Ranking Amazon's Best Books of the Century

Summary

Book Riot – The Podcast

Episode: Ranking Amazon's Best Books of the Century

Hosts: Jeff O’Neal & Rebecca Schinsky
Air Date: February 18, 2026

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Episode Overview

This episode is a lively, opinionated deep dive in which Rebecca and Jeff revisit Amazon’s 20 annual “Number One Book of the Year” picks from 2001–2025. Drawing on their bookish expertise (and not a little nostalgia), each host brings a ranked top ten, debating which selections have stood the test of time, which were flashy but fleeting, and which Amazon editorial zags still baffle. Along the way, the duo reflect on career arcs, book club hits, adaptation triumphs (and missteps), and the shifting sands of “It Book” status in the 21st century.
Expect: passionate disagreements, hot takes, literary sidebars, and the inside baseball of contemporary book culture — all with their trademark “low stakes, high opinion” energy.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

How the Ranking Works

• Concept: Review all of Amazon’s “Best of the Year” #1 picks from 2001–2025.
• Method: Each host independently ranks their personal top 10, then they compare and contrast their choices and rationale.
• Extra: Three notable “oddities/outliers” from the Amazon picks are discussed at the end.

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Countdown: The Top Ten

10. The Round House by Louise Erdrich

Why it’s here:

• Both hosts agree it belongs for literary excellence and underappreciated status.
• “You have to put Louise Erdrich on the top 10. But she is…still on my list of underappreciated, because I just don’t ever think she gets as widely read as she should be.” — Rebecca (02:59)
• Noted for National Book Award win (2012) and for resonating across years.

9. Educated by Tara Westover (Rebecca’s #3, Jeff’s #9), vs. The Year of Magical Thinking by Joan Didion (Rebecca’s #9)

• Educated: Celebrated as the decade’s biggest memoir not by Michelle Obama, and a genuine phenomenon.
  • “It does the things we want an IT book to do. It sold, it had word of mouth, people liked it. And it is very good.” — Rebecca (05:27)
  • Jeff notes: For Westover, it didn’t trigger a broader literary career.
• The Year of Magical Thinking: Jeff places higher for its genre-defining impact.
  • “Very few of these books…can claim to have introduced new structures of feeling into the reading public…I think you can make an argument that [this] did something different…” — Jeff (28:18)

8. Everything I Never Told You by Celeste Ng (Rebecca), The Heaven & Earth Grocery Store by James McBride (Jeff)

• Celeste Ng: Saluted for career trajectory and the rare debut that becomes “Book of the Year.”
  • “For a debut to be the book of the year is a huge deal and she did not regress to the mean.” — Rebecca (11:32)
• McBride: Jeff’s pick, though he admits it might be recency bias. Noted for being widely read, award-winning, and likely to remain influential.

7. The Goldfinch by Donna Tartt (Rebecca), A Thousand Splendid Suns by Khaled Hosseini (Jeff)

• Goldfinch: A huge commercial and critical hit, though not beloved by either host.
  • “She only does about a novel every decade…That was a big deal and she’s a big deal.” — Rebecca (14:31)
• A Thousand Splendid Suns: Both hosts acknowledge its powerful emotional impact despite heavy subject matter.
  • “It’s a difficult needle to thread. And he does thread it.” — Rebecca (17:24)

6. The Immortal Life of Henrietta Lacks by Rebecca Skloot (Rebecca), The Adventures of Kavalier & Clay by Michael Chabon (Jeff)

• Henrietta Lacks: Lauded for resonance, staying power, and cultural/policy impact.
  • “It resulted in actual real world policy change and built awareness…also, not an easy subject to take on and make appealing to the book club crowd.” — Rebecca (22:25)
• Kavalier & Clay: Jeff loves it for blending genre/literary, but Rebecca notes it’s faded from current conversation.

5. A Thousand Splendid Suns (Rebecca), Killers of the Flower Moon by David Grann (Jeff)

• Killers of the Flower Moon: Praised as the standard in historical true crime and for inspiring an acclaimed Scorsese adaptation.

4. Life of Pi by Yann Martel (Rebecca), The Immortal Life of Henrietta Lacks (Jeff)

• Life of Pi: Noted for long-lasting popularity and adaptation, but a “one-hit wonder.”
  • “For me, I’m not going to put it here. You could say the same thing about my next book.” — Jeff (21:52)
• Henrietta Lacks (again): Its cross-genre appeal and ongoing relevance merit repeated mention.

3. Educated (Rebecca), Fates and Furies by Lauren Groff (Jeff)

• Fates and Furies: Jeff’s personal favorite, admitting bias for Groff.
  • “It was my favorite book of the year, and I went on NPR to talk about it. So I have to…” — Jeff (26:41)
• Rebecca leaves it off her top ten, seeing it as more “2015” and understandably favoring Groff’s later work.

2. The Heaven & Earth Grocery Store (Rebecca), The Year of Magical Thinking (Jeff)

• See thoughts above on both. Both hold importance for lasting cultural and personal impact.

1. The Underground Railroad by Colson Whitehead (both)

• Unanimously selected as the pinnacle of the list.
  • “Very few of these books…can claim to have introduced new structures of feeling into the reading public…You can make an argument that your magical thinking did something…but [The Underground Railroad]…the more distance we get, I’m not sure it’s the highest peak, but it’s certainly on the mountain chain.” — Jeff (28:18)
  • “If a book like this became a huge hit today, it would reassure me…about the intellectual health of the general public. Because it’s not easy.” — Rebecca (29:53)
• Noted for National Book Award win, landmark adaptation by Barry Jenkins, enduring literary and cultural relevance.

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Notable Side Conversations and Quotes

Adaptation Power & Scarcity

• “There’s a version of me that has [Heaven & Earth Grocery Store] at two…It has a shit ton of Goodreads ratings…He’s won awards. This is also not my favorite McBride…But I really love it…We’re going to continue to be, I think, in the conversation.” — Rebecca (13:07)
• “If you could get a new book announcement from [any living author], plausibly…is Donna Tartt number one in terms of…IT book of the month…What would cap [her return]?” — Jeff (14:44)
• “The scarcity is a huge part of it.” — Rebecca (15:28)

“It Book” Phenomena vs. Literary Longevity

• “[Educated]…the biggest memoir of the last decade that wasn’t by Michelle Obama…” — Rebecca (05:27)
• On The Art of Fielding: “Probably the greatest example of the gap between the hype machine and actually how a book lands that I’ve seen in my career in publishing.” — Rebecca (34:45)
• “For a debut to be the book of the year is a huge deal…” — Rebecca on Celeste Ng (11:32)

Outliers, Oddities, and Picks That Didn’t Age Well

• Boys of Riverside (last year’s pick), A Million Little Pieces (“Doesn’t hold up great as a pick, now”), Art of Fielding, Suite Française, The Testaments, Northern Clemency (“I know that I read it. Zero memory…” — Jeff (37:17-39:14), A Knock at Midnight.

Reflections on the Amazon List

• “When you get it right, you look like a genius. And when you get it wrong, it really looks like, what world were you living?” — Jeff (38:40)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

| Timestamp | Segment | |-----------|------------------------------------------| | 01:48 | Explanation of ranking methodology | | 02:50 | #10 – The Round House | | 04:23 | #9 – Educated/Year of Magical Thinking | | 11:02 | #8 – Celeste Ng/McBride | | 13:49 | #7 – The Goldfinch/splendid Suns | | 17:32 | #6 – Henrietta Lacks/Kavalier & Clay | | 19:14 | #5 – Splendid Suns/Flower Moon | | 21:47 | #4 – Life of Pi/Henrietta Lacks | | 26:12 | #3 – Educated/Fates and Furies | | 28:10 | #1 – Underground Railroad | | 33:07 | Outlier picks and oddities | | 34:36 | The Art of Fielding and hype | | 37:17 | Books that faded or were odd picks | | 39:14 | Fun closing thoughts on the project |

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Tone & Style

Consistently warm, opinionated, readerly, and a bit irreverent — Rebecca and Jeff point out where their reasoning diverges, debate the merits of literary versus commercial triumph, and frequently break for bookish sidebars and anecdotes. They’re not afraid to address their own subjectivity, nostalgia, or recency bias, and routinely reference literary phenomena old and new to contextualize their arguments.

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Memorable Quotes

• “The scarcity is a huge part of [Donna Tartt’s] mystique.” — Rebecca (15:28)
• “If a book like this became a huge hit today, it would reassure me…about the intellectual health of the general public. Because it’s not easy.” — Rebecca on Underground Railroad (29:53)
• “I think when you get it right, you look like a genius. And when you get it wrong, it really looks like, what world were you living?” — Jeff (38:40)

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Final Thoughts

This episode is a treasure for book lovers who enjoy spirited discussion and care about how literary taste changes over time. Jeff and Rebecca’s rank-off is a reminder of how the book world both shapes and is shaped by changing interests, industry forces, and the elusive magic that makes a book “of its moment,” and sometimes, truly timeless.

Transcript

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[Rebecca]

Hey there listeners. Today we're sharing something from the archives. Back in the fall, over on our Patreon, just before the flood of all the best books of the year lists hit, we decided to pull Amazon's number one book of the year picks from the last 20 years, the century so far, and we ranked the top 10. We each came in with our lists. We hadn't talked to each other in advance. There were some modern classics, there were some forgotten flashes in the pan, and there were some truly out of left field selections. Some of them haven't aged a day and some were actually pretty wild to look at in hindsight. Today we're sharing that full Patreon episode here in the main feed. And if you like this kind of deep dive, low stakes but high opinion, literary chaos, you know the stuff you know me and Jeff for, you can join us on the Patreon. That's Patreon. Patreon.com BookRiotpodcast to get access to our entire back catalog. That is several years and hundreds of episodes of rankings, drafts, book clubs and other experiments. We hope you'll enjoy it and we'll be back with the news on Monday. Have a great weekend.

[Jeff]

All right, Rebecca, what we're going to do here is consider the 25 books that Amazon's book editor have picked as the number one book of the year this century. So far, pal rank the top 1010 to 1. And then talk about the three three outliers, idiosyncratic picks and oddities there. We talked about the list as a whole on the regular show just a few minutes ago, but it's been a few days. For the rest of you, anything else to say about the list before we get into this?

[Rebecca]

No, it's an interesting list. Some of them really do feel like a snapshot of the particular year.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

That.

[Rebecca]

The books were chosen. But some of these books were on Barnes and Noble paperback favorites tables for like the better part of a decade.

[Jeff]

Yeah, all kinds on the whole, more familiar than not. Which is not a surprise as being a part of the taste making apparatus and a significant one at that. Not a surprise. Why don't you tell me your number 10?

[Rebecca]

My number 10 is the Roundhouse by Louise Erdrick.

[Jeff]

That's what I had at number 10. Look, hell yeah. Why so?

[Rebecca]

Because you have to put Louise Erdrich on the top 10. But she is. She is still on my list of underappreciated because I just don't ever think she gets as widely read as she should be. And like she is a little bit more literary. The mark. The books are still marketed as being very literary even though the Mighty Red got spread just last year which was very confusing. And like I would have thought that was the best book or one of the best books that came out that year. But it was certainly not one of the most widely read ones. It is the highest. Not the highest rated. It might be the highest rated. It has the most ratings of any Louise Erdrich novel on Goodreads by like an order of magnitude.

[Jeff]

It won the national book Award in 2012. That's just going through this book is very good. So.

[Rebecca]

It is very good.

[Jeff]

A young boy is. He investigates his mother's death because he doesn't believe that the right thing was happening. It's like stand by me plus an Agatha Christie thing set on a jibbon reservation. Like it's awesome. It's. Erdrich is our absolute best.

[Rebecca]

Yeah, I don't have Erdrich like slated yet for zero to well read. But when we get to Erdrich this will be the obvious one to start with, I believe.

[Jeff]

I don't even think it's particularly close. I mean it won the National Book Award so I mean none of the rest have so really cool to see. I have that number 10 so that means we're to your number nine.

[Rebecca]

I have the Year of Magical Thinking by Joan Diddy in number nine.

[Jeff]

That much higher.

[Rebecca]

Okay.

[Jeff]

I have Educated by Tara west over at night.

[Rebecca]

Oh, I have that at number three.

[Jeff]

Okay. I think they're pretty close to flip flop so let's do the lower one first here. So that's my educated. Hard to remember now unless you were there. What a monster juggernaut. Multiple quadrant. Everyone was listening to it in audiobooks and we still haven't got the adaptation. I just realized when looking at this again we were talking about this is going to be a wonderful Jennifer Lawrence.

[Rebecca]

I'm afeared that's probably been lost in adaptation. Hell.

[Jeff]

I was like it's a winter's bone but for people who like to read books like Get Jennifer Lawrence Back in the Saddle, her story of growing up on the side of the hill in a quasi cult, certainly authoritarian parental figure. And then the book, spoiler alert for all these, I guess I should say eventually ends up at Oxford or was it Cambridge somewhere, studying books in Europe essentially. I don't remember exactly. Erudite, moving, restrained, impactful. Everyone loved, everyone loved this book. Publishing once a book like this every year if they could.

[Rebecca]

Yes. Yeah. That's why I had it at number three. Like it does the things we want an IT book to do. It sold, it had word of mouth, people liked it. And it is very good. Huge Goodreads ratings, very popular. Like, in terms of the vibes, this is the biggest memoir of the last decade that was not written by Michelle Obama. Like I'm sure there have been other celebrity memoirs that have out.

[Jeff]

Like, I wonder what it says look like compared to I'm glad My mom died. I'd be very curious to see the comps because that. That's the only one even close.

[Rebecca]

That is the only one even close. And that was not a contender for this list. But yeah, that's why I had it up so high. I also think one of the, one of the things that I was considering here with power ranking is how has this stood the test of time so far? It's only been like seven years since Educated. Not quite seven, but I think it will continue to stand the test of time. Like it's been 20 years since the Glass Castle. We're still talking about it. I think we will be talking about Educated when It has been 20 years since educated came out. So I had it up much higher.

[Jeff]

It's a good, It's a good argument. My. I took a slightly different path in thinking about it. It's like it's sort of a one on one. It didn't really lead anywhere for Tara Westover. Like there hasn't been a follow on. It hasn't made a career. It's not part of everyone else. He says carefully. Well, say for one, is part of a larger career narrative. And so I had a harder time putting it up because while it's great, it didn't like break any ground, it didn't feel, it felt like the best version of a thing we knew. You know, like we have always lived in the Castle or, you know, bastard out of Carolina. It's very much in that tradition, but not radically different from them. Just a. More like this is a story that's going to need to keep being told of like people in these isolated communities who aren't exposed to have access to the wider world. And for some reason, by hook or by crook or chance or will or, you know, grit, they break out of it. And that continues to be an inspiring story and really a tale as old as, you know, Beowulf, frankly. But for this particular, like Tara Westover, name another book there. I don't think there even is one. There is nothing else.

[Rebecca]

Yeah, yeah, I didn't. I wasn't thinking so much about whole career arcs. That is. Yeah, no, I think like, yeah, we have different schemas here, but it's interesting to know how you were approaching it because I think that probably will be reflected in other variations. This podcast is supported by Quince as the seasons start to change, or at least as we start to be wishing for spring, my husband and I always do a little wardrobe reset. We put away the heavy stuff, we take stock of what actually gets worn, and we fill in the gaps with pieces we'll rely on every day. And that's where Quince comes in. I've been a customer for years, and it's one of the places that we both turn to when we want staples that feel easy, well made and built to last. Especially for menswear, Quince makes the kind of everyday essentials that really carry a wardrobe. Organic cotton sweaters, polos that work for just about any occasion, and lighter jackets that keep you warm as the weather shifts without feeling bulky. These are the pieces that get worn again and again and still look good. Quince works directly with top factories and cuts out the middleman. So you're not paying for brand markup, just quality clothing from premium materials as part of our refresh. In my household, we've been stocking up on organic cotton sweaters, polos for him from Quince, and they've become instant staples. They're comfortable, they hold their shape, and they look pulled together without trying too hard, which is exactly what you want from your everyday pieces. Get in on the fun with us and refresh your wardrobe with Quince. Go to Quince.comBookRiot for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns. Now available in Canada too. That's Q-U I-N-C-E.comBookRiot free shipping and 365 day returns. Quints.comBookRiot.

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[Rebecca]

About your magical thinking when we get up to it. My eight is Everything I Never Told you'd by Celeste Ng, which given your career arc situation, I'm guessing you have.

[Jeff]

Higher I didn't actually have it on the list. I looked hard at it.

[Rebecca]

Interesting. Okay.

[Jeff]

I think I really like Celeste Ng and I looked hard at it. I feel like there's other books like this now. I feel like we're so in the world of psychological thriller. But that's counter. I mean it is a counter to what I just said of like where it led. I actually kind of like little fires everywhere better.

[Rebecca]

I did too.

[Jeff]

Yeah, I looked at it. It was. It was probably 11th for me. Say more about it.

[Rebecca]

It is not my favorite of the Celeste Ngs, but it was. I mean four for a debut to be the book of the year is a huge deal and she did not regress to the mean. It wasn't come out of the gate with a huge debut and then hit the mid list. Celestine continues to do very well. There have been big adaptations of a couple of her books. You know I didn't have it at 1, 2, 3, but she I think continues to also live in that IT book zone. She hasn't Gotten quite to the win a National Book Award place. But I wouldn't be surprised if we saw her write something that was nominated for one. There's a career there we thought we.

[Jeff]

Were going to get. I mean, I don't think her last book, A Buried Heart. Our Buried Hearts. I can't quite get the pronouns correct there. Didn't do very well. And we're probably due for another Celestia. I wouldn't be surprised if we get an announcement about.

[Rebecca]

Yeah, she edited this year's Best American Short Stories. I just got that in the mail. And I've been curious about what she's working on while we're not seeing her out there right now. So what did you have at 8?

[Jeff]

This is weird because sort of when you're my moving my cells around, they start to settle and I felt like it's too low, but I couldn't put it above. I had a hard time putting above other things. And I think it's just because Heaven and Earth Grocery Store. Like, I like good lud. I think I like Good Lord Bird a little bit better. I like. You know. So it's on my personal list. It's probably second or third of the McBride, though. That's a wonderful list to be on. Also Recency Bias. Like, I'm not. It sold great. So I have it at 8, but you probably.

[Rebecca]

I had it at 2. I had it at 2.

[Jeff]

That's not a surprise. There's a version of me that has it at two.

[Rebecca]

I mean, it has like, talk about it. Book four quadrant. It has a shit ton of Goodreads ratings. People liked it. He's won awards. This is also not my favorite McBride. Good Lord bird and the Excuse of An Ethan Hawke adaptation is my favorite McBride as well. But I really love to have it in Earth Grocery Store and everybody read it. Like, I just. We're gonna. It's gonna continue to be. I think in the conversation I also. I interrogated my. Is this recency bias? But the rest of the ones at the top of my list are not terribly recent.

[Jeff]

So. Okay.

[Rebecca]

So that was your eight.

[Jeff]

My seven, then Your seven. Yeah.

[Rebecca]

The Goldfinch by Donna Tartt didn't have.

[Jeff]

It on my list.

[Rebecca]

Okay. Ton of ratings won awards. Way more people love this book and they love it way more than I ever feel in my bones.

[Jeff]

Yes.

[Rebecca]

Like, this is not my preferred Donna Tartt.

[Jeff]

I like the book. Yep.

[Rebecca]

I liked it. I was lukewarm on it. I think I was whelmed by the Goldfinch when it came out. So I don't really care that the adaptation seemed blah because I wasn't super attached to the book. But it's sold like crazy. She only does about a novel every decade. Yeah, yeah, we're.

[Jeff]

Are we due?

[Rebecca]

We're due. We are due for Donna Tartt.

[Jeff]

Yeah, we are.

[Rebecca]

We're due for some Donna Tartt. Um, I also have Donna Tartt on the brain because this is the week that we're recording the Secret History for zero to well read. But it was a big deal. That was a big deal and she's a big deal. And maybe some of that is the.

[Jeff]

Scarcity sidebar question related to this and this. I. We're getting into a little stepping on zero to well read stuff. But this is a Patreon for the BR Pod. So this is more of a question if of all the authors that you could get a new book announcement from. Plausibly. Plausibly is Donna Tartt number one in terms of. It will be the IT book of the month whenever it comes out. Like, what would. What would cap a new big Donna Tartt novel for what we do with the IT book segment? Does anything jump out to you?

[Rebecca]

I mean, it's hard to think about what could take it out.

[Jeff]

And I think some of it's just a scarcity. Right. Like, and it's only 10 years.

[Rebecca]

Right. The scarcity is a huge part of it.

[Jeff]

What would it even be? I guess if there's another Harry Potter book or like a Song of Ice and Fire, that would be the book it would have.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Yeah.

[Rebecca]

It would have to be something that is going to be bigger commercially than Donna Tartt because nothing is going to be bigger. Book nerd excitement in a month of new Donna Tartt when it's one a decade. Ish.

[Jeff]

Whitehead. I just can't even think of.

[Rebecca]

Groff.

[Jeff]

Would Sally Rooney.

[Rebecca]

Not for me personally, but maybe for the.

[Jeff]

But there's been three in like the last five. I mean, it's just a scarcity thing. Yeah, yeah.

[Rebecca]

The. The mode Groff is going in, like the trajectory of Lauren Groff. Yeah. Is going to a place where that is very exciting. But a new Donna Tartt is compelling. Although the other side of it is that in my personal reading, none of the Donna Tarts have been as good as the Secret History. So after a couple where I'm whelmed, I am less excited.

[Jeff]

But people love. I mean, that's just us. But like, people do.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Yeah.

[Jeff]

Most people are on the goldfish. They're on an upswing.

[Rebecca]

Right. Like, I almost left The Goldfinch off. And then I went and looked at all of the ratings and I was.

[Jeff]

Like, damn, I like this.

[Rebecca]

I do think I'm right about this one.

[Jeff]

Yeah, my number seven. And this is, I fully admit, idiosyncratic. I did the whole Khaled Hosseini backlist when I interviewed him for the 20th anniversary of kite Runner. So I put a thousand splendid sums at seven. I have it at five books. And it's extraordinarily good. It just really is really good. It takes everything he does well in the Kite Runner and just polishes it up. I mean, that's really what it is.

[Rebecca]

Yeah, I have this up at 5 because it is. It is surprising for novels that handle such heavy subject matter to be as popular and well loved and also, frankly.

[Jeff]

As readable and not saccharine either. Because it's very tempting to be saccharine with a story like that.

[Rebecca]

It's a difficult needle to thread. And he. He does thread it. So, yeah, I had him right in the middle of the list at five.

[Jeff]

Okay, that's my seven. So we're up to yours.

[Rebecca]

Six. The Immortal Life of Henrietta Lacks by Rebecca Skloot.

[Jeff]

Okay, that one. Here I had Adventures of Cavalier and Claire by Michael. Michael Chabin. Because, A, I think it's terrific. B, it does feel like a harbor. I feel like if this book came out today would feel contemporary in a lot of ways. I mean, I'm sure there's be some different things around the edges, but this historical fiction genre blending comic book superheroes, this came out before Iron. Like, this came out before all of that stuff. Like, it really feels prescient. Not like in a dystopian, Orwellian kind of way, but it felt like that was on. It had its finger on the pulse of the nerve of the railroad tracks leading to where we are today. And I think it's a crowd pleaser. Like, this was a huge book when it came out, and it was in a lot of ways the collision of genre and literary fic that I wanted for sure. When this book came out, I was very much in the wheelhouse for this.

[Rebecca]

Yeah, I left it off because I wanted to be able to make a case for Shabin. But he's out of the conversation right now. And Cavalier and Clay is out of the conversation. It was like undeniably huge when it came out.

[Jeff]

And I do think there's an adaptation at the New York Metropolitan Opera of this right now. So it's not all out of the. I mean, an opera now that's all current.

[Rebecca]

Yes. Give the people what they want, which is an opera adaptation. It would have been in my top 12, probably.

[Jeff]

I love this book. I really love.

[Rebecca]

Yeah, I just couldn't get there. Okay, so that was sixes. I had a thousand Splendid Sons at five. What do you have at five?

[Jeff]

Oh, I'm sorry, I stepped. We were supposed to say that. I have Killers of the flower Moon at 5. David Grant. Maybe the best of this particular genre of historical true crime. Well done, well researched, has larger political themes, and not for nothing, I think is, you know, in the upper tier of Scorsese can at this point. I think underrated at the time, but the movie is extraordinary. And this book continues to be read. And this kind of historical narrative crime fiction with like American history stuff baked into it has a long, like In True Blood kind or In Cold Blood.

[Rebecca]

Leg sort of situation, you know, That's a great point. I left it off. I had a hard time, like, situating it among the rest of them. But it was in my like 12 or 13 contenders. As a sidebar, have you started the Mr. Scorsese documentary?

[Jeff]

No, I'm not. I'm not watching a lot of movies right now, so I'm behind on many different things. I do want to watch that.

[Rebecca]

It's a five part series. They're like an hour each. I recommend it's not like 10 hours. It's not.

[Jeff]

It's not a huge. I mean, I watched the like three part Steve Martin thing. Like, I'm not opposed to it. I think at this point, my kids stay up later than I do. I do not have the there goes your TV show. Watch an hour of Scorsese documentary tonight. Like, we need four quadrant stuff and.

[Rebecca]

That'S send them to their rooms and tell them to entertain themselves.

[Jeff]

Right. Because that's. That's what I'm looking to do with the wild and precious lives I get under my care at this point.

[Rebecca]

My 4 is life of PI by Jan Martel.

[Jeff]

Interesting. Okay, say more. I didn't have this on my list.

[Rebecca]

This was also one of those, like, it was big and it was big and it stayed big forever. Like now, by my own, it's out of the conversation rules. I should not have put this on the list.

[Jeff]

That's the reason I didn't put it. Because you talk to anyone that's under 30, like, what?

[Rebecca]

What it is still. It is still floating around on those paperback tables at Barnes and Noble every now and then. So, like, someone is picking it up randomly enough to justify that merchandising decision. This was an idiosyncratic one.

[Jeff]

No, it's fine. I know some people like really like the movie. It got apparently a good adaptation. I think there was also a musical as well. Yeah. This. It's hard to articulate for me that this. Why this and not Cavalier and Clay. For example. Jan Martel felt like more of not a flash in the plan, but like a one hit one. It's a book.

[Rebecca]

According to it is a one hit wonder. That's true. It is a one hit wonder and.

[Jeff]

I like the book. But for me I'm not going to put it here. Yeah. You could say the same thing about my next book. But I think Immortal Life of Henrietta Lacks.

[Rebecca]

Okay.

[Jeff]

That's why I did that cross over one hit wonder. Like I think this is. It just sticks around long. And I think it was meant something at the time about the black woman.

[Rebecca]

Yeah. There are 800,000 Goodreads ratings.

[Jeff]

Yes.

[Rebecca]

For a work of nonfiction that resulted.

[Jeff]

And maybe even still. I mean it's historical so like there's nothing that really dates it now.

[Rebecca]

Yeah.

[Jeff]

But one of the great Swiss army narrative nonfiction picks you could ever get at.

[Rebecca]

It was huge. And it resulted in actual real world policy change and like real activity and built awareness. I think an underrated contributor to some conversations around especially how black people were exploited and manipulated in scientific research and what can be done to try to make good or to come as close to making good as you can for those things. Also like not an easy subject to take on and make appealing to the book club crowd. And Rebecca really did it.

[Jeff]

Do I want Siddhartha Mukherjee's version? Maybe for myself.

[Rebecca]

But do we want Siddhartha Mukherjee's version of everything that's true.

[Jeff]

Yes.

[Rebecca]

And there is gonna be joy to the world for us. A 10th anniversary edition of the Emperor of All Maladies next year with new introductory material. I can't.

[Jeff]

I meant to tell you there's going to be a special edition of the Martian. Like with spreads and shit and like some more commentary. It's coming.

[Rebecca]

That might be. Yeah, that might.

[Jeff]

The nothing. The spread. We're all going to get spread just at some point or other.

[Rebecca]

Our colleague Jan, our sales director, was just at the Frankfurt Book Fair and he sent me the German edition of the new Dan Brown because it has a much better cover than the US edition and spreadjes. It looks great. I'll have to put it up on our Instagram. Okay. So that was.

[Jeff]

So there's. He was just quick Frankfurt Book Fair anecdote that he told me is like, so there's like 12, it's like four Javit centers put together. Like it's unbelievably huge, enormous. And he went to, he's like, oh, I'm going to go to the Romantasy floor. Because he's like, just want to see a whole floor. And he's like, I never heard of any S. He realized every single one is. It's just all German Roman. Like it's its own. Just mind boggling.

[Rebecca]

I had that, I had a version of that this morning. There was an English headline, I think in the Hollywood Reporter and something I was reading about a filmmaker who's trying to make a movie about Bartleby the Scrivener. Like she's trying to adapt Bartleby the Scrivener and she has made a documentary about herself trying to adapt Bartleby the Scrivener.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Yeah.

[Rebecca]

And I was like, I need to watch this trailer, but it's entirely in German and there are no subtitles. It's like, well, looks great.

[Jeff]

I'm in. I need to add. A lot of people have emailed us about short stories and probably Bartleby the Scrivener is way up there on short stories.

[Rebecca]

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[Jeff]

This episode is brought to you by FX's Love Story. John F. Kennedy Jr. And Carolyn Bassette join host Evan Ross Katz on the official podcast for FX's new series Love Story, John F. Kennedy Jr. And Carolyn.

[Rebecca]

Bassette and go behind the scenes with.

[Jeff]

Cast and special guests featuring Sarah Pigeon.

[Rebecca]

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[Jeff]

FX's love story John F. Kennedy Jr. And Carolyn Bassette.

[Rebecca]

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[Jeff]

Educated. My three is fates and Furies. I felt like I had to for a couple of reasons and got the honor of having to. Is that a thing? I'm not sure I can do that many gerunds in a row. I love this book. And I think for me, after Arcadia really announced that Grof was on one also, it was my favorite book of the year, and I went on NPR to talk about it. So I have to. I have to do you do. I can't get. I can't put it out of the top three. So anyway. That's right.

[Rebecca]

I also loved Fates and Furies, but I think I left it off the list. And, like, it would have been 11. I think it.

[Jeff]

That is crazy for you. I know you left it off.

[Rebecca]

I know, I know, I know. And I had that thought even as I was doing it. But it feels like a real relic of 2015 to me. And Groff, in my readerly estimation, has.

[Jeff]

As opposed to educated.

[Rebecca]

Listen.

[Jeff]

It'S a man without the monkey and Fates.

[Rebecca]

But for me, like, yeah, it's. That's true. Like, I mean, there's a version of my list where Fates and Furies is number one. Like, I. I also love Lauren, but I think because Matrix and the Vaster Wilds. But, like, really, Fates and Furies at the time felt like Lauren Groff is on one. And then Matrix was like, oh, she's on. She's on one we didn't even know she had. And I'm so here for the latest iteration of Lauren Groff that, like, it's hard for me to imagine myself going back to Fates and Furies for as much as I loved it, because what she's doing now is much more singular and interesting. There are other writers kind of doing things like Fates and Furies.

[Jeff]

It's almost like Lauren Groff took a Percival Everett to the domestic drama is what she did in Fates and Freeze. And so all of those words are things I enjoy hugely. So that's why it's three. For me.

[Rebecca]

Making these lists is always so weird.

[Jeff]

Yeah. We must have the same number one, then.

[Rebecca]

Underground Railroad.

[Jeff]

Yeah, you're magical. Thinking I had it, too. What did you have it too?

[Rebecca]

I had an Earth grocery store.

[Jeff]

Yeah. Maybe reasons you buy is because we've talked about it, but remind me what a Titan. Very few of these books, if any of the books, can claim to have introduced new structures of feeling into the reading public. And I think you can make an argument that your magical thinking did something different for people thinking about end of life, thinking about their time on our thinking, how they think about those things. And you just can't say that about any of the others Book maybe save Underground Railroad by Colson Whitehead, which the more distance we get from it is. I'm not sure it's the highest peak in the mountain chain for me, but it's certainly on the mountain chain. But also judging by a very high bar at that level. It's so interesting to see this one here and not James. Just because I think of them as being of a piece of historical fiction about slavery about some of our great writers, writers of any of any stripe, but especially amongst black writers. It's so weird to see the boys of Riverside and that's, you know, number one on my list of idiosyncratic picks.

[Rebecca]

Me too.

[Jeff]

But the Underground Road is amazing. It won multiple words. It got turned into one of the great adaptations of all time. I think probably benefited from peak adaptation in a way that no other document did because you're not going to get a five part Barry Jenkins no holds bar. You're just not. No book is ever going to get and let it go in the Underground Railroad.

[Rebecca]

And it is so no holds barred. It took me like three months to watch those six episodes.

[Jeff]

It took. It cost all the dollars to use older Internet parlance, but yeah. But what does it say about Underground Rotor?

[Rebecca]

Well, I think also it was like it was the it bookiest you could get. And in a way that like, if a book like this became a huge hit today, it would reassure me to like a significant degree about what we're doing like with the intellectual health of the general public. Because it's not. Underground Railroad is not easy.

[Jeff]

No.

[Rebecca]

It has surreal elements. It has really difficult, painful stuff about slavery. Like Whitehead looks that straight in the face and I think Nickel Boys is his best work to date because it really looks at something straight in the face and it does it without any fantastic elements. But that Underground Railroad is about what it's about and is written the way that it's written. And like it's challenging in multiple ways. It's also like subtle and it's weird. Like it's just so much weirder than you know it's going to be because Colson Whitehead is almost always weirder than you think he's going to be and that like it was winning the National Book Award and every book club in the world was reading it is that's the thing that doesn't happen today. Like, the lesser writers take on this subject today and then they say all the things. Things.

[Jeff]

Yeah.

[Rebecca]

And it's a book that does not say the things because the, The.

[Jeff]

The conceit is so geniusly compact, but also kind of obvious. Right to the point where some people, like, was the Underground Railroad actually a railroad? Like, you know, people get that question. I used to get that question at Koinfo and I was working there 30, 30 years ago. But then it's also not just sort of like a mechanicistic, like what would actually happen. Kind of like El Doctor could write a version of this where it's much more about like trains and shit. Where really it becomes another, you know, becomes a vehicle, pardon the pun, for a study about these individual people. And I think that's. That's amazing. But I think we're on the same page with nickel boys where doing. Pulling off the same trick. Not the same trick. Doing similar kinds of historical literary investigations without the wow, what a cool idea for a book. Is harder. It's like my thing about a great.

[Rebecca]

I was just about to say this.

[Jeff]

Great TV show without a Gun is harder than a great TV show with it.

[Rebecca]

It's harder to make the Mad Men good than it is.

[Jeff]

It's harder than it's.

[Rebecca]

To make the Sopranos great or the Sopranos. Oh, yeah. We should have a whole sidebar about task later.

[Jeff]

Are you on task?

[Rebecca]

Yeah, I just finished it. Yeah.

[Jeff]

Amazing. Cool. Let's do. I already mentioned Boys of Riverside, which is the Amazon pick for last year, which is very strange. It's just a strange.

[Rebecca]

It was such a zag. Like, I understand theoretically, the Amazon editors being like, well, James is everywhere. But a lot of the books that have made their number one have been everywhere.

[Jeff]

Killers of the Flower Moon and Immortal Life were not like, Underground.

[Rebecca]

Like, yeah, Life of Pie, the Heaven and Earth grocery store. Like, these were also books that were.

[Jeff]

Well, also remember, these are different people. Even though it's coming from the same editorial body. I don't know, they have a different.

[Rebecca]

Sense of collections of editors. That's a good point. But like, James was everywhere and it deserved to be everywhere, and it will. It's not going to age well that they did not make James the number one book of the year.

[Jeff]

Yeah. It's unfortunate to me that one of the great zags proving that they have an opinion, which I want an opinion, is like my favorite book of last 20 years. You know, like, it's just strange. A Million Little pieces Doesn't hold up great as a pick. Now, you couldn't have known this at the time. I don't think I go back and look at the timeline, but this was a juggernaut too.

[Rebecca]

Yeah, that's justifiable. At the time, it was also everywhere and it was doing it book stuff like it was on Oprah, but it was also about serious things and book clubs are reading it and it was selling like, that's a really interesting one. The other, another one that doesn't age well, but that publishing would have been shocked, wouldn't age well is the Art of Fielding by Chad Harbach.

[Jeff]

I think I was just blogging or just starting to blog when that came out. And now my blog was. He was the new Franzen. Was that sort of the idea? Yeah.

[Rebecca]

This makes. Telling this story makes me feel like I need to do it. Like, gather round, children. Like when the Art of Fielding, which is a big, like doorstop of a campus novel about a, like young. A young man who plays baseball at college figuring out how to be a young man in the world. When it was coming out, he got a like, million dollar advance. Hachette was marketing it as a bestseller before it was out. And they had published an ebook about how to engineer a bestseller based on the art of fielding before the book was even out. Like the.

[Jeff]

And it did okay.

[Rebecca]

And it did okay.

[Jeff]

Okay. It probably was so far in the red and from the advanced point of view, like.

[Rebecca]

But it was the hype machine. This is probably the, the greatest example of the. The gap between the hype machine and actually how a book lands that I've seen in my career in publishing. And if you are newer, if you're just younger or newer to paying attention to the industry, you probably looked at this Amazon list and were just like, what the hell is the Art of Fielding by Chad Har? But that was very engineered and it was good. It was not great.

[Jeff]

Everybody liking it?

[Rebecca]

Yeah, I liked it. They had announced, I mean, I love a canvas novel. But they had tried to position him as like the heir to the Franzen.

[Jeff]

Richard Ford, maybe John, like some of those others, Eugenides and like that bent. We're going to talk more about, like, this is the Bennington circle, but Those early to mid-90s blockbuster upmarket fiction, New England white writers. Like, this was going to be another one in there. I've never read A Knock at Midnight. I was just. I forgot. I don't remember talking about this. This was, you know, during COVID I don't remember talking. I Remember. But I remember you and I talking about this book at all. And so this is. I don't remember seeing it. About a lawyer who takes up a case. And in the grand tradition of a lawyer takes up a case books. It sounds like it's great.

[Rebecca]

Yeah. This is one of the cases like the 911 Commission Report is the other big case where this list does this, where they pick a book of the year that reflects something that's happening in politics. And so to take a lawyer takes up a case dealing with the criminal justice system and the impacts of race and that that's their pick in 2020, when George Floyd has been murdered and the Black Lives Matter protests have been one of the big stories of the year. Makes a lot of sense. I didn't go back and look at, like, what else they could have picked in 2020. I'm sure there were big popular novels, but also, like, they. Like, this is one of those. Like, we have an opinion and we're going to use the platform to say a thing. And. Yeah, that was an interesting one. I've never read that.

[Jeff]

So I will make this case to the Amazon folks. I admire the. You pick one. And that one I very much admire. I think for their best books of the year, I think would be all right to have fiction. Nonfiction. Yeah, maybe a best nonfiction. Best fiction, if you want to do one of those two. But they're different enough. What someone wants from a fiction read and one nonfiction read are different enough. I think I'm okay to take two bites of the apple. For our best nonfiction and our best fiction of the year.

[Rebecca]

I would agree with that. I could support that. Did you have any just like straight up? Did you have any like, straight up Mrs.

[Jeff]

Again, I didn't do the longitudinal study of what was a contender. I remember reading the Northern Clemency. No, wait, let me rephrase that. I know that I read it. Zero memory. I looked at the description and I was like, that's what that book was about. I remember buying it. I remember where I was. I feel like I remember having it in my hand, but it just. Okay, it's just gone.

[Rebecca]

I was surprised to see Sweet Francaise by Irene Nimirovsky.

[Jeff]

That was a huge book, too. You were huge.

[Rebecca]

It was a huge book. The Testaments by Margaret Atwood in 2019 is my biggest. Come on, guys. Like. But I think that was also a political statement. Like, it's just that they made a political statement with a novel. That's fine. Yeah, there were tons of pre orders. It was a big Hype. Because this was going to be. I mean, it is a Handmaid's Tale prequel. It was coming out right in the middle of the first Trump administration. And the assault on reproductive freedom was very real. Like, that has to be the explanation for that being the number one book of the year. Because it was not the best novel that year.

[Jeff]

Yeah. Again, because this is a small group of people in a room, you're gonna get some weirdo picks. Like, if it was us and Sharif and Vanessa and like one of. And Danica and Erica, we'd probably have some weirdo picks if we did this.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Yeah.

[Rebecca]

I mean, we put some weirdo pics on our book.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Riot.

[Rebecca]

Best of every year.

[Jeff]

Yeah. But it's not the one. Like, he's really doing the one. I think when you get it right, you look like a genius. And when you get it wrong, it really looks like, what. What world were you living? So the Northern Clemency is a 600 page story set in northern England, examining the beginning of Margaret Thatcher's Britain in the 1970s. I gotta tell you, if you'd asked me, if you'd asked me in a lie detector, did you read this book? The thing would. Yes. True. He's saying it. Tell me one thing about it. And I'd be like, I literally. I think it's in English. That's. That's very tough stuff.

[Rebecca]

A fun exercise. I'm glad Amazon did this.

[Jeff]

2008. Cool.

[Rebecca]

You know, I have one other one, my other nitpick. Tomorrow and Tomorrow and Tomorrow was the 2022 pick that was popular, but not the best novel of the year. I think Demon Copperhead is the one people love.

[Jeff]

Oh, they love Demon Copperhead.

[Rebecca]

Demon Copperhead. That's the one you get in the time machine and you swap out.

[Jeff]

I'm glad that Kingsolver has you here to cape for her, because otherwise she wouldn't be anywhere.

[Rebecca]

Somebody's got to do it, Jeff.

[Jeff]

Someone's got to take up Barbara Kingsolver. This was fun. Really good. Walk down memory. I do continue to enjoy the best books of the century. Thank you so much to Gilbert Cruz, the New York Times, for kicking off in almost every medium, like, and, you know, the ringers doing it. And the movie places at a spin like, everyone's like, wait a minute, this is a cool. Oh, this is a cool thing.

[Rebecca]

I don't think I remembered to text you about it, but Rolling stone dropped the two. The 250 best songs of the last 25 years while I was on vacation. It is.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

It.

[Rebecca]

It is too many. But it was fun to bounce through the list and they put the whole thing on Spotify.

[Jeff]

Oh, that's a good idea.

[Rebecca]

Yeah, it's a good shuffle and just an interesting combination of also it songs that everybody knew but some weirdo obscure stuff and then going back to be like, what is this thing? I've never heard of, but I kind of like it. Why is it important?

[Jeff]

Speaking of things, I meant to mention otherwise, if you are inclined to give your magical thinking a try and you're an audiobook or ebook person, it's on sale for 2 bucks at bookshop and Amazon and some other places as an ebook. And it's 99 cents if you have an audible membership, which I know a lot of people do. Maybe it's available in Libra and some other places down price, but a one. I mean, frankly, if you ever think you're going to be interested in and you have an E reader, just. Just buy. Just. Just add it to the catalog for two bucks. I did. I got. I just listened to it and I have it on audio. So I'm like, I don't need this. But I bought the ebook because I might want to just. Just have this in my collection someday. So that's a hot shopping tip for there. Okay, Rebecca, thanks so much. Talk to you later.

[Rebecca]

Good times.

[Jeff]

Yeah. Film Vault. We are one of the original film podcasts. That can't be true. There was like two other film podcasts when we began. Brian, how long are we doing this show? You and I first sat down and did a version of the show over 20 years ago. My God. Two episodes each week. One we review movies and the first episode, the second one different.

[Rebecca]

Top five every week.

[Jeff]

Movies that made you cry. Worst movie accents, most disturbing movies. All right, the Film Ball. Check it out wherever you find a fine podcast. That's right, the Film vaults. Going on 20 plus years.