Warner Bros. Rejects Latest Paramount Bid, Favoring Netflix

Summary

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Bloomberg Intelligence Podcast Summary

Episode Title: Warner Bros. Rejects Latest Paramount Bid, Favoring Netflix
Date: January 7, 2026
Hosts: Carol Massar, Tim Stenovec
Featured Guests: Geetha Ranganathan (Media Analyst, Bloomberg Intelligence), Caroline Hyde (Bloomberg News), Brian Eggers (Senior Gaming and Lodging Analyst, Bloomberg Intelligence), George Ferguson (Senior Aerospace Analyst, Bloomberg Intelligence)

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Episode Overview

This episode focuses on the ongoing saga in media M&A, with Warner Bros. Discovery rejecting Paramount’s updated takeover bid and continuing to favor a competing deal with Netflix. The podcast dives into the rationale behind Warner Bros.’s decision, the dynamics of the current bidding war, concerns in the cable TV business, and broader implications for the streaming and entertainment landscape. The episode also touches on developments from CES regarding AI and memory chip market trends, analyzes sports prediction markets, and discusses Boeing’s outlook with a new order from Alaska Airlines.

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Main Segment: Warner Bros. Discovery, Paramount & Netflix Bidding War

[01:43 – 07:12]

Key Discussion Points

Paramount Bid and Warner Bros. Response

• Warner Bros. Discovery has again rejected Paramount’s improved takeover offer.
  • Despite Paramount meeting prior demands (personal guarantee from Larry Ellison and increase in termination fee to $5.8B), Warner Bros. still deems the offer inadequate.
  • Debt Concerns: Warner Bros. highlights the “leveraged buyout” nature of Paramount’s bid, calling it “probably the biggest one in the history of M&A” with “too many risks and too many uncertainties.”
  • Cost of switching from Netflix to Paramount’s offer (including termination fees and financing costs) is now around $1.80 per share.
• Quote:
  • “They actually call this a leveraged buyout, probably the biggest one in the history of M&A and so say that it just presents too many risks and too many uncertainties and is definitely inferior to the Netflix offer.”
    — Geetha Ranganathan [02:16]

Shareholder Sentiment & Expectations

• Only 500,000 shares (out of 2.6 billion) have tendered at Paramount’s $30 price.
  • Indicates shareholders anticipate a price increase, possibly expecting a bidding war.
  • Street speculation: Warner Bros. CEO David Zaslav is eyeing $34 per share as the “final” price to accept a Paramount deal.
• Quote:
  • “The number out there on the street is that David Zaslav is looking for $34 as the final offer at which he will sign his company away to Paramount.”
    — Geetha Ranganathan [03:48]

Netflix’s Position and Strategy

• Netflix remains largely silent, only reiterating they are working with Warner Bros. Discovery and regulators to close the deal.
• Geetha expects Netflix will only raise its bid if Paramount further sweetens its own offer; Netflix is motivated by the long-term strategic value of Warner Bros.’s assets.
• Quote:
  • “It’s not just the cost of doing deal, it’s the cost of not doing the deal. And they obviously do not want to strengthen their competitors.”
    — Geetha Ranganathan [05:19]

Implications from Cable Networks & Industry Trends

• Warner Bros. Discovery had planned to spin out cable networks, similar to Comcast’s move with Versant Media.
  • Versant’s shares have dropped ~25% in the past few days, spotlighting the cable network sector’s rapid decline.
  • Despite different scale and international footprint, the writing is “on the wall” for the traditional TV network business.
• Quote:
  • “The TV network business is bleeding. Not a slow death anymore. This is really happening fast and furious.”
    — Geetha Ranganathan [06:28]

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CES Highlights: AI & Semiconductor Updates

[10:09 – 14:13]

Key Discussion Points

Accelerated AI Demand & Energy Needs

• Interviews with Nvidia's Jensen Huang and Siemens' Roland Busch emphasize the insatiable energy requirements for the expanding AI industry.
  • Nvidia claims a “10X” increase in energy efficiency with each new chip generation, yet demand continually outpaces gains.
  • CEO Lisa Su of AMD predicts a 100x increase in compute needs in upcoming years.

Memory Chip Market Boom

• Memory storage shortages are fueling stock surges (e.g., SanDisk up 1000% from its lows).
  • Samsung indicates further price hikes ahead due to tight supply.
  • US memory maker Micron saw 240% gains in 2025 and is still rallying.
• Ongoing debates over whether AI and chip trends are a bubble, but infrastructure buildout continues at massive scale.

CES Consumer Tech Trends

• The show balances AI-driven innovation (humanoid robots, interconnected home tech) with traditional consumer electronics (unique TVs, quirky gadgets).
• Quote:
  • “The main thing, guys, I cannot walk without seeing a humanoid robot of some sort... apparently cute is the way in which we’re going to go forward.”
    — Caroline Hyde [12:52]

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Sports Prediction Markets & Legal Landscape

[16:48 – 22:51]

Key Discussion Points

Expansion of Prediction Markets

• DraftKings and FanDuel have ventured into prediction markets (separate from sportsbooks) to compete with Kalshi and Robinhood in financial-event-based contracts.
  • Focused on non-sports states due to regulatory hurdles.
  • Some states have issued “cease and desist” orders.

State vs Federal Regulatory Tension

• Sportsbooks are state-regulated; prediction markets are federally regulated (CFTC).
  • Ongoing legal disputes over jurisdiction may be headed to the Supreme Court, possibly by 2026.

Risks & Impact on Casinos and Leagues

• Casino operators may participate in prediction markets, especially in states lacking legal sports betting.
  • Activity growing among younger demographics, raising questions about regulation and consumer protection.
• Quote:
  • “It’s surprising and it also gets very problematic when you have college kids, college games, college players. But yeah, there’s a big national draw to this...”
    — Brian Eggers [21:08]

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Boeing’s Major Order and Airline Strategy Discussion

[25:05 – 30:29]

Key Discussion Points

Alaska Airlines’ Major Boeing Order

• Alaska Airlines orders 105 Boeing 737 Max 10s and five 787 widebody aircraft.
  • Seen as a positive indicator for Boeing, regaining momentum over Airbus in orders.
  • Alaska has been a core Boeing customer, even as its acquisition of Hawaiian added Airbus planes to its fleet.

Alaska’s Growth Ambitions

• The new order signals a pivot from a regional West Coast carrier to a global full-service airline, leveraging acquisition synergies and expanded routes.
  • Aspirations to join the ranks of major US global carriers, adding premium service and international destinations.

Airline Industry Trends for 2026

• Premium seating expansion could saturate the market; loyalty programs remain crucial.
  • Mergers between large carriers (e.g., Alaska and Southwest) would face significant regulatory scrutiny.

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Memorable Quotes & Notable Moments

• On the need for a “sweetened bid:”
  “[Warner Bros.] do need a sweetened offer... this just presents too many risks and too many uncertainties.”
  — Geetha Ranganathan [02:16]

• On media M&A brinksmanship:
  “We used to call that the final final offer.”
  — Carol Massar [04:39]

• On the decline of cable networks:
  “The TV network business is bleeding. Not a slow death anymore. This is really happening fast and furious.”
  — Geetha Ranganathan [06:28]

• On CES atmosphere:
  “The main thing, guys, I cannot walk without seeing a humanoid robot of some sort.”
  — Caroline Hyde [12:52]

• On regulatory chaos in new betting markets:
  “It’s confusing... state vs federal. Ultimately, I think this heads to the Supreme Court.”
  — Brian Eggers [19:06]

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Timestamps for Segments

• Media M&A: Warner Bros., Paramount, Netflix: [01:43 – 07:12]
• CES and AI/Chip Industry: [10:09 – 14:13]
• Sports Betting & Prediction Markets: [16:48 – 22:51]
• Aviation: Alaska Airlines & Boeing: [25:05 – 30:29]

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Closing

This episode offers a deep dive into media’s ongoing transformation, the fierce competition among industry giants, and how tech trends and legal ambiguity are reshaping other major markets. The hosts and Bloomberg Intelligence experts provide actionable insights and forward-looking perspectives for investors, executives, and industry watchers alike.

Transcript

[Carol Massar]

Ditch the complexity. Intuit Enterprise Suite delivers AI native ERP that is intuitive and intelligent. Scale faster with advanced control. Getting started in days, not months. Learn [e-mail] Enterprise and get the power.

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[Carol Massar]

YouTube. All right, the Media M and a trade that just won't go away. Warner Brothers Discovery says an amended takeover offer from Paramount Skydance is inferior to its deal with Netflix and urges shareholders not to tender their shares. I don't know what's going on here, people, but our next guest does Geetha Ranganathan. She is the media analyst for Bloomberg Intelligence here. Actually, I thought we'd have something done by now. I mean, these offers are pretty clear. The values seem kind of similar to me. What do you think's going on.

[Geetha Ranganathan]

Here? Yes, at this time, what Warner Brothers is saying, in addition to the fact that the offer is actually inadequate, this is what they said the very first time when they reached rejected this $30 bid from Paramount. You know, they obviously wanted the personal guarantee from Larry Ellison, which they got. They wanted, you know, Paramount to raise its termination fee to 5.8 billion to match Netflix. That also they got. But now they're saying that they actually really do need, you know, a sweetened bid. So they cite a number there. They say that if they had to terminate their agreement with Netflix, they will also incur, you know, obviously they have to pay the termination fee. Plus there's going to be significant financing cost. All of that comes out to about $1 $1.80, close to 179 or 180 a share. So they obviously need to be compensated for that. So basically I think, you know, they do need a sweetened offer and the big thing that they highlight this time around is the amount of debt. So they actually call this a leveraged buyout, probably the biggest one in the history of M and A and so say that, you know, it just presents too many risks and too many uncertainties and is definitely in inferior to the Netflix.

[Tim Stenovec]

Offer. Right. The conclusion that it has drawn and what it's recommending to shareholders remains the same, which is go with Netflix's. The Netflix bid. Having said that, what does it mean that Warner Brothers Discovery wrote this letter to shareholders? Do we get the sense that shareholders are tendering shares to.

[Geetha Ranganathan]

Paramount? Not so. So from what we've heard, you know, when it was last reported, Scarlett, about 500,000 shares were tendered at that $30 price. Remember, we have about 2.6 billion. So we're really very, very long ways off. So, you know, I think shareholders definitely expect the price to go up. They do think that there is going to be a bidding war. The number out there on the street is that David Zaslav is looking for $34, as you know, the final offer at which he will sign this his company away to Paramount. I'm not sure whether Paramount is actually going to raise their offer, but that, that is really the number that he's looking for. And we know him, he's, he's really a master craftsman when it comes to, to getting the best deal for his company. So again, it's a wait and.

[Carol Massar]

Watch. We used to call that the final final offer. This is our final.

[Tim Stenovec]

Final. We're not, we're not so final that we need to say it.

[Carol Massar]

Twice.

[Tim Stenovec]

Exactly.

[Carol Massar]

Geek. We have not heard really too much from Netflix, have.

[Geetha Ranganathan]

We? So all the Netflix said today, Paul, was after, you know, Warner Brothers Discovery put out that letter was, you know, they said, yes, we continue to, you know, work with Warner Bro World. We're working with the antitrust authorities, you know, we're working with the regulators and we hope to get the deal done. So everything kind of proceeding as expected from from the Netflix management team.

[Tim Stenovec]

You mentioned $34 a share is what David Zaslav is really eyeing. Is there any reason to think Netflix will raise its.

[Geetha Ranganathan]

Offer? Netflix needs to raise its offer, Scarlett. Only if Paramount comes back with a sweetened bid. And we do think that they actually will raise their offer. They really believe, even though the you market price reaction obviously has been very negative to this whole Netflix deal. Just kind of given that, it really kind of complicates a very clean narrative. I think Netflix really believes that they're doing this, you know, in the long, in the long. They're playing the long game here. You know, this is a great collection of assets. Again, it's not just the cost of doing deal, it's the cost of not doing the deal. And they obviously do not want to strengthen their competitors. They believe this is a great collection of assets that gives them, you know, tremendous value over many, many years to come. So I absolutely think they will raise the price. But the first move has be from.

[Carol Massar]

Paramount. Geetha, Part of the Warner Brothers discovery plan before this offer was it was to spin out their cable networks. And that's exactly what Comcast did several days ago, spinning out its cable networks. The company new company is called Versant Media Vs NT. That thing is traded off about 25% just in the last few days, man. What does that tell you about the cable network business and maybe how it might affect these.

[Geetha Ranganathan]

Bids? Yeah, it's really bleak. This actually strengthens the case for Paramount. This is exactly what they were saying saying let's buy this whole thing because you don't know where this, you know, the global networks business or the TV networks is going to actually trade. And here we go. Versant is actually just proving their point. So does not really bode well for Warner Brothers. But again, I think still Warner Brothers will continue to have the upper hand because again, they can argue that their cable networks, again a slightly different business, much larger in scale compared to the Versant properties, has an international footprint. But again, the writing is on the wall, Paul, as you've said many times, I mean, the TV network business is bleeding. Not a slow death anymore. This is really happening fast and.

[Carol Massar]

Furious. Stay with us. More from Bloomberg Intelligence coming up after this. Stop struggling with complex, costly ERP systems. Introducing Intuit Enterprise Suite, the AI native ERP that adapts with your business. Get enterprise grade power made, intuitive, intelligent, adaptive and ready for what's next. It streamlines complex financial management, automates workflows and unifies all your entities. It's simple to access and quick to adopt. Helping you get going in days, not months. Get the power you need without the complexity. Learn [e-mail] Enterprise Now Small businesses.

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[Carol Massar]

On YouTube. Nvidia CEO Jensen Huang says the artificial intelligence industry always needs more energy. On the sidelines of the annual consumer tech event, CES Jensen Huang and Siemens CEO Roland Bush spoke exclusively with Bloomberg's Ed Ludlow on their.

[George Ferguson]

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[Carol Massar]

The power. All right, that was Jensen Huang. He is head of Nvidia and Siemens CEO Roland Busch speaking exclusively with Bloomberg's Ed Ludlow of their AI partnership out at the Consumer Electronics show in Las Vegas. Let's get the latest reporting from Vegas. Caroline Hyde joins us. She's out there. She's the B tech co anchor for Bloomberg News. Caroline, it just seems like, you know, you listen to Mr. Wang, Mr. Bush, the need for AI and the spending on AI shows no real signs of slowing yet. Is that the vibe you're getting.

[Caroline Hyde]

Out there? That is very much the vibe we're getting. We heard from Lisa Su yesterday as well, CEO of amd, saying in the next few years you're going to have to 100x the amount of compute that we currently have has stocks still falling today, I might add. And so many people may be factoring in this extraordinary scale at which we're likely to see the compute needs still ramp up. And it's having a marked effect on certain companies. Stocks like I'm sure you were covering yesterday and into today, SanDisk, it is up 1000% from its lows back in April, but It's up almost 50% in the first few trading days of the year. This is all about a shortage in memory, memory storage. We are seeing still the fact that we're worrying about energy, as Jensen says, we're worrying about memory as you're seeing impacting Samsung stock as well. We had a Samsung executive on the network yesterday saying look, we're going to have to see a hike in prices because supply is just so tight. And yet still people question whether we're in some sort of bubble. But all I'm hearing is the infrastructure just needs to get ever bigger and we kind of need to get on board.

[Carol Massar]

With.

[Tim Stenovec]

That. Yeah. Speaking of memory chip makers, Micron, the biggest US memory chip maker, jumping 240% last year and up about 10% yesterday. So just an example of that. So Caroline, the Consumer Electronics Show, Paul and I were reminiscing how once upon A time it met big screen TVs and other gadgets that companies dreamt up but consumers may or may not want to sign on for. Is that still what's happening at the CES or has it turned into a high level discussion on chips.

[Caroline Hyde]

And AI? I think they're managing to walk both sides. We're still seeing those big unveils and discussions coming from Nvidia CEO from amd, CEO from Qualcomm CEO. They're talking about what's in inside these electronics or what's inside the compute that is needed to foster these electronics. But then you have Samsung, which is very much on the train with its chips, but also unveiling the latest, greatest Samsung frame or the latest TV that has, you can see all around the curvature of it. Or the fact that they are still trying to think about how your home is going to be connected, how your television is discussion, discussing with your oven as to whether or not the food is cooked and you get in between messaging between the two. I mean there are companies that, that still continue to unveil. They're also the ludicrous. I mean there's lollipops that play music as you eat them. There's little toys. Everything that seems to be about AI and about companionship is something that just seems to involve some sort of cuddly toy that talks to you. But apparently cute is the way in which we're going to go forward. But there are the vacuum cleaners, there's the massage chairs. It still very much has this idea of pushing the innovation forward. And the main thing, guys, I cannot walk without seeing a humanoid robot of some sort. So we're going to have some big interviews. A little bit later. We got Boston Robotics, for example, coming on the show and that's really Boston Dynamics, in fact, which has a huge new unveil of its.

[Carol Massar]

Latest humanoid. Stay with us. More from Bloomberg Intelligence coming up.

[Tim Stenovec]

After this. Small businesses are the pulse of every community. They bring people together, create opportunities and drive growth. With a widespread presence in communities across the country, Chase for Business supports small business owners at a local level that makes it possible for you to connect, learn from each other and grow together. There's a real commitment to seeing small businesses succeed. The Chase for Business team has knowledge and expertise that span a wide range of financial areas. They can help you make more informed decisions as you navigate the complexities of running your business. They'll help your business grow with individual guidance and convenient digital tools all in one place. With that guidance and your determination, you can take your business farther and help build a brighter future for your community. Learn [e-mail] business chase for business make More of what's yours the Chase Mobile app is available for select mobile devices. Message and data rates may apply. JPMorgan Chase Bank NA Member FDIC Copyright 2026 JPMorgan Chase & Co. Bloomberg Daybreak is your best way to get informed first thing in the morning, right in your podcast feed. Hi.

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[Brian Eggers]

The NFL playoffs. Yeah. So DraftKings and FanDuel, among other things, recently rolled out these prediction market apps which are separate from their sports books. And this is really to compete more head on against Kalshi and Robinhood and other of these financial firms that offer these event contracts in a.

[Carol Massar]

Number of states. How big is I'm hearing more and more about this prediction market market. How big.

[Brian Eggers]

Is this thing? I mean, this is potentially really large. I don't have numbers in front of me, but the key thing is that Kalshi and Robinhood are trying to do this in all 50 states. There are about a dozen states that have either told them cease and desist because they effectively are engaging in illegal sports betting according to the states, or a couple states have warned DraftKings FanDuel don't do the same thing if you've got a sportsbook license. So what DraftKings and FanDuel did was try to go into states with this product where they don't operate sportsbooks. They can do prediction markets on politics or entertainment events in any state. But the real issue is with respect to sports, that's where.

[Tim Stenovec]

They limit themselves. Let me ask you a dumb question, and maybe we don't know the answer to this yet. Who is the target audience for a sports prediction market versus sports contract and in prediction market setting versus, you know, just a regular parlay or.

[Brian Eggers]

Some bet in. I mean, so regardless of the type of person, in terms of the type of area or territory, think about the fact that you've got mobile sportsbooks in almost 30 states, three some odd states drafting fandom on 25 of them. Other states, big states like Texas and California that don't have legal sports books and sports betting, that's a logical market for Kalshee and Robinhood to go in there and say you can do these prediction markets and engage in that even though sports betting isn't active and legal in the state, that's.

[Carol Massar]

Really the big. So what would a Texas and Florida.

[George Ferguson]

Say.

[Brian Eggers]

About that? Right. So without going through every state, there about a dozen states that either specifically told Koshi and Polymark or Robinhood, cease and desist, don't do this. A few others have issued letters warning drafting some FanDuel do not offer a sports prediction market in a state where you've got a sports bet license. So what FanDuel and DraftKings did is, you know, 17 states for DraftKings, five for FanDuel. They're offering this product in states where they don't have sportsbooks and where sports betting.

[Tim Stenovec]

Isn'T, quote, legal. Who regulates.

[Brian Eggers]

The sports markets? So it's confused. It's very confusing because the sports books are regulated by state gaming regulatory authorities. The prediction markets are regulated by the cftc. So it's state versus federal. And that's been the argument of Kalsha that, you know, we're a financial futures contract. We're not sports betting. We are federally regulated. The states have pushed back and said, no, this is a form of effectively unlicensed sports betting. And ultimately I think this heads to the Supreme Court. That's certainly the view of Elliot.

[Carol Massar]

Steiner, litigation analyst. So what do the casino companies say these days? What do they say? Does that impact their sports book and their sports betting.

[Brian Eggers]

On the margin? To the extent that MGM and Caesars have mobile products, it's very possible to look into this type of product as well. Again, in those states where sports betting isn't legal. So everyone's going to Think about it in real other other wrinkle is Texas and California, once they realize we may not have sports betting, what we have effectively sports bettors, if you believe that's what predictor markets are, we might as well legalize it. And so there's a whole bunch of.

[Tim Stenovec]

Ramifications to this. What about Native American tribes in states like California, in Connecticut, where do they fit in? How.

[Brian Eggers]

Do they fit? So it's an issue. I mean in California, although sports betting isn't legal in California, the tribes have themselves challenged and through legally the likes of Kalshi and Robin Hood, I don't remember which one. So to the extent that tribes have opportunities to operate sports books which effectively Florida has a Seminole Tribe operating Hard Rock betting site even though Giraffe Kings fanduel are not involved. So the tribes very much will care to the extent that this is effectively a competing product as consumers.

[Carol Massar]

Might perceive it. So is betting just going crazy the total dollar amount? I see kids, high school kids having conversations in detail showing a level of expertise which really blows me away. Kids, high school kids and I don't know, it just doesn't.

[Brian Eggers]

Feel it's surprising and it also gets very problematic when you have college kids, college games, college players. But yeah, there's a big national draw to this to draw to this and I think the real I don't think draftkings and fans will get as affected as some might fear in states where they've got a sportsbook, but in states where they can't operate a sportsbook. But Kalashi and Robinhood and Polymark and others are offering prediction markets. That's where I think they see risk as.

[Tim Stenovec]

Well as opportunity. Brian, what about the sports leagues, the NFL, the NBA, the NHL, the mlb. How do they fit into all this? I mean are they going all in with.

[Brian Eggers]

The prediction markets? Well, I think so. They're watching obviously with interest. I mean the major principles in terms of where this heads are state regulators versus federal regulators, states issuing in some cases cease and desist orders and ultimately because there's a lot of ongoing court cases, many on appeal, the Supreme Court is the logical destination for the.

[Tim Stenovec]

Legality of this. But I mean that's.

[Brian Eggers]

To get resolved months, maybe years away depends on the urgency. I know Elliot Stein believes it could happen potentially as early as 2026 that there's a decision but we don't know. But ultimately I think this it needs to be clarified and resolved as to who.

[Carol Massar]

Has jurisdiction here. It is crazy the amount I mean just a few years ago, I mean you wouldn't even have thought this, but now you get sports teams in Vegas. Yeah.

[Brian Eggers]

I mean, yeah. So they started this is leading up to the presidential election. There was a lot of activity on policy and polymarket about who would win the election and that kind of kicked off a lot of popular interest in this, which means that's when when they became involved in sports prediction markets actively.

[Carol Massar]

A year ago. Stay with us. More from Bloomberg Intelligence coming.

[Tim Stenovec]

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[Carol Massar]

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[Carol Massar]

Us live on YouTube. Looking at a story here today Alaska airline ordering Boeing Co. Aircraft, including 105 narrow body 737 Max 10 models and five 787 wide body aircraft. So good day for Boeing. The Stock's up about 8/10 of 1%. The stock's up about 34% over the trailing 12 months. George Ferguson joins us here, senior aerospace, defense and airlines analyst for Bloomberg Intelligence. George, a. Is this a, this seems like a nice day. A good order for Boeing. How are they doing.

[George Ferguson]

Out in the marketplace? Yeah, I think it's a, it was a nice kickoff to the year as far as orders look through. We've tracked them through November of last year. We get to see December order and deliveries from Boeing or Airbus. But through November of last year, Boeing was beating Airbus in the order game for the year. And so, you know, we had sort of expected this or there were some core customers I think that were probably sitting on the sideline watching to see if Boeing was going to get its troubles behind it before it placed orders. And we, so we saw a bit of a bounce back last year in 2025 as Boeing sort of pulled in a bunch of those orders. I think if you're an airline, you know, when you're sort of fleet planning, when you have backlogs that are 10 years large for the, for the most important airplanes, for the narrow bodies, you kind of got to be sort of in, in the order mode, you know, every year or so many years sort of topping up orders to make sure that you have airplanes coming regularly as either you're expanding or things leaving your fleet. So good to see Alaska do it again. We think Boeing, a lot of Boeing customers caught up last year. This year probably, probably a decent order year as well as that catch up continues for Boeing. And this was a core customer for Boeing. Alaska has been a core Boeing flyer. They recently bought Hawaiian that added a bunch of Airbus aircraft to its fleet. Not a lot, but a bunch of them. A handful of them, actually more than a handful, 20s or 30s. And I think another indicator that they've kept this Alaska, they've kept the Alaska Airlines as a core customer. And I would see them kind of going to a more pure Boeing fleet in the future as they ease out some.

[Carol Massar]

Of those Airbus aircraft. It seems like a big order for Alaska. Does this signal any change in strategy or.

[George Ferguson]

What'S going on there? Well, I think it's pretty interesting, right Alaska, their 787 dash, they think dash tens ultimately when they buy them, the biggest 787, they've got an order for five of them. Alaska traditionally had been just a narrow Body kind of US but really west coast focused airline. Since they bought Hawaiian, they've added international routes. Clearly they added Hawaii. Hawaii. Hawaiian had routes into Asia where there's a fair amount of demand for Hawaii. Alaska looks to be trying to grow into, you know, a global airline. They've got European service now too. So this is, I think a continuation of that push by Alaska to be what it wants to be when it grows up, I guess, which is going to be maybe another one of the big, big.

[Carol Massar]

US Full service carriers. Is there room, George, do you think, for another.

[George Ferguson]

US Full service carrier? I think if you do it well, there probably is, right. I think look, you got, you got Southwest coming as well. Southwest is adding premium seating. They're already pretty large in the US they don't have much international, but Southwest is a four, definitely a force to be reckoned with. But they're leaving the old world where they were very much a pure fleet and they could control costs. Well, going again into the, you know, sort of premium and making their operations more complex. Alaska kind of coming the other way. They already have premium now trying to go global. I mean, I think going back to Alaska, they've got to figure out what they want to be when they grow up because I don't think they can survive just, just as a largely west coast airline. I think Hawaiian was the beginning of that expansion strategy which included long haul, this, these follow on orders. I think reinforced. To me that's the direction they're going. They're going for a global airline. You know, it's going to take a while to get there, but that's.

[Carol Massar]

What they're going for. Would regulators ever allow, you know, the combination of Alaska.

[George Ferguson]

And Southwest, for example? You know, that's to me, I think anytime you get some of the big carriers involved in buying somebody, I think it gets difficult. I think it's going to, I think would be hard. I think it would be hard. I think Alaska have to look at something maybe smaller or you know, Southwest I think would be difficult to do an acquisition, maybe a very small acquisition. But if Alaska is getting together with somebody, I think it's kind.

[Carol Massar]

Of JetBlue and down. What do you think here just in 20, 26, air traffic, air travel. How do you think that's going to.

[George Ferguson]

Shape up this year? Yeah, so we see a lot of additions to premium, to premium carriers and we see carriers adding premium seats that weren't traditionally premium carriers. So to us it feels like premium could be under a bit of pressure as we get into the new into the New Year or 2026 here because it looks like a lot of people go in that direction. That's where, that's where the earnings have been driven late lately. Loyalty programs, super important basic economy world looks like it's starting to right size. Things could get better, but it will take a.

[Tim Stenovec]

Little time, I think. This is the Bloomberg Intelligence Podcast, available on Apple, Spotify and anywhere else you get. Your podcasts listen live each weekday 10am to noon Eastern on Bloomberg.com, the iHeartRadio app, TuneIn and the Bloomberg Business app. You can also watch us live Every weekday on YouTube and always.

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