Kaylee (3:13)

That's right.

Senator Joe Manchin (3:14)

So we're hoping that's not the case. And I don't, they're just, I mean we thought we've neutered them if you will, but my goodness, they keep firing and they keep having missiles. And I'm understanding China has really come in strong in help and defense of Iran. That's not a good sign.

Kaylee (3:30)

Well, to the extent you think Congress has abdicated its duties so far, there will be another inflection point coming when we reach the 60 day mark of this conflict. That'll be on April 29th. And we've heard from a number of members who said, look, you know, the President's got some bandwidth here. Does the debate change at that point, in the parlance of war powers, when we're 60 days into this and there might not be an end in sight?

Senator Joe Manchin (3:50)

Well, it should. You know, we feel up until Iraq and Afghanistan wars, we paid for every war. It was dedicated funds that paid for the wars that we had. So we didn't incur any more indebtedness. We saw what the Afghanistan Iraq war did to us as far as accumulating more debt. And now we're at 39, pushing $40 trillion. A civilized country cannot survive that because sooner or later it's going to be such a burden on the people, the citizens that they will reject what's going on. And when that happens, you just get total dysfunction. We're close to that. We're an inflection point now to where, okay, no one's talking about the debt we've raised we have increased the debt more in the last five months faster than any time in history. As I'm understanding. It's over $1 trillion. This is whenever the debt exceeds the cost of defending your country. So we're $1 trillion. We've passed the 1 trillion mark. That's greater than what we have as far as what we pay to defend the country. I know the president wants to increase that to $1.5 trillion. That's going to be a very, very heavy lift. The power of the purse is still in the House. Okay. And it takes, it has to have agreement with the Senate. So that's the balance you have. The Senate has the filibuster, the 60 vote threshold, which is a wonderful thing for our country up until now. It's not only time, it's not wonderful is if you're in power, if you're in the majority, you want total absolute power. So the Democrats wanted to get rid of the filibuster when they had last night, 2020 with Joe Biden. I, I would not do it under any circumstances and Kirsten Sinema did not do it. So without us two, or without even one of us, they could not get rid of the filibuster. Now the President wants the Republicans to get rid of it because they want a voting and both of them want to get rid of it because of a voting, of a voting law that they both wanted to push.

Joe (5:33)

The Save America Act.

Senator Joe Manchin (5:34)

Yeah. So with that being on, I said, wait a minute. The bottom line is you're going to be flip flopping back like most European parliaments do. If you do that, we have stable government. When we pass legislation, it's going to be there for quite some time. It's harder to get rid of it too. And what happens is that we won't be that superpower with the predictability and stability that the world has looked towards. And right now I'm concerned about that.

Joe (5:59)

Well, and your defense of the filibuster has been well documented to this point. The Senate Majority leader, John Thune has also tried his best to defend it. Refuse the talking filibuster that President Trump asked for, for example. But I wonder what you make of the notion that to get around the filibuster, we're just doing a bunch of budget reconciliation packages. Obviously you were a critical vote for Democrats in the Biden administration and a reconciliation package. We've seen Republicans already successfully pursue one this Congress. They're talking now about 2.0 and 3.0. Is this just the way we're going

Senator Joe Manchin (6:30)

to do things well, this is exactly what the Democrats try to do. And I told Chuck Schumer, I said, chuck, this, the establishment of the Senate is the most deliberate body in the world, okay? It was not designed to run on simple majority 51. It was designed to run on more of a consensus. And that means that the minority would always have input. As a senator, it didn't really make that much difference to those of us who might not be the majority leader or in leadership because we still had input, we could talk, our voice was important and our vote was very important. So you always were needed to sit down and negotiate and work through things. Now they're getting to the point where they said, we'll just disregard that. And I told President Biden, I said, Mr. President, what you're doing here and allowing this to go into reconciliation, coming in with American Rescue Plan ARP is wrong. I said, you're the one on the stage, as I recall, running for president that said, I know how it works. I've worked with these people. I know how to bring people together. And now you're throwing a nuclear option, what we call the nuclear option just coming out of the gate. And I believe they would have ran the, the 117th Congress, which is 2021 through the 20th of January 2023, with four reconciliation bills, two in 2021 and two in 22. And I said, I'm not going to. You need my vote. You're not going to get it. It's not going to happen. And I killed the big build back better because it was basically throwing so much. It had been a $10 trillion bill, we'd have thrown the world, I believe, into a recession, if not a depression. It was awful. You cannot digest that much money in the system. When they did the, when American Rescue plan was, was, was passed In January of 2021, that meant within one year we put $5.1 trillion of government spending into the system. We run the government about five and a half trillion dollars. During that period of time, we doubled the amount of money. We couldn't digest it. You talk about fraud, abuse and waste. That's how it happens. And you see what's happening.

Kaylee (8:29)

We were all chasing you around every day up there, trying to get a number from you. And I mean, you really held the cards at that point. Senator, who's the Joe Manchin now? Because they're talking about 2.0 and 3.0. The president's already backed one of these plans. They're talking about save America maybe being in the next one. And everyone wants to know how many limbs we can can get on this Christmas tree. Is there a mansion or a center?

Senator Joe Manchin (8:49)

Well, I would like to. I think there is. I truly believe in my heart of hearts there is. But what they have to come to realization. What's your purpose? Is it about your country or about your party? So once you get that in your mind, who do I serve? I said, I told Harry Reid one time, I said, harry, I can't vote for that. He got upset and I said harry, listen, you didn't hire me and you can't fire me. And I said, I don't work for you. I don't work for the people President. I don't work for anyone here except my oath to the Constitution to protect and defend it. I took that oath and the people back home in West Virginia. And if I can't go home and explain it, I'm not voting for it. I was never afraid of getting defeated to go home because I had to live with myself. And I know there's enough good Republicans and enough good Democrats that feel the same way. They seem to have the courage. This might be my last hurrah. But if I'm going to go out, I'm going out on my terms and do what's right for your country. But you know you can be respectfully, the President has a temper. I know him pretty well. But you can work with him. Just be respectful and say, Mr. President, if he gets mad and calls you dumb, stupid and ugly and everything else you say, oh, he doesn't really mean that. He's my friend. He'll get over it. Okay, but do it respectfully because I think he would respect that more. Knowing that you feel very strongly about your position, the biggest thing in the political arena today. It's easy to be against something. Tell me what you would be for if we could change it. Help me before you. I'm against it. Have you thought about this? Would you try this? I think it might work better. I've done what you're going to do right now and I've made that mistake. I'm asking you not to repeat it. Be positive, don't be negative, don't call people names, don't say it's all the Democrats fault or it's all the Republicans fault. It's all of our fault for allowing the Democrats and Republicans to mess the system up this bad.

Joe (10:35)

Well, it gets back to your dead center book and our final moment here, Senator, can a dead center candidate survive the primary system to have a successful run at the presidency. Would you try, sir?

Senator Joe Manchin (10:46)

I would have loved to been able to be on the stage, to be able to talk what was normal and common sense to people, how they live their lives, what's important to them and how we treat people around the world and how we have people that, that want the same quality of life, the same economies that we have here in the US that's what you prosper. To be a superpower of the world takes more than being just a super military or a super economy. You have to have super compassion for those least fortunate. And if you don't show that, people won't follow you. We've got to change and the system, the process, whether it's a third candidate, change the process of how we elect. Open up your primaries, let more people. Don't let the Democrat Republican Party control everything because they're screwing it up.

Kaylee (11:24)

You got to love that. Kaylee's still asking you whether you're going to run, right? That's the point. They're still asking. Joe Manchester, that's live in Washington. Thank you, son.

Senator Joe Manchin (11:31)

Thank you, Joe. Good to be with you here. Thank you.

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