Episode Summary: "How Much Are You Like The Characters You Read About?"

Podcast: Book Riot – The Podcast
Hosts: Jeff O’Neal, Rebecca Schinsky
Guest: Laura McGrath (English professor, literary historian, data scientist)
Date: February 25, 2026
Main Theme:
The episode explores how readers' identities (race, gender, sexuality, etc.) relate to the characters they choose to read about. The discussion is anchored by new research into "reader-character identity interdependence," tackled through a large survey, and extended by the hosts’ and guest’s personal experiences and industry insights.

Overview

The hosts welcome frequent guest and data correspondent Laura McGrath to discuss new findings from a study by Prof. Millicent Weber and Rachel Norda about the connection between readers’ identities and the identities of the characters they read. The conversation ranges from the selection process for books, representation in fiction, publishing trends, personal anecdotes, and the larger implications for the world of reading.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Introduction to the Study & Its Aims

• Laura outlines new research about "reader-character identity interdependence," i.e., how closely readers’ identities match with the characters in their books and whether readers are intentionally seeking out that match or not. (02:19–03:48)
• The research is based on survey data from 3,000 readers across the US, UK, and Australia.

2. Personal Book Selections/Survey Recreation

• Laura puts the hosts through a version of the survey, asking about the most recent novel they read and the main character’s demographics.
  • Rebecca: Kin by Tayari Jones (main characters: Black women, one straight, one queer but appearing straight; set in Louisiana).
  • Jeff: The Correspondent by Virginia Evans (main character: retired cishet white woman; set around Baltimore).
  • Laura: The Ten Year Affair by Erin Summers (main character: cishet straight white woman; set in upstate New York). (05:14–09:14)
• They discuss why they picked these books, balancing logistics, author reputation, recommendations, and personal connection to the content.

Notable Quote:
“I was excited about the form of the book, the kind of sliding doors and two timelines. But also this book is just unfortunately or for better or for worse, I'm not sure, a little close to home for me.”
— Laura McGrath (09:14)

3. Reader Identity and Book Selection

• The hosts and Laura reflect on whether they intentionally seek characters similar to themselves.
  • General agreement: They value diverse perspectives and don’t purposefully select “mirror” characters, even though sometimes their picks incidentally resemble them.
  • Reflection on professional bias—many Book Riot listeners/readers and the hosts are more self-aware about these choices than the general public. (12:14–14:39)

Notable Quote:
“Part of Book Riot's mission and something that's baked into the way that I read now... is engaging with other modes of experience.”
— Rebecca Schinsky (12:14)

4. Industry and Demographic Data

• Discussion of industry stereotypes: “men read about men, women about women, and women are more open than men.”
• Complications introduced by intersecting identities (race, class, gender, ability, etc.); citing Kimberlé Crenshaw’s concept of intersectionality. (16:50–19:39)
• The publishing industry and bestseller lists often don’t reflect true diversity—Rebecca points out that while middle-aged white women are stereotyped as the ‘average’ reader, buyer demographics are complicated by stats (e.g., Black women’s book-buying rates). (15:21–16:06)

5. Overview of the Study’s Methodology & Demographics

• The study asked about participants’ last book read, character demographics, book setting, and related context but didn’t focus explicitly on why the book was chosen beyond open-ended questions.
  • 35% of survey participants: BIPOC
  • 67%: women or gender non-conforming
  • 14%: LGBTQIA
  • 42%: disabled or chronically ill (30:57)

6. Survey Results: Character Representation

• 47% of main characters were women or gender non-conforming, even though 67% of respondents belonged to these groups—overrepresentation of male characters relative to the reader pool. (32:10–32:24)
• Only 23% of main characters were BIPOC, lower than the percentage of BIPOC participants (35%).
• 10% of main characters were disabled/chronically ill (seems high compared to fiction's baseline, per Rebecca).
• LGBTQIA numbers were more aligned: 14% of participants and of main characters.
• There’s significantly more diversity among secondary characters, but quality of representation (“mere numbers” don’t guarantee meaningful roles). (34:55–35:41)

7. Why Readers Pick What They Pick (or Don’t Know Why)

• Most participants reported choosing books for reasons like “a good story” rather than consciously seeking identity match or contrast.
• Hosts and guest note the power of subconscious biases—most readers, especially casual ones, select books based on availability, what catches their attention, or recommendations, not on character identity per se. (21:09–22:14)

Notable Quote:
“I think a lot of this is subconscious, if it’s happening at all.”
— Rebecca Schinsky (21:43)

8. Market Forces, Algorithms, and The Role of Availability

• Discussion of “ambient awareness” (what’s available in Costco, Target, airports, etc.) and how it shapes selections.
• The role of BookTok and other platforms in surfacing books—examples include The Seven Husbands of Evelyn Hugo attracting a wide audience because it’s not overtly pitched as queer, allowing “invisible” representation.
• Algorithms amplify selection bias and can make it difficult for books from underrepresented communities to get traction, despite increased market availability. (52:23–53:39)

9. Tension Between Representation and Business

• It’s necessary—but not sufficient—to increase books by and about marginalized people; business and marketing dynamics, as well as the need for intentionality by readers, play a role.
• Concern: Once someone is “on the bestseller flywheel,” it’s hard for new, diverse books to break through unless they also become phenomena.

10. Moral/Empathetic Value of Reading Diverse Stories

• Debate over whether reading really makes people more empathetic: Laura notes that “reading doesn’t make you more empathetic” by default, but a powerful story can shift one’s sense of self.
• Conservatives often give “a much more powerful story about what literature can do” (e.g., book banning assumes books can transform identity), whereas academics may downplay literature’s transformative potential.
• Reading expansively can broaden perspectives, but we “know a lot of well read assholes”—being well-read does not guarantee open-mindedness. (45:31–48:44)

Notable Quote:
“I know a whole lot of well read assholes. Reading doesn't make you more empathetic…what am I doing other than selling literature short and selling its capacity to change us and to expand our world so short.”
— Laura McGrath (45:31)

Study Conclusions & Implications

• Race is the strongest predictor for “reader-character congruence.” BIPOC readers heavily favor books with BIPOC main characters (and sometimes white characters); white readers overwhelmingly choose white protagonists.
• Gender also predicts, but less strongly: women/gender-nonconforming people read about similar characters more than men do, but also read more expansively.
• Marginalized readers generally show greater openness to difference, but in aggregate, the field still skews heavily towards white protagonists.
• For real change, production (i.e., what’s being published and promoted) remains critical, but so does understanding of selection/availability effects—and the reinforcing role of algorithms.

Notable Quote:
“It is perhaps not terribly surprising, but…it is so extraordinarily useful to actually have receipts...when we talk about these sorts of assumptions, particularly around demography and particularly around identity and taste, because this is a whole mishmash of vibes.”
— Laura McGrath (23:57)

Highlighted Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Rebecca: “Things people like are good actually, Jeff.” (11:43)
• Jeff: "I think an interesting chasm in readers is people who think about their reading at all...versus just picking up a book." (20:00)
• Laura: “I think our idea of what a good story is is likewise culturally conditioned...It's entirely impossible, I think, to separate them from our own subject positions.” (42:22)
• Rebecca: “I care about living in a world where people are interested in and curious about the world and other people's experiences...books are a vehicle for that way of engaging with the world.” (47:47)

Timestamps for Important Segments

• 03:48–09:14: Survey recreation and book discussion
• 12:14–14:39: Do readers seek out “mirror” characters?
• 30:57: Survey participant demographics breakdown
• 32:10–34:55: Main and secondary character representation data
• 38:39–41:26: Availability, marketing, and the impact on what’s read
• 45:31–47:47: Do books actually make us better people?
• 49:32–52:20: Conclusions: selection congruence and the imperative for more representative fiction
• 53:37–54:36: Algorithms, BookTok, and the rise of “stealth” representation

Podcast Tone and Style

• Conversational, nerdy, “wonky” but accessible; a balance of humor, data, and critical analysis.
• Frequent asides and playful banter, e.g., jokes about Warby Parker glasses and “sad literary men.”
• Deeply self-aware, often meta, reflecting on their role as book media figures and the complexity of both the industry and their own reading lives.

Conclusion

While the publishing industry has made steps toward diversity and readers sometimes value exposure to different identities, selection heavily reflects personal identity—especially with regard to race and, to a lesser extent, gender. The episode underscores both the limits and potential of changing reading habits, the power of availability and algorithmic recommendation, and the challenging work ahead for publishers, marketers, and readers who care about representation.

Listeners are encouraged to reflect on their own motivations for book selection and to consider how broadening their reading can impact their perspective—while also pushing for systemic changes in the industry.

Additional Resources

Laura McGrath’s upcoming book, Literary Agents and the Making of American Fiction, will explore how agents shape the American literary canon. She also writes the Textbook Crunch Substack for those interested in data-driven book industry insights.

For more episodes and full show notes, visit bookriot.com.