Borrowed Future – Ep 7: How to Pay For College Without Student Loans

Date: November 11, 2019
Host: Ramsey Network, George Kamel
Featured Experts: Anthony O'Neal, Rachel Cruze, Seth Godin, Dave Ramsey, Financial Aid Officers, and more

Overview

This episode tackles the core question at the heart of the student debt crisis: How can students and families pay for college without taking out student loans? Featuring financial experts, real college students, and parents, it lays out practical steps, busts myths about college costs, and offers hope (plus a challenge) to anyone who wants to graduate debt-free. The central message is clear: Paying for college without debt is challenging, but entirely possible—and it starts with making deliberate, sometimes countercultural choices.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

The Student Loan Crisis at a Glance

• The U.S. is currently facing a $1.6 trillion student loan crisis, affecting millions ([04:44])
• The societal myth is that student debt is “good debt,” but the show challenges this notion decisively.

Six Steps to a Debt-Free Degree

Anthony O’Neal (author of Debt-Free Degree) lays out a six-step process ([04:16–09:20]):

1. Take Debt Off The Table
   • Decide upfront: No student loans, no credit cards, “debt is completely removed” from consideration.
   • “The number one thing we have to decide today, right now… is that debt is no longer an option.” – Anthony O’Neal ([04:27])
2. Have a Vision
   • Know your goals and write them down.
   • “Where there is no vision, that’s where people perish.” – Anthony O’Neal ([04:43])
   • Develop daily habits to work toward that vision.
3. Research and Prep
   • Look into 3–5 affordable schools, prep for their requirements (grades, volunteer hours, tests, etc.).
   • Plan early—not at the last minute.
4. Decision Day
   • Make a firm decision to attend a school that can be paid for via scholarships, grants, and work—no loans.
   • Don’t be distracted by prestige or peer pressure.
5. Work, Save, and Behave
   • Work 10–19 hours per week, live on a budget, stay focused.
   • “When you walk onto the college campus, you’re a young man or woman with character and integrity.” ([08:33])
6. Walk the Stage Debt Free
   • Graduate with pride—and continue to avoid debt after college.

The Critical Mistake: College Choice

• Rachel Cruze: “The number one mistake students make when it comes to college is college choice... they’re simply going to a school they cannot afford.” ([10:41])
• Community college, online classes, or an in-state public university are often the most financially sound options.

Busting the Prestige Myth

• Seth Godin: Acceptance at selective schools is often “random,” and being accepted or rejected “means nothing about you.” ([11:40–13:43])
  • “Go find a door you can afford and go game the system…so you’re not starting with free and easy money you’ll be paying off for decades.” ([13:15])

Parental Role and the Guilt Trap

• Dave Ramsey: “Where you go to school is a choice. And what you pay for it mathematically is the biggest problem you’re facing.” ([13:57–15:53])
• Parents are not obligated to cover their child’s full college expenses; focus on guiding, not sacrificing retirement.
• “You are not a child abuser if you do not pay for your child’s college.” – Dave Ramsey ([46:07])

How to Maximize Scholarships & Free Money

The Reality of Financial Aid

• Brent Tenner (Vanderbilt): Financial aid comes in several forms: grants/scholarships (free money), loans, and work-study. ([17:11])
• Colleges differ greatly in how they award aid; deadlines are critical.

The Scholarship Hunt

• $2.9 billion in scholarships go unclaimed every year ([20:29])
• Barriers: Many students feel too busy, underestimate their chances, or miss deadlines. Local organizations often beg for applicants. ([21:11])

Guidance Counselor:

• “They just don’t get it in by the deadline.” ([22:18])
• Academic scholarships typically have deadlines in November or December—don’t procrastinate.

Anthony O’Neal:

• Treat scholarship hunting like a job.
  • “Every single day for one hour...looking up grants and scholarships like it’s your job.” ([24:04])
• One student raised $88,000 over 4 years using this discipline ([24:41])

Practical Scholarship Advice

• Ryan Davis (Ramsey Education):
  • Get great grades and scores (ACT/SAT).
  • Build a well-rounded resume (volunteer, activities, etc.).
  • Search for scholarships at least an hour a day. ([26:04])
• Kyle (math teacher):
  • Success came from retaking the ACT, applying last-minute, and chasing even small local scholarships like the “Gene Scholarship.” ([27:21-30:33])
• Christina:
  • Graduated debt-free after winning $500,000 in scholarships.
  • Her mom started the "you’ll need to pay for college on your own" conversation as a freshman in high school.
  • “Once you go for a few big scholarships, you have great application materials that you can recycle.” ([31:34–35:15])

Parents: How (and Whether) to Fund College

Protect Your Finances First

• Anthony O’Neal: Don’t cash out retirement or sacrifice your own stability.
  • “The best way you can help your kid…is to make sure that you are financially set.” ([35:29])
• Use the debt snowball to get out of debt, then fully fund your emergency savings, then start investing for retirement before contributing to college funds.
  • Let your child have “sweat equity” in their education.

Savings Vehicles

• ESA (Education Savings Account): Up to $2,000/year per child, grows tax-free
• 529 Plan: Higher limits, tax-free growth, but more restrictions ([39:11])

Late Start? Cash Flow College

• Brad Barnett (JMU): For parents “late in the game,” examine your current budget to find cash for tuition and avoid loans. ([41:11])
• Making changes in the present is better than simply defaulting to loans.

Honest Family Conversations

• Rachel Cruze: Have the college cost/responsibility chat early and honestly.
  • “The biggest blessing you can do early on in your child’s life is talk about the subject and talk about what you have prepared.” ([42:57])
• Dave Ramsey: Not paying for college is not “child abuse”—sometimes helping too much actually harms.
• Chris Hogan: Don’t borrow against your home or 401(k)—and have ongoing money conversations with your child ([48:05])

Start Money Talk Early

• Anthony O’Neal:
  • “When should I start the conversation with my kids? ...As early as you can. As soon as they can start talking.”
  • Instill proper planning and work ethic throughout childhood so that debt-free college is always the expectation ([50:36])

Real-Life Inspiration: The Immigrant Story

• Mladin, Croatian Immigrant:
  • Came to the U.S. as a refugee with $200, spoke no English, and got a master’s degree debt-free by working full-time, using employer tuition assistance, and never considering loans ([53:22-58:52]).
  • “Not having the debt sets you free. Your decision-making process is way, way different.” ([58:57])

Final Thoughts & Memorable Quotes

• “I would rather you live like a college student while you’re in college than try to live like a 25-year-old and then graduate and have to go back to live like a college student because you have no money and so much debt.” – [62:45]
• “If I can do it, so can you. Here’s the advantage you have over me—you’re young.” – Anthony O’Neal ([61:40])

Notable Quotes by Segment & Speaker

• Anthony O’Neal, on Commitment:

  “Take debt off the table...we’re not touching student loans, we’re not touching credit cards, we’re not financing cars…Debt is completely removed.” ([04:20])

• Seth Godin, on College Admissions:

  “Getting in means nothing. Getting rejected means nothing about you...go find a door you can afford and go game the system.” ([12:53–13:15])

• Dave Ramsey, to Parents:

  “You are not a child abuser if you do not pay for your child’s college...” ([46:07])

• Christina, $500k in scholarships:

  “I treated [scholarship searching] basically like a part time job. My mom would often go to the library with me and we would stay up late at night digging through scholarship databases…” ([31:34])

• Mladin, on living debt-free:

  “Not having the debt sets you free. And your decision-making process is way, way different.” ([58:57])

Timestamps for Key Segments

• 04:16–09:20 — Anthony O'Neal's six steps for debt-free college
• 10:41–11:15 — Rachel Cruze: The college choice mistake
• 11:40–13:43 — Seth Godin: The random truth about college admissions
• 13:57–15:53 — Dave Ramsey: Mathematically, college choice matters
• 17:11–20:29 — Basics of financial aid & maximizing free money
• 21:11–22:56 — Guidance counselor: Why students miss scholarships
• 24:04–25:43 — Anthony O'Neal: Scholarship strategy success story
• 26:04–26:59 — Ryan Davis: Practical steps for students (grades, volunteering, searching)
• 27:21–30:33 — Kyle's story: Local scholarships & debt-free degree
• 31:34–35:15 — Christina's story: $500,000 in scholarships
• 35:29–39:11 — Anthony O’Neal: How parents should approach college savings & priorities
• 41:11–42:57 — Brad Barnett: Budgeting and late-stage college planning
• 42:57–44:35 — Rachel Cruze: Open parent-student communication
• 46:07–47:34 — Dave Ramsey: Parents should feel zero guilt
• 48:05–50:23 — Chris Hogan: Financial mistakes parents make
• 50:36–52:45 — Anthony O'Neal: Start money conversations young
• 53:22–58:52 — Mladin’s immigrant journey to a debt-free degree

Summary Takeaways

• Paying for college without debt is possible—but it requires determination, early planning, smart choices, relentless scholarship hunting, and honest family conversations.
• Parents: Take care of your own financial house first. Offer guidance, not martyrdom.
• Students: Your daily actions and willingness to hustle are the difference.
• Don’t believe the myth that everyone must borrow or that “school prestige” is worth mountains of debt.
• Every family’s situation is different, but the debt-free path is open to all who will take it.

For more resources and future episodes, visit borrowedfuture.com.