Boiling Point Podcast: "California’s Shapeshifting Coastline"

Host: Sammy Roth
Guest: Rosanna Shaw, Environmental Journalist and Author
Release Date: January 30, 2025

Introduction

In this compelling episode of Boiling Point, hosted by Sammy Roth, the focus centers on the dynamic challenges posed by sea level rise along California's iconic coastline. Through an in-depth conversation with Rosanna Shaw, an esteemed environmental journalist and author of the acclaimed book "California against the Sea: Visions for Our Vanishing Coastline," the podcast delves into the multifaceted aspects of climate adaptation, community engagement, and the pressing need for sustainable solutions.

Setting the Stage: The Reality of Rising Seas

The episode opens with a reflection on the evolving perception of climate change's impacts. Previously associated mainly with melting ice sheets and polar bears, the focus has shifted to more immediate and destructive effects such as wildfires, droughts, and intensified storms. Sammy Roth emphasizes the urgency of sea level rise, highlighting that even an 8-inch increase in the Pacific Ocean over a century significantly amplifies the potential damage from subsequent storms and high tides.

"Rising seas are a slow moving disaster... for every inch the Pacific Ocean rises, there is much greater potential for damage during the next storm, the next flood, the next high tide." [00:22]

Conversation with Rosanna Shaw

Rosanna's Journey and Expertise

Rosanna Shaw brings over a decade of experience reporting on climate and energy in California and the American West. Her extensive coverage spans from solar farms and coal-fired plants to wind turbines and coastal wetlands. In the podcast, Rosanna shares her passion for uncovering stories that challenge public officials and energy companies to adopt better practices.

"Every time I'm out on the beach and it's like, yeah, I have a great job, I get to go to the beach a lot. ... I have not lost my sense of wonder every time I go out there." [06:33]

"California against the Sea": Reception and Impact

Rosanna discusses the overwhelming positive response to her book, which won the 2024 PEN EO Wilson Literary Science Writing Award and a gold medal from the California Book Award. She attributes this reaction to the public's desire to engage in conversations about climate change and their need for accessible narratives that connect scientific data with personal and community experiences.

"There are just so many people out there who have been wanting to have this conversation about climate change... but they just didn't quite know where to start." [08:01]

Engaging Communities and Overcoming Denial

A significant portion of the discussion revolves around the challenges of prioritizing sea level rise amid other pressing issues like drought, wildfires, housing, and homelessness. Rosanna emphasizes the interconnectedness of these issues and the importance of framing climate change as a multifaceted problem that affects every aspect of life.

"The debate in California is not whether or not climate change is real, it's how much time we have." [10:07]

Rosanna also highlights that climate denial is less prevalent in coastal communities, where the tangible effects of sea level rise are more apparent. She underscores the necessity of recognizing shared values and fostering trust to bridge divides between different community members.

"Everyone cares. And I think kind of getting to that point of realizing that a community is a community for all the different types of people who live there... is really, really important." [18:07]

The Role of Emotions in Climate Conversations

Drawing inspiration from Naomi Klein, Rosanna discusses the importance of addressing emotions in climate change dialogues. She believes that acknowledging people's feelings—whether fear, anger, or concern—is crucial for building meaningful and productive conversations that can lead to collective action.

"Conspiracy theorists get the facts wrong and the emotions right... recognizing sometimes we need to start the conversation with the emotions." [18:07]

Compromise and Trust in Policy-Making

Rosanna explores the complexities of political polarization and the challenges it poses to climate policy-making. She advocates for a reframing of adaptation conversations, focusing not just on what needs to be sacrificed but also on what communities can build and achieve together.

"Can we frame this conversation instead as an opportunity to think about what it is that we can build towards?" [22:53]

She also shares insights from her interactions with coastal planners, reflecting on the parallels between journalism and urban planning in terms of building trust and ensuring that all voices are heard and valued.

"Planning moves at the speed of trust. And I think that trust building takes time." [25:29]

Documentary on Ocean Pollution: Expanding the Narrative

Towards the end of the episode, Rosanna introduces her documentary project, which investigates the historical and ongoing pollution of Southern California's oceans. The documentary uncovers the legacy of toxic waste disposal and its long-term impacts on marine ecosystems, further illustrating the intricate relationship between human activity and environmental degradation.

"I made a feature-length documentary that I also co-directed and produced for the LA Times... we'll be playing in California for the very first time next weekend at the Santa Barbara International Film Festival." [38:22]

Conclusion: A Call to Action and Hope

In wrapping up, Sammy Roth reflects on the broader implications of Rosanna's work, emphasizing the need for collective action and the establishment of common ground across political and ideological lines. He expresses hope that through continued dialogue and shared commitment, sustainable and effective climate solutions can be achieved.

"No one wants to see their children hurt. No one wants to see their children unhealthy. And those are all common values, for sure." [20:05]

Rosanna echoes this sentiment, advocating for expanded engagement and the inclusion of diverse perspectives in climate conversations. She stresses that empowering more people to participate is essential for developing comprehensive and resilient strategies to combat sea level rise and other climate challenges.

"So I think step one is to get more people engaged in this conversation and to expand who might think they belong to this conversation." [35:35]

Final Thoughts

"California’s Shapeshifting Coastline" serves as a poignant reminder of the urgent need for climate adaptation and the importance of community-driven solutions. Through Rosanna Shaw's insightful analysis and personal narratives, the episode underscores the resilience required to navigate the ever-evolving landscapes shaped by climate change.

For those interested in exploring these critical issues further, Rosanna Shaw's documentary offers an in-depth look at the historical and present-day challenges facing California's oceans, promising to enrich the dialogue begun in this episode.

Notable Quotes:

• Sea Level Impact: “Rising seas are a slow moving disaster... for every inch the Pacific Ocean rises, there is much greater potential for damage during the next storm, the next flood, the next high tide.” [00:22] — Sammy Roth

• Sense of Wonder: “I have not lost my sense of wonder every time I go out there.” [06:33] — Rosanna Shaw

• Public Engagement: “There are just so many people out there who have been wanting to have this conversation about climate change... but they just didn't quite know where to start.” [08:01] — Rosanna Shaw

• Emotion in Dialogue: “Conspiracy theorists get the facts wrong and the emotions right... recognizing sometimes we need to start the conversation with the emotions.” [18:07] — Rosanna Shaw

• Common Values: “No one wants to see their children hurt. No one wants to see their children unhealthy. And those are all common values, for sure.” [20:05] — Sammy Roth

• Engagement Expansion: “So I think step one is to get more people engaged in this conversation and to expand who might think they belong to this conversation.” [35:35] — Rosanna Shaw

Stay Connected:
For more insights on climate challenges and solutions, tune in to Boiling Point every Thursday, hosted by Sammy Roth. Explore Rosanna Shaw's groundbreaking work in her book and upcoming documentary to deepen your understanding of California's coastline and the broader implications of climate adaptation.