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- [00:00]
Danielle Robay
This is an I Heart podcast. Guaranteed human. Today's episode is brought to you by Cotton. We spend a lot of time with stories, hours curled up with dynamic plots and characters who feel like friends. What if the story isn't just in your hands but also in the world around you? In the fabric that's holding you close? Cotton is that timeless companion. Soft sheets for a lazy weekend morning with a book. Breezy dresses for afternoons spent reading in the backyard. And it's the fabric that can be tossed in the wash without fuss. It's about ease, comfort and caring for yourself and the planet. Just like books we cherish, cotton weaves meaning into everyday moments. Next time you settle in for a chapter, slip into something cotton. Not just to read the story, but to feel it. Cotton. The fabric of our lives. Learn more at thefabricofourlives.com@just roll they believe the kitchen is where joy lives with their refrigerated dough. There's no fussy proofing, no hours of waiting. Just big smells, big smell miles and that first irresistible flaky bite. They do the hard part so you could skip straight to the fun. Just Roll Puff Pastry is made with non GMO high quality ingredients ready to roll with parchment paper straight from the fridge. No thawing, no stress, just golden bakery worthy layers every single time. With Just Roll, every bake is simple. From savory show stopping appetizers to sweet dessert masterpieces, this is a fresh way to bake. Familiar but better find. Just Roll Puff Pastry in the refrigerated section of your grocery store. Or visit justroll.com to find a store near you.
- [01:37]
Rebecca Armitage
And Doug.
- [01:38]
Liberty Mutual Advertiser
What a horrible call. Hey ref. Open your eyes ref. You're really not going to call that?
- [01:43]
Danielle Robay
Come on.
- [01:44]
Liberty Mutual Advertiser
Hey ref. Why didn't you customize your car insurance with Liberty Mutual and save money?
- [01:49]
Rebecca Armitage
I don't think you get what we're doing.
- [01:52]
Liberty Mutual Advertiser
Sure I do. We're all just giving him advice. You guys on sports, me on saving money.
- [01:57]
Rebecca Armitage
Nope, that's not it.
- [01:59]
Liberty Mutual Advertiser
Only pay for what you need@libertymutual.com Liberty.
- [02:02]
Rebecca Armitage
Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Go.
- [02:05]
Trainer Games Narrator
10 athletes will face the toughest job interview in fitness that will push past physical and mental breaking points.
- [02:13]
Danielle Robay
Let's go.
- [02:16]
Trainer Games Narrator
You are the fittest of the fit. Only one of you will leave here with an IFIT contract for $250,000.
- [02:24]
Rebecca Armitage
This is where mindset comes in.
- [02:26]
Trainer Games Narrator
Someone will be eliminated.
- [02:28]
Liberty Mutual Advertiser
Pressure is coming down. Trainer Games on Prime Video January 8th. Watch the trailer on trainergames.com this is.
- [02:35]
Eva Longoria
Eva Longoria from Hungry for History with Eva Longoria and Maite Gomez Rejon. Like the song says, it's the most wonderful time of the year and also a wonderfully busy one. All that merriment can weigh down even Santa's sleigh. So keep it wonderful by keeping yourself wonderful with a crisp, cold Coca Cola. Ah. Pause for fizzy joy. Look out for yourself and then look out for everyone else. And together we'll make this season as wonderful as it's meant to be. Enjoy a Coca Cola Refresh your holidays.
- [03:08]
Danielle Robay
Bookmarked by Reese's Book Club is presented by Apple Books. Hi, I'm Danielle Robe, and welcome to Bookmarked by Reese's Book Club. It's our final episode of the year. How did that happen? We launched this show in June, and all of a sudden it's the end of December. You know, it only felt right to close things out with our December pick, the Heir Apparent by Rebecca Armitage. Because it's a story that quite literally begins on New Year's Eve. So here's a quick little refresher. We meet our heroine, Lexi, as she's living this adventurous life as a doctor, and she also happens to be the granddaughter of the Queen of England, when a tragic accident suddenly puts her directly in line for the throne. Lexi's forced to confront a future that she never asked for, and she's deciding whether she's willing to accept it or not. So, yes, it takes us inside the British monarchy. Yes, there are tiaras and palaces and jaw dropping privilege, but at the center of this story is Lexi, who's staring down a life that looks perfect on paper but is asking herself a very real question. What if this life isn't the life I want? And that's what makes this book such a great year ender. Beneath the royal drama, it's really about reflection and agency and that quiet panic that comes from realizing that you might be living somebody else's plan. I know I've felt that panic. And Lexi isn't trying to blow up the monarchy. She's just trying to imagine a future where she gets to choose herself. The book is sharp and escapist, and it's surprisingly relatable. And as we all stand on the edge of a new year, thinking about what we want to keep and what we want to release and who we want to become, it feels like exactly the right story to sit with. So if this season has you thinking less about letting life happen and more about choosing what comes next, you're in the right place. Let's turn the page With Rebecca Armitage. Rebecca Armitage, welcome to the club.
- [05:19]
Rebecca Armitage
Thank you so much. It's a huge honor. I still can't believe it.
- [05:23]
Danielle Robay
We are so excited for you. I'm so excited for you. The book is so, so good. And it's a story all about a woman stepping into her power, which who does not want to read about that? Right. But it has another layer because it's about this woman becoming the heir and owning the crown that comes with it. And there are definitely a few nods to real life royals or at least inspired moments, shall I say? So I want to ask you something fun to start off with. Which princess are you most like? Are you most like Princess Diana of Wales, Princess Catherine, Kate Middleton, Princess of Wales, Princess Charlotte, the Next generation Spark, or Princess Anne, officially titled the Princess Royal?
- [06:10]
Rebecca Armitage
Ooh. I don't think I bring princess vibes at all. But if I had to choose, I'd probably go Princess Anne just because, particularly in her youth when she was a little bit mouthy and she was a little bit out of control and she was a little bit impatient. Like, I think if I ever found myself as a princess, that's how I would be. I would not be able to bring the elegance that Kate brings. I just would mess it up, I think. And that's what I love about Anne is she's such a spitfire and she just does whatever she wants and it's paid off. Everyone loves her.
- [06:39]
Danielle Robay
She has this no nonsense attitude. And wasn't she an Olympic equestrian?
- [06:44]
Rebecca Armitage
Yeah, I think that's what's so cool about her is she had a passion and she dedicated her life to that. And I think it took a long time for the British people to understand her because she was very much like her father. She was very impatient and she would just pop off at people. But she was such a hard worker and remained such a hard worker and I think people were like, oh, no, I get her now. She's. She's just utterly herself and she does the job perfectly, but she doesn't pretend ever. Effy.
- [07:09]
Danielle Robay
No pretense, no pretending, no nonsense. I like that about you.
- [07:14]
Rebecca Armitage
Well, hopefully on my best days.
- [07:17]
Danielle Robay
Well, we'll see by the end of the interview. I'll let you know what I think.
- [07:19]
Rebecca Armitage
Yes, please do.
- [07:22]
Danielle Robay
So you describe this book as a modern day fairy tale, but for our protagonist, Lexi, it begins with a major family tragedy and her getting pushed back into the world that she doesn't really want to be in. And I wrote this down. You say that the question that the book answers is really? Is she going to step into this throne that she was given? Like, she's the only person that's really standing in her own way. Which is interesting, because I think in other fairy tales that I've seen, it's like the evil queen or a man or somebody is in their way. But in your book, Lexi is in her own way. So how do you describe a fairy tale?
- [08:01]
Rebecca Armitage
I think there's different versions and different understandings of fairy tales. Like, if you think of a Disney fairy tale that is so different from a Grimm's Brothers fairy tale, like, if you go back to the origins of the story, they're so dark and the. They're full of terrors, and they were conceived to warn children about the dangers of going into the forest. Like, that was the purpose they served. So it was like, if you stray from the family home, this is what's gonna happen. So I think most fairy tales are built around someone leaving the comfort of their home and encountering dangers, but also encountering the thing that's gonna make them who they are. And they have to overcome obstacles. They have to fight against their enemies. But in the case of Lexi, yes, she's got an evil uncle, but the biggest thing she has to overcome is her past traumas, is her sense of self, is her fear of being in love. She really is waging this battle not against dragons or against an evil queen. It's against her own demons in a way.
- [09:03]
Danielle Robay
What do you think makes it modern?
- [09:05]
Rebecca Armitage
Obviously, the setting is contemporary. It's set in the current day. But the forces that she's fighting against are a modern media environment where she's got the tabloids chasing her and twisting her words. There are members of her family who are leaking secrets against her. So she's really fighting against a media narrative rather than a dragon. There are fantastical elements. It's glamorous, and there's designer clothes, and they're hanging around castles. But it's happening in this world. And she's dealing with the things that every young woman who's coming to her 30th birthday is dealing with.
- [09:40]
Danielle Robay
You know, I was really excited when I closed the book and I learned that you were a journalist. I heard that the first big royal event that you covered was Harry and Meghan's wedding back in 2018. And I think that as Americans, we have this absolute fascination with the monarchy because we're so removed from it. Will you give us the gossip?
- [10:02]
Rebecca Armitage
Yeah. Look, I'm not part of the royal rota, which is like the press pool. That follows the royals around. That's only open to British journalists. So I do it from afar. And I truly believe that no journalist will hold back a secret. They can't. They can't do it. Like, if a journalist knows something, they will tell you, because that's just in our nature. We're not discreet people. We are terrible with secrets. So even if they manage it for a few months, eventually they will tell someone who will tell someone. It'll end up in a group chat. So I'd say, like, if you read everything, you probably pretty much know everything. Like, stories are definitely twisted and information is posed in a certain way, way to control the narrative. But I don't think much is being held back from us.
- [10:45]
Danielle Robay
Can I ask you your takes on certain royals?
- [10:48]
Rebecca Armitage
Yes, of course.
- [10:50]
Danielle Robay
Okay. Which royal gives you main character energy in real life?
- [10:54]
Rebecca Armitage
Harry, I think. Harry.
- [10:57]
Danielle Robay
Yeah.
- [10:57]
Rebecca Armitage
Harry was born to be a prince. Like, I think if you think about it as a job, he's so good at his job. He's such a good prince. He is handsome, he is charming. He's. He's amazing with children. He's hilarious, he's extroverted. So he gets energy from those events. So I really think, wow, he was a real loss when they. I think whatever you think about, you know, there's obviously very strong opinions about Harry and Meghan, but I think I was just startled that they allowed them to leave because they were just such assets to the family. And I just couldn't believe that you would let your two most charismatic main characters go.
- [11:35]
Danielle Robay
Yeah, you're right. They really were the main characters.
- [11:38]
Rebecca Armitage
I think it's very clear that the House of Windsor is often torn apart by jealousy. And I think that the fact that they had such star power did not sit well with. It's hard to say if it's royals or the people that work for them, but I think that they were seen as a threat by a lot of people because they got every front page. Every time they had an event, people came out to see them. And I think if. If you don't have that, it can be quite threatening.
- [12:05]
Danielle Robay
Which royal do you think should be an influencer?
- [12:09]
Rebecca Armitage
I actually think it would have been amazing if Diana had lived for many reasons, but I think she would have. Man, she would have just owned that game. Can you imagine if she had an Instagram account? It would just be incredible.
- [12:21]
Danielle Robay
Incredible. Well said. Okay. You know how all the royals have all these fabulous hats? Whose hat Game is on point?
- [12:29]
Rebecca Armitage
I think that Beatrice and Eugenie, like, look, they're not hats I would wear. I'm not really a hat wearer, but I just think it just brings me so much joy every time they come out and they're just wearing the most elaborate headpieces that just. They're like six foot tall. It's just amazing. Like, that's the energy you want a princess to bring, right? It's just like a big hat. So I pay full credit to their hat game.
- [12:53]
Danielle Robay
Now. You could have written about so many things. What about the royals personally fascinates you?
- [12:59]
Rebecca Armitage
I think families are fascinating because families have a way of stripping us of our dignity and our sophistication. Whether it's the family that raised you or the family that you've built, they know you better than anyone. And they've seen you in your worst moments. They've seen you throwing up and sick. And it's hard for you to put on that face that we present to the world like, they know you. But the thing with the royal family is that they're not just a family. They have to present this image of perfection. Like, they don't just have constitutional responsibilities, they have social responsibilities. And that is to basically model the perfect family for the masses. And that's kind of an impossible ask, particularly under the conditions they're in, because they are under a spotlight. Everyone's watching everything they do. They're ranked against each other. And I think that just goes against human nature to know that your brother is more important to the family because he was born first. Like, I just think that does something to a relationship. So for me, it's just like, they are just like us, but they are told that they are better than us. And I think what that does to the human brain is just so fascinating.
- [14:04]
Danielle Robay
When you say they're told they're better than us, you mean like, because they live in a castle or do you think they're actually told that?
- [14:11]
Rebecca Armitage
Yeah, I think they are. And I think every time, sometimes, sometimes they're like, oh, no, you know, just call me William. I'm just like you. But it's. They are told that they have been chosen by God. Like, whether they will admit to it or not that their role within society is that they been chosen by God to be held above all other families. And if you're the monarch in particular, it's in the documents that God has chosen you to be his representative on earth. So I don't know how you execute those duties and dedicate your life to that position if a part of you doesn't secretly believe that's true. Because otherwise why would you do it? It would be like a lie. I just, it would be so stressful. And I think that's, that's the problem for Lexi is I think deep down she's not quite sure if that's true. And I think that's what she really struggles with because she thinks, well, this is just an ancient institution that continues on. I don't believe that we are better than other people.
- [15:07]
Danielle Robay
She has a little more self awareness.
- [15:09]
Rebecca Armitage
Yeah, well, she's had time away and her mother dies when she's young and I think that really sweeps away a lot of her illusions and she starts to question everything and that's why she leaves is because she, I don't think she can hold up the illusion anymore.
- [15:26]
Danielle Robay
At Just Roll, they believe the kitchen is where joy lives with their refrigerated dough. There's no fussy proofing, no hours of waiting. Just big smells, big smiles, and that first irresistible flaky bite. It's tiny hands helping unroll the dough. It's laughing over a slightly wonky cinnamon swirl. It's pulling golden puffed layers out of the oven and hearing that perfect crispy crackle. They do the hard part so you could skip straight to the fun. Just Roll Puff pastry is made with non GMO high quality ingredients ready to roll with parchment paper straight from the fridge. No thawing, no stress, just golden bakery worthy layers every single time. With Just Roll, every bake is simple. From savory show stopping appetizers to sweet dessert masterpieces, this is a fresh way to bake. Familiar but better find Just Roll puff pastry in the refrigerated section of your grocery store. Or visit justroll.com to find a store near you. Today's episode is brought to you by Cotton. We spend a lot of time with stories, hours curled up with dynamic plots and with characters who feel like friends. What if the story isn't just in your hands but also in the world around you, in the fabric that's holding you close? Cotton is that timeless companion. Soft sheets for lazy weekend mornings with a book. Breezy dresses for afternoons spent reading in the backyard. It's the fabric that can be tossed in the wash without fuss. It's about ease, comfort and caring for yourself and the planet. Just like the books we cherish, cotton weaves meaning into our everyday moments. Moments like following four adult daughters as they navigate love, loss and the legacy in the Most Fun We Ever had by Claire Lombardo, all while curled up in soft cotton joggers or sinking into the island of Missing Trees by Elif Shafak A story that spans generations. Forbidden love and a fig tree that remembers everything wrapped in a hand stitched quilt, each thread holding its own kind of memory. Next time you settle in for a chapter, slip into something cotton. Not just to read the story, but to feel it. The fabric of our lives. Learn more at thefabricofourlives.com Being a small.
- [17:34]
Eva Longoria
Business owner isn't just a career, it's a calling. Chase for Business knows how much heart and effort go into building something of your own. That's why we make your business growth our priority. Our team takes the time to understand your mission, where you are now and where you want to go. Our broad range of solutions is designed with you in mind so you can bring your ideas to life. From banking to payment acceptance to credit cards, you can conveniently manage all your business finances all in one place with our digital tools. Looking for tips and advice? Our online resources are always available to give you the solutions you need to help your business thrive. See how your business can go farther with Chase for Business. Learn more@chase.com business chase for business make more of what's yours the Chase Mobile app is available for select mobile devices. Message and data rates. May apply JP Morgan Chase Bank NA Member FDIC Copyright 2025 JP Morgan Chase.
- [18:30]
Trainer Games Narrator
& Co. 10 athletes will face the toughest job interview in fitness that will push past physical and mental breaking points. You are the fittest of the fit. Only one of you will leave here with an IFIT contract worth.
- [18:49]
Rebecca Armitage
$250,000. This is where mindset comes.
- [18:52]
Trainer Games Narrator
In. Someone will be.
- [18:54]
Liberty Mutual Advertiser
Eliminated. Pressure is coming down. Trainer Games on Prime Video January 8th watch the trailer on trainergames.com did you know Microsoft has officially ended Support for Windows 10? Upgrade to Windows 11 with an LG Gram laptop voted PCMag's reader's choice. Top laptop brand for 2025. Thin and ultra lightweight, the LG Gram keeps you productive anywhere, and Windows 11 gives you access to free security updates and ongoing feature upgrades. Visit lgusa.com iheart for great seasonal savings on LG Gram laptops with Windows 11. PCMag reader's choice used with permission. All rights.
- [19:31]
Danielle Robay
Reserved. Three of the main female characters are Lexi, who's our protagonist, Amira, and Isla. Were these characters modeled after any specific.
- [19:41]
Rebecca Armitage
Princesses? Yes. Yeah, absolutely. I openly admit that I used the scaffolding of the House of Windsor to build the fictional House of Villier. So every character has a real life royal that they're very loosely modelled on. So Isla is very, very obviously Diana, and just in the broad strokes, like, I. I've written a lot about her, so I know a lot about her, but I ultimately think that these people are unknowable to us. Like, we don't really know who they were as human beings. We know their iconic image, and you can read a lot about them and get a sense of the person, but they, their true selves don't belong to us. She belongs to Harry and William and the people that knew her. But, yes, Isla, definitely Diana. Lexi, weirdly, is based on a royal from the 16th century called Lady Jane Grey, who was Queen for about two weeks when she was 16. It was a period where there wasn't an obvious heir, so she was just kind of pushed to the front by her husband and her father, and she ruled for two weeks, and then she was executed. And it was just such a tragedy because she was this really smart girl. She spoke 12 languages, and if the conditions had been different, she probably would have been a great queen, but she was just sort of at the mercy of the men around her. And then Emira, I really wanted the experience of an outsider, a commoner who marries into the family. So she's not Meghan and Kate, but I definitely read a lot about their experiences to build that.
- [21:06]
Danielle Robay
Character. So I think at first glance, people might feel like it's giving Princess Diaries a little bit. Obviously, we have the title, which is the heir apparent, and then there's the first line, which, I don't know. Should I read it or. You read it? Because it's an amazing first.
- [21:22]
Rebecca Armitage
Line. You read it. I want to hear you read.
- [21:24]
Danielle Robay
It. Okay, so you write, I was about to kiss my best friend when the helicopter came. It feels very romance, doesn't.
- [21:33]
Rebecca Armitage
It? Yeah. Yeah. And I'm, like, unapologetic about the fact that this is a love.
- [21:37]
Danielle Robay
Story.
- [21:38]
Rebecca Armitage
Yeah. And it will be aspirational and it will be juicy, and I talk about clothes, and I love all that stuff. And I think often women are interested in that stuff, and it is dismissed as frivolous as a result. And I often find the same with royal reporting. Like, it is dismissed as a silly beat of journalism all the.
- [22:00]
Danielle Robay
Time. The only thing, though, is that, like, you would think that this book is romance and whimsical, but it's actually, like, way more complicated and a little dark sometimes. And I think at the heart of the book is the battle often waged in the media, which you're a part of. What was it like writing this from the other side? Or other.
- [22:20]
Rebecca Armitage
Perspective. I think it was me probably working out the complexities of the industry I work in. And I think with royal reporting, like, I'm not deep in it, in the rota, so I'm not talking to courts and I'm not talking to royals. I'm very much removed from that. And so just reporting on it from afar. But it just became quite obvious to me the way royal reporting works. Like, Harry really likes People magazine, and so his people often talk to people. So then you get this sense if Harry or a source close to Harry is quoted in People, you can take that to the bank, that that is Harry's perspective. And then Charles really likes the UK time. So if a source close to Charles is saying something in that, then you know that's probably come from either him or someone close to him. And then you realize that they're talking to each other. So Harry's talking to his father and then his father is responding. And so it's just the most bizarre form of journalism where you are kind of like a carrier pigeon between these two royals who won't just pick up the phone and talk to each other. They are transporting secret messages via the media and. And they're trying to control each other's narrative. And once you understand that, then you can kind of understand the language with which they speak and you can see what's going on. But if you're just a casual reader, you're not going to pick that up. And I have real ethical concerns about that because I think if you hear the way people talk about Meghan and Harry, they've obviously just casually read things here and there, and they've just taken that as Godspell. And it's like, no, there's a certain person who wants you to believe that. And if you just casually dip in and out, you might succumb to lies or mistruths or half truths. And so I think, yeah, for me, definitely, this was me grappling with the industry that I work in and the limits and the way we don't always tell the audience the full truth and what is the ethic of.
- [24:15]
Danielle Robay
That. I'm personally so curious about how you had to transition your writing, because news writing, it's very to the point, and writing a novel, especially fiction, is very different. Did you have to kind of relearn how to write for this genre? Did it come.
- [24:31]
Rebecca Armitage
Naturally? An average news story is about 700 words. So I said, I'll write 700 words a night, because I know I can do that. And if I Just keep going. Eventually a novel will be.
- [24:43]
Danielle Robay
There. How long did it take you to write.
- [24:45]
Rebecca Armitage
It? The first draft took six months. I don't know how I did it because I was working all day. And I have a job where sometimes you're woken up in the middle of the night or, you know, something happens and then everyone's got to jump on a call and figure it out. So I don't really know how I did it. I just had this burst of creative energy that will probably never happen again. But I was just so. I was so in the zone that I just. It was from 8pm to 10pm and I just. And I think because I'm so deadline oriented as a journalist, it was like, well, at 10:00pm I have to. So I better get my 700 words.
- [25:16]
Danielle Robay
In. I remember one time reading a tidbit from Jennifer Garner and her tip for working out was, just get on the treadmill and walk for 10 minutes. Because usually you'll end up walking longer or even running. And it made me think of what you just said, which is like, just get on your computer, in your journal and write 200 words or 300 words, and you'll end up with a whole.
- [25:36]
Rebecca Armitage
Book. Because I think writer's block is often just, you're uncomfortable or you don't really know what to do next, and so you just back away. But I think just write one sentence, and it doesn't even have to be good. Just write it and then usually be like, okay, I'll just write one more, and then you're going. So you just have to push through that initial discomfort, and I think you'll get.
- [25:57]
Danielle Robay
There. Was there ever a moment where you had to toil between fact and fiction? And when I say that, I mean, did you write anything that was too close to the truth and you had to pull back and sort of reimagine.
- [26:09]
Rebecca Armitage
It? Yeah, because I definitely. Pretty much every anecdote in the book, particularly in the first half, is based in fact. So I say that Lexi's father got in trouble because he took a helicopter from London to Cambridge when he could have taken, like, a bus, a train, a car, like, literally anything. And that's something that Prince Andrew did. And there's a scene where Birdie cuts her friend's ear with a sword because she's drunk and she's drunkenly knighting him. Beatrice did that to Ed Sheeran. King Charles apparently has someone who squeezes his toothpaste onto his toothbrush. I just wanted the limits to be. I could use those fun little things, but when it came to really serious stuff and the family law, that had to be fictional, you know, they're ultimately still real people. And I don't want to invade anyone's privacy, you know, with, with Princess Diana, Princess Isla, who was her inspiration, she dies in a, in a boat accident. I was never going to do a car accident because I think Princess Diana is still very alive in the minds of people and I didn't want to pick over a real family's trauma. In a.
- [27:15]
Danielle Robay
Way. Yeah, that makes a lot of sense and that's very kind. I know that you are a digital editor, so I wouldn't expect anything less, but you did an epic book rollout on.
- [27:27]
Rebecca Armitage
Instagram. Thank.
- [27:29]
Danielle Robay
You. It is so good just for everybody if they haven't seen it. Rebecca did this rollout on Instagram and you partnered with your publisher to do a many part series about each step it takes to bring a book into being. Which there are so many fabulous writers and hopeful writers that listen to our podcast. And so I actually recommend that they go watch this series because it's everything from writing it to getting an agent to the COVID process to getting it onto bookshelves and in bookstores. You really demystify it all. Where did this idea come from? I've never seen anyone do.
- [28:04]
Rebecca Armitage
This. It was Lizzie who works at HarperCollins Australia. It was her idea. She's the social media manager there, so she's brilliant. And it was so smart because I was talking to them that often we talk about social media in the news because that's where audiences are now and you have to meet people where they are. And I had noticed as they had, that when you do behind the scenes content, that does really well because people just want to know how things are made. They want to know how it all comes to be. They want a little glimpse behind the curtain. So that was really their brilliant idea. And I learned a lot because I'm very new to this. And so for me, I had no idea how half these things happened as well. So it's like you can all learn from.
- [28:44]
Danielle Robay
Things. If you could share one piece of advice or tidbit to somebody who has dreams of publishing. Is there something you learned in this process that you would pass.
- [28:55]
Rebecca Armitage
On? I think my biggest takeaway, because I'm going to be a first time published author at 40 and that's great and I think that things happen when they're meant to happen. But I do think I probably delayed things a lot because I just didn't have the confidence to do it and I didn't think I'd be able to do it. So I had the idea for the heir apparent from probably about 2018 and I didn't write it until 2023. So there was a five year period where I was thinking about it and obviously Covid happened. So it was like kind of busy and things were crazy. But I don't think I wrote it until I got to the point where I was like, if I don't write this, it's always going to be in my mind. It's going to be haunting my dreams. You know, I'm in the shower and I'm thinking about it. It was just kind of stalking.
- [29:37]
Danielle Robay
Me. And was it the number 40? Was it your 40th birthday or what was it.
- [29:41]
Rebecca Armitage
That. No, I think. I think it just got to a point where I was thinking of nothing else and it was clearly not going away. So I thought if nothing else, I just have to write it. So it exists outside of myself and have no aspirations to get it published, but just so that it exists. And I think with all art that is the goal is it just needs to exist. And I think my fear was that I would fail, that I would write three chapters and then I would give up, or that I would write it and then I might try and get it published and it wouldn't happen. And that would be so heartbreaking to have tried and to have failed. So I think my advice is just do it. Like you never know. But the act of making it is the most important thing. Like the night I finished the first draft is still the biggest moment for me because I did something that I was still for years too scared to do. So I think you just have to write your thing and you need to write every day or as close to every day as possible. That's not possible for everyone if you've got children or unpredictable shifts. But it needs to be a practice and it needs to be a part of your life. So just write and then worry about the logistics later. But don't think, oh, I'm not going to do it. Because hardly anyone gets published. You just never know. And you're not going to know.
- [30:53]
Danielle Robay
Until you try on Instagram today. And I'm sharing this because you're from Australia. There was an Australian marathon and there was an 80 year old man who signed up. And when asked why he signed up to complete it, which he did, he said, I wanted to show all my grandkids to get over their fof. Their fear of.
- [31:12]
Rebecca Armitage
Failure.
- [31:13]
Danielle Robay
Yes. Which I love it that's beautiful. And you got over.
- [31:15]
Rebecca Armitage
Yours. Yeah. Are you going to die thinking, oh, I could have tried. Our time on Earth is so fleeting. You don't want to waste time. And I honestly think that even if you write a novel and it's never published, that's still an accomplishment to have written a novel. So don't let practicality and fear and logistics get in the way. Just make your thing and then just see what.
- [31:38]
Danielle Robay
Happens. You know, my grandfather passed away and he had three film scripts that he never did anything with, but I have them, and they're so special to me, and so I totally agree with you. Even if they're not published, it's such an.
- [31:52]
Rebecca Armitage
Accomplishment. Yeah. And now you have that connection forever. Like that. So beautiful. It doesn't have to be in book form or film form to be real art. Art is the thing that you make for yourself. And the magic of what your grandfather has done is it's now with you. That's all you need to worry about. The rest might happen, but it might not. Doesn't.
- [32:10]
Danielle Robay
Matter. What's so cool is that the magic of what you've written is going to be in so many people's hands. I'm so.
- [32:17]
Rebecca Armitage
Excited. Yeah, I know. I still can't believe it. I still can't believe I got a book deal. I'm still emotionally back.
- [32:22]
Danielle Robay
There. I just imagine people reading this on a train, on the beach, in bed, and it's like, those are your words. It's.
- [32:29]
Rebecca Armitage
Amazing. Yeah. The idea of people being transported and entertained and, you know, staying up for one more chapter, that's all I want. That's all I want. That's so.
- [32:39]
Danielle Robay
Amazing. Yeah. I love asking our guests each week what they've bookmarked. It can be a poem, a quote, a weird fact, something that you've saved on Instagram. Rebecca, what have you bookmarked this.
- [32:52]
Rebecca Armitage
Week? I bookmarked a recipe, actually. It's kind of old, but I highly recommend it. It's Orzo Alemone by Molly Bars, and it's one of those recipes where if you've got nothing in your pantry and nothing in your fridge, you can make dinner. So you just basically need a packet of Orzo, a lemon, and a little bit of Parmesan, and you have a delicious meal. So I highly recommend it because it just will save you when you come home and you're like, oh, my God, what am I going to do? What am I going to make? You can make.
- [33:21]
Danielle Robay
Dinner. That's so fun and easy and spoken like a true journalist that has no time on her.
- [33:26]
Rebecca Armitage
Hands.
- [33:27]
Danielle Robay
Exactly. At Just Roll they believe the kitchen is where joy lives with their refrigerated dough. There's no fussy proofing, no hours of waiting. Just big smells, big smiles and that first irresistible flaky bite. They do the hard part so you could skip straight to the fun. Just Roll Puff Pastry is made with non GMO high quality ingredients ready to roll with parchment paper straight from the fridge. No thawing, no stress, just golden bakery worthy layers every single time. With Just Roll, every bake is simple. From savory show stopping appetizers to sweet dessert masterpieces, this is a fresh way to bake. Familiar but better find Just Roll Puff Pastry in the refrigerated section of your grocery store or visit justroll.com to find today's episode is brought to you by Cotton we spend a lot of time with stories, hours curled up with dynamic plots and with characters who feel like friends. What if the story isn't just in your hands but also in the world around you? In the fabric that's holding you close? Cotton is that timeless companion. Soft sheets for lazy weekend mornings with a book. Breezy dresses for afternoons spent reading in the backyard. It's the fabric that can be tossed in the wash without fuss. Us. It's about ease, comfort and caring for yourself and the planet. Just like the books we cherish, cotton weaves meaning into our everyday moments. Moments like following four adult daughters as they navigate love, loss and the legacy in the Most Fun We Ever had by Claire Lombardo, all while curled up in soft cotton joggers or sinking into the island of Missing Trees by Elif Shafak. A story that spans generations. Forbidden love and a fig tree that remembers everything wrapped in a hand stitched quilt, each thread holding its own kind of memory. Next time you settle in for a chapter, slip into something cotton. Not just to read the story, but to feel it. Cotton the fabric of our lives. Learn more at thefabricofourlives.com Being a.
- [35:28]
Eva Longoria
Small business owner isn't just a career, it's a calling. Chase for business knows how much heart and effort go into building something of your own. That's why we make your business growth our priority. Our team takes the time to understand your mission, where you are now, and where you want to go. Our broad range of solutions is designed with you in mind so you can bring your ideas to life. From banking to payment acceptance to credit cards, you can conveniently manage all your business finances all in one place with our digital tools looking for tips and advice. Our online resources are always available to give you the solutions you need to help your business thrive. See how your business can go farther with Chase for Business. Learn more@chase.com business chase for business Make More of what's yours the Chase Mobile app is available for select mobile devices. Message and data rates may apply JP Morgan Chase Bank NA Member FDIC Copyright 2025 JP Morgan Chase & Co.
- [36:26]
Trainer Games Narrator
10 athletes will face the toughest job interview in fitness that will push past physical and and mental breaking points. You are the fittest of the fit. Only one of you will leave here with an IFIT contract.
- [36:43]
Rebecca Armitage
Worth $250,000. This is where mindset.
- [36:46]
Trainer Games Narrator
Comes in. Someone will.
- [36:48]
Rebecca Armitage
Be eliminated. Pressure is.
- [36:50]
Liberty Mutual Advertiser
Coming down. Trainer Games on Prime Video January 8th watch the trailer on trainergames.com did you know Microsoft has officially ended Support for Windows 10? Upgrade to Windows 11 with an LG Gram laptop, voted PCMag's Reader's Choice top laptop brand for 2025. Thin and ultra lightweight, the LG Gram keeps you productive anywhere, and Windows 11 gives you access to free security updates and ongoing feature upgrades. Visit lgusa.com iheart for great seasonal savings on LG Gram laptops with Windows 11. PCMag reader's choice used with permission. All.
- [37:25]
Danielle Robay
Rights reserved. So I want to dig into the book. I is obviously giving Diana her daughter Lexi. I know you said she is Lady Jane Grey, but there is kind of Prince Harry codes a little bit. There is the story kind of like, what if Prince Harry was thrown a rope and given a way out? What would have happened? I feel like you were.
- [37:49]
Rebecca Armitage
Imagining that the first seed of the book was I was asked to collate some vision, I think, of Harry and Meghan's wedding preparations. And at that point I didn't really know much about royalty at all. So that was back in 2018 and it was very clear that they were in love and he was thrilled to marry her. But there are a couple of occasions where he had this look on his face where he looked really stressed or really upset about something. And I now think that he, like Diana, has no poker face. You can always see what he's feeling and thinking on his face. He's just one of those people. And I was like, oh, that's weird. He just looks really worried about something. And it planted this seed where I thought, what happens if you're royal but you don't want it? Are you allowed to leave? How does that work? And that was the first idea for the book. So Harry's intricately involved in the conception of the book. And then. And then obviously he went through with it and he stepped back as a working royal. And then I had this real life case study of what happens to a person when they do that, which I was not expecting, but it was obviously incredibly valuable to me as a journalist and a writer to do. I had this idea and then I saw it literally happening to a person. But I think it was ultimately, for me, I think there's this bargain you make with royalty, even though you're born into it, so you don't really get a choice where in exchange for privilege, money, fame, jewels, everything, you have to let people into your life and let them follow you. And your wedding needs to be televised. And when your children are christened.
- [39:22]
Danielle Robay
If you.
- [39:22]
Rebecca Armitage
About you. Yeah, that is the. That is the exchange. And what Harry did was say, I'm not interested in this exchange anymore. And he stepped back. And I think the anger from sections of the public was really telling because they felt like he'd broken that agreement.
- [39:37]
Danielle Robay
With them. But what did you have to change in the book? Because Lexi's obviously a woman, so there's like added things to grapple with, added elements. I.
- [39:47]
Rebecca Armitage
Would say. Yeah, I think I wanted it to be a woman because I felt more comfortable writing from the perspective of women, firstly. But I also really wanted to play with the idea that I think as little girls, we are taught that being a princess is the ultimate status you could ever achieve. Like, we watch Disney movies and fairy tales and all this. It's just so steeped in our culture that there is no greater status as a woman than being a princess. So what happens if a princess is like, I don't want this, I don't want anything to do with this. What is the vitriol that she's going to face? She's going to be completely slammed by the press. She's going to be smeared. So I really wanted to play with that idea of what happens when you're given the thing that we are all told to want and you don't want it. And I do think that the way women are treated in the tabloids was worthy of exploration as well. The way they treat her weight loss and weight gain, the way she's just picked over as.
- [40:45]
Danielle Robay
Public property. Well, to your point, one of the themes that stuck out to me was appearance as armor. And especially for female characters, it's very clear when the royals do it, I think women do it on a daily basis, regardless of if they're royals or not. What are you saying about all.
- [41:01]
Rebecca Armitage
Of us. That's why there's a lot of talk about outfits in the book. I talk about clothes a lot, not just because I enjoy fashion, but because I think that is, like, a weapon that royal women wield, and it's often the only weapon they have. They can't do interviews that often. They can't do television interviews. They can't really write books. They can't release press releases. They can't go on Instagram live and, you know, to speak their truth. Like, they often. They're told that they never complain, never explain. So they have to communicate their messages in other ways. And often that is through clothes. And you can see that. Like, you can tell sometimes Princess Kate will wear an outfit where she. You almost can't see her. There was a Christmas a few years ago where she was wearing this dark green hat and coat, and she faded into the background to the point where you actually kind of missed her in the photo. And that was a deliberate choice that whatever was happening that year, she wanted to be in the background. And then sometimes she'll wear a really bright color and she'll be in the foreground. And those choices are made very deliberately. And I think we all do that as well, you know, And I think, particularly for women, if you go to work, you think, well, is this skirt too short? Is this jacket too tight? What does this say about me? And it's not what you think of you, it's how other people are going to interpret you. So we're all speaking a language with.
- [42:19]
Danielle Robay
Our clothes. Well, I think another idea in your book is inheritance. Even if you're not royal or don't have money or jewels coming to you, we all inherit legacy. And I realized that legacy is more about what you leave in people than what you leave for them. And we all have that from our bloodlines. I can feel the pride when you talk about this book. And I'm wondering what you've inherited from your mom that she'd be proud of you sharing in.
- [42:47]
Rebecca Armitage
This world. I definitely inherited from her a love of reading. I had the chickenpox when I was 5 or 6, and she bought me a babysitter's little sister club book. And that was meant to last me the week. And I read it in a day, and she was like, oh, I think I have a reader, and she loves reading, and she's got no ego about what she reads. It's just she's always got a book going. She probably reads two books a week. I was allowed to borrow any book I wanted from the library. Like, she basically said to them, whatever she wants, it's fine. So I read, like, Silence of the Lambs when I was 11 or 12, which is probably a little bit inappropriate, but she was like, you're reading. That's all I want from you. And I think reading is how you learn to become a writer. So this absolutely would not have happened if she had not bought me that babysitter's little.
- [43:31]
Danielle Robay
Sister book. That's amazing. I wrote down so many questions when I was reading your book. And not questions about the book, but questions that the book left with me that I wanted to start asking myself or my friends or considering. Can I read you a few of them to see if you meant for these.
- [43:49]
Rebecca Armitage
Or not?
- [43:50]
Danielle Robay
Of course. Okay. So I wrote down, what does it mean to inherit power you didn't.
- [43:55]
Rebecca Armitage
Ask for? I think it can be incredibly dangerous. I think inherited power is probably a scourge on the earth and probably shouldn't happen because power should be something that is bestowed upon people who have sought it and campaigned for it and who have made a reasonable argument for why they should be entrusted.
- [44:19]
Danielle Robay
With it. Speaking of power, my next one was, can you ever truly reconcile love.
- [44:23]
Rebecca Armitage
And power? I think it's really hard. I think they are in many ways polar opposites of each other. I think, you know, tyranny and love are probably polar opposites, but power can so easily slip into tyranny, you know? So I think. I don't think that you have to sacrifice love to get power or sacrifice power to get love, but I think it can be probably one of the most difficult things a human being can do. But then you look at the Obamas and they have both, so it is definitely possible. But I think it's a negotiation, and there's probably a lot of sacrifice on.
- [44:57]
Danielle Robay
Both parts. And lastly, what does it cost to tell.
- [45:01]
Rebecca Armitage
The truth? I think it can cost you everything that you have, but I think that secrets can also make us really sick. And holding onto secrets, it's. It's like it festers inside you, and sometimes the only option you have is to tell the truth, even though it's going to cost you.
- [45:20]
Danielle Robay
A lot. Did writing this book change you in any way? Do you feel like a different person from manuscript to.
- [45:27]
Rebecca Armitage
Published author? I think it's probably made me a more confident person because I think the lack of confidence was the thing holding me back from writing it in the first place. So I think I've lost a lot of fear. One of the things you find when you Write a book. Is that when you tell people, they're like, oh, I've always wanted to write a book, or I've got this manuscript and now I'm like, you've just got to do it and you've just got to try. Which was probably not my vibe before this. So I think it's definitely changed my outlook on life in the sense that I'm like, you just have to take the risk because you don't want to get to the end of your life and realize that you never gave it.
- [46:01]
Danielle Robay
A shot. Rebecca Armitage, published authority, journalist and inspirational speaker. I'm adding.
- [46:09]
Rebecca Armitage
A title. Sure, I'll.
- [46:10]
Danielle Robay
Take that. Okay, so we are coming up on the end of our conversation, which means it's time for speed read. I'm going to see how many rapid fire literary questions you can get through. Are.
- [46:23]
Rebecca Armitage
You ready?
- [46:23]
Danielle Robay
I'm ready. Okay. Three, two, one. Who is your favorite fictional.
- [46:29]
Rebecca Armitage
Royal family? Ooh, I really love the Princess Diaries. I want to live in Genovia. I want her to be my grandmother. Like, it's just. Yeah, send me that.
- [46:39]
Danielle Robay
Right now. Okay. Your favorite book about journalism.
- [46:42]
Rebecca Armitage
Or media? I. Look, it's. It's the one everyone reaches for, but there's a book called. It's actually, it's about being an author, really. But Stephen King's On Writing was so fundamental to me as a journalist, and just the way he breaks. Breaks things down so practically. So if you want to be a journalist or a writer or write anything at all, I highly recommend.
- [47:05]
Danielle Robay
That book. What book do you wish you could read again for the.
- [47:08]
Rebecca Armitage
First time? I love a book called the Lost Flowers of Alice Hart by Holly Ringland. It's about a young woman who grows up in a domestic violence ribbon family. And then she tries to break that cycle. It's the most beautifully.
- [47:22]
Danielle Robay
Written book. Who is your desert island author? Who are you reading for the rest of.
- [47:26]
Rebecca Armitage
Your life? I'm going to take with me Daphne.
- [47:29]
Danielle Robay
Du Maurier. Favorite fictional character, one that you think you're secretly.
- [47:32]
Rebecca Armitage
Most like. Ooh, I think I'm a lot actually like the unnamed narrator in the book Rebecca, which I was your namesake. Yeah, I was actually named after the book Rebecca, but Rebecca, yeah, she's. She doesn't actually appear in the book Rebecca. She's long past and it's the new Mrs. De Winter, but she's this all seeing character who thinks that she's not worthy and she lacks a lot of confidence. And then she slowly, slowly grows up. So that's one of my favorite Books. And I always identify with that.
- [48:08]
Danielle Robay
Unnamed woman. What's a book that shaped the way you see.
- [48:10]
Rebecca Armitage
The world? Probably there's an Australian book called Boy Swallows Universe by Trent Dalton, and it's considered Australia's great novel. It's about a young journalist, actually. He grew up in the suburbs of Brisbane, and he eventually became a crime writer. And it's just the most beautifully written book. And it's totally shaped my view of Australia and of.
- [48:29]
Danielle Robay
The world. You have 10 minutes in a bookstore. Where are.
- [48:32]
Rebecca Armitage
You headed? First I'm going to New Releases, Then I'm going to the romance section. Then I'm going to the desk to ask.
- [48:38]
Danielle Robay
For recommendations. Have you ever recommended a book to somebody without ever.
- [48:42]
Rebecca Armitage
Reading it? I don't think so, because I would be scared that I'd done the wrong thing. So I try.
- [48:48]
Danielle Robay
Not to. Who would narrate your.
- [48:50]
Rebecca Armitage
Memoir audiobook? I'm gonna pick Helen Mirren just because I love.
- [48:53]
Danielle Robay
Her voice. Yeah, love. I thought you were gonna say Naomi Watts. Cause you guys kind of look alike, but Helen Maron is.
- [48:59]
Rebecca Armitage
So iconic. Yeah. Well, thank you. Naomi Watts is everything, so thank you.
- [49:04]
Danielle Robay
For that. Absolutely. Rebecca, this book is so fabulous and so fun, and I'm so excited for everybody to read it. So thank you so much for.
- [49:16]
Rebecca Armitage
Joining us. Well, thank you for having me on. It's.
- [49:19]
Danielle Robay
An honor. In the very first episode, I told you that I loved Great Shoes and great books because they both take us places. And honestly, the books and authors and actors and artists that we've talked to this season have taken us everywhere. Emotionally, intellectually, occasionally existentially. And one of my biggest takeaways from almost every author we've spoken to is this. So many of them carried a book in their heart for years before ever writing it. And once they finally did, every single one said it was life changing. No regrets, no looking back, just the thought of, why didn't I do this sooner? So if you have a story in you, write it down. And if the thing on your heart isn't a story, maybe it's building a family or a business or finally sending that email that you've been drafting in your notes app for three years. Let's make this the year you take a step toward it. Small counts. Nervous. It counts. Googling. How do I even start? Absolutely counts. I actually did that the other day. I just think it's all about taking small steps towards something bigger. And that brings me to this idea of being legendary. Someone said that word the other day, and I decided to look up the Latin root, which is legere, and it means things to be read. Can you believe that? So in the Middle Ages, it referred to stories about the lives of saints that were read aloud during religious services. Stories, legends. Being legendary isn't about being louder or bigger or more online. It's about being lasting. It's the quiet power of impact, the way something you said built or dared keeps rippling through other people's lives long after the moment has passed. And what things last? Words and books and stories and sometimes a good pair of shoes that they're really made. Well, you know, that's it for this episode of Bookmarked. Getting to share these stories with you over the last six months has been such an honor. I cannot wait to continue learning and laughing with you in the new year. We have so much fun stuff coming. I'll see you in 2026. Stay tuned. If you want a little bit more from us, come hang with us on socials. We're at Reese's Book Club on Instagram serving up books, vibes and behind the scenes magic. And I'm Danielle Robay. R O B A Y Come say hi and DM me. And if you want to go 90s on us, you can call us. Okay, so our phone line is open, so call us now at 501291 3379. That's 501-291-3379. Share your literary hot takes, your.
- [52:06]
Rebecca Armitage
Book.
- [52:06]
Danielle Robay
Recommendations. Ooh. Please share those and questions about the monthly pick or just let us know what you think about the episode you just heard. And who knows, you might just hear yourself in our next episode. So don't be shy, give us a ring. And of course, make sure to follow Bookmarked by Reese's Book Club on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your shows. Until then, see you in the next chapter. Bookmarked is a production of hello Sunshine and iheart Podcast. It's executive produced by Reese Witherspoon and me, Danielle Robaix. Production is by Acast Creative Studios. Our producers are Matty Foley, Brittany Martinez and Sarah Schlied. Our production assistant is Avery Loftus. Jenny Kaplan and Emily Rutter are the executive producers for AK Cast Creative Studios. Maureen Polo and Reese Witherspoon are the executive producers for hello Sunshine. Olga Kaminwa, Sarah Kernerman, Kristin Perla and Ashley Rapoport are associate producers for Reese's Book Club. Ally Perry and Lauren Hanson are the executive producers for iHeart podcasts. Today's episode is brought to you by Cotton we spend a lot of time with stories, hours curled up with dynamic plots and characters who feel like friends. What if the story isn't just in your hands but also in the world around you, in the fabric that's holding you close? Cotton is that timeless companion. Soft sheets for a lazy weekend morning with a book. Breezy dresses for afternoons spent reading in the backyard. It's the fabric that can be tossed in the wash without fuss. Us. It's about ease, comfort and caring for yourself and the planet. Just like books we cherish, cotton weaves meaning into everyday moments. Next time you settle in for a chapter, slip into something cotton. Not just to read the story, but to feel it. Cotton the fabric of our lives. Learn more at thefabricofourlives.com@just roll they believe the kitchen is where joy lives with their refrigerated dough. There's no fussy proofing, no hours of waiting. Just big smells, big smiles and that first irresistible flaky bite. It's tiny hands helping unroll the dough. It's laughing over a slightly wonky cinnamon swirl. It's pulling golden puffed layers out of the oven and hearing that perfect crispy crackle. They do the hard part so you could skip straight to the fun. Just Roll. Puff Pastry is made with non GMO high quality ingredients ready to roll with parchment paper straight from the fridge. No thawing, no stress, just golden bakery worthy layers every single time. With Just Roll, every bake is simple. From savory show stopping appetizers to sweet dessert masterpieces, this is a fresh way to bake. Familiar but better. Find JustRoll Puff Pastry in the refrigerated section of your grocery store or visit justroll.com to find a store.
- [54:58]
Liberty Mutual Advertiser
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- [55:37]
Danielle Robay
Call that?
- [55:37]
Liberty Mutual Advertiser
Come on. Hey ref, why don't you customize your car insurance with Liberty Mutual and.
- [55:43]
Rebecca Armitage
Save money? I don't think you get.
- [55:46]
Liberty Mutual Advertiser
What we're doing Sure I do. We're all just giving him advice. You guys on sports, me on.
- [55:51]
Danielle Robay
Saving money. Nope, that's.
- [55:53]
Liberty Mutual Advertiser
Not it. Only pay for what you.
- [55:55]
Rebecca Armitage
Need@Libertymutual.Com Liberty. Liberty.
- [55:57]
Trainer Games Narrator
Liberty. Liberty. 10 athletes will face the toughest job interview in fitness that will push past physical and and mental breaking points. You are the fittest of the fit. Only one of you will leave here with an IFIT contract.
- [56:17]
Rebecca Armitage
Worth $250,000. This is where mindset.
- [56:20]
Trainer Games Narrator
Comes in. Someone will.
- [56:22]
Rebecca Armitage
Be eliminated. Pressure is.
- [56:23]
Liberty Mutual Advertiser
Coming down. Trainer Games on Prime Video January 8th. Watch the trailer on trainergames.com.
- [56:29]
Danielle Robay
This is an I heart podcast.