Bloomberg Businessweek: "The Epstein Class Needs to Make Amends"

Date: March 20, 2026
Hosts: Carol Massar & Tim Stenovec
Guest: Max Chaffkin, Senior Reporter at Bloomberg Businessweek

Overview

This episode delves into the fallout from the recently released Jeffrey Epstein files and their profound impact on public trust in business and societal elites. Hosts Carol Massar and Tim Stenovec, with guest Max Chaffkin, explore the growing hostility toward major institutions, the emergent "Epstein class," and the urgent need for accountability and amends from implicated leaders. They discuss the broader psychological and societal consequences, consumer power, and why this scandal is likely to affect perceptions of leadership and capitalism for years to come.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Erosion of Trust in Elites and Institutions

• Main Theme:
  • There is a marked decline in public confidence in business leaders and other societal elites, as evidenced by polls and increasing populist rhetoric from both political wings.
  • Quote:
    • “The sense of growing hostility toward business leaders and others in powers everywhere you look, it’s in polls that show sinking opinions of large companies, universities, the media, churches, and virtually every major institution.” — Carol Massar (01:44)
• Populist Movements:
  • Hostility comes from both left and right populist angles, exacerbating distrust.

2. The Epstein Files: A Bombshell for the Elite Class

• Scandal's Uniqueness:
  • The Epstein files align with existing conspiracy theories about a global elite, fueling even more suspicion among the public.
  • The files’ breadth—over 3 million documents—exposes embarrassing and incriminating behavior among some of the world’s wealthiest and most respected figures.
  • Quote:
    • “This is like a bomb going off in the relationship that Americans and people all around the world have with their business leaders.” — Max Chaffkin (03:44)
• Long-Term Impact:
  • The scandal will have lingering effects on trust and accountability, possibly for decades.

3. (Lack of) Accountability and Elite Resilience

• Ostracism & Real Consequences:
  • High-profile resignations (e.g., Larry Summers, Kathy Ruemler) are exceptions; many maintain their positions or retain support despite links to Epstein.
  • Quote:
    • "There is a sense of a lack of accountability... Some people have resigned... but you still have people like Bill Gates and Reid Hoffman maintaining their roles." — Max Chaffkin (05:19)
• U.S. Perspective vs. Global:
  • Unlike in some countries where scandals lead to real falls from power, in the U.S. the consequences are muted.

4. Contagion Effect & Lingering Suspicion

• Boycotts & Consumer Sentiment:
  • The scandal affects consumer loyalty and can lead to boycotts, even for companies only loosely linked to Epstein.
  • Example: LifeTouch (owned by Apollo, which had a connection to Epstein) faced boycotts despite a distant link.
  • Quote:
    • “You’re seeing places where there isn’t even a really close connection to Epstein, where companies are suffering.” — Max Chaffkin (05:54)
• Ongoing Relevance:
  • The Epstein saga influences voter attitudes and is likely to shape future populist electoral results.

5. The Social Structure and the “Epstein Class”

• Perceived “Club” and Moral Decay:
  • The files conveyed an image of a closed, elitist club focused on self-interest and internal maneuvering—deepening disenchantment with the system.
  • Quote:
    • "What’s so damaging... is not only the alleged crimes, but the sense of this little private club and people... only interested in maneuvering within that clique." — Max Chaffkin (06:46)
• Wider Societal Discontent:
  • The scandal intersects with pre-existing anger over inequality, the wealth gap, and perceived lack of justice post-Great Financial Crisis.

6. Professional Judgment and Morality

• Failures of Leadership:
  • Many of those implicated are meant to be professional judges of character, capital, and societal vision, raising questions about their suitability.
  • Quote:
    • “It does show an incredible lack of judgment... from people supposed to be professional judges...” — Max Chaffkin (08:10)
• Trust Gap in Technology:
  • The AI industry is cited as suffering from distrust rooted in broader skepticism of elite motives and competence.

7. Public Power: Beyond the Ballot

• Consumer Influence:
  • Voters may feel limited by the political system, but have power as consumers, potentially shaping companies’ fortunes through collective action.
  • Ongoing investigations and upcoming congressional testimonies (including hints at Bill Gates possibly testifying) signal that the story is far from over.
  • Quote:
    • “It will continue to hang there for a long time because there are all these redactions in the Epstein files... Some of these people... are going to testify in Congress.” — Max Chaffkin (09:24)

8. The Call for Genuine Amends

• Acknowledging Failure:
  • Chaffkin argues that true redemption for implicated leaders requires direct confrontation and honest acknowledgment of their actions, as opposed to evasive PR responses.
  • “What we’ve seen instead... is a shifting story tailored to suit whatever information has already been released.” — Max Chaffkin (10:32)
  • Example: Elon Musk’s public denials leave out clear evidence from the files, illustrating the problem of incomplete admissions.
  • Quote:
    • “The people who will be able to move past this are going to be the ones that confront it head on... rather than trying to get around it with these kind of evasive statements...” — Max Chaffkin (10:32)

9. Why Did So Many Still Seek Out Epstein?

• Motivation: Power and Access:
  • Even after Epstein served prison time, prominent individuals sought him out for their own ambitions and networking.
  • “You could just say a lack of a moral compass... If you wanted to be more charitable, I think you would say access and money.” — Max Chaffkin (11:56)
  • Example: Dr. Peter Attia viewed Epstein as a conduit to build his business profile.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• "This is like a bomb going off in the relationship that Americans and people all around the world have with their business leaders."
  — Max Chaffkin [03:44]

• "You layer that on this very upsetting sex scandal, and then you layer on a wealth gap... that becomes a stew that I think could lead to some significant social changes."
  — Max Chaffkin [07:03]

• "Being in these files doesn't mean you were complicit... but it does show an incredible lack of judgment."
  — Max Chaffkin [08:10]

• "The people who will be able to move past this are going to be the ones that confront it head on."
  — Max Chaffkin [10:32]

Timestamps for Key Segments

• [01:44] — Discussion of declining public trust in institutions
• [02:47] — How the Epstein scandal amplifies elite distrust
• [04:19] — Is the fallout truly consequential for the elite class?
• [05:06] — Notable resignations and the limits of accountability
• [05:54] — Impact on businesses tangentially tied to Epstein
• [06:46] — The damaging optics of the "Epstein class" and social discontent
• [08:10] — Failures of professional judgment
• [09:24] — Ongoing investigation, persistent story
• [10:32] — Genuine amends and the need for honesty from leaders
• [11:56] — Why so many courted Epstein, even post-scandal

Conclusion

The episode paints a vivid portrait of a society grappling with leadership crises and the challenge of restoring trust in the wake of scandal. The hosts and guest lay out a road map for how business leaders might begin to make amends—not through PR maneuvers, but with honest self-reflection and public accountability. The implications stretch far beyond the Epstein case, promising to shape debates on power and trust for years to come.