Khamenei Dead After Airstrikes on Iran, Three Service Members Killed in Action

Summary

Bloomberg This Weekend

Episode Summary: "Khamenei Dead After Airstrikes on Iran, Three Service Members Killed in Action"

Date: March 1, 2026
Hosts: David Gura, Christina Ruffini, Lisa Mateo

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Overview of the Episode

This episode delves into the aftermath of unprecedented US-led airstrikes on Iran that resulted in the assassination of Supreme Leader Khamenei, the resulting regional upheaval, and the significant news that three US service members were killed in action with five others wounded. Host David Gura and the team lead a nuanced conversation with policymakers, intelligence committee leaders, foreign affairs experts, and journalists to explore the motives, legality, strategy, and global ramifications of these strikes. The podcast features candid interviews with Senator Mark Warner, Congressman Jason Crow, Congressman Mike McCaul, regional experts, and Bloomberg journalists, highlighting both the immediate fallout and the uncertainties ahead.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Initial Reaction and Casualties (03:32–06:01)

• Senator Mark Warner offers immediate condolences for the US casualties and sharply questions the administration’s goals and rationale for the attack.
• Warner notes conflicting justifications from the White House—initially framed as nuclear containment, then missile threats, and now “regime change.”
• He emphasizes the absence of an imminent threat ("as a member of the Gang of Eight… there was no imminent threat to America" – Warner, 03:32), raising concerns about transparency and Congressional oversight.

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2. The Legality and Process of Going to War (06:01–08:06)

• David Gura asks whether the President’s actions are legal.
• Warner sidesteps the legal specifics but strongly asserts a constitutional process was ignored (“…the Constitution is clear that when you go to war, the President has to come before Congress… None of that took place as he chose to start this war Friday night.” – Warner, 06:13).
• Points raised about the lack of Congressional debate, insufficient coalition-building, and historic parallels with prior Middle East wars.

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3. Decision Process and the Uncertain “Day After” (08:06–11:07)

• Joe Weisenthal probes on briefings given to top lawmakers ahead of the attack.
• Warner describes a lack of clarity even within the administration regarding the trajectory or aftermath (“…there were clear questions raised by many about, well, what happens the day after, the week after, the month after. I never got an answer.” – Warner, 08:54).
• Exposes gaps in US intelligence regarding Iran’s internal dynamics and opposition.

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4. Risks of Regime Change and Historical Parallels (11:07–13:13)

• Comparison with Venezuela, warning that Iran’s opposition is fragmented and a “vacuum” could breed greater instability or harder-line rule.
• Warner expresses grave concern about escalation and obligations if Iranian civilians respond to US calls for uprising and are crushed (“…what obligations does America hold to those Iranians who are responding to the President's call?” – Warner, 11:51).

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5. Congressional Accountability and War Powers (15:28–18:41)

• Rep. Jason Crow criticizes the White House for lack of transparency and urges Congressional engagement, referencing the lessons of Iraq and Afghanistan.
• Calls for a War Powers vote to force accountability (“…Congress has all sorts of power if it is willing to use it…The problem is…its unwillingness to use it, which is not just our responsibility, but it’s actually our duty.” – Crow, 17:02).

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6. Political Repercussions and Public Sentiment (19:41–21:34)

• The episode discusses potential electoral blowback for President Trump, with Crow noting both parties are increasingly wary of “endless wars.”
• Crow highlights how Trump’s campaign promises of restraint have given way to widespread and costly interventions (“…He campaigned to end these wars…Now that he’s in power, he's just perpetuating the same thing. Right. Seven countries bombed in the first year alone…” – Crow, 20:06).

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7. Foreign Affairs Perspective & Strategic Vacuum (23:02–28:07)

• Rep. Mike McCaul describes the decapitation strike as a “significant event”, claiming Iran is now isolated and leaderless.
• McCaul contends the opportunity exists for Iranians to “take back their country,” while also emphasizing the crucial difference from Iraq/Afghanistan: “Iran is all alone now and there's no one there to save them. And their leadership is completely decapitated such that there’s no serious governance that can take place.” – McCaul, 23:47

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8. US and Israeli Roles, Next Steps, and the War Powers Act (28:29–30:20)

• McCaul foresees Israel, not the US, leading any possible on-the-ground operation, with US involvement remaining at arm’s length.
• He highlights the need for Congressional authorization within 60 days per the War Powers Act, pending upcoming classified briefings.

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9. Expert Analysis: Iranian Protest Dynamics and Uncertain Leadership (32:23–35:55)

• Gar Shomali (Atlantic Council / Columbia University) outlines three critical factors to watch:
  • Growth and direction of protests
  • IRGC cohesion and minor defections
  • Economic implosion as a driver of instability
• Discusses limitations in understanding popular sentiment, with internet blackouts and exiled opposition figures (notably the Shah’s son) surfacing but lacking unified domestic backing.

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10. President’s Strategy and International Order (35:55–41:51)

• Conversation with Bloomberg correspondents and experts examines:
  • Ambiguity of US objectives post-strike (“I don't have the answer to that because I'm not sure that he does.” – Crow, 36:15)
  • Contrasts with the Venezuela playbook
  • The crumbling of traditional international order and the US’s unilateral approach
  • Trump’s paradoxical mix of disdain for multilateralism paired with a pursuit of validation (“He is somebody who is absolutely taking control of the international order and reframing the United States and the world in his vision.” – Crow, 41:20)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the strike’s fallout:
  “Let me acknowledge the fact that the Iranian leadership, the Supreme Leader’s taken out. I mean, that is good news. I mean, this regime is awful. But ... we don’t have great visibility about who or what comes next.”
  — Senator Mark Warner (03:32)

• On constitutional war powers:
  “...before a president chooses to go to war, you got to get a declaration. You got to make the case to the American people. You've got to ask Congress. None of that took place as he chose to start this war Friday night.”
  — Senator Mark Warner (06:13)

• On military interventions and public trust:
  “We won every single battle in the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. We didn’t lose a single engagement, a single battle. We won all of them, but we lost the wars. In the end, it’s because we didn’t have a strategy. We didn’t articulate what our interests were and what we were doing.”
  — Rep. Jason Crow (20:06)

• On regional and global realignment:
  “The people of Iran now have a chance for freedom and a chance to take back their country. ... Since 1979, we've seen what Iran has done as the largest state sponsor of terror. ... They also send drones to kill Ukrainians. They also fueled China's imperial war machine. ... Where is China and Russia? They're nowhere to be found.”
  — Rep. Mike McCaul (23:47)

• On the fragility of international norms:
  “Where is the international world order going? ... those rules are not being respected by anybody. And so that’s crumbling. ... you’re seeing the United States taking matters into their own hands because that system is not working.”
  — Gar Shomali (38:37)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• 03:32 — Senator Mark Warner on the consequences and questions surrounding the initial strikes
• 06:13 — Debate over legality and constitutional process for engaging in war
• 08:54 — Lack of clarity on “day after” scenarios post-strike
• 11:51 — The moral and strategic quandary of inciting and supporting Iranian uprisings
• 15:28 — Rep. Jason Crow on Congressional accountability and war powers
• 19:41 — Discussion on anticipated political impacts for President Trump
• 23:47 — Rep. Mike McCaul on historical shifts and the new regional landscape
• 28:29 — War Powers Act procedural details and Congressional intent
• 32:23 — Regional expert Gar Shomali on protest dynamics, IRGC tensions, and economic drivers
• 36:15 — White House uncertainty on long-term strategy
• 38:37 — Assessment of the international order’s efficacy and future

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Podcast Tone

The episode balances sober analysis, urgency, and historical perspective. Lawmakers and journalists speak candidly, often with frustration or concern: the tone is serious, at times critical, with calls for greater accountability and transparency. The guest experts provide granular, region-focused insight, and the overall tenor is one of caution and vigilance amid rapid global developments.

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Takeaways for Listeners

• The US strike killing Khamenei has triggered both immediate casualties and deep strategic questions.
• Lawmakers express grave doubts about the administration’s planning, motives, and long-term vision.
• Consensus builds across party lines in Congress about regaining war powers and reasserting constitutional checks and balances.
• Both the internal situation in Iran and the global reaction are fraught with uncertainties: fractured opposition, economic crisis, unpredictable foreign policy shifts, and doubts around international institutions.
• The United States’ unilateral approach has created new alliances and isolation, with future risks both domestically and abroad.

Listeners come away with a detailed, critical understanding of a transformative moment in US-Iran relations, rich in context, firsthand political insight, and regional expertise—essential context for making sense of fast-moving global news.

Transcript

[Alec Baldwin]

Hey, it's Alec Baldwin. This season on my podcast here's the Thing, I talked to composer Marc Shaiman.

[Joe Weisenthal]

It's about the hang. It's the pleasure of hanging out with the people that you're with. You know, Rob and I was always a great hang.

[Alec Baldwin]

And journalist Chris Whipple.

[Senator Mark Warner]

Every White House staffer, they work in a bubble called the West Wing. And it's exponentially more so in the Trump White House.

[Alec Baldwin]

Listen to the new season of here's the thing on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts.

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This is Special Agent Riegel, Special Agent Bradley Hall. The time is approximately 11:15am about to start consensual telephone call with Dr. Daiwa Zhang.

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China's Ministry of State Security is one of the most mysterious and powerful spy agencies in the world.

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But in 2017, the FBI got inside.

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Wait.

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I'd never seen that much evidence in my entire career, and I don't think

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we'll ever see that much evidence again.

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I now have several terabytes of an MSS officer, no doubt, no question of his life. And that's a unicorn. This is a story of the inner workings of the MSS and how one

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man's ambition and mistakes opened its vault of secrets. Listen to the Six Bureau from Bloomberg Podcasts starting on February 13th on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

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Try something new. But what's the first step? The University of Cincinnati has flexible online

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So take the first step. You'll be glad you did at UC wecu. Succeeding Visit WECU UC Edu to Take the first Step.

[David Gura]

Bloomberg Audio Studios Podcasts Radio News welcome to the Bloomberg this Weekend podcast with

[Gar Shomali]

David Gura, Christina Raffini and Lisa Mateo.

[David Gura]

Thanks for joining us for today's selection of conversations from the show.

[Joe Weisenthal]

You can listen to our favorite discussions right here on the podcast, but also make sure to join us live every Saturday and Sunday morning starting at 7am Eastern.

[Congressman Jason Crow]

We're on Bloomberg Television Radio and the

[Gar Shomali]

Bloomberg Business App, bringing you unique takes

[Joe Weisenthal]

and in depth interviews on news, politics, lifestyle and culture. Over the course of these last two days, we've been reporting on these significant strikes on Iran, the fallout from them in the region, and yes, here in the United States. And again, that latest Headline, crossing the Bloomberg Terminal. Three service members killed in action. Five have been wounded. And on that note, I want to bring in Mark Warner, the Senator from Virginia, the ranking member of the Senate Intelligence Committee, who joins us on this Sunday morning. And, sir, I have to start there. We heard the President warn that this could be something that might happen as a result of these strikes. Your reaction to this news on this Sunday, that there have been casualties as a result of these strikes?

[Senator Mark Warner]

I'm heartbroken for the families. You know, I know our military will always perform exquisitely. The President warned there would be these potential for casualties, and this is. But it begs the bigger question. Why did the President choose to start this war and what are its goals? I mean, a week ago, we heard the administration talk about stopping Iran's nuclear program, which, by the way, the President claimed had been obliterated seven months ago. Then we heard the President's people talk about Iran's ballistic missile capability, ability to shoot missiles at our bases or into Israel. And now it's evolved into regime change. So what I know as a member of the Gang of Eight on the Intelligence Committee, that there was no imminent threat to America. So what are his goals? He owes it to not only the families of those three deceased service members. There will be, unfortunately, probably be more. He needs to make the case. When you start a war of choice, why it was so critical and is the goal Iran's nuclear capability is. It's the ballistic missiles. Regime change. And let me acknowledge the fact that the Iranian leadership, the Supreme Leader's taken out. I mean, that is good news. I mean, this regime is awful. But I can tell you from the intelligence standpoint, we don't have great visibility about who or what comes next. So there is a very high probability that you could have even more violent Iranian leadership come in and replace the current leaders. You could have somebody that's even more brutal to the Iranian people. And now that the President has called on the Iranian people to rise up, and if they do rise up and they are suddenly butchered by the Iranian regime, do we owe an obligation to go in on the ground and protect the Iranian people? This is why. This is why our system says before a president chooses to go to war, you got to get a declaration. You got to make the case to the American people. You've got to ask Congress. None of that took place as he chose to start this war Friday night.

[David Gura]

So, Senator Warner, to that point, I mean, we did hear the President use war in his speech, which is a power of Congress, not of The Presidenc, in your opinion, was this an illegal act?

[Senator Mark Warner]

I will allow others to debate legality. What I do know is that the Constitution is clear that when you go to war, the President has to come before Congress. We don't have. We're not in a country where there is a single monarchical leader. We are a democracy with co equal branches of government. And the people's representatives, which are the House and the Senate, need to weigh in, particularly as we now have crossed the line into American casualties. And again, our history of wars in the Middle east, at least in the last 50 years, is not great. And again, the President promised his supporters that he wouldn't get into a bunch of wars. This president has taken eight different military actions in his second term. And ironically as well, just a quick point out that when the Iranian people rose up in early January and there were literally hundreds of thousands on the street, the President said at that point he might want to back those people. But he was unable to because the military assets that should have been in the region were part of the aircraft carrier in particular was off the coast of Venezuela on another one of his military forays. And the European allies that would normally be with us helping put pressure on the Iranian regime were appropriately focused on the President's, I think, crazy folly about trying to take over Greenland. So the idea that America is going into this conflict with potentially only Israel, I know there are some indications of other nations flying, but it sure as heck not the combat, the coalition of the willing that could have been brought to bear if the President had made the case of why now and why this was inevitable.

[Joe Weisenthal]

The now late Supreme Leader warned in the run up to all of this that if there were strikes, there would be a regional war that would develop. You were one of only a handful of lawmakers who have been briefed by this administration. You remember the so called Gang of Eight. You received a briefing, as we understand it, on Tuesday around the State of the Union from the Secretary of State, Marco Rubio. I'm very curious how what you were briefed on, forecasted what has come to pass here in the days that have followed. From what we've seen here, the way that this is widened, the prospects of this lasting not just days, but maybe weeks or longer, was something that the administration seemed to have to have weighed going into that briefing that you had

[David Gura]

a few days and was that discussed in the briefing?

[Senator Mark Warner]

Yeah, I can't go into what was discussed in the briefing. I can say that there were a series of options at that point. The President had not made a decision. I was.

[David Gura]

Do you believe that, sir? Do you believe the President had really not made a decision at that point?

[Senator Mark Warner]

I will accept the word of Secretary Rubio. I was recontacted on Friday. But the idea of what was driving this, was it our timeline? Was it Israel's timeline? You know, I have a lot of questions about. And there were clear questions raised by many about, well, what happens the day after, the week after, the month after. I never got an answer to any of those questions. And quite honestly, I don't believe anyone, even in the administration, knows the answer to what happens next. We do not have that great a visibility into Iran. This is, again, where the Israelis do, but this is where, if we had not burned so many of our relationships with our European allies, who do have a diplomatic presence in Tehran, more people in country, I think we might have had a better visibility about what the opposition looks like. It appears to me that the opposition, while widespread, is not organized in a classic sense. So I'm not sure the President says, rise up and take over. I'm not sure who would rise. The people might rise up, but where is the leadership to take over? When I think the more likely scenario may be that you even get further hardliners that are going to be even more brutal to the Iranian people and may then take their proxies all across the region and strike at American interests. And just to go a little bit even further, you know, we have Keshe Patel at the FBI distracted flying around the country. We have the Director of National Intelligence, Tulsi Gabbard, obsessed about relitigating the 2020 elections. You know, what are we doing to make sure that Iranian proxies potentially in our country or people inspired by Iran or this war aren't going to take actions in the homeland? I hope that was factored in as well.

[Joe Weisenthal]

You bring up Venezuela, and I think a lot of people cautioned us after that effort to remove the President getting Maduro out of Venezuela that it was not a good analogy to look at what might happen in Iran. But there is the kind of similar sense of vacuum here, an unwillingness of the administration, Congress, the country to get involved on the ground in a place like that. We see how that's played out in Venezuela effectively. There's been a shuffle of leadership, but a lot of the structure remains in place. What do you make of the President's entreaty to Iranians that they should kind of make this happen on their own? There have been these. These airstrikes what are going to be or what could be the forcing factors that do lead to some kind of leadership change there, barring having U.S. forces or others there to encourage that, that happening on the ground?

[Senator Mark Warner]

Well, my fear is that the president, you know, because the military executed the Maduro operation so brilliantly and the bombing of the Iranian nuclear facilities was carried off extraordinarily well. Now, it obviously didn't obliterate their program since they were trying to reconstitute, but again, it was done in a relatively painless way. My fear is that the president thought, well, that was easy. Let me do this again in Iran. I think most of the intelligence would overwhelmingly say that will not be as easy in Iran. There's not an organized opposition the way there was in Venezuela, the single strike we was against a single facility back in June when our bombers took off. But the idea of calling on the Iranian people to rise up, if they rise up, and, and they are brutally murdered by the Iranian Revolutionary Guard forces, what obligations does America hold to those Iranians who are responding to the president's call? I don't think. I don't know the answer to that. And I think, again, it's incumbent upon the president to tell the American people.

[Joe Weisenthal]

On this morning, we learned that three service members have been killed in action, five wounded. We have Ursula von der Leyen of the European Commission warning that the risk of further escalation is real. Great to spend some time here with the ranking member of the Senate Intelligence Committee, Senator Mark Warner of Virginia. Thank you very much for your time and for joining us on Bloomberg this weekend. Stay with us for more on Bloomberg this weekend, right after this.

[Alec Baldwin]

Hi, it's Alec Baldwin. This season on my podcast, here's the thing. I'm speaking with more artists, policymakers and performers like composer Marc Shaiman.

[Joe Weisenthal]

Once you've established that you have the talent, it's about the hang. It's the pleasure of hanging out with the people that you're with. You know, Rob and I was always a great hang. We would sit in kibbutz for hours and then eventually get around to the music. That's what I mostly think of when I think of him, the time together.

[Alec Baldwin]

Laughing Lawyer Robbie Kaplan.

[Gar Shomali]

The great gift of being a lawyer

[Joe Weisenthal]

is the ability to actually change things in our society in a way that

[Gar Shomali]

very few people can.

[Joe Weisenthal]

You can really make a difference to causes in the United States if you bring the right case at the right time.

[Alec Baldwin]

Marriage equality, yeah.

[Joe Weisenthal]

Windsor's the perfect example.

[Alec Baldwin]

And journalist Chris Whipple.

[Senator Mark Warner]

Every White House staffer they work in a bubble called the West Wing. And it's exponentially more so in the Trump White House.

[Alec Baldwin]

Listen to the new season of here's the thing on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts,

[Joe Weisenthal]

We're to hear from a pair of lawmakers now members of the House of Representatives. Representative, you might not know this, Christina, born and raised in Colorado. I was born in Boulder. We were insistent we get somebody from the Centennial State here as our guest this hour. Jason Crow, of course, Democratic congressman from Aurora and its surrounding environs, joins us now. He sits on the Armed Services and Intelligence Committees. Congressman Crow, great to have you with us here on this Sunday morning. And I look at the statement that you issued after these strikes became public. You said the administration owes Congress and Americans answers. Have you gotten more here over these last few hours? And we've seen reports this morning of there going to be a wider briefing of lawmakers, including members of your committees, in the hours to come. Can you confirm that? And what are you hoping to hear from this administration?

[Congressman Jason Crow]

Good to join fellow Coloradans. And the answer is we haven't got any answers. And that's a problem, a huge problem for me. This is about accountability, right? We spent over 20 years of war in Iraq and Afghanistan. We spent trillions of taxpayer dollars, thousands of American lives, tens of thousands of others who bear the visible and invisible scars and burdens of those wars. They ended poorly. And that's, I think, because we stopped debating it. We financed it with debt. There weren't votes. There wasn't an accountability loop. And that continues today. You know, we've started that same cycle again of conflict after conflict without real debate and without a real decision by the American people about whether or not this is in their best interest. So we're gonna keep on pushing the Department of Defense and the administration for answers for engagement. My immediate question right now is what are we doing to protect our troops, the tens of thousands of Americans who are serving in that region who are coming under tremendous assault by missiles and drones? And what are we doing to protect that force?

[David Gura]

Congressman, the other what are we doing question I've been getting a lot from folks in the last 24 hours is what is Congress doing? And I know there is an upcoming vote. I know Democrats are trying to move it forward on the War Powers Act. Even if that resolution is upheld, does Congress really realistically have the power to stop this particular president from doing whatever he wants to do militarily?

[Congressman Jason Crow]

We do have the power. The question is, as you point out, are we willing to take it?

[Alec Baldwin]

Right.

[Congressman Jason Crow]

We're going to force a vote on Wednesday so that people have to stand up and let their constituents know where they stand on this issue. You know, thumbs up, thumbs down. Right. So we need to start taking a role, taking names. And that's the beginning of that accountability process that I was talking about. But Congress has all sorts of power if it is willing to use it. Appropriations, polling money, pulling funding, putting guardrails on deployments. Congress actually can do all of those things. The problem is not whether or not it has the power. The problem has been in my time in Congress, its unwillingness to use it, which is not just our responsibility, but it's actually our duty to do that, to take that power back and to put those guardrails in place. So in all of this, the question is not whether or not the Iranian regime was a terror regime. It was awful. All of those things are true. Right. This was a terrible rogue, terrorist supporting regime. It killed American soldiers, destabilized the entire Middle Eastern region. All of those things are true. The question is whether or not this is the right response, whether or not we should be spending tens of billions of US Dollars, whether or not regime change is something we should be engaged in, and whether. And whether it's going to actually turn out better for us in the end.

[Joe Weisenthal]

Earlier this morning we spoke with Eric Wasson, our colleague who covers the Capitol. No doubt he's asked you some pressing questions over the course of your career in Congress. And gazing into his crystal ball, he expressed some. He suggested that perhaps this war resolution isn't going to pass. The Democrats are too divided on this issue. And I'm curious, when you look at your caucus, do you think that it is going to be a piece of legislation that gets the wide majority supportive Democrats in the House?

[Congressman Jason Crow]

I do think we're going to get a lot of support for it. I even think some Republicans are going to vote for it. I don't think we're all that divided on this issue. People have different views on regime change in Iran, but we are pretty united on this issue of Congress retaking its war powers. Because regardless of what you think about any one particular instance, Venezuela, Sudan, Iran, Ukraine, what remains true is that the American people, Americans really want there to be checks and guardrails put in place. They're very tired of no debate, no public discussion, no votes, no accountability on all these conflicts. Right. They actually want us to be thinking about what we're doing long term and whether or not it is in their core interest? Is it making groceries cheaper? Is it protecting them? Is it keeping their families safe? Is it reducing the cost of health care? Is it helping them afford homes? That is the discussion and the debate that has not been happening and that has to happen and that we're going

[David Gura]

to force to pivot to exactly what you were talking about. And that's because we do have a midterm coming up and all politics are local. Do you think this is a liability for the president the longer this conflict continues because he, even in his world there is division about this American expansionism, the Don Row doctrine. Is this something that Democrats are going to hit hard against their Republican opponents coming come the midterms?

[Congressman Jason Crow]

Absolutely. You know, Donald Trump realized something on the campaign trail, something that I know deeply and that is there is a lot of anger and resentment in working class America where I'm from, the people that I grew up with and the people that I served with and I fought with when I went to war in Iraq and Afghanistan three times, people are angry with this lack of accountability by endless conflict and it not delivering for them. So he actually campaigned as an isolationist. He campaigned to end these wars and to end this constant cycle of conflict. And now that he's in power, he's just perpetuating the same thing. Right. Seven countries bombed in the first year alone. Tens of billions of dollars spent on these operations where a lot of Americans are saying, what are we doing? What are we accomplishing here? What is the end game? Right. Because Iraq and Afghanistan was the same thing. We won. Here's an important point. We won every single battle in the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. We didn't lose a single engagement, a single battle. We won all of them, but we lost the wars. In the end, it's because we didn't have a strategy. We didn't articulate what our interests were and what we were doing. And we didn't have an end game. Right. And we're in the same situation here now again, and people are pretty fed up with it. So, yeah, I do believe this is going to blow back on the president and we're going to see who's willing to stand up and try to end the cycle of madness versus versus those who are going to perpetuate it.

[Joe Weisenthal]

Congressman Jason Crow joining us on this Sunday ahead of that briefing he's scheduled to get from the administration and that vote on war powers in the House later this week, Wednesday.

[David Gura]

Stay with us for more on Bloomberg this weekend, right after this.

[Alec Baldwin]

Hi, it's Alec Baldwin. This season on MY Podcast. Here's the thing. I'm speaking with more artists, policymakers, and performers like composer Marc Shaiman.

[Joe Weisenthal]

Once you've established that you have the talent, it's about the hang. It's the pleasure of hanging out with the people that you're with. You know, Rob and I was always a great hang. We would sit in kibbutz for hours and then eventually get around to the music. That's what I mostly think of when I think of him, the time together.

[Alec Baldwin]

Laughing lawyer Robbie Kaplan.

[Gar Shomali]

The great gift of being a lawyer

[Joe Weisenthal]

is the ability to actually change things in our society in a way that

[Gar Shomali]

very few people can.

[Joe Weisenthal]

You can really make a difference to causes in the United States if you bring the right case at the right time.

[Alec Baldwin]

Marriage equality.

[Joe Weisenthal]

Yeah, Windsor's the perfect example.

[Alec Baldwin]

And journalist Chris Whipple.

[Senator Mark Warner]

Every White House staffer, they work in a bubble called the West Wing. And it's exponentially more so in the Trump White House.

[Alec Baldwin]

Listen to the new season of here's the thing on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts.

[David Gura]

We're gonna turn now to the great state of Texas and Representative Mike McCall. He, of course serves on the Foreign affairs and Homeland Security committees and is the Chairman Emeritus of Foreign Affairs. Congressman, thank you so much for joining us. I know you're having a busy day. I believe we are your inaugural Zoom interview on television. We are very, very grateful for that and thank you to those who helped make this happen. But I didn't know if you could hear Congressman Crow, his criticism towards the end. There is that in this campaign there is no strategy and there is no end game. What is the president's strategy in Iran? Do you understand what it is and do you support it?

[Alec Baldwin]

Well, first, it's great to be on your inaugural Sunday show.

[David Gura]

Thank you so much.

[Alec Baldwin]

You know, I think, look, the president's trying to negotiate, just like Maduro. The Iranians are very deceptive. They're not good faith negotiators. I believe in his mind, he knew at the end of the day, couldn't trust them, and he went to plan B. This was what was interesting to me is the targets. It was no longer about eviscerating the nuclear sites, but rather going into regime change. I mean, to see the compound of the Ayatollah just completely blown up. And we know that not only was he taken out his top advisors and the irgc, this was a significant event. And I don't want to diminish the sort of greatness of this moment. Since 1979, there's been a dark veil that descended across the Middle east, and that shroud has now been lifted. And the people of Iran now have a chance for freedom and a chance to take back their country. And since 1979, we've seen what Iran has done as the largest state sponsor of terror. You know, they've had their proxies. And it's not just Israel. Everybody talks all about Israel. They also send drones to kill Ukrainians. They also, they also fueled China's imperial war machine. And you know what's interesting lastly, Christina, is the typical allies here. They have completely turned off the Gulf states from them. I mean, with this miscalculation of hitting not only our military bases, but hotels in the Gulf states surrounding Iran, they are now aligned with the United States and Israel against Iran. And where is China and Russia? They're nowhere to be found. So I, I understand, you know, the veteran standpoint, Iraq, Afghanistan, I understand all that. The difference is Iran is all alone now and there's no one there to save them. And their leadership is completely decapitated such that there's no serious governance that can take place. I do think it's time for the people to rise up. I think the big question for me is, what do we have in place to help these people rise up? What is Israel doing?

[Joe Weisenthal]

Let me go there, if I could, because that's my question of the morning, which is the government may be out. You have this vacuum. How does the US Encourage that to happen here without boots on the ground, which I think, dare I say, you and others in the Congress are probably reluctant to have be the case going forward here. How does the US And Israel encouraged the growth of a new administration, new government in Iran?

[Alec Baldwin]

Barring that, that's a great question. I think it is the question of the hour. I think we got us in trouble in Iraq. If I can go back to Iraq and Afghanistan, we had the chance to kill bin Laden early on and we missed him here. We did. We killed the ayatollah. He is gone. Our presence there evoked the jihadists. So it was our boots on the ground in Iraq and Afghanistan that drew like a magnet, the jihadist to us. We're not going to see that in this case. And I have to think that Israel is probably the one in the best position to effectuate, you know, help with not only communications, but weapons and leadership. And those are the three elements I talk about a lot. I don't know who the next leader of Iran is going to be. I don't see weapons right now, but that's possible in the communications. We got to get Starlink in there. I know they were trying to, but Iran was taking out those, those, you know, those terminals. I think that's going to be a big change when Starlink gets back up and they can communicate amongst themselves. Now, I remember the last strike in the 10 day, or the, you know, 10 day war, whatever it was that, you know, I was surprised at what the presence of the assets Israel had on the ground in Iran to take out these targets. And I think everyone in the intelligence community was equally surprised by their, the presence they had. So I, I do think Israel is probably in the better position if it does need boots on the ground. Certainly Israel's better. I don't see this President putting American boots on the ground.

[David Gura]

Congressman, I want to ask you. There's been some reporting that members of Congress are going to be getting some briefings, maybe as soon as today or tomorrow. I'm wondering if there's anything you can say about that, what you, what briefings or information you've received from the White House so far. And then I also want to ask you about this War Powers Resolution that some of your colleagues are trying to send to the floor and whether or not you'll support it.

[Alec Baldwin]

Sure. So a couple of things. War Powers act has been invoked. This was a, this was a military, the use of our military in the foreign land in a strike situation. So that prong has been fulfilled. Therefore, within 48 hours, a notification has to come to the Congress notifying us of the circumstances, the legal justification and the extent and duration of the conflict. If the conflict exceeds 60 days, it needs authorization from Congress. Now Congress can do that prior, typically it has not in the past. We do have briefings scheduled this week that will be classified briefings and what's called the scif, that's a classified briefing space.

[David Gura]

What information will you be looking for in those briefings? What questions do you have for the administration?

[Alec Baldwin]

I think for me, next steps. Look, this was a once again like Venezuela, masterful military executed plan, flawless. No Americans were killed. What I'm looking for is what's the overall objective moving forward. It's clearly not just taking out military sites now. It's about regime change. And I would like to know what objectives are at hand and what are the next steps in place and how long were all our involvement take place, if I can say. As Chairman of Foreign Affairs Committee, I was trying to update these old AUMFs from the 2001. Yeah. Jason Crowe is part of the the thing, the sticking point, Christina, was I couldn't get the left or the right to agree to add Iran and their proxies onto the 2000.

[David Gura]

Congressman, we got to go. I'm so sorry. Thank you so much for taking the time with us. We really appreciate it.

[Gar Shomali]

Stay with us for more on Bloomberg this weekend, right after this.

[Alec Baldwin]

Hi, it's Alec Baldwin. This season on my podcast, here's the Thing, I'm speaking with more artists, policymakers and performers like composer Marc Shaiman.

[Joe Weisenthal]

Once you've established that you have the talent, it's about the hang. It's the pleasure of hanging out with the people that you're with. You know, Rob and I was always a great hang. We would sit in kibbutz for hours and then eventually get around to the music. That's what I mostly think of when I think of him, the time together.

[Alec Baldwin]

Laughing lawyer Robbie Kaplan.

[Gar Shomali]

The great gift of being a lawyer

[Joe Weisenthal]

is the ability to actually change things in our society in a way that very few people can. You can really make a difference to causes in the United States if you bring the right case at the right time.

[Alec Baldwin]

Marriage equality.

[Joe Weisenthal]

Yeah, Windsor's the perfect example.

[Alec Baldwin]

And journalist Chris Whipple, every White House

[Senator Mark Warner]

staffer, they work in a bubble called the West Wing, and it's exponentially more so in the Trump White House.

[Alec Baldwin]

Listen to the new season of here's the thing on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Joe Weisenthal]

We're talking a lot about politics. Yes, here in the US the fallout from these strikes over the weekend, but politics in the region, in Iran as well. And I want to bring in Somali, formerly of the US Mission to the UN now affiliated with the Atlantic Council and with Columbia University. She's here on set with us along with Joe Matthew, the anchor of Balance of Power, and Jeff Mason, our White House correspondent here at Bloomberg News. Picard, let me turn to you. We've talked a lot about the vacuum that's erupting here. The supreme leader killed in these attacks and what might happen next. The president of the United States encouraging Iranians to step up and take advantage of this opportunity. How are you watching and thinking through what's happening on the ground now and what's going to foment or perhaps lead to some, some major changes here in Iran going forward? Sure.

[Gar Shomali]

Well, there are three things that I'd be looking for. So first is one, for greater protests and are those protests are going to

[Alec Baldwin]

are they going to grow?

[Gar Shomali]

We've seen a lot of Iranians celebrating the streets. You've also seen some Iranians going at the US Embassy and protesting the other way. But when, when it comes to Iran, it's hard to know when they express support for the regime, if they're paid, if they're scared or if you know how genuine it is. So one thing we'll be looking for is protests, celebrations, how big those become. Another thing I'd be looking for is the direction of the irgc. So we're hearing some stories and I don't want to over emphasize these but small stories of low level defections, folks that won't fire on people and such. When you have that it's showing cracks and fissures in the irgc, you want to see more of that to indicate that the regime is going to fall because a dictator is only as strong as a military is loyal. Now there is no real dictator. There is an eye. It's a new named newly named Ayatollah. But that said there's the leadership has been decapitated as Representative McCaul said. So hard to see what that really, what really happens there. So IRGC and then the third and this is a really important one that I don't think receives enough attention except on blue Bloomberg which is the, the economic situation which has been dire, super dire in in Iran. In October one of their biggest banks, bank Ayanda bank collapsed. It's the regime absorbed it into Bank Meli, a state run one of the biggest lenders in Iran. They printed Rials. Inflation skyrocketed. That is what precipitated the protests. And there are about five other banks that are about to face very similar situations. So when you have an implosion like that, it means the regime doesn't have an economic leg to stand on.

[David Gura]

I want to ask you what we know about popular sentiment in Iran. It's obviously not a place that we're going to be getting very accurate or even possible polling. So we have these two camps as you're mentioning. We have people inside Iran who are hemmed in by not being able to speak out openly in the regime. At the moment Internet and phones have been cut. I was talking to a friend. She hasn't talked to her family in 24 hours. She has know if they're in the city, she know they're outside of the city. And you have this very vocal expat community, many of them in the US including the Shah's son who has been making videos and would very much like to sweep back into power. Is that at all a possibility? Is there a Third player in addition to folks inside the regime who would be naming themselves the new leader, former shah's son. Is there a third player in there or is that yet to be determined?

[Gar Shomali]

No, there's yet to be to be determined, I would say so. The Shah's son. I would, I'm personally loathe to, to endorse any one person and, and in particular, the. We're not looking for endorsements here. Right. Or the son of a former monarch too. Right, exactly.

[David Gura]

I mean, this was not a flawless regime and there seems to be a little retrofitting of history going on among his supporters.

[Alec Baldwin]

Right.

[Gar Shomali]

And I could see that, you know, and I met him actually at the Munich Security Conference and he's very well spoken, very smart. His been in the United States since He was literally 17 years old and he seems to have a great vision for how things could unfold now. So, but I can't speak to, I don't know if the majority of the Iranian people support him. We do know that he has some support. He has very strong support outside. He does have some support inside. But that said, he has talked about anyway that he would, if, if he were to the one to try and install a constitutional monarchy and bring in democratic reforms, that he would bring, bring in a very diverse group, you know, representing the diverse elements of Iran. So there's, there's hope there. He has met with the White House several times, but they're also, you can see, very loath to, to endorse any one person in particular.

[Joe Weisenthal]

Jeff Mason, let me ask you about what the President wants to see happen here. I'm going to go out on a limb and bet that he's been scrolling through social media, as we all have, and seen these videos pop up of dubious legitimacy. Who knows if they're real or not. We haven't verified all of them. Some of the protests and celebrations that Hagar was talking about just a moment ago, what does he want exactly? What does he want this to lead to in Iran?

[Congressman Jason Crow]

I don't have the answer to that because I'm not sure that he does.

[David Gura]

I was going to say, does he have the answer to that?

[Congressman Jason Crow]

Exactly. I think that, I mean, it's a good question. He indicated in one of the interviews

[Joe Weisenthal]

that he did that the US could

[Congressman Jason Crow]

sort of sweep in or the US

[Joe Weisenthal]

could wait and watch how things happen

[Congressman Jason Crow]

and come back again in three years.

[Joe Weisenthal]

I think he said if Iran were

[Congressman Jason Crow]

to pursue nuclear weapons again. So I think, I think it's an ambiguous answer. I think it's also interesting to compare what happened now in Iran versus what the US did in Venezuela, taking out the leader and then really having what seems so far to be a pretty decent relationship with his successor, despite the

[Joe Weisenthal]

fact that they went in and took out Maduro, which of course the Maduro

[Congressman Jason Crow]

regime and the government there was not happy about. So big contrast there, but also big question marks in terms of what does happen next and what implications does that have for the country, for the region and for President Trump.

[David Gura]

Joe? Matthew, we had John Bolton on the show yesterday and he said this is the most consequential decision of President Trump's presidency.

[Joe Weisenthal]

Yeah.

[David Gura]

Do you agree with that?

[Joe Weisenthal]

Well, yes, we'll see how that goes in the next couple of weeks. I mean, I guess there could be a Venezuela version of this, but that seems to be pretty unlikely even. And if everybody packed up their toys and went home right now, remember, the president a couple of weeks ago is really interesting. Following the capture of Maduro and the questions about, well, why, why Del C. Rodriguez. And he point to the deep vacation of Iraq. This is something I'd love to know who it was he was talking to the night before when that was implanted in his brain, because that, that was the approach there. And I wonder how that will inform what's about to happen next in Tehran.

[David Gura]

Can you explain that to those of us who may not be completely familiar with the de baathification? Is the argument there that they did

[Joe Weisenthal]

it wrong and this is, yes, by removing everybody that made our situation in Iraq worse. Why don't we keep the people who are there who have institutional knowledge and maybe we can have a relationship with them, but to duplicate that in Iran might be frankly impossible. Let me draw on your past experience at the UN at the US Mission to the UN and we did see the Iranians call for a meeting of the Security Council yesterday. That came to pass. We heard from Mike Waltz, the current US Ambassador to the UN making the case they're in that body for what's happened here. How do you think about the role of foreign leaders and international diplomats at this moment in time, as all of this is unfolding and our focus is so squarely on, because of the immediate danger of it, the strikes that we're seeing taking place yesterday and continuing today?

[Gar Shomali]

Well, David, you're asking me at a unique moment because on one hand I feel we've never, we've never seen the UN Be more feckless. The Iranian ambassador went to the UN Security Council blatantly lied through his teeth as they, as the regime often does. You saw the Secretary general, Antonio Guterres, take a few hours, it took him a few hours to come out and condemn these strikes, whereas it took him over a week to come out and condemn the regime's mass force against their own people. And so they're not exactly looking very credible at the moment. You also had, as soon as these strikes started, you had European leaders that came out obviously against this, and, and they've been largely ignored, ignored and even made fun of, certainly on the Internet, but the administration as well. And so what you're seeing there, that's really all a symptom of a larger situation, of this. Where is the international world order going? It's, you know, and I don't want to get too nerdy here, but those rules are not being respected by anybody. And so that's crumbling. You're seeing leaders try and want to exercise, exercise some kind of influence and frustrated that they can't. And so a lot of these examples, Venezuela, Iran, you're seeing the United States taking matters into their own hands because that system is not working. And so when you see these other, more middle powers, if you can call them, they are feeling irrelevant, and so they're trying. And what you might see is that they later might unite and carry forward other practices of the international world order. But in the meantime, it's not, it's not going to weigh heavily. Where I would keep my eye on is the Gulf, because the, the regime is making a huge mistake, a super dumb strategy to be striking countries in the Gulf, countries that actually implored the United States not to pursue strikes. And that's only going to pivot the gulf even further to double down on the United States.

[David Gura]

First of all, this is a safe space for nerdy, so never apologize for that. But I think you do make a good point, and that's about the international world order, something that has almost been President Trump's nemesis for as long as he's been in office. And now we see him trying to build almost a parallel structure to the United nations with this peace.

[Joe Weisenthal]

Board of Peace.

[David Gura]

Board of peace. Thank you. It's so basic, I can't remember the name of it. Jeff, the odd thing about this is at the same time, he abhors some of these multilateral organizations. We've seen the US Pull out of the World Health Organization. He almost never has anything necessarily about the United Nations. Why does the president still seem to want some form of legitimacy from the international community? Things like the Nobel Peace Prize, a good speaking slot, a seat at the table Talk to us about that balance.

[Congressman Jason Crow]

Well, I mean, President Trump is someone

[Joe Weisenthal]

going back to his real estate days

[Congressman Jason Crow]

in New York who likes to have validation. And I think that that applies to whether he's working on his business career,

[Joe Weisenthal]

working in his political career career.

[Congressman Jason Crow]

That said, the sort of Jekyll and Hyde aspect of that is he's not someone who waits for permission. He is somebody who is absolutely taking control of the international order and reframing the United States and the world in his vision. And that is exemplified by this attack. It's exemplified by how he's dealt with tariffs in terms of the economic world order. It's exemplified by how he's dealing with

[Joe Weisenthal]

universities, law firms, the media on a domestic side in the United States. So he does all of that.

[Congressman Jason Crow]

But you're not wrong that he also wants to be patted on the back.

[Joe Weisenthal]

And that's just kind of his mo.

[David Gura]

Joey, got about a minute left.

[Joe Weisenthal]

Yeah, it's just it's an ironic sort of split screen that he talks about how many wars he has stopped when you've got Congressman Crow on the air counting how many countries he has seven missiles. I'm not sure that many people are keeping score in that regard. But it is pretty remarkable the extent to which hemispheric influence, and now I guess worldwide influence is awfully important to this president who came into office elected on three big things, right, the economy and affordability. He's got an issue there, immigration, where we're running into issues. And I'll remind everybody that we have a partial government shutdown still underway. And then it was no new wars. Joe, of course, the anchor balance of power here on Bloomberg Television and radio, Jeff Mason, our White House correspondent, with us here in New York this weekend, which is a treat. Gar Shomali, thank you very much for coming in. She's affiliated with the Atlantic Council with Columbia University, of course, before that was at the US Mission to the United Nations.

[David Gura]

Thank you very much. Thanks for joining us on today's Bloomberg this Weekend podcast. Don't forget to tune in live for the show every Saturday and Sunday morning starting at 7am Eastern.

[Joe Weisenthal]

We're on Bloomberg Television, Radio and the Bloomberg Business app, bringing you unique takes and in depth interviews on news, politics, lifestyle and culture.

[Alec Baldwin]

Hey, it's Alec Baldwin. This season on my podcast, here's the thing. I talked to composer Mark Shaiman.

[Joe Weisenthal]

It's about the hang. It's the pleasure of hanging out with the people that you're with. You know, Rob and I was always

[Alec Baldwin]

a great hang and journalist Chris Whipple.

[Senator Mark Warner]

Every White House staffer, they work in a bubble called the West Wing, and it's exponentially more so in the Trump White House.

[Alec Baldwin]

Listen to the new season of here's the thing on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts.