Breaking Points with Krystal and Saagar

Episode Date: November 19, 2025
Main Topics: Trump Meets MBS, MTG Calls Trump Traitor, Epstein’s Rothschild Bank Ties, Obama Official on Holocaust Education

Episode Overview

This episode centers on a high-stakes diplomatic meeting between Donald Trump and Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman (MBS) at the White House, the political fallout from a historic House vote to release Jeffrey Epstein-related files, and an examination of shifting social attitudes on Israel, antisemitism, and the impact of Holocaust education. The hosts—Krystal Ball and Saagar Enjeti—navigate complex global politics (Saudi-US relations, Middle East peace efforts), domestic political drama (Marjorie Taylor Greene vs. Trump), and revelations about elite banking, cyberwarfare, and intelligence circles. They close with a fiery critique of the establishment’s response to evolving narratives about Israel and Gaza.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Trump’s White House Summit with MBS and US-Saudi Relations

[02:23–13:00]

• Recap of Visit & Announcements:

  • MBS visited the White House. Trump designated Saudi Arabia as a “major non-NATO ally” and announced a new Strategic Defense Agreement.
    • Trump: “Tonight, I’m pleased to announce that we are taking our military cooperation to even greater heights by formally designating Saudi Arabia as a major non-NATO ally... and signing a historic Strategic Defense Agreement.” (07:55)
  • The move followed similar deals with other Gulf countries in the wake of Israeli military actions.

• Mutual Flattery, Realpolitik, and the Khashoggi Murder:

  • Trump was effusive while fielding questions about MBS, brushing aside questions about the murder of journalist Jamal Khashoggi.
  • MBS called the Khashoggi killing “a huge mistake,” downplaying responsibility.
  • Krystal riffs, incredulously, “Did he say that it was a mistake that they carved him into pieces?” (12:28)
  • Trump: “[MBS has] done a phenomenal job. You’re mentioning somebody that was extremely controversial... but he knew nothing about it and we can leave it at that. You don’t have to embarrass our guest by asking a question like that.” (11:32)

• Normalization with Israel & the Abraham Accords:

  • Trump pressed MBS on Saudi normalizing relations with Israel, but Saudi officials reiterated demand for movement on a two-state solution.
  • MBS: “We want peace for the Israelis. We want peace for the Palestinians. We want them to coexist peacefully in the region.” (28:08)

• Tone and Subtext:

  • Saagar notes Trump’s “bullying, alpha dog” style toward MBS—slapping his knee, ribbing him, and putting him on the spot.
    • “It’s a level of friendliness you’d rarely see with any foreign leader, let alone the Crown Prince of Saudi Arabia.” (29:04)
  • The hosts reflect on the United States’ willingness to “deny, not overlook” egregious acts (Khashoggi murder) for strategic gain, and the normalization of relations with once-toxic actors.
    • Krystal: “In some ways, it’s humiliating, but in other ways, it’s just a blunt way out. It’s like, we’re not going to overlook that he did this. We’re just going to deny it… Don’t embarrass our guest.” (16:31)

2. House Unanimously Votes to Release Epstein Files (& Political Fallout)

[33:57–45:31]

• Marjorie Taylor Greene’s Press Conference:

  • MTG claims Trump called her a traitor for pushing to release Epstein files; asserts people power drove a rare bipartisan action:
    • MTG: “A traitor is an American that serves foreign countries and themselves. A patriot is an American that serves the United States… This only became possible today because the American people… demanded that this vote happen.” (34:28)

• Trump’s Tense Position & Partisan Dynamics:

  • Saagar: “This is an issue that just absolutely embodies what people see as the swamp. And you can’t kind of hand wave it away.” (36:25)
  • Krystal speculates on Trump’s resistance: “For Trump to hold on this long really makes you wonder—what is he worried about is in there?” (38:22)

• Bipartisan Obstruction—Who’s Protecting Whom?

  • They discuss why presidents (Democratic and Republican alike) have moved cautiously, suggesting the real incentive is “protecting the intelligence community.”
    • Saagar: “The one incentive that ties them together is protecting the intelligence community. That explains the reluctance on both their parts.” (39:11)
  • Krystal: “If you’re not connected to the crimes, fine. But if your name is in the emails and you were trading your power as a US official to try to sleep with a Chinese Communist Party official’s daughter... sorry if that’s going to cause you a few days of bad press.” (42:19)

• The MTG–Trump Rift:

  • MTG publicly criticizes Trump for prioritizing personal allegiances and exposing herself to political risk to stand with Epstein survivors.

3. Epstein’s Banking and Cyber Connections: Rothschild Bank & Israeli Cyberweapons

[51:25–61:08]

• Epstein, Swiss Rothschild Bank, and Israeli Cyber:

  • Krystal details new reporting: Epstein cultivated ties to the Swiss Rothschild Bank to finance ex-Israeli PM Ehud Barak’s cyberweapons ventures.
    • “Jeffrey Epstein pursued Swiss Rothschild bank to finance Israeli cyber weapons empire.” (51:25)
    • The relationship, initially denied by the bank, was in fact “very, very deep.”
    • Ariane de Rothschild directly courted Barak via Epstein: “If Ehud wants to make serious money, he will have to build a relationship with me, take time so that we can truly understand one another.” (Krystal quoting email, 56:00)
  • Epstein also connected Rothschild to powerful defense and cyber companies that are now ubiquitous online (referencing Akamai, Gardacor, etc.).
  • “They really made our world in a significant way... and are doing it again just so casually in their emails.” (59:27)

• Tech, Intelligence, and Casual Corruption:

  • The hosts marvel at the informality and arrogance in these circles: government officials, bankers, and tech visionaries exchanging messages about “national security, literally global security and just making money off of it, changing the world like it’s nothing.” (60:35)
  • Suggests mainstream media still underreports or understates Epstein’s true role—as a “fixer,” connector, and possible blackmailer at the intersection of politics, espionage, and finance.

4. Obama Official Critiques Holocaust Education in the Social Media Era

[62:30–73:18]

• Viral Clip from Sarah Hurwitz, Obama Speechwriter:

  • Hurwitz laments that Holocaust education and unfiltered social media imagery (particularly from Gaza) have led young people to instinctively side with “powerless” Palestinians over “powerful” Israelis, fueling antisemitism.
    • Hurwitz: “TikTok just smashing our young people’s brains all day long with video of carnage in Gaza... They learn about big, strong Nazis hurting weak, emaciated Jews... So [when] they see powerful Israelis hurting weak, skinny Palestinians... they think the lesson of the Holocaust is you fight Israel.” (63:15)

• Hosts’ Critique:

  • Krystal pipes up, “My worldview is being rejected because people are seeing images of carnage, people are seeing facts… It’s not my worldview that needs to change. It isn’t that we should end the carnage. We should end the Holocaust education, and we should make sure that we can kill social media so people don’t see the images.” (65:08)
  • Saagar: “That’s the death rattle of the gatekeepers… She is truly upset that people have access to information that previously… was kept out.” (65:23)
  • Krystal: “Even if you don’t care about the people themselves. It looks really bad.” (69:40)
  • They both emphasize that a basic human/animal sense of justice is offended by images of civilians being bombed, regardless of educational framing.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On US-Saudi Relations & Khashoggi:

  • Trump: “He’s done a phenomenal job... a lot of people didn’t like that gentleman you’re talking about. Whether you like him or not, things happen.” (11:32)
  • MBS: “It’s painful and it’s a huge mistake.” (17:37)
  • Krystal: “‘Bureaucratic error, you know, he wanted documents to get married. They thought he wanted to be chopped into pieces. These things happen.’” (17:51)

• On Epstein and Elites:

  • Krystal: “If your name is in the emails and you didn’t do anything wrong, fine. If your name is in the emails and you were trading your power... for your own personal gain… sorry if that’s going to cause you a few days of bad press.” (42:19)

• On Social Media & Holocaust Education:

  • Hurwitz: “Unfortunately, the very smart bet we made on Holocaust education as anti-Semitism education… is beginning to break down… they think, ‘oh, the lesson of the Holocaust is you fight Israel.’” (63:15)
  • Saagar: “That’s the death rattle of the gatekeepers.” (65:23)
  • Krystal: “Even animals understand when a powerful force is attacking the weak, that’s wrong. You don’t actually need education to understand that.” (69:44)

Timestamps for Important Segments

• Trump–MBS Meeting & Khashoggi Discussion: [02:23–13:00]
• Epstein Files Vote / MTG–Trump Fallout: [33:57–45:31]
• Epstein–Rothschild–Cyberweapons Ties: [51:25–61:08]
• Antisemitism, Social Media, Holocaust Ed: [62:30–73:18]

Tone & Style

The episode flows with Breaking Points’ characteristic mix of sharp analysis, blunt critique of power, sardonic humor, and a populist, anti-establishment bent. Krystal and Saagar alternate between earnest policy breakdowns, incredulous asides, and ironic commentary, intentionally exposing uncomfortable truths and challenging official narratives.

Conclusion

This episode pulls back the curtain on elite deal-making (US-Saudi, big tech, intelligence), the politicization of trauma and education, and the grassroots demand for transparency about Jeffrey Epstein. The hosts insist on confronting reality and spotlighting hypocrisy, offering a primer on why independent journalism is more vital than ever in a post-gatekeeper world.