What a Government Shutdown Means

Summary

Bloomberg Businessweek – Episode Summary

Episode: What a Government Shutdown Means
Date: October 1, 2025
Hosts: Carol Massar, Tim Stenovec
Key Guests: Nathan Dean (Bloomberg Intelligence), Noor Bint Ali Al Khulif (Bahrain Economic Development Board), Damien Garde (Bloomberg News), Angie Frank (Calderos), Alexis Brown Roberts (Alexis Investment Partners)

---

Episode Overview

This episode examines the first day of a U.S. government shutdown and its economic, political, and market implications. The hosts dig into political stalemates, possible outcomes, and sectoral effects with policy experts. The show also explores global economic trends, focusing on Bahrain's investment strategy, discusses the ramifications of new drug pricing deals between Pfizer and the White House, and finishes with a perspective on labor market data and investment sentiment.

---

Key Segments & Discussion Points

1. Government Shutdown: Causes, Politics & Potential Duration

• [01:48] The episode opens with reactions to the U.S. government shutdown commencing as the fourth quarter begins, with Carol Massar and her co-host questioning its likely duration and consequences.
• [02:13] Nathan Dean (Bloomberg Intelligence) joins to analyze the situation:
  • Political Blame Game: Both parties are blaming each other; no leadership-level progress is evident.
  • Shutdown Timeline Expectations: Odds favor a shutdown lasting about 10 days (Polymarket consensus: 11.5 days).
  • Bipartisan Senate Discussion: Some discussion of a short-term continuing resolution (CR) possibly tied to Obamacare subsidies, but negotiations are slow, with pressure not peaking until the following week when the House returns.
  • Quote: "Shutdowns occur when both parties think that it's politically advantageous for the shutdown to occur." – Nathan Dean [04:55]
• [04:07] Democrat Strategy: Holding out over health care and subsidies; challenge will be finding an exit strategy.
• [06:15] Election Impact: Long-term electoral effects are likely minimal; focus is on rallying party bases ahead of midterms.
  • Quote: "I don't think any people are gonna go into the voting booth and say, hey, remember what happened back in October of last year?" – Nathan Dean [06:27]
• [07:14] Potential for Layoffs: White House Budget Director Russell Vogt threatens imminent federal layoffs, but actual broad action deemed unlikely and more likely political posturing.
  • Quote: "You'll probably see notifications go out and you'll probably see signs. But as of right now, I still think it's political posturing. Not so much actually a real layoff threat." – Nathan Dean [07:46]
• [09:00] Influence on President Trump's Decisions: Trump is described as primarily listening to himself, with outside influence from JD Vance and Russell Vogt, but ultimately making the final call.
  • Quote: "I think the president is listening to himself and I think the president is going to make the decision that he wants to make." – Nathan Dean [10:01]

---

2. Global Perspective: Bahrain's Strategic Investments

• [12:58] Interview with Noor Bint Ali Al Khulif:
  • Bahrain's Economic Diversification: 85% non-oil GDP with strong finance and manufacturing sectors.
  • Open for Business: Bahrain positions itself as a testbed for international businesses, with focus on infrastructure, regulations, and human capital.
  • Attracting U.S. Investment: Meetings with U.S. tech, manufacturing, and film companies; seeking to support foreign businesses entering Bahrain.
  • Global Climate: Navigating protectionism (e.g., U.S. tariffs on foreign films); Bahrain promotes itself as a complementary, not competitive, destination.
    • Quote: "...we believe it's not a zero sum game. Some companies would need to have presence in both regions, not necessarily just one..." – Noor Bint Ali Al Khulif [17:10]
  • Competitive Edge: Cost competitiveness, international connectivity (including U.S. free trade agreements), and government/private sector collaboration (e.g., "Team Bahrain" concept).
    • Data Jurisdiction Example: Established laws so data centers (e.g. Amazon/AWS) can treat Bahraini-hosted data as U.S. diplomatic property. [18:45]
  • Immigration Opportunity: Golden Residency Program attracts foreign talent for 10-year renewable residence, appealing to tech workers affected by U.S. H1B visa constraints. [21:20]
  • AI and Data Centers: Bahrain was a leader in regional hyperscale data centers, supports further AI infrastructure investment. [22:38]
  • Risks & Realities: Main challenge—explaining Bahrain’s diversified, stable, and business-friendly environment to foreign investors.
    • Quote: "What that means is for years and years, for decades, we've built knowledge and know-how in our people, in our infrastructure, in our regulation..." – Noor Bint Ali Al Khulif [25:25]

---

3. Pfizer, Drug Pricing, and Policy Implications

• [26:39] Pfizer-White House Drug Pricing Deal:
  • Pfizer and the White House strike a deal: 3-year tariff reprieve for Pfizer in exchange for promises to lower Medicaid prices.
  • Market Reaction: Pfizer stock surges, as do pharma peer stocks.
• [28:10] Damien Garde (Bloomberg News) on Policy Realities:
  • Medicaid already pays amongst the lowest prices by law; no guidance update from Pfizer, suggesting negligible financial impact.
    • Quote: "Medicaid already pays the lowest price available in the United States. It is legally obligated to get that." – Damien Garde [28:21]
  • Main benefit: Alleviating fears of aggressive presidential drug price controls and avoiding costly tariffs.
• [31:01] Angie Frank (Calderos) on Potential Impacts:
  • Agrees that immediate out-of-pocket benefits are limited, but calls the deal a “first step” toward more affordable drug access.
  • Discusses the Trump Rx direct-patient drug platform (potentially disruptive if leveraged by employers to bypass PBMs and middlemen).
    • Quote: "We’re certainly opening up more channels for patients to access their drugs at more affordable prices." – Angie Frank [31:28]
• [34:39] How It Would Work:
  • Trump Rx (yet to launch) would be a direct, cash-pay alternative, possibly greater future impact if sold to employers—not just uninsured individuals.
  • Ongoing industry hope is this will redirect policy scrutiny from manufacturers to PBMs (pharmacy benefit managers).
• [35:21] Innovation Concerns:
  • Franks contends price transparency and eliminating waste will support R&D investment, not hinder it.
    • Quote: "When you simplify and drive more transparency, you have less waste in the system. And that waste will feed the top of the funnel. That will be dollars that can go directly to ... innovation funnel..." – Angie Frank [35:54]
• [38:25] Who’s Next:
  • Eli Lilly is expected to be the next big pharma dealmaker with the White House.

---

4. Markets in Focus: Labor, Sentiment & Portfolio Strategy

• [41:11] Weak Private Jobs Data:
  • ADP reports 32,000 private sector jobs lost vs. 51,000 expected gain; hosts discuss labor softness.
• [42:04] Alexis Brown Roberts (Alexis Investment Partners) on Markets:
  • Not concerned about labor market “cracking”—sees seasonal volatility and focus shifting to Fed rate cuts.
  • Clients remain invested, some adding new money; tactical equity positioning and largest holding is gold (~9% portfolio).
  • Plenty of cash remains on sidelines, room for more market upside.
    • Quote: "We tend to look at the AI Bull Bear sentiment ratio survey ... not necessarily euphoric at this point ... there is some room to run on that front." – Alexis Brown Roberts [45:09]
  • Cautions about rich valuations and watching for possible Q4 pullbacks, but ready to buy into dips.
• [48:22] AI Innovation as a Market Driver:
  • Real excitement is not just in “sexy” AI stocks, but broad productivity gains for established companies leveraging AI in all sectors.

---

Notable Quotes by Segment

• Shutdown Politics:
  "Shutdowns occur when both parties think that it's politically advantageous for the shutdown to occur." – Nathan Dean [04:55]

• Policy Deadlock:
  "I don't think any people are gonna go into the voting booth and say, hey, remember what happened back in October of last year?" – Nathan Dean [06:27]

• Presidential Influence:
  "I think the president is listening to himself and I think the president is going to make the decision that he wants to make." – Nathan Dean [10:01]

• Global Investment:
  "...we believe it's not a zero sum game. Some companies would need to have presence in both regions, not necessarily just one..." – Noor Bint Ali Al Khulif [17:10]

• Bahrain’s Economic Pitch:
  "What that means is for years and years, for decades, we've built knowledge and know-how in our people, in our infrastructure, in our regulation..." – Noor Bint Ali Al Khulif [25:25]

• Drug Pricing Reality:
  "Medicaid already pays the lowest price available in the United States. It is legally obligated to get that." – Damien Garde [28:21]

• Pharma-Policy Interface:
  "We're certainly opening up more channels for patients to access their drugs at more affordable prices." – Angie Frank [31:28]

• Innovation and Cost:
  "When you simplify and drive more transparency ... That waste will feed the top of the funnel. That will be dollars that can go directly to ... innovation funnel..." – Angie Frank [35:54]

• Investment Sentiment:
  "We tend to look at the AI Bull Bear sentiment ratio survey ... not necessarily euphoric at this point ... there is some room to run on that front." – Alexis Brown Roberts [45:09]

---

Timestamps for Important Segments

• Government Shutdown Deep Dive: [01:48] – [10:05]
• Bahrain Economic Development Interview: [12:58] – [26:03]
• Pfizer/Drug Pricing & Policy Analysis: [26:39] – [38:36]
• Labor Market & Portfolio Strategy with Alexis Brown Roberts: [41:11] – [48:49]

---

Summary

This episode of Bloomberg Businessweek provides a multifaceted look at the economic and political turbulence of October 2025. It critically examines the root causes and likely duration of the U.S. government shutdown, dives into global business trends through discussions on Bahrain's aggressive investment strategy, analyzes the real impact (and limitations) of high-profile drug pricing deals, and wraps up with smart money managers sharing perspectives on labor market signals, AI innovation, and equity allocation. The episode is packed with practical insights, direct quotes from major policy and business players, and expert analysis on the nuanced intersections of politics, markets, and global business.

Transcript

[Noor Bint Ali Al Khulif]

When we go into a new region, networks matter. Experience matters.

[Podcast Host]

For an inside look at the global connections that help businesses succeed, search for.

[Carol Massar]

Turning Point brought to you by Bloomberg.

[Podcast Host]

Media Studios and HSBC.

[Canva Representative]

Okay, I have 30 seconds to explain Canva, and that's impossible, but here's a glimpse. Canva can take your presentations to another level. With Canva Video, you can generate awesome videos with one prompt. Can Canva Docs lets you create stunning visual documents, reports, plans, whatever magic write can write in your voice using AI and Canva sheets make spreadsheets people will actually like. Canva lets you bring your big ideas to life as fast as you can think of them.

[Carol Massar]

Put imagination to [e-mail] Hiscock Small Business Insurance Knows there is no business like your business across America, over 600,000 small businesses, from accountants and architects to photographers and yoga instructors, look to Hiscox Insurance for protection. Find flexible coverage that adapts to the needs of your small business with a fast, easy online'@hiscox.com that's his c o x.com there's no business like small business. Hiscox Small Business Insurance.

[Podcast Host]

Bloomberg Audio Studios Podcasts Radio News this is Bloomberg businessweek Daily reporting from the magazine that helps global leaders stay ahead with insight on the people, companies and trends shaping today's complex economy. Plus global business, finance and tech news as it happens. The Bloomberg Business Week Daily Podcast with Carol Massar and Tim Stenbeck on Bloomberg Radio.

[Podcast Host/Interviewer]

Well, day one of the government shutdown. Day one of the fourth quarter as well. Mm.

[Carol Massar]

And it's been an interesting one.

[Podcast Host/Interviewer]

How long is it going to happen? How long is it going to go on?

[Carol Massar]

I think it's a big question. Right. And I think the duration of this shutdown, you know, that is going to be a big deal in terms of the impact we will certainly see. And I think we're all waiting and watching because the concerns have been whether or not we start to see workers being cut, as the president has said he would do.

[Podcast Host/Interviewer]

Yeah, the president. Well, rather White House Budget Director Russell Vogt is planning to swiftly dismiss federal workers, with layoffs to happen within two days imminent very soon, according to White House Press Secretary Caroline Levitt. We're going to continue to bring you the latest from Washington, D.C. and that includes checking in with Nathan Dean. He's Bloomberg Intelligence Senior Policy analyst. He joins us from the nation's capital. Nathan, you were, I don't remember how optimistic you were yesterday, to be honest. I have to be honest with you. Feel like you were optimistic in the early Part of the day, and then in the later part of the day, you got less and less optimistic. And certainly what ended up happening was the government did shut down. Is there any. Is the daylight decreasing between Republicans and Democrats right now at the leadership level?

[Nathan Dean]

Look, they're both in the posture right now where they're trying to blame the other. And Yesterday it was 241 when I told my first client that I thought it was going to shut down. But I still feel that it's a little optimistic to say that we think that this shutdown is going to end probably within 10 days. Now polymarket has it 11.5 days. So that's the general, general consensus out there. But we did see the first time today some bipartisan senators, not at the leadership level, but at the working level, I would call it gag on the Senate floor to potentially talk about a short term CR combined with maybe some type of effort on Obamacare subsidies. Now they left for today. They're out for Yom Kippur. They won't come back until Friday. I think that you're gonna see more political rhetoric take place on Friday and. And you're not gonna see serious negotiations till over the weekend because remember, the House Republicans still aren't here. They come back next week. But all that has to happen and keep the government open is five Democrats need to go and support this because yesterday's vote, three Democrats or two Democrats and an Independent that caucuses with the Democrats ended up voting for this. So Senator Schumer only has a few more days until I think the pressure for more Democrats will be to go and say we're going to reopen the government.

[Carol Massar]

You mentioned cr, of course, that's a continuing resolution. Nathan. What I'm wondering is, are the Democrats, I mean, what are people saying? Or what do you think? As you watch, the government, whether would have been Democrats or Republicans, are Democrats in this case, in this instance, kind of right to put their foot down on an issue that's very important to their voters or their constituents in terms of health care. And if they don't put their foot down and they say, all right, let's not shut down the government, let it go. You guys say, you'll talk to us. Are they silly in not kind of getting a deal or, you know, beforehand, you know, getting some kind of commitment to an issue that they say is very important to their American voters. And let's remember, go back to the election, you know, half voted for the president or a little bit more than half. Right. If you look at the popular vote, and the other half did not.

[Nathan Dean]

You know, shutdowns occur when both parties think that it's politically advantageous for the shutdown to occur. And I think that's the situation we're still in there. There's a lot of folks that blame Republicans for this. There are a lot of folks that blame Democrats for this. But from the Democratic perspective, there were two goals, I think, going into the shutdown. One was for Senator Schumer to rally the troops, to be seen fighting President Trump. And the second was to bring attention to the issue of the Obamacare subsidies that expire at the end of the year. Now, Senator Thune has said that there's gonna be no negotiation on Obamacare subsidies, at least resolving that issue while the government is shut down. And I believe him on that. But the Democrats have achieved their first goal, or will within a few days of being seen as combating President Trump. The challenge for Senator Schumer at this point is what is the exit strategy? How do we get out of this government shutdown? And that's why I think that sometime next week, you will see, like in an unofficial agreement, unofficial handshake, if you will, that there will be an effort to deal with these Obamacare subsidies. Because I think there are some folks in the Republican Party, President Trump included, who recognize that it may not be beneficial in an election year for Obamacare subsidies to go up for average Americans. But let's also remember that the bulk of the Republican Party most likely wants this to go away. So even if there is an agreement that says we're going to kick the cannon till November, these shutdown fights are going to continue probably into the beginning of next year.

[Podcast Host/Interviewer]

If it continues into the beginning of next year, does it affect the midterms? I was talking to some colleagues earlier today, and it seems like voters, like, anecdotally, they don't really remember shutdowns now.

[Nathan Dean]

They don't. Especially not this far out from November. I mean, look, it's October 1st, and we have a year and some change until the midterms. I don't think any people are gonna go into the voting booth and say, hey, remember what happened back in October of last year? And remember the Tea Party somewhat did this back in 2013, and the Republicans ultimately ended up gaining nine seats in the following midterm election of the following year. But I will say is that it's certainly about momentum. And the Democrats right now have a very poor approval rating. It's around 30%. And so from the Democratic perspective, why don't we shut this down. Why don't we rally the troops and rally the progressive support? Let's support our base and then we'll spend the next year and change actually trying to build some momentum. So I can see the case for why the Democrats would want to shut the government down because there is plenty of time for them to come back and get messaging onto other issues.

[Carol Massar]

Hey, Nathan, what about, you know, Vice President J.D. vance has downplayed plans to use the shutdown to slash services. He says Republicans don't want to lay anybody off and that Democrats would be held responsible for any negative consequences of the government closure. President Trump has come out, he's been very clear, right, talking about, you know, the ability or, you know, to cut some of the federal government jobs. Russell Vogt has certainly we've seen that as well. So are we expecting that to happen? And if it does happen, you know, who is responsible for that?

[Nathan Dean]

So I think you're going to see signs of that. You know, Russell vote even said just in a House Republican caucus earlier today that layoffs are, and I'm paraphrasing here, imminent in the next day or two. I think there's some, probably some truth behind that. You would also see additional cancellation of projects, the $18 billion that earmarked for those of you in New York City in terms of infrastructure projects. But ultimately, it's going to be President Trump that makes this decision. And I think that President Trump realizes that widespread layoffs of government workers, it's such a broad nature, is not going to be popular with the American populace. Joe Matthew, on Balance of Power, has had several Republicans on this week where they've asked President Trump to bring a scalpel to this as opposed to a sledgehammer. So you'll probably see notifications go out and you'll probably see signs. But as of right now, I still think it's political posturing. Not so much actually a real layoff threat. But again, time may change. And if this is the if it does happen, I think it actually could push parties further apart and potentially extend the shutdown even longer.

[Podcast Host/Interviewer]

Well, we did a deep dive yesterday, as you know, on Russell Vogt and his role at OMB and the DNA that he brings to this role. Does he take a scalpel when it comes to laying off federal workers?

[Nathan Dean]

Not if he gets his wish. I mean, obviously this goes back to Project 2025 and this idea that the government is extremely bloated. And former OMB director Mick Mulvaney was on balance of power a couple weeks ago and he was jubilant in saying, look, I'm excited for Russ vote because you're going to be able to dismantle a lot of apparatus of the government. I'm paraphrasing his works there, but I will say is that it's not easy to do. Both sides often come to Washington and saying, look, there's, there's bloat, there's things that we need to cut, but it's not easy to do so because there are things like regulations and statutes and laws. And if you end up cutting folks like we saw what happened with Doge earlier this year, and you break the law or at least you're breaking regulations or you're breaking what the American people want you to do, you have to end up hiring them back.

[Carol Massar]

Nathan, really quickly, 15 seconds. I mean, who is President Trump listening to in all of this?

[Podcast Host]

J.D.

[Carol Massar]

Vance was very much out front and center and very much in command earlier today talking about the shutdown. There's Russ vote just got about 10 seconds. Who is the president listening to Very quickly?

[Nathan Dean]

I think the president is listening to himself and I think the president is going to make the decision that he wants to make.

[Carol Massar]

All right. Going to leave it there. You rock. Nathan Dean, Bloomberg Intelligence senior policy analyst, joining us from Washington, D.C. stay with us.

[Podcast Host/Interviewer]

More from Bloomberg Businessweek Daily coming up after this.

[Podcast Host]

What's the secret to navigating uncharted waters in business? Meet Sami Sriram from Clearbot, a startup reshaping autonomous shipping. Hear her take on the real key to success, frictionless user experiences that move your business forward.

[Noor Bint Ali Al Khulif]

When we go into a new region, you need to make sure that the experience of using something new is good. Because if not, then you make a bad first impression, they never try it again. We are just trying to find the right partner, somebody who knows the right people to speak to. Somebody that is as invested as we are.

[Podcast Host]

For more on what it takes to unlock global growth, search for turning Point.

[Noor Bint Ali Al Khulif]

That intention really matters. We want to build something that becomes the norm.

[Carol Massar]

Brought to you by Bloomberg Media Studios and hsbc.

[Podcast Host]

Wherever your business takes you, HSBC can help.

[Canva Representative]

At gsk, our focus is on doing the right thing for patients. We believe they should be free to focus on doing what they love, especially when they're living with a disease like cancer. That's why we focus where we can make the biggest difference, matching the right treatment with the right patient. At gsk, we're pioneering advanced technologies like antibody drug conjugates that precisely target and attack cancer cells. By uniting science, technology and talent we work tirelessly to stay ahead of cancer together. Visit gsk.com to discover more.

[Lisa Mateo]

This is the Small Business Minute brought to you by Amazon Ads. I'm Lisa Mateo. Credit car perks offered to small business customers include cash back and travel rewards, but the feature many business owners find the most attractive is a high credit limit. Nearly half of all the small and medium sized businesses surveyed by payments.com and payments processor i2b said so. But the smaller and younger the business, the more likely higher credit limits were at the top of the priority list. The survey also found small business owners using business and personal credit cards to finance their operations, and nearly half of the smaller and younger businesses were carrying card balances over each month. Payments.com and i2b say the survey speaks to the need for alternative credit solutions tailored to the needs of small businesses. That was the Small Business Minute brought to you by Amazon Ads, helping you reach relevant audiences through streaming TV ad solutions.

[Podcast Host]

You're listening to the Bloomberg Businessweek Daily podcast. Catch us live weekday afternoons from 2 to 5 Eastern. Listen on Apple CarPlay and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business app or watch us live on YouTube.

[Carol Massar]

Bahrain has emerged as a key economic and security partner for Washington, hosting several US Military assets including the US Navy's Fifth Fleet and the branch of Central Command. And you might recall over this past summer a meeting at the White House where Bahrain's crown prince pledged $17 billion worth investments in the United States. While our next guest is focusing on bringing investments into Bahrain, joining us is her Excellency Noor Bint Ali Al Khulif. She is CEO of the Bahrain Economic Development Board and also the Kingdom's Minister of Sustainable Development. She is in our Bloomberg News L A Bureau. I'm so delighted, your Excellency, that we could spend some time with you. Bloomberg has reported a lot about the Middle east at large, how it's transitioning, taking moves to broaden out the region's economy, making investments in sports, tourism, technology, and a lot more. Tell us about for Bahrain about attracting investments in the digital and tech worlds. Your mission who has invested so far? Give us some size and scope if you would.

[Noor Bint Ali Al Khulif]

Absolutely. First of all Carol, it's exciting to be with you today. Looking forward to the conversation as well. So thank you so much for hosting me today and I always find it very helpful to start with maybe a 30 second elevator pitch about about for those that are not familiar with the country. Bahrain is a small island, part of the Gulf Cooperation Council. As a country, historically it's been a strategic maritime State. So it was always considered as a transit, as a hub, as a gateway to the region and a transit for trade going east and west. And that's also started because of the pearling industry in Bahrain. But fast forward till today, we still retain that role and that really underpins our ethos or our DNA of being business friendly. And when you look at our economy today, people think Bahrain, it's an oil exporting country in reality and on the ground, our GDP is 85%. Non Oil Financial services sector is the largest contributor to our economy, followed by manufacturing. But our other strategic sectors that we focus on are tourism, logistics, technology. But also we have the education and the health care. So you can see that diversification was achieved through attracting investment into the country, being very open, allowing investors to come and take advantage of the region and what's happening and using Bahrain as their testing ground, as their base. So it's been really interesting time, especially with the growth that is happening in the region at the moment.

[Podcast Host/Interviewer]

Well, you're in our Los Angeles bureau now, ostensibly in Los Angeles, to help attract investment to the country. Can you talk a little bit about who you're meeting with, the type of investment that you're hoping to attract?

[Noor Bint Ali Al Khulif]

It's been a variety actually of companies and sectors that we've had conversations with and I have to say it's been very, very interesting. We've always in Bahrain admired specifically the technology sector of the US and having direct conversations with their innovators, with the founders, with the people that are really close to not just what's happening at the moment and what consumers have, but really also what is expected to come going forward. So a lot of discussions about technology and how Bahrain can support that. But also we've had discussions on manufacturing, we've had discussions even on the film industry, and we do that. And the way we look at Bahrain and the way we're able to talk about those different industries is because when we assess our market in Bahrain, we look at various things. We look at what is the infrastructure that I have at the moment, what are the regulations that I have, what is the human capital that I have and how can that serve international companies in various sectors and what would, what would be beneficial for them to come in and take advantage of that business environment.

[Podcast Host/Interviewer]

Is it a difficult thing to do in a world that is increasingly going, I don't want to say the world's going America first, but countries are increasingly looking inward. You mentioned the film industry and meetings that you're having out there just this week. The President said he's imposing a 100% tariff on foreign made movies. How much more difficult does that make your job trying to attract those folks to Bahrain?

[Noor Bint Ali Al Khulif]

Look, we acknowledge and we see what the President Trump is doing in terms of attracting more local investments. And actually if you look at the region, Bahrain and the rest of the gcc, we actually mirror that sentiment. A lot of the countries are trying to bring in investments into, into the region, but we also believe it's not a zero sum game. Some companies would need to have presence in both regions, not necessarily just one, in order to achieve the results that they want, even locally here in the US and we're talking to some of those that need the input. Other companies actually need to be closer by nature to their consumers and giving the growth in the demand and the growth in the consumer base in the Middle east and specifically the gcc, a lot of the companies would need that presence closer to the consumer. So we're having a lot of conversations with companies about that. But we very much understand what is happening here in the US and we try to do our best in Bahrain to support those companies. The first thing we do with companies is ask what are your growth plans, what are your strategies, how can we support you in the region and what can Bahrain do for you? Because we honestly believe that their success means our success. So their success in the region means they will stay here for the foreseeable future, which means they become part of our ecosystem and part of our economic development.

[Carol Massar]

Your Excellency, I'm curious too. What's the competitive landscape as you vie for investments in capital? I mean, yes, your country versus other Gulf nations, they've got similar ambitions. We report about it all the time. So what is that competitive landscape like?

[Noor Bint Ali Al Khulif]

First of all, it's absolutely exciting to see all of the countries having their vision, 2000-30s vision, 2050s, really focusing on economic development. And the region really has complementary economies. Certainly for Bahrain, the way we see ourselves and view ourselves is economy that's complex, complements what is happening in the rest of the region. We very much look at what's happening and we invite companies to come and use Bahrain as a base to test those concepts and those ideas that they have. Again, it's a small country. You can do a country wide rollout really easily. But also we always look at our competitive advantage. For us, cost competitiveness is really important. We continue to monitor how much it costs, not just to set up your business, but also if you're moving people international, how much does it cost for them? To live there, to put their kids in school, to use the health system in Bahrain. The other thing that we have is connectivity. So Speaking of the U.S. we have a free trade agreement with the U.S. we have the SACEPA agreement, but also we have free trade agreements and investment agreements with about 30% of the world GDP. Because as a small country, we have to make sure that companies can reach a wider consumer base. But we also, what's really important for us us is that we work very closely with the private sector. So the government and the private sector works as one unit in Bahrain, and we have that ethos of the Team Bahrain concept. And as I, as I said, we always start with, what do you need and how can I support you? And we have examples of where we've introduced a new legislation or new regulation in response to requests by the private sector. Maybe AWS is a great example in that case, because they've said, what can you do for us in terms of the regulation? And we said, how about data jurisdiction law, where the data hosted in Bahrain is treated as an embassy? So me as a Bahrain cannot access that data and actually could only be accessed by a U.S. court request.

[Podcast Host/Interviewer]

You mentioned Amazon, and I'm looking at a report coming from Mordor. Intelligence talks about some of the biggest tech companies in Bahrain. Oracle, Amazon, IBM, Microsoft are among them. Here in the US We've been thinking a lot about immigration with regard to the H1B visa issues that have come up in recent weeks and the confusion here in the US about that. And I think one piece of the conversation that has been lost is certainly the US Wants to make sure that it employs or that companies are paying for it sounds like paying for these visas. Is there an opportunity for Bahrain to come in and take some of that talent that could work at a US Tech company that would be from outside of the US and instead work at a US Tech company in Bahrain.

[Noor Bint Ali Al Khulif]

As I've said, our human capital for us is really, really important. So we not only invest in the human capital in Bahrain and we have a lot of programs, we subsidize training for Bahrainis, but it's also very important to us as a country and an economy to bring in international talent. So a few years back, coming out of COVID as part of our economic recovery plan, we've launched our Golden Residency Program, which allows investors, retirees, entrepreneurs, talent to come in Bahrain, stay for an extended period of time. It's 10 years, renewable automatically for them and their families. And that allows a lot of international companies, should they wish to do that, but also a lot of individuals to move their people into Bahrain and take advantage of not just the program, but also all of the other business benefits that you get by being in Bahrain.

[Carol Massar]

Hey, one of the things I want to ask, and I know high tech and technology certainly of interest and I'm just curious when it comes to big AI data centers, I mean, as you would imagine, your excellency, we spent so much time talking about the build out, the investments, the money flowing into anything and everything data. Curious if you guys, if the country and your office are considering backing AI data centers such as what we've seen in countries Qatar, that they've done with Blue Owl.

[Noor Bint Ali Al Khulif]

Yeah, absolutely. It's important. I mean it's coming. It's not. It's already there. So we've had us set up the first hyperscale data center in the Middle east in Bahrain a few years back. And again, as I mentioned, the reason they chose Bahrain is because of the regulation, but also the strength of the human capital. You mentioned Oracle, but we also have some regional and local investments for data centers. So we're definitely seeing growth in that, that region where international companies that wish to use that to take advantage could come and plug and play and take advantage of the data centers already available. But really because of the demand, there's a lot of potential and opportunities for companies that still wish to have data centers in the region to come also and take advantage of that.

[Carol Massar]

So I am curious, you sound very optimistic. What's the biggest hurdle optimism obstacle right now in you attracting further investment? What's the thing that's difficult in terms of what you do?

[Noor Bint Ali Al Khulif]

I wouldn't say difficult, but we have to have a lot of conversations to explain the business environment, talk about the characteristics, what makes us different. But it's all very, very exciting. So we don't mind that at all.

[Carol Massar]

And I also do think about, you know, something that's certainly been front and center, front of mind for us, excuse me. And certainly coming off the UN General assembly and you know, watching the turmoil that we've seen in the, in the, in the region, how important is that to, to the folks that you're talking, whether it's companies, big name companies that we know, other investors in terms of investing, obviously not every kingdom or area within the Middle east is the same. But you know, the turmoil and the, and certainly the war that we've seen, seen between Israel and Hamas, how much of that, the political situation sometimes slows things down.

[Noor Bint Ali Al Khulif]

You absolutely need safety and stability for companies to thrive for the economy to grow and for us in Bahrain and the region as a whole, we've always advocated for, for peace. We've always played a part on a regional level, on an international level to advocate for, for peace and stability. And we continue, continue to do that. At the same time, the countries are very much focused on their economic strategies, economic plans. And we continue to have conversations with companies and for those that have any doubt, we just say, come and talk to us. We will show you, we will explain to you the current business environment. But we are blessed to have to have a very stable and a safe business environment in Ukraine.

[Carol Massar]

I have one last question too, and I'm just curious. When you do have questions with investors, obviously well known companies, big companies, I'm sure folks do their homework. But what is the thing that you think they don't really understand about Bahrain and in terms of the economy and what you guys are doing?

[Noor Bint Ali Al Khulif]

I think how diversified the economy is is something probably people do not realize. And given the journey we've had a long journey of reform, our journey in reform and achieving the diversification that we've achieved today with 85% of the economy being non oil, with a large manufacturing sector and large financial services sector and others as well, is something people do not realize. And what that means is for years and years, for decades, we've built knowledge and know how in our people, in our infrastructure, in our regulation, in the way we do business and the way we, we work with the private sector as well. So that's something that I think always surprises people when we talk to them.

[Carol Massar]

Well, we're so glad we could get some time with you. We know we had some technical difficulties earlier, so we really appreciate you sticking around and so that we could have a conversation. Thank you. Thank you again. Her Excellency Nor Bent Ali Al Khulif. She is CEO of the Bahrain Economic Development Board, also the kingdom's Minister of Sustainable Development. She's joining us from our L A bureau.

[Podcast Host]

You're listening to the Bloomberg Businessweek Daily podcast. Catch us live weekday afternoons from 2 to 5 Eastern. Listen on Apple CarPlay Play and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business app or watch us live on YouTube.

[Podcast Host/Interviewer]

Wall street had long feared that President Trump would follow through with threats to impose aggressive drug pricing policies, eroding the pharmaceutical industry's profitability and depressing share prices. Those fears, though largely laid to rest this week after Pfizer cut a deal with the White House, the company negotiating a three year reprieve on drug import tariffs in exchange for a promise to reduce what it charges. Medicaid. Here's Pfizer CEO Albert Bourla at the White House yesterday alongside President Trump.

[Nathan Dean]

The big winner of this deal clearly.

[Podcast Host/Interviewer]

Will be the American pace. There is no doubt about it. They are the ones that will see significant impact in their ability to buy medicines.

[Nathan Dean]

But I would argue that it is.

[Podcast Host/Interviewer]

Not the only winner. I think who else is a winner here? It is American innovation and American economy.

[Nathan Dean]

We're going to have another meeting next week on this. We have another great company coming in similar kind of numbers, but we're going to show you some 1000% drops in prices. There has never been anything like this in the history of medicine.

[Podcast Host/Interviewer]

That was President Trump, you just heard, and Pfizer CEO Albert Bourla at the White House yesterday. Pfizer shares surging close to 7% yesterday. They're up more than 7% today. I just hope my high school math teacher is not listening. About a thousand percent drop.

[Carol Massar]

Yeah, I know.

[Podcast Host/Interviewer]

Because we're not going to get into for another day the math, math thing there, but it's for another day.

[Carol Massar]

I want to bring you drug stocks overall in the last two days, not just Pfizer, up about 10% in the past two days, the whole group.

[Podcast Host/Interviewer]

Let's bring in Damien Garde's Bloomberg News health reporter. He's been very busy. He's taken some time to join us here in the Bloomberg Interactive brokers studio. Are drug prices going to go down as a result of this for the.

[Damien Garde]

Vast majority of Americans? No, I sincerely doubt it. There is no reason to conclude that based on what we learned at least yesterday from Albert Bourla in the Oval Office and the promises that Pfizer has made, we can get into the nitty gritty. But I think the main thing, the promise to Medicaid, an important caveat there is that patients on Medicaid, Medicaid already pays the lowest price available in the United States. It is legally obligated to get that. So the notion that Pfizer making a commitment to lower that further would change the out of pocket costs for patients. I don't, I just don't think there's much there. And furthermore, in terms of Pfizer's business, only about 5% of that business accounts for doing business with Medicaid. That's the word business probably too many times. And I think the main thing that should drive the reaction here is that in this announcement, Pfizer, which has a fiduciary duty to maximize its profits and to update shareholders on its Guidance did not update its guidance. The company said this thing that ostensibly means we're going to make less money, at least that's how the President characterized it, but didn't actually say we're going to make less money, which of course, legally they're required to do. I feel like that through line is maybe the lens, maybe not cynicism, but the lens of reality that people should look at these announcements.

[Podcast Host/Interviewer]

Well, look no further than the share price reaction.

[Carol Massar]

I said yesterday. I'm like, why is this stock rallying they're going to make less money? I had no. I just made no sense. It was like, well, it's all about the tariff thing. And I'm like, true. And that is certainly a part of it, but I'm like, they're going to make less money. How can this be a good thing?

[Damien Garde]

Right. So I think the relief that you're seeing in the share price reaction is twofold or maybe even threefold. One, it alleviates the threat that the Trump administration was really going to come down hard with an aggressive policy that would be on the books, that would really constrain what drug companies could charge. Instead, we get this voluntary, relatively vague promise from Pfizer that is expected to set a template for the company's peers, eli Lilly, Merck, etc. They will probably all have their day at the Oval Office to do a similar kind of dog and pony show. And then, furthermore, what's established is that if you make those promises, you get a reprieve from tariffs, which is the other kind of overhang for the entire sector is this fear that the import of medicines from Europe would face levies of. The president has said 100, 200%. The notion that if you just go out there and say we're going to follow what the administration wants on drug pricing, we get that alleviation.

[Carol Massar]

Damian, just quickly, just to be fair, I mean, has Pfizer come back and said this is going to impact us financially or it's not going to impact. Have we gotten any clarification from the company on this?

[Damien Garde]

They have not. There hasn't been a follow on filing with the sec, kind of making clear that they're restating any guidance. And furthermore, what they've said is that the terms of their agreement with the White House are confidential. So, respectfully, we can only conclude what's been said publicly.

[Podcast Host/Interviewer]

Damien, sit tight. We're going to bring in Angie Frank. She's CEO of the private health company Calderos. The firm does drug discount management. It uses AI as well as communicating with different parties involved in the negotiating process to get consumers the best prices. She joins us from Wisconsin. Angie, I'll ask you the same question that I asked Damian because you're right in the middle of this drug pricing thing. Are drug prices going to come down as a result of what we saw at the White House yesterday?

[Angie Frank]

I think what Damien said, there's, there's some truth to that. I think at the end of the day we won't all feel it immediately, but I do think drug prices are going to come down. I think the announcement yesterday is a big change to the system and it is the first step in and what I think will be multiple steps. We're certainly opening up more channels for patients to access their drugs at more affordable prices. And I think the underlying, the Medicaid price that, that states currently pay is going to come down based on Pfizer's announcement yesterday.

[Damien Garde]

Well, that's interesting. What would the mechanism for that be? Because that's what I found myself wondering even yesterday in the announcement, which granted was lacking key details for obvious reasons, is very new, but why would this kind of set in motion a snowball that would end with patients paying less at the pharmacy counter?

[Angie Frank]

Yeah, yeah. So I think, you know, if you look at the overall list, prices starting to come down to an MFN like number and that opening most favored nations. Yes, most favored nations, exactly. And that opening up more channels for patients to access their drugs at lower rates. I do think the direct model that the, the website that was also announced yesterday which opens up a channel for patients to be purchasing direct at lower costs could really have a ripple effect on the way benefits are offered and how employers and self insured employers start constructing benefit plans that give their employees access to drugs, which may bypass other players in the system, the traditional players in the system, middlemen that have been making money off of, off of drug pricing and discounts and rebate models that, that really didn't benefit patients directly. So I think, I think the new channels being opened up and the new price point at max most favored nation will over the longer term have a, have a pretty significant impact.

[Carol Massar]

Nothing confuses me as much as like picking up prescription and coupons and pharmacy benefits and I don't know, it's just kind of crazy. Damien, the PBMs, the pharmacy benefit managers, they are being looked at closely like another layer that drives up costs. And so that is certainly part of the narrative here. So does that potentially remove that in what we heard from the president and the CEO of pfizer yesterday, but then throw in this Trump Rx, like what role is that play that we need.

[Damien Garde]

To see play out? But I think through the eyes of Pfizer and certainly people in the pharmaceutical industry, there is an optimism and maybe a hope that the agreement announced yesterday, if in fact it's a template for other companies, will shift the White House's attention away from pharmaceutical manufacturers and toward the PBMs and the other middlemen that you mentioned. And I think to Angie's point, there is a potential that Trump Rx, this sort of direct to patient offering that we've heard about, you know, there are arguments as to just how popular that might be. How many people who don't have insurance would be willing to pay out of pocket hundreds or even thousands of dollars a year for a medicine?

[Podcast Host/Interviewer]

Is that what Trump Rx would offer is an insurance like this is not covered by insurance.

[Damien Garde]

It would be a cash pay business. And so we assume that the majority of customers for it would be uninsured or underinsured because otherwise they could get the drugs much cheaper through their insurance carrier. But the opportunity, I realize we're getting kind of in weeds here. The opportunity is if one of those direct offerings were selling instead to employers rather than patients themselves, then they would be truly bypassing the middlemen that exist. This is sort of the Mark Cuban model that he's at drugs. Exactly. So if Trump, and I'm using my imagination here, there is, this is not something anybody's announced. If Trump Rx, the website that has not yet launched but has been described, were to expand its aperture to include employers, then we could be talking about legitimate savings for all parties involved and a huge change to the way it's done.

[Podcast Host/Interviewer]

Now, Angie, come on back in here and talk a little bit about the innovation side of things. Because Albert Bourla at the White House yesterday said it's not just the American patient who will be a big winner, but it would also be the American innovation and the American economy. Perhaps there are those out there who might say, okay, well, if companies, drug companies aren't able to make as much money from the drugs that they sell, R and D in this space might suffer. We know it's expensive to run the clinical trials and to do the R and D. What do you think it means for American innovation when it comes to pharmaceuticals?

[Angie Frank]

Well, I think it was great. I agree with Albert on all points. I think it's great for America that we're moving manufacturing and that level of innovation, job creation, et cetera, to the U.S. when you, when you simplify the supply chain and the pricing mechanisms for, for our, our current, you know, drug pricing model, when you simplify that today there's that we lack so much transparency and how prices are established and who gets which price. And to your point earlier, Carol, where you mentioned, you know, the coupons and the co pays and all these things are so confusing. They're confusing by, by design people are making a lot of money off of that confusion and that opacity. When you simplify and drive more transparency, you have less waste in the system. And that waste will feed the top of the funnel. That will be dollars that can go directly to the top of the innovation funnel and enable manufacturers to continue to work on and innovate more drugs and more medication therapies that help patients with, you know, life saving and life changing conditions. So it takes two and a half billion dollars to bring a drug to market. So every dollar of waste compromises our ability to invest in more therapies. So I think it's going to have a tremendous impact over the long run.

[Carol Massar]

Angie, just got about a minute left. I mean just talk to us about what you do. It's a data engine, it's information you have. It looks like a couple of different constituencies that you work with. But just give us an idea and what that tells you about kind of the drug industry and drug pricing industry, what you have been seeing.

[Angie Frank]

Yeah, we, we really have a technology platform where we ingest, you know, large volumes of data. We apply logic and rules around various pricing programs and discounts and rebates and then we ensure price integrity, that the right price is going to the right set of patients and the right, you know, for that, for that particular therapy. So we're really driving quite a bit of price integrity in the system. The constituents that we work with include both pharmaceutical manufacturers and providers. And we really believe fundamentally that ensuring that the providers and the manufacturers can work more closely directly together. Benefits Americans, benefits patients.

[Carol Massar]

Right.

[Angie Frank]

Benefits innovate.

[Carol Massar]

10 seconds. Damien, who are we going to hear from next? What CEO?

[Damien Garde]

The expectation is that Eli Lilly will be the next company to take the stage. The president has said their name constantly without totally giving it away. But like I said, the expectation also is that all of the major peers will have their day at the Oval Office.

[Carol Massar]

All right, well, we will be watching, listening, reading your reporting. Thank you so much. Angie Franks, of course, CEO of Calderas. Joining us from Wisconsin, Damian Garde, health reporter at Bloomberg News here in our Bloomberg Interactive Brokers studio. This is Bloomberg businessweek Daily.

[Podcast Host/Interviewer]

Stay with us. More from Bloomberg businessweek Daily coming up after this.

[Canva Representative]

At gsk, we believe that to get ahead of disease, you need to understand its root cause. And that's why we combine our deep understanding of immune science with cutting edge technology. It helps us to create targeted therapies that match the right treatment to the right patient, transforming the lives of millions. By uniting science, technology and talent, we work tirelessly to get ahead of disease together. Visit gsk.com to discover more.

[Lisa Mateo]

This is the Small Business Minute brought to you by Amazon Ads. I'm Lisa Mateo. Credit card perks offered to small business customers include cash back and travel rewards, but the feature many business owners find the most attractive is a high credit limit. Nearly half of all the small and medium sized businesses surveyed by payments.com and payments processor i2b said so. But the smaller and younger the business, the more likely higher credit limits were at the top of the priority list. The survey also found small business owners using business and personal credit cards to finance their operations, and nearly half of the smaller and younger businesses were carrying card balances over each month. Payments.com and i2b say the survey speaks to the need for alternative credit solutions tailored to the needs of small businesses. That was the Small Business Minute brought to you by Amazon Ads, helping you reach relevant audiences through streaming TV ad solutions.

[Carol Massar]

Introducing the all new Adobe Acrobat Studio now with AI powered PDF spaces. Do more with PDFs than you ever thought possible. Need AI to turn 100 pages of market research into 5 insights with a click. Do that with Acrobat. Need templates for a sales proposal that'll close that deal. Do that with Acrobat. Need an AI specialist to tailor the tone of your market report to sound real smart in real time. Do that with the all new Adobe Acrobat Studio. Learn [e-mail] do that with Acrobat.

[Podcast Host]

You're listening to the Bloomberg Businessweek Daily podcast. Catch us live weekday afternoons from 2 to 5 Eastern. Listen on Apple CarPlay and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business app or watch us live on YouTube.

[Carol Massar]

Stocks higher. A bit of a rally underway. We're staying near our highs of the session. On the equity side of things, we've seen yields move back a bit on expectations that yes indeed, we'll get another Fed rate cut later on this month. We did have some weak private jobs data. We're talking about adp. Those numbers coming in definitely below estimates.

[Podcast Host/Interviewer]

Street estimates so shedding of 32,000 versus estimates of a gain of 51,000.

[Carol Massar]

That's a bit of a reversal.

[Podcast Host/Interviewer]

That's exactly where I want to start with Alexis Brown Roberts COO and portfolio manager at Alexis Investment Partners. They've got around $185 million in assets under management. She's back with us from Montgomery, Texas. Alexis, welcome back. I want to start with the labor market and your view on it. 32,000 job shed and private payrolls today, 51,000 added. Was the survey is the labor market cracking?

[Alexis Brown Roberts]

Well, hi, first of all, thanks so much for having me back on. No, I don't think it's necessarily cracking. It is definitely weakening a bit. But we're heading into a different seasonal period once we get through October. So it'll be interesting to see what happens from there. I think the reason why job numbers were being a little bit more looked at today is because of the government shutdown and the probability that we won't get a job number on Friday. But I think there's a lot of other factors happening in markets that are going to affect things more than necessarily the job market does. And we'll have to see what this spurs the Fed to do and if this is just a little bit more fuel to the fire for the Fed to continue cutting rates.

[Carol Massar]

All right, so let's talk about those factors. And I guess what I'm, I'm always most interested when we talk to somebody who is managing money, big or small, if you will, is what their clients are saying, what investors are saying. Are they giving you new money to invest or they're saying let's back off, let's put something in, something safer. Are they buying gold? Because it seems like everybody's buying gold this year. So give us some color about what you are doing or what your clients want to do with their investments right now.

[Alexis Brown Roberts]

Yeah, so we're tactical managers. So a lot of our clients and all of our clients really have a lot of trust in us to make the changes necessary in their portfolios and really adapt to changing conditions. So we have seen clients adding new money to portfolios, especially as we've worked through the lows last April and continuing onward. For example, in our tactical portfolios, we've really changed our equity positions throughout the past year, going from over overly done in equities slightly getting all the way up to almost 90% on a 70% benchmark equity portfolio to now being slightly Underweight at about 65% and within those, having a lot of fluctuations as we've seen markets change and respecting the fact that we're up 4% in the past month, 7% in the past quarter, 15% year to date. And just law of average when we're aiming to do like a 10 to 12% on that 70% benchmark equity exposure, having that ability to change our equity as well as diversify. We do own gold. In fact, that's our largest position. We're at just under 9% gold right now. In that tactical portfolio, I want to.

[Podcast Host/Interviewer]

Understand how much upside you see in the s and P500 right now or US stocks, I guess, more generally. Bank of America out with a note that says the sentiment indicates that it's hardly euphoric. They essentially have this indicator. It's the sell side indicator. It retracts recommended allocations to US equities among different Wall street strategists. It remained flat in September at 55 and a half percent compared to the dot com bubble in 2000 saw sell side equity allocation surge above 70% and then in 2007 clearing 65%. So essentially B of A saying there's more room to run. Do you agree?

[Alexis Brown Roberts]

I would agree. I do think that there is a lot of cash on the sidelines. When you talk about sentiment, that's a really interesting story. We tend to look at the AI Bull Bear sentiment ratio survey and while there has been an uptick in bulls, there has actually been even more of an uptick in bears compared to historical averages. So there is some room to run on that front. Now we aren't necessarily euphoric at this point. Like I said, we're about in a neutral allocation, just respecting how far we've come so far this year. So we are looking still to participate in future gains heading into this year. We did a Fibonacci retracement. Just simply looking at at the breakdown in April to the lows and if we were to have an equal move back up and that got us to about a 6,400 to 6,700 range on the S and P. Obviously we're knocking on that 6700 today. But I did also look at potentially reaching 7000 and coming back. So I think it'll be interesting to see from here where we wind up. But there are a lot of reasons to still be positive on the market, but perhaps not quite as strong as we were heading into this year.

[Carol Massar]

All right, so what's your biggest worry in this environment? One of the things that we talked with when we began our show and we had a conversation with McCartney. Yes, Allie McCartney over at UBS. She actually is alignment partners at UBS and it was like the Complacency that we're seeing in the market, the VIX is really low and that doesn't need to be certainly the indicator that tells all. But there is feels like there's a lot of folks thinking that this momentum will continue. What is the thing, what is the thing that you keep your eye on that says that, well, maybe there is problems like the, you know, today's labor data.

[Alexis Brown Roberts]

So I would think that the main thing that we're looking at right now that gives us a little bit of pause is just valuations being a little bit rich and once again, just respecting how far we've already come in such a short time period and just recognizing that perhaps that means that we'll have some room to pull back. And honestly, there's a lot of strong parts to the market right now, though, as you pointed out, momentum, we are strong believers in momentum and innovation. And it tends to be that if there's a strong Q3, which obviously this was a very strong Q3 in market, that that momentum tends to carry forward through Q4. That being said, we are still watching valuations and the different moving factors, for example, Federal Reserve policy, seeing how that affects things going forward. If there is a pullback heading through Q4, we're probably going to be biased to actually buy into that, although more patient than we have been prior to reaching these valuations. But if we run up a lot through Q4, that would probably be our indicator to pull back exposure a little bit.

[Carol Massar]

Hey, one last thing. I just got 30, 40 seconds here. Alexis, what about that trade? How much are your investors saying, yeah, give me exposure or and if so, how do they want that exposure? Just quickly.

[Alexis Brown Roberts]

We like I like I said big, big proponents of innovation. We're not in the business of finding the next Apple and Google. We'd rather go ahead and invest in those strong fortress balance sheet companies. But really the exciting part of AI to us is how it will affect the market in general. And all these other companies, say a Wal Mart, a Caterpillar that will use AI to boost productivity rather than specifically trying to find that sexy AI play itself.

[Carol Massar]

All right, going to leave it there. Hey, good to check in with you, Alexis Brown Roberts, CEO and portfolio manager at Alexis Investment Partners, around $185 million in assets under management. Joining us once again from Montgomery, Texas.

[Podcast Host]

This is the Bloomberg businessweek daily podcast, available on Apple, Spotify and anywhere else you get your podcasts listen live weekday afternoons from 2 to 5pm Eastern on bloomberg.com, the iHeartRadio app TuneIn and the Bloomberg Business app. You can also watch us live Every weekday on YouTube and always on the Bloomberg Terminal.

[Podcast Host/Interviewer]

Bloomberg Screen Time is where creators and capital connect. My name is Lucas Shaw and I'll be interviewing industry leaders like Warner Bros. Pam abdy and Mike DeLuca, Instagram's Adam Masseri and director Ryan Coogler. Screen Time is where you can go behind the scenes to hear about the strategies and stories powering what the world watches next. Join us live in Los Angeles October 8th and 9th. You can get your [e-mail] screentime and thanks to representing sponsors AWS and Coriant, as well as the supporting sponsors Nielsen, Turkish Airlines and Weil, Gottschall and Manjis.