• “All innovation in the world has been, I don't want to wash my clothes by hand. I'll make a dishwasher... So my discipline comes entirely from wanting to save energy.” — Dave Asprey (27:00–28:17)
• “Ayurveda will kick your ass. There's 5,000 years of wisdom there.” — Dave Asprey (48:22)
• “There are very few things on earth that will get you more into your body than a good orgasm.” — Dave Asprey (63:06)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

| Segment | Timestamp | |-----------------------------------------------------|---------------------------------| | The weight loss myth & Dave’s early struggles | 00:00–04:12 | | The biology of energy, stress, mitochondria | 05:30–07:49 | | Psychedelics, altered states, and integration | 07:49–12:50 | | Trauma, boundaries, and family betrayal | 14:18–16:39 | | Relationships, polarity, and dating after growth | 18:04–24:25 | | Freedom vs. discipline and lazy innovation | 24:25–28:17 | | Supplements: essentials, quality, and pitfalls | 29:49–38:47 | | Biohacking industry critiques | 38:29–41:10 | | Longevity: gene therapy, stem cells, “cheating” | 41:10–44:07 | | Women’s health, ovarian aging, and intuition | 45:16–46:52 | | Ancient wisdom vs. Western science | 48:12–50:57 | | Cultivating community and checking for envy | 52:10–56:08 | | Influences & Elon Musk’s management | 56:08–58:23 | | Psychedelics for transformation & consciousness | 60:18–62:30 | | Sex as gateway to healing & energy management | 62:37–65:44 |

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Tone & Style

• Candid, direct, irreverent—Dave pulls no punches, combining humor (sometimes dark), science, and personal anecdotes.
• Empowering, practical—Offers clear steps, encourages radical self-responsibility and self-compassion.
• Critical, evidence-oriented—Not afraid to debunk industry myths, call out bad advice, and challenge listeners to question assumptions.
• Holistic & unconventional—Blends Western science, ancient spiritual traditions, and cutting-edge self-experimentation.

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Conclusion & Actionable Takeaways

• Question accepted dogma, especially around weight, wellness, and supplements.
• Address stress and energy holistically: physical, psychological, and environmental.
• Prioritize self-compassion, set boundaries, and embrace loneliness to grow.
• Integrate (don’t just consume) personal growth work—especially with plant medicines.
• Choose relationships and wellness interventions based on discernment and energy, not fear or “shoulds.”
• Consider personalized supplementation and radical systemization for health, but beware of industry hype.
• Don’t overlook sex and ancient tradition as pathways to healing and optimization.
• Start simple and gentle with psychedelics or altered states—never out of peer pressure or trendiness.

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For the full, unfiltered Dave Asprey experience, this episode delivers both myth-busting and life-upgrading wisdom—whether for biohackers, skeptics, or anyone stuck in the endless cycle of modern health advice.

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Transcript

[Dave Asprey]

Eat less and work out more. It's bad advice. I eat the least of any of my friends and I work out more than all of them in combination. And I'm still fat. Having judgment about supplements is dumb. And if you're like, well, I should get all of my nutrients from my food. Your food doesn't have nutrients in it. Cuz the soil doesn't have nutrients in it. I just want to have the energy and the focus and a brain that doesn't turn off in the middle of the day with no excuse.

[Podcast Host]

Dave, I'm so excited to sit down and talk to you. You have been such an inspiration to me on my own biohacking journey. And if it wasn't for your work, I don't think I'd be in the space. So I read your book 2019, which is superhuman. 2018. I did game Changers.

[Dave Asprey]

Wow, you even did Game Changers. That was my highest number of stars of all the books, like 4.9 or something.

[Podcast Host]

And it was so incredibly motivating because you literally interviewed some of the biggest names in the space who are so, like, powerful and at the head of their game. And you broke them down into their habits, what they're doing and how they're optimizing themselves.

[Dave Asprey]

It's, it's so cool that that was helpful for you because I was kind of bummed that one sold, but it wasn't one of my bigger books. I'm like, this is, this is like reading 25 personal development books. It was the hardest of all my books to write too, but, oh well.

[Podcast Host]

But it was one of the biggest inspirations. So thank you for putting that incredible workout and thank you for continuing to do incredible work.

[Dave Asprey]

You know, the number of people that I just met at the conference here in Miami who had stories, it's really touching. And then a few days before we were recording this, I got to interview the commissioner of the FDA on stage. And if you'd have told me 10 years ago that they would ever let me in the same building with someone from the fda, I would have never believed it. But I'm actually really, really excited by the direction that we're going with our health. We've got a lot of work to do, but I feel like we may be broken through some things that were congested.

[Podcast Host]

So I wanted to bring up this picture because this guy, ah, yeah, I'm.

[Dave Asprey]

A good old fat pitcher.

[Podcast Host]

This guy was the one that maybe you would have never imagined would be who he is today.

[Dave Asprey]

Oh, it's totally funny. You found a Good one there. That's one of my less common ones. But people still to this day, they're like, dad, you were never 300 pounds. I'm like, how about my pictures from Entrepreneur magazine when I'm 23? Is that enough of proof? No. So, yeah, guys, I was never fat. It turns out I've just always been lean and ripped and 6% body fat. Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

What inspired that guy to get started on his journey? Because everybody knows you as Dave Asprey now. And unless you've read your original work, which I've dived into, they might not know. What was that pivotal moment in your life that you were like, I can't live like this anymore.

[Dave Asprey]

Well, there's, there's a couple of them. They diagnosed me with arthritis and I was 14 in my knees, like, is that what old people get? And just said, well, you know, enjoy your soccer. It's going to hurt. Like, okay. But by the time I'm 23, I've had three knee surgeries. I'm thinking, all right, I have to lose this weight. I've been exercising. I've been on a low fat, low calorie diet. I went to the gym 90 minutes a day, six days a week without fail for 18 months. And I went on a low fat, semi vegetarian. I'd eat meat sometimes, but really strict diet. I never lost an inch and I never lost a pound. I'm sure I put on some muscle underneath all the fat, but, oh my God, it was so frustrating. And then I decided I would do something that was maybe higher risk for the knee and I blew my knee out again playing laser tag. This sucks. Like, I did everything to the extent you could possibly do it. And I just realized this isn't working. Same thing. I'm sitting with my, my thin friends out of Carl's Jr. And they're eating double western bacon cheeseburgers. I'm like, oh, the chicken salad with no chicken and no dressing. And I eat the least of any of my friends and I'm the biggest. And I work out more than all of them in combination. Like more than six people and I'm still fat. Maybe it's lack of effort or maybe it's just not working. And this mean spirited lie that it's eat less and work out more. It's bad advice.

[Podcast Host]

Right? You in Your book in 2018 said, don't be a jerk to yourself.

[Dave Asprey]

That's a really good piece of advice.

[Podcast Host]

And do you still apply that to yourself today when you're having really hard days?

[Dave Asprey]

Oh, I don't have a mean voice in my head anymore. It's totally gone. I truly don't completely. Yeah. I've spent six months of my life with electrodes glued to my head. Each week is equal to 10, 20, 30 years of meditation. So literally anything that triggers me, okay, I'm gonna go work on that. And you can turn off the alerts. It's like if you went to your phone and you turned off all of the things From SMS and TikTok and Instagram or whatever else pops up, nothing's gonna pop up. And if something did, you'd say, oh, that's weird. Let me go into the settings and turn that off. It's just not worth having a mean voice in your head. It's not even you, it's someone else. And people sometimes go, that can't be. Well, your body has a voice and it has motivations that come from mitochondria. And you have your conscious brain and they're actually different with different goals. And we think that we are both voices. Once you sort that out, you can train your mitochondrial network pretty much to be like a service dog instead of like the Labrador that pees on your couch and eats all your food and barks at the neighbors.

[Podcast Host]

And for people who are listening and their body is in fight or flight and they're hyper alert and they're super vigilant and they're like, dave, how do we even calm down our nervous system to be able to train our mitochondria to that extent?

[Dave Asprey]

You should just try to calm down. It's like the worst thing.

[Podcast Host]

Snap your fingers and just be like, zen.

[Dave Asprey]

Isn't it funny how that just doesn't work?

[Podcast Host]

Right, right.

[Dave Asprey]

But we still tell ourselves that. So how does the body really decide to be stressed or not? It looks at the environment around you. And this isn't about you thinking about the environment around you. It's your body sensing the environment around you. And it says, what's my energy balance? Are there things that the body perceives as stressors? Is it too hot? Is it too cold? Is it bright in the middle of the night? Are you indoors and you never got any sunshine? Are you eating foods that actually are slightly poisonous to your mitochondria over time? And you won't be in fight or flight if your body does a great job of making energy. Because I've got enough energy to handle anything today. And that's why it's called danger coffee. Like, danger, who knows what you might do? I actually feel good again. And that's because of the minerals and the coffee. But even if you have enough energy, you can still have programming and beliefs that are a problem. So if you have a story in your head, I'm not worthy, Nobody loves me. You know, I'm a worm, whatever your thing is. Well, you can address those beliefs, but those are not the most common cause of feeling anxious and stressed. It's biological dysfunction. And your body's like, I'm freaking out here. You're telling me to go harder and I'm not safe.

[Podcast Host]

Right.

[Dave Asprey]

If you can address that, first with your environment, and secondly with some kind of therapy or trauma resolution. And you might want to use some biohacks like vagal nerve stimulation is one way to do that. Breath work in Heavily Meditated, which is my most recent book, I go through all the different techniques for putting yourself in different altered states, including the one that makes you chill out. So if the voice in your head is really mean, do one of those techniques, like breathe in for four seconds and then breathe out for eight. And doing that a few times will surprisingly shift things. Maybe the voice in your head will be quieter. Certainly your nervous system will calm down, the body calms down, mind calms down.

[Podcast Host]

And when you talk about all this stuff and all this personal development that you had that brought you to this state, how much of a role did psychedelics or plant medicine play in your evolution?

[Dave Asprey]

Well, altered states played a very big role in my evolution. If you'd have told me when I was 28 that the world was as weird as it is, I said, no, the world is logical. I'm a computer science guy.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah, exactly.

[Dave Asprey]

Like, this is dumb and you're in a cult. So then I did holotropic breath work. I was like, oh, my God, things are way more complex than I thought.

[Podcast Host]

Right.

[Dave Asprey]

And then I also did. I did ayahuasca in 1999, and this was before tourists would ever do it. I went down and they said, dave, you're white. I'm like, yeah, I know. And it's for locals. Yeah. So I went and I found a shaman in Peru. In Peru, yeah. And I. I had a ceremony, and it was. I say it was interesting, but I don't know that I. I don't know that I went as deep as I probably should have gone. And since that time, I've actually done shamanic training, and I'm very familiar with medicine space, and I can do things like that. But I actually. I kind of feel bad that at the beginning of the biohacking movement, I mentioned that Trip to Peru to do ayahuasca, just as a little pebble for people like, oh, maybe this guy is also doing consciousness, because I couldn't bring up some of the conscious work that I do and all the other stuff like butter and coffee and lasers on your brain, because people already thought I was pretty weird, Right? So there's like a timed release of these things. The problem is that some people like, oh, ayahuasca, yay. And then it's not a party drug. I think you want to do it in the jungle with people who are trained originally. I think it's actually kind of dangerous. And it makes me. It makes me uncomfortable when I hear some of these influencers saying, bro, I've done ayah 87 times.

[Podcast Host]

It's crazy, right?

[Dave Asprey]

It's like, when are you going to notice it's not working? Like, it's a sacred medicine and has a very big dark side. And that's the shaman's job, is to be a firewall to keep the dark stuff out. Well, the female side of the plant does the work. So. How do you say all that in an Instagram post? I don't know, but. So that was part of it. And I've done all of the medicines except for ibogaine.

[Podcast Host]

Are you curious about that one?

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah, it's on my to do list. Yeah. In fact, it's already booked for Q1.

[Podcast Host]

So where are you going to be going to to try it?

[Dave Asprey]

I'm going to go down to a clinic in Mexico.

[Podcast Host]

Amazing. Same one that Mark just went to?

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah, Surprisingly, I just talked to Mark and he'd gone to it and. And it's one of those things where this is one of the more dangerous drugs from a cardiac perspective. So I'm not doing that drug unless I have an EKG and a crash team, because I'm not crazy, even though lots of people have done it without that. So it's also not about checking the list. Like, I want to try the whole set. These aren't playing cards. When I'm doing this, it's always intentional. It's always. It's always work. But by far, I've seen the most things and had the most development from neurofeedback. So neurofeedback and breath work would be my top two psychedelics would be the third, and I'd be most cautious with ibogaine and Aya. And if you're saying, but I want to do I no just smoke some DMT? It's very simple. It's only 15 minutes less risk. Okay.

[Podcast Host]

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[Dave Asprey]

Beautiful. Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

And my big thing is that it's not the ceremony itself. It's a work after. So it's not about drinking it 100 times or 60 times, 70 times. It's about the integration and really taking those lessons and applying them to real life.

[Dave Asprey]

What they don't tell you in the world of psychedelics. Earlier I talked about how your mitochondria have their own awareness and heavily meditated. Became the number one best selling philosophy book in the country. Which is weird for a meditation book because I have a unique perspective on the origins of the ego. I think it's a emergent behavior from mitochondria just trying to stay alive. So if you look at that, if you do plant medicine and you don't write it down or talk to someone and do the integration work, well, your mitochondrial intelligence gets all the knowledge, but it has the ability to make you forget stuff.

[Podcast Host]

Correct.

[Dave Asprey]

The ego is in charge of forgetfulness, at least in Buddhism. So I've seen this over and over in people doing 40 years of Zen, which in involves ketamine if you want it to. And so they have these amazing breakthroughs and 10 minutes later, like their ego's completely erased it. Like, no, no, no. And the integration brings it back into your consciousness so you get to be more in charge. I think if you're doing these medicines 87 times, you're actually becoming less in charge and making your ego stronger. And you'll never see your ego when it's stronger because that's the nature of ego. And it's so weird. People like, what is this biohacker talking about? Ego biohacking is just a Trojan horse to get people to pay attention to longevity and consciousness work. And it turns out setting up the environment around you and inside of you so you have a body that works is a nice side benefit to being more conscious and living a long time.

[Podcast Host]

Do you think consciousness also. Obviously it impacted a lot of your personal relationships. But as you started shifting and changing, did some of your closest relationships also not be able to recognize you for who you were becoming? Or were they supportive?

[Dave Asprey]

You know, very few people who go on a personal development path will have supportive families. Like, if your parents were hippies and they've been doing it their whole life, good for you. And like, you're very lucky. But for the most part, your family is going to think you're nuts. Even when I started losing weight.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Dave Asprey]

Oh, you're losing too much weight. I'm like, fuck off. I'm not losing too much weight. I've been trying to do this for like years.

[Podcast Host]

It's finally working.

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah, no, I don't look too thin. I like buying new pants. Right. And so it's okay that people who know you one way, they actually feel threatened when they see you changing because maybe it means that they might have to change too. And they're going to be resistance. So it's normal. And I'd say it's even healthy when you start having some kind of. I'm going to do an introspective process. Some people won't like it. Even if you don't do an introspective process, some people won't like you. Maybe it doesn't matter.

[Podcast Host]

It doesn't really matter what people think. And when it came to letting go of certain personal relationships, looking back, would you have done things differently?

[Dave Asprey]

I would have done it sooner.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Dave Asprey]

Like, I straight up divorced my sister. Like my only sibling, tried to steal one of my companies, full on white collar crime, premeditated, all this kind of stuff. I'm like, are you serious?

[Podcast Host]

That's insane.

[Dave Asprey]

It's totally insane. So I write about this in heavily meditated because there's two traumas that adults usually go through, and one is injustice and the other one is betrayal. And when there's someone who you've trusted, Correct. Who you think is working for you and isn't, and then they stab you in the back, that actually leaves marks. This is why the process at 40 years in, I would say it saved my life. I mean, how do you, how do you let go of that? How do you ever adjust people again? Well, you run through the forgiveness, the reset process there. It's eight steps, and I did it with electrodes on my head. And I can see it for what it is. Envy, greed, and whatever. Fear not. Yeah, not my problem. But the reality is I have good boundaries. And I know that when you're dealing with narcissism, there's a step by step recipe for how to deal with narcissists. You don't talk to them again. And it doesn't matter if they're blood relatives or not.

[Podcast Host]

Right?

[Dave Asprey]

So I'm not angry, I'm not holding a grudge, but I'm holding boundaries. And it's funny because the more narcissistic or codependent someone is, the more they get angry when you have a boundary without being mad, because their whole goal is to make you mad. But understanding these things about the world, man, you have a lot more peace if you can look at someone's behavior without the voice in your head going and without your nervous system getting all tweaked.

[Podcast Host]

And that is where the regulation is so important. So that's why I think your work with 40 years of Zen and heavily meditated was so profound. Because it helps people go back into their body and drown out the outside noise to be like, what is really going on here? And is this my programming and my belief systems, or is this actually something that I shouldn't be participating in?

[Dave Asprey]

It's always helpful to have a few really conscious friends or a good therapist. You should always double check your, your judgments, your assessments. Or possibly if you're in a healthy relationship, your partner can be a good sounding board. And I would say if you're a guy, ask the women in your life. Women are generally more intuitive than men. Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Do you, when it comes to personal relationships, have you felt that meeting a partner now is easier or harder because you've. Wait, you've kind of shifted through all these levels of consciousness. Right. So is it easier for you to pick up on somebody when you meet them? Or actually it's like, hey, I know too much and it's almost like harder. You know what I mean?

[Dave Asprey]

That's a really cool question. So it's very easy for me to date because I have a well regulated nervous system.

[Podcast Host]

Right.

[Dave Asprey]

And there's, in fact I'm, I'm thinking about doing a class for men to just teach a technique for how to give a good hug. Like there's a thing that you can do with your energy field that shows someone who you are.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Dave Asprey]

And it's, it's very noticeable when you hug someone the right way, they, they'll melt. Right. And it's, it's like the unconscious handshake between two people where you like, who is this person?

[Podcast Host]

Right.

[Dave Asprey]

So dating's not a problem. And also plus like I'm well known and tall, you know, it's not that hard. But yeah, finding people that I want to date. There's all kinds of interesting people, but I'm not, I'm not that interested in a long term relationship right now. I just got out of a two year girlfriend boyfriend situation.

[Podcast Host]

Right, so you just focused on you.

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah. And ended really beautifully and you know, no one did anything bad. But yeah, I'm too busy. And yeah, like it's almost like having a part time job to have a girlfriend.

[Podcast Host]

So I think it's really important to have the right relationships in your life. Because of wrong relationships or when something is finished, it just drains you.

[Dave Asprey]

Oh, totally.

[Podcast Host]

And I think that's where a lot of people get stuck in this loop because it comes back to fear and am I not good enough? And then the ego plays into it and they're like, wait, I'm okay.

[Dave Asprey]

It's funny. I was talking with my kids and it's like, oh no, what does it mean if she doesn't like me? Like, well, okay, let me ask you this. Do you like pizza or tacos? And then, you know, they pick one. Kids actually don't eat very much of either.

[Podcast Host]

Right.

[Dave Asprey]

But okay, you like pizza. Great. So if you're the taco, what does it say about tacos? Nothing. It means you like pizza. So it doesn't matter if someone likes you. It truly doesn't. Okay. It's not about you, it's about them. And I feel that way. And so yeah, whenever I decide I want a long term relationship, I'll look around and it'll, it'll appear when it, you know, but I'm not, not on the, not on the path for that.

[Podcast Host]

When you're alone and no one needs anything from you, who do you feel you truly are?

[Dave Asprey]

That's A weird question. Do you think that I'm different when people need things from me than when I'm truly alone?

[Podcast Host]

But you know, do you think. No. But I always wonder because sometimes who I have to show up at work as a CEO, as a founder, and everybody expects so much from me. Right, Right.

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

It's a version of myself that has to show up when I'm actually alone in quiet and I can just be by myself. Then I'm able to soften a little bit more.

[Dave Asprey]

Oh, okay. It's different because you're a woman and women CEOs and I support a lot of very powerful women CEOs who've been through 40 years in and some who are my dear friends. It's like you're sitting in a masculine energy all day long and pushing. Right. And at the end of the day, you have to soften. Otherwise it's actually really hard for you. And for a male CEO, it's a little bit different because we're going to sit in our masculine anyway. But one of the guys I just had on my show, Adam Lane Smith, I think it was his last name, talks about there being four kinds of safety that men bring and four kinds of peace that women bring in relationships and that most of us don't know how to do at least two of those four kinds. So what's going on is you need to be able to drop into that side of peace. So developing the ability to switch states or switch polarities effortlessly is really important. And that's been a part of my work on more of the Eastern mysticism, the esoteric kind of stuff. So all polarities that exist allow life to be. You can't have light without dark. Man, woman, you know, teacher, student, all of the things that are out there and all of them you can switch between. And the reason that it's hard to switch is fear. So when you're absolutely unafraid to go into your full on, like, I will kill you if you don't do what I say versus take me, you know, whatever the opposite is for you, if you're safe in all those states. And most of us along the way, get a message from society or parents or teachers or coaches or whatever that it's not safe to do that. In fact, my favorite author for women of all time is Kasia Urbanayuk. And I bought her book for hundreds of friends. It's called A Woman's Guide to Power. And in fact, I had dinner with her last night. Funny enough. Um, she was teaching a class in Miami Here. So in Kasha's work, she says, look, here's why society tells women you're either too much or not enough. And you've learned this when you're very young, to the point that it's very hard to even know what you really need. You ask for what you're supposed to need instead of what you actually need. And she has a process to teach women. Here's how to tap into what you really want instead of what you think you want. And it's profound. I've seen so much growth in people. So explain comes down to, do you feel safe that you generate yourself and then safe to be fully relaxed at home and then fully strong in whatever position you are at work and just be okay with it? Or is one of them have, like, an edge?

[Podcast Host]

Right. And that's, I think, what women find so hard, navigating between and shifting between. And that's why the right sort of partnerships and the environments they're in are so important. So who are they working with? Who are their colleagues, but also who they choose as a partner?

[Dave Asprey]

Oh, 100%. If you want to be really successful, have a great partner. Right.

[Podcast Host]

I was going to ask you, do you ever feel the person who's just expected to know everything and have all the answers at all times?

[Dave Asprey]

But I actually do.

[Podcast Host]

Okay, Dave the narcissist is coming out.

[Dave Asprey]

I'm very happy to say that I don't know the answer, and quite often I don't. And it's funny, the things that I'm curious about, I tend to really know. And because I was a computer hacker and I'm a systems thinker, and maybe because I used to have autism, like, if it's my domain, I can figure it out, really. I know. But if you want to know something about who played baseball when I'm pretty sure baseball is a thing with the bat, like, I just don't care. I know it is. It's just not. None of my consciousness goes there. And if you play baseball, full respect, like, great, but it's just not what I think about. So I'm either 100% or zero.

[Podcast Host]

It's all in or nothing for you. A lot of your work centers around discipline and being controlled and having that discipline on yourself. Was there an early part of your childhood that you felt that you completely were not in control or could not be disciplined?

[Dave Asprey]

That's such an interesting perspective. I actually think my life revolves around freedom.

[Podcast Host]

You think?

[Dave Asprey]

Which is the other side of the polarity of control.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Dave Asprey]

And because I had chronic Fatigue syndrome for so long. I grew up with OCD and something called odd. You know about that one?

[Podcast Host]

No.

[Dave Asprey]

Oppositional defiant disorder.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Dave Asprey]

This is like having that rage against the machine f you out, do what you don't. That song's playing all the time in your head. Anytime a teacher, a parent tells you to do something before you can think, you're like, no, no. So that's not good. And it's caused strangely by having toxic mold in your house that triggers chronic strep throat, which triggers an immune reaction to a neurotransmitter. No, not to some kind of nerve. I forget. But anyway, yeah, that's known as called pandas. So I know that I had all these things, so I just want to have the energy and the focus and a brain that doesn't turn off in the middle of the day with no excuse. Right, right. Because that's annoying. Just like having a, a brownout in the electrical grid in the middle of your math test. But it just happens randomly all day long. So I just didn't want that. And then I want to be happy. And I, I worked on this a lot. Like, oh, I'll be happy when I'm famous. I'm 23 years old. I'm in Entrepreneur magazine. I'm the first guy to sell anything over the Internet. That didn't make you happy for 15 minutes. Like, woohoo. I got to press it. And then, well, that didn't work. So I'll get rich a couple years later, $6 million. I make it, I'm like, I'll be happy when I have 10. And then I lose it all anyway. So money doesn't make you happy? Fame doesn't make you happy? Oh, I'll get married. I get married for a couple years in my twenties. Dude, that sucked. So what else are you supposed to do? I guess we have to work on me because I'm the only common element in all these. So yeah, it's always been about freedom and just experiencing happiness and maybe doing things that are beautiful. But I do want to control my body because your body will fucking lie to you all the time and it'll get fat and do stupid stuff and make you eat all the cheesecake and so like, behave yourself.

[Podcast Host]

How do you stay consistent with having such incredible discipline? Do you ever cheat?

[Dave Asprey]

I don't have consistent discipline unless I'm like working with the dominatrix. That's like a different conversation.

[Podcast Host]

We talk about that next.

[Dave Asprey]

There's a chapter in the book on it. So what I do though, is I practice extreme laziness. And this is, oh yeah, this is a trigger word for people. They get so mad. In fact, it's worse than talking about like death or sewage or something. But here's the deal. Your mitochondria hate wasting energy. So all innovation in the world has been, I don't want to wash my clothes by hand. I'll make a dishwasher. I don't want to walk, I'll make a bicycle. Like everything we do to make life easier is because we are fundamentally inside ourselves, energy saving beings. So what I do is I excite myself with the savings I get instead of with the work I have to do. Okay, so yeah, I get to go to the gym. Gross. Your body doesn't want to go to the gym. I could try to tell myself I want to go, but in all seriousness, unless I'm addicted to endorphins, I actually don't want to go to the gym. I'm, I'm truthful about that, but I'm going to go to upgrade labs and I'm going to save 45 minutes of sweating on a bike and I'm going to get six times better results. Okay, I want six times better results. I'm going to go. So it's motivating yourself by understanding your body is wired for power and, and it's wired for sex. And this is before you can think. So I recognize that about myself and we all have it, even if we don't want to think that. So then I'm like, okay, how can I get this done in the least possible effort? That's interesting. That's a problem. I can solve that problem. So my discipline comes entirely from wanting to save energy.

[Podcast Host]

As someone who's always drawn to wellness products that are simple, effective and actually help you understand your body, which is why I'm so excited to share. The Harmon Zoomer by Vibrant Wellness, a company I love and trust. It's an advanced at home test that gives you real insight into your energy, mood and overall balance. That's why I trust Vibrant. It combines standard of care labs with genetics and innovative biomarkers. Backed by over 400 researchers and more than 40 peer reviewed studies. I took the Hormone Zoomer myself. And finally getting clear answers behind signs and symptoms I'd always blamed on stress or too much travel, which was extremely empowering to me. It measures up to three times the markers of typical hormone panels, including hormones, adrenal and bone health, oxidative stress and endocrine disruptors, and toxins like glyphosate and phthalates, essentially five tests in one. And with Vibrance network of over 30,000 trained providers, you get expert interpretation and a plan that makes sense for your body and your needs. If you're ready to understand what your body's been trying to tell you, ask your provider for the Hormone Zoomer or find a Vibrant Certified [e-mail] BiohackIT because understanding your body changes everything. If anybody listening, they're like, what supplements? Because you've obviously run the gamut. Everything comes across your desk. You try everything. If there were some core supplements, men and for women, that really help with mitochondrial health, what would that be?

[Dave Asprey]

There's two that are foundational and they're so boring, which is why I make them. So I, I, there are dozens of really powerful cool longevity supplements that I do episodes on on my podcast. Yeah, but the two that I just couldn't find in a good way. One is called Vitamin D. You can go to Vitamin D A K e dot com. This is a mix of fat soluble vitamins in the right ratios and you need those. And if you don't have those, your mitochondria won't work and neither will thousands of other things in your body. And the other one is called minerals 101.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Dave Asprey]

And this is a mix of almost a dozen different minerals. And you can say, I'm gonna meditate today, I'm gonna go to the gym. And your mitochondria, like dumbass, you don't have zinc. I cannot build muscle without zinc. I can't build neurotransmitters. So let's get the building blocks in there. And it really comes down to fat soluble vitamins to guide the minerals to go to the right place in your body. So those are my two non negotiables every day. And then man, from there I take 150 supplements a day and people say, what's the list? People have offered me tens of thousands of dollars for the list. No, because unless you have my genetics, my background and my goals, if you take the supplements I take, you're probably going to get disaster pants. They're not going to work for you. You get a headache. So what we do is we customize your stack. There's a couple ways to do that. One of them is with AXO Health. This is one of my companies, part of Upgrade Labs. It's a XO Health. And let's get your blood work done. What are you lacking? Let's address that. And the other thing, when I'M doing the very high end concierge longevity medicine with a medical doctor. This is at Unlimited Life and there, where you have $40,000 worth of lab tests. We're looking at your genetics, looking at your biomarkers, looking at everything and looking at your goals and saying, okay, if we go through all these, what are the supplements that are going to address that one weird genetic thing that isn't methylation, but something no one's ever heard of? So you can get really specific. I've done all of that work and a lot more. So I would say you want to take something for your mitochondria and it might be something like Timeline. Could be something like sodium butyrate, which is. Or calcium magnesium butyrate from Body Bio is a company that makes a good one and things as basic as coenzyme Q10. You know how many people would be better off if they spent 30 bucks a month on Coenzyme Q10? It's not that hard.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah, it's incredible for oxidative stress, which we're all experiencing all day, every day, and it damages our cells.

[Dave Asprey]

I'm going straight from here to the airport to fly to Dubai, so I'm pretty sure I'll be taking extra supplements on that flight to avoid the oxidative stress and I'm not going to get jet lag when I land.

[Podcast Host]

Do you have a whole, like, bag out there just full of supplements?

[Dave Asprey]

Pretty much, yeah.

[Podcast Host]

And do you organize it by day or just carry it like in Ziplocs with you?

[Dave Asprey]

I have a spreadsheet.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Dave Asprey]

And I have a room in my house where the walls are just shelves. It looks like a GNC or something. And I just have six months of everything. So I just grab a bottle, whatever. And then when I'm going on trip, I asked my personal assistant to pack these for me and I put them in these really cool bags.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Dave Asprey]

And then we like put a sticker on it and we heat seal it so that it looks so official otherwise having just random bags of pills.

[Podcast Host]

That happened to me. So I was leaving Ibiza this summer and I had like a six week supply of pills and they stopped me at the airport and they're like, you're transporting drugs? And I was like, these are not drugs, these are my supplements. And they were like, but it's all different colors. I'm like, yes. And they're like, how can somebody take so many pills? And I'm like, well, I'm in my 40s. This is what I need. This is my stack. And I literally have pictures of them stopping me. They had to get the drug squad out. They started like scanning everything.

[Dave Asprey]

Oh, my gosh.

[Podcast Host]

I was like, thank God I didn't actually have something on me. Cause that would be the end of it. And I was just like, mortified. Standing there for 45 minutes while they scanned my entire suitcase.

[Dave Asprey]

I would've had fun with it. It'd been like, oh, that one. That's like herbal Viagra. Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

They're like, what can you say? This is like some mdma. This is some ecstasy over here, you know? But they were mortified. They were like, how does a human being take so many supplements? But that's also where the Europeans are so different to the Americans.

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah, but a lot of their teeth.

[Podcast Host]

Are crooked and they have a lot of other health issues.

[Dave Asprey]

Sorry, Europeans. I come from Europe. But bottom line is having judgment about supplements is dumb.

[Podcast Host]

Right.

[Dave Asprey]

And they're concentrated food. And if you're like, well, I should get all of my nutrients from my food. Your food doesn't have nutrients in it because the soil doesn't have nutrients in it. Because we've been growing the food there for a hundred years. Correct.

[Podcast Host]

And we've got poison the soil as well.

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah, totally. We've got problems. So it's weird. We take food and then we get rid of the toxic parts in this weird process called cooking. Right. And then we take that same food and we get rid of many more parts of it and keep the most useful parts. And it's called an herbal supplement. And you take that and somehow that's cheating. Okay, I'm cheating. Great. I admit it, I cheated. But I also feel better. Look better, my brain works better, everything's better.

[Podcast Host]

I'm optimized to the best capacity. So why would I not be doing that?

[Dave Asprey]

Because it's expensive and it's kind of annoying.

[Podcast Host]

And people need to be organized and disciplined with how they take it, time it, all of that stuff.

[Dave Asprey]

And building systems reduces friction and discipline that relies on willpower. Will fail because willpower is driven by mitochondria and they run out of sugar or run out of ketones or something. They're like, no willpower for you. Yeah. So what you do is you say, all right, how can I set this up so it's the least possible work for me to do my supplements. And that's why I buy a six month supply. Could you imagine if I take 150 supplements every month? I have to hit 150 reorders. I would hate my life. That alone would be A full time job.

[Podcast Host]

Right. So it's like creating efficiencies in your life so you can manage everything better.

[Dave Asprey]

Yep.

[Podcast Host]

What are some supplements, however, on the market that you think are absolute bullshit, except for green juices and powders?

[Dave Asprey]

This is a rough question because for this one person out there, a supplement that doesn't work for most people might just be life changing for them. We are all so unique. And if you look at the standard curve, that bell shaped curve, a lot of epidemiology, like, well, let's design for that one guy in the middle. If you remember back in say high school or something, there's this one kid who's like, this is the best teacher ever. And then half the class is like, this is so boring. And the other half is like, I don't understand. Because you can't please everyone. So a supplement that might just be not good for a lot of people could be really important. So I have a hard time just throwing things under the bus. But what I can do is say, why are you putting titanium dioxide in your supplements? That's not okay. You want artificial coloring to make it look pretty. That's dumb.

[Podcast Host]

Right?

[Dave Asprey]

So I look at ingredient quality and excipients and binders and then is it something that you need? And sadly, there's a bunch of people out there who said, oh, this is a get rich quick kind of thing.

[Podcast Host]

Correct.

[Dave Asprey]

They'll formulate supplements without understanding how they work. And then they kind of slap some stuff together. And I'm even then as long as the ingredients are what they say they are. And if you bought it on Amazon, it's probably not that way. Amazon has a serious problem with counterfeit supplements, but it's really hard to just throw one under the bus. Oh, I know one. Beta carotene is stupid. You want to take real vitamin A, which is called retinol, because most people can't convert beta carotene into vitamin A. It's a genetic thing. So why would you take the form that your body might not convert when you could just take the real stuff and then folic acid, we should ban that stuff. It is the worst thing ever. And people say, but it reduces neural tube defects. And this is why I have to be careful with epidemiologists and people like registered dietitians, unless they're functional registered dietitians, which many of my friends are. So there's a difference. The RDs are the ones who put McDonald's at hospitals and in school lunches and say it's okay because of calories so folic acid for about a third of people is actually toxic, but it can be beneficial for another third of people. There's a form called folinic acid, which, it's funny, in 2011, my first book on fertility, I'm like, if you don't want a kid with autism, take folinic acid. They're now using it to treat autism only 14 years after I wrote the book. And this is what happens. Folic acid might turn to methylfolate, might turn to folinic acid. So you might as well just take the downstream component that your body can absorb. So folic acid is dumb. Synthetic vitamin E is dumb because it doesn't work. It increases risk. But other than that, there's probably someone somewhere where it changed their life. But for the rest of us, it might just not be a good investment.

[Podcast Host]

You're actually the guy who came up with the word biohacking. You came up with the term, and the industry has now kind of piggybacked off it and changed so much. What are the things about the industry that you love, where you see it today? And you're like, I helped pioneer this, but what are also parts of it that deeply annoy you?

[Dave Asprey]

I'm just in awe. I see the industry analyst reports, I started a 36 billion dollar industry.

[Podcast Host]

Yes. How crazy, right?

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah, I. I really, I set out to say, something is so deeply wrong with the way we think about our health, and it's so disempowered for people. And, like, I actually don't want to be healthy. I'm gonna be way more than healthy. Like, really, you can ask for anything you want. You, like, have a little jar and you rub it. The genie comes out, goes, what do you. I want to be healthy. No. I want to be Superman. Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

I want to be optimized to the best of my ability.

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah. So I'm just. I am in awe and I'm grateful. In terms of things that annoy me, it's really hard to annoy me because I've done all this weird neurological work. There are things that I think are just wasteful. I'm like, oh, man. Or sometimes I see people intentionally driving division as much as they can in order to sell things. And the two things that I hear the most, One is my favorite. It's usually a woman saying, biohacking is just for men. And I'm like, bitch, please. It's been 58% women since the start of the movement. Like, what are you talking about? Women than men? Since the first. Actually, maybe the second blog post. Right, right. I know. I have the data. And so it turns out women are better biohackers than men. And then they say, well, there aren't that many female biohackers. I'm like, have you listened to my show?

[Podcast Host]

Correct. There's so many women out there.

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah. So it's not men ignoring women. It's women trying to create divisiveness to get attention for their products. So that's one. And the other one say, oh, it's just for rich men. And I'm like, every one of my books. Here's the principle we didn't understand.

[Podcast Host]

Correct. This is a way to do it on a budget.

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah, yeah. It's free. Like, yeah, like, curtains cost a dollar. Aluminum foil is almost free for your curtains. Like, you can do the free sunshine and darkness. You get a fancy red light. But the principle is what matters. And so most of the things are affordable or cheap. And some of the things that we're doing to prove it's possible, like gene therapy, I have done two gene therapy treatments. They're 25 grand a pop. I'm doing another one in Dubai. So that's probably not something anyone's gonna do now, but It'll probably be five bucks in 20 years, because that's the nature of things.

[Podcast Host]

For anybody listening who doesn't know what gene therapy is, can we explain it a little bit?

[Dave Asprey]

This is when you inject something in your body that instructs your cells to make a new compound. I'm doing gene therapy that tells my body to make longevity molecules. So the two I've done so far are Follistatin. And next I'm doing something called vegf.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Dave Asprey]

Which increases the growth of micro capillaries, which is good for tissue circulation. And I'm going to go back after that. The next one I'm going to do is called Clotho.

[Podcast Host]

Okay, and what does Clotho do?

[Dave Asprey]

Clotho is one of these amazing longevity compounds that I wrote about in Superhuman, but you couldn't buy it anywhere. And Clotho increases cognitive function and reduces your speed of aging dramatically. So is something we've dreamed of being able to introduce to the body. And it's about to happen.

[Podcast Host]

And out of everything else that you've tried and tested on yourself, what else do you think is absolutely phenomenal? Stem cells, exosomes. Like, what's your take on all that?

[Dave Asprey]

The stem cell work I've done in the early days in the US Was very rough. It was like getting hit by a truck.

[Podcast Host]

I mean, is it that painful?

[Dave Asprey]

Well, I had every joint in my body and my reproductive system and face all injected with stem cells taken from my bone marrow and fat. And that. Yeah, that was brutal. Now I go out of the US to rmi, and there it's a lot more palatable. But the really incredible thing that I did last time I was there, we used focused ultrasound. So two intersecting beams of sound on the base of my brain to open up the blood brain barrier. So stem cells get into the brain and reverse the. The central aging clocks time. So it's like setting the time back.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Dave Asprey]

So that was amazing.

[Podcast Host]

And you also recently did. I thought it was last year where you did a fat transfer.

[Dave Asprey]

There wasn't very much fat to get.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah, I was going to say.

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah, it was more than. Let's just call it what it was. It was a facial circumcision.

[Podcast Host]

Okay. I mean, the results are amazing.

[Dave Asprey]

You're not supposed to laugh over there. I thought I heard that.

[Podcast Host]

No, but it was. The results are incredible.

[Dave Asprey]

Thank you. So, having been really fat, I have about a half of a large bath towel worth of extra skin on my body, and I look freaking great with my shirt off. Because you're seeing me from the front. Unfortunately, most of it went to the back and on my face, I had a full handful of skin, like a passport cover worth of skin, extra on my face. And you could grab it and pull.

[Podcast Host]

It from your old days.

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah, just from when I was fat and puffy like that picture. So there's no longevity technique. I actually have young skin, but I just had a lot of it. So, like, all right, I cut my toenails. I'll just trim my face. Why not? Some people got really judgy about it, and then I just made fun of their moms when they got judgy. It was fun.

[Podcast Host]

About something that you're openly sharing and being so genuine and.

[Dave Asprey]

Authentic about because it's cheating.

[Podcast Host]

Cheating, too.

[Dave Asprey]

People love suffering and doing it the hard way. I'm like, do you drive to work? You're cheating. You should walk. Shame, shame, shame. Like, come on, guys. Yes. I took the extra skin off my face because I used to be fat. Used to. Should not get as fat as I was. It's not good for you.

[Podcast Host]

What's your take on rapamycin for longevity?

[Dave Asprey]

There isn't very good evidence for rapamycin for longevity. And I've experimented with it over the years and just said, you know, that's one that I'm probably not going to do. And I've been Saying for a long time, metformin is another drug that people have been taking for longevity. Unless you have diabetes, it's not worth it. And back in 2003, a study came out that showed that it mimicked fasting in mice. And because I'm that kind of guy, I got some metformin. I started taking it in 2003. And in 2005, I met the company who did that research. And I went in. In this room full of these doctors in white lab coats, and I talked about the research, and I said, well, I've been taking it for two years. And this. What, you're. You're taking Metformin? This was just a mouse study. I'm like, well, it's not gonna hurt me. It's a known drug. And they look at me, they go, how old are you? And I'm like, I'm 74. And so they believe me for, like, half a second.

[Podcast Host]

They're like, eureka, it works.

[Dave Asprey]

But what I found is it affects mitochondrial function. It makes you tired, lowers your VO2 max. It inhibits your B12, and there's just better ways to get the same effects.

[Podcast Host]

The only reason I'm asking is because rapamycin, recently, and it was just published, had some really interesting research when it came to slowing down her baron aging in women.

[Dave Asprey]

Mm. That's interesting. I haven't seen that research, but if I was a woman and I was still young, what I would want to do would be to take a very small amount of ovarian tissue, and this does require minor surgery, and put it in a tissue bank, frozen.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Dave Asprey]

And then when perimenopause starts, you re. Implant that back in your ovaries, and you'll have another full 20 years of no perimenopause.

[Podcast Host]

And where can they do this?

[Dave Asprey]

I don't know.

[Podcast Host]

We have to figure out where.

[Dave Asprey]

The research is all done. They've done it, and it is profound.

[Podcast Host]

Because they are doing stem cells and exosomes and now for the ovaries, too. But the life cycle on that is about six months to eight months. Right? So they haven't got to the point the extension of 20 years.

[Dave Asprey]

When you look at it from more of an energetic or an Eastern perspective, I believe that the ovaries are actually the seat of female intuition. And they're a very unique organ. They have more mitochondria per cell, like something like a hundred thousand, up to 600,000 in some of them. And mitochondria are antennas for reality that then receive reality and do something with it. Like make you stressed or fearful or hungry or something. But they decide how to allocate energy. So men don't have that level of mitochondrial density anywhere. And yes, that's speculative. I do not have a double blind, placebo controlled study because it's hard to measure intuition, guys, but we have measured intuition and it is real.

[Podcast Host]

If you want to live longer and heal naturally, you are going to love the Dr. Josh Axe show, hosted by my dear friend, Dr. Axe. Every week he shares how to balance your hormones, restore your gut, boost your energy and slow down aging without relying on harsh medications or quick fixes. He shares both ancient biblical practices and the latest breakthroughs in nutrition, herbal remedies and lifestyle medicine. And he sits down with world renowned experts to have a real unfiltered conversation you won't hear anywhere else. If you're ready to take control of your health, renew your energy, and transform your body, mind and spirit, tune in to the Dr. Josh Axe show every Monday and Thursday, wherever you get your podcasts. Women live in the 5D kind of reality, right? We are the intuitive guiding light. And that's where they always say that. That's where great partnership comes in. Always look to your woman to guide you and tell you they're like, almost like oracles. And they can showcase, you know, tell.

[Dave Asprey]

You when they feel safe.

[Podcast Host]

When they feel safe. Only with the right partner.

[Dave Asprey]

Exactly.

[Podcast Host]

You should start a dating book next.

[Dave Asprey]

Oh my gosh, that'd be interesting.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah, I think that's what your next book should be. Dating advice for men and women.

[Dave Asprey]

Interesting question. I'd have to ask all my ex.

[Podcast Host]

Dates girlfriends if they'd like, contribute to the book. When it comes to Eastern traditions and Eastern medicine, what do you think some of the biggest takeaways for us should be?

[Dave Asprey]

Well, there's a lot of arrogance in the West. Like we know everything. All those old cultures don't know anything. And just toe to toe, Ayurveda will kick your ass.

[Podcast Host]

Right?

[Dave Asprey]

There's 5,000 years of wisdom there and not everything makes sense to us because we see things through a very, a very western linear approach. And we don't generally understand signaling systems and cycles. We sort of feel like we are meat robots. And I have seen profound results from these ancient things that I didn't believe worked when I was young. And it was only after I exhausted all the western stuff to get rid of the toxic mold that I had that I didn't even know what it was at first. And all the weight and all that I explored all the weird stuff. And I've been to the strange little Chinese stores where there's, you know, eye of newt in little wooden drawers wrapped in newspaper and you boil it and your house stinks for a week. I've done all this stuff like that. And sometimes it works for reasons that no one really knows. And then I didn't think this was possible either. I've had a chance to study with some gurus who have very powerful abilities. They just know stuff and they can do stuff. And that's real. And you can say, well, no, that's not real, Dave. No, I don't believe you. I can't believe anything you said. Because I disagree with one thing. If you believe that, get out of third grade. Because I could just be wrong about that and write about other things. But anyway, some people get triggered by this. And then you can look at the books by Dean Radin or Joe Dispenza, who's been on my stage multiple times, who's a friend. And there are scientific studies showing that these things actually happen. So don't throw out the ancient stuff. My goal has been let's get the data right and let's see if it works. And it usually does, but not always.

[Podcast Host]

And what do you think has been personally for you? Some of. Besides ayurvedic, some of the masters you studied, which one has been the most profound for you? That you look back and you're like, I'm so glad I met that person. I'm so glad I came across that modality.

[Dave Asprey]

Man.

[Podcast Host]

Because there's so many. You. You've experienced so many different things.

[Dave Asprey]

I don't. I don't know that I can like, stack rank the people who've been kind enough to call me up and tell me things. And there's. The way that stuff works is it's called mysticism for a reason. But they say, like in alchemy, when the student is ready, the teacher will appear.

[Podcast Host]

And it's true.

[Dave Asprey]

And that's how it happens. So each time when someone. Just for reasons, I'm still like, wow, why did this person call me? Why did we get introduced?

[Podcast Host]

Why did we.

[Dave Asprey]

They're just there at the right time. And. And I hope that I'm there at the right time for someone else. And. Yeah. Where it just happens that way. So I think that's the universe working.

[Podcast Host]

Do you have any, at this stage in your life, any personal insecurities?

[Dave Asprey]

Hmm. Thinking about that. I don't know if it's an insecurity. I. I have, like, uncertainties. Right. I don't know that feeling secure about everything you're uncertain about would be healthy either. That might be a little bit self deceiving. So yeah, I really haven't figured out like do I actually want to be in a long term relationship again? Because I was married for 17 years and I've had beautiful multi year dating experiences. But I have a big mission and I also recognize you don't want to.

[Podcast Host]

Be distracted from that.

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah. But I also recognize just the incredible power of having female energy in my life. But I'm also fortunate I do have female. I have some. So many of my best friends in the world are energetically super potent women. And like, let's do some magic together, we'll keep our clothes on but like let's just hang out and like just you know, be present. So I'm feeling nourished at this point.

[Podcast Host]

That's an incredible way to look at things that you have still that need that's being met with other places in your life and that goes down to showing all the inner work that you've done to cultivate that community around you.

[Dave Asprey]

I feel so lucky to have some of the friends that I have. Yeah, there's, there's been times when I really needed them and vice versa.

[Podcast Host]

And if you have to give people listening a piece of advice on how to cultivate those relationships for themselves because sometimes people are not really good at vetting people out, having healthy boundaries and keeping the right people there because they're so scared. They're like, well, what if I kick these people out? And there may might be toxic for me, but that's all I have.

[Dave Asprey]

It's really easy, get really comfortable being lonely. You're just fine by yourself. And it's fear of being alone that makes you choose people who are not the wrong people. And for me, I kind of just do stuff that I'm scared of. I used to, years ago I knew that one of the things that would make me eat is if I was feeling lonely, I would do it. And because I used to have Asperger's, there were times I was lonely on the playground. Right. Because I don't understand what all these kids are doing. They're dumb and they keep trying to punch me, but I'm twice their size so I'll just sit on them. First grade logic, right. So I was like, I'll just go to a cave. I'll have a shaman drop me off in a cave for four days with no food. So then I can be hypoglybitschy and Hangry and nothing. Like, I'm not gonna get. Nothing's going to happen. So I would say just be alone for a few days, right? And if you start feeling, oh, I'm going to die, is it real? Is it true? No, it's not. You're not going to die, right? Or go on a vision quest, like, spend seven days in the middle of the forest somewhere with nothing. And then you just realize, I'm really confused because I thought I would die if I was alone. In fact, it's the same way you thought you'd die if you didn't have tacos for lunch, didn't you? But when you skipped lunch and you learned fasting, it was fine. So it's liberating. So fall in love with yourself and then you'll pick good people. But if you don't love yourself, you won't be able to see that they're not the kind of people. And then I mentioned, yeah, this is Robert Greene's work. But I summarize it in heavily meditated around spotting people who have envy. Because if you have friends who are envious of you, it's super toxic and you should fire them right away or call them out on end.

[Podcast Host]

How do you spot envy in someone?

[Dave Asprey]

You tell someone, you look them right in the eye, so you're watching carefully and you say, oh my gosh, I just got a hundred thousand dollars. Right? And someone who's envious will just briefly go like. They get like a little snarl and then they smile. Oh, good for you. And like, wait a minute. And if you've done awareness and healing work, you can actually feel another person's energy. And then you're looking for congruence. And that's when the inner state matches the outer state. And we can all feel this. So people can walk in and they're like, trained at acting, so they're saying one thing, but inside you're like, they're like, how can I take from this person?

[Podcast Host]

Or how can I emulate who they become?

[Dave Asprey]

Oh, yeah, that's a huge problem for influencers. In particular, someone who spoke at the Business of Biohacking conference this year. This is where I teach entrepreneurs about, you know, how do you build companies the way I did? Bulletproof. She's like, dave, the problem is if you hire people who want to be you, they're looking to you as a savior. And all influencers will get this, you're going to save this person. And then when you don't, because they have to save themselves, then suddenly you become the Bad daddy or the bad mommy or whatever. And then they're the ones who just blow up and then just make up shit or steal money and all kinds of stuff. And every entrepreneur I know has had people do that. So now I don't even advertise that it's a job for my companies. It's just some random job someone wants to work, and then they find out who it's for.

[Podcast Host]

Is there anybody at this stage in your career that really inspires you?

[Dave Asprey]

Hmm. You know, Ben Franklin was a pretty interesting dude.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Dave Asprey]

There was a guy named Royal Rife who Tesla actually kind of borrowed some of his stuff. Not Tesla car, but Nikolai Tesla or Nikola Tesla, borrowed a lot of the research from Royal Rife. And these were just really early innovators who saw the world really differently. And then Jack Welch, who ran GE and back when GE was doing really well and just had a different perspective on things. In terms of more modern CEOs, I have to say Elon's Otto, or not Otto, but Elon's biography. Holy crap. That is a really interesting book. And I don't agree with everything Elon does, nor should I, nor should anyone else. He's not a God. He's a human being. And it's okay that I like, you know, six out of seven things, whatever, it doesn't matter. But his perspective on how do you make a company efficient is freaking brilliant. And the way he went in to Twitter and just cleaned out. I'm going to be really rude here. Cleaned out the trash. There were a lot of people with a lot of unreasonable expectations, and he just. Absolutely. It was like watching a samurai at work. I'm like, how would you fix a culture that broken? So I have a lot of respect for that. And I'm sure he's done all sorts of things I would have. So Elon, definitely at least some aspects of it, but also for all these people, just because you are interested in what someone does, they might also do some douchebag thing, but you have to hate them for it.

[Podcast Host]

That's their process and their journey.

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

So funny enough, today, I heard when we were at Eat Ammonia, there was one of the vendors, they were selling these psychedelic mushrooms. And they were selling them. Yeah, they were selling them. Yeah, they were able to sell them. And you didn't know until you approached the gun. He's like, hey, like, be careful with your dosing what you take here. And he said, I'm friends with somebody who supplied Elon some mushrooms around the time that he was gonna buy Twitter. And I was like, okay, so he made that decision on psilocybin. Incredible. I was like, I'm gonna say that on the podcast now.

[Dave Asprey]

You know, I. It's hard to say he made that decision only then, but I can see why he made the decision. And also many people I know, including very successful people, will use psychedelics to see things from a different perspective. And there's nothing wrong with that. I mean, we use ketamine at 40 years of Zen as an optional add on because it increases neuroplasticity. And I've done some of my strongest esoteric shamanic kind of work using ketamine as the molecule versus some other kind of plant medicine. So for healing work. Mushrooms actually aren't that good. They're good for communing or something, but they had too much visual distortion. So if I'm doing something that's really precise energetically, if I'm working on someone's energy or whatever, it's like I lose fidelity. This is frustrating. I need a pinpoint accuracy and I can't do it because the mushrooms are with my head. So.

[Podcast Host]

So the ketamine allows you to do that and go really laser focused.

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Are you starting to serve people in shamanic circles and helping your friends or people close to you?

[Dave Asprey]

I'm not a. I haven't done full shamanic initiation.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Dave Asprey]

I've been initiated in some things and I'm not a shaman. Like I. It drives me insane when you see these people, oh, I'm a shaman. Everyone's a shaman. I'm like, do you not know what those guys do?

[Podcast Host]

Right, Exactly.

[Dave Asprey]

They live on the medicine for at least eight, eight years. And it is rough and I have like so much respect, uber respect. And I hire people like that because they're true experts in the field. So that said, when, when I'm in a medicine space and I see that and I. It's very obvious to me and whatever, what, what someone needs, I'll do it. And I've developed some ability to help people in, in, I think, really beautiful and profound ways. But it's just something that emerges over time and it's not, it's not part of my professional life. But my friends, they know that I'm there for them if they need that kind of work. Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

And for somebody who wants to work through their energy and just kind of upgrade themselves as a person, what molecule would you suggest? Would it be ketamine? Would it be dmt? What would you recommend?

[Dave Asprey]

So there's one chapter in heavily meditated about psychedelics and I go through a list in order of psychedelics and I'm really concerned when people who are complete newbies, like I'm going to go do ayahuasca, that's at the very bottom of the list.

[Podcast Host]

Right?

[Dave Asprey]

Not saying you shouldn't do it. So for a lot of people I'm just gonna say cannabis doesn't count. There are some states you can get into with it, but it's so common and it's not particularly good for your brain and people tend to use it a lot. So eat a lot of cannabis. If you've never done anything for one time, okay, fine, whatever. But after that it's either mushrooms or MDMA depending on your goals. And mushrooms are relatively gentle, relatively safe mdma, a little bit more of a side effect profile, but really beautiful. So if it's trauma resolution or building depth in your relationship, you go down the MDMA or MDA path. And if it's personal exploration, then you go down a mushroom path and then you maybe go to lsd. And after you've done those kinds of things, then smoking some DMT is probably a good idea, right? Right. And people saying, what do you mean good idea? Look, if you're called, you're called. Right. But the one thing that I really want to say, don't do these things because like, oh look cool, just check.

[Podcast Host]

It off your list.

[Dave Asprey]

Because yeah, when you're called, it's, you get this inner knowing that isn't a thought, it's like an impulse. And like four different people just randomly tell you on the same day, like you should try, like, oh wait, I'm going to listen. And it's very dangerous to say, I'm going to go do this drug that I'm not a hell yes to. And I go do it anyway. Just because you feel social pressure or because I. So that's when I see people have the most energetic disturbances. I don't believe in bad trips, but I do believe in chemical mal reactions. There are things that can happen that you just don't want and there are interventions where sometimes you have to bring in the shamans from the jungle to fix it. But maybe don't go there.

[Podcast Host]

Maybe don't go there until you're ready and you're called to it.

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

If there's one piece of advice that we feel that you haven't covered, Dave, to leave our listeners with, what would that be?

[Dave Asprey]

Well, we didn't talk about the other gateway to altered states. That is it deserves a place right up there. With breathwork and psychedelics. And it's sex, okay. Specifically tantric sex or conscious kink. So all of the stuff that causes pain in people, the suffering, it's somatic, it's in the body experiencing. And there is very few things on earth that will get you more into your body than a good orgasm.

[Podcast Host]

Right.

[Dave Asprey]

So having conscious sex using techniques similar to breath work that help you to really connect with that. 20% of people report meeting God during orgasm at least once in their life.

[Podcast Host]

Really?

[Dave Asprey]

Well, how are you going to know they're laying there flopping around like they always do. Right. Unless they tell you.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Dave Asprey]

So. Yeah. Really? So this is an altered state that is actually so nourishing for adults. Like you're saying, how do you soften when you come home from a hard day at work? That's an effective way to soften, to.

[Podcast Host]

Soften as a woman and have great.

[Dave Asprey]

Sex and as a man too. Right. So I think sometimes we just have all this weird shame about that. But there are books on this, there are experts on this, and there are techniques where you can use that to master your own energy. And it's very different for men and women. So I share about that in Heavily meditated too. And it turns out though, for men, ejaculating frequently does cause problems.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Dave Asprey]

And it's because your testosterone goes down and something called prolactin goes up. And some men are more sensitive than others. But all of the longevity practices, Chinese medicine, Tantra itself, Ayurveda, it's ejaculating all the time, especially as you age, is actually depleting. So guys, you should learn how to have sex without ejaculating every time. And your life will improve dramatically because you'll have a lot more sex because you're always ready to go. And your partner's life will improve dramatically because it turns out for women, right, orgasms don't diminish you at all. They actually power you up. It's not fair.

[Podcast Host]

And what is it for women that you've like, kind of seen the research.

[Dave Asprey]

And you've learned around women and orgasm? There's at least seven and maybe nine kinds of orgasms.

[Podcast Host]

Women are capable of nine different kinds of orgasms.

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah. And I'm not going to list all nine.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah. I'm going to tell people to go read the book.

[Dave Asprey]

I didn't put all the types of orgasms. That's not that book. But your EQ goes up and your stress hormones go down and your oxytocin goes up dramatically. And I've had multiple experts on the show, OB GYNs and people who practice more on the tantric side. And it's amazing what happens in a couple and just in each person individually when that need is met. It's as important as having a good steak and you have to do it every day. But to ignore that as part of personal development, we do that at our own peril.

[Podcast Host]

And do you believe that having a casual one night stand with somebody can, you know, equals to having conscious sex?

[Dave Asprey]

It depends on the person.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Dave Asprey]

I've had some profound experiences, but it's all about discernment and it's about communication and boundary setting. And if you're both not drunk and you both say, you know what, let's do this thing, it can be incredibly healing and profound and amazing. But only if you're both well trained in how to do that. And if one of you is like, okay, I'm just going to pretend I'm trained, but I really want to get married and I have all these, then.

[Podcast Host]

It'S not going to work.

[Dave Asprey]

It can get sticky and it won't work. Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Dave, I've loved interviewing you and just getting to know Dave Asprey behind Instagram and behind the books and just getting into a little bit more of your personal sites. Thank you so much for coming on the show. I know you have a lot to catch, so I appreciate you.

[Dave Asprey]

Thanks for having me on.