Bloomberg Talks

Episode: Bain’s Steve Pagliuca Talks Private Credit
Date: October 17, 2025
Host: Bloomberg
Guest: Steve Pagliuca, Co-Chairman, Bain Capital

Episode Overview

This episode features Steve Pagliuca of Bain Capital in a candid conversation about the evolving landscape of private credit, the shifting dynamics of leveraged buyouts, the growing role of private equity globally, and his ventures in the sports industry. The discussion offers insider perspectives on credit markets, the U.S. national debt, sports franchise valuations, and the increasing value of live sports content.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Evolution of Leveraged Buyouts & Private Credit

Timestamps: 00:23–02:48

• Comparison of Past and Present LBOs:
  • Host draws parallels between the recent Electronic Arts buyout and the historic HCA deal (2006–07), both involving massive leveraged transactions.
  • Pagliuca: The capital structure of LBOs has shifted towards higher equity and comparatively less debt, reflecting changes in market risk appetite and lender strategies.
    • "That buyout was $5 billion equity and $27 billion debt. This buyout is much more equity—kind of $30 billion of equity and $20 billion debt… So the markets have changed to that extent that you can't leverage much." (00:59)
• Quality of Private Credit Markets:
  • Pagliuca expresses confidence in the stability of private lenders and banks (notably JP Morgan and Bank of America), distinguishing private credit’s risks from systemic banking risk.
    • "Private credit is different than credit for banks because if it does go bad, you only write off the equity from people who put the equity in. It doesn't have a systemic multiplier effect." (01:44)

2. Concerns Over the U.S. National Debt

Timestamps: 01:40–03:38

• Rising Debt and Its Implications:
  • Pagliuca voices concern over the ballooning U.S. national debt and its impact on government spending, especially as low-interest government refinancings mature.
    • "It took 250 years to have $1 trillion of national debt… In the last 40 years, we now have $37 trillion, which is more than the GDP… Our interest from the government now is one of the highest expenditures. It's right up there with defense and healthcare." (02:16)
  • Warns about complacency: each round of debt increases becomes normalized, but the long-term risks accumulate.
    • "In situations like this, it's always okay till it isn't okay…At some point you've got to have some long-term plan to pay that money back." (02:58)
  • Notes that most of the debt is still financed at low rates but will soon need to be refinanced at higher rates, raising interest expense further.

3. Geopolitics and Private Equity Deals

Timestamps: 03:38–04:11

• Concerns Around Foreign Involvement:
  • The discussion touches on potential political sensitivities regarding foreign (notably Saudi PIF) involvement in large tech buyouts and the perceived role of intermediaries.
  • Pagliuca downplays the risk, citing robust U.S. private equity leadership.
    • "Silver Lake’s a fantastic firm and they're leading the charge there…there’s really going to be no concern because they'll be calling the shots on the deal." (04:04)

4. Globalization & Capital in Private Equity

Timestamps: 04:11–05:20

• Growth and Diversification:
  • The private equity landscape has globalized and multiplied in size, with a much greater range of players, including sovereign wealth funds and institutional investors partnering with PE shops.
    • "When I started out… there was only three or four firms doing this…Now it's global. Fund sizes are up probably twenty times…so the dry powder is huge." (04:20)
• Opportunities Abound:
  • Despite abundant capital, Pagliuca asserts opportunities for new investments remain robust due to the value-added potential of private equity management.
    • "PE is here to stay. The model has really evolved...and I think there’ll be plenty of opportunities for these folks to invest money." (04:46)

5. Sports Investment: Atalanta & Beyond

Timestamps: 05:20–07:37

• Partnership with New Balance & Atalanta:
  • Pagliuca describes a strong, values-driven partnership with New Balance, including stadium naming rights and shared ethos as “fighting brands.”
    • "New Balance is a…fighting brand, growing, taking a lot of share. They really like the Atalanta story because we have the same values…It was kind of a match made in heaven." (05:34)
  • Notes the family-owned nature of Atalanta, New Balance, and other stakeholders, underscoring a collaborative, long-term vision.
• Boom in Sports Valuations:
  • Sports franchises are trading at record valuations due to their unmatched ability to aggregate massive global audiences—a dynamic propelled by technology and media.
    • "Sports is now the only thing left that aggregates huge audiences globally...fans are counted in the billions instead of the tens of thousands." (06:20)
  • Advertisers and broadcasters are driving up values, given the importance of live content.
• Perspectives on Future Sports Investments:
  • Sees significant growth in women’s sports (WNBA, soccer), but also reiterates that NFL remains the premier asset class.
    • "The WNBA is a great opportunity. Women’s sports in general, women’s soccer in the USA and globally is growing. The NFL is the marquee property." (07:07)
  • On potential team acquisition: currently waiting on NBA moves, excited by rising ratings and fan engagement in women’s basketball.
    • "We've kind of stood down for now, and we're going to abide by whatever the NBA wants to do with the [Connecticut] team...The ratings are huge for WNBA." (07:43)

6. Personal Reflections & The American Dream

Timestamps: 08:09–08:33

• Pagliuca’s Background:
  • Ends on a personal note, reflecting on his immigrant family’s journey and the sense of fulfillment in returning to his roots with Italian club Atalanta.
    • "My grandfather came from Italy on a boat with one suitcase…worked in a shoe factory here in New York in the Bronx for $8 a week. So I would say America is a great place… I love the homecoming. Coming back to Italy with Atalanta, …everyone looks like me there." (08:09)

Notable Quotes

• On private credit stability:
  "Private credit is different than credit for banks because if it does go bad, you only write off the equity from people who put the equity in. It doesn't have a systemic multiplier effect." — Steve Pagliuca (01:44)

• On national debt risks:
  "It's always okay till it isn't okay. At some point you've got to have some long-term plan to pay that money back and get that deficit down because it's eating up huge amounts of the government budget." — Steve Pagliuca (02:58)

• On the explosion of private equity:
  "When I started out…there was only three or four firms doing this. Now it's global. Fund sizes are up probably twenty times...so the dry powder is huge." — Steve Pagliuca (04:20)

• On sports as a resilient live content asset:
  "Sports is now the only thing left that aggregates huge audiences globally." — Steve Pagliuca (06:20)

• Personal fulfillment:
  "My grandfather came from Italy on a boat with one suitcase…So I would say America is a great place… I love the homecoming. Coming back to Italy with Atalanta." — Steve Pagliuca (08:09)

Important Timestamps

• 00:59 – Structural changes in leveraged buyouts
• 01:44 – Private credit vs. banking sector risk
• 02:16 – National debt’s historical context
• 02:58 – Debt risks and future concerns
• 04:20 – Globalization of private equity
• 05:34 – Atalanta and New Balance partnership
• 06:20 – Sports franchises' audience and value growth
• 07:07 – Growth of women’s sports and NFL leadership
• 08:09 – Pagliuca reflects on family and heritage

Tone & Takeaways

Steve Pagliuca blends financial acumen with optimism about America’s opportunities. His tone is pragmatic—sounding alarms about unsustainable debt, candid about market realities, but ultimately upbeat regarding private equity’s evolution and the enduring growth of sports assets. The episode delivers clear context for current financial headlines through the lens of a seasoned industry leader, with relatable personal reflection bringing it home.