Bitcoin Audible – Episode Chat_126

"Bitcoin In Real Life" with Wyatt O'Rourke

Host: Guy Swann
Guest: Wyatt O’Rourke
Date: February 5, 2025

Episode Overview

This episode centers on bringing Bitcoin and its ethos into the physical world—what it takes to build and sustain real-life Bitcoin communities, called "citadels." Guy Swann hosts entrepreneur and Denver Space (a nonprofit Bitcoin citadel) co-founder Wyatt O’Rourke, discussing the nitty-gritty of organizing, funding, and fostering in-person Bitcoin networks and their larger societal importance. The conversation ranges from practical details of managing such a community hub, to the philosophical and moral implications of living by Bitcoin values, and the need to revitalize in-person social connections in the digital age.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Need for "Bitcoin in Real Life" (00:00–04:00)

• Both Guy and Wyatt emphasize the importance of embodying Bitcoin values not just online, but through tangible, local communities.
• Wyatt O’Rourke:

  "When it actually comes time to take action, the in real life aspect, you know, can't be understated and... you need to lock arms as the collective and move forward supporting a cause that is bigger than oneself." (00:00)

2. Origins and Structure of Denver Space – A Bitcoin Citadel (06:05–10:00)

• Wyatt details the founding of Denver Space, a nonprofit, community-run Bitcoin "citadel" in Denver.
  • Began in fall 2023, formalized in April 2024, moved into a physical space October 2024.
  • Now has ~77 members, run entirely by and for the community ("grassroots movement").
  • Contrasted with top-down, for-profit models like Bitcoin Park/Commons.
• Importance of open-sourcing their processes (handbooks, policies) to help others start their own hubs.

3. The Erosion—and Rebirth—of Community (10:01–12:28)

• Both agree that younger generations are unaccustomed to true, in-person community; these citadels serve as a "phoenix" of old social structures.
• Guy Swann:

  "It seems... not an easy thing to have to deal with the resource constraint and organization of people in real life in a physical space and to make that sustainable and to like build a community... it's not an easy thing to do." (09:12)

• Building real culture demands intentionality and continual proof-of-work.

4. Operational Details: Funding, Management, and Member Engagement (12:29–17:53)

• Launched with 25 early "members" paying discounted membership ($50–$100/mo) for vaporware—the promise of a space to come.

• Board of nine (six officers, three member representatives).

• Relied on luck; one member purchased real estate and leased the space to the community.

• All treasury held in Bitcoin except fiat buffer for expenses.

• Sustained through member contributions, corporate sponsorships (Compass Mining, Unchained, Casa, Fetty), and frequent events/workshops.

• Wyatt O’Rourke:

  "Any landlord… would like to see… three years of financial statements and they're not exactly keen on your... treasury being in bitcoin. So... one of our members... purchased commercial real estate... and so we rent the first floor..." (14:56)

5. Technology & Security (17:54–20:35)

• Treasury kept in cold storage multisig.
• Use of Strike/Zap/LNBits for member payments; self-hosted tech stack for privacy.
• Open transparency with policies and board minutes published on website.
• Member contributions go beyond money—committees leverage individual talents for growth and operations.

6. Events & Hands-On Activities—Learning by Doing (20:35–29:01)

• Frequent technical deep-dives (mining, wallet setup, sovereign tech). Example: "Heat Punk Summit" around home-mining and using heaters.

• Mining is integrated into everyday life for many—members even heat their homes with miners.

• Guy Swann:

  "One of the things about an in real life space is you can do those things, you can do hands on projects, things that just aren't the same when they're just a YouTube video, you know." (25:01)

7. The Broader Mission: Fixing the Money, Fixing Society (30:04–44:09)

• Wyatt’s article "Fix the Money" deconstructs the cyclical rise and fall of civilizations tied to monetary centralization.

• Draws from Larry Locard and Lyn Alden, citing how manipulation of money strips agency from individuals, breeds despair, and weakens societies.

• Read-aloud highlight: (42:35–44:09)
  Wyatt reads a passage on how distorting money "deprives [people] of the right to receive accurate signals... leading to a profound erosion of their sovereign agency..."

• Conversation on social, psychological consequences of monetary distortion—loss of trust, increase in nihilism, and the undermining of cooperation.

8. Bitcoin, Morality, and the Call for Higher Standards (55:25–65:48)

• Both see Bitcoiners as having a duty to act with nobility, carrying "prosperity with purpose," not just personal gain.

• Wyatt: Influence of faith/Catholic worldview—calls to "call a spade, spade," seeing the struggle between good and evil in monetary history.

• The noble obligation ("noblesse oblige") of Bitcoiners, who will be tomorrow's economic/political elite, to act with integrity and stewardship for the community.

• Wyatt O’Rourke:

  "Once we're in that position [as the 1%], are we going to have... the firm foundations to conduct ourselves in a manner that will ultimately help build a prosperous, trust based, high trust society?" (65:48)

9. Regulation: Community vs. State (69:47–75:17)

• Regulation itself isn’t "bad," but government regulation is often poor, corrupt, and insufficient. Bitcoiners should set their own, higher standards—"be better regulators than the government."

• Example expectations: proof of reserves, cold storage, multisig, bitcoin-only products.

• Guy Swann:

  "We need to take over regulation and we need to get rid of centralized government regulation because you're being forced to pay something that's taking away resources and basically letting somebody slip through." (71:29)

10. Wyatt’s Day Job—Financial Services Tailored for Bitcoiners (75:17–84:25)

• Runs Basilic Financial, a registered investment advisor focused on integrating Bitcoin with traditional financial planning.
• No AUM (assets under management) fees for Bitcoin—finds it "rent-seeking" to charge for simply buy/hold advice.
• Encourages self-custody (partnered with Unchained) regardless of age/wealth level, with options for individuals or institutions, and also helps clients consider philanthropy or legacy planning with Bitcoin.
• Advocates for responsible financialization (e.g. bitcoin-backed lending with proper reserves).
• Recognizes the need for real capital markets, fixed income, and hedging tools built natively atop Bitcoin.

11. The Future: Real Capital Markets, Multisig as a Service, and the Impact of Sound Financialization (84:25–88:14)

• The market for Bitcoin-collateralized loans, multisig, and on-chain proof-of-reserves is just starting and will be crucial in maturing Bitcoin’s role in the broader economy.
• Challenges with capital and trust models will produce new forms of jurisdictional and technological innovation.

12. How to Replicate This: Open Resources, Getting Involved (91:08–94:26)

• Open invitation to use Denver Space’s open-source materials for starting local Bitcoin hubs.
• Wyatt’s contact details and writing linked for further exploration.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Community:
  "We try to be scrupled with our membership... it's a bitcoin focus hub, but that bleeds into a lot of synergistic things... health sovereignty, tech sovereignty." – Wyatt O’Rourke (10:45)

• On Funding:
  "At that point, we were kind of selling vaporware... giving people discounts... if they would commit early." – Wyatt O’Rourke (13:37)

• On Monetary Manipulation:
  "When market feedback [is] distorted or manipulated, people lose the ability to make informed decisions, leading to a profound erosion of their sovereign agency, their intrinsic gift from God." – Wyatt O'Rourke (citing his writing, 42:35)

• On Local vs. Digital Connections:
  "There's a layer of in real life that needs to happen in order to make this revolution real... that starts and ends in real life." – Guy Swann (93:46)

• On Regulation:
  "It's not that regulation is bad. Regulation is wonderful... The problem is centralized government regulation is bad regulation. It is corrupt and easily bought regulation." – Guy Swann (71:29)

Important Timestamps

• Opening Vision of IRL Bitcoin Communities: 00:00–01:07
• What is Denver Space? Vision & Model: 06:05–09:12
• Resource Constraints/Ethos of Building Real Communities: 09:12–12:28
• How Funding, Membership, and Real Estate Work: 13:38–16:40
• Handling Treasury, Banking, Security: 16:40–18:17
• Corporate & Community Events, Tech Sovereignty: 18:17–20:35
• Technical Workshops & Culture-Building: 20:35–24:44
• Mining and Home-Heating as Community Activities: 24:44–27:06
• Start9, System76, Technical Community: 29:01–30:04
• "Fix the Money" Deeper Dive: 31:24–41:54
• Social Despair and Loss of Agency: 42:35–44:09
• Moral Worldview, Bitcoiners’ Nobility/Obligation: 55:28–65:48
• Regulation – Be Your Own Standard: 69:47–75:17
• Basilic Financial, RIA for Bitcoiners: 75:17–80:12
• Bitcoin Collateralized Loans – New Capital Markets: 80:12–88:14
• Final Thoughts, Where to Find Wyatt and Resources: 91:08–94:43

How to Connect & Resources Mentioned

• Denver Space (Denver Citadel) Resources & Handbook: denverspace.com
• Wyatt’s Financial Services: Basilic Financial – "Prosperity with Purpose"
• Wyatt’s Personal Writings: wyattorourke.com
• Twitter: @WRO_Rourke

Closing Takeaways

• Bitcoin Community Must Exist in the Physical World: Real, lasting change comes from boots on the ground—shared spaces, relationships, and projects that strengthen both individual sovereignty and collective purpose.
• Open Source Everything: Success breeds replication—Denver Space shares its blueprints so others can ignite local movements.
• Money, Morality, and Meaning Are Entwined: Centralized money undermines agency and society’s fabric. Living the Bitcoin ethos means upholding higher standards—personally and organizationally.
• Financialization Isn't Evil—If It’s Built Soundly: Responsible, transparent lending and capital markets built atop Bitcoin are essential to its evolution.
• Anyone Can Start: All it takes is a few motivated people and a shared ethos. The revolution truly starts in real life.

For further info, links to Wyatt’s writings, Denver Space’s resources, and to connect with both Guy and Wyatt, check the episode show notes.