Episode 557 - RJ and Aubrey Cianciarulo || Thinking Will Save Hunting

Summary

Blood Origins Podcast Summary

Episode: Episode 557 - RJ and Aubrey Cianciarulo || Thinking Will Save Hunting
Release Date: May 8, 2025
Host: Blood Origins Inc.

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1. Introduction

In Episode 557 of Blood Origins, Robbie engages in a thought-provoking conversation with RJ and Aubrey Cianciarulo. As the next generation stepping into the hunting industry, RJ and Aubrey bring fresh perspectives while honoring the legacy of RJ's parents, Ralph and Vicky Santorulo, stalwarts in the outdoor and hunting space.

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2. Guest Background and Industry Legacy

Robbie introduces RJ and Aubrey, highlighting their deep roots in the outdoor industry. RJ shares insights into his upbringing and involvement in the family business.

• RJ Santorulo (04:02):
  "We've been in the outdoor industry space for decades. My parents started videotaping back in the mid-80s, and it's been phenomenal for our family."

RJ explains that his father, Ralph, was instrumental in establishing their presence, starting with an archery shop in Chicago and later expanding into media with shows like "Archer's Choice" and "The Choice."

• Aubrey Santorulo (04:14):
  "We moved to southern Colorado about five years ago and now live in Trinidad. It's been a significant shift, but we're embracing it."

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3. Perceptions and Challenges in Modern Hunting

Robbie steers the conversation toward the evolving landscape of hunting, emphasizing the impact of social media and changing public perceptions.

• Robbie (02:38):
  "There's a perception around who hunters are and what they're supposed to be. Modern hunters, especially those active on social media, face unique challenges that weren't present in past decades."

RJ and Aubrey delve into how the hunting community is often misrepresented and the internal conflicts that exacerbate these misconceptions.

• RJ (19:16):
  "Our industry is fairly cannibalistic. We tear each other apart over different hunting methods, which weakens our collective message."

• Aubrey (20:43):
  "Sharing that hunting is not just about killing animals but about stewardship and conservation is crucial for the industry's survival."

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4. The Importance of Unified Messaging

A significant portion of the discussion revolves around the necessity for a cohesive message within the hunting community to improve its public image and ensure future sustainability.

• RJ (19:16):
  "If we can push out one strong, concise message across our entire industry, it would translate to the general public that hunting is about caring and conservation."

• Aubrey (20:43):
  "We need to work together rather than against each other to convey that hunting serves a purpose beyond the act itself."

Robbie underscores the concept of "thinking" as a pivotal strategy to navigate the complexities of modern hunting.

• Robbie (27:00):
  "The thing that's going to save hunting is thinking. Every decision, from taking the shot to posting on social media, requires thoughtful consideration to maintain integrity and respect."

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5. Practical Strategies for Positive Influence

Robbie challenges RJ and Aubrey to implement critical thinking in every aspect of hunting and its portrayal, particularly in media.

• Robbie (28:16):
  "Thinking happens at every single junction of the hunting process. From deciding whether to take a shot to how you post about it, each step requires deliberate thought to prevent negative repercussions."

Given the rise of social media, the trio discusses how hunters can influence public perception positively by being authentic and thoughtful in their interactions.

• RJ (37:04):
  "Confidence in what you believe and how you communicate it is essential. It's about leaving a mark that reflects our values and dedication to conservation."

Robbie encourages RJ and Aubrey to utilize their platform to foster meaningful conversations and challenge negative stereotypes.

• Robbie (37:15):
  "You have the opportunity to take the platform your parents built and use it to advocate for thoughtful and respectful hunting practices."

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6. Addressing Controversial Topics

The conversation touches on sensitive areas such as predator hunting and the controversial nature of certain hunts, emphasizing the need for respectful discourse and transparency.

• Robbie (55:43):
  "For instance, when hunting bears, it's crucial to acknowledge the differing perceptions and address them openly to build understanding and trust."

• Aubrey (54:22):
  "We strive to explain the rationale behind hunts like depredation elk hunts, emphasizing their role in protecting farmland and maintaining ecological balance."

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7. Building Confidence and Influence

Robbie and the Cianciarulos explore ways to build confidence in discussing and defending hunting practices, especially against criticism.

• RJ (43:05):
  "It comes down to confidence in whatever you believe in and being consistent in your messaging across all platforms."

• Robbie (50:45):
  "Influence people by being genuine and thoughtful in your actions and communications. Your responses set an example for others to follow."

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8. Conclusion and Future Directions

Towards the end of the episode, Robbie reiterates the importance of RJ and Aubrey's role in shaping the future of hunting through conscious thinking and unified messaging. The episode concludes with an invitation for listeners to connect with RJ and Aubrey through various social media platforms and their television show airing on Pursuit Channel and Wild TV.

• RJ (58:10):
  "For more information about us, visit ContentKingMedia.com or follow us on all major social media platforms @RJandAubrey."

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Notable Quotes

• Robbie (27:00):
  "The thing that's going to save hunting is thinking."

• RJ (19:16):
  "Our industry is fairly cannibalistic. We tear each other apart over different hunting methods."

• Aubrey (20:43):
  "We need to work together rather than against each other to convey that hunting serves a purpose beyond the act itself."

• Robbie (28:16):
  "Thinking happens at every single junction of the hunting process."

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Key Takeaways

• Unified Messaging: A consistent and positive message across the hunting community is vital to improving public perception and ensuring the industry's future.

• Thoughtful Actions: Every decision in hunting, from the moment of the shot to social media interactions, requires deliberate and ethical consideration.

• Influence Through Authenticity: Building trust and influence is achieved by being genuine, respectful, and transparent in all hunting-related activities and communications.

• Addressing Controversies Openly: Engaging openly with controversial hunting practices helps in building understanding and dispelling misconceptions.

• Empowering the Next Generation: RJ and Aubrey's involvement signifies a commitment to evolving the hunting industry's narrative through thoughtful leadership and innovation.

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For more insights and ongoing discussions about hunting and conservation, tune into future episodes of Blood Origins or connect with RJ and Aubrey Cianciarulo on their social platforms.

Transcript

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[Robbie]

Hey.

[RJ Santorulo]

What'S up happy people?

[Robert Arrington]

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[Robbie]

RJ and Aubrey Santorulo are the daughter in law and son of Ralph and Vicky Santoro. They've been in the outdoor industry space for decades. I wanted to talk to RJ and Aubrey because they're a new face coming in behind sort of stalwart of the hunting industry space and I wanted to use this podcast. I think I surprised them a little bit because they were gonna approach it that hey Robbie wants to talk about our hunting adventures and our hunting show and whatnot. And that's not what I wanted to talk to them about. I really wanted to give them some advice and I really wanted them, as you'll hear me say, I wanted them to think so. You guys that listen to me, that follow us know it's one of the core things that I think that's going to save hunting is thinking. And so this podcast is going to help you think because I challenge RJ and Aubrey on this. So if you have any comments on this podcast, DM us, email us, text us. I want to hear from you. So there's a reason why I started Blood Origins and that reason is simple, is that I wanted to convey the truth about hunting.

[RJ Santorulo]

It brings awareness to non hunters that it's more than just killing animals. How do I start it? Brittany My name. Does my hair look okay?

[Robbie]

My name is Mike Axelrod. Start again. Yeah, I hated it too. Braxton, you said something in the car to me. You said that you were living on borrowed time. There's a perception around who hunters are, what we're supposed to be. And a, a feminist that works for a nonprofit that is a hunter that has only eaten wild game for the last 20 years is likely not the thing that people think about when it comes to a hunter. So as we were firing this up. 5, 4, 3, 2, 1. What? I, I, it was RJ. Why are you, you making sure your hair is perfect and whatnot?

[RJ Santorulo]

I gotta make sure it's no flowing just right.

[Robbie]

It was Aubrey. It was Aubrey checking her hair.

[Aubrey Santorulo]

Yeah, it was.

[Robbie]

I am not going to pretend to say your last name because I would have done the same thing for your parents because I will mess it up. And I'll let you. Why don't you just go ahead and introduce yourself to start with and tell everybody your last name.

[RJ Santorulo]

Alrighty. Well, I'm RJ Sanullo.

[Aubrey Santorulo]

And I'm Aubrey Sano, my wife.

[RJ Santorulo]

And we just got married last year. And my parents are Ralph and Vicki Santa. We, we, we do a little bit in the, in the outdoor industry.

[Robbie]

Yeah. So your parents have been stalwarts, essentially, right? Like, how long is, how long have your parents been. All your life, right? Yeah.

[RJ Santorulo]

Oh, yeah, absolutely. Actually, quite literally, like double my lifespan at this point. My dad's been doing it and my mom joined pretty early on back in the. The 80s and 90s. My dad started. Started videotaping back in the mid-80s, and it just, it's done phenomenal things for him. And that was just after the bow shop. He had an archery shop in Chicago. I mean, he's, he's been just enthralled in this outdoor lifestyle his entire life.

[Robbie]

Did he get raised a hunter by his father?

[RJ Santorulo]

No, not, not as far as I understand. It was really more of his uncles that kind of got him into it in his family outside of his parents. And it was when he was young. His mom, my grandma, got him a bow. And I mean, since then, it just kind of. It stuck.

[Robbie]

Did I assume obviously, him being in the hunting lifestyle, you were thrust into it from the beginning?

[RJ Santorulo]

Yeah, it was when I, the year that I was born was the same year that they had first started airing their first TV show, Archer's Choice. And since growing up, since I was young, it's been just like. That's been my entire lifestyle. And I, I've. When I was younger, I didn't understand it.

[Robbie]

Fully.

[RJ Santorulo]

But now that I've kind of grown up into it, especially throughout high school and then now graduating and moving into the company more, I understand a lot more about the, not only the management side of the game, but also this kind of like giant crazy industry where I mean we have goods, we have good bads, we have a little bit of everything in this outdoor industry. And I'm understanding more of it now and I'm kind of starting to love the whole trying to get more people, new people, whether they're young or old, into the outdoors. Because I see it more so from I think the perspective my dad and my mom have had for the past 20, 30, 40 years. Now that it's a, it's, it's an industry that we really have to push to continue to be able to live this lifestyle.

[Robbie]

Did you not feel pressured?

[RJ Santorulo]

I never felt pressured to hunt or film or any of that kind of stuff when I was young. It was, it was more of a. My parents were always gone because this was how they made a living. And through that. It's not that I disliked hunting by any means. It was more so that when I was young hunt, when they would go to hunt, that means my parents are gone. And then one thing led to another and I'd just be like, oh well, dang, I don't like this. But as I as, again, as, I mean, I started growing to understand more of why they did what they did.

[Robbie]

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[RJ Santorulo]

Yeah. And I.

[Robbie]

Because mom and dad are gone for sure. Not a single second.

[RJ Santorulo]

No, I've never. I'd never resented hunting by any means.

[Robbie]

Not just from a standpoint. I guess I'm just saying not, not hunting but rather like, oh, mom and dad aren't around because they're off hunting again.

[RJ Santorulo]

Oh yeah. I mean, there was, there was plenty of times where I was at home. I, Nani, we call her my grandma, my dad's mom.

[Robbie]

Are you a single child, by the way?

[RJ Santorulo]

Yes, sir.

[Robbie]

Okay. Okay.

[RJ Santorulo]

Yeah. But she, she, she, she was who I stayed with whenever my parents were gone. And I mean, that was a lot of, a lot of times it was September throughout the fall. My parents were gone most of the time. They'd come back usually every weekend or every other weekend or so, depending on the year. And I definitely disliked the whole idea of them being gone that much for a lot of my childhood, that's for sure.

[Robbie]

When did they start bringing you into the fold? Like, hey, you're going to be on this hunt and you're going to be on this camera and whatnot.

[RJ Santorulo]

I mean, since I was a baby, I, they, they'd been taking me out into the field whenever they could with them throughout high school. It was nice because I guess school in general, middle school and everything, my parents would talk to the school and they were like, hey, we kind of have a little bit of a different lifestyle than most and we want to be able to have enough time with our, with our kid, so we'd like him to have maybe a little bit more time out of school. And essentially the stipulation that the school had was as long as I kept my grades up, they would give my parents kind of like a little, in a way, like homeschooling courses. But it was only like a week long course whenever we would go on a trip. And that would get me usually a couple extra weeks I could leave out of school. And then when it really started kicking in was about midway through high school, I started picking up a camera a little bit more here and there for behind the camera, but as well as being on a couple hunts at a time. And then when I graduated, it was especially when things started kicking into gear.

[Robbie]

And where's home right now? Illinois's home?

[RJ Santorulo]

No. So that's where we were born and raised in about what, four years, five years ago now?

[Aubrey Santorulo]

Yeah, about five.

[RJ Santorulo]

We moved to southern Colorado and now we live in Trinidad.

[Robbie]

Dang. Right?

[RJ Santorulo]

Yeah, it's been crazy.

[Robbie]

I, I hunt, I hunt a cow elk. Let me see Google Maps, like, but we come in and do a cow elk hunt in the beginning of November every single year. Let me just see where the actual place is. It's. There's a place called Wurstenberg or something like that, if I remember correctly. Walsenburg and Garland. How close are you guys to those places?

[RJ Santorulo]

Like, not 40, 30. 40 minutes up the road. Not far at all if you hop on I25.

[Robbie]

Oh, there we go. Yeah. So I will drive through Trinidad when I'm going home.

[RJ Santorulo]

Absolutely. Let us know. Come on by.

[Robbie]

Yeah, we'll probably drive through Trinidad now. I got a place to stay.

[RJ Santorulo]

Absolutely. 100. Come on.

[Robbie]

So we hunt a place called Trinchera.

[RJ Santorulo]

Okay. Yeah, I've heard of that.

[Robbie]

Which is just over the past between Wolsenburg and Ford Garden. They're big fans of what we do. And we get, I think, two elk tags, cow elk tags with three elkharts.

[RJ Santorulo]

That's awesome.

[Robbie]

So, Aubry, where are you from? Are you from southern Colorado?

[Aubrey Santorulo]

No, I'm from Illinois. We went to high school together.

[Robbie]

Okay.

[Aubrey Santorulo]

Yes. Little sweethearts.

[Robbie]

Geez.

[Aubrey Santorulo]

I know.

[Robbie]

You grew up hunting too.

[Aubrey Santorulo]

I did not. No one really hunted in my family. Um, I remember the first time I went over to his house. I was like, holy crap, what am I getting myself into? Because all these animals were just on the wall. I'm like, oh, my gosh.

[Robbie]

Was your pers. What was your perception of hunting? Was it just negative? Was it negative or just neutral? Were you just sort of like. I haven't really thought about it.

[Aubrey Santorulo]

Yeah, I guess I. It was neutral. I didn't really have any issue with anyone, like, going hunting. I just didn't have any really interest in it because that's not what I was brought up in. But it all changed when I met this guy.

[Robbie]

So what was the first thing that you hunted with him?

[Aubrey Santorulo]

I actually sat on a doe hunt. I went and sat and watched him kill a doe. And I was like, okay, I don't want to do this now.

[RJ Santorulo]

Yeah, that's. It was. It was a little bit more aggressive. She. After I shot the doe, we went. We recover it and everything else. And it was during shotgun season. And she looks at me, and she goes, I'm up next year.

[Robbie]

Yeah.

[Aubrey Santorulo]

I didn't really ask. I was like, yeah, I should show. I'm gonna do this.

[Robbie]

Yeah.

[Aubrey Santorulo]

And then that following year, I killed my first doe, and I've just been hooked ever since.

[RJ Santorulo]

And now she shows me up every year.

[Robbie]

Hey, as it should be. As it should be. As your wife should do. Let me ask. I. I again, you don't know me very well. We just got to know each other over the. The show season. And I don't know how much you know about blood origins and our voice and whatnot, and we tend to be a more serious voice than a funny hunt ha kind of voice. And I don't know how many podcasts you've done that, you know, talk about hunting adventures and like, what's the best thing? And it's more, ha. I don't want this to be that. I want this to be more challenging to both of you and sort of, sort of dig in philosophically a little bit about what, what drives you and things that you need to think about, things that I think you need to be thinking about. Because if you're following in your parents footsteps, you're obviously now a husband and wife team.

[RJ Santorulo]

Yes, sir.

[Robbie]

Today's hunting industry world is very different than your dad and mom sort of came up in, right?

[RJ Santorulo]

Very.

[Robbie]

The. Your dad and mom were raised outside of our social media space. You know, that's something that's come to fruition since 2005. Ish. 2008. Ish. And it comes with its own challenges, most specifically people doing stupid things tied to hunting, to be frank. And so let me ask this question to. I'd be interested to hear both of your responses to this. And whoever starts, please don't say whatever he said or whatever she said. Okay. Because that's cheating. Okay. What do you think, in your opinion, is the greatest challenge to allowing you to, to do what your parents just did and hopefully one day raise a boy like RJ in the lifestyle that you do? So what is, what do you think is the greatest challenge for you to be able to do that?

[RJ Santorulo]

You want to go first?

[Aubrey Santorulo]

You go first. Go for it.

[RJ Santorulo]

I mean, kind of like you said, it's a totally different world now with having social media, having the YouTube, having television now readily available to pretty much stream whatever you want to. That being said, I think that's going to be one of the biggest challenges that we have, is continuing to get a good word out for the outdoor industry, for the hunting industry, for not only managing game, managing the lifestyle that you live yourself mentally and everything else that goes along with it, but more so. I think there's always been bad things out there, like whether it be videos or photos of people doing bad things that they probably shouldn't be doing while hunting or in the outdoors. And especially now with so much, with so many eyes on pretty much everything that we do in the world that I think that's going to be the hardest part is making sure that we have a strong message to be able to push out to the general public. I guess that that continues to portray hunting in a good light rather than in a bad light, and making sure there's not false information going out there.

[Robbie]

What is that message, R.J. i think.

[RJ Santorulo]

There'S a lot of parts into it because, I mean, our industry.

[Robbie]

Don't give me, don't give me a cookie cutter answer.

[RJ Santorulo]

Oh, I will.

[Robbie]

Your heart is in your heart. What is that message?

[RJ Santorulo]

I think the message that needs to get put out to our industry specifically, not necessarily general public.

[Aubrey Santorulo]

I know exactly where you're going to go with this.

[RJ Santorulo]

This, this is something that we've said for a while now is our, Our industry is fairly cannibalistic, is a term that we like to use here, between us. And it's, it's. When you look at, I mean, yes, there's competitions, everything else, but the hunting industry can tear each other apart. When you look between somebody that uses maybe traditional recurve bow to a compound or your muzzleloader to your rifle or what, whatever it might be, we tear each other apart rather than having one strong, concise message across our entire industry. And I think that if we can do that, that alone will be just the family and the connection that that brings will translate to the general public that this industry is caring, loving. I mean, there's so many people in this industry that truly have such a passion and desire to continue managing game and the outdoors as a whole that I, I think if we were to just not be so cannibalistic to our own, that that would translate much stronger than it currently does.

[Robbie]

Aubrey, what do you think we should be doing for hunting to survive in the future?

[Aubrey Santorulo]

Sharing it with everyone. Sharing that it's not just going out, killing the animal. Like that's not what it is. You're going out there, you're hunting this animal for food, for, you know, just taking care of being stewardess of the land, if that's the correct word. We just need to work together rather than against each other, really.

[Robbie]

Okay, so here'll be the hardest question you probably get from me, Aubrey.

[Aubrey Santorulo]

Okay.

[RJ Santorulo]

Looking forward to it.

[Robbie]

How do you, how do you do that? How do you do that in an industry that you are in, that you have to show that you kill?

[RJ Santorulo]

That is a great question. Something that I'd say we still kind of deal with every day is trying to get the proper message out, whether it be on social media, through the television show, through word, through anything that we can. We try to. We try to be as real as we can be with getting that word out, because I'm sure you've seen it. You can pretty much tell. And people know when you're, when you're being fake on camera, when you're Being fake, talking to somebody, anything like that, it, it just, that alone already starts putting a bad taste in somebody's mouth. And that being said, I think if it's hard to say because there's, there's so many ways you can shoot something down, whether you just push the hunting industry as a whole and then you see like you're saying people putting content out there that they shouldn't be putting out there realistically. And it, it hurts both sides no matter which way you look at it. I believe, but correct me if I'm wrong, but I'd say if we, if, if we as a whole in the outdoors, in the hunting industry can put together one strong message that we all agree with, there's no bickering back and forth between all of us. I guess, I guess kind of like I said a little bit ago, I think that would, that alone would translate by showing, by showing that we're a strong community, that we, that we all love each other no matter our differences, with whatever weapon we might use, with whatever we prefer to hunt, wherever we're at, whatever it might be.

[Aubrey Santorulo]

I think kind of like what your parents have always said for years and years and years, it's simple, just hunt no matter what you choose to hunt with.

[RJ Santorulo]

So yeah, that's, that's why they originally, like I'd said earlier, earlier, the first show they had was Archer's Choice. And that was very kind of not pigeon toeing. No, but they ended up doing a rifle hunt. They used a rifle on a hunt and they got a lot of slack for it. So what they ended up doing is they kept Archer's Choice, but they started a new show back in 2006, I'm not mistaken, called the Choice. And that show, it's like Aubrey just said, its tag is, it's simple, just hunt. It doesn't matter what you use, where you use it, as long as it's legal in your state or province. Get out there, we're all in this together.

[Robbie]

Yeah, I totally agree with you. I will say that. I think I'll burst your bubble and say that. I don't think I'll ever see the hunting industry get onto the same page ever.

[RJ Santorulo]

Unfortunately. I agree.

[Robbie]

And so I think for, and honestly, you know, I almost see ourselves like a little, I think people say, they look at the hunting industry and they say, look, you, you guys are like a greenhouse, right? Everyone's looking into the greenhouse. They can see the back and forth throwing of the pork plants and throwing up the dirt and stuff like that. And Honestly, I don't think that's the case because here's my, here's why I say that I think that there's disagreements on the anti hunting side. I think there's disagreements in PETA, I think there's disagreements in the Humane Society, there's disagreements in every industry space. If you think about it 100% you don't see it in the Peters of the world or the Humane Society of the world. And the reason being is that you don't follow it.

[RJ Santorulo]

That's a fair point.

[Robbie]

The only reason we see it, the only reason we see the bickering and the back and forth and whatnot is because we follow a thousand accounts that are in the space. There's no human animal rights people following a thousand hunting accounts to understand, oh, look at the drama that's happening here. I'll throw, I'll sit back and pop popcorn. I don't think it happens. And so because of that I have to ask myself is like how bad is the bickering for us?

[RJ Santorulo]

That's fair.

[Robbie]

And so I almost have, I've almost ignored it. And maybe me being in what I've done for four years and you guys slowly getting more and more into your voice, I think definitely, you know, take that champion voice that your parents have, which is, it's simple, just hunt as a straightforward, like this is what we do. But I think especially in your space and especially you talking on social media and interacting with your parents who have a bigger voice than you right now I would like to invite in sort of imbue into you things that you going to talk to them about and for them to think about and for you to think about and communicate through social medias and whatnot. Which is to me, if you had asked the question to me like Robbie, what do you think you've asked both of us like what is this? What you know, what are you going to do to save hunting so that you're being able to do this as a career and your kid can do it. And that, that, that, that choice isn't up to hunting because hunting hunters are 4% of the population, 4.2% of the population. It varies between 11 and 14 million people every year depending on things. And so the people that go to the polls are for the vast majority non hunters like Aubrey was, that either have a neutral position, either have a slightly positive position or either have a slightly negative position. And so I say how do we convince those people? And number one, because I've seen it through our message, our voice Is if you. If you take a voice, somebody's going to copy that voice. And so one of the things that we've constantly said to people is, I think the thing that's going to save hunting is thinking. You're nodding your head, saying, that makes sense, Robbie, but you don't know what I'm going to say.

[RJ Santorulo]

No, I'm listening. I'm thinking.

[Robbie]

Thinking happens at every single junction of the hunting process. So let's. Let's put you guys in a scenario. RJ and Aubrey, you're sitting in a tree stand whitetail season, and a buck decides to come in. The first thing that you gotta think about is, is this an. Is this the right animal that I want to take? That's the first thought process you did. Yes or no? Why did you make that decision? Okay, then you got to think, is this the. In the position that it is when you take the shot, is this the appropriate shot to take? So you're thinking about, is this the right shot to take? Yes. No. And all of these thinking processes, as you'll start seeing, will start with, will change. Things that happen later, right? Pictures that go up later, videos that go up later, things that people will say that go up later, things that you will say that go up later. So then you decide, yes, I'm going to take this shot. And let's assume it's a bad shot, which happens. You've got to think, is that something I'm going to post? You've got to think, is that something I'm actually going to put on a TV show? But you don't have to. You can still have the shot. You don't have to show that it was bad or you don't show it at all. Well, let's take it one step further. You did decide to do all these things. Then it's like. Or, how am I deciding? How am I going to. Are you going to. You need to think about, how am I portraying the animal? Have we cleaned it up? Have we not cleaned it up? Have we. Have we thought about how it going to look to people that maybe don't understand? So you. You're just thinking about things that maybe you shouldn't normally don't think about. You think about what you're going to say. You know, I think one of the coolest things. I don't know. Do you know Militia? Militia, Alicia Mutts Decker? Do you know who that is?

[Aubrey Santorulo]

I don't.

[Robbie]

Next time you're on show season, go find them. They run Glacier Guides, Inc. In Alaska. They Run a big luxury yacht to do black bear hunting. They do black bear hunting on Kuyu Island. And mutts. There's a film about mutts that I think you should watch later. It's an hour and a half film. And when I started watching, I was like, oh, man, I'm not going to watch an hour and a half. This is crazy. I watched the entire thing. It was filmed by a guy called Sean Ender in Colorado. And it's not, you know, cinematically, it's not like a beautiful cinematography documentary. But what it shows is how Matts hunts and Mutt hunts. Mutts hunts very respectfully. And she takes it to like the ultimate degree. It's the first time I've ever watched somebody hunt that they. Whispering all the time. All the time. After the shot, even too constantly whispering. And she's whispering because she doesn't want to disturb the wildlife in the system that they've just hunted in. She's also very much. There's no hooping and hollering. When the shot goes off and the animal is down. She recognizes what's just happened. It's almost. There's a silent high five, there's a thumbs up, you know, there's all these hand signals. She goes up to the bear, hands on the bear again, whispering, hey, congrats, this is a great beer, you know, kind of thing. There's no like. And there's nothing. I'm not saying there's anything wrong with it, just a very different way of doing things. And it's just. Whoa, just watch it. It's called Kuyu's Ku Use Bears. You'll find it on YouTube. It's got a lot of views.

[RJ Santorulo]

Okay, I write that down.

[Robbie]

So anyway, going back to the thinking. So you're thinking about what you're saying. You're thinking about how you're acting around that animal. Then you're thinking about what you're posting. You're thinking about what you say on that post. You're thinking about if somebody comments something negative. You're thinking about how you respond to that person. And all of a sudden you've done 10 things of thinking that if you do all that thinking, I don't think we can get into trouble because you would never have put yourself in the position to be a viral video of. You just took a bad shot because you've already tagged out, but you decided to take that shot because it's on tv. Heard that story before. So here, what do you think?

[RJ Santorulo]

If. If you don't mind me Asking how. How do we get more people to think before they do something? Because I'm sure, as you know, antlers, horns, things like that, everything goes out the window. Yeah. People go crazy. They want to shoot the biggest animal. They film it. They don't worry about it. They just want views. They want to show off how cool they are.

[Robbie]

How.

[RJ Santorulo]

How do you think we change that mindset?

[Robbie]

I'll throw a couple of questions back at you. Okay. If you. I assume you guys. Are you sponsored by Bass Pro?

[RJ Santorulo]

Yeah. Yes, sir.

[Robbie]

Okay, let's assume you're not.

[RJ Santorulo]

Okay.

[Robbie]

Why are you wearing that camera? If you are not sponsored and you're wearing a certain camera, why are you wearing a camera?

[RJ Santorulo]

Probably because seen it used, works ideally.

[Robbie]

Probably not works. Probably seen it. Probably seen it, heard somebody talking about it, got interested, was like, I'm going to try that out. Aubrey, why did you. Are you a reader?

[Aubrey Santorulo]

Not really.

[Robbie]

Okay. He's just screwed me in my. In my question line. Okay. You like to listen to music? I hope that's.

[Aubrey Santorulo]

Yes.

[Robbie]

Okay. What kind of music do you listen to?

[Aubrey Santorulo]

A little bit of everything. Like, 80s rock is the main one.

[Robbie]

Okay. 80s rock. Why do you listen to 80s rock?

[Aubrey Santorulo]

It makes me think of when my parents were growing up.

[Robbie]

Did. Did you just come upon it or.

[Aubrey Santorulo]

My parents played it.

[Robbie]

Somebody played it.

[Aubrey Santorulo]

Yep.

[Robbie]

Somebody played it and you liked it. And you're like, I want to. I want to listen to that more. I want to do that more. We are a society that is influenced. It's unfortunately why we have tags of, you know, jobs of influences today is that we are a society of being influenced all the time. You don't realize you're being influenced. You are being influenced.

[Aubrey Santorulo]

Yes.

[Robbie]

You're being influenced by your politics, being influenced by your decision making. You're being influenced to buy a stretching ball on Instagram because you're like, that was a great video. I want to buy it right now. And so I think honestly, the easiest way to answer your question is influence people. I do it all the time. I'm doing it right now.

[RJ Santorulo]

Yeah, absolutely.

[Robbie]

If people watch you and they see you talking the way that you want them to believe in how they do it, people are going to do it. Ralph and Vicky are examples of that.

[RJ Santorulo]

Yes, absolutely.

[Robbie]

They probably have. I don't know how many people they've probably touched hundreds of thousands of people that do things because Ralph and Vicki does it or because they source and they're like, I like that. That's. That's what I'm gonna do. And so you guys are in that boat. If you're not thinking, if you're not thinking about this kind of stuff, that's why you're on this podcast, because you have to be. Because if you're not, number one, I don't think you'll have influence or the right influence, but let me restate that. I think you'll have influence. You won't, in my opinion, won't have the right influence. And number two, I think you'd get yourself into trouble.

[RJ Santorulo]

Yeah, it's easy to do today. Might not. See, now we're thinking.

[Aubrey Santorulo]

Yeah, now we're thinking. Yep.

[Robbie]

And. And again, it's. I think you have the opportunity, You've got the platform. That's what your parents built. And so now you've got to take that platform and say, how do I. How do I do what I think is probably the best thing that can be done for hunting for the future. You can still hunt. You can still do everything that Ralph and Vicki have done. But what is RJ and Aubrey's legacy going to be with this?

[RJ Santorulo]

Something that we'll figure out.

[Robbie]

Make sure people start thinking, I can drink green juice. At the same time, if people are watching this on YouTube, I'm drinking green juice. So tell me. Talk to me. Talk to me about what I've just laid. Again, this is probably not what you thought this podcast was going to be, but I have been thinking about it a lot.

[RJ Santorulo]

It is.

[Robbie]

Talk to me.

[RJ Santorulo]

Well, geez. I mean, that's another. Now there's a lot of thinking going on and I can feel the gears turning.

[Aubrey Santorulo]

Oh, yeah, we're definitely gonna have a big chat after this, I think, just to get some things.

[Robbie]

And it's going.

[RJ Santorulo]

It's more so kind of, kind of the take, like you were just saying with thinking rather than like the issue being maybe we're not open enough to the, like being as friendly to the Inviting more people that are kind of sitting in that middle zone. But more so just rather than trying to make people stop going after each other's throats, make it so you're just staying true to yourself in a way, to you, your friends, your family, getting your own message out there rather than. Rather than trying to change other people's messages. Right. I mean, yeah. So that being said, like, like you're saying too. I mean, every. Every industry is probably cannibalistic in their own way. And I. It's hard because, I mean, yeah, we all follow thousands of accounts that are all hunting based. They all talk about the different things you get the somebody shoot something and they're like, oh, why'd you shoot that? Why didn't you give another year or whatever it might be. You don't even know if it's some young kid's first deer that he's ever shot. And it's a little spike or whatever it might be. But it's rather than, rather than going after the people that are saying stuff, just go more towards the, just congratulating being. That's awesome. Great. Fantastic. And continuing to push just genuine love. I mean that's.

[Robbie]

Have you watched my Blood Origins episode of Travis T. Bone Turner?

[RJ Santorulo]

No, not T Bones.

[Robbie]

So T Bone's episode is called Celebrate.

[RJ Santorulo]

Okay.

[Robbie]

And it's essentially that message. His message is we need to celebrate. We need to celebrate the, you know, 180 know, 180 point white tail deer and we need to celebrate the dink spike buck that somebody hunts. Yeah, I think, yeah, you're, you're right. But I think again, I hate to say it this way, but it's okay. You, you are thinking very hunting. What about other hunters are going to say, how are we going to talk to other hunters? What are we, you know, when I think you've got an opportunity to talk differently about our industry to the non hunting person like Aubrey was, get them swayed. But at the same time, really, because you're a hunting show, you're not going to have that much influence in that space. Okay. But what you are going to be is have a lot more influence in the hunting industry to be talking the way that you talk to be, you know, ruminating, excuse the pun on these things constantly. And yeah, I think that, you know, I think that you should be, you know, always willing and that's, you know, you've developed a relationship with us now, with me now feel free to call me, feel free to reach out to me and go, hey, how would you, can I talk to you about this topic? And how would you talk about this topic? Because that's what I want. I want you guys to be, be confident to speak about, you know, I don't know what it is. Let's just, you know, probably the, the hottest topic in the hunting space I would say is hunter recruitment, the R3 movement. You have people that are very pro R3, you have people that are very anti R3. We don't need more hunters. Things are crowded, crowded public spaces. We don't need more hunters. But by percentage we are decreasing our influence in the, in the non hunting general public space. Do we need to recruit more Hunters to keep our numbers the way they are. Yes. Do we need to increase the number of hunters? There's a debate to that, but I think that you guys should formulate. How are we saying, what are we to. How do we talk about R3? I think I know what you're going to say about it, but how do we talk about R3? How do we, what's our message about R3? Those kinds of things. Because the more confident you are in talking about it, the more confident somebody else is going to talk about it.

[RJ Santorulo]

Yeah, right, Absolutely. That's, I mean that's what it ultimately is like it comes down to confidence in what you're saying. And I mean, I know, at least for me, I don't know about Aubrey, but I definitely lack confidence when it comes to speaking about big topics, which is why you probably hear me stutter throughout this because I get a little bit nervous and stuff like that. And I'm trying to make sure I don't say the wrong thing. But it just, I guess it just ultimately takes repetition of learning, repetition of thinking and repetition of truly just saying it. Just getting you the word out. Whether it be to your best friend back at home or to millions of people online. Whatever, whatever it might be. It's just, I guess like you're saying it comes down to just confidence in whatever, whatever you believe in. And that was actually we, of course we have the media company, Content King Media that produces the shows and whatnot. And that's kind of one of the topics we've been talking about lately is having confidence. When you go online, when you go to do, whether it's like a legacy format media or even online videos or photos or even offline, when you're going to, maybe a show to speak or podcasts like this, even have the confidence in what you're doing, no matter really what it is, leave your mark for what you believe in and whatever that might be. I mean, and how are you going to do that?

[Robbie]

How are you going to leave your mark in what you believe in? I guess by following practical, practical like things like how can you do that better?

[RJ Santorulo]

Try to try to talk more, try to, try to have more again confidence in what you're saying. But talk to more people, learn more again, whether online or offline, have face to face conversations. Cause I'm, I'm sure you understand that talking to somebody like this, like one on one or however it might be is so much more powerful than when you're sitting there scrolling and you see somebody and it's like, oh, okay, scroll the next video.

[Robbie]

And you're like, well, you've got the perfect sounding board sitting right next to you.

[RJ Santorulo]

The perfect what?

[Robbie]

You've got the perfect sounding board sitting right next to you. Somebody who's super interested in your space. Who's in your space. And that you can, you guys can look at something on social media and you probably have done this before and said something about something like, oh, can you see this? Look at this. And again, it's difficult to do it. It comes with time and it comes with experience. But don't leave that kind of conversation superficially. Start digging deeper into sort of your philosophy and your thought process and then challenge each other. Like Aubrey, you say to him like, I love you, but that makes no sense.

[RJ Santorulo]

I get that pretty often. It's been amazing though, being able to just like, like you're saying we, we have a lot of these like superficial kind of conversations where maybe like it is, you just pull up a video, oh my gosh, look at that. We laugh at it. And then it's like, okay. And then you just keep scrolling. We call it doom scrolling. And you just sit there on your phone and you keep scrolling to the next.

[Robbie]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[RJ Santorulo]

But rather than doing that. And it doesn't happen very often, but a lot of times, especially on like car rides and stuff.

[Robbie]

Yes.

[RJ Santorulo]

Aubrey and I will be sitting there and we'll just be driving. And I mean it could be anywhere from the first, the moment you hop in the car, or it might be two hours down the road on a 20 hour car ride. And at some point along the ride something comes up, whether it's hunting related, whether it's maybe a video Aubrey found on her phone, whatever it might be. And that's, it's kind of like we need to do it more than like when we're in a car, we'll sit there for hours and talk deep about something. But when we get back home, we don't do that as often. Yeah, it's.

[Robbie]

And I don't know, but at least you're having that. You're having those conversations in the car. And not to pump my own horn here, but find a podcast of ours. We have 550 of them and some of them was on super controversial topics.

[RJ Santorulo]

Absolutely.

[Robbie]

Two today. And you can like, ah, let's listen to him. And I'll pose, I'll answer somebody's question and you just pause the podcast and be like, I don't agree with Robbie and here's why I don't agree with him and Aubrey can either say, ah, yeah, I agree with you. You're absolutely right. He's absolutely wrong. He's a jerk. He's an idiot. Or Aubrey's like, no, I actually think he's right. And this is why. And what you've, what you, again, in that moment, what you've just done is you've challenged each other's thoughts and given each other confidence to respond to that challenge. You're like, why do you think that way? Like, dig down deeper into why you think that way, definitely. And so that somebody, when again, I do so much of this that I've had to think through all of my rhetorics and I've had to think through all of my narratives. And if somebody says this, I'm going to say that. If somebody says that, I'm going to say this.

[RJ Santorulo]

So then here's a question for you. Cause I'm, I'm sure you've been through plenty of debates at this point, across podcasts and controversial topics and everything. Do you, do you believe that when you debate somebody about something that you so strongly believe in and they're on the opposite end of things, do you believe you grow more confident or less confident throughout a debate?

[Robbie]

Usually It's a great question. I think it stays about the same. I think I'm at this stage, I'll go into a debate and be extremely confident, knowing what the subject matter that I know. They're going to bring things to the table that I don't know about. And I think it's important to be honest, number one, like, oh, I don't know anything about that. That's super cool. That's super interesting. Would you send me some of those links? Will you send me some of those. That information so I can learn about it? Because in that moment, I'm going to, I'm going to pull that information, learn about it, and go, he was actually right or I was actually wrong, or, oh, here's more ammunition to put into my rhetoric belt for the next time I have that conversation. I think that, I think approaching debates, especially in the social media space, like, you'll find, like, these podcasts that I did today, and I've done podcasts in the past. I'm not toeing a line of, you're wrong, I'm right. This is an amicable discussion where you're posing your opinions. I'm posing my opinions. I may change your mind on a couple of things. You may change my mind on a couple of things at the end of the day, like this Vegan philosophically, I will never get him to say, and I think I did, I think I, I think he did say, I'm okay with hunting. But philosophically he's like, nope, like no use of animals. It's no exploitation of animals in the story. And so I'm more of, I'm just, I think a lot of what we do is influencing, again, we've talked about influencing. Is the hundred thousand people watching this interaction.

[RJ Santorulo]

Absolutely.

[Robbie]

Watching you comment back and forth. So for instance, if somebody calls you all names under the sun, whether it's a hunter or non hunter, your response is if. I would say again, if you go through this thought process, you're going to get upset and you're going to try and change that person's mind to think the way that you think. We're in. You should be thinking, how do I change 50,000 people watching me comment here? Number one, my sort of the, the characteristics of who I am reflected in the comment, how I respond, how I act reflected in the comment, giving them confidence to respond to a similar situation somewhere else. So if I change the person's mind, great. If I don't, I'm okay. Because I know that somebody else has watched me interact with that person and go like, oh, Robbie didn't take offense to them calling him a snowflake. He just was like, look, I, I appreciate your, your honesty. I'm not big into name calling, but if that's what you want to call me, cool, no problems. But here, let me explain what I know. Boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom.

[RJ Santorulo]

That's, that's about the same approach we try to take on most social media posts. Yeah, I mean we've had, we've had plenty of times where oddly enough, especially when one of the ladies will go and hunt a bear or shoot a bear, that those are for some reason one of the worst that we get a lot of.

[Robbie]

Okay, why is that the worst?

[RJ Santorulo]

That's a fantastic question that I couldn't answer.

[Robbie]

Aubrey Wise Bear. Why is, why is that portrayal the worst?

[Aubrey Santorulo]

I really don't know.

[Robbie]

Have you asked your friends that don't hunt? Sorry, have you asked your friends that don't hunt?

[Aubrey Santorulo]

No, I haven't.

[Robbie]

Have you got friends that you can ask?

[Aubrey Santorulo]

Yeah, but I don't, I don't know if they'd give me like, okay, well.

[Robbie]

Maybe you don't, maybe you don't. Again, this is being self. Aware. Number one. Two, again, having thought through things. Society and social media is going to react completely differently to predators as they do ungulates so that's your thought, number one. You recognize that immediately. So when you're on a bear hunt, your thinking has to change for all of the processes that I just talked about, just because of that fact. So what you post, how you post it, what you say, watch your video, how you put the video out, it all has to change because of that predator. Now somebody will say, and I'm surprised you haven't said it, maybe because you're being respectful to me. Why should we change? There's nothing wrong with it. There's nothing wrong with hunting a bear. It's legal, it's responsible from our perspective. It's ethical from our perspective. So what, what gives. Why are you, why are you catering? I'm not catering.

[RJ Santorulo]

Yeah, I mean, that's. We're definitely.

[Robbie]

We're.

[RJ Santorulo]

We've always been open to change within reason.

[Robbie]

Um, it's not changing. I'm not asking. All I'm asking you to do is what? Think a hundred percent.

[RJ Santorulo]

And that's. Sorry, that's. That's, that's more. So what I meant is think, like being open to new ideas and thinking deeper on things. And that's. I mean, we, we've always tried to do our best to explain. Like last last year we went on a depredation elk hunt where they're in velvet. And in the episode where we, we go through the process, we thought about it a lot. We're trying to explain why people do that. I mean, on one side, the biggest issue at that point is they're destroying farmland, they're destroying fences that people run cattle in and all that. And that's. We, We. I think I, I'd like to say that we do. I, I know that I can say that we do our best to try to get the word across. Yes. That like, whether it be the depredation elk or the bear hunts or whatever it might be why we, why we do that in our episodes. But like, you're saying maybe, maybe we could do a better job on social media getting that word out rather than.

[Robbie]

Posting or even in the episode. You can just acknowledge it.

[RJ Santorulo]

Oh, and we, and we.

[Robbie]

We will, you know, that, you know, for instance, just be on your bear video. Right. You're going to be announced like, look, man, people are going to be upset with us right now because this is a bear hunt and being honest about it again is. Honesty is such a diffusing mechanism right off the bat that they're like, oh, they already know.

[RJ Santorulo]

So you mean just call them out? Pretty much, yeah.

[Robbie]

Well, like for instance, I use this example a lot. If you Google trophy hunting and you look at the images of trophy hunting, there's this, there's this one image that we will never, ever, ever get rid of, which is this big fat white American sitting behind this huge lion and he's holding his gun. We will never get rid of that image. It'll always be used against us. So clearly that guy didn't think about that. Okay, but how do I manage me, us, our hunting message in light of the fact that I'm never getting rid of that photo? Well, I'm gonna first thing off the bat and say, yeah, you're right, it's a photo. I wouldn't do it. You know, d even, you know, do I say, I wouldn't go to the as far as saying it's disgusting. But I was like, yeah, it's not a good look. Yeah, it's I again I'm diffusing them. I'm like, yeah, I agree with you. But now let me tell you about some things now that I've got you, let me tell you about some things.

[RJ Santorulo]

Hook them.

[Robbie]

Anyway, you've got again, I, I'm a big fan of your, of your father and mother and was great meeting you guys and I've been watching, you know, from afar. I just think that you guys have an opportunity to, you know, you, you're carrying the torch forward, you're carrying the flame forward and you know, hopefully myself and others in our space that think deeply about these kinds of things and can have a influence on you guys as your voice projects out into. Because we've again, I've got a certain community that follows us and they expand their communities and you're now part of this and you're going to take what I've said and we're going to interact in the future and that's, you know, my biggest, you know when I will hang up my hat is when you're on TV and say, you know, we're going to do some thinking here because there's a guy that talked about us doing some thinking.

[RJ Santorulo]

Okay, be sure that'll happen. Don't worry. Well, there will be a lot thinking done from here.

[Robbie]

Well, I appreciate you guys.

[RJ Santorulo]

We appreciate if people want to know.

[Robbie]

About more about you guys and what you do and how you do it. Where can they find you across the.

[RJ Santorulo]

Board for Facebook, Instagram, TikTok, YouTube, anything social media based. It's @RJ and Aubrey. And then for the television side of things, the choice is a television show and we're airing on Pursuit channel and Wild TV. If you want information, the website's content king media.com okay.

[Robbie]

I would have advocated for Aubrey and RJ because A comes before R. Yeah.

[RJ Santorulo]

We weren't sure how AR would look.

[Aubrey Santorulo]

Yeah, that's fair.

[Robbie]

Oh, true, true, true, true, true, true.

[RJ Santorulo]

We, we were thinking. We were thinking.

[Robbie]

Yay. There we go. All right, boys and girl, we appreciate it. Yeah, just don't hesitate to reach out to me, okay?

[RJ Santorulo]

If you need anything, fully expect texts and calls.

[Robbie]

All right, guys. Well, that's it for today. Appreciate you listening. As always, leave a review, share it with your friends and most importantly, do what's right to convey the truth around.

[Narrator]

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[RJ Santorulo]

Gear up for the hunt and learn from the best with deer and deer hunting. Wednesdays at 10pm Eastern on Waypoint TV. Tune in every week for expert hunting tips and unforgettable moments in the field. Waypoint tv, your destination for outdoor entertainment.