Bloomberg Tech Podcast Summary
Episode Title: Oracle to Recreate TikTok’s Algorithm in the US
Date: September 22, 2025
Hosts: Caroline Hyde (NY), Ed Ludlow (SF)
Notable Guests: Kurt Wagner, Brody Ford, Mike Sievert, Srini Gopalan, He Bang (H.E. Band)
Main Theme:
A rich, fast-moving discussion on Oracle's central role in the TikTok algorithm handover and corporate shakeup, T-Mobile’s CEO transition, the ramifications of a $100,000 H1B visa fee, and shifts in the U.S. tech and business landscape.
1. Oracle’s Move to Recreate TikTok’s Algorithm in the US (00:05–08:40)
Key Points:
- Oracle is at the forefront of a deal for a U.S. consortium to take over TikTok's U.S. operations.
- Due to legal restrictions on technology transfer from China, Oracle will license the algorithm from ByteDance temporarily, then "recreate" and retrain a new, U.S.-controlled algorithm.
- The deal is highly complex, unprecedented, and still pending final approvals.
- U.S. investors involved: Oracle, Silver Lake Partners, and Andreessen Horowitz (among others, still in flux).
Notable Quotes:
- Kurt Wagner (00:58):
“Under US law, ByteDance … is not allowed to have any say in the algorithm or the technology of this new U.S. version. And Chinese law says you can't export this valuable technology. So it seems that they figured out some type of workaround where Oracle… will license the algorithm from ByteDance for a short time while they essentially recreate it…” - Kurt Wagner (02:50):
”Just because the President says, hey, we have a deal and it will be signed… until everyone truly signs on the dotted line, we have to assume this is still being worked out in real time."
2. Oracle’s Internal Shakeup: Co-CEOs Take Over (08:40–14:10)
Key Points:
- Safra Katz steps down after a decade, replaced by Clay McGawk and Mike Sicilia as co-CEOs.
- Clay McGawk, leading Oracle’s booming cloud infrastructure, gets a significantly bigger compensation package.
- This mirrors the dynamic of previous leadership (Ellison & Katz): one is the operations/engineer, the other more administrative.
- Oracle’s cloud business becomes even more pivotal after striking not just an OpenAI deal but a rumored $20 billion deal with Meta.
Notable Quotes:
- Brody Ford (09:44):
"They're co-CEOs, they have the same title, but one of them is going to make $150 million more in stock awards. That doesn't exactly sound equal to me." - Brody Ford (11:00):
“She [Safra Katz] was … a little skeptical [of cloud]. She came up in the era where they were selling databases on prem for, you know, margins that are some of the highest you can get…”
3. T-Mobile’s Leadership Succession: Sievert to Gopalan (18:20–28:30)
Key Points:
- Outgoing CEO Mike Sievert chooses to leave amid company strength, handing over to Srini Gopalan, emphasizing a strategy of succession "amid success".
- Gopalan’s vision: accelerate technology-driven transformation (fiber, AI, digital customer experience) and “define the industry”.
- T-Mobile’s innovations: Home 5G broadband category, Starlink satellite partnership (now connecting customers to 600 satellites, ending “dead zones”).
- Fiber will be a major expansion focus. T-Mobile favors partnerships (joint ventures) for local network buildout and aims to scale aggressively.
- T-Mobile is now the fifth-largest ISP in the U.S., with 13 quarters of broadband growth.
Notable Quotes:
- Mike Sievert (19:00): “You should do succession amidst success… Srini is ready. He’s the person to lead us into the future, and the company has put wind in his sails.”
- Srini Gopalan (22:22):
“At T-Mobile, we don’t believe in kind of sitting on our hands…We define the industry, we define how this goes forward.” - Mike Sievert (26:20):
“Our dream when I announced that with Elon back in 2022 was to end dead zones...today, T-Mobile customers can connect to 600 satellites.”
4. The $100,000 H1B Visa Fee—Shock and Fallout (42:30–52:45)
Key Points:
- Trump administration announces a $100,000 H1B visa application fee.
- Major confusion: Initial ambiguity on whether it applies to new or existing visa holders; later clarified as new applicants only.
- Tech companies scramble: Staff overseas rushed to return before fee imposition, some halted travel, mass concern from smaller companies.
- Fee is "not manageable" for startups or small/mid-size firms, threatening U.S. tech competitiveness and innovation.
- Broader impact: Not just tech, but also universities, healthcare, manufacturing.
- Potential for legal challenge given Congressional authority over immigration fees, but Supreme Court precedent may limit immediate injunctions.
- Possibility of exemptions for doctors (national interest).
- Some view the move as negotiating leverage with India rather than a final policy.
Notable Quotes:
- He Bang, Immigration Partner (43:41):
“$100,000 fee for an H1B visa petition is not manageable at all for startups, for small businesses, even for mid sized businesses... any policy that makes it harder for American startups... is going to impact our competitiveness down the line.” - He Bang (46:50):
“There are quite a few checks and balances built into the H1B process as it stands today... I haven't seen any evidence of misuse.” - Cathie Wood, ARK CEO (49:58):
"This is part of President Trump's negotiating process… I think this is a little bit like tariffs… it's going to capture all the headlines… but when all is said and done, we're probably going to loosen up the H1B visa program.”
5. Market and Corporate Insights: Tech, Earnings, Macro (29:00–34:15)
Key Points:
- Equity markets are at record highs; shift toward growth, particularly big tech ("Magnificent 7"), despite reservations about high valuations.
- Oracle’s AI infrastructure deals seen as fueling optimism.
- Financial advisors urge holding big tech but caution against overweighting due to stretched valuations.
Notable Quotes:
- Eric Bailey, Steward Partners (31:00):
“The risk trade is on. Investors are taking risk … growth equity perform extremely well and that’s day to day keeps going higher." - Eric Bailey (33:28):
“I think you hold [the Magnificent 7], but … new money going in? I would be cautious because valuations are so high…”
6. Oura’s Meteoric Rise and Data Privacy Challenges (56:20–1:04:50)
Key Points:
- Oura Ring approaches an $11B valuation, doubles revenue, with rapidly growing user base and a strong focus on operational (not just financial) metrics.
- Expanding product focus: Women's health features like menopause/pregnancy insights, broader moves into metabolic health, sleep, overall wellness.
- Oura is the largest health wearable supplier to the U.S. military; privacy is critically emphasized after social media-driven PR issues involving Palantir integration rumors.
- Oura relocated supply chains (out of China; new U.S. and Mexico factories) in anticipation of tariffs and regulatory pressure.
- H1B exposure seen as minimal due to Finnish roots, but U.S. talent focus is growing.
Notable Quotes:
- Tom Hale, Oura CEO (1:01:45):
"Privacy is a third rail, especially for women. So we took that incredibly seriously. I took to TikTok myself to address our customers directly.” - Tom Hale (1:03:40):
“We were well prepared [for tariffs]. We don’t manufacture in China. In fact, we opened up a factory in the US, in Mexico…”
7. Amazon in Legal Crosshairs for Prime Subscription Practices (1:07:50–1:11:20)
Key Points:
- FTC lawsuit: claims Amazon makes cancellation of Prime subscriptions intentionally difficult.
- Amazon risks billion-dollar fines if found in violation; trial expected to be lengthy.
- More regulatory scrutiny coming for Amazon, including search advertising practices, even under new administration.
Notable Quotes:
- Spencer Soper, Bloomberg (1:09:33):
“Amazon’s looking at potentially fines well into the billions of dollars around this… The FTC is arguing that Amazon just made it complicated and deliberately difficult for people to cancel Prime.”
Timestamps for Major Segments
- Oracle/TikTok Algorithm Deal: 00:05–08:40
- Oracle Co-CEO Transition: 08:40–14:10
- T-Mobile CEO Succession & Strategy: 18:20–28:30
- Markets – Tech and Macro: 29:00–34:15
- $100,000 H1B Visa Fee Fallout: 42:30–52:45
- Oura CEO/Business, Data Privacy: 56:20–1:04:50
- Amazon FTC Lawsuit: 1:07:50–1:11:20
Memorable Moments & Tone
The episode is brisk, urgent, and packed with breaking news and expert analysis, balancing corporate intrigue with broader social and policy implications. The hosts’ tone is probing but conversational, with an undercurrent of awe at the scale and complexity of the deals and policy moves discussed.
- Safra Katz’s cloud pivot reluctance, now utterly upended by Oracle’s ascendance in AI cloud.
- Srini Gopalan’s determination to “define the industry, not just respond to it.”
- Tom Hale’s direct-to-consumer TikTok outreach, addressing privacy issues "in the trenches".