Behind the Mastermind: Dissecting the Epstein Files

Summary

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Podcast Summary: Bleep! with Ana Navarro

Episode: "Behind the Mastermind: Dissecting the Epstein Files"

Original Air Date: March 2, 2026
Host: Ana Navarro
Guest: Julie K. Brown, Investigative Reporter, Miami Herald

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Episode Overview

In this episode, Ana Navarro conducts a fearless and in-depth conversation with award-winning investigative journalist Julie K. Brown, widely credited for reopening the Epstein case and driving public and legal scrutiny of Jeffrey Epstein and his network. The discussion centers around the latest release of the Epstein files, historical failures of law enforcement and governmental institutions, and the ongoing battle for justice for Epstein’s survivors. The conversation explores both the mechanics of Epstein's power and manipulation, recent revelations implicating high-profile figures, and systemic accountability failures—emphasizing the need for continued public outrage and investigative pressure.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Julie K. Brown’s Investigative Journey

[09:39–12:40]

• Julie recounts first reading about Epstein’s 2008 “sweetheart deal” and deciding to investigate further partly due to mainstream media ignoring critical leads.

• Initial catalyst: a 2016 lawsuit alleging Donald Trump and Epstein raped a 13-year-old, which received little press. The accuser disappeared after dropping the lawsuit:

  “Every time I read something about how he somehow got away with his crimes even though he had sexually assaulted and molested like, dozens and dozens of girls, I just kept shaking my head thinking, how does that happen?” —Julie K. Brown [10:25]

• Julie’s reporting intensified after Alex Acosta, who as U.S. Attorney negotiated Epstein’s lenient plea deal, was nominated by Trump as Secretary of Labor.

2. Institutional Failures and the Sweetheart Deal

[12:51–20:19]

• Acosta’s light vetting for a Cabinet position exemplified failures across multiple levels:

  “It’s so unbelievable to me that Alex Acosta went through a full vetting...and the man who gave Jeffrey Epstein the sweetheart deal...was questioned...by maybe one, maybe two senators. And they were rather small parts of the hearing.” —Ana Navarro [14:03]

• Julie explains the secrecy of Epstein’s plea agreement and law enforcement’s neglect:

  “When he did that deal, it was secret. It was sealed. When he went into court and did that plea, nobody showed what he was pleading to. Nobody knew anything. He went into jail. Nobody could get a copy of that deal for a whole year. So it was done in secret.” —Julie K. Brown [19:18]

3. Victims’ Longstanding Struggles for Justice

[20:19–24:08]

• The earliest known law enforcement warning came from the Farmer sisters, especially Maria Farmer, who went to the FBI in the 1990s—but nothing was done.
• Navarro and Brown both emphasize that victims were disappointed by every administration, with Democrats and Republicans both falling short.

  “These victims have been let down time and time again for decades and decades...by local law enforcement, by federal law enforcement, by administration after administration.” —Ana Navarro [22:18]

4. New Revelations & High-Profile Connections

[02:33–05:42; 27:15–32:16]

• Recent Epstein file drops reveal previously hidden connections, including Donald Trump, Prince Andrew (now under UK investigation), and Peter Mandelson (ex-British ambassador to the US).
• Larry Summers resigned from Harvard after being implicated.
• Epstein successfully manipulated perceptions by leveraging the reputations of elites (e.g., Bill Gates, Bill Clinton, Peter Thiel) for social validation:

  “It was like a shell game where he just shifted influence around, put all these pictures in his townhouses and homes and showed off his influence...It’s that group think.” —Ana Navarro [29:18]

5. Media Coverage, Survivor Support, and Justice Delayed

[24:08–39:15]

• Brown discusses how the Department of Justice (DOJ), across four administrations, failed to pursue leads, especially under AG Merrick Garland, whom Navarro criticizes sharply.
• The current document release is vast (3 million docs), but only a fraction is publicly accessible. Julie’s focus is on prosecutorial collusion and the aggressive, manipulative tactics Epstein used to co-opt prosecutors and lawyers.
• The podcast underscores the importance of transparency and the role of persistent citizen advocacy in pressuring for justice.

6. Gendered Patterns and Societal Failure

[30:58–32:16]

• Brown highlights that women (e.g., Tina Brown) typically rebuffed Epstein’s advances, while powerful men looked the other way.

  “It seems like most of the women...said, no, are you crazy? I’m not going to that. But the men didn’t do that.” —Julie K. Brown [31:41]

Notable Quote

“You know, my theory on this, Julie, is...Epstein was represented by some very powerful attorneys who could either provide [Acosta] a job or open doors for him...I think he let ambition get the best of him.” —Ana Navarro [16:35]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Law Enforcement Neglect:

  “The Justice Department...failed these women, failed these victims. Undoubtedly, you know, that more should have been done.” —Julie K. Brown [24:08]

• On Public Outrage:

  “I wonder if Trump would still feel that way if his daughter was molested or raped...I mean, it should be thought about like that. It could have been your daughter.” —Julie K. Brown [34:34]

• On Socio-Economic Targeting:

  “They were preying on young, poor girls...They weren’t preying on the daughters of the circle that they ran in. They were going out and actively searching for poor, disadvantaged girls and grooming and preying on them.” —Ana Navarro [35:41]

• On the Power of Local Journalism:

  “It’s a reminder to everybody to support local journalism. Without this story in the Miami Herald, we would not be where we are.” —Ana Navarro [39:15]

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Important Timestamps

| Timestamp | Segment | |-------------|--------------------------------------------------------| | 02:33–05:42 | Ana Navarro monologue on latest Epstein revelations | | 09:39–12:51 | Julie K. Brown on beginning the Epstein investigation | | 14:03–15:29 | Failures in Congressional vetting of Acosta | | 15:29–16:35 | Acosta’s inadequate answers in DOJ interviews | | 17:41–20:03 | Secrecy, groupthink, and protecting powerful men | | 20:51–22:13 | The Farmer Sisters—early FBI tip-off, ignored | | 24:08–25:35 | Critique of DOJ and Merrick Garland’s inaction | | 27:15–29:18 | Strategies Epstein used to manipulate powerful people | | 30:58–32:16 | Gendered responses to Epstein’s behavior | | 34:30–36:05 | What justice looks like for survivors | | 37:29–38:14 | Julie on the difficulty of covering Epstein documents | | 38:26–39:15 | Call to action: Demand transparency, contact reps |

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Call to Action

• Be Vocal and Demand Accountability:

  “Everybody really needs to contact their local representatives...and tell them how important this story is, because it really is about trust and transparency in our government systems.” —Julie K. Brown [38:26]

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Final Thoughts

• Justice for Epstein’s survivors remains elusive, and institutional accountability is still lacking.
• The bravery of journalists like Julie K. Brown, along with unrelenting public pressure, is essential to keep the investigation alive.
• The episode closes on a note of hope through activism, transparency, and support for local journalism, as Ana Navarro reminds listeners that “fearless dialogue can transform fear into courage, and courage into change.”

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This summary was created to communicate the essential points, notable quotes, and urgent calls to action from the episode.

Transcript

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[Anna Navarro]

Hi everyone, it's been another packed week. Welcome to bleep. I'm Anna Navarro. We have a special guest today, Julie K. Brown. She's probably the most informed person on the Epstein story, the foremost authority. And not only that, there probably would be zero accountability and the case would not have been reopened but for Julie K. Brown. So we talked to Julie earlier this month following the release of the latest batch of the Epstein files. I think you'll find what she says about the history of the case and her insight on the latest file drop to be insightful. But since we talked to Julie a few weeks ago, even more has come out on the files. Just in the last few days, we found out that Trump is in the Epstein files in a way we didn't know about. We found out that the Justice Department withheld some Epstein files related to the allegations that Trump sexually abused a minor, this minor in 2019, sat down for three or four interviews with the FBI, and those pages have somehow disappeared from the release of the Epstein files. We'll have to have Julie back at some point to talk about this in particular. Also, we saw that the Royal formerly known as Prince Andrew was detained and is being investigated in the UK he's being investigated for having abused his powers as special envoy, trade envoy, and possibly having shared information that he shouldn't have with Jeffrey Epstein. And at the same time, there was another Brit who also was detained and is being investigated. He is the former British ambassador to the United States, also being investigated for having shared documents with Epstein. His name is Peter Mandelson. And finally, something's happening on our side of the pond. There's no prosecution, but there's some level of accountability. We learned in recent days that Larry Summers would been Bill Clinton's Secretary of the Treasury. He served as president of Harvard for a while and was still teaching there, was still on the staff there as an economist. He just resigned from Harvard in shame. So good. And listen, we cannot let go of this story. We just simply can't. It is up to us to continue demanding full accountability and the release of all the Epstein files. We cannot continue failing the survivors of Epstein like our governments have for four consecutive administrations. And that is why for me, it was so important to talk to Julie to get the history to go through some of these latest revelations in this last batch of files. And so we'll talk to Julie right after the break.

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[Anna Navarro]

I asked to come on today a woman who I admire enormously. She is a friend of mine, somebody whose career I have followed and supported and who I think knows the most. She is the utmost expert on Epstein, which I know is not a good thing. In fact, you know what, not only is she the utmost expert, I think Jeffrey Epstein would have never been in jail the second time. I think we would not have gotten any of these releases if it wasn't for Julie K. Brown, investigative reporter of the Miami Herald, book author. Her book Perversion of Justice is a must read. And Julie, let's not waste any time. Welcome.

[Julie K. Brown]

Thanks for having me.

[Anna Navarro]

Julie, let's break it down a little bit because I see you talking a lot, but I don't know that people understand just how crucial your involvement in this was and leading to where we are now. By the time you began investigating, you began investigating, correct me if I'm wrong, you began investigating Epstein in 2016 looking into this. That's correct.

[Julie K. Brown]

That's correct.

[Anna Navarro]

By then, it had been almost 10 years since he'd received the sweetheart deal from former Labor Secretary, then U.S. attorney Alex Acosta. So what put Epstein on your radar screen ten years after that?

[Julie K. Brown]

Well, I knew about this story and I had run across stories about it before I started investigating it. And every time I read something about how he somehow got away with his crimes even though he had sexually assaulted and molested like, dozens and dozens of girls, I just kept shaking my head thinking, how does that happen? You know? So I, I sort of had the parameters of this story. And in 2016, Trump was running for election and there was news about this lawsuit that had been filed against him and, and Epstein by this woman who claimed that when she was 13, she was raped by the two of them. And there wasn't a lot of coverage of this lawsuit in the mainstream media. And I thought, well, maybe I should just take a look at this because nobody else is doing it. Why not? So I started with the idea that I was going to just see what I could find out, look at the lawsuit, do one of those kinds of things, just take a deep dive into what the allegations were. And it sort of snowballed because this woman disappeared essentially after preparing to go public on national tv. She disappeared within days of the election and then dropped the lawsuit and. And silence. So that, of course, made me more suspicious. And I thought, you know, maybe I should start taking a look at this whole Epstein thing, which never really made sense to me to begin with.

[Anna Navarro]

And, Julia, is this going on at the same time before or after the MeToo movement?

[Julie K. Brown]

It's a good question. I started this investigation before the MeToo movement, but I benefited from the fact that the MeToo movement sort of exploded while I was investigating. And what was funny about that is my editor, you know, who backs me all the time with the work I do, he wasn't as excited about the story when I proposed it. But then the MeToo movement and Larry Nasser, the Olympic doctor, was. The gymnasts were on tv, and he's like, okay, where's the Epstein story? Because it made it more newsworthy.

[Anna Navarro]

How do you begin the research for this story? How do you begin contacting the victims, the women, now young girls, then?

[Julie K. Brown]

Well, I thought at the time, as I was digging into this, ironically, Trump nominated Alex Acosta to be his labor secretary. So think about it. I'm already deep in looking in this story, and I'm thinking, oh, my gosh, he's nominating Alex Acosta. Alex Acosta is the Miami U.S. attorney that gave Epstein this sweetheart deal. And I'm thinking, when he goes before the Senate for confirmation, they're gonna really grill him on this. And as it turned out, they really didn't grill him on it. And Acosta gave the same PAC answers that he always gave when he was asked about it, which were really non answers. And so I thought at the time I would just do a story saying he, you know, gave these answers and what do these victims. I thought, I wonder what the victims think. And I thought, you know, I would just do a react story, not a big investigation. And basically what happened is it was harder than I realized to find these girls because all their documents were redacted, their names, so we didn't know who they were. So it was an investigation at that point, because I defined them. And that was a long investigation. That part of it.

[Anna Navarro]

It's so unbelievable to me that Alex Acosta went through a full vetting, went through a full Senate investigation and confirmation hearing. And the man who gave Jeffrey Epstein the sweetheart deal was questioned, I think it was, by maybe one, maybe two senators. And they were rather small parts of the hearing. And, you know, I know Alex Acosta. I knew him then Remember, he was dean of the Florida International University Law School. I don't think he knew Trump. I actually, I actually think Marco Rubio probably suggested him to Trump, sight unseen by Trump, who owed the Cuban American community that has supported him so strongly, always owed them so something and gave them this cabinet position through Alex Acosta. I, I've always had suspicions of why Alex Acosta did that. Sweetheart deal. Do we know? Hmm.

[Julie K. Brown]

Well, let's just. I have to be careful how I answer this. I think, no, we don't know, but I've gotten a lot of. Of, let's say, intelligence or information that, you know, I've been working on for a long time. So I don't know. We really don't know for sure at this stage.

[Anna Navarro]

And do you feel like he has answered adequately? He was, he was in a Senate hearing. He was at a congressional hearing, what it was last year, I think, where he was answering questions about this. And I don't feel like he answered any questions.

[Julie K. Brown]

No. And furthermore, he was questioned by the Justice Department in an investigation or right after my series ran, I want to say 2020 or thereabouts, he was questioned. And we have the transcript, the transcripts of that were in the. Are in the Essene files. And if you look at those transcripts, they're kind of incredible because these Justice Department investigators are really skeptical of the answers that he gave. And, you know, for example, at one point he. He kept referring to the victims as women. And someone, one of the investigators finally said, stop doing that. You know, these. Weren't they girls that were 13, 14, you know, so there was quite a number of those things where they were sort of fact checking him as he was trying to answer these questions.

[Anna Navarro]

You know, my theory on this, Julie, is that he was, as U.S. attorney that was a political appointee, his term was coming to an end, he needed his next job. He's a very ambitious guy. And I think Epstein was represented by some very powerful attorneys who could either provide him a job or open doors for him. So I think he let ambition get the best of him. And I'm glad he lost his job in the Cabinet and that he's gonna have to live with the infamy of having been the guy who gave Jeffrey Epstein a free pass basically for the rest of his life. But one of the things that bothers me, it just bothers me to no end is there were so many powerful, mostly men, mostly men, some women, powerful, rich, connected. Mostly men, mostly white men, old, old

[Julie K. Brown]

white men who,

[Anna Navarro]

who knew or should have Known because it feels to me like Jeffrey Epstein never took great efforts in hiding what he was doing. In fact, if anything, he used it and let people know, be in the know and, you know, be part of the. Who didn't give a damn, Julie. They didn't give a fuck that the guy had been molesting and assaulting and harassing and raping and trafficking children. How is that possible? How do you. Are you able to reconcile that at all? Are you able to explain that at all to yourself?

[Julie K. Brown]

Well, there's two answers to that question. I would say early on, right after he got out of jail, you know, which was 13 months, and then he was on house arrest, I would say that there's a fair argument to be made for people that, you know, sort of associated with him immediately after that happened. Because, look, he designed it. He was a. He was a maestro. He and his lawyers designed that deal so that he was only charged with solicitation of prostitution with a minor and another solicitation, deportation charge. So think about it. He's going out there back to his friends, and he's saying, oh, it was a prostitution charge. I didn't know how old she was. It sounded like. And he served his time. So initially, he could have. He made that argument, I'm sure. But come 2011 and 12, when all these women. That's what changed it. All these women started coming forward and filing these civil lawsuits against, you know, there was like 100 women that were starting to, you know, by that time the discovery was coming out in those civil suits, and we were really getting a picture. You know, the other thing back up that I want to point out, that's really important that a lot of media people don't understand or forget about. When he did that deal, it was secret. It was sealed. When he went into court and did that plea, nobody showed what he was pleading to. Nobody knew anything. He went into jail. Nobody could get a copy of that deal for a whole year. So it was done in secret. So nobody really knew the extent of it.

[Anna Navarro]

Including the victims. They didn't know.

[Julie K. Brown]

Including the victims.

[Anna Navarro]

Right.

[Julie K. Brown]

And so it was secret. And then when he got out, it was sort of. When it finally was made public, it was a solicitation charge. And so, like I said, they were very skillful with how they did.

[Anna Navarro]

You know, in this country, we like to say nobody's above the law, but there were so many times that authorities and law enforcement missed or just didn't act on tips and on suspicion because he was rich, because he was powerful. Because he was connected, because he had good lawyers. Tell me about. I mean, is the first instance that we know of that this is on the. Gets on the radar of law enforcement? The Farmer sisters?

[Julie K. Brown]

Yes, yes. Will you tell us about her when came forward? Well, she. She was an art student, and she. She was introduced to him. He was sort of a patron of the arts, or I think it was more of a patron. I'm trying to get young art students, you know, to work for him so that he could, you know, rape them. But he was affiliated with art schools, and she met him through that and started sort of working for him as an assistant. And she saw a lot of things that were going on. And he met her sister, who was a lot younger than her. And then, you know, there was a lot of funny business that was going on where they were flying Maria to Ohio to stay at a house that Epstein had on the property of Les Wessner, who was the owner of Victoria's Secret. And some, you know, she's claimed that Epstein Maxwell tried to molest her. So anyway, she did go to the FBI and report several things that had happened, especially involving her sister. There was a photograph that she found missing of her sister, and she just felt that there was something not right here.

[Anna Navarro]

And that was in 19.

[Julie K. Brown]

Oh, I don't remember.

[Anna Navarro]

It was. It was in the late 90s. It was.

[Julie K. Brown]

It. I think it was in the early 90s, actually.

[Anna Navarro]

So. Well, before.

[Julie K. Brown]

Yes, he.

[Anna Navarro]

Well before he.

[Julie K. Brown]

He.

[Anna Navarro]

He was convicted of the. Of the crime that he was. So, Julie, let's move on now. And, and the reason I wanted you to lay that groundwork is because these victims have been let down time and time again for decades and decades and decades by local law enforcement, by federal law enforcement, by administration after administration. And, you know, when I do debates on TV against Trump supporters and I'm on panels with Trump supporters, they always bring up the issue, well, why do Democrats care about this now? Why are they only caring about this now? Where were they before? And frankly, I credit Trump supporters the same way I credit you for having gotten Jeffrey Epstein in jail the second time. I credit MAGA and Trump supporters for not letting this issue die because they made it a campaign issue in 2024. But I'm amongst the myriad of people that I'm pissed at over this issue is Merrick Garland, because he had the same paperwork that is getting released now, and he didn't do shit about it. He sat on it like if he was hatching an egg. He sat on that giant egg for four years. He could have released it, he could have prosecuted. But I think, in my view, Merrick Garland was so afraid of being viewed as being politicized and weaponizing the DOJ that he would ask the left hand for permission to move the right hand, and he ended up doing nothing. So are you as pissed with Merrick Garland as I am, or am I wrong to be feeling this way?

[Julie K. Brown]

I don't know if I would use the word pissed, but I. Because I have a bigger view of it. But look, the Justice Department through, I think we counted four presidential administrations failed. These women failed these victims. Undoubtedly, you know, that more should have been done. What I will argue about the Biden administration is they were prosecuting Maxwell during that period. I mean, they had an open case. So they're not going to kind of start telling you everything that they have when they have an open criminal investigation. And then even after she was convicted, she appealed. And you're not going to open your playbook and tell them everything that you're looking at when you already have an open criminal investigation going on. So that's the only defense I will say. Now, that said, what I'm seeing so far in the Epstein files, we do now have, I don't see any evidence that they really investigated. Now, who knows those. We might not have those files, but I don't. I wonder if Trump would let us see files, for example, if. Let's just say victims came forward and said that, that Trump was somehow involved. We don't see those files, but that doesn't mean it didn't happen. So it's hard to know what the Biden, Biden administration was doing.

[Anna Navarro]

Well, I don't think it was Joe Biden doing any of it. I don't think it was the president or the vice president doing anything of it. But I think there's far more that Merrick Garland could have and should have done. But, okay, so we are where we are now. And in part, it is again, because MAGA wouldn't let go of it, because the podcasters, the blogosphere, the MAGA supporting women in Congress and some, some of the Republican congresspeople did not bend despite incredible pressure from the Trump administration. Marjorie Taylor Greene talked about getting a call from Donald Trump asking her to change her vote on the release of the Epstein files. And she says that he told her, a lot of my friends are going to get hurt. And now that we see the release, I tend to believe her that Donald Trump said that to her, because, in fact, there are a lot of people that he knows that are from the financial circles or philanthropic circles or social circles of New York and other areas that he knows that are part of. Of his circle. So, okay, we are where we are. We've got still. I mean, it might be 3 million documents, but it's still only a fraction of what they have. What do you see in these files? What has caught. As somebody that knows every. You know, as much as there is to know about this, what caught your attention? What names surprised you? What. What's. What stood out to you?

[Julie K. Brown]

Well, keep in mind there are 3 million documents, right? So I don't think I've seen. Maybe I saw, like, I don't know, a couple of thousands. So I haven't seen it all. And what's kind of cool is all the members of the public that are sending me information and other journalists things that they see because we can't possibly see everything. So I'm getting a lot of good tips. But what strikes me so far, because my piece of the story was really, and I think it's an important piece, is when you think about it, if Alex Acosta had done a different job, his job, we wouldn't be sitting here right now. Epstein would have gone to jail probably for the rest of his life. So that piece of it, to me is really important to look at. And what I am seeing from not only the time that that deal was being negotiated, but even in the years following that, 2011, 12, 13, Epstein was contacting all these prosecutors from Miami and anyone he could to try to get them under his roof. He was offering them jobs. One of the attorneys, one of the former, one of the architects of his plea deal, was meeting with him for breakfast, lunch, and dinner. And, you know, it was clear that. That Epstein. There's emails where Epstein is saying to him, will you take this case for me? I want you to do this for me. You know, will you take that? Now he's arguing he didn't really get any business from Acosta. So why is he, this lawyer, still meeting with him over, you know, a long period of time, seven years? So Epstein had a playbook. He was trying to get everybody in his pocket, and that's. And the lengths to which he tried to get them under, you know, his thumb, are really interesting, the things that he did. And so that's what I'm working on right now.

[Anna Navarro]

And it's. It's. It's, you know, what comes out very clear from. From the release of these documents is what a mastermind he was in manipulating people, powerful people, and Using them to, using each one of them to validate him with the other. Using Peter Thiel to validate him with the other crypto guys. Using his relationship with Bill Gates to validate him with the Prime Minister of Israel. Using his relationship with the Prime Minister of Israel to validate him with Harvard. I mean, he just, it was like a shell game where he just, he just shifted influence around, put all of these pictures in his townhouses and homes and showed off his influence. And I just kind of think like it's that group think, well, you know, well, if Bill Gates is okay with him, then he is okay. If Bill Clinton is okay with him, then he's gotta be okay. If Donald Trump's okay with him. You know, that kind of validation and groupthink and he got away with it for so long. So can we talk a little bit about the Clintons? When you saw those pictures that came out in December, that were released in December of Bill Clinton, you know, bare chested in a pool, Bill Clinton in like silk pajama looking things, kimonos. I don't know what they were, but they were silk and tacky next to Jeffrey Epstein. How did that. Because it made me feel all sorts of ways. And how did, how did it make you feel?

[Julie K. Brown]

You know, I wasn't surprised because I already had talked to women who, you know, were on that flight when they went to Africa and did all those flights. So I, I sort of knew we know what Clinton's M.O. is. I mean, he has a history of, you know, you know, liking beautiful women around him. So it didn't shock me. I, I would say, you know, we don't have any evidence that he, I haven't spoken to a single victim who has told me that they had sex with him. To be honest with you. That doesn't mean it didn't happen. It's just that I don't, I haven't found it. But it's creepy. It's like you said earlier, it's all these people that didn't recognize, wait a minute, this guy's a pedophile that was molesting 13 and 14 year olds. I don't think I should. And interesting. It seems like most of the women, like Tina Brown, for example, it was women that kind of were invited to some of his events or dinners who said, no, are you crazy? I'm not going to that. But the men didn't do that. And certainly it didn't bother Clinton hanging around with him. So, you know, it's, it's more of that Tawdry. What are you thinking? And, you know, why would you do this kind of thing, you know?

[Anna Navarro]

You know, I, I, I still can't believe Hillary Clinton allowed. Ghislaine, Ghislaine. I don't know how, I don't know how the, to pronounce her name. I'm not gonna learn. I don't want to learn. Had her at Chelsea's wedding. And, you know, this was after Epstein had served time in jail. This was after he, I think he was at, in home arrest at the time of that, of that wedding. And they certainly knew the relationship and association between Epstein and Maxwell. And to me, that's something that I just don't understand how somebody like Hillary Clinton, for whom I have great respect, they didn't say, no, that can't come to this wedding. I'm sorry. You know, they claim that she came as somebody's plus one. But I mean, I'd like to think that if my daughter was, have, was getting married or I was having some sort of social event and somebody was bringing a, you know, Ghisain Maxwell as the plus one, I would say no, they, they, they don't get a plus one. They either come alone or they don't come, you know, but I mean, it's just disappointing. Do you think it makes sense to call the Clintons up to testify like Congress is doing?

[Julie K. Brown]

Absolutely. I think everybody that had an association with him is open or it deserves to be at least looked at. And absolutely, I think that they should be transparent and if they have nothing to hide, then testify.

[Anna Navarro]

So even with the release of these documents, I feel like we're still letting these women down. And Donald Trump was answering questions about it earlier this week, and he said it's time to move on. And this is a Department of justice under Pam Bondi that and Todd Blanche, that when Donald Trump says jump, they say, how high? So if he's saying it's time to move on, my feeling is they're going to move on because they've so far done everything he has said. Are these girls, are these women ever gonna get closure, justice? I mean, what, and you know what I want you to tell us what can we do as regular citizens interested in this?

[Julie K. Brown]

I have a couple answers. First of all, what I would say to anyone that says let's move on. I wonder if Trump would say, still feel that way if his daughter was molested or raped by another, you know, older man when she was 13 or 14. I wonder if he would just say to his daughter, let's Move on. Let's forget about it. I mean, it should be thought about like that. It could have been your daughter. You know, these were young girls. And to say move on to someone when they were 13 or 14, which is very damaging. The younger you are, the more it damages you. One of the reasons why I kept going on this story was once I started finding out who these women were, I saw a pattern. All of them, their lives had completely changed. Some of them were honor roll students. Their whole lives fell apart after this happened. So it's really, I think, really horrible to say, let's move on when you have so many women that have been sexually abused.

[Anna Navarro]

And most of them, if not all of them, were, Were poor, were disadvantaged.

[Julie K. Brown]

That's right.

[Anna Navarro]

People, they were praying. They were preying on young, poor girls. They weren't preying on the. On the daughters of the members of Mar a Lago. They weren't preying on the daughters of the circle that they ran in. They were going out and actively searching for poor, disadvantaged girls and grooming and preying on them.

[Julie K. Brown]

Right. And as far as whether they're ever going to see, you know, justice, I think justice is different for different victims here. But I think overall, it looks like now, at least under the Trump administration, there's not going to be. Todd Blanche has said he's not going. It's game over. You know, they're not going to investigate anybody else. But how can they?

[Anna Navarro]

How can they so shamelessly, for example, even with everything that has been released now and that the public is seeing, how can they possibly justify having Ghislaine Maxwell having moved her after that interview to a spa of a prison where she gets to play with a puppy and get massages and do yoga? What in the actual hell is that? You know, how is that possible? And that nobody raises an eyebrow and says, you know, even if it's just for optics, maybe we need to move this bitch back to where she was. I mean, it's just, you know, it defies credulity. Julie, before we go, because I know you have to go one, I want to thank you again, because I think as far as we've gotten, none of this would have happened had it not been for you and your efforts and your series and your report. You told us you were working on another piece. Can you tell us what it's, what the gist of it is?

[Julie K. Brown]

Well, we're finding a lot of new information in these files. It's just taking us a long time to put them together because these stories and I'm sure all the media is struggling with this. First of all, even downloading these files is a nightmare. It took days for some media outlets to download these files, and they're not very searchable on the web where they are now. So putting it into our own on purpose. Yeah, it's a mess. So you might see some. An email here that implicates someone, and then you all of a sudden find one that clears it up. So it's very. It's very hard to do these stories, but we are putting together some stories that will provide more insight into what the FBI knew. So as we end.

[Anna Navarro]

As we. As we end, can you just give us a call to action? Like, what are people listening to this podcast? What are regular Americans? What can we do to make sure that these women get some justice at some point?

[Julie K. Brown]

Well, I think everybody should be calling there. I know it sounds like a broken record, but everybody really needs to contact their local representatives, especially if their representatives haven't been active in this. And they need to tell them how important this story is, because it really is about trust and transparency in our government systems. And if we just ignore, you know, one man or, you know, we know of others, too, who are. Who committed this kind of heinous crime, what does that really say about us as. As a, you know, as a country, you know, we should be protecting the most vulnerable in our country. And to ignore this and to forget about it, which a lot of people, I think, would like us to do in our government, I think really says that we aren't really good human beings.

[Anna Navarro]

Julie, what it says is that. That, no, not everybody is equal under the law. It says that if you're rich and powerful, you can get away with things that others don't, whether your name is Jeffrey Epstein or Harvey Weinstein or P. Diddy or fill in the blank. But listen, I. I love you. I appreciate you. I respect you enormously. It's a reminder to everybody to support local journalism. Without this story in the Miami Herald, we would not be where we are. And we will keep talking because we're not about to let this story die. Thank you for your time today, Julie. And we've got other big topics to talk about when we get back.

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[Angela Yee]

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[Anna Navarro]

And before we say goodbye, you know, I like to end all the episodes by highlighting my hero of the week and my cobarde, my coward of the week. Let's start with a coward. This week it goes to Congressman Tony Gonzalez. He's from Texas. He represents part of San Antonio and Uvalde. And this story is horrible, it is tragic, it is shameful. He was having allegedly an affair with one of his staffers, his district director in Uvalde. Her name was Regina Santos Aviles. She died after the affair was revealed. She set herself on fire and died by suicide. Died the next day in a hospital in excruciating pain. Her husband had discovered the texts of the affair and her husband says she had been tremendously despondent after the affair was discovered and she was ostracized professionally. And of course they were having all sorts of issues as a result. But here's the point. This guy, Tony Gonzalez, congressman, is not resigning. And the speaker of the House, Mike Johnson is not forcing him to resign. They're just kind of hands off. There's even Republicans, Republican women like Lauren Boebert and Anna Paulina Luna of Florida and Nancy Mays of South Carolina, all Republicans who have called for his resignation. It is disgusting that this man is still serving in the House. Of course he's a Republican and Mike Johnson needs his vote. And that's why Mike Johnson is pretending that there is nothing to see here. But I want to ask the people of Texas because the primary is tomorrow. The primary is March 3rd in Texas and Tony Gonzalez is running for reelection. You all this man has to lose. It is unacceptable that somebody who is a fake holy roller, he's married with six kids and who was engaged in this kind of relationship. It wasn't just an affair. It was an affair with somebody who was working for him. A young woman who was working for him and was married and who he asked for lewd pictures. She pushed back. This guy cannot continue in Congress. So Texas, since he doesn't have the

[Julie K. Brown]

shame

[Anna Navarro]

to resign, it's up to you to resign for him. It's up to you to kick him out of the House and make sure he doesn't get reelected. Now I want to talk about something happy. I want to talk about the hero of the week for me. It's this cop who adopted the dog abandoned in the Las Vegas airport. I don't know if you all saw this story, but there's this two year old Goldendoodle and his owner. She was set to travel. She hadn't filled out the paperwork. She was told that she couldn't bring the dog on the plane. You have to fill out all sorts of paperwork and get the forms in before flying with a dog. This bitch just left the dog there, tied the dog up to the counter and abandoned the dog and went to get on her plane. She ended up getting arrested for abandonment of an animal. And the officer, Skeeter Black. God, what a great name. Who assisted in rescuing the dog from the airport. He and his family ended up adopting the dog. This dog is going to have such a much better life because of this. They ended up naming him JetBlue because he was abandoned at the counter of JetBlue. So this is a happy, a sad story with a happy ending and with a great hero, Officer Skeeter Black Chacha. Did you like that story? She's a golden doodle. You're a poodle. You're almost related. Okay, so that's it for this week. Thank you all for listening and see you next week Monday when we talk to Jorge and Paola Ramos and dig into the situation in Mexico and all around the Western Hemisphere. Thank you so much for your support for your listenership. I am reading your replies and your comments, so leave me your thoughts and your opinions. Bleep with Ana Navarro is a Hyphenate Media Group Production in partnership with iHeart's My Cultura podcast Network. For more of your favorite shows, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

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[Angela Yee]

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