Takedra Malakana (2:58)

I think it's important to interpret that this is an inflection point. Right. Like in 2025, we quadrupled the number of trips that we are providing. So we offered 15 million rides and we have over 20 million lifetime rides. So it was just a really important year. And now that we've launched Miami, that's across six cities, but at that time it was across five cities. And so demonstrating not only that the technology works, that we're able to drive the safety impacts that we've been focused on, you know, with when we were at 127 million miles, we were able to demonstrate a 90% that we had 90% fewer serious injury causing crashes or worse. That's the kind of safety output that drives us. That's our mission, to be the world's most trusted driver. So coming in at this point demonstrates that consumers are adopting it. The safety case is being made and it's just really exciting. Time to join the team.

Ed Ludlow (3:56)

You set the scene for expansion across 20 cities this year. Right. Right now you're doing 400,000 paid rides a week across six cities. It's a greater scale than when you and I talked more than a year ago, which seemed to be to be a time of pace then. What's the biggest challenge of operating a robotaxi service at that new scale that you're developing?

Takedra Malakana (4:19)

I think everything is really exciting right now and there are many, many things to be learned as we go. Right. Like some markets are still not open and they're really important transportation hubs around the world, like New York City.

Ed Ludlow (4:33)

Right.

Takedra Malakana (4:33)

You know, and so we were the first company to receive a testing permit where we had driver supervision of fully autonomous testing in the city. And we believe now with Governor Hochul that we will be able to be the first company to launch in New York City or New York State. But you know, this is going to be a path to actually figuring out the regulatory landscape.

Ed Ludlow (4:55)

There's something there isn't that city versus state versus federal. We will talk about it.

Takedra Malakana (4:59)

Yeah.

Ed Ludlow (5:00)

I got a lot of interest when I said that I was going to be speaking with you. About $16 billion. A lot of money. But actually how will you use it? There's a tension between scaling operations, the fleet. You know, you've got to have more cars, but also a commitment to invest in technology. And I wanted to how far you thought about how Much goes into each of those buckets.

Takedra Malakana (5:21)

Yeah. So first and foremost, when we think about 2026, just the year ahead of us, execution, execution, execution. So scaling across these 20 cities that we're laying the groundwork for continuing to grow our world class team is obviously super important to us. Making sure that we are continuing to cost down our hardware stack and prove out our unit economics while scaling our fleet. And so we have our, you know, fully electric I pace fleet. We are starting to introduce the Ohio vehicles and then you will see the Ioniq 5s come online. And so making sure that we are investing with for the long term for a sustainable business is what we're really.

Ed Ludlow (6:01)

See the Ohio vehicles testing. If I am a user of the service right now, will I soon be able to actually get into an Ohio?

Takedra Malakana (6:10)

You will this year be able to. Right now we've only throughout 2025, in the beginning of this year had employees in three cities.

Ed Ludlow (6:18)

We just had a huge weekend here in the Bay Area, San Francisco, but Santa Clara Super Bowl.

Takedra Malakana (6:23)

Yes.

Ed Ludlow (6:24)

I across social media saw a lot of people reflect on that, their first experience in a robotaxi. Some of them of course with Waymo. Was that a tangible, meaningful moment for the company to town?

Takedra Malakana (6:39)

Yes.

Ed Ludlow (6:40)

What data, what evidence can we, can we point to on how big a weekend.

Takedra Malakana (6:44)

Yes. Super bowl is a reminder for us that Waymo is part of the fabric of the Bay Area. Right. Like people were able to hail rides from sfo, from San Jose Airport, people were able to get to and from the Levi's stadium. You know, we obviously did a lot of fun activations with influencers, but it's just a reminder that people are using the Waymo service in everyday errands, doctor's appointments, you know, getting kids to practice in big life moments, weddings, parents, picking up a child from daycare, having a baby, you know, going to the air, going to the hospital, pregnant, coming home from the hospital with a newborn. And then these large cultural moments. And so we've had a number of them. Obviously we started the month with the Grammys, we had a host of activations there, then the super bowl and then of course we have the All Star weekend coming in Los Angeles. And so we're just finding this intersection of everyday life and then real enthusiasm because a lot of people came to the Bay Area for the super bowl and were not in their city. And it's the thing they had heard from their friends in the area. You have to check out Waymo. And so we saw so many downloads and so many happy riders While they.

Ed Ludlow (8:00)

Were here, Waymo's reputation is growing globally. And we're going to talk about, about the literal expansion of your operations, but with this funding round, you know, it's a who's who of investors now on the cap table. It's a, it's a big raise at a premium valuation. How much of that is sort of setting the pieces in motion to life eventually as a public company? Is that something that you and Dimitri and the rest of the leadership plan for, or is there merit staying as you are now?

Takedra Malakana (8:31)

You know, we are just laser focused on execution, you know, building Waymo to be financially responsible, operationally. Excellent. And then make sure we maintain the safety culture like that's what we're really focused on, having this vote of confidence, as you said, not only from Alphabet, but from our three co leads from this round and from all of the new investors who decided to join our cap table and the existing ones who doubled down on their belief that this is the right opportunity to fund. And so we just feel humbled. But also there's a lot to do and the world is really focused on making sure that we can scale, focusing on our two first international launches, you know, London and Tokyo, and scaling across the United States.

Ed Ludlow (9:15)

Let's talk about the growth. A lot of people just want to understand in some of those cities where people are frustrated because the service doesn't exist, what does it take to launch in a city, to go from mapping that city through to a full paid commercial service?

Takedra Malakana (9:31)

Yeah, if the regulatory climate of a city is welcoming, then if, then we can show up and map and launch in a couple of months like we did in Miami.

Michael McDermott (9:42)

Right.

Takedra Malakana (9:43)

You know, that's a city where, you know, they were welcoming and they were ready and we were ready. And so we showed up, you know, we have a fleet operating partner and we were able to launch quite quickly after we first arrived. I think in a lot of cities, especially cities that are meaningful from a transportation perspective, where we're helping, we're working, engaging with policymakers, you know, we have the burden to demonstrate our safety impact. And so with 127 million miles and 90% fewer injury, serious injury causing crashes or worse, you know, we have to educate them on that kind of impact. 82% fewer airbag deployments. You know, this isn't something that any fleet based business has been able to come in and give policymakers data. So assuming that we can do that and then grow trust, and, you know, we do that by partnering with organizations in markets who have been trying to solve Road safety issues. They've been trying to expand mobility options for residents. And so we partner with them and then obviously we work with law enforcement and first responders to train them on how our technology works.

Ed Ludlow (10:55)

We do not yet have, although there has been progress toward just this week, a federal level framework set of rules. What do you think the direction of travel is with that? And you know, clearly if you had to deal with one set of rules and not a city by city, let alone state by state basis or case, you'd be making a bit more progress, I suppose.

Takedra Malakana (11:18)

Yeah, we think it's really important that there is a federal AV standard. We've been advocating for sort of a safety case based approach because the technologies are different. And we think that the burden should be on companies to demonstrate why you believe your technology is safe enough. We also think there should be transparency requirements. You know, people should have to demonstrate. How many trips are you providing? You know, I don't. Right now, the balance isn't quite there. I mean, some states require a lot of reporting, some don't require as much reporting. I think the United States has an opportunity with this technology to lead globally. And I don't think you can lead globally if it's a framework that's governed by multiple jurisdictions across the states. And it's a way to slow down the adoption of this technology, not only in the US but in other markets.

Ed Ludlow (12:08)

New York City. New York City, not necessarily New York State. A lot of people want to know what's the, the roadblock there, Pardon the, the expression. And what's the timeline? You know, you work closely with the authorities, but that is a big potential market.

Takedra Malakana (12:26)

Yeah, that's a market where, you know, we're just going to have to do the work and demonstrate our safety outcomes and earn the trust and chisel away at it over time.

Ed Ludlow (12:36)

They have the rules for you to follow.

Takedra Malakana (12:38)

They do not have rules that allow the human operator to be removed from the vehicle entirely.

Ed Ludlow (12:44)

And until that changes, and until that changes.

Takedra Malakana (12:46)

But, you know, there is an interest in doing this in the state, even outside of the city. And that gives us an opportunity to grow more fans. And fans actually are calling for this. In cities where our technology can't be deployed, we are seeing organic campaigns spring up saying, I want Waymo in my town. You know, and sometimes it's, you know, parents of children who will never have driver's license saying, like, okay, this is a safer alternative.

Ed Ludlow (13:15)

Right?

Takedra Malakana (13:15)

Let's bring it in and let's give these children independence. And so it's been really exciting for us to see people demanding it and over time that's going to grow.

Ed Ludlow (13:23)

Of those 20 cities that are coming this year, New York City is not one of them Factored in now. That's right, that's Waymo Co CEO to Kedra Malakana. I'm Ed Ludlow and you're listening to a special bonus episode of of Bloomberg Tech. We'll have more on Waymo's future with the company's co CEO right after this.

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Ed Ludlow (16:19)

Thanks for listening to this special edition of Bloomberg Tech. I'm Ed Ludlow. Now here's more of my conversation. Waymo Co CEO Takedra Malikana San Francisco the Bay Area is, is my home. London's where I grew up. And I was studying the map of the boroughs that you proposed to launch in and you correct me if my math is wrong, but just based on those boroughs at launch, this seems to be the biggest citywide deployment from the start that you guys will have done. Is that correct?

Takedra Malakana (16:54)

It possibly it's correct. I mean, we're in the phases of figuring out the specifics around the launch and figuring out the actual framework around the launch. And so I don't want to speak too definitively about what we're going to do, but what you're speaking to is we're not gated by the technology.

Ed Ludlow (17:11)

Right.

Takedra Malakana (17:11)

And we have the appetite to scale and we want to partner and do so safely and we want to earn trust. So that's like there's a lot of levers there that we have to figure out how to strike the right balance and how to make sure that we're introducing it to the community, both to meet the demand and to grow.

Ed Ludlow (17:27)

I asked, because of those 20 cities to come, London is one.

Takedra Malakana (17:30)

Yes.

Ed Ludlow (17:30)

And London is now outside of the European Union, but it's, you know, it's kind of your Europe launch.

Takedra Malakana (17:35)

Yes.

Ed Ludlow (17:36)

What was that experience like within London's regulatory framework? In the UK's regulatory framework there, they've.

Takedra Malakana (17:43)

Been extremely forward leaning and interested in seeing how this technology could actually improve safety on their roadways. Right. And that's where I think, you know, we find a sweet spot when people are less sort of complacent about the status quo. And I think there's a lot of complacency about road deaths, 40,000 or 1.2 million globally. And when there isn't, I think people are actively interested in solutions and then they want to figure out, of course, what are the things they need to.

Ed Ludlow (18:12)

Think through and learn pricing for one, like Londoners take the bus.

Takedra Malakana (18:16)

Yes.

Ed Ludlow (18:17)

Londoners take the tube. Londoners prepared to sort of pay for a robotaxi service that's equivalent to a human driven cab, black cab in London or Uber and Lyft.

Takedra Malakana (18:29)

Yes, I. Yes, people are. There's, you know, obviously before we go in, we do a lot of polling, we meet with a lot of residents as well as advocates and people are. People want safe, private spaces. It adds to their day versus becoming time that they lose in the day. And so it's a. You know, the thing that's been most exciting is once we introduce the Waymo service into a cityscape, people discover things they didn't think they could have. Like that hour a day in the morning, and that by yourself, to get something done, people have just sacrificed it.

Ed Ludlow (19:06)

Yes.

Takedra Malakana (19:06)

And whether that's on transit or whether that's. It doesn't matter. And we're not, you know, people want to take transit. That's great because you can also sit there. Just can't sit there maybe and take a call and quiet. And so this is something that we're hearing from riders all the time. I didn't know that I needed this the way that I needed it.

Ed Ludlow (19:22)

Asia Pacific is also somewhere that is. It varies by country, but robotaxis are embraced. You are looking very closely at Japan.

Takedra Malakana (19:30)

Yes.

Ed Ludlow (19:32)

What do you see in the Japanese market? Of course, you're very closely aligned with Toyota as a partner, almost a national champion for them in the automotive space. But does your hope of launching that go beyond Toyota? Is it enabled by Toyota? And again, we have a lot of viewers in that country who just want to know when.

Takedra Malakana (19:51)

Yes, yes. When we first thought about Tokyo, Japan, we thought about Tokyo.

Ed Ludlow (19:57)

Right.

Takedra Malakana (19:57)

And when we first thought about Tokyo, we decided to partner with Neon Kotsu and Go. And that's because, you know, the cab are such an integral part of life.

Ed Ludlow (20:07)

They're culturally as well.

Takedra Malakana (20:08)

Culturally, exactly. And so what that's allowed us to do is we have a fleet of vehicles there and the drivers of those vehicles are part of that partnership. You know, they're collecting the data for us. And so they're like helping to usher in this change. There will still be cabs for a long time and there will be an introduction of autonomous vehicles. And so finding partners, like you said, national champions who can help us navigate not only the regulatory climate, but who already have that trust of riders and who can help us educate riders that this isn't like something they are not welcoming. It's actually something they're quite excited about. Seeing Tokyo become a city of the.

Ed Ludlow (20:47)

Future from a transport that is a market where the rules exist for you to through partners or otherwise, but to charge a fare and have a real business, even if modest at first.

Takedra Malakana (20:57)

That's exactly right. And of course, it's something we've helped shape.

Ed Ludlow (21:00)

Right.

Takedra Malakana (21:01)

You know, there's most places contemplated drivers around the world. Right. I mean, that's the way laws, whether it's 50 years ago or 100 years ago, I mean, they were sort of written to regulate automobiles and automobiles were presumed to be driven by people. And so most places we have to think through, through what needs to change in the laws. And then if people are willing to work with us on that, then we work with them to change it. And so in Japan, we have a.

Ed Ludlow (21:28)

Path forward around the world, the sort of robotaxi race is, is framed in US companies against Chinese technology companies. Right. I think this is something that Waymo and some of Waymo's executives have been kind of candid about this past week in testimony. How do you see that, that playing out? You, for example, with Toyota, you have a partner who also in common work with Pony as an example. It's something you must be conscious of in markets where you want to expand outside of America in particular.

Takedra Malakana (21:59)

Yes. In, in general, if there are other companies focused on autonomous driving to make roads safer, we think that's positive. Like that is a positive thing. We should have competition around saving lives. And so that's a good thing. I think what we don't spend a lot of time thinking about is how everyone is thinking about how to pursue partnerships. Right now we're just laser focused on our strategy. We're the only company that is offering a 24 by 7 service across six markets in the US with ambitions to be in many more this year and launch internationally. And you know, we've driven over 200, almost 200 million fully autonomous miles and we're driving over 4 million miles per week. And so that's, if you think about it, that's over six human lifetimes every seven days. And so our driver is learning at a rapid pace. And so we don't think there's anyone who's doing anything close to what we're doing. And so for us, it's just staying focused on our own ambitions.

Ed Ludlow (23:05)

Safety. There are still concerns and in January in particular, there's two kind of, again, case studies of regulatory scrutiny. Right. Of two specific incidences. I think it's important for both of them. I take time in putting it to you and explain to you, but in the case of the Santa Monica incident, for example, a Waymo vehicle struck or collided with a Child. But the system detected the child. It breaks sharply and at the point that the impact was made, it was a speed of single digits miles per hour. Blue 6.

Takedra Malakana (23:41)

Yes.

Ed Ludlow (23:41)

It had been traveling at 17. So in that instance, the, the system worked, but a probe was opened. Just would you reflect on. On that? But also, you know, my, my interpretation of what Waymo's publicly state about this is that you actually kind of welcome the opportunities open, open up the system to the regulators, let them look at it.

Takedra Malakana (24:02)

Yes. So first and foremost, this was a child. And we are extremely happy that she walked away from this incident, as you said, because there's, you know, an investigation pending. We thought it was important to become a party to the investigation, and so we're doing that. And as we've already stated, you know, our car was traveling 16 miles per, 17 miles per hour. We did detect her, you know, coming between from behind a tall SUV into the roadway. We hard braked and we made contact and at six miles an hour. And we also determined in our human equivalent model that human would not have been able to perform as our superhuman driver performs. And so this is an example, we believe, of exactly why we do what we do. We want to make roads safer. And we welcome the opportunity to cooperate with NTSB in this investigation.

Ed Ludlow (24:58)

Separately, safety investigators are looking at the issue of how the Waymo interacts with parked school buses. This seems to be sort of a separate technical challenge. What is that about? Why is it that the Waymo system has to, I guess, struggles with. Is the. Is the headline that came out, but with a parked vehicle of that size in a school zone, of course, where you'll have mixed foot traffic of children in particular.

Takedra Malakana (25:27)

Yeah. I think, you know, first and foremost, with safety being our priority, how we perform around school buses and children is a top priority for our company. You know, we've already addressed this situation with software release, which is really important to us. But also we partnered with the Austin Independent School District.

Ed Ludlow (25:47)

Yes.

Takedra Malakana (25:47)

To look at data they have so we can make sure that we are learning from what they have. You know, their data obviously would be more based on human driven vehicles. But still, having that opportunity to learn is really important to us. And then once again, we have agreed with the NTSB to be a party to this investigation because we think it's important for us to understand. For them to understand what we're seeing, because we also have a lot of awareness of. Around the school buses, if we call.

Ed Ludlow (26:16)

That an edge case interaction with the school bus. That software fix that you talked about is It a total fix. In other words, does Waymo believe it's now solved that technical challenge?

Takedra Malakana (26:29)

I don't think we can think of it as a single thing.

Ed Ludlow (26:32)

Okay.

Takedra Malakana (26:34)

And I want to be super respectful of the investigation here and so, so, but I don't think we should think of it as a thing because you know, there are angles, there are times there, there are not all parked. And so I think we should let the investigation play out and, and then. Happy to talk to you afterwards.

Ed Ludlow (26:52)

There was a big sort of technological development which was with, with Genie 3, you know, the use of simulation, how much that kind of accelerated the technology development side of what Waymo is doing of late.

Takedra Malakana (27:07)

I think it, it's really exciting for us and something that we continue to partner with the research teams. But really our acceleration hasn't been dependent on that.

Ed Ludlow (27:20)

Waymo has always talked about safety in the context of redundancy. Right. It's a multi sensor suite around the vehicle. Camera, vision, lidar, radar, Tesla's approach, and they are at much smaller scale, especially in the vehicles that no longer have a safety supervisor is a vision only approach. When you are trying to scale in all of these cities. Is the different technology, are the different technology approaches something that worry you based on your belief of the kind of redundancy that's required?

Takedra Malakana (27:58)

No, it doesn't worry me. We have a lot of conviction about our approach.

Ed Ludlow (28:03)

Right.

Takedra Malakana (28:04)

Our approach is what allowed us in October of 2020 to remove the human driver from behind the wheel. And it's what's allowed us to be the only company to scale to over 400,000 trips per week. If you can see and smell and taste and touch and have all of your senses, why wouldn't you? And especially with a safety critical function, we think it is very important in the early days especially to make sure you're taking in as much data as possible to inform the models and then to achieve the outcomes. And you know, then we can all debate, you know, how you go forward from there. But this has been critical to our approach and it's allowed us to scale and it's allowed us to achieve these safety Results of a 90, 90% fewer serious injury causing crashes. And that is how you evaluate whether or not this approach is working. And I know there's a lot of discussion around costs, right?

Ed Ludlow (29:00)

Especially think about the economics at scale.

Takedra Malakana (29:02)

The economics at scale. And so of course we're laser focused on bringing these costs down. You have to bring the costs down once you achieve the safety because how else do you actually know what the investment model for the business is if you haven't actually achieved the safety, safety bar. And so that's what we are focused on, achieving the safety bar. Now, we can drive the cost down because we know what it takes.

Ed Ludlow (29:22)

So let's end by me asking you this in case I don't speak to you for another year. In a year's time, what are the metrics by which you as a leader in this company will judge success? You know, you plan to launch in 20 cities, but you often point to different safety metrics in the miles driven internally. What are you going to be holding the teams to account on by the.

Takedra Malakana (29:46)

End of 2026, we will be doing over 1 million trips per week and we will be doing that across a host of us paid trips. Paid trips. We only talk about paid trips. And so we will be doing over 1 million paid trips per week by the end of this year.

Ed Ludlow (30:04)

And that's the measurement of success in the near term.

Takedra Malakana (30:06)

It's one of them, I think, do having the safety culture that we've had within the company, it permeates through the data, but it starts with how we are so disciplined about what we do and how we do it. It matters a lot to us. And so making sure that we have that culture intact, I think is the other way that we will continue to measure our success.

Ed Ludlow (30:29)

That's Waymo co CEO to Kedra Malakana. And that does it for this space. Special bonus episode of Bloomberg Tech. Find us on all your favorite podcast platforms and subscribe so you never miss an episode and catch our live show every Monday through Friday at 11am Eastern, 8am Pacific on Bloomberg Television. I'm Ed Ludlow. Thanks for listening and this is Bloomberg.

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