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- [00:02]
A
When the holidays start to feel a bit repetitive, reach for a Sprite Winter Spiced Cranberry and put your twist on tradition. A bold cranberry and winter spice flavor fusion Sprite Winter Spice Cranberry is a refreshing way to shake things up this sipping season, and only for a limited time. Sprite Obey your thirst.
- [00:30]
B
Jake here. As you know, my whole life has been a wild ride, and honestly, it's gone crazier since Blink launched back in February. Blink has been voted best of 2025 by Apple, which is crazy, but not surprising because arguably I do have the craziest story ever. And that only happens because for you, the listener. So thank you. Thank you for listening, thank you for caring, and thank you for the overwhelming support. A lot has happened since the show came out. There are updates, there are things I haven't talked about, and there are a lot of questions I promise to get to. So today we're doing something a little different, a Q and A episode. Let's get into this.
- [01:26]
C
Foreign.
- [01:33]
B
I want to introduce Hannah Smith. Hannah's a big fan of Blink. She's an incredible journalist, and you might know her from shows like the Opportunist and her current show, the Knife, a true crime podcast.
- [01:48]
C
Hi, Jake. I'm so glad to be here today with you.
- [01:51]
B
Hi, Hannah. It's amazing. Thanks.
- [01:54]
C
You know, I'm such a huge podcast fan as someone in the industry, and I listen to a lot of shows and Blink was one of my absolute favorites from this year. So I'm just thrilled to be here with you today. You know, you guys covered so much in the series, but there's so much to the story that the listeners have so many more questions. And so we've gathered those questions, and I'm excited that I get to be the one to ask them to you today.
- [02:20]
B
Thank you so much for being such a fan. And it's amazing to hear how you love the show. I really wanted to get someone who was a true Die Hard fan to host these Q and A's.
- [02:34]
C
Well, I've listened to the whole series twice, so I am a certified fan.
- [02:39]
B
I know that you're not the only one who's listened to it more than once, but really, thank you. Thank you.
- [02:47]
C
We have so much to cover. You shared with me just some of the questions that you've gotten, but it's hundreds and hundreds of questions from people who are curious about your life and where things are now. So we're gonna cover a lot of that. We're gonna get into medical questions locked in Syndrome, your recovery updates on things that have happened even since the last episode of Blink in June of 2025. And of course, we are going to talk about legal questions and where things stand with Ellen. So do you want to just jump into it?
- [03:22]
B
Please take it away. I'm super excited.
- [03:25]
C
Well, I want to start. You know, in the last episode of Blink, you talked about how you had been doing since the launch. Um, you talked about being really excited about the show coming out and your story, but then experiencing some unexpected feelings. You went through sort of a, you know, short period of depression, but then also you had to deal with this new reality of becoming a recognizable person. All of these people hearing your story, hearing intimate details about your life that you don't know. You know, how are you doing now after a few months since that update? How is that for you now?
- [04:04]
B
I've certainly acclimated a little better. I mean, as you mentioned, I definitely went through. It was really strange with that bout of minor depression for, I would say, seven, 10 days. I really worked hard to document this whole story during the worst of times. And then I had this PR strategy that I implemented to, you know, searching socials in prep for this launch. And everything worked out, obviously. It became best of 2025 by Apple. And even with every step of the way at working out, I still felt this kind of weirdness, this shame, this depression. And I couldn't understand it. I really couldn't, because it wasn't like, oh, everyone knows that I was a heroin addict. That's obvious. I was talking about that the whole time. It was something else. And I don't know if it was my expectation of how I would feel once I told the story the way I wanted to tell it, if I thought I would feel a different way. And it just felt not great, I guess so. I still don't understand why that is. Anyway, since that last episode came out, I've definitely acclimated to it. And I'm just me. I'm just me. And what happened, it's history. I can't change it. And I'm not, certainly not the old me. There are elements of the old me, like my personality, definitely not my voice, but my personality, how I think and problem solve. But the addict Jake is gone.
- [06:05]
C
Another thing that's changed is that you do a lot of speaking at, like, medical conferences. It's astounding, really. You're the only person on record who has ever reached stage four of. And let me make. See if I can say this right. Acute, toxic, progressive leukoencephalopathy and survived. So that makes you incredibly unique and I imagine, incredibly interesting to the medical community. How has your story being out there in a bigger way affected that? How has it been received by the medical community?
- [06:42]
B
Very well. I do a lot of public speaking. Everything from kids, kind of in my day, it was called dare. I don't know if it still is called dare. Talks like that. And I'm not like, don't do this. My approach is very much like, crazy, horrible things can happen to you. You should have an understanding of what can happen. Choices have consequences. Here's my story. To medical, to corporate retreats, all that, but specifically with the medical community. They're usually astounded. And I would say 90% of the medical community were, like, unaware that this can fully happen, that someone has come out on the other side. I can speak about it. And really it's. It's a lesson on how they can treat, detect, notice things and make the experience for someone who's going through the unbelievable and the awful a little bit better. So it's questions like, is there anything we could do? What. What type of TV would you have liked on?
- [08:04]
C
Well, what's the answer to that? Because that was a question that I had when I was listening to the podcast. You know, I think it was so haunting, the moment when you realized, oh, people have stopped talking to me. Like, you know, a lot of us have spent time in hospitals for whatever reason, visiting people or there ourselves, and were familiar with a nurse walking in or a doctor walking in. The first thing they do is introduce themselves and say, I'm here to do whatever. And that stopped happening. Which. Which just sounds so lonely. What would have been better for you? Would you prefer people to continue to talk to you? Would you want the TV on?
- [08:40]
B
I think what it comes down to is variety. Too much of anything is awful. It can be torturous. I've said this Law and Order SVU was, for some reason on Marathon. And I kept saying in my head, sarcastically, how much can one dying man take of rape? Constantly. It was just like, it's like a. That wasn't my favorite show. My now ex wife, Ellen, they were like, what does he like? She was like, I like Sonor. Okay, well, maybe not in this situation when I'm like, dying.
- [09:18]
C
Yeah.
- [09:19]
B
And stuck with thoughts. But the answer is you, the individual right now. If you love EDM music, you're not going to know what you love when you're dying, paralyzed, or just stuck in the hospital and can't communicate. It Having said that, variety. There's going to be a time where you want something more upbeat. There's going to be a time where you might want a little audiobook. Someone to like, come and say, it's going to be okay regardless of this situation. Just breathe, relax. Let me read you a half hour of audiobook. Go back to some calm TV or music if they're a sports guy. For instance. I like sports. Recovering. Even when I got out of lockdown, I couldn't watch sports for two years. I put on an NFL game and it made me. It made me cry. Honestly, I. I kind of thought, I'll never be able to do that again. Oh my God, look. Look at how fast they are. Look how strong they are. And I couldn't watch sports for a while.
- [10:39]
C
Yeah, that's such a good point. That everything had changed for your reality and your life. And so it makes sense that the things that you would have enjoyed watching are going to be different and are going to affect you in a different way.
- [10:53]
B
I still think the answer to that question is definitely variety. Into the other question of would you like people to talk to you? For sure. Calm, soothing tones, tell me about your day. But again, I'm that type of person. You know, there might be someone who's just like, shut up. Leave me the fuck alone. I'm dying.
- [11:17]
C
Yeah, good point.
- [11:28]
A
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- [11:57]
C
Close your eyes.
- [11:59]
A
Exhale. Feel your body relax and let go.
- [12:02]
B
Of whatever you're carrying today.
- [12:05]
C
Well, I'm letting of the worry that I wouldn't get my new contacts in time for this class. I got them delivered free from 1-800-contacts. Oh my gosh, they're so fast.
- [12:13]
B
And breathe.
- [12:14]
C
Oh, sorry. I almost couldn't breathe when I saw the discount they gave me on my first order. Oh, sorry. Namaste. Visit 1-800-contacts.com today to save on your first order. 1-800-contacts. You know, a lot of people had questions about Locked in syndrome. What was the. What the total time that you were experiencing locked in syndrome. Like, what was that amount of time?
- [12:49]
B
9 months and 3 weeks of totally locked in I did fluctuate a bit through states of consciousness. I'm paralyzed. I'm not able to blink. But there's a Glasgow Coma Scale, believe it or not, where they rate people in these levels of states of consciousness. And I was definitely vegetated for a point in time. I was deemed disconnected from reality at times. And there were on the tail end of falling into it and exiting it, moments where they're like, did he just blink? You know, but that was nine months and three weeks, so essentially 10 months.
- [13:38]
C
Wow. So your experience thinking back about that was that, like, you were conscious and aware at times, and then at times you were more so out of it.
- [13:51]
B
Hmm. Again, you're talking to someone who's dissected their million pages of medical records. So during that time, it just felt like, hello, guys, I'm in here. I wish you could understand me. Yeah, it was kind of all the same for me. Total nightmare. It's unimaginable. It's. It's. I'll give you a bunch of adjectives in kind of a word salad to explain it, but it comes down to it's unimaginable. You cannot believe this is possible to happen to a human.
- [14:32]
C
Yeah. You know, in the episode called Blink Twice, you talked about this really unusual thing that happened to you during that time. You talked about, like, this voice that you would talk to, which was really just you, but you kind of had this experience where it was separated from, like, more of like the scared voice and then a wise voice, and you had these conversations with yourself. I'm so curious. Two things. What you think the purpose of that voice was, and also, can you still hear it?
- [15:07]
B
I think now the purpose of that voice I'm going to answer in the now was coping. Straight up coping. My brain was firing somehow on all cylinders through this traumatic, extraordinary brain injury I had with so much alone time in isolation and overhearing, you're going to die, now you're in hospice and you're aware, oh, you got hours left, keep hearing this. You just kind of come to a conclusion. This is it. This is reality. And I think in order to cope this happened. I was always talking to myself, but I was talking to myself in ways people talk to themselves about their day. But this two voice thing just happened. I use the term rock bottom loosely because throughout my life, I hit rock. I thought I hit rock bottom multiple times, but this was really the rock bottom when I realized there's something scarier than death, and that's being stuck in my own body, paralyzed for the duration of my life, which at that time, I thought, I'm like, 30. This really could be 50 to 60 years. Unimaginable.
- [16:36]
C
Unimaginable.
- [16:38]
B
And I just think it's coping. Coping. And to answer the other one, I know I no longer hear that voice.
- [16:50]
C
One last question with the locked in. You know, you talked about this idea of, like, wow, I could be looking at 50 years of this and the dread of that. And then In July of 2018, Dr. Levison at MGH noticed your wrist move. And then a bunch of things happened. But that kind of started off this thing that led to the staff finally understanding, oh, wow, you're in there. What did it feel like when you realized, wow, someone is finally understanding that I'm conscious of, wow.
- [17:26]
B
What's so crazy, too, is I can. You asked me this stuff, and I go right there. And I was obviously nine months, two weeks, three weeks into when he actually noticed this. I had lost all hope, really. And I would say I was like. And maybe this is. I don't know if it's a draugr term nowadays, but I was a little bipolar. And what I mean by that. I don't know if it's the morning or the night or whatever, but three hours of really negative kill me now. I just. Please let me die. To the occasional. Really, I'm gonna. I'm gonna get out of here again. And I heard those fireworks, right? And that. That's what led to me on 4th of July being like, oh, I know where I am. I'm gonna see those fireworks again one day. And I tried to time it out exactly in my medical records. Looks like it was between 24 and 48 hours later than this that Steve Levinson noticed this minor wrist movement. What'd it feel like? I heard that, and it felt like I was a kid at a bowling alley or like, with the best day of his life, you know, kid in a candy store. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. Oh, my God, is this real? Is this real? Is this real? And as I keep doing that, I hear that was involuntary from other doctors. And I went to, oh, no. Oh, my God, it's not. They're gonna. And then Stephen goes, hey, I don't know if he can hear me, but if he can do it again. And that feeling was, oh, my God, I am noticed. I have to. I fucking have to with all my might. Do this again. This is my one chance. It's like the most important thing I'll ever do, you know, this is. This is my one shot.
- [19:48]
C
Yeah. Wow.
- [19:49]
B
That's. That's how it felt.
- [19:51]
C
That's wild. And, and you did. And you, and you moved your wrist again. And I mean, I think that that story too is like such a good, I don't know, example of everything else that was to come with your, your rehab and physical therapy and your recovery was this like extreme motivation to make progress and get better. A lot of people had questions about your therapy and the progress that you've been making. You share a lot about this on your social media, on your Instagram. A big question people have is, you know, what has been the hardest therapy milestone for you?
- [20:32]
B
Just like everything Jake Handle, I will need to break this down into time frames. Where I'm at now, where I was at then I would say, well, in retrospect, looking back when I was still non verbal and just notice and the, the four months and everything, everything but the pain was really hard. And I was somebody that was so motivated and honored or that I was at the caliber of hospitals I was, was at. And I fully said I'm gonna do whatever it takes to myself. They know best. Do that. The serial casting. Again, for context, when you're mobile for so long, the human body just starts to contract. So all your fingers, your phalanges, they fold inwards. My nails were stuck in my palms, My ankles were flexed downward, I believe negative 60 degrees, which, you know, ballerinas can do very nicely, but hard when.
- [21:46]
C
You'Re trying to walk around.
- [21:48]
B
Totally. And in the time frame talking about there was certainly none of that, but there was a lot of serial casting, which gave me the basis for where I'm at now. And what that means is they just pry and stretch you open as hard as it can go. It feels like you're, you know, they're, they're molding you like clay. They're contorting you to reverse. These contractors, and it's like three people, they get you open as much as possible and they lay a bunch of plaster and everything else and they cast you and it hurts like hell. And they hold you in that for about two weeks, cut it off, do it again. So every, every round you get a little morange, a little morange, a little more inch. At least that's the hope. And it doesn't always work, but this was a painful 16 month process that stopped during COVID and then restarted. I mean, I would say the hardest thing for me right now is my balance and my walking. And although they've done an amazing job reversing these contractures, my Ankles are. They don't have much bend to them. They don't have much flex. So for any skiers out there, when you've seen me or if you see me on Instagram starting to walk with no device or with their device, you have to imagine I'm walking in ski bindings that are set very, very tight. And this is something, mentally, that has been really paining me because I don't think this is ever going to get better. And you're talking to one of the most positive persons on the planet. I'm saying this because experts are kind of like, well, you've come so far, you're functional. But it's like, yeah, I'm functional in the sense of I can walk in ski boots. What about when I want to run or my balance gets worked out and I can. I think my ankles are going to be holding me back so much to the point where I'm like, should we cut these things off below the knee and get me some prosthetics with some bend? And that sounds crazy and aggressive, but this is. Honestly, I'm contemplating it, but the only way it would make sense is if my balance is fully worked out at that point. And then I start a whole new, different recovery process. Because if I'm walking with prosthetics with balance issues, it's gonna be even harder and more painful.
- [24:49]
C
Yeah. Wow. Yeah. There's still a lot to figure out and work through. But even as. As you said here and previously, you have a lot of goals still that you're wanting to progress, and you wanna be able to. To walk with more ease than you do now. And so, you know, you also, I imagine you've been told many times over the course of your recovery that you might not even get to where you.
- [25:15]
B
Are now for sure. I mean, it started with, you're going to die, like, by Christmas, one week into the New Year, all in hospice. Okay. Survived. He's never. And I heard this after the fact, but when Levinson noticed me and they got me to Spalding, and real quick, really shout out Steve Levinson. Without him, I certainly would not be here. But also, I never knew this, but Spalding denied me. And without Spalding, like I said, they gave me the foundation for my recovery. They denied me. He denied their denial.
- [26:06]
C
Oh, wow.
- [26:08]
B
Yeah. Which meant, legally, I could not go anywhere else. I would be at MGH until they accepted me. I don't know if it was court or what, but he denied their denial. And by doing that, I ended up at Spalding.
- [26:26]
C
Wow.
- [26:27]
B
Dr. Levinson. What a guy. I don't know how he found so much time, was so observant with every patient. So really shout out him. Thank you so much if you ever hear this. I heard after the fact that at Spalding, they were kind of like, he's probably never gonna verbally speak, you know, or get out of the hospital, like nursing home. So I went to a nursing home after that. And in early 2019, that's when a lot of magic started happening. That's when I started making infancy baby sounds. I was proficient, non verbal, started to move a digit, or I could raise my arm, all these things started happening. And then it was, yeah, but he'll never walk and likely knock it out of the rehearsing home. And then I went back to mgh and they were like, we really, we really don't know anymore. But like, you know, they were still thinking. And I know this again from talking to them now, that the likelihood of me walking around was very slim. And then I got out of the hospital and started to walk and they're, they're tripping out. And one thing I know is they don't say never anymore, but they're saying never on these ankles. And I kind of. I kind of do feel that something radical will need to happen. And I've done it all. They've shot me up with the legal amount. Before poisoning of Botox, one can get into your ankles. Yeah. And that helps. Aggressive stretching, that will loosen you up for three months. It also weakens you, so you gotta be like, very careful. But I'm a strong guy, so I'm like, give me the dose. Let's see. That's not working. Nothing is working.
- [28:31]
C
Hmm. Wow.
- [28:33]
B
But, you know, I still am certainly grateful for where I'm at. I'm happy with my life and I'm gonna keep trying regardless.
- [28:43]
C
Yeah. You know, it's interesting even hearing you talk and reflect about the journey that you've been through and people saying you might not ever be able to talk. It's just so. I mean, it's so wild as someone who, you know, met you in person for the first time recently, and it's just so hard to imagine you like that because you're. You're not like that at all now. You know, it's like, wow, I can't believe that that was your reality. It's, it's. I mean, obviously I believe it, but it's just. It's pretty wild to think about you and me both.
- [29:14]
B
You and me both. And Doug here we have The Limu emu in its natural habitat, helping people customize their car insurance and save hundreds with Liberty Mutual.
- [29:38]
C
Fascinating.
- [29:39]
B
It's accompanied by his natural ally, Doug Limu.
- [29:43]
C
Is that guy with the binoculars watching us?
- [29:45]
A
Us?
- [29:45]
C
Cut the camera.
- [29:46]
B
They see us.
- [29:46]
D
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- [30:32]
C
So we have a bunch of questions to get through. I'm going to ask a few more medical ones because we have a lot of other stuff to talk about. You had quite a few questions about autonomic storming, you know, and blink. You said at one point, from November 17th to February 19th, you stormed every day. A lot of people want to know if you still experienced that or if not, when was the last time that you stormed?
- [30:56]
B
I don't still experience that. Storming is obviously very intense during this intense time. It was every day between 12 and 18 hours a day, and then it subsided to four hours a day. And then I had. I would call it residual effects of storming. So these were not severe storms, but for like a year, I'd feel my heartache starting to go, and I'd be like, you really gotta calm down. You really gotta calm down. And then with that, I'd overheat and I get really, really cold, and I could switch on a dime. These are the residual effects, spasms, you know, but again, infrequent, not constant. So just very residual. What I experience nowadays is I am very sensitive, not really to hot, but definitely to cold, which is the reverse. So if you ever see me roaming around Boston and I'm shivering and it's not that bad out, that's probably a residual effect of storming. But no, thankfully, that chapter seems to be closed.
- [32:17]
C
Yeah. Okay, good. Besides, you know, the physical aspects that you've spoken about since you. Your recovery, is there anything else that you notice that's different about your brain? Like, is there other things that you're like, oh, yeah, this is different from before.
- [32:36]
B
Give me an example.
- [32:38]
C
I don't know, like, I'm Just. Cause I was just thinking like, oh, yeah, brain damage and brain injuries. You hear about people having extreme brain injuries and then they're like, oh, like I can't. My long term memory is affected, or my ability to count or like random stuff that your brain might be missing or different.
- [33:01]
B
Yeah, I understand. No, I'm really sharp. I'm sharper than I've ever been. One thing I noticed that's different, which might be obvious, but I'll say it is. Everyone knows I was an addict, but they mainly know it was a heroin addict. But if it wasn't heroin, if I couldn't find it, was an addict to everything, everything. Sex, alcohol. And it was more, more, more, more constantly. And I don't, I don't crave anything. I mean, who doesn't like sex? But I mean, it's not like I wake up and I'm like, ugh, life sucks. I should take a bunch of whatever I can get my hands on. I certainly don't have that anymore. I think my sleep is different. I don't require a lot of sleep. I operate on like five hours a night regardless. If I go to bed late at night. If I go to bed at 8pm, I'm up at 1am for the day. Right. That's different because I was somebody that worked long hours of Chef and I. When I could sleep, I could sleep for. Until you wake me up or I'm sleeping the whole day away. I mean, I really am the same person with these minor tweaks.
- [34:28]
C
I have some questions about addiction that I want to get into, but I want to make sure I have two other questions medical before I move on real quick. So I may have missed this. I don't know. I listened to the whole podcast twice, but I could have missed it. There was a point after you've been diagnosed and you know you're losing your ability to move, to speak. And at one point you see this doctor who I think is Dr. Vena. And there's this whole scene where you say you ask. I think you ask Ellen to ask him, am I gonna die? And you're watching his face and she asks him, he wants to know if he's gonna die. And you're like, he looked confused. And he said, I don't think so. And I'm just curious, like, did he not know what your diagnosis was? Or why did he say, no, he's not going to die? Did you ever talk to him later?
- [35:25]
B
No. And I would love to know the answer to this. First of all, Dr. Vena is the world expert on a number of things, but happens to be in this super rare disease. And I knew this. And you're recollection of this scene is spot on, very accurate. I know for a fact he knew the answer. Right.
- [35:52]
C
Are you saying that then or now in reflection? Both.
- [35:57]
B
Okay, both, actually. And what? I don't know if he was thinking then, yeah, he's gonna die, but he doesn't need to hear that right now. That's what I don't know. And the way he answered gave me so much hope. I mean, because I. I like zoomed in. I swear to God, when you're losing all abilities, your senses get heightened. I was able to like zoom in with my eyes and they had me rolled over in a stretcher so I could zoom in. And I was looking for micro facial expressions. And I mean, very convincing. If he really was like, I'm gonna lie right now because this guy needs to hear that. But the way he answered was like, oh, well, if the world expert doesn't think so, maybe I'm not.
- [36:56]
C
I mean, I imagine that gave you a lot of hope going forward.
- [36:59]
B
Totally, totally. I mean, things got dark as hell. But I mean, okay, there is a possibility because Dr. Venner, I've seen Dr. Vena once since I've been out of the hospital, which was December 2020, and he's such a rock star physician. He's rolling around with like 20 people clipboards. Right. Like rock star physician. It's crazy.
- [37:33]
C
Well, if you see him again, I'd be really curious to know the answer to that question.
- [37:38]
B
I know, I gotta, gotta get in touch with him. And it's not lack of trying.
- [37:45]
C
Yeah, I mean, it sounds like he's a busy guy. Okay, I have to admit, there's one way in which listening to this podcast has actually changed some of my habits. And that is I have eaten significantly more blueberries since listening to this podcast.
- [38:03]
B
Fucking right. Let's go. That's awesome.
- [38:06]
C
Like, if this guy who's basically a medical miracle was eating a ton of blueberries before this happened, and since then, there's gotta be something to it. But I'm curious, you know, in all of the medical conferences that you've been to and talked to people, has this ever come up? Has anyone ever come up to you and said like, there might be something to the fact that you were eating all these blueberries or.
- [38:28]
B
No, no. But I do. You know, as this turns out, I've always fucking loved blueberries, you know, and again, there's no Treatment for this, where it was like, high doses of three vitamins might do something. Anything else. Blubers. Okay. Ate a shitload of them. I honestly feel like blueberries had something to do with it.
- [38:57]
C
Do you still eat a lot of blueberries?
- [38:59]
B
I do. I wish I ate more. And, like, when I get them, I overeat them. Like two pints.
- [39:05]
C
Yeah.
- [39:07]
B
And I can put a whole pint in a smoothie.
- [39:09]
C
Oh, they're so good.
- [39:11]
B
I'm just very happy, among all the things I do that I'm changing the world by opening people up to eating more blueberries.
- [39:22]
C
Yeah. Big Blueberry should sponsor Blink, please.
- [39:27]
B
We do ad reads.
- [39:30]
C
Okay. So you talked about your heroin addiction very openly on the podcast. Even in this conversation, you've talked about, you know, not just heroin, but just that sort of addictive personality or whatever that is. In the podcast, you said, thinking back about before your diagnosis, there was a point in your life when you weren't really sure if you would ever be able to get clean and quit heroin. Like, you really weren't sure if. If that would be possible. And then you were kind of, like, forced to. Even though I. I don't want to say it wasn't your decision, because it was. But you got diagnosed, you went to the hospital, and then in May of 2017, I believe you talked about this decision, like, okay, no, I'm not doing this anymore. I'm gonna actually try to live the best life I can if I'm gonna die or fight. A lot of people have written questions about this to you, but they wanna know, you know, what is your relationship with addiction now?
- [40:32]
B
I don't think I have a relationship with addiction now. I know I'm addicted to, like, having a good time. That doesn't mean substance. I think addiction, being an addict. I probably will always be an addict. I am an addict. But now it's not about substance. It's about doing fun things. It's about building things. It's about the next activity. What would be cool. I was somebody that probably wouldn't go to, like, a lot of the shit I go do nowadays, but I want to experience everything, you know, you only live once. I went to see I'm gonna butcher this word. But somebody asked me, they were like, you want to come see the old movie Notice Ferratu with a live orchestra. Old Jake would have been like, nah, that's not my thing. I was like, when is it? Oh, yeah, I got, like, two hours. Yeah, I'm down. So I'm, like, kind of addicted to, like, Doing fun things. And I'm also addicted to bettering myself, especially in recovery. So that was something that helped me back when I was in the hospital. I knew one hour of each therapy a day wasn't gonna cut it. So non verbally, I'm like, can you give me some homework? The addict in me was like, more, more, more to achieve this.
- [42:10]
C
Wow, that's really interesting. I hadn't put that together, but I bet you're right that there's a connection there. You know, I guess you hear stories of people becoming sober and then 15 years later having a relapse. You know, it's an incredibly difficult thing and a really incredible thing that a lot of people do. But I guess I'm interested if that relationship, that like, urge of I gotta have more, more, more. Not like fun experiences, but maybe like numbing.
- [42:44]
B
Yes, the numbing. That's exactly it. I consider myself sober. I do drink, though. And I'm not like drinking a bottle to, like, numb it out. I like socially going out for drinks with my buddies and stuff. I don't want to numb anything. I want to feel everything. And that is very different from Jake before illness. Now, I mean, even I would like to numb out my physical chronic pain, but there is no substance in the world that would do that, frankly. So I. I don't take pain pills or anything because it's not gonna. It's not in fear of being hooked on them or something. It's more like that is not going to help. So why would I take it?
- [43:42]
C
Hmm. It's kind of incredible when you think about it. I mean, you had to go through a lot to go through a lot. But that I think for a lot of people, that never goes away, like, even if they get sober, that, you know, that desire to numb.
- [43:57]
B
Yeah. And I also feel. I don't want to say bad is the wrong word, but when people are like, how'd you get clean? You know, it's like, well, you said it was my choice. But also is like, you could rapidly die right now or you could fight this. I chose to fight. Sadly, not for me, but to get back to my wife, get back to my. My life. I don't want to die. I gave it all up day one. Right. Well, use heroin in the hospital bed for about four hours, then give it up. So that's still day one. But yeah, when people are like, how'd you do it? An unimaginable set of circumstances led me to do it. And through all this, I now have this perspective in that version Wanting to numb everything is just gone. It feels like a different lifetime ago. And frankly, my addiction was so strong and I was so sad for so many years and using everything to numb. I used to. Now that I say this, maybe I did get my wish right, but I actually remember saying to myself, I hope I get injured so I won't be able to smoke this up. Like, physically won't be able to smoke it off tinfoil for a period of time where I can be done with it.
- [45:34]
C
Wow.
- [45:35]
B
Did I wish for this? No, I didn't. But I. I guess what I'm saying is I understand the people that are going through it and how fucking hard it is. And yeah, I'll say to it is it gets much better on the other side, but it's going to suck. You're gonna feel like you're dying. Like, I felt like I was dying, but because I was dying, it masked a little bit of the withdrawal. Even though I went through with Jar still.
- [46:08]
C
Yeah. Have you had people reach out to you who are struggling with addiction since the podcast came out?
- [46:15]
B
Lots. Yeah. And I respond to everything I see. And me and Adrian talk about it a lot. We have a show together, and she's somebody who went through it. Ex girlfriend, ex wife, Adrian, for clarification, she had her own crazy set of circumstances, but she was as addicted as me, for sure. And, you know, she went through it. She went through sober home. She managed a sober home. She is now a nurse. She's, you know, sober off that junk. And so it is possible. And a big thing she says to people because she work as a nurse and a detox is like, you have to give yourself some grace and, you know, go through to the three months. It takes about three months. You know, you're physically sick for about a month. Then it's two months of a very dangerous point where you could be like, oh, I can do that once. Nope, you go right back to it. Three months until your brain starts to change a little bit.
- [47:32]
C
Wow.
- [47:34]
B
So, yeah, that's what I tell people, but I. I understand. I mean, you're talking to someone who wish they got in a car accident or something so they couldn't physically hold the lighter. I know how hard and painful it is.
- [47:49]
C
Yeah. I'm glad to hear that Adrian's doing well, too. We heard a lot from her in the podcast, so it's great to hear. Do you personally think it's a miracle that you survived?
- [48:03]
B
That's a great question. Whoever asked someone. I don't know if I personally believe in miracles, while things happen that might seem miraculous. I don't know. I guess, I don't know. I mean is can sound kind of miraculous for sure. Was it an actual miracle? I guess history will tell. Because is it a miracle? I'm somebody who believes this whole universe out there, little old me, whatever, who cares, right? It's like people die all the time. Why am I special? Right. I think it was a stars aligned situation. I was in the right place, right time, the right motivation, right personality, felt like I loved the right person. Whether if I knew that person or not, that's another story. But all these things put together the right recipe where somebody can push through what's deemed the impossible. Is it a miracle? No, I don't think so. But what I meant by history will tell, it's like if, if, and this is a huge if, live out my life and accomplish all this stuff and then in 500 years they find out my brain unlocks the answer to like this, whatever. Maybe that could be argued as a miracle.
- [49:55]
C
Yeah, it'll be interesting to see. You know, if there's any sort of medical advancements or discoveries that happen because.
- [50:03]
B
Of this, it probably won't be in my lifetime. Right.
- [50:08]
C
I have no idea how long it takes for that. But yeah, it does seem like it takes a long time for research to.
- [50:13]
B
Happen for some reason.
- [50:15]
C
Yeah. You have been close to death multiple times. Probably more than most people alive can can say that they have. But here you are, alive. Does that impact your daily life and how you view your life at all?
- [50:35]
B
Rationally, I believe we only have one and I think we should all operate under that assumption. And I want to make the best of it and do the most and be good, productive person. And that's how it impacts my life. Everything is more precious to me. Time is precious. I just understand how things can happen. Blink of an eye. And so everyone should try and make the best out of really everything they do and the time they have and the people they're with. And that's a major thing I've learned through all this.
- [51:22]
C
I love that. Okay, so Jake, I have to say re listening to Blink when I got to the part where you guys had to take a break and it was hinted at. Well, someone's not happy with this. Content of this podcast that was unclear. But now listening to the whole thing back again, I assume that someone was Ellen. Is this something that you can talk about?
- [51:47]
B
Uh, yeah, I think so. I think, frankly, I just think I don't really care anymore. Next time on Blink. I'm finally ready to talk about what I've been dealing with legally and what's actually been happening behind the scenes.
- [52:33]
E
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