Bloomberg Businessweek Weekend - June 12th, 2026

Summary

Bloomberg Businessweek Weekend - June 12th, 2026

Hosts: Carol Massar & Emily Graffeo

Guests: Mark Gurman, Gina Raimondo, James Walker, Tim Jackson, Mark Gongloff

Release Date: June 13, 2026

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Episode Overview

This episode of Bloomberg Businessweek Weekend navigates the week's most urgent topics at the intersection of technology, power, and culture. From Apple’s ambitious AI overhaul, the challenges and opportunities posed by AI for workers, and the real-world race to meet skyrocketing energy demands, to the fate of vital climate data infrastructures and the journey of a Tony-nominated Broadway sensation, hosts Carol Massar and Emily Graffeo bring in leading voices for in-depth analysis.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Apple’s AI Pivot: Strategy and Stakes

Guests: Mark Gurman (Bloomberg’s Managing Editor for Global Consumer Tech)

• Key Takeaway: Apple delivered a much-needed, overdue reset to its AI and Siri strategies at WWDC, aiming to ensure upcoming hardware launches succeed.
  • “Apple has just reset its AI strategy, its Siri strategy, and its underlying software platforms because they have a blockbuster next three years of new hardware products that they need to get right.” – Mark Gurman (04:54)
• Apple’s adoption of on-device and cloud-based LLMs is designed for practical consumer use, but trails behind tech AI leaders.
  • “They're where they should have been two years ago. They're not caught up in any shape or form. But...their approach is super smart for the mass consumer.” – Mark Gurman (05:52)
• Future hardware roadmap: foldable iPhone, AirPods with cameras, smart home devices, new iPads, and touchscreen Macs. New iOS 27 contains hints of the impending foldable phone arriving September.
• On European regulation: Gurman criticizes the EU’s approach under the Digital Markets Act for harming both consumers and developers.
  • “I'm not really sure who the EU is helping here.” – Mark Gurman (08:46)

Timestamps:

• [04:33] – Start of Apple segment
• [04:54] – Mark Gurman’s main analysis
• [08:46] – Reaction to EU digital regulation

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2. AI and the Labor Market: Preparing for Turbulence

Guest: Gina Raimondo (U.S. Secretary of Commerce, former Governor of Rhode Island)

• Key Takeaway: AI leadership demands not just world-class technology but a robust people strategy to prevent mass unemployment.
  • “We’re not going to win the global AI race if we have great technology and sky-high unemployment.” – Gina Raimondo (10:12)
• Praises training programs paying trainees, emphasizing apprenticeships and “all hands on deck” collaboration.
  • “It’s important to say we're going to pay you while you get trained, and if you graduate...there will be a job at the end of that training.” – Gina Raimondo (11:12)
• Calls for urgent action: new training initiatives, safety nets, and incentives for redeployment, without overregulating AI.
• Balancing innovation and labor stability is vital, especially with China advancing rapidly.
  • “We need to do both...If we wound up with extremely high unemployment, we won’t win the AI race with China.” – Gina Raimondo (13:34)

Timestamps:

• [10:01] – Raimondo on AI and workforce strategy
• [11:37] – Addressing economic/labor disruption
• [13:34] – Competing with China, policy balance

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3. Powering the AI Boom: Nuclear Microreactors and Data Center Demand

Guests: James Walker (CEO, Nano Nuclear Energy), Will Wade (Bloomberg Energy Reporter)

• Key Takeaway: The expansion of AI in data centers is driving a historic surge in energy demand, with next-gen nuclear (SMRs) emerging as a key solution.
  • “I would argue that objectively we're in the lead in the commercial micro reactor race.” – James Walker (18:51)
• Nano Nuclear’s Kronos microreactor project is the first of its kind to submit a construction permit to the NRC, setting expectations for commercial operation by 2030.
• DOE pilot program is relevant for early research, but Walker (and four other companies) are far enough to focus directly on NRC commercial licensing.
• Tech giants are investing in nuclear to address looming “power bottlenecks,” seeking off-grid, flexible, and clean baseload energy. The massively capital-intensive grid upgrades required for alternatives are a key driver.
  • “...if you have a nuclear power station that can be co located and off-grid and put wherever...you've de-risked your industry and then China doesn't catch up your AI industry.” – James Walker (22:28)
• Utilities are being hedged against by tech companies—betting on many solutions, but only needing one to pay off.
  • “They only need one of those [energy] to pay off, not necessarily all three. They just don't know which one is going to be right.” – Will Wade (23:44)
• Nuclear’s reliability (capacity factor) is vital for data centers' near-zero downtime tolerance.

Timestamps:

• [18:07] – Energy impact of AI/data centers
• [18:51] – Nano Nuclear’s commercial lead
• [21:12] – Timeline for commercial deployment
• [22:28] – Tech’s energy investment logic

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4. Climate Data at Risk: Political Decisions & Scientific Progress

Guest: Mark Gongloff (Bloomberg Opinion)

• Key Takeaway: The dismantling of federal climate monitoring systems is eroding scientific capacity and long-term environmental resilience.
  • “Rather than putting more stuff in the water just to double check and see what's going on there, we're pulling stuff out. And all in the name of...the administration's priorities are pretending to that climate change doesn't exist.” – Mark Gongloff (26:32)
• The AMOC (Atlantic Meridional Overturning Circulation) is under-monitored just as warning signs emerge.
• Breaking up Boulder, Colorado's National Center for Atmospheric Research jeopardizes $31 billion in annual national economic value from weather prediction.
• Lack of data in the "AI age" is likened to flying blind into mountainous terrain.
  • “It's a bit like if you're flying a plane and your instruments tell you there's a mountain ahead, you just panic and shut your instruments off.” – Mark Gongloff (28:49)

Timestamps:

• [26:27] – Climate data infrastructure at risk
• [28:49] – “Flying blind” quote

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5. Broadway’s Breakout Hit: “Two Strangers Carry a Cake Across New York”

Guest: Tim Jackson (Tony-nominated Director), with Chris Rouser (Bloomberg Pursuits Editor at Large)

• Key Takeaway: A small “indie” British musical becomes a Tony darling, channeling the spirit of New York through outsider eyes.
  • “The show is a love letter to New York...to make sure that they were having the most playful and fun and exciting adventure through the city.” – Tim Jackson (34:39)
• Originated in Ipswich and Northampton, UK, evolving through workshops and regional runs, and found viral success through streaming of its opening number “New York.”
  • “A lot of people have said who are native New Yorkers...oh, this show's made me sort of re fall in love with New York again, because you see it through those fresh eyes.” – Tim Jackson (36:46)
• Show’s intimacy (two actors) paradoxically delivers a broad, “epic” experience.
  • “...when people leave, they were like, oh my gosh, it's so much bigger than I thought it was going to be.” – Tim Jackson (42:08)
• North American tour launching 2027, with a focus on accessibility to all audiences outside Broadway hubs.
• Jackson’s pride and surprise at Tony recognition for both himself and collaborators.
  • “It feels wild. It feels absolutely wild. It feels so exciting.” – Tim Jackson (43:53)

Timestamps:

• [33:36] – Show introduction and nominations
• [34:39] – Creative approach and appeal
• [36:46] – Outsider perspective on New York
• [42:08] – “Small but mighty” in Tony race
• [43:53] – Personal reaction to Tony nominations

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Notable Quotes

• Mark Gurman:
  • “Apple has just reset its AI strategy, its Siri strategy, and its underlying software platforms...” (04:54)
  • “They're where they should have been two years ago. They're not caught up in any shape or form...” (05:52)
• Gina Raimondo:
  • “We’re not going to win the global AI race if we have great technology and sky-high unemployment.” (10:12)
  • “It’s important to say we're going to pay you while you get trained, and...there will be a job at the end of that training.” (11:12)
• James Walker:
  • “I would argue that objectively we're in the lead in the commercial micro reactor race.” (18:51)
  • “...if you have a nuclear power station that can be co located and off Grid and put wherever...you've de-risked your industry and then China doesn't catch up your AI industry.” (22:28)
• Mark Gongloff:
  • “Rather than putting more stuff in the water...we're pulling stuff out. And all in the name of...the administration's priorities...” (26:32)
  • “It's a bit like if you're flying a plane and your instruments tell you there's a mountain ahead, you just panic and shut your instruments off.” (28:49)
• Tim Jackson:
  • “The show is a love letter to New York...to make sure that they were having the most playful and fun and exciting adventure through the city.” (34:39)
  • “...when people leave, they were like, oh my gosh, it's so much bigger than I thought it was going to be.” (42:08)
  • “It feels wild. It feels absolutely wild. It feels so exciting.” (43:53)

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Memorable Moments

• Mark Gurman’s prediction: Expect Apple’s foldable phone previewed in the next iOS, launching under new CEO John Ternus ([08:05]).
• Gina Raimondo’s explicit warning: Without a worker strategy, the U.S. will lose to China in the AI race ([13:34]).
• James Walker explaining the strategic role of nuclear as the only grid-independent clean energy capable of data center uptime ([22:28], [24:33]).
• Mark Gongloff’s analogy of the climate data shutdown: “Flying blind” into global instability ([28:49]).
• Tim Jackson's emotional response to his first Tony nomination and the audience’s rediscovery of NYC through “Two Strangers Carry a Cake” ([43:53]).

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Segment Timestamps Quick Reference

• [04:33] – Apple’s AI & hardware strategy with Mark Gurman
• [10:01] – AI’s impact on labor, Gina Raimondo
• [18:07] – Energy & nuclear microreactors, James Walker
• [26:27] – Climate monitoring cutbacks, Mark Gongloff
• [33:36] – Broadway musical, Tim Jackson

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For more in-depth coverage, analysis, and breaking news from Bloomberg’s reporters, visit Bloomberg.com.

Transcript

[IBM Representative]

So there's a lot of noise about AI, but time's too tight for more promises. So let's talk about results. At IBM we work with our employees to integrate technology right into the systems they need. Now a Global workforce of 300,000 can use AI to fill their HR questions, resolving 94% of common questions. Not noise Proof of how we can help companies get smarter by putting AI where it actually pays off. Deep in the work that moves the business. Lets create SMA to business IBM.

[Mark Gurman]

So as a pizza genius I know

[Emily Graffeo]

pizza shop orders come from well everywhere. With Genius by Global Payments online orders

[Mark Gurman]

actually sink straight into your kitchen.

[Tim Jackson]

It's as simple as pie.

[Emily Graffeo]

And with digital menu boards, your specials,

[Tim Jackson]

your prices, your brand always front and

[Public Investing Representative]

center, it's one system ready for game

[Emily Graffeo]

night crowds any night of the week. Really.

[Bloomberg Businessweek Daily Podcast Host]

Cheers.

[Emily Graffeo]

Big league reliability for any business. That's genius.

[Chase Sapphire Reserve Representative]

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[Carol Massar]

Bloomberg Audio Studios Podcasts

[Bloomberg Businessweek Daily Podcast Host]

Radio News this is Bloomberg Business Week Daily reporting from the magazine that helps global leaders stay ahead with insight on the people, companies and trends shaping today's complex economy. Plus global business, finance and tech news as it happens. The Bloomberg Business Week Daily Podcast with Carol Massar and Tim Stanweck on Bloomberg Radio hi everyone.

[Carol Massar]

Welcome to the Bloomberg Business Week Weekend Podcast, a topsy turvy week for global markets driven by the ongoing conflict in the Middle east, it seems never ending. The US and Iran exchanging strikes, jolting their two month old truce and endangering talks aimed at securing lasting peace in the Middle East.

[Emily Graffeo]

Meanwhile, Wall street going all in on Elon Musk's SpaceX, which debuted on the Nasdaq on Friday in a record breaking ipo. Investors scrambling for a piece of the space giant, also the AI giant, also the owner of the platform formerly known as Twitter. And maybe, just maybe, as some analysts have told us, maybe it'll be part of Tesla or Tesla will be part of that in the future.

[Carol Massar]

Throw in the boring company and then Neuralink, Neuralink and whatever else, right?

[Emily Graffeo]

Elon does a lot right?

[Carol Massar]

Robots like all of it.

[Emily Graffeo]

Investors certainly scrambling for a piece of the space giant. For a full breakdown of this record IPO, head on over to the Bloomberg Terminal or bloomberg.com with that as our

[Carol Massar]

backdrop, another mega cap tech company was also on our mind this past week. That was Apple, Bloomberg's managing editor for global consumer tech and our in house Apple expert Mark Gurman, who correctly forecast many months ago maybe what was coming when it comes to AI and Siri. Well, he unpacked the details further from this past week's Apple annual Worldwide Developers Conference. Everything from the biggest overhaul of Siri to yes, a foldable iPhone. Although that really wasn't part of the announcements. But what what Mark reminded us, you read inside all the details and that's where you find out about this possible or expected foldable iPhone.

[Emily Graffeo]

Plus, as AI continues to seemingly reshape everything, including the corporate landscape, pressure on the American worker is growing. Former U.S. commerce Secretary Gina Raimondo weighs in on what needs to be done to avoid significant dislocations in the labor market.

[Carol Massar]

And we can't talk about AI without being reminded of all the energy it requires and all the sources needed to meet that demand, including new nuclear. The CEO of nanonuclear, James Walker gives us an update on those much talked about SMRs, small modular reactors.

[Emily Graffeo]

And later on we catch up with the director of the hit Broadway show Two Strangers Carry a Cake Across New York. All that to come. We begin with a closer look at one of the world's most valuable companies. We are talking about Apple.

[Carol Massar]

We are indeed. This past Monday, Apple unveiled a new AI strategy at its annual Worldwide Developers Conference out on the west coast, aiming to provide practical improvements and features that the company believes everyday consumers will actually use. For more, Bloomberg's Emily Graffeo and I caught up with our in house Apple whisperer, Bloomberg's Managing editor for global Consumer tech, Mark Gurman.

[Mark Gurman]

My big takeaway is that Apple has just reset its AI strategy, its Siri strategy and its underlying software platforms because they have a blockbuster next three years of new hardware products that they need to get right. And what you've seen from Apple lately is that the gate to some of their hardware products coming out on time and being successful, working as advertised has been AI and has been the underlying operating systems. And so for the foldable iPhone, AirPods with cameras, three smart home devices, new iPads and touchscreen Macs to come out and sell at their peak, needs to work properly and they need to get the software and AI story in shape. And they did just that. Obviously they can't come out and say because of their culture that this is why they're doing that. But from what I'm telling you is that this is all about enabling this next generation suite of hardware under incoming CEO John Ternus.

[Chase Sapphire Reserve Representative]

So are they finally caught up in AI compared to the other big tech companies?

[Mark Gurman]

No, they're where they should have been two years ago. They're not caught up in, you know, in any shape or form. But what we also saw is Apple roll out AI in a way that is for mass consumers. Their new LLM, their new on device Siri technology also getting to the cloud is effective. This is what mass consumers are going to use. Don't forget a third of the world is using these Apple products. And so I think their approach that they're taking is super smart for the mass consumer. But at the same time I think if Apple was capable of rolling out these whiz bang features and developer tools, things like codecs, things like OpenCloud, they would do just that. And they will probably get there eventually. Obviously they got a helping hand from Google, Anthropic and OpenAI this time around. But I do think they are in a very fair place for consumer expectations today and brand is super strong and so people are going to keep buying the product. So I think they're in a decent place. An adequate place.

[Carol Massar]

All right, so decent place for consumers. I mean it's not on par with some of the other high flyers certainly in the tech space. So what will it take for investors to get more impressed? What do we need to see from Apple and maybe how long does it take for it to get there?

[Mark Gurman]

Investors are going to need to understand that for the next few years Apple is not going to be a, a winner in terms of the way that they think about AI winners today. They're going to need to recalculate their investment thesis around is the Apple product story, the overall cohesive story. Strong are the new hardware products industry leading. And don't forget Apple's always been a hardware company at its core. 80% of the revenue is from the hardware. The other 20% services and they've been doing good in services and they've been doing good in hardware but the hardware needs to be in a place where it's actually excellent again. And my hope as a consumer is that these new software features are going to try to push the Hardware into a great place, an excellent place. So we'll see if that happens.

[Carol Massar]

And that includes you did have another story out about the iOS 27 overhaul and all these related software updates, what it says about the foldable phone from Apple. So what did you glean from all of that?

[Mark Gurman]

Yeah, this three year roadmap of major new hardware products. The first one is the foldable phone. You'll see the new CEO introduced that in early September. The new iOS obviously is going to run on this phone, so it's chock full of hints about the upcoming device. I'm pretty excited for it. It's going to have a widescreen display, excellent reliability and durability. So I think it's going to be a pretty compelling product.

[Chase Sapphire Reserve Representative]

Mark, before we let you go, we do want to get your reaction to this Apple News saying that under EU regulators, extreme interpretation of the Block Digital Markets Act. What do you make of just the regulation in Europe and how much it's going to stifle Apple's growth projections here?

[Mark Gurman]

I don't like what the EU is doing at all. Let's take Apple and growth and you know, Apple's a company aside. If I'm a consumer in the eu, someone like me who loves tech wants to try out these new features, wants these breakthrough new products and you know, software enhancements. I'm upset with the EU because I just want this stuff and I want my Apple ecosystem to work as advertised as it's supposed to work. If I'm a developer, which the eu, you know, said they're putting these rules in place to protect competitors, to protect third party app makers. I'm really angry because if I'm a developer in the eu, I'm not able to introduce new AI apps, all these features that take advantage of the new frameworks, these new platforms and I want to be able to do that in order to make money for my small app business. So I'm not really sure who the EU is helping here.

[Emily Graffeo]

That was Mark Gurman, Bloomberg News Managing Editor for Global Consumer Tech.

[Carol Massar]

Apple's news was overdue for many investors who were concerned that Apple was falling behind on its AI strategy more broadly. This is all part of a massive and expensive race between the big tech giants to be at the center of this latest tech disruption. That's upending how we live, how we work, how we play, and when it comes to how we work, that's creating opportunities, it's also creating job losses.

[Emily Graffeo]

For more on what this could mean for the future of the U.S. labor force, Carolyn Emily Griffeo spoke with Gina Raimondo, 40th U.S. secretary of Commerce under President Biden. She was also the 75th governor of Rhode Island.

[Gina Raimondo]

I am an AI forward person. I think that the US does and needs to continue to lead in this global AI competition. And that means, of course, being ahead with the technology, but it also means having a strategy for people. I mean, we're not going to win the global AI race if we have great technology and sky high unemployment. And so I think it's time for the country to get very serious about changing the way we support people when they change jobs and the way we train people because we have to bring all Americans along. This cannot just be AI for the big tech and not bring everyone along. And so with this announcement, as I understand, you know, what Met is doing here, the thing I really liked about it was they're paying people while they do the training. And I know from when I was governor, I was a real, a leader in a lot of these apprenticeship and training programs. People can't afford to do a six week or six month training program and not get paid. They're not going to finish that training program. I think it's. First of all, I think it's good that companies in America are stepping up to say, let's get innovative and try to support workers. But I think it's important to say we're going to pay you while you get trained, and if you graduate and if you get your credential, there will be a job at the end of that training.

[Chase Sapphire Reserve Representative]

Secretary, you wrote a guest essay for the New York Times earlier this year. It was entitled America Cannot Withstand the Economic Shock that's Coming. What do you think the country, the Trump administration, and lawmakers from both parties really need to do to address this very much feared economic and labor disruption that AI is expected to unleash?

[Gina Raimondo]

We have to prepare for it. I think it is a transition. I do believe AI will create new jobs. Every technology has created disruption and job loss, but over time, new jobs, new industries, many, many, many, many millions of jobs in our economy today did not exist even 20, 30 years ago. So I think we're going to get to that place. However, there will be a transition. And I worry that during that transition, if we're not thoughtful and purposeful, too many Americans could be on the losing end of that transition. And so we need to get very serious right now and create new training initiatives like the one we're talking about. But that is not enough. Training is not enough. We need new incentives for companies to redeploy people. We need new, you know, like a new safety net to help people transition from one job to the next. And so I think this calls for some pretty urgent action with the government, with employers. You know, it's an all hands on deck moment to create a people strategy to get us through this transition.

[Carol Massar]

It's a US Race, it's a global race. If we don't get this right in terms of how we are approaching it and protecting our labor force, but at the same time making sure that we are making the right investments and moves when it comes to AI. When you've got China and the government in their deep pocket, will that put potentially the US At a disadvantage? In many ways, yes, it will.

[Gina Raimondo]

I've spent as much time as anyone thinking about how to protect America from China and how to to compete with China technologically, economically, militarily, and we need to do both. I personally oppose over regulating AI or regulating the technology to a point that it would stifle innovation. However, I also would oppose putting our blinders on and letting AI out into the world without a plan for our workforce because truthfully, if we do that and if we wound up with extremely high unemployment, we won't win the AI race with China. We won't. We will then have political unrest, economic unrest, deep recession, and frankly, a regulatory backlash. So I see no other alternative than to do both. We can do it. America has consistently risen to the challenge in the face of these big challenges before. And if everybody works together, we can do it again.

[Emily Graffeo]

Our thanks to former US Secretary of Commerce Gina Raimondo, Emily Griffeo joining us again later this hour.

[Carol Massar]

Coming up, tech giants are building tomorrow's world. And yet will there be enough power to run it all?

[Emily Graffeo]

Enter all kinds of energy, including nuclear. The CEO of Nano Nuclear joins us when Bloomberg Businessweek continues. This is Bloomberg.

[IBM Representative]

So there's a lot of noise about AI, but time's too tight for more promises. So let's talk about results. At IBM, we work with our employees to integrate technology right into the systems they need. Now a global workforce of 300,000 can use AI to fill their HR questions, resolving 94% of common questions, not noise. Proof of how we can help companies get smarter by putting AI where it actually pays off, deep in the work that moves the business. Let's create smarter business.

[Public Investing Representative]

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[Chase Sapphire Reserve Representative]

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[Bloomberg Businessweek Daily Podcast Host]

this is the Bloomberg Businessweek Daily podcast. Listen live each weekday starting at 2:00pm Eastern on Apple CarPlay and Android Auto with the free Bloomberg Business app. You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship New York station. Just say Alexa play Bloomberg 11:30 the

[Carol Massar]

rapid scaling of AI in data centers has created an unprecedented demand for electricity and the race to power. It has officially entered a new regulatory phase.

[Emily Graffeo]

Earlier this year, the Nuclear Regulatory Commission accepted the construction Permit application for Nanonuclear's Kronos microreactor. It marked a major milestone for commercially ready grid independent nuclear power.

[Carol Massar]

Nanonuclear also signed a strategic partnership with tech giant Supermicro to explore building more of these Kronos microreactors directly alongside next gen AI server racks.

[Emily Graffeo]

For the latest update on how close they really are to building and deploying something real, we caught up with James Walker, CEO at Nanonuclear Energy, alongside Will Wade. He's Bloomberg News energy reporter.

[James Walker]

I would argue that objectively we're in the lead in the commercial micro reactor race. I think we're the only microactor company that submitted a construction permit application to the nrc, which is the federal regulator. So if someone's going to be first to build a first of a kind full scale full power reactor system, it'll be us.

[Will Wade]

Well, let's talk about Antares. They had their big breakthrough. That's the criticality demonstration through the DOE's reactor pilot program. That feels like notable.

[James Walker]

No, it's notable definitely. To get something critical is no small feat, but it's a different thing to take a reactor critical at a zero power reactor and then build a full scale, fully operational, net power producing reactor system that's commercially licensed. These are different challenges. One is for what we're shooting for, we have a commercial site. We don't need the DOE program to assist us and we're gearing towards a commercial license where we can then go on to sell working systems that we could demonstrate at full scale.

[Will Wade]

We've seen that the DOE program has almost a dozen companies working for that criticality. You're not part of that program, right? Can you talk a little bit about you're not?

[James Walker]

Yeah, absolutely. So actually there's five companies that have submitted a construction commercial companies that submitted a construction permit application to the nrc. And none of those five were part of the DOE program. And the reason why is that us and the other four were just too advanced for that program. We already had our site, we already had our NRC engagement and the benefits of the DOE program were not there for us. There was no funding for that program. We already had a site and the DOE program does not give us a commercial license, whereas the NRC route does. So there's the DOE program. It's good to expedite development of concept reactor systems. If you're shooting for the commercialization of your systems, you still need to go that NRC route. And that's where me and, well, our company and the other four that have submitted that Construction permit application are gearing towards so different programs. And if you are sufficiently far along in terms of your commercial development, there weren't very many benefits of being part of this DOE program.

[Will Wade]

I kind of wonder that too sometimes because it goes through the DOE instead of the nrc. So that puts you on track to build a commercial plant when exactly? Can you give us some details there?

[James Walker]

So yeah, sure. So actually we've already done all the geotechnical drilling on the site and we've submitted that, that construction data. We should get permission to start construction sometime in 2027. Once we get that data with that permission back, we'll be, we'll immediately start that construction process next year. By about 2029, the reactor will be almost completely constructed. And I would imagine 2030 will have a full scale, fully power operating reactor system, net output of power that's fully licensed and ready for commercial sale in 2030.

[Carol Massar]

What if energy demand starts to decline? Does that, will that make you pull back? Maybe it's a silly question, but I will think about this. This is a good question because I will say the Cerebras CEO and one of the, I believe co founders, Andrew Feldman, Andrew Feldman, right at Bloomberg Tech in San Francisco said there's plenty of power out there. That was his view. He says it's just not near where it needs to be. It's not easily accessible.

[Emily Graffeo]

So build the data centers next to those. Power.

[Will Wade]

Power.

[Carol Massar]

Perhaps. Perhaps that was his view. But I'm just wondering if for some reason, let's just go there, that we don't need as much power. Three years is a long time out or three and a half years. A lot can happen between now and then. Could it slow the progress that you have laid out for us or that

[James Walker]

you plan well, I mean he's part of the tech industry and you know, the tech industry has been making massive investments into nuclear for a reason. And the reason why, I mean you've seen it from Microsoft, from Meta, from aws, from Amazon. They're making those nuclear inroads. And they're not doing it because there's abundant power. They're doing it because there's a massive projected bottleneck of power. And the reason why is that to actually get the grid up to a point where we'll be able to outlay the projected amount of power the tech industry needs, you'd need to put something like $5 trillion into the grid infrastructure. Now that's not their business, but if you have a nuclear power station that can be co located and off Grid and put wherever you want, advantageously providing that baseload power. You've de risked your industry and then China doesn't catch up your AI industry. So there's one opinion against the massive weight of hundreds of millions, if not billions of dollars coming from tech industry. So but I would follow the money.

[Carol Massar]

The only thing I will say and will you help me out here? I feel like I remembered, I can't remember who I was talking to and just said, listen, a lot of the hyperscalers were making bets and deals with a lot of utilities and they were hedging their bets. And it wasn't necessarily all of those contracts or prom or agreements or conversations were going to pan out. They just wanted to make sure they had power.

[Will Wade]

Yeah, there's been some talk that they're putting money here and they're putting money there and they're putting money in this thing over here and they only need one of those to pay off, not necessarily all three. They just don't know which one is going to be right.

[Carol Massar]

So I do wonder. So again. Go ahead, James.

[James Walker]

Yeah, no, go ahead. I was just going to say. No, you're right. Like the tech companies and other industries, they're energy agnostic. They don't care where it comes from. It could be a geothermal or hydro or whatever. The challenge that they face is an infrastructure one. And already there's quite a lot of backlash against data centers, rising utility bills, things like that. And the feedback we're getting is that they're increasingly looking at models where they want to be off grid. So they're out of sight, out of mind. Now if you want to do that and you want to have baseload power, you've only you're stuck with nuclear unless you're going to build massive transmission lines and gas pipelines all around the country.

[Emily Graffeo]

They do have some, my understanding is some are powered by generators right now.

[James Walker]

Yes. But the, the issue is if like say your generator, what's powering that generator? Is it diesel?

[Emily Graffeo]

Like, yeah.

[James Walker]

Are you going to be chucking it in? And also like they do still have a clean energy mandate now. They're producing a lot of carbon emissions and like if what's the scale up going to be? Like, are you going to need more generators? Like, and also the other thing too is that the amount of downtime that can be sustained by a data center on an annual basis is like minutes, maybe less than that. And like that means that you're going to need a constant output of power. If there's anything Wrong with your generator. Yeah, like you've already missed your targets. The highest capacity factor of all energies is nuclear, and capacity factor is a measure of consistency of output. If you, if you need that baseload power and you need that to be absolutely consistent as much as you can make it. So you're so stuck again with nuclear power, which is why they keep coming back to it.

[Carol Massar]

Hey, James, just real quickly, a yes or no. Nano went public a few years ago. This is a Will Wade question, but I'm squeezing it in. Are we seeing so many IPOs now because these companies need money, yes or no?

[James Walker]

Yes, I would say it's a, it's a hot market. They're all chasing the cash.

[Emily Graffeo]

Our thanks to James Walker, CEO of Nano Nuclear Energy, and to Will Wade, Bloomberg News energy reporter.

[Carol Massar]

Some big tech hyperscalers, as you know, are driving the AI boom. They include Amazon, Microsoft and Google. And they have made massive bets on nuclear energy to power the AI boom. Meantime, Elon Musk and others talk about building them and powering them in outer space. Our next guest is concerned about a problem he sees, though, right here on planet Earth. Climate change. And a recent action by the Trump administration to dismantle what he writes is a scientific establishment long considered a national treasure and the envy of the world, and is now a blueprint for deliberate ignorance.

[Emily Graffeo]

Those are the words of Mark Gongloff of Bloomberg Opinion. He's a columnist who covers climate change.

[Mark Gongloff]

This is a $386 million system of buoys and other devices spread across two oceans. We spent that $386 million 10 years ago. So these are taxpayer dollars that were already spent. And this system was supposed to last another 15 years after that. So this is a 25 year project to study everything about the oceans and that includes how fish are doing, how coral reefs are doing, the temperatures, chemistry, and also important currents and patterns of water. And one of the big ones is the thing that, you know, you might hear a lot about, which is the amoc, which is this current that runs from the Gulf Stream at the equator all the way around and helps keep Europe from freezing over. And everybody's really obsessed with that thing. And we get lots of data from these buoys that tell us what's going on there. And in fact, there's a cold blob that's just shown up that's got people a little anxious about whether that means that this system is slowing down a little bit, which could cause problems, rather than putting more stuff in the water just to double check and See what's going on there. We're pulling stuff out of the water. And all in the name of mainly, you know, supposedly money, because it's kind of coming from the. The Office of Management and Budget Budget. But the OMB has been saying all along, every time it shuts down one of these scientific enterprises, that it doesn't fit with the administration's priorities. And the administration's priorities are pretending to that climate change doesn't exist. No longer gathering climate change data, getting out of the business of having anything to do with climate altogether.

[Carol Massar]

You know, this is not. This is a situation where ignorance is not bliss. Like, I just think about this, right, Mark, you know, I was in Portland, Oregon. People were talking about the weather, talking about how it's going to be a really dry summer. We've got a story by our Brian K. Sullivan about why the world is bracing for a rare super El Nino, which might create flooding in some parts of the world and droughts in the other. I mean, we need to be monitoring our environment. This is about everybody. And we have to have coordination globally. Like, we need this data. You know, it's so interesting in an AI world where data is so important to making that important, data is so important to making sure that we can all exist on this Earth.

[Mark Gongloff]

Yeah, I mean, it's a bit like if you're flying a plane and your instruments tell you there's a mountain ahead, you just panic and shut your instruments off. So you can live in denial for a few seconds, but pretty soon you're going to be in trouble. And that's what we're looking at right now. There are many reasons to study the environment as people 5,000 years ago started recognizing, because you have to know, understand its patterns and its behavior, to grow crops and to fish and to survive boat trips. So all this stuff was happening long before anybody understood anything about climate change. And so, you know, the ncaa, which is this thing in Boulder, Colorado, this huge thing that's been there for decades. National center for Atmospheric research provides a $31 billion a year service to the country by helping people just do weather, just predict the weather. We all like that. And that's also being broken up. A judge recently kind of halted the breakup a little bit. But in the meantime, during the months while people were waiting to see the fate of this thing, scientists have left, programs have shut down, funding has shut down. So we're already unplugging our eyes and ears on the world.

[Emily Graffeo]

That was Mark Gangloff, a Bloomberg Opinion columnist who covers climate change.

[Carol Massar]

Still ahead on Bloomberg Businessweek, the Tony Awards just wrapped up and one of the season's breakout hits is a unique import from London's West End.

[Emily Graffeo]

Eight time Tony nominated director Tim Jackson joins us next. This is Bloomberg.

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[Carol Massar]

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But that's weird.

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[Carol Massar]

That's from the Broadway hit and Tony nominated Two Strangers Carry a Cake Across New York the Tony Awards were held this past week at Radio City Music hall in New York City, and yet the financial and creative ripples are just beginning for Broadway's newest hits. Transforming a West End musical into a commercial success in New York is one of the highest stakes gambles in show business, especially for an indie production.

[Emily Graffeo]

Our next guest did exactly that. His hit production, Two Strangers Carry a Cake Across New York got eight Tony nominations this year, including best Musical and best Director. The romantic comedy follows a Brit who lands in New York for his estranged father's wedding. He's picked up by Robin, the sister of the bride, and they've got an adventure through New York City. For more, Emily Griffeo and I caught up with Tim Jackson alongside Bloomberg Pursuits Editor at large Chris Rouser. Well, first of all, congratulations on on the nomination. That's really, really cool. The awards coming up this Sunday. Just talk to us a little bit about your approach in creating a musical that has such wide appeal.

[Tim Jackson]

Well, from the second I got the script, I sort of knew it could have wide appeal because the characters are so relatable. What's brilliant about the two of them is Dougal and Robin are seemingly quite ordinary people who are leading quite conventional lives and then they're thrown into this orbit with each other and then have this wild 48 hours in New York together. So I mean, the show is a love letter to New York. And so my focus always was to make sure that they were having the most playful and fun and exciting adventure through the city that they could. And with the two actors that we have, that's been very easy because they're so funny and so brilliant and yeah, they bring a lot of joy, let's put it that way.

[Will Wade]

So the show is a Love Letter to New York, but it's not from New York. It started in Ipswich, in Northampton. Can you tell us the story of how you came to be a part of this show and where it originated?

[Tim Jackson]

Yeah, so I was brought on board in 2018 as a dramaturg. So I was. I was brought on to help develop the writing and to work with the two brilliant writers, Kit Buchan and Jim Barn, to sort of finesse it and give it some shape. And then after about three workshops, we were doing a sort of presentation and the producers said, we feel like maybe you are the right person to direct it. So at that point I was brought on to do these regional productions and then it's been on an epic journey. So we did it in these two theatres that you've mentioned and then we brought it to off West End to a theatre called the Kiln Theatre. And that's where Sam Tutty, who's now on Broadway, joined our process. And then we took it to the West End and then we took it to art in Boston where we did more rewrites on it. And we gained our Broadway leading lady, Christiane Pitts, who joined us there. And we did lots of rewrites then. And especially having an American woman play the role of Robin, who is an American character, sort of opened up some doors for us. And then, yeah, final few bits of tweaks and then we were on Broadway.

[Will Wade]

So no one is a New Yorker.

[Tim Jackson]

In two straight ups, no one is a New Yorker. We have all the way through, sort of made sure that we involve as many Americans in the creation of it as possible. My husband is American, which is helpful. And yeah, we've sort of made sure one of our producers is American. And so we've sort of been doing as much homework as we possibly could. But a lot of the show is sort of seeing New York through the perspective of an outsider. And so what's actually been really lovely about the response to the show is quite a lot of people have said who are native New Yorkers have been like, oh, this show's made me sort of re fall in love with New York again, because you sort of get to see it through those fresh eyes and feel the excitement of what it's like to arrive into the city for the first time and, and see all the secrets and treasures that are sort of hidden.

[Chase Sapphire Reserve Representative]

Tim, how did you approach, you know, doing homework, learning about kind of the essence of New York to fulfill this director role?

[Tim Jackson]

Well, I'd been very lucky that two years ago I choreographed a musical on Broadway called Merrily Roll Along.

[Will Wade]

It did okay. It did all right.

[Tim Jackson]

Yeah. It did all right. Yeah. And so I'd got to be around for the duration of the show. And then I stayed in New York for another six months after that. And so I really. I got sort of time to fully immerse myself, and I went to the different locations where the show was taking place, because this other show, The Two Strangers, had been in development since 2018. I already knew I was doing it. I didn't necessarily think we'd get to Broadway, but at the time, I was like, well, I'm here, so I should make sure. I've been to Flatbush. I've walked the routes. I've walked the routes around China, Chinatown. I've sort of experienced it as much as possible to try and make sure things were authentic and took lots and lots of pictures to share with the writing team and the designers, etc.

[Will Wade]

So New York is notoriously tough, and that's partly what the show is about. But Broadway is notoriously tough, especially for a new musical. And you guys went from the West End to the US Pretty quickly. My understanding is you're. You had a pretty strictly limited run in the West End. Why come so quickly to the US when it is so dicey for new musicals?

[Tim Jackson]

Yeah, well, I'm glad that we did. And well done to our producers for making it happen, because it is brave. I think. We had recorded an album in the UK that had really caught fire, and lots of people were streaming it in America, and we were able to see that there was an appetite in New York, and we've since then recorded another album with the Broadway cast, and that's going bananas as well. So I think we knew there was an appetite. And the opening song of the show, New York, had gone viral, and we were getting a lot of love from America and people saying, please bring it over, please bring it over. So I think that it certainly is a risk for our producers, but one that seems to be paying off so far, because I think a lot of shows open just before the Tonys, but ours was open well before the end of last year, so we've sort of been doing pretty. Pretty good business, I think. And the nicest thing is that you can feel that there's a buzz. There's a build in a buzz. I feel like people are talking about the show more and more, which we're obviously thrilled about, because we started off this show in tiny studio theaters which seat 30 people, and now we're at the Longacre So, so it's an exciting evolution for the piece.

[Emily Graffeo]

We're speaking with Tim Jackson, the Tony Award nominated director and choreographer of Two Strangers Carry a Cake Across New York. Tim, the North American tour will start in fall of 2027, and I'm wondering about a couple things with regard to going from doing this in London to then doing this on Broadway and then taking it across North America on tour. Does the experience. Is the experience different or will it be different than somebody seeing it on Broadway?

[Tim Jackson]

I, I can't tell until we get there, I suppose. I mean, my intention is to make it as good as it can possibly be, and I wouldn't want it to be any lesser than watching a show on Broadway. I think there's something about seeing a show come into your local theater that's really exciting because you sort of watch that space transform as another little gem arrives into it. So I think that's exciting. I think we'll still be aiming for like the most stellar casting and, and the, the elements will be the same. So the, the. You'll be seeing the best version of the show that we can have going around the country. So, yeah, that's certainly the intention. We're re. We're so excited about the tour because we want to connect with as many people as possible and we feel like it's a, it's a very relatable show for all of America. It's not just for. It's not aimed at Broadway audiences, it's aimed at every person. I'm really passionate about making theater for anyone and everyone.

[Will Wade]

It's also a small show, which makes it easier for it to transfer around the US for at the Tonys, you're up against some huge shows that were capitalized for three, four times as much as you guys spent to put the show together. How does it feel to be. Be kind of like the small but mighty contender in that space?

[Tim Jackson]

It feels lovely. You know what's nice is that I think all the shows in the categories are quite individual and quite discreet from each other, and therefore we just have to get on and do our own thing. I think it's nice you described it as small and mighty because I think that is how we feel about has two characters in it, but unanimously, it feels like when people leave, they were like, oh my gosh, it's so much bigger than I thought it was going to be. And there's a feeling of scale and epicness. I think Sutra Gilmour, who's our set designer, who's also nominated for a Tony Award, has done the most beautiful job at creating a space that's sort of ever evolving. And we're on a double turntable, so it's always moving and especially towards the end of the show, it gets. The visuals become bigger and bigger as we go through. So I think the nice thing is we feel like we're delivering in terms of scale and a sense of bigness, I suppose. And people come out the other end of the show and they're like, oh, I sort of forgot it was only two people. And I sort of felt like I'd connected with everyone in the room. So I think the sort of connectivity between strangers is something that sort of bleeds into the auditorium and sort of lifts the piece and. Yeah, and it means you can't really compare any of our shows in the different category and in the different. In their best musical category. I think they are. They're really different and I think they're all brilliant. And. Yeah. So we just have to get on with it and just make sure that what we're doing at the Long Aid Co is the best that we can make happen.

[Will Wade]

So two people on stage, eight Tony nominations. This is your first time directing on Broadway. Yes.

[James Walker]

Yes.

[Will Wade]

And your first time directing on Broadway, you are nominated for a Tony. How does that feel?

[Tim Jackson]

It feels wild. It feels absolutely wild. It feels so exciting. And I was so nervous on the day of the nominations, but not for me. I just really wanted it for Kitten Jin, the writers, and I really wanted it for Sam and Cristiani and everything else that came along is a blessing. And I'm very happy for Sucha and Lux Pyramid, who's our orchestrator, because I think he's done an amazing job, but I was just rooting for them. And so when that news came through, it was so exciting. And then the fact that I got a nomination too, I was surprised and delighted. And I'm actually in rehearsals for another show at the moment. I'm doing this musical, something rotten in the uk and I had to go back into rehearsals after finding out and sort of pretend like nothing had happened. But my brain was slightly elsewhere that afternoon. But, yeah, I feel really proud and chuffed. And I watched the Tony awards from the UK on YouTube as I was growing up and I was always very admiring of it, but I didn't really think I would necessarily be part of that nominated gang. So I am, yeah, I'm chuffed a bit.

[Emily Graffeo]

That was Tim Jackson, Tony nominated director, alongside Chris Rouser, Bloomberg Pursuits Editor at large.

[Carol Massar]

And that wraps up our weekend edition of Bloomberg Businessweek from Bloomberg Radio. Thank you so much for joining us.

[Emily Graffeo]

Be sure to tune in to Bloomberg Business Week Daily Monday through Friday starting at 2pm Wall street time on Bloomberg Radio, Bloomberg TV and SiriusXM channel 121.

[Carol Massar]

You can also watch our daily broadcast on YouTube. Just search Bloomberg podcasts or simulcast on Bloomberg originals, available on bloomberg.com originals and streaming platforms including Roku, Amazon, Fire TV, Samsung TV and more.

[Emily Graffeo]

I'm Tim Stenebeck.

[Carol Massar]

I'm Carol Massar. Have a good and safe weekend, everyone.

[Bloomberg Businessweek Daily Podcast Host]

This is the Bloomberg Business Week Daily Podcast, available on Apple, Spotify and anywhere else you get. Your podcasts listen live weekday afternoons from 2 to 5pm Eastern on Bloomberg.com, the iHeartRadio app, TuneIn, and the Bloomberg Business App. You can also watch us live Every weekday on YouTube and always on the Bloomberg Terminal.