House Speaker Mike Johnson Talks Government Shutdown

Summary

Podcast Summary: Bloomberg Talks – House Speaker Mike Johnson Talks Government Shutdown

Date: October 8, 2025
Host: Bloomberg News
Guest: U.S. House Speaker Mike Johnson

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Overview

In this episode, House Speaker Mike Johnson joins Bloomberg live from Capitol Hill to discuss the ongoing government shutdown, its origins, the policy disputes at its core, and prospects for resolution. The conversation focuses on the political divisions in Congress, the impact on federal workers and services, and Johnson's perspective on negotiations and responsibility. The discussion offers insight into the partisan dynamics and the human and economic costs of the shutdown.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Origins and Blame for the Government Shutdown

• Johnson's Frustration: Johnson expresses deep frustration over the shutdown, attributing it to "political games being played by Democrats in the Senate" (00:42). He challenges the narrative that Republicans are at fault, pointing to a shift in Senate Democrats’ position.
• Shifting Politics: Johnson alleges Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer is responding to intra-party pressures and left-wing challenges ("the Marxist wave in New York") and using the shutdown as a political tool against former President Trump (00:42–01:55).
  • Quote: "They picked a fight that has nothing to do with stopgap funding... It's a red herring. It's a distraction." – Mike Johnson (01:37)

2. Policy Disputes and the "Clean CR"

• Obamacare Subsidies: Johnson argues that issues like Obamacare subsidies are unrelated to immediate government funding, stating negotiations on these were always scheduled for later months (00:42–02:10).
• Simplicity of the CR: He describes the House’s continuing resolution (CR) as a "clean" 24-page bill with "zero Republican policy riders," maintaining current Biden-era policies and spending (02:10–03:42).
  • Quote: "The clean CR is so simple, Joe... We just said, do what you’ve always done. Let’s keep the lights on..." – Mike Johnson (03:10)
• Rejection of Negotiation Prematurely: Johnson refuses to promise bringing negotiated legislation to a floor vote or to commit to policy outcomes before open debate, labeling such demands as unprecedented (02:10).

3. Negotiation Prospects and "Off-ramps"

• Lack of Progress with Senate Leadership: Johnson confirms he has not spoken with Schumer since their recent Oval Office meeting but recounts President Biden’s plea to keep the government open, saying Schumer and House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries "walked out defiantly" (05:20).
  • Quote: "The president made an impassioned plea while we were there to please not do this. Please don’t shut the government down, Chuck. And he was burned." – Mike Johnson (05:23)
• Impacts if Shutdown Persists: Johnson warns the consequences intensify with time, with military personnel, TSA agents, and Border Patrol agents at risk of lost pay; services like health and disaster relief are stalled; half the federal workforce is furloughed (05:20–06:11).
  • Quote: "October 15th, troops begin to lose a real paycheck... This is dangerous stuff. Real people are being hurt." – Mike Johnson (05:27)
• Outreach to Democrats: Johnson calls on Senate Democrats to "come to their senses," join Republicans, and end the shutdown (04:08–05:12).

4. Economics and Worker Impacts

• Back Pay Debate: Johnson believes the law requires back pay for furloughed workers and expresses confusion about President Biden’s criticism, reaffirming respect for federal employees (06:47).
• Economic Consequences: He raises concerns about GDP loss, projecting $15 billion in loss per week of shutdown and potential for 43,000 civilian layoffs in a month, along with impacts on national security and nuclear deterrence programs (07:41).
  • Quote: "We had some analysis today that every week that the Democrat shutdown continues, we could lose $15 billion in gross domestic product. I mean, it's a real hit for real people..." – Mike Johnson (07:44)

5. Process and Legislative Prospects

• Returning to Washington: Johnson confirms he’ll give House members 48 hours’ notice to return if new developments arise but is skeptical changes to the clean CR are possible or necessary (08:28–08:49).
• Counterproposals: Johnson strongly dismisses suggestions to increase spending or include benefits for specific groups, like undocumented immigrants, as part of any compromise (08:49).
  • Quote: "We're not taking Chuck Schum ridiculous counterproposal. We're going to do the right thing for the people and the Republicans are on the job to do it." – Mike Johnson (09:35)

6. Decorum, Tensions, and Congressional Process

• Capitol Tensions: Johnson references increased hostility and altercations among lawmakers, noting he champions civility but attributes tensions to the high stakes of the shutdown (09:48–10:56).
  • Quote: "I try to model that myself. I try to, you know, encourage colleagues to do it. But I would tell you the tension here is very high because... the stakes are so high." – Mike Johnson (10:35)
• Special Election & Swearing-In: Johnson explains the timing of swearing in Rep.-elect Grijalva from Arizona, calling Democratic senators’ protests a “distraction”; insists the government must reopen for the House to resume business and swear in new members (10:56–12:30).

7. Closing Thoughts & Outlook

• Johnson's Hopes: Looking ahead, Johnson expresses he is "on my knees praying" the shutdown will soon end, reiterating his call for lawmakers to focus on serving the people and restoring government operations (12:39).
  • Quote: "We have got to get the government operating again. It’s the most basic function of the federal government..." – Mike Johnson (12:42)

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Notable Quotes (with Timestamps)

• "This is a very frustrating exercise for us. It's no fun at all, Joe. ... Real Americans are feeling real harm because of this." – Mike Johnson (00:42)
• "Obamacare was supposed to bring down the cost of health care. Premiums have skyrocketed since it was created in 2010. They're up like 60%. So something’s not working." – Mike Johnson (02:32)
• "They refuse to do it because, again, they want to show a fight because they can't stand President Trump." – Mike Johnson (03:23)
• "The president made an impassioned plea while we were there to please not do this. ... And Chuck Schumer and Hakeem Jeffries walked out defiantly." – Mike Johnson (05:23)
• "We could lose $15 billion in gross domestic product. ... If you keep it closed for a month, ... you lose 43,000 civilian employees." – Mike Johnson (07:42)
• "I authored the Honor and Civility Caucus pledge and the Commitment to Civility. ... There are fights about policy, but it shouldn’t be personal." – Mike Johnson (10:20)
• "We have got to get the government operating again. It's the most basic function of the federal government is to serve the people, keep the people safe and keep the lights on." – Mike Johnson (12:43)

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Important Timestamps & Segments

• 00:42–01:55: Johnson discusses the shutdown's origins and attributes blame to Democrats and Chuck Schumer.
• 02:10–03:42: Debate over the CR and policy riders; rationale for refusing precommitment to future votes.
• 04:08–05:12: Discussion on negotiation, off-ramps, and responsibility for reaching a deal.
• 05:20–06:11: Details on Biden’s involvement, consequences for federal workers and public services.
• 06:47–07:41: Back pay for furloughed workers; economic and employment impacts.
• 08:28–08:49: Process for recalling House members and skepticism toward CR modifications.
• 09:48–10:56: Rising tensions, civility, and decorum in Congress.
• 10:56–12:30: Procedures for swearing in new House members and pushback against political distractions.
• 12:39–12:54: Johnson’s closing remarks and appeal for bipartisan cooperation to end the shutdown.

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Tone & Style

The conversation is direct and combative, with Johnson frequently expressing frustration and urgency. He emphasizes accountability, procedural integrity, and voices skepticism toward his Democratic counterparts while framing the Republican position as reasonable and conciliatory. The host maintains a neutral, probing tone, seeking specifics on process, impact, and next steps.

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For Listeners Who Missed the Episode

This episode offers a revealing look into congressional standoffs during a government shutdown, as well as insight into Speaker Johnson’s stance, arguments, and emotional state. He describes the stakes as high, emphasizes the harm to Americans, and positions the House’s efforts as reasonable but frustrated by Senate intransigence, while warning of real economic and personal costs if resolution is delayed.

Transcript

[A]

Indiana University is shaping the future of healthcare, advancing discoveries that become treatments for Alzheimer's, obesity and cancer and training the providers trusted to deliver them. See how IU solves What's next iu Edu Impact Bloomberg Audio Studios Podcasts Radio News Joining us now, as we promised, live from Capitol Hill is the U.S. speaker of the House, Mike Johnson. Welcome Back to Bloomberg TV and radio. Mr. Speaker. Bill looking forward to the conversation and I appreciate your time this evening. I'm sure you're having a ball and you don't want this to end anytime soon, but I'm just wondering what your gut check is here and how long you think this is going to go on.

[B]

This is a very frustrating exercise for us. It's no fun at all, Joe. And that's because real Americans are feeling real harm because of this. It's political games being played by Democrats in the Senate. There is one reason and one reason alone that they have all just magically changed their tune. I mean, they've done 180 degree turn from what they have always said and done, in fact, in keeping the government open. They said as recently as March of this year. We're playing the highlight reel tape outside the speaker's office right now. They all said in their own words, you can't shut the government down. It's too painful. Something changed. What changed was the political calculation Chuck Schumer is worried about, as was just said, an attack or a challenge from his left flank. He's afraid that the Marxist wave in New York is going to take him over as well because he represents that state. And so he's got to pick a fight with Trump and show that he's fighting. Well, they picked a fight that has nothing to do with stopgap funding. They're talking about the Obamacare subsidies, for example. That's a December 31st policy issue. We were always going to negotiate that and debate it and deliberate over it in October, November. That always has been on the schedule and they know that. But they're trying to pretend that's the issue of the day. It's not. It's a red herring. It's a distraction. They're not doing their jobs and real Americans are getting hurt.

[A]

Well, we spoke just a few moments ago with Congresswoman Catherine Clark, who said we just want a gesture. Mr. Speaker, would you consider a promise to bring that negotiated legislation to a floor vote, up or down, we'll make sure that happens before the end of the year.

[B]

The speaker of the House is in no position to project forward what the outcome of a big policy debate is going to be. That's. That'd be unprecedented for anyone to do that, and I won't. What we have told them is the obvious fact that there are. There are ongoing negotiations and discussions going on today between Republicans and Democrats and certainly within our own caucuses about how some of that would need to be reformed. Look, there's a lot of conservatives who have real problems with the Obamacare subsidies, okay? When the government subsidizes something, it means it's not working. It's like the EV mandates. You know, people didn't want to buy electric vehicles. The government said, we'll give you $7,500 cash if you do. And they still didn't buy enough of them. Right. When the government subsidizes something, it means the market's not working. Obamacare was supposed to bring down the cost of health care. Premiums have skyrocketed since it was created in 2010. They're up like 60%. So something's not working. There's real reforms that are needed, but it's a complex issue. It takes a lot of time for members on both sides of the aisle and in both chambers to negotiate. They're trying to sear, short circuit all that right now. That's not how this process works. The clean CR is so simple, Joe. It's 24 pages in length. It has exactly zero Republican policy riders on it. We made it so simple. We just said, do what you've always done. Let's keep the lights on and keep the appropriations and the negotiation process going. They refuse to do it because, again, they want to show a fight because they can't stand President Trump. That's what this is. And in the meantime, American people are being used as pawns in this game. And it is so frustrating to us. I think it's shameful. I think it's immoral for them to do what they're doing right now.

[A]

Well, I know your position on that. And you know, we hear about the Schumer shutdown a lot around here. Tom Emmer was with us just a couple of days ago, making the point. And we've heard this over the past couple of weeks. But what happens if Chuck Schumer doesn't come around for you? What happens if weeks go by, if members of the military are not being paid? Are there off ramps here for you, Mr. Speaker? Will you start reaching out directly to Democrats? Do we need another meeting in the Oval Office?

[B]

Look, I am a good faith operator. I am a negotiator. I like to find common ground. Here's the problem. Because we were operating in good faith and doing the most basic, simple thing, I mean, the bare minimum piece of legislation to keep the lights on. I literally don't have anything to negotiate on the cr. I can't go into that document and say, oh, let me, let me pull off these Republican priorities and see if we can get some more Democrats to vote on it. I don't have anything to pull off of it. I sent over a clean continuing resolution and by the way, very important. It continues Biden era policies and spending which, which we conservatives don't like. We're trying to change that, but we need the appropriations process to finish it. All we needed was seven more weeks on the clock to finish the process. And the Republicans and Democrats who are appropriators are the ones that decided that date and decided it should be clean. And everything was going smoothly until Chuck Schumer decided to blow it up. Is he going to fold? I don't know. But I'll tell you what needs to happen. Some other Senate Democrats need to come to their senses and realize they should not be blamed for the pain that's being inflicted on the people. Make it stop as soon as possible. Do the right thing and join your Republican colleagues in open and the government back up.

[A]

That's why I ask if you're reaching out to some of the Democratic senators. Mr. Speaker, have you talked to Chuck Schumer since your Oval Office meeting?

[B]

No, not since the Oval Office meeting. But I tell you what, the president made an impassioned plea while we were there to please not do this. Please don't shut the government down, Chuck. And he was burned. And Chuck Schumer and Hakeem Jeffries walked out defiantly. You know, they wanted to pick this fight. It's very clear. The question everybody's asking is how long. October 15th, troops begin to lose a real paycheck. And you've got TSA agents and Border Patrol agents and all these people sacrificing their own safety to protect everyone else and they won't be paid. You've got nutrition programs and health services and FEMA services and all sorts of other things stalled. And half the, half the civilian workforce of the federal government is now furloughed. This is dangerous stuff. Real people are being hurt. Air traffic controllers are falling back on their job because they don't have enough personnel. This is serious stuff and we need the Democrats to come to their senses and do the right thing.

[A]

Well, of course there's a threat of mass layoffs coming from the president. He said maybe four or five days he would make a decision on that. But there's also been a conversation. I heard you speaking earlier in your briefing about back pay for federal workers who have been furloughed. There's of course a law in the books around furloughed workers getting back bay today. And I know that you have been speaking to the letter of the law. The president yesterday, yesterday said though that there are some federal workers who do not deserve the quote was to be taken care of. Is this issue the purview of Congress? Do you plan to follow this law or is this somehow up to Russ vote now?

[B]

Well, look, there's, there's different legal analyses that are floating around right now and I've been so busy with this, I haven't had a chance to dig into it. I am a lawyer. I'm looking forward to reading through that because I kind of get into all the scholarship side of this. It has always been my understanding that the law requires furloughed workers to be to receive back pay. And of course that's been the tradition. And I'm not sure exactly what the president is referring to there. I haven't had a chance to talk to him about that specific issue yet. But we will you this though the view of the White House, the view of the president himself, is that he doesn't want federal workers to be used as pawns. Here we've got some great patriotic Americans who work for our agencies and provide essential services to the people. They should not suffer the harms of people who want to play political games. And I think this really important principle for us to advance.

[A]

Do you worry about mass layoffs coming as early as next week and that actually poisoning the well even more between Republicans and Democrats? What would be the impact of a move like that?

[B]

Well, look, I'm worried about all sorts of adverse effects because of how it affects the American people. We had some analysis today that every week that the Democrat shutdown continues, we could lose $15 billion in gross domestic product. I mean, it's a real hit for real people and it has a reverberating effect. And if you keep it closed for a month, then one of the estimates I saw today is you lose 43,000 civilian employees. You know, because it has a ripple effect throughout the economy. We can't afford to do that. Right. Things were going in the right direction and this is a terrible setback for the country. It also has implications for national security. I mean, you look at things like nuclear Deterrence. Those programs are stalled right now. Right. And every day you do that, it has real world consequences for us, not a game. And we need to end it right now.

[A]

I know that you've said to House Republicans, at least reportedly, that you would give them 48 hours notice if they had to come back into town when folks left following the vote on the CR in the House, if they're talking next door in the Senate, if some sort of deal is brokered that might alter the CR as it stands now, do you plan to call your members back?

[B]

Look, the devil's in the details, but I don't know how they could possibly alter it. We made it so simple. There again, there is nothing to take off of that. It is virtually identical to what Chuck Schumer himself championed in March of this year. And so we're not going to strap on extraneous policy issues and all of that. That would take a long time because the government's now closed down. They need to pass the clean, turn the lights back on and get everybody back to work. I'm just so frustrated with the nonsense around this. And I think more and more people at home are as well. I saw a Rasmussen poll that came out a couple of hours ago. 49% of the American people were polled, said the Democrats did this to give benefits to illegal aliens. They are not wrong. $200 billion in their counter proposal would pay illegal aliens the benefits that hard working American taxpayers provide. We're not doing that. We're not going to add a trillion and a half new dollars to spending. We're not taking Chuck Schum ridiculous counterproposal. We're going to do the right thing for the people and the Republicans are on the job to do it.

[A]

I know you had a couple of visitors at your office today, Mr. Speaker. A couple of Democratic senators. I believe Kelly and Gallego had a lot of things to say about the swearing in of a new member of Congress from Arizona. I also saw Congressman Mike Lawler from New York get into an altercation with Hakeem Jeffries as he was coming out of his office here. I know that elbows can be sharp on Capitol Hill, but Mr. Speaker, what's happened to decorum? Is this a new low?

[B]

Look, I work on decorum around here all the time. Everybody knows that's my record. I started it. When I came to Washington in January 2017, I authored the Honor and Civility Caucus pledge and the Commitment to Civility. I mean, we have to maintain this. There are fights about policy, but it shouldn't be personal. I try to model that myself. I try to, you know, encourage colleagues to do it. But I would tell you the tension here is very high because it's high because the stakes are so high. And you got real Americans, real constituents back home who are really suffering because of the nonsense. And it gets our. Gets us upset here sometimes. You know, I understand that emotion. We've got to keep it in check. We got to get everybody working together. We've got to get the lights back on.

[A]

I want to ask you about that new member, Grijalva, the congresswoman elect from Arizona. The senators were asking you to swear her in, or I guess they were urging you to swear her in, which I know you've done a couple of times for Republican members in pro forma sessions. These two senators were yelling about Jeffrey Epstein, I think, to make a point here, and they did get some coverage on that. Mr. Speaker, is this an Epstein issue or is this a process issue?

[B]

They're masters at distraction. And go back and watch the video of Senator Ruben Gallego. These are the two Democrat senators from Arizona, Mark Kelly and Gallego. And they're voting to keep the government closed. I told them, if you want to get your House colleague from your state, take the oath of office, then open the government so we get back to regular session. They claim everything's about Epstein. It's a joke. Master's a distraction. We did. This is a long standing tradition in the Congress. When you administer the oath after a special election, you do it the first time that the Congress is back in session after that. We did change that, modify it earlier this year on one occasion we had two Floridians who came in on the same special election. But it was a very different set of circumstances. I explained to them very quickly. We had a scheduled date for the office ceremony. The House went out of session unexpectedly. They already had their family and friends here and it was already prearranged. So we just went ahead and went through the motion. We're going to Rep. Elect Grahava will be sworn in as soon as we get back to regular session. She never had a scheduled date because she got elected after the House went out of session. This is real simple. We're going to do that as soon as we get back. But they are in charge of turning the lights on so Congress can get back to work.

[A]

Well, I appreciate your answering that for us, Mr. Speaker. Lastly, if you were to join me, say next Wednesday, would we be having the same conversation about a shutdown?

[B]

I am on my knees praying that we would not be. We have got to get the government operating again. It's the most basic function of the federal government is to serve the people, keep the people safe and keep the lights on. And we need the Democrats over here to see the light and do that.

[A]

We appreciate the conversation. House Speaker Mike Johnson, thank you. You're always welcome. On Bloomberg TV and radio there are two kinds of people in the world, people who think about climate change and people who are doing something about. On the Zero podcast we talk to both kinds of people. People you've heard of like Bill Gates. I'm looking at what the world has to do to get to zero, not using climate as a moral crusade and the creative minds you haven't heard of yet. It is serious stuff but never doom and gloom. I am Akshat Ratty Listen to Zero every Thursday from Bloomberg podcasts on Apple, Spotify or anywhere else you get your podcasts.