Boiling Point Podcast Summary: "Drill, Baby, Drill…Again"

Release Date: January 23, 2025

Host: Sammy Roth, Climate Columnist for the Los Angeles Times
Guest: Ann Carlson, Environmental Law Professor at UCLA and Faculty Director of UCLA's Ammett Institute on Climate Change, Law and the Environment

Introduction

In the January 23, 2025 episode of Boiling Point, Sammy Roth delves into the immediate and long-term impacts of President Donald Trump's second inauguration on climate change and clean energy policies in the United States. Featuring an in-depth conversation with UCLA's Ann Carlson, the episode explores the reversal of previous environmental actions, the implications for state and local initiatives, and the broader global context of climate leadership.

Trump Administration's Climate Policies

Shortly after his second inauguration, President Trump took swift actions to dismantle the Biden administration's climate initiatives. Within hours, Trump signed executive orders that:

• Reversed over a dozen environmental actions taken by President Biden.
• Paused new wind energy development on federal lands and waters.
• Initiated the withdrawal from the International Paris Climate Agreement.
• Declared a national energy emergency, aiming to fulfill his campaign promise to "drill, baby, drill".

Notable Quote:

“With my actions today, we will end the Green New Deal and revoke the electric vehicle mandate, saving our auto industry and keeping my sacred pledge to our great American auto workers.”
— President Donald Trump [00:59]

Sammy Roth highlights the misinformation in Trump's statements, clarifying that there was no existing electric vehicle mandate under Biden, but rather federal tax credits aimed at combating the climate crisis driven by oil and gas consumption.

Impact on Key Regulations

1. Clean Car Rule

The Clean Car Rule, aimed at reducing emissions from passenger vehicles by mandating zero-emission vehicles by 2035, faces significant challenges under the Trump administration.

Discussion Highlights:

• California's Leadership: California has been a frontrunner in setting stringent emissions standards. However, Trump has signaled intentions to revoke EPA waivers that allow California to implement these standards independently.

• Legal Challenges: Ann Carlson explains the complexities surrounding the Clean Car Rule, emphasizing that it's not only about reducing carbon emissions but also about addressing conventional pollution that contributes to smog. The rule is mandated by federal law, posing legal difficulties for the administration's attempts to dismantle it.

Notable Quotes:

“The Paris Agreement would not have occurred but for the United States leadership. And we're withdrawing from the Paris Agreement. That is a big blow...”
— Ann Carlson [07:47]

“It's going to be really weird for the Trump administration to try to say, oh, you don't need this rule, but by the way, you're violating federal standards.”
— Ann Carlson [15:37]

2. Wind Energy Development

Trump's executive order to halt new leasing and permitting for wind farms on federal lands and waters poses a significant setback for renewable energy expansion, especially offshore wind projects.

Discussion Highlights:

• Federal Authority: The administration leverages its authority to impede wind energy projects, disrupting the growth of this renewable sector.

• Impact on Offshore Wind: With offshore wind projects dependent on federal permits, Trump's actions could lead to substantial delays and reduced investments in this area.

Notable Quotes:

“He's certainly trying. I think he's going to succeed in halting a lot of these projects. The executive branch has a lot of authority to do that.”
— Ann Carlson [16:32]

“It's going to cause havoc in the wind energy market, particularly for offshore wind.”
— Ann Carlson [16:32]

Role of the Inflation Reduction Act

Despite the Trump administration's efforts to roll back climate initiatives, the Inflation Reduction Act (IRA) remains a robust pillar supporting clean energy and technological innovation.

Discussion Highlights:

• Tax Incentives and Subsidies: The IRA provides extensive tax credits and subsidies that are difficult to repeal through executive orders.

• Obligated Funds: Many funds under the IRA are already obligated, limiting the administration's ability to halt their distribution effectively.

• Political Dynamics: Investments made in both liberal and red states complicate the administration's attempts to undermine the IRA, as many projects are located in politically diverse regions.

Notable Quotes:

“The Inflation Reduction Act, it contains all kinds of tax incentives and Subsidies to develop clean energy across the economy. And that was passed by Congress.”
— Ann Carlson [06:50]

“There are complicated politics here, because it isn't just the case that energy developers are supporters of liberal Democrats.”
— Ann Carlson [18:33]

State and Local Responses

California, alongside a dozen other states, continues to spearhead climate action despite federal rollbacks. These states leverage their own regulatory powers to maintain and even strengthen climate initiatives.

Discussion Highlights:

• Renewable Portfolio Standards: States like California set ambitious targets for clean energy adoption, requiring utilities to source a significant portion of their electricity from renewable sources.

• Vehicle Emissions: States opt into California’s stricter vehicle emissions standards, pushing towards zero-emission fleets by 2035.

• Legislative Actions: Governor Gavin Newsom of California has pledged to replace federal tax incentives for electric vehicles with state-level initiatives if necessary.

Notable Quotes:

“The single biggest thing we can do is pass laws and regulations to attack climate change.”
— Ann Carlson [32:49]

“California had a strong presence at the international climate talks even as the United States was backing out of them.”
— Ann Carlson [22:56]

Global Implications: U.S., China, India

The discussion extends beyond national borders, analyzing how U.S. policy shifts influence global climate leadership, particularly in relation to China and India.

Discussion Highlights:

• Technological Innovation: The U.S. risks losing its technological edge in clean energy to China, which is heavily investing in both renewable technologies and coal, creating a dual impact.

• Emission Trends: While the U.S. continues to strive for emissions reductions, China's and India’s ongoing reliance on coal poses challenges to global climate goals.

• Clean Energy Dominance: Advancements in electric vehicles and renewable energy within China could reshape global markets, offering both opportunities and competitive pressures for the U.S.

Notable Quotes:

“It's a shame for the United States to back out of the innovation game.”
— Ann Carlson [28:13]

“We have two trends, one very negative and one very positive. And whether the positive can turn the very negative trend around is something that is going to take several decades for us to see.”
— Ann Carlson [27:10]

Energy Emergency Declaration

Trump's declaration of a national energy emergency raises questions about its practical implications and legality.

Discussion Highlights:

• Definition of Energy: The executive order defines energy narrowly, excluding solar and wind, which may limit its scope and effectiveness.

• Symbolic Gesture: Carlson views the declaration as largely symbolic, given current energy market conditions like record-low gas prices and U.S. energy independence.

Notable Quotes:

“It's odd symbolism at a time when gas prices are actually at close to record lows and the United States is energy independent.”
— Ann Carlson [31:19]

Call to Action

Concluding the episode, Ann Carlson urges listeners to engage in both personal and political actions to sustain climate progress.

Key Recommendations:

• Advocacy: Support and advocate for climate policies at local and state levels.

• Personal Responsibility: Invest in low or zero-emission vehicles, reduce water and energy usage.

• Political Engagement: Communicate with Congress members, especially those in swing districts, to express the importance of the Inflation Reduction Act and climate action.

Notable Quotes:

“We need to make our politicians understand that we care about the climate and we want action and leadership on it.”
— Ann Carlson [34:01]

Conclusion

The episode of Boiling Point underscores the precarious state of U.S. climate policy under the Trump administration. Despite federal setbacks, state and local initiatives, coupled with the resilience of the Inflation Reduction Act, offer pathways to continued progress. The global landscape remains complex, with significant contributions from major emitters like China and India shaping the future of climate action. Carlson emphasizes the critical role of innovation and advocacy in maintaining momentum against the backdrop of political turbulence.

Notable Producers and Contributors:

• Producers: Mary Knoff and Jonathan Shiflett
• Sound Design and Original Music: Jonathan Shiflett
• Editor: Elijah Wolfson
• Studio Manager: Denise Callahan
• Production Manager: Ben Church
• Engineer: Nick Norton
• Executive Production: Darius Derekshon
• Created by: Sami Roth

Special Thanks:

• Anna Magzanian, President of LA Times Studio
• Chris Argentieri, President and COO of the Los Angeles Times
• Terry Tang, Executive Editor of the Los Angeles Times

This comprehensive summary captures the essence of the "Drill, Baby, Drill…Again" episode, highlighting critical discussions on policy reversals, state resilience, global dynamics, and actionable steps for listeners concerned about climate change.