Loading summary
Transcript282 lines
- [00:00]
A
Foreign.
- [00:11]
B
I've got some bad news.
- [00:12]
A
Oh, no. What is it?
- [00:14]
B
We gotta leave Substack.
- [00:15]
A
I. You know, what is it? Because they had a party and they didn't invite us.
- [00:17]
B
They invited me. That. It's about the party. Were you not invited?
- [00:20]
A
No, I was not invited.
- [00:23]
B
Well, you don't. You're not in New York. You don't go to anything.
- [00:25]
A
Sometimes they invite me to stuff. I will not go to it. But do you think finally the thing has happened that Janet has always warned me it's going to happen, that if I continue to say no to every opportunity, I'm going to stop getting asked?
- [00:36]
B
Yeah.
- [00:37]
A
Does it happen? We reach that point?
- [00:38]
B
Well, yeah. And also whenever someone from some city's like, why don't you do an event in la? I always. I blame it on you.
- [00:44]
A
Because that's true, Jesse. I will go to la. For the sandwich.
- [00:47]
B
For the sandwich. For Dune. Oh, maybe we could do an event at Dune. It's very small, so we could sell it out. No, this. We have to leave Subsack. Because I was at a Substack party yesterday, whatever day that was. I want to say Thursday. And it was sort of a conference and then there was a party at the end. And I looked around the conference and I realized it was like all white people. Yeah, that's why. Because it wasn't racially diverse again, enough. No, it was all like attractive 20something media people. Like just.
- [01:18]
A
It was like, yeah, we don't belong there.
- [01:20]
B
No, we're supposed to be the freaks. Like this could have been like, pick some lefty literary journal. It was like that kind of crowd. And Substack is supposed to be bigots, you know, monsters like us.
- [01:33]
A
Yeah. Where's the Bigot Conference? I guess that's why I wasn't invited to the conference.
- [01:36]
B
Well, I mean, I don't know. I don't know why I was. I'm glad I was invited. I had fun. Although I did once, like there was sort of a conference and then at 6, it sort of turned into a party and more people came in. When I looked around this room of interesting, largely attractive young people from every walk of life. And of course I went home and I watched basketball and I ate frozen yogurt.
- [01:55]
A
But it is funny how sub sack. I mean, it's good how they have completely not just survive. Yeah, they won. They won. I mean, who knows?
- [02:04]
B
All their enemies are dead.
- [02:05]
A
Who knows how? Or they're on go. They are ghosts.
- [02:07]
B
Shout out to Jude Doyle. Should I mention that if you say Jude Doyle's name three times. Does he just show up at your house and scold you?
- [02:13]
A
So Jude was not at the party. Was there. Was there a ghost party next door? Smaller party, maybe?
- [02:18]
B
I just. Like, this was. This was. It was clear from some of the questions, like, during the conferences. It was also a ideologically diverse crew. You know who I saw was Karen Atia. She was there. Oh, did you guys chat and like Matt Iglesia? So it was a. And from bigots like Maddie. I did. I said hi to her because we had met on a dating show. You can make me sound douchey. Yeah. Dating show. It was a junket to Germany. Me, Iglesias and Karen Attia had been on the same junket to Germany.
- [02:46]
A
I can't tell if this is a true story or the intro to a joke.
- [02:49]
B
A white, a Jew, a Cuban Jew, and a black woman go on a junket to Germany. What do you think the headline would be? Katie? I dare you. This will get us kicked off substack, and then we won't have to be honest anymore. No. Anyway, it was. It was a good event, but it made me realize subst is mainstream and everyone's hotter than me. So we need. We need to leave.
- [03:09]
A
All right, well, I've been. I've been looking for an excuse. I have something more important than that. You got our notes there?
- [03:15]
B
Yeah.
- [03:16]
A
Right. Click that first link.
- [03:17]
B
This is a White House link, so it's going to be very inappropriate. Oh, Jesus Christ. I saw this. Yeah.
- [03:23]
A
Read it.
- [03:23]
B
Today we remember a legend. On this day in history, Harambe would have celebrated another birthday. An icon that became part of Internet history, American culture, an entire generation's timeline.
- [03:33]
A
Okay, that's enough. That's enough. Do you want to remind people who Harambe?
- [03:38]
B
Harambe was a gorilla. Who. This dumb kid?
- [03:42]
A
Yeah.
- [03:43]
B
How old was the kid? Like three or something. This idiot kid climbed into Harambe's cage, stabbed him. Cincinnati.
- [03:48]
A
I want to say they do have a big zoo there.
- [03:50]
B
It'd be weird if it was, like, Fallujah. Cincinnati. Yeah, it was Cincinnati. Anyway, this was back when the Internet was good. I think a kid got into his enclosure. They killed Harambe rather than doing what they should have done, which is kill the kid, to say, protect Harambe. And Harambe became this incredibly wholesome meme. I think everyone listening knows this. Like, just Google Harambe. You'll find.
- [04:11]
A
No, we have a lot of elder listeners.
- [04:13]
B
Tons of your friends.
- [04:14]
A
My friends.
- [04:15]
B
You'll find a ton of, like, genuine, generally very wholesome memes about Harambe. And I Think Harambe united the Internet because like everyone is hoping, as some of the memes suggested, that Harambe is in heaven. Sometimes in heaven he is with Cecil the Lyon who was also killed.
- [04:29]
A
Yeah. So at the beginning this incident sort of united the Internet. But, but then, and there were all of these memes kind of mourning Harambe. But then pretty quickly it became more fodder in culture wars. So some progressives called this out as racist. The kid who crawled under this enclosure and Harambe like dragged him into the pen, he was black. So there was this idea that people valued the gorilla's life more than the black kid's life. And then the meme itself was co opted by right wingers, particularly like racist online edgelords. Partly, you know, blaming the kids parents because the kids, they saw the kids parents as irresponsible and they were black. And then partly because this sort of classic like comparing black people to apes and gorillas. So Harambe himself did nothing wrong except for almost kill a child. And the White House tweeting about this has inspired a, another wave of reactions. Jesse, have you seen any of these?
- [05:32]
B
Well, I don't know what I saw. What I saw people pointing out was like he died very close the day George Floyd died May 20. May. George Floyd died May 25. Harambe died May 28. And people were sort of like, was the White House making some sort of point by tweeting this out? I don't know.
- [05:48]
A
Okay, that seems dumb too.
- [05:49]
B
That theory seems dumb.
- [05:51]
A
Yes. I'm not saying that there's not some dog whistle here. I mean, the White House comms people seems to be run by 22 year old Edgelords. But this connection with the death of George Floyd, it's. I mean it's not the same day and it's not as though they like chose the date that Harambe was killed. This seems like a stretch.
- [06:12]
B
I mean, it's just weird. It's. Well, probably not the Trump. The shit like the DHS post is like pretty racist. You just. There's nothing. I wouldn't put anything past them. I think it's weird. It makes me. What I hate is it's not Harambe's fault that he's been embraced by Donald Trump, but that makes me like Harambe less.
- [06:31]
A
I doubt Donald Trump knows who Harambe is. He would probably see a photo of Harambe and say something about how it's Leslie Jones. But this shows you just how online the White House comms people are. It's like the funhouse mirror image of who Was the. Who was the most online Democratic candidate? Who was the most like pronouns in bio. Listen to what the 22 year old Tumblr users have to say.
- [06:55]
B
Harris, I guess Harris was extremely online.
- [06:58]
A
I think Warren was extremely online. And I just, in any of these cases, I just don't think that this speaks to normal people. And for some reason I find this distasteful to say. For some reason I find MMA on the White House lawn distasteful. I just feel like there should be some fucking dignity in the office. Maybe this is my problem, but can we bring some dignity back?
- [07:18]
B
One of the, one of the. Two of the higher wattage people they had at this conference yesterday were Tim Miller and Pablo Torre gave a talk. And one of the things Pablo Torre pointed out was like one of the failures of the Tim Walls social media strategy was like Tim Walls was a football guy. Why not lean into that if you're going to do the whole like masculine thing? And. And Tim Miller said it's because all the social media staffers are gay. And he blamed it on the gays. Yeah, which he said he's allowed to say. And I think you're allowed to say it. But I'm not.
- [07:48]
A
Yes, I think that's probably true.
- [07:50]
B
It's the gays fault. Yeah.
- [07:51]
A
Yeah. Although I think that maybe the Trump White House could use a few more gays. This is their problem. Not enough gays.
- [07:56]
B
Oh, you don't think the maga movement is like 70% gay?
- [08:01]
A
You know, we are going to talk about Twinks for Trump soon. That was actually going to be today's episode, but something else came up, so I think we're going to save that for the next primo.
- [08:09]
B
Oh, great. Katie, what are we going to be talking about today?
- [08:12]
A
Jesse, Today we are revisiting the Patrick Tomlinson saga.
- [08:16]
B
This is Stalker Child.
- [08:19]
A
You were mentally ill. Yes, this is a character. An extremely online and extremely harassed character. We have some updates on the Patrick Tomlinson story that we first did in 2023, but before we get to that, can we do a little. I know it's not Pride month yet, but can we do a little. Can we do a little queer shit?
- [08:36]
B
Yeah, just this once.
- [08:37]
A
Okay, so a couple of primo shows ago, we did an implosion about two dyke bars. Excuse me, Sapphic venues. One was in Denver, one was in Philly. If you haven't listened to that, highly recommend it. But there are two somewhat related stories I couldn't squeeze into that episode, so I'm going to do it here instead so in Pittsburgh's Millville neighborhood, there's an establishment, or really two establishments called Harolds and Mods. Harold's formal name. Harold's Haunt describes itself as Pittsburgh's haunted they bar. Yes, it's a non binary bar. A non bi. Are you listening to me, Jesse? A non binary bar, which if nothing else, makes the line for the women's bathroom shorter. And Harold seems like an interesting place. So Jesse, I want you to read from their bar rules here. This is posted on Instagram.
- [09:24]
B
Bar etiquette help us keep Harold's tidy, safe and legal biology following these handy guidelines. Bring cash or start a tab. Don't snap, clap big wave or yell for the bartender. Bring your empties to the bar as you empty them. No poop knives. What's that?
- [09:38]
A
You don't know what poop knives are?
- [09:40]
B
No.
- [09:40]
A
Okay, I don't know poop knives knives are either. But keep going.
- [09:42]
B
Don't puke on the babies. Okay, look at the cocktail menu. We spent a lot of time on it.
- [09:47]
A
My guess is that the issue is that like you are bringing your own poop knife instead of using their bar provided poop knife.
- [09:54]
B
Okay, that makes perfect. That explains it.
- [09:55]
A
Yeah. So recently Harold did something that proved to be a bit controversial in the non binary community. So Jesse, please read from this Instagram
- [10:03]
B
post an update at the haunt. Starting on April 20, Harolds will be implementing a recommended two item purchase minimum during all events. Swipe for more info if you want to.
- [10:13]
A
Okay, swipe.
- [10:14]
B
We've added some low cost, fun, silly things to our menu. So you can hit that recommended two item minimum without breaking the bank. Things like $2 gummy shots, $3 worm juice shots.
- [10:23]
A
Wait, do you see what a gummy shot is?
- [10:25]
B
Oh, $2 gummy shots. Literally a shot glass full of your choice of gummy candy from our gummy bar. That seems like a bad deal.
- [10:32]
A
Yeah.
- [10:33]
B
$3 worm juice shot. A shot of agave tequila, free. If you get this shot with the worm in it, great deal. $2 pickled eggs. For some reason at this bar where a lot of trans folks hang out, people really want pickle shit even more. Okay, yeah, they're just, they're.
- [10:48]
A
This is very standard. They're asking people to spend an extra four or five dollars at the bar. And you might think that the they thems who patronize Pittsburgh's really probably the world's only non binary bar would be happy to support this community space. But not everyone appreciated the ask. So Jesse, please read this exchange. This is in the comments section. On their Instagram.
- [11:07]
B
Heralds is literally a small business trying to survive while still offering a wide range of free, low cost events for queer folks. It's not unhinged to ask for community support, and they're clearly doing their best to be accessible by making a recommended minimum, offering low cost options.
- [11:21]
A
That's enough.
- [11:21]
B
Read the response to this except money is the root of all evil, so why are they chasing it so hard?
- [11:26]
A
Yes, so. So people were upset that this small business was trying to stay in business. I will say most of the people commenting on this realize that it's completely reasonable to charge a nominal fee for people going to your events. Particularly because apparently all the door money at these events was all going to performers, which is not actually standard. A standard agreement would be that the bar keeps some of the money right to pay for the event, the event staff, things like that. But this came on the heels of another much bigger controversy at their sister business, Mod's Paper Wing Gallery. It's like a chotchki shop for people who call themselves witches. So they sell zines and stickers and tinctures and tarot cards and books about abolishing the family. And if you're wondering why Woo and witchery are so popular in the queer community, which doesn't exist, but you know what I mean. The answer is because I have. I have discovered the answer after years of research. It's because queer people are followers and one hot butch named Matt got a tarot deck like 30 years ago and now all lesbians are into astrology. It's very unfortunate. Jesse, you're on the meat market. Are you encountering a lot of astrology lovers in your travels?
- [12:36]
B
Yeah, there's a huge thing. Straight women in astrology. It's a huge thing. I can't believe we're even asking that. That's so offensive.
- [12:41]
A
That's cultural appropriation. They stole it.
- [12:43]
B
Well, who stole from who?
- [12:44]
A
They stole it from the queer gentrifiers. Okay, so Apparen, both Harolds and Mods are having money problems because a few months ago mods posted on Instagram asking for people to volunteer to work there in exchange for store credit rather than money. So here's the ask.
- [12:58]
B
Jesse, please read this in the shop. What we're looking for are folks who can work regular with an axe, regular shifts a few hours a week or month, folks familiar with retail, folks familiar with discord, folks who like doggos. Tasks might include watching the register, inventory, filling back stock, tidying or tidying oop out of oop. What's op there.
- [13:20]
A
I don't know.
- [13:21]
B
Also, you will be required to occasionally pet Fred. Fred, I hope, is a dog, not a guy.
- [13:29]
A
That would be incredible.
- [13:30]
B
He's not a gimp.
- [13:32]
A
Yeah. All right. So this does not go over well. People are very mad that this for profit business. These capitalists are asking for free labor. Labor. And there's so much pushback that mod later posts this. Click this link.
- [13:44]
B
You may have seen our post the other day looking for people who might want to help out at the shop in exchange for store credit. Well, we fucked up. Given the capitalistic hellscape in which we live, our thought was that this might be a good way to introduce bartering for good. Since we know so many people, ourselves included, are low on funds right now. Our thought was we get someone to help with small tasks and that someone gets an item they've had their eye on. Everyone benefits. But nah, that's not actually how it works. In response to our post, points were made that in our excitement over having people say they wanted to help, we didn't consider the big one being labor law. Our elementary school teachers would be so proud. Those legal safeguards were enacted to Blah, blah, blah. Yeah, it goes on.
- [14:22]
A
Yeah, it ends with this. We are incredibly grateful to everyone who has reached out looking to support us not only by offering time, but also helping us learn and grow and be educated. We still want to find ways to bend outside of capitalism as much as is possible for a small business. But we're going to step back and take time to make sure we are doing so ethically. Thanks for reading. So Jesse, what do you think is offering people store credit instead of cash exploitation?
- [14:48]
B
I mean it would depend a lot on the context. I don't know what the law is. I don't, I don't know. It just. It made me think of the Park
- [14:54]
A
Slope Food Co Op.
- [14:55]
B
Park. So Food Co Op where you have to do a shift every so often. I mean I'm. I would for not just because of the recent stuff. There's so many reasons I would not join that place. But that's like a well known aspect is. Yeah, you have to do a shift every so often to be a member.
- [15:07]
A
Yeah, we're going to be talking about this on Monday at noon for our prima listeners. I'm going to have a conversation about, about the co op, the business there. There's this ongoing, this ongoing drama over BDS and Israeli products at the co op. I listened to a three and a half hour meeting at like co op board meeting online. The Other day, the login very generously provided to me by a member who listens to the show. It took them a straight up. It took them an hour to get to even the fucking land. Acknowledgments. This was the most. You would think something this, this, like highly dramatic would be interesting. It was not. Anyway, there we are going to talk more about this. But yes, there are some businesses where you exchange, you pay a fee, you pay like a membership fee and you exchange goods for either the privilege of shopping there or for a discount. That's actually pretty normal for tax purposes. There's probably some particular designation. I don't know what that would be. But I also think, like, it's tough to be a small business. I guarantee you these people are not making money. And if somebody wants to volunteer to keep businesses like this alive in their community, it's fine by me. No one is forcing you to work the counter at the witch store.
- [16:19]
B
No.
- [16:20]
A
You know, I've sort of changed my mind about this. Like, I remember in the early days of Kickstarter or GoFundMe, a queer bar where I lived at the time, they did a fundraiser to buy a new sound system and they, they pitched this as this benefit to the community. And my feeling about it was like, I donate to you every time I buy an overpriced beer. Like, why are you, like, you're a fucking business, you're making money. Why are you asking me to give you something for free? But I've, I've softened my stance on that somewhat just because I think I have a better understanding of profit margins and what it takes to keep a business open. And if people want to donate to a new subwoofer rather than like a dog with cancer, it's not like, like, who cares anyway? That's what's going on in Pittsburgh's non binary scene.
- [17:01]
B
Thank you.
- [17:01]
A
Meanwhile. Meanwhile, in Pittsburgh's S M scene, there's another scandal, this one at the Sadomasochist and Leather assembly of Pittsburgh, or slap. They've been holding a monthly party at a bar since July of 2025. And according to Slapp's own description of events, it was a, quote, space for leather freaks to gather and we'll all raise funds for the orgs and individuals we want to see survive. That sounds like an extremely fucked up version of Squid Game. A bunch of leather daddies voting on who lives and who dies. The event itself sounded strange. Quote, come early for a conversation between SLAP organizers and Pittsburgh Leather Legacy, including Mr. Pet, including Mr. Pittsburgh Leather Fetish 2024 Stay Late for Music. You can cruise, bruise and bop to treat your leathers to a shine. From this month's. From this month's featured boot Black. So it's a panel discussion slash cruising event where you can get your boots shine.
- [17:52]
B
Nice.
- [17:53]
A
Very sexy. So slaps Instagram handle is 412. Com slap. Jesse, please read this post from April 3rd.
- [18:01]
B
This is from 412. Com slap. There's barbed wire. That's the border, of course. What happened? We formed an organization which only included one black member internally. This created a structurally racist dynamic all too common, which put them in an unfair, unsustainable, tokenized position. White organizers fought each other over conflicting approaches to this problem at the expense of actually listening to their needs or ideas or worsening their experience and sapping the whole group's energy.
- [18:27]
A
Now, I very much wish I could tell you exactly what happened here. Unfortunately I can't because I don't know. No one in SLAP is talking. I found one vague comment online from someone claiming to have worked with slap. This is also a black person who says actually there were two black organizers and this statement erased her contributions. She says she helped create the flyer, she paid for stickers out of her own pocket and she left the group because, quote, I saw these issues coming to a point. Minimizing safety concerns at the bar events lacking direction in embodying the manifesto marginalized members attempts to direct being labeled as divisive and was also talked around when speaking about them in chats and meetings. This one really brings me back because it's so vague. Like this was very much a characteristic of the 2020 era cancellations. Harm has been done, but no one will explicitly say what that harm was. Maybe because the harm is extremely minor. And if you actually said what the harm was, everybody be like, what the fuck are you talking about? And maybe that's not the case here. Maybe 412cum slap is truly racist, but I sort of doubt it because this is a part of that statement they put out. Jesse, read this.
- [19:30]
B
What steps have we taken towards accountability and repair? We've offered direct personal apologies where appropriate. And we offer an apology now to anyone reading who experiences this as a betrayal. We sent our black former member all our remaining org funds. Wow. After our website domain expense for the rest of 2026 in order to support their other projects at Wish, we agreed to retire the SLAP name and manifesto.
- [19:52]
A
So SLAP is dead.
- [19:53]
B
Long live SLAP disbanded.
- [19:54]
A
Do you think this is where Donald Trump got the idea for his J6 reparations fund.
- [19:59]
B
In a word, yes.
- [19:59]
A
Yes.
- [20:00]
B
Yeah, almost certainly. It just. Yeah, the timing lines up.
- [20:02]
A
All right, let's do housekeeping.
- [20:04]
B
We are a podcast. You can find us@blockchain reporter.org if you go there, you can become a premium subscriber and you get all sorts of extra benefits, including the aforementioned chat between Katie and. Are we saying her name yet? Yeah, hashtag, say her name. Lisa Sellyn Davis. Great local. Well, not local journalist, but a journalist who is local who will be talking to you about the Park Slope. I want to say slop. The Park Slope slop. The food co op and the BDS stuff. Yeah. Become premium subscriber. If you want to see that. If you want to watch our. If you want to listen to our extra episodes, you can also go to Apple Podcasts rate and review us. Anything else, Katie?
- [20:45]
A
Before we get back to it, I wanted to mention one other thing that our listeners might be interested in. Friend of the pod, Megan Dom. She runs the Unspeak Easy. This is a. She offers private retreats. She calls them free speech vacations. These are off the record conversations about complicated, controversial topics, some of which we talk about on this show. I've been a guest speaker at a couple of these events. They're very fun. When I did it was all women. But she's now doing some of these co ed. They're called Small Gathering Big Ideas. This is now open for registration. This next one takes place October 19th to 21st in New York's Hudson Valley. Guest speakers include the author, linguist and New York Times columnist John McWhorter, as well as Jungian analyst and podcaster slash author Lisa Marchiano. The retreat is limited to about 30 people and there is currently an early bird special, so get in it now. You can go to theunspeakeasy.com to find out more.
- [21:39]
B
Okay, time to move on to our favorite stalker child.
- [21:42]
A
Yes, Jesse, for people who weren't around in 2023 when we did our two part Patrick Tomlinson series. Who is Patrick Tomlinson?
- [21:50]
B
One of the most harassed and online and asking for it, wearing a proverbial short dress people in Internet history is Patrick Thompson.
- [22:00]
A
You can see his butt cheeks.
- [22:01]
B
You can literally see his butt cheeks. Metaphorically.
- [22:03]
A
Yeah. So this was one of the wildest stories we've ever covered on this show. It's. It was about a truly psychotic group of Internet losers. And every time this subject comes up, I'm a bit nervous about speaking about them because as you will hear, these freaks came after me personally. But these are the things we do in this podcast. I'm going to poke the bear.
- [22:22]
B
We make sacrifices.
- [22:23]
A
Some journalists go to war zones. We go to message boards, which are
- [22:26]
B
type of war zones. Yeah, yeah.
- [22:28]
A
So Patrick Tomlinson, he's a sci fi author based in Milwaukee. He's written a bunch of books, mostly about space. None of them have made him particularly famous, but he has become, if not famous for his work, notorious for his post and what his post led to.
- [22:40]
B
And. And how. How did the Patrick Tomlinson age of discontent begin? Remind me what happened.
- [22:46]
A
Yes. So in September 2018, Patrick tweeted that Norm MacDonald wasn't funny. That's it. Was he wrong? Yes, Norm MacDonald was funny. And in that moment, Norm MacDonald was in the news because he was. He had defended his friends. Louis C.K. you know, the man who enjoyed jerking off in front of his friends. Who doesn't? And Roseanne Barnes.
- [23:04]
B
Well, if it was his friends, maybe it would have been less a problem. It was young female acquaintances, colleagues.
- [23:09]
A
Well, he asked.
- [23:10]
B
I know.
- [23:12]
A
If you. If I asked you, Jesse, is it okay if I jerk off on front of you and then you said yes and then I did it.
- [23:18]
B
I would not say yes in this scenario.
- [23:19]
A
I think you would.
- [23:20]
B
No. You'd probably pressure me. Yeah, exactly. You would threaten me. Louis CK is so much funnier than Norm MacDonald, by the way. Sorry, just.
- [23:27]
A
You're gonna. Oh, don't let Opie and Anthony forums might add about that.
- [23:32]
B
I'm not even gonna. These people are psychos. They're. Yeah, they were love. Yeah.
- [23:35]
A
Anyway, so he had. So Norm MacDonald had defended Louis CK and Roseanne Barr. This was after her Ambien moment. She called Valerie Jarrett Harambe, essentially in a. What she said later was a Ambien moment. So Norm MacDonald is being dragged online for this. It's 2018, and Patrick joins the pylon. And this does, by the way, tell you something about Patrick's politics. He's very resistance lib, very blue sky. But this tweet didn't go vi. Viral or anything like that at the time. Like in the. The hours after, it had something like 16 retweets, a few hundred likes on Twitter. It was nothing. But on Reddit, specifically a Reddit called R slash Opie and Anthony, it became something else entirely. So, Jesse, you're from Boston. Can you explain Opie and Anthony?
- [24:19]
B
Yeah, there were these shock jocks. I associate them with waf. Associate them with. Do you know what wow is? With wow.
- [24:29]
A
Is that a radio station?
- [24:30]
B
No. Let's whip him out. When to stays oh, that seems like
- [24:34]
A
something they would do.
- [24:35]
B
Yeah. And it's like whenever. You know, you can definitely have conversations about me, too, having gone too far this or that. But this was like mainstream shock jock culture in the probably 90s to just be like, have a day where you would yell at women to whip them out. It's not great.
- [24:51]
A
Oh, I thought funny.
- [24:53]
B
You thought it was penises.
- [24:54]
A
I thought it was penises.
- [24:55]
B
I thought it was like, oh, well, things have changed. Me too. Happened. Now, if anyone's whipping anything out, I know this was about. It was a day celebrating women whipping out their breasts in public.
- [25:05]
A
No, you don't whip out a titty. You whip out a dick. You don't whip out a titty. It doesn't even make any sense.
- [25:10]
B
Well, that's what they called it. Katie, why don't you to get in your time machine and correct Opie and Anthony?
- [25:14]
A
Well, they were canceled in 1998 for the first time after they announced that the mayor of Boston had build been killed in a car crash with a Haitian prostitute as an April Fool's joke. Then they moved to New York, and the show started to get even bigger.
- [25:26]
B
This was no defamation. This was wbcn, not waf. And I just want to send one thing in the chat.
- [25:34]
A
In the chat.
- [25:35]
B
Not to interrupt you in the note in our notes, Doc. So that's like. That's a bumper sticker. Okay, Just describe it.
- [25:41]
A
Okay. This is a bumper sticker W 104.1 WBCN, which was one of the best
- [25:47]
B
rock stations at the time.
- [25:49]
A
Wow. Opie and Anthony.
- [25:49]
B
So that's just sending me this. This is Whip Them Out Wednesdays. Wow.
- [25:52]
A
Okay, so they had a sticker.
- [25:53]
B
They had a sticker. That's how evil they were.
- [25:55]
A
We will not be putting this sticker in the show notes because we don't want to get sued by whoever took this photo in 1997.
- [26:02]
B
By Opie and. Or Anthony.
- [26:03]
A
They were actually canceled for a second time in 2002 because they had a stunt called Sex With Sam, where they would encourage couples to have sex in public. You know, maybe.
- [26:13]
B
What's Sam? Who's Sam?
- [26:14]
A
Sam Adams, obviously.
- [26:16]
B
Duh.
- [26:17]
A
It was sponsored by the beer company so staff from the show would observe.
- [26:22]
B
Wait, I'm sorry. Sam Adams was sponsoring this? You're joking. No, no. You're joking. You're joking. There's no way a beer company sponsored a public sex thing.
- [26:30]
A
They did the most outlandish act or place that somebody had sex for Sam.
- [26:35]
B
You called it sex.
- [26:36]
A
I'm sorry. Sex for Sam. Oh, now. Now it makes sense.
- [26:39]
B
There's no way a beer company sponsored. Look it up. Wow. Beer exec apologizes for sex show involvement. We got to include a link to. This is ad age 2002. God, you're teaching me so much about my own.
- [26:52]
A
Does this make you think that maybe we did need. Like, we did need social justice movements and like, maybe this was a corrective.
- [26:57]
B
That's what I was. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. For every. Like, me too's gone too far. You have a Whip him out. Wednesday, you have sex for Sam. Where? The beer company.
- [27:06]
A
Yes. A beer company encouraging people to have sex in public while a staff member from the Opie Anthony show would observe it and narrate it live on the radio. And then the winner of this contest would get a trip to Boston. Retail value $26.
- [27:21]
B
What a prize.
- [27:22]
A
I know. So a Virginia couple was arrested for having sex in the vestibule of St. Patrick's Cathedral on Fifth Avenue. And this led to Opie and Anthony being fired from radio station WNEW in 2002.
- [27:34]
B
The Ad Age articles pay well, but the Post covered it too. Them getting.
- [27:38]
A
Of course.
- [27:38]
B
Yeah. Okay. Michu did not go. Is my new view.
- [27:41]
A
Yeah. So that was. So they were fired again. They pivoted to satellite radio. They managed not to get fired for over a decade. But then in 2014, Anthony. His real name is Anthony Kumia. He went on a tear on. On Twitter, he said he was assaulted by a black woman in New York. And then he posted this thread. Jesse, why don't you read a few of these tweets?
- [28:00]
B
So I'm taking pics in NYC and a black girl who was in frame punched me in the face. I called her a something because that's what she was. He has symbols, so it's unclear what he called her. I suppose we can guess.
- [28:13]
A
Yes, that's. It's probably racial.
- [28:16]
B
Then she punched me five more times. She's lucky I was a white legal gun owner or she'd be dead. Then black five blacks started giving me shit. And this is 2014. This is not 1994. And it goes on in that vein for quite some time. Yeah, they are in peep. They aren't people.
- [28:33]
A
I told them to back the fuck off. This wasn't their show. The cunt boys. Then punch me again. Seems white boys don't hit back. Lucky Savage. He calls her a lion cunt. I hope she gets shot her. I hope she gets shot in her ass face. Yes. They aren't people. It's a jungle out in our cities after midnight, violent savages own the streets. They all came to defend this pig. I had to yell like dogs. So he got fired for that.
- [29:01]
B
What? Just that.
- [29:04]
A
Okay, so after that, Opie stayed on and did the show solo for a while. It didn't quite work, and it was later canceled, and. But the Opie and Anthony subreddit outlasted the show, and the users were, by all accounts, awful. Which you can sort of guess based on who they were fans of.
- [29:21]
B
Yeah.
- [29:21]
A
Truly deranged, antisocial losers. And they would harass people who annoyed them. Mostly liberals. So Patrick, who is an annoying liberal, who insulted Norm MacDonald. He was the perfect target, in no small part because of Patrick's own response to being bullied. We'll get to that in a second. But what happened to Patrick goes well beyond your garden variety online bullying. They got his phone number, his email, his home address. They spammed his Amazon reviews. They got him banned from Twitter multiple times, including by reporting his own profile photo, which was a headshot that he paid for as a copyright violation. They make parody accounts in his name, like Jesse. So I just searched Twitter or X for Patrick. The name Patrick Tomlinson. Here's a screenshot of the various. Just the top few Patrick Tomlinson accounts. Read these.
- [30:02]
B
Is that top one the real one? Stealthy geek.
- [30:04]
A
Yeah, Stealthy geek is him.
- [30:05]
B
Patrick Tomlinson's stolen galaxy, Patrick Tomlinson's dildo. Patrick Tomlinson, Patrice Tomlinson, Patrick S. Tomlinson's leaked pornhub, and so on.
- [30:16]
A
Yeah. So they dug into every facet of his life, including his messy first divorce. They paid for an actual Norm MacDonald cameo where Norm read a script mocking him. Someone contacted him, pretending to be a journalist named Josiah, did two hours of fake interviews and posted them online. That's the light stuff. It got criminal. So. So someone called in a bomb threat to a Patti LaBelle concert he was attending in Milwaukee. 2, 000 people had to be evacuated. They called it a bomb threat to a Brewers game that they knew he would be at. They've stalked him in person. One guy flew from Boston to Milwaukee to film Patrick's house and then put video on YouTube, set it to the song Somebody's Watching Me. Another guy drove from Indianapolis to demand the staff at Patrick's regular bar where he hangs out. The. The staff tell Pat, tell them where Patrick lived. And he's been swatted dozens and dozens of times. So that means someone has called the local Police department and said the guy at this address is holding someone hostage or something like that. The local police show up in the middle of the night with weapons drawn. They've also swatted his family members, including his elderly parents. Here's a real highlight. In 2020, someone made a fake Craigslist ad using Patrick's name, his home address, and phone number, claiming he was giving away free pepperoni made from the bodies of African American children kidnapped in his neighborhood.
- [31:30]
B
And that wasn't true?
- [31:31]
A
True, no, it did. But it was Italian children.
- [31:32]
B
That's the best pepperoni.
- [31:33]
A
Two months later, a stalker filmed himself trespassing on Patrick's property and dropping pieces for a pepperoni on the front steps. Then someone made a Tomlinson pepperoni commercial on YouTube selling pepperoni made from, quote, local Milwaukee urban young black meats. Okay, so they just enjoy torturing this guy. The original subreddit eventually got banned, but users migrated to a site called this.
- [31:57]
B
Was the Opie and Anthony separate? Yeah, yeah.
- [31:59]
A
But users migrated to a site called onaforums.net at the time we did our episode about him in 2023, there were about a quarter of a million posts about Patrick Tomlinson. The site has since moved. It's currently at Onaforums St. And Kiwi Farms. Looks like a gentle study group in comparison to this place. And unfortunately, Patrick is constitutionally unable to stop responding. And he has this very unfortunate habit of actually replying to his stalker's tweets. Jesse, do you remember any of his catchphrases?
- [32:30]
B
Yes. He calls people like child, or he calls them stalker. Just. And I think at this point, probably tens of thousands of times he's done this.
- [32:38]
A
You are mentally ill, child. You are going to prison. Stalker. He'll just say these things over and over in response. He cannot stop. He calls people mentally ill, criminal, cyber stalker. You are going to prison. Enjoy prison. Your life is old. Oh, your life is over. And the trolls love this. And look, the guy's a victim, no doubt. I had my own unfortunate interactions with his stalkers. They are deranged. Loser. But it is undoubtedly true that Patrick makes it worse by responding to it. And he completely denies his own role in perpetuating this cycle.
- [33:10]
B
Yeah, it. I mean, again, yeah, it's not his fault that he's like. He's a world historical figure for being targeted, but there's definitely things you can do at the margin to make it better or worse, and he's. It's sort of the Will Stanchel effect, but much worse.
- [33:23]
A
Yeah. And he has this tendency to get caught in small inconsistencies that his stalkers then pounce on. Like, like he once said he'd never been fat, when he obviously has been fat. Like I've seen, there's photos of him. He said he wasn't in debt. His debt is on the public record. He has a tendency to do things to hurt his own case. He's not the perfect victim. And the other thing I should say, and this is important, there's no conclusive evidence that the swats themselves originate at the forums. My guess is that yes, one or some of his trolls on are on the forums and they've called these threats in or paid someone else to swat him. But that's pure speculation. They absolutely deny it it and in fact they say it's Patrick swatting himself and.
- [34:01]
B
Yeah. What evidence do they have for that again?
- [34:04]
A
Yeah, so at the time that we did the story in 2023, their main evidence that Patrick was swatting himself was a telegram post from a guy who ran a swatting for hire service called Tour Swats. That post said, I'm dumping the name of one of my most serial customers who scammed me 250 Hail Patrick Tomlinson. Patrick said obviously this was not him and I do not think he is swatting himself. I listened to the audio of one of the swats. He was clearly very distressed. Although it didn't help his case that he insulted the cops who showed up
- [34:32]
B
to his house and he ended up suing the Opie and Anthony forum.
- [34:36]
A
Yeah, he did and he lost. And he was ordered to pay the forum's legal fees. So he has to pay money to the owner of the site that destroyed his life. And you know, there are, there are important free speech implications here still. It's, it's really shitty for Patrick.
- [34:51]
B
Yeah.
- [34:51]
A
And, and just like with Huey Farms, any attempts to get the site actually taken down have failed. They just moved domains. There's a lot more to the story that I won't get into here. I'll post a link to our two part series for anyone interested. It is truly psychotic. There's this self proclaimed cyber security expert named Jackie Singh who decided.
- [35:08]
B
I forgot about Jackie Singh. She's so crazy.
- [35:10]
A
She's crazy. She decided that she was going to help Patrick and unmasked Tour swats and she ended up, she named a random Swedish man who had nothing to do with this. And, and, and Tour Swats was by the way actually unmasked in 2024 after our episode came out. And by Unmasked, I Mean arrested. Turned out it was a 17 year old from Lancaster, California named Alan Fillion. The DOJ tied him to more than 375 swattings. And under threats, not just a Patrick, but of schools, Moss colleges, government officials and others, he pled guilty in federal court. And in February 2025, he was sentenced to four years in prison. So Jackie was wrong about that. Whoopsies. And even worse, after our episode, she accused me of being trans, but was unclear if I'm F to M or M to F. And she's probably listening to this. So Jackie, get back to me on that. Which is it?
- [35:56]
B
Yeah, well, I've been curious about that too.
- [35:58]
A
And I mentioned a second ago that after our episodes aired, Patrick stalkers came after me. They did. They started calling me incessantly. They also called members of my family, including my dad. They called my dad and they said that his daughter has sex with stuffed animals. As though Hal Herzog can't recognize a furry when he sees one. Insane. Come on, guys, do better. But it wasn't fun. I had to call the local police station and tell them I might be swatted. I had to explain to my family what was happening. But unlike Patrick, I know the answer to crazy is silence. And I just blocked their numbers and they stopped.
- [36:30]
B
Okay, does this, does this bring us to an update? What happened?
- [36:33]
A
Yeah, so we actually have a few updates. So first off, Patrick got in a feud with a lit agent named Leslie Varney. She's based in Seattle. She represents sci fi and fantasy authors. So they're in the same professional world. Remember, he's a sci fi author. They move in the same convention circuit.
- [36:48]
B
What are they fighting about?
- [36:49]
A
So in May 2024, Patrick posted a thread on Twitter about Barney in which he said that over the previous year, she had, quote, made the conscious choice to closely align herself with the criminal cult stalking and swatting my family. The actual substance of what she did or didn't do is a bit murky. Like, most of the details either come from Patrick or from some a small number of right wing sci fi blogs that have been dunking on Patrick for years. The basic story is that there's a convention called Penguicon. It's a sci fi slash, open source computing convention. Sounds fun. It's held in Ann Arbor, Michigan. Patrick was invited to and did present in 2022. He says that there was a bomb threat at that event, but the organizers were prepared. They coordinated with local police to take a bomb sniffing dog around the property. They found nothing. The convention went on. That Detail has been disputed by the anti Patrick side, but this is his retelling. So in 2024 Patrick says he gets an email from the same organizer who invited him in 2022. Will you just read read this passage? This is from a blog post he
- [37:49]
B
wrote on this I was surprised and happy to receive an email from the person who'd invited me in 2022 asking about scheduling for 2024. The surprise quickly turned to confusion when they asked if I'd submitted a panel suggestion Alien Crabs and dragon pox how STDs are depicted in SFF and why we need more Sex positive representation. Reader I had not. I'm all for sex positivity, but no, I didn't want to run a panel on space herpes.
- [38:11]
A
So he says that this was one of his stalkers impersonating him and this person applied to this to hold this panel, which is a good idea for a panel, I think.
- [38:21]
B
Yeah.
- [38:21]
A
All right, back to Patrick. Read this part.
- [38:23]
B
I politely declined to run their panel, but offered to do another presentation of my own choosing. My counteroffer was quickly accepted and a presentation, why Not Venus? About terraforming, our closest planetary neighbor was put on the official schedule. I booked my room and set to work researching, preparing and practicing the presentation and inter intermittent process, which took a total of about two weeks.
- [38:42]
A
He says that just hours after he was finishing his presentation, he was informed by Penguin Khan that he was being disinvited due to threats and harassment from
- [38:49]
B
his stalkers, and he said the last time that hadn't worked they tried to get it canceled. But why did it work this time?
- [38:57]
A
So a lot of this is disputed. There are endless wars in the sci fi literary world, much of it based on politics from what I can tell, with the right wingers continually on the outs and feeling aggrieved. So you can read dueling blogs debating every allegation and counter allegation. But in Patrick's retelling he says he got this message from the organizer Jesse
- [39:17]
B
Read this While we appreciate the time and effort you have spent in planning your attendance at Penguicon this year, we must consider the threats of physical violence that have been made to our attendees this year in the context of prior events in which the public was put under threat in a way that, while initially no fault of your own, involved your incitement using violent rhetoric ahead of and during the event itself.
- [39:35]
A
He says he responded to them asking for examples of violent rhetoric, and a board member responded back when we say that you use violent rhetoric, we can simply Refer back to the Feedback forum from, from 2022 where you called all of us retards for having a mask mandate. In terms of incitement, the fact that you engage with your stalkers on social media is in my mind dangerous and fuels their desire to be bold and violent.
- [39:59]
B
That doesn't, it doesn't sound like he would call someone a retard.
- [40:02]
A
No, he, it would be very off brand. He is a social media justice warrior. He does not use the archler and he willingly masks. So he says this, and this makes sense that once again he was being impersonated by stalker. So they're, they're like Feedback form was a public forum that anybody could reply to and wouldn't be hard to impersonate. Patrick. As for the second claim, you know that his engagement with his stalkers makes the situation worse. Yes, it does. Patrick told them, however, what he told me, quote, ignoring them doesn't make them go away. Indeed, it has been our long experience. After nearly six years, ignoring them is what makes them double down and become more bold and violent. So that's what he says every time someone is like, dude, stop feeding the trolls.
- [40:45]
B
Yeah. Which is like sort of a cop out.
- [40:47]
A
Like you don't, I don't think he's ever actually stopped.
- [40:50]
B
He responds to them so often. Yeah, yeah.
- [40:53]
A
I mean like at one point someone, after we did our show, one of these got my phone number and put me on a text thread with Patrick and starts spamming me and Patrick with text. And he responds to every one of them. Oh Jesus, your mentally ill child. You are going to prison, child. Like, just block the number, dude. Just block the number. Anyway, according to his retelling, the conference was targeted by Patrick stalkers who went directly to the conference faking concern about him. The conference took these fake concerns seriously and banned Patrick. And then of course, the stalker celebrated. I'll post a link in the show notes to his blog about this if you want all of the messy details. There's a lot.
- [41:34]
B
So where does a Leslie Varney person come into this?
- [41:37]
A
Okay, right, so she's an odd character. She's a middle aged woman, professional, a liberal, who has, yes, actually aligned herself with Patrick stalkers.
- [41:46]
B
How did that happen?
- [41:47]
A
Okay, so according to her, and I'll post a link to her explanation. This started when she replied on Twitter to someone Patrick claimed was a stalker. He had a little shit fit about it. And then she got an email from someone claiming to be Patrick. Jesse, can you read this? This is something that she posted that night.
- [42:04]
B
Our website received a message, ostensibly from Mr. Tomilson, saying that I was harassing him on Twitter and that he would sue the agency and me individually if I didn't stop. Now, I admit I was not as informed in troll tactics as I am now, and it didn't occur to me that it might have been someone else. I did reply to Mr. Tomlinson's email, which was included in the message and which I verified had via Mr. Tomlinson's personal website. I never heard back. So, again, it didn't occur to me that it might not have been him, or I would assume he would have contacted us about the confusion. Could this message have been sent by someone else? Yes. Is it probable it was sent by someone else? At this point, I would again say yes. Could it have been sent by Mr. Tomlinson? Yes, of course. I will say that. Whether it was him or not, the voice seemed quite similar to his Twitter posts.
- [42:44]
A
I find that sort of confusing. She's like, yes, it could have been someone else, but also, it could have been him. It was probably not him. It was probably.
- [42:51]
B
Yeah, probably not him.
- [42:52]
A
Yes. He, like, there's a long undocumented history of him being impersonated and people doing exactly this sort of thing. So that was the beginning. And after Penguin Con, Leslie Varney emailed the organizers this.
- [43:04]
B
I'm writing to see if there will be clarification on the situation with author Patrick Tomlinson. I'm sure you're familiar with many of the tactics that surround Mr. Tomlinson, and perhaps with an understanding that he is without blame for a situation. But I want to assure you that this isn't the complete picture. I encountered Mr. Tomlinson first last June, when he and another author took offense that I didn't immediately believed their account of harassment and I communicated with their supposed terrorist stalkers. These are just two examples of the hyperbolized language they used for me. They used words like wicked, mouth breather, evil, imbecile. Since that time, Mr. Tomlinson.
- [43:36]
A
At least he didn't call her child.
- [43:37]
B
Exactly. Since that time, Mr. Tomlinson and his associates have attacked me mercilessly on social media, up to and including a death threat from one of his associates, much to the expressed entertainment of Mr. Thomason. During this drama, I received messages from several other people who had faced the same treatment. And it didn't take a genius to notice. They were all.
- [43:54]
A
You know what? I'm gonna guess that the people who were messaging here were probably not all women. I think that Patrick's stalkers tend to not be women. I think they're men.
- [44:03]
B
In fact, I had originally called Mr. Tomlinson and his fellow author out on the misogyny and homophobia they expressed openly or supported quietly. Especially in light of their accusing faceless attackers of being racist and homophobes. Anyway, this is all a long winded request to know if I can look forward to attending Pangrikan in the future. Knowing he won't be attending. I've been considering if how to bring the subject up to the Worldcon 2025 committee, since I know he plans to attend and I'd appreciate knowing if I can point to your decision as a precedent. Thanks in advance for any help you can provide, Leslie.
- [44:31]
A
Okay, so Leslie posts this on Twitter. And at first it was sort of confusing because she posted this and it wasn't clear that she sent this to them after the conference. And so there was like, there's one sci fi blogger in particular who thought that she sent this to the conference. And that's why Patrick was banned from the conference. This was sent after the conference, but
- [44:56]
B
she was trying to get him banned from future conferences.
- [44:57]
A
From future conferences.
- [44:58]
B
Right? Yeah.
- [44:59]
A
And she says she's going to bring this up to the World Con 2025 committee. She seems to be saying she feels unsafe in his presence and in Worldcon 2025. This is a big convention. That's where the Hugos are awarded. So the feud escalates from there. Patrick and Leslie continue to lob insults at each other online. And the next year, 2025, it is not Patrick who gets banned from Worldcon. It is Leslie.
- [45:24]
B
Why? Why did she get banned?
- [45:26]
A
We don't entirely know. Like, they haven't commented, but it was held in Seattle that year. So this is her hometown con by her own explanation. This is posted on an. On a subset called Freedom Polls. It was either anti Semitism or the work of Patrick Tomlinson.
- [45:40]
B
Well, how did. But do they had. Did they explain why?
- [45:44]
A
No.
- [45:44]
B
Like what was there? Okay, the con didn't.
- [45:46]
A
Your. Your registration has been canceled.
- [45:48]
B
Huh.
- [45:48]
A
Okay, so this is a minor plot point in the larger Patrick. Patrick Tomlinson scandal. But I do think it speaks to his ability to make enemies. Like, he and Leslie Varney are politically in line. They're both shit libs. But he's so defensive, he basically drove her into the arms of his truly deranged enemies. And I'm not trying to excuse her behavior. She's an adult acting like an edgelord online. She is becoming one of these stalkers herself. So, Jesse, click this link. I searched her X account for Patrick's name. Just look at how many tweets. Like, read a couple of those.
- [46:20]
B
I can't. I'm locked out. I can't see anything.
- [46:22]
A
Oh, that's right. Okay, I will do it for you. Here's one. Foolish, foolish man. I am of the firm belief that Patrick has a histrionic personality disorder, the causes of which are authoritarian parenting and childhood trauma.
- [46:34]
B
She seems pretty obsessed.
- [46:36]
A
Yeah. Patrick secretly admits to being a Trump supporter. There's dozens and dozens of these tweets. The whole thing is, it makes them both look terrible.
- [46:46]
B
She does seem like quite a weirdo, though.
- [46:48]
A
Yep. Okay, next update. So I just mentioned that Tor Swat. So this was the 17 year old Alan Fillion. He pled guilty in 2025 and was sentenced to four years in prison. Around the same time, a Romanian man named. Named Tomas. Tomas. You speak Romanian? Jesse, how do you pronounce his name?
- [47:05]
B
No idea.
- [47:06]
A
Tomas Zaba. He was extradited to the U. S. In connection to these crimes, including swatting members of congress, cabinet officials and federal judges. He was apparently the ringleader of this swatting network. And in April 2026, he was also sentenced to four years in prison. There's another case still pending. The perp in that one is Serbian. So Tor Swatz was not a lone wolf. And while Patrick said that the arrest of Tor Swatz and the others was the first time he and his wife got a decent night's sleep in years. Unfortunately, arresting these three didn't actually stop the swatting. So right after Fillion was arrested, a new telegram channel called Tour swats returns popped up. Whoever was running it was selling swattings for $40 a pop with a returning customer discount. And also, you could swat Patrick Tomlinson for free.
- [47:51]
B
Well, that's. Yeah. I mean, I. It's crazy that they can just do that stuff right out in the open like that. I guess that's the point of, like, encrypted communications platforms.
- [47:58]
A
Yes, but we do have a better update for Patrick. So in 2024, he filed a civil rights claim against the Milwaukee police department, and he named 20 police officers in his suit. His argument was that the Milwaukee police department knew he was being swatted and yet continued to show up at his house weapons drawn. His claims against the individual officers were dismissed due to qualified immunity. There should be a movement against that, huh? I'm gonna. I'm gonna. I'm gonna start that.
- [48:24]
B
That would be a really good idea.
- [48:25]
A
Yeah. But his suit against the city was allowed to proceed. And in early May, just a couple weeks ago, he and his wife settled with the city for $575,000. It's not finalized, but that's the number that the city attorney recommended.
- [48:37]
B
Okay, so they. So they gave him. He got money.
- [48:40]
A
He got money for all the.
- [48:41]
B
He'd been through.
- [48:42]
A
Yeah. So this was reported by the local CBS station. Let me just read you a quote from them. For years, Tomlinson begged for MPD to flag his address for any future calls telling us it has led to deaths. People have been killed this way. Court documents show police often agree on one call. An officer said, luckily, we already kind of know this is an ongoing thing, because if we didn't, this could end with the guy dead. One officer sent a memo asking that the home be marked as a slaughterhouse in MPD's dispatch system. A supervisor declined. So they never flagged Patrick's house. They didn't properly train their police officers, and now Patrick is getting a big fact check, which, of course, is big news on the ONA forums.
- [49:19]
B
Yeah, they're probably not gonna like that, but good for Patrick. Patrick, you finally had a victory. You should take the W. Although I
- [49:24]
A
think he probably has to take that money and pay a part of a significant portion to the owner of the
- [49:30]
B
ONA forms, so maybe they will like it.
- [49:31]
A
Yeah.
- [49:32]
B
Yeah, True, Katie. Thank you for that. I continue to know far more about Patrick Tomlinson and his deranged stalkers and this new. And this new weird obsessive than I ever could have hoped to. But, yeah, this has been blocked. Important as always, we are produced with help from Jesse the 80s baby. Thank you for listening.
- [49:49]
A
Bye.
- [49:50]
B
Bye.