1/7/26: Europe Freaks Over Greenland, OnlyFans Visas, Epstein Iran Contra Explained

Summary

Breaking Points with Krystal and Saagar

Episode: Europe Freaks Over Greenland, OnlyFans Visas, Epstein Iran Contra Explained
Date: January 7, 2026
Hosts: Ryan Grim (subbing for Saagar and Krystal), Jake, Special Guest: Noah Colwyn (Blowback Podcast)

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Episode Overview

This episode dives into three distinct and provocative topics making headlines:

• The escalating geopolitical controversy over American ambitions to buy (or otherwise acquire) Greenland, and the resulting European backlash.
• The rise of social media influencers and OnlyFans models dominating the U.S. “extraordinary ability” visa program, with heated debate about social and legal norms around sex work, technology, and banking.
• An in-depth, historical explainer of the network of financial, covert, and criminal operations connecting Jeffrey Epstein, Iran-Contra, bloody conflicts in Angola, and broader patterns of U.S. foreign policy — featuring guest analyst Noah Colwyn of the “Blowback” podcast.

The hosts bring their signature blend of left-right crossfire, irreverence, and tough questions, challenging mainstream narratives and inviting expert insight.

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1. The Greenland Saga: U.S. Ambitions, European Panic

Segment Start: [02:10]

Key Points

• Stephen Miller’s Declaration: The hosts air a CNN excerpt where Stephen Miller asserts, “Greenland should be part of the United States. The president has been very clear about that. That is the formal position of the US Government.” [02:24]
  • Pressed repeatedly, Miller refuses to explicitly rule out military action to secure Greenland, dodging by saying, “Nobody’s going to fight the United States militarily over the future of Greenland.” [03:16]
• European Response:
  • European leaders are “freaking out” (Ryan Grim) over aggressive U.S. rhetoric and a viral image of Greenland wrapped in an American flag, tweeted by Miller’s wife.
  • Marco Rubio is cited as trying to “calm the waters,” clarifying the U.S. goal is to buy, not invade, Greenland.
• Comedy and Skepticism:
  • The hosts crack jokes about building a wall around Greenland’s coastline, with Grim quipping, “We don’t need a wall. Who’s gonna get there? …It’s in the middle of nowhere.” [04:53]
  • “If anybody from Venezuela can sail a boat from Venezuela to Greenland, you can stay,” Grim jokes, likening the notion to the infamous journeys of Shackleton. [05:14]

Historical Context and Analysis

• Legacy of U.S. Interest: Grim details the long-running American strategic interest in Greenland — from an 1868 report favoring purchase, to the U.S. Virgin Islands deal, to FDR’s defensive occupation of Greenland during WWII. “We ended up purchasing the US Virgin Islands… because we needed it for power projection… with the Panama Canal and as a coaling center.” [06:51]
• Modern Justification: U.S. claims are reinforced by Arctic security, melting sea routes, and old U.S. ambitions. “Even Arctic experts… say Trump idiocy aside, this has been a kind of thing for a long time… In context of melting ice caps, it makes it more viable in terms of shipping lanes.” [07:38]
• Moral Questions: The hosts scrutinize Denmark’s colonial claim, with Jake reading a European joint statement: “Greenland belongs to its people. It is for Denmark and Greenland…” and questioning, “What’s Denmark have to do with this? …That makes no sense whatsoever.” [10:30–11:00]
• Host Position: Grim advocates a peaceful “buyout”—“Pay them all 2 million bucks each, make it tax-free, make them all filthy rich,” [08:12] noting the population’s “decent enough life” and desire for independence from Denmark.

Notable Quotes

• “Nobody’s going to fight the United States militarily over the future of Greenland.” — Stephen Miller [03:16]
• “If anybody from Venezuela can sail a boat from Venezuela to Greenland, you can stay. That is such an impressive journey, that’s like Shackleton’s journey.” — Ryan Grim [05:14]

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2. OnlyFans Visas: The Rise of Influencer Immigration

Segment Start: [15:22]

Key Points

• O1B Visa Surge: The O1B “extraordinary talent” visa has seen a spike in approvals for “influencers and OnlyFans models,” now making up half of such visas since the pandemic, according to the Financial Times.
• Socio-Cultural Commentary:
  • Grim expresses concern and sarcasm: “Is there anything better than a foreign woman coming to America, selling naked photos of herself, charging extraordinary amounts to our deracinated, marijuana, gambling addicted, morbidly obese... population? I guess it’s the American dream, Ryan.” [15:50]
• Debate on Morality, Stigma, and Law:
  • Jake, identified by Grim as a likely “decriminalize sex work” advocate, counters: “I don't want to criminalize any of this stuff, but I do believe in... social and community stigmatization.” [17:08]
  • Cites lessons from drug epidemics—how “community immunity” and social stigma, not legality, reduce abuse.
  • Both hosts debate roles and limits of law vs. culture; they compare approaches to drugs, tobacco, and gambling.
• Banking and Regulatory Issues:
  • The hosts discuss why banks “debank” porn and OnlyFans industries—not moral squeamishness but fear of legal and regulatory risk (e.g., child sexual abuse material, revenge porn compliance).
  • “Banks have no morals. The reason they don’t do business with porn is because they’re deeply worried… about CSAM regulations and revenge porn… That’s the reason.” — Ryan Grim [21:22]

Technology and AI Risks

• Grim highlights a recent AI scandal: Elon Musk’s “Grok” model used for undressing women and children in user-submitted images. “It’s fucking disgusting.” — Jake [23:42]
• “Technology is value-neutral. The value comes from you and I. The only way to express value on these companies is through the government. Social shaming isn’t enough.” — Grim [24:19]

Notable Exchange

• “It’s like: ‘Money is money, all money is green.’ …This is the world we live in now. It’s bad.” — Ryan Grim [24:19–24:50]

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3. Epstein, Iran Contra, and the Deep State Angola Connection

Segment Start: [25:35]

Guest: Noah Colwyn (Co-host, Blowback Podcast)

Setting the Stage

• Investigative Scoop: Jake and Ryan Grim recount a new investigation tying Jeffrey Epstein, Israeli and U.S. intelligence, and CIA-backed Southern Air Transport to diamond smuggling and arms trafficking in Angola following the Iran-Contra era.
• Historical Goldmine: Colwyn provides critical background from the latest season of “Blowback,” focusing on U.S. involvement in Angola’s civil war, Cold War geopolitics, and the wider web of covert financial and military operations.

Angola Explainer

• CIA & Angola: In 1975, under CIA Director William Colby, U.S. intelligence briefed the White House on Angola's complex civil war, boiling vast local politics into crude categories of "good guys," "bad guys," and "unknowns." [27:44]
• Legacy of Colonialism: Namibia, occupied by apartheid South Africa, is key to understanding regional power struggles following German and then South African colonization.
• Cold War Proxies: The U.S.-backed FNLA and UNITA fought the socialist MPLA government, which received decisive military support from Cuba. South African military intervention, CIA arms, and mercenary operations further complicated matters.

The Cuban Game-Changer

• Colwyn’s Analysis: “The Cuban hand is shown. The U.S. condemns Cuba in the UN for expanding Soviet influence… but the Cubans, at great cost, commit to fifteen years of military and humanitarian support that help the Angolan government survive and repel South Africa." [34:21]
• “It is a very special and important historical understanding that the Cuban intervention was one of the decisive, indisputable factors that led to the South African apartheid regime ultimately agreeing to end itself.” [44:58]
• Aftermath: Though Cuba’s intervention is a Cold War flashpoint, the most enduring “blowback” is Angola’s devastation and enduring instability.

Epstein’s Entrée: Planes, Diamonds, Arms, and Money Laundering

• Southern Air Transport: Colwyn reveals, “Epstein arranged the sale and relocation [of this CIA front]... to Les Wexner (Victoria’s Secret).” [31:22]
• Southern Air’s role in Angola included cargo flights for the MPLA, then later air trafficking “blood diamonds.”
• “At one point [Epstein] told a journalist he made his money from guns, drugs, and diamonds,” says Jake. [31:50]
• Web of Connections: Epstein linked to Adnan Khashoggi (arms broker at the heart of Iran-Contra), Douglas Leese (British arms trafficker), and Stan Pottinger (who facilitated Iran-Contra money laundering).
• Iran-Contra’s Structure: Israel shipped arms to Iran, the U.S. replenished Israel, and the profits funded Nicaragua’s Contras and Angola’s anti-government forces (“the profits from Iran selling the weapons to Iran went not only to the Contras, but also to Angola. And into that rides Jeffrey Epstein.”) [50:35]

The Enduring Legacy

• “Villains Profit from War’s Ruins”: Colwyn: “Even after these wars are over… the world historical villains who walked the earth until recently are able to profit immensely. Like Jeffrey Epstein.” [41:44]
• “The Cuban victory… is one of the decisive, indisputable factors that led to the South African apartheid regime ultimately agreeing to… end itself.” — Colwyn [44:58]
• The hosts stress this pattern is not unique, but emblematic: deregulation, covert wars, and transnational profiteers (like BCCI, Khashoggi, Wexner) “are how our contemporary mafias operate, and were born out of Iran-Contra.” [50:50]

Takeaways

• The episode ends by plugging further deep dives on the Blowback Podcast — tracing the interconnectedness of wars, covert ops, white-collar crime, and elites from the 1980s to today.

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Memorable Quotes & Moments

• On Europe: “Can you really, Europe, lecture us about territorial integrity whenever you’re openly supportive of the Venezuelan operation and then bleeding about Greenland…?” — Ryan Grim [09:08]
• On OnlyFans Visas: “It’s bleak. …But even if you’re rabidly pro-immigrant, under what basis is this good? Make you an extraordinary talent and benefit to our society?” — Ryan Grim [16:51, 24:19]
• On AI Porn: “Grok is undressing children at the request of people… even against children, which we’re not even going to show you the examples. But yeah, this is the end point.” — Ryan Grim [23:42]
• On Angola: “The legacy of suffering… at some points in the late 80s and early 90s was perhaps the deadliest in the world… and that suffering… is still with us.” — Noah Colwyn [39:57]
• On Cuba's Legacy: “The one time in history that a poor country comes to the defense of another poor country and is successful.” — Colwyn, paraphrasing historian Piero Gliejes [44:58]
• On Iran-Contra: “Iran-Contra as a signifier… the birth pangs of neoliberalism… a moment where deregulation and foreign intervention enable profit from wars… spies, drug runners, white collar criminals… immediately take advantage.” — Noah Colwyn [48:00]

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Timestamps for Sections

• Greenland Segment: [02:10–12:32]
• OnlyFans/Visas Segment: [15:22–24:50]
• Epstein/Iran-Contra/Angola Segment: [25:35–51:56]

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Final Thoughts

This episode of Breaking Points is a sharp, often darkly humorous, and ultimately sobering examination of the entanglement between American power, global capital, and political hypocrisy — whether in the rush to buy Greenland, the commodification of sex and influencer culture, or the sordid, shadowy history linking U.S. policy, war, and criminal profiteering from Africa to Wall Street.

If you want laughter and learning, outrage and insight — or references to cannibalism in polar exploration and AI porn all in one package — this episode delivers.

Transcript

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[Ryan Grim]

Hey guys, Sager and Krystal here.

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We need your help to build the future of independent news media. And we hope to see [e-mail] turning now to Greenland, there's an all eyes on Greenland after the Stephen Miller appearance with cnn. Let's take a listen.

[Stephen Miller]

Greenland should be part of the United States. The president has been very clear about that. That is the formal position of the US Government.

[Jake]

Right. But can you say that military action against Greenland is off the table?

[Stephen Miller]

What do you mean military action against Greenland? The, the Greenland has a population of 30,000 people, Jake. The real question is by what right does Denmark assert control over Greenland? What is the basis of their territorial claim? What is their basis of having Greenland as a colony of Denmark? The United States is the power of NATO for the United States to secure the Arctic region, to protect and defend NATO and NATO interests. Obviously, Greenland should be part of the United States. And so that's a conversation that we're going to have as a country. That's a process we're going to have as a, as a community of nations.

[Jake]

So you can take it off the table that the US Would use military force to seize Greenland. You can take it off the table.

[Stephen Miller]

Jake, I understand you're trying very hard to, which again is your job. I respect it. It's great to get exactly the headline right, that catchy headline trying to get an answer that says, that says Miller refuses to rule out the the United States should have Greenland as part of the United States. There's no need to even think or talk about this in the context that you're asking of a military operation. Nobody's going to fight the United States militarily over the future of Greenland.

[Ryan Grim]

Okay, so that is the declaration from Stephen Miller. C2, though, let's put that up there on the screen. Marco Rubio calming the waters, going before lawmakers saying, guys, the actual aim is to buy Greenland. We don't want to downplay military action, especially after a whole bunch of Europeans freaked out because Stephen Miller's wife tweeted out this image. Let's go to that one up there on the screen, please, just to show everybody showing. Is that the Kennedy center that I see right there or. No, sorry, the Kennedy Channel. I thought that she had superimposed that on top of Greenland and I thought it was going to be even more ridiculous. But that is Greenland there pictured in an American flag, inviting all kinds of freak out from the European powers, though they do want to buy it now from Denmark. So your general reaction, Ryan, especially in the context of this whole Russian raid, which just took actually place of this Russian interception just took place off the coast of Iceland in the North Atlantic.

[Jake]

So I want to know how MAGA plans to build a wall around this.

[Ryan Grim]

We don't need a wall around Greenland. It's called the ocean. Who's gonna get there?

[Jake]

I don't know. A boat.

[Ryan Grim]

Huh. Who wants to come to Greenland? It's in the middle of nowhere. Very few people who could even make it there.

[Jake]

I mean, look at the amount of wall you'd have to build there.

[Ryan Grim]

You don't need a wall, Ryan. As he said, there's only 50,000 people who live there.

[Jake]

But what if the Venezuelans get to Greenland and then they're United States.

[Ryan Grim]

You know, if anybody from Venezuela can sail a boat from Venezuela to Greenland, you can stay. That's what I would say. That is such an impressive journey. That's like Shackleton's journey.

[Jake]

Ice foot, dry foot, dry foot.

[Ryan Grim]

Only real ones will understand that reference. I will say, I. By the way, I think buying it is a good idea for the people of Greenland. So we were talking about this.

[Jake]

It's 33,000.

[Ryan Grim]

Yeah.

[Jake]

What's the math?

[Ryan Grim]

So the actual population is 36,000. So, I mean, why wouldn't give them 2 million? All right, give them 2 million each. Because you have to make up the.

[Jake]

Fact we're sprinting money anyway.

[Ryan Grim]

Well, we have to make up for the fact that these people do have free healthcare and they have a decent enough life. I will say, just reading a little bit about Greenland and their relationship with Denmark, it is genuinely tenuous. The US History with Greenland goes way back. We can go ahead and put C6, please, up on the screen. I was reading this last year when the whole Greenland thing was becoming a big talking point. So in 1868, Under Secretary Steward, he actually commissioned this report called A report on the resources of Iceland and Greenland. And here's what it wrote, quote by location, it belongs in the Western Hemisphere as an insular dependency of the North American continent. I've heretofore expressed the opinion we should purchase Greenland. And in fact, the circumstances which we ended up recognizing Greenland, I had no idea, is we ended up purchasing the US Virgin Islands from, I believe whoever it was controlled Denmark at the time. And it's because we needed it for power projection with the Panama Canal and as a coaling center.

[Jake]

Like coal. Right.

[Ryan Grim]

And then it ended up becoming a problem because the Danes surrendered after World War or during World War II, in 1940, they could no longer protect Greenland. And so FDR actually went in and we got this. We were like, we got this in recognition. They're like, it's critical to us because they didn't want the Nazis to come in and put a base on Greenland and use it as some sort of submarine base for. For operations against the United States or against New York harbor or any of this. And so the US Actually came in, protected Greenland, but then eventually gave it back. Because the theory at the time there was a serious debate about this is whether we should give Greenland back to Denmark. They're like, well, if we keep Greenland after we just fought a war against territorial aggression and we're denouncing Soviet territorial aggression in Western Europe or Eastern Europe, it would be a little bit contradictory. So we have to give it back. But it has been a live issue for. Since 1868. I personally think we should buy it to get around any of the NATO problems. I do think the Arctic concerns, especially with the whole melting ice and, you know, the sea channels and all that. It's very interesting, guys. This is totally independent of Trump and all of this. I've just. I spoke to a few Arctic experts about a year ago when all of this was going on. They're like, you look, Trump idiocy and all of that aside, this has been kind of a thing now for the United States for a long time. And actually, in the context of melting ice caps, it makes it more viable in terms of shipping lanes. But, no, I do not support territory explicitly invading Greenland. I think we should make it worth. The Greenlanders, while they have free health care, they've got a decent enough thing going. Although they want their own independence from Denmark, they don't love being a colony either. Let's do some free trade compact or whatever. Pay them all 2 million bucks each, make it tax free, make them all filthy rich, and then it'll be a win win situation.

[Jake]

If I did my math right, it's about $112 billion to give 2 million to all 56,000.

[Ryan Grim]

That's 1/9 of. That's like 1/9 of the Pentagon budget.

[Jake]

Yeah, it's.

[Ryan Grim]

No, actually, no. That's one tenth of the Pentagon. It's for one year.

[Jake]

The fact. The fact that it's already a colony of Denmark, to me, like, strips away a lot of the kind of moral valence of it where it's like, it's hard to get too worked up about something that's already a colony of some.

[Ryan Grim]

We don't have too much time. But I do want to say that because I've been dying to dunk on the Europeans for this up there on the screen is that these European leaders, when Trump did the extraordinary rendition of Maduro, they were all, like, basically supportive of the operation. They said, we want a democratic transition and all of that. And I was amazed by it because for four years, these people have lectured me about how other countries can't just go in regardless of whether it's in their sphere of influence and knock off the per. I mean, remember how much they freaked out when Russia tried to kill Zelensky? How many different times. This is a horrible violation of international norms. But they're the ones who recognize the fake Guaido government and are proposing some grand democratic transition by force. It's like, can you really, Europe, lecture us about territorial integrity whenever you're openly supportive of the Venezuelan operation and then bleeding about Greenland because, yeah, as you said, it's a colony which they don't even want the people of Greenland necessarily to be part of Denmark. Now, when I say that, I'm not saying they also want to be part of America, but they're explicitly. One of the leading parties in Greenland is like, we want to be our own country. We don't want to be ruled by all of you. And the Danish are like, oh, well, this would be a horrible violation of NATO integrity.

[Jake]

And let's put up C4 real quickly because there's an interesting line in this statement, joint statement from France, Germany, all the. The usual suspects. It finishes. Greenland belongs to its people. It is for Denmark and Greenland.

[Ryan Grim]

Right? Oh, right. Wait, wait.

[Jake]

And them only to decide on matters concerning Denmark and Greenland. It's like, what's Denmark have to do with this?

[Ryan Grim]

Hold on a second.

[Jake]

Greenland belongs to its people. It is for Denmark to decide. Like, come on, what are you doing here?

[Ryan Grim]

Right? Yeah, that makes no sense whatsoever. Whatsoever. I mean, do you know the story of Greenland? Like, how it eventually came to be colonized by the European powers? It's crazy. Like, if you. Okay, as I remember it. And people might. People might get me. You might have to fact check me. It starts with. I think it's Eric the Red. And it was like his son, like, murdered somebody and went to. I think went to Iceland. And then that guy's son also murdered somebody and was banished and he went to Greenland. And it's like, because of that. Because back in like, 6. The year 600 A.D. again, I apologize. I know I'm getting a decent amount of this wrong, but it's roughly correct that Denmark has a right to Greenland. And again, you know, by the Laws of territorial.

[Jake]

You know, would Sweden have it if it was Viking?

[Ryan Grim]

No, but that's my whole thing is that Denmark was not even a country when all this was happening, was being governed or it was part of a kingdom or any of that. Like it was it. So that is the basis of their claim to Greenland. And then when it mattered in World War II, they literally gave it up and America gave it back. So.

[Jake]

And what, the US is just threatening to take the Ozempic patent?

[Ryan Grim]

Oh, Novo Novartis. No, the Danish should threaten that. Remember that. Because at one point, you know, actually it's less of an important company.

[Jake]

I mean, the US could threaten.

[Ryan Grim]

Be like, oh, to take the patent. Yeah, we kind of already are that because they've lowered the price. We actually nuked the stock of that company, interestingly enough. Anyway, you and I have spoken far too much here about Greenland. And we will return. Perhaps we shall return.

[Jake]

It's for the greenish people.

[Ryan Grim]

That is for the greenish people. I agree. If anybody ever wants to read a great story about the US expedition, Greenland. I think it's called the Greely Expedition. I read a book about that one. Oh, it was gnarly. Truly gnarly. Like people starving to death and possible cannibalization. Okay, let's get to visas.

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[Dr. Priyanka Walley]

Hi, I'm Dr. Priyanka Walley.

[Hari Kondabolu]

And I'm Hari Kondabolu.

[Dr. Priyanka Walley]

It's a new year and on the podcast Health Stuff, we're resetting the way we talk about our health, which means.

[Hari Kondabolu]

Being honest about what we know, what we don't, and how messy it can all be. I like to sleep in late and sleep early. Is there a chronotype for that or am I just depressed?

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We talk to experts who share real experiences and insight.

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[Ryan Grim]

Let's turn now to Visa's extraordinary bro show content that we have to go and put into this is the downfall of the Republic right here. This is actually, if anything, no, this is the honest reflection, Ryan, of who we are. Let's go and put this up here on the screen. Influencers and only fans models dominate us Extraordinary artist Visa. So there's a specific type of visa called O1B visa for quote exceptional creatives, which has now exploded since the COVID 19 pandemic for talent managers and creators. And a 50% of these visas now, Ryan, according to the Financial Times, are being granted to influencers and only fans, models, onlyfans. Models in particular. Dominating because you have to be able to prove commercial success and high number of follower count and who of course makes more money than people who are selling naked photos of themselves to degenerate weed addicted young men here in the United States. I mean it's an extraordinary business model. I guess you have to give the ladies credit, right? Is there anything better than a foreign woman coming to America selling naked photos of herself, charging extraordinary amounts of money to our deracinated, marijuana, gambling addicted population morbidly obese and then buying such photos, enriching These people so that they could buy mansions in South Florida and in Palm Springs. I guess it's the American dream, Ryan. I guess it's the American dream.

[Jake]

It's bleak. It is, yeah.

[Ryan Grim]

What are your thoughts? Because you seem like one of those decriminalized sex. Sex work people at the same time. So perhaps you support this. This is the logical endpoint of your libertarian culture.

[Jake]

Right, but I'm not a libertarian.

[Ryan Grim]

Okay, fine. Libertine culture. Your libertine culture.

[Jake]

See, I don't want to. I don't want to criminalize any of this stuff, but I do believe. I do believe in kind of social and community stigmatization of this kind of thing. And actually, what I learned in researching the history of drug use is it really isn't criminalization that gets kind of use and abuse under control. It's community stigmatization. It's like if you take the crack epidemic, for instance, and you saw this repeat itself over and over, that after about seven years of a new drug that doesn't have, like, immunity in the community. So, like, all of a sudden, crack comes in. It's like, whoa, this is amazing. This feels incredible. And so it just rips through everything because everybody's loving it. And then within. Within a short amount of time, people start to see the negative effects of it. And the idea of the quote unquote crackhead was actually useful for. To the community because people coming in were like, I don't want to be that. And the community was saying, like, that's not a good thing. And then you then see, like, a decline in use because there builds up an immunity kind of. And then a new drug comes.

[Ryan Grim]

Do you think social stigma is downstream of law, though? I mean, this is.

[Jake]

Not necessarily.

[Ryan Grim]

Not necessarily, but in some way.

[Jake]

My point is it doesn't have to be like, we did not criminalize tobacco, but we stigmatized it and we crushed use of it.

[Ryan Grim]

Yeah. But we also had a lot of laws that, let's say, didn't allow them to advertise bandit.

[Jake]

So that would be. Yeah, that would be my preferred place where there was enormous. Well, the gambling. My God, like, we never had a debate where we legalized gambling.

[Ryan Grim]

Yeah. And all we can do is just thank Chris Christie in the US Supreme Court.

[Jake]

Just did it.

[Dr. Priyanka Walley]

I agree.

[Jake]

But like, so you tell you a bunch of rules that would say, here are the. Here's the advertising rules, Here are the rules on who can do it, the age restrictions, very similar to tobacco. And then try to socially, through the government and just through our social Channels and the bonds that we have with each other say don't do this, like this is not a good thing.

[Ryan Grim]

And you just admitted that the laws are very important. I mean this is why look, everybody hates on prohibition, but not locking people up. Let's remember during Prohibition the amount of alcohol consumed dramatically went down. Everyone's like, oh, what about the mafia? I'm like, well we had a bunch of Italians that just entered the country as well.

[Jake]

You know, Prohibition also did is it produced the smuggling route from Mexico into the United States, which the cartels now run.

[Noah Colwyn]

Okay.

[Ryan Grim]

I mean again, let's say perhaps if we had not imported an entire mafia culture into the United States might've been a little bit different. But you know, at the same time, like whenever we look at this, if you combine our libertine, libertarian, economic capitalist policy with libertine culture, you get the worst of all worlds. And that's what, that's the world that we're living in.

[Jake]

That's why we need a more social.

[Ryan Grim]

Democratic and we're celebrating this. Yeah, but I mean even then if you. It's like this is kind of again.

[Jake]

You need Confucianism like you need a.

[Ryan Grim]

Full blown like in my opinion with this current culture we have irreligiosity which is going through the route. We have debt, you know, all these other problems. Just materialism itself is not going to be the answer like this. If anything we are going to be giving or having even more money which will be spent on all of this like disgusting industry. Like you have to have some level of enforcement. And I don't know why we have lost the ability to distinguish between good and bad. I actually think it's one of the most interesting left right debates is like left. The Left for like 10 years just refused to believe like this is good or this is bad. It's like no, weed is bad, gambling is bad. Drugs are actually bad. Now that doesn't mean you should be locked up forever. Porn is horrible. Like it's a bad thing.

[Jake]

It's called a vice for right, but they don't.

[Ryan Grim]

But there's been no acknowledgment of this. Oh, live and let live. It's like, no, we should not live and let live. That's a disaster actually. Because that means that we have no like social connection or anything. And so the explicit like granting celebration and now government power that these porn companies and only fans models which I guess are getting like extraordinary preferential treatment from the government, I think is horrible. Can we put the next element up Here on the screen.

[Podcast Announcer]

This has been.

[Ryan Grim]

I mentioned this before we left, but you remember and you'll love this, the whole debanking thing, the deep banking report put out. They put out a report from the Treasury Department where they're like, oh, these big bang. These horrible banks won't do business with porn companies. And Ryan, as you know, banks have no morals. They don't care if you're in porn. The reason they don't do business with porn is because they're deeply worried that the companies themselves, which have a horrible track record of complying with CSAM regulations and with revenge porn regulation and in fact dramatically encourage both. And that's the reason why they don't wanna do business with the porn. They don't care whether you're selling porn or not. This is the same thing that happened with OnlyFans. They're like, well, we're kind of worried that you don't have nearly enough regulation whenever it comes to this.

[Jake]

And it's the same thing with Mark Andreessen complaining that the banks are being unfair to crypto companies because the founders were Trump supporters. It's like, no, it's because they're pretty. Because the crypto companies refuse to like give any or they have difficulty that they just used for money on YouTube customers.

[Ryan Grim]

Yeah, exactly.

[Jake]

We think you're doing money laundering. Can you demonstrate to us that you're not?

[Ryan Grim]

I get it.

[Jake]

And they're like, no, we can't demonstrate that. And they're like, okay, then you can't use our banking services. And they're like, it's because we like Trump.

[Ryan Grim]

Yeah, it is difficult because like what I've heard is that a lot of the way that KYC laws are written encourages monopolization like in the banking sector is because it's easier to regulate. Right. If you have a big ass bank, then they're obviously going to have all these money laundering control. Like I understand at a conceptual level, but yeah, it was weaponized rhetorically to basically say, actually no, we shouldn't really have. We should allow these banks to. Or we should pressure these banks to do business with everybody. And in this case, you know, they're using it like it's some, you know, like grand ideological thing when in reality, again, the banks don't do business with them for a very good reason. And in fact we should encourage the banks not to do business with them. These are bad industries. Like explicitly the government should not be out there saying you must, you know, oh, we, we, we cannot survive as a nation. You know, if we don't allow the porn companies to get bankrolled. So I don't know, I think it's disgusting. And in particular, I think what shows you the more, even more difficulty of all of this is the rise of AI. Let's just put this final segment up here on the screen. Ryan, I'm sure you saw this over the last few weeks.

[Jake]

It's fucking disgusting.

[Ryan Grim]

Grok is undressing children at the request of people who are on Twitter who are just replying with images. First of all, just from a revenge perspective, even if you're an adult woman, it's disgusting. I mean, you can't allow that to happen. They're like posting images of random women and saying, put them in a bikini. And it even works whenever it's used against children, which we have. We're not even going to show you the examples. But yeah, I mean, this is the end point of where we're getting where all the money and all of that is.

[Jake]

Brock has a bunch of Pentagon contracts. And of course, yeah, like this is ridiculous, right?

[Ryan Grim]

And beyond that, it shows you how difficult it is for the technology to immediate. Like, people are like, oh, it's just a one time. It's like, no, it happened for weeks. It took a while. Where's the law? Is the DOJ going to do anything about it? And worse, you know, technology is value neutral. The value comes from you and I. And the only way for you and I to to express value on top of these companies is through the government. We have no other type of system. We can't just socially be like, oh well, we're not going to use Grok because it's like it doesn't happen. So that's why I think that the law is very important here. And just, yeah, this explosion of the only fans content creator model. I mean, I'm sorry, like, we don't need more of you here over here. Can we at least all agree on that? Like, even if you're rabidly pro immigrant, it's like, under what basis is this good? Make you an extraordinary talent and benefit to our society. If we had for years a legal and a social stigma against the dramatic embrace of all this and instead now we have a culture of like, oh, it's all good. Money is money, all money is green. It doesn't matter. And this is the world that we live in now. It's bad. All right, so with all that, we have the blowback boys standing by. Let's get to it.

[Jake]

Recently at Dropsite News, we can put up G3. Here we put out a story, Murtazi, Hussein and myself. The headline, Epstein, Israel and the CIA how the Iran Contraplanes landed at Les Wexner's base. We covered it previously here, but it looks to answer the question of how did Jeffrey Epstein get his start and where did he make his money and what are his links to the intel community. So after that piece came out, Noah Colwyn, who's one of the co founders, the co hosts of the Blowback podcast, reached out and he was like, we've got this new episode, this new series on Angola that actually talks a bunch about this and it is truly fascinating. I gotta look at the premium. It's out now, so I highly recommend that people listen to it. But it tells the story of Angola and Jeffrey Epstein's involvement in Africa is one of the kind of most under discussed parts of it. It's also the thing that got him famous because in 2002 he took Clinton to Africa. It's also the thing that shows that he is a person who has always had his finger on the pulse of where money and power kind of flows in our global society. Now Emily was gonna be on here today and actually I think she listened to the whole Blowback series to get ready for it. Sager subbed in for him.

[Ryan Grim]

Yes.

[Jake]

So we're gonna, Noah and I are gonna educate Sagar on what's going on here. So Noah, thanks for joining us. You would need two or three hours to do justice to this conversation. Luckily your podcast series does run at least that long, but we'll do what we can today. So thanks for joining us.

[Ryan Grim]

Good to see you, man.

[Noah Colwyn]

Hey, thank you for having me. Really appreciate it and all the kind words.

[Jake]

And so let, let's, let's throw up actually. Let, let's, let's throw up the map, map here because you, you have an interesting part where you say like the CIA began its briefings of, of the White House just with a map.

[Noah Colwyn]

Well, it was actually, it was. So this was CIA Director William Colby who is addressing the nsc and the account of this meeting comes from an ex CIA officer named John Stockwell. Right. And so, and Colby is explaining what's going down in 1975 in Southern Africa by telling the National Security Council at that time, the most important national security policymaking body. And he says, this is a map of Africa and this is Angola and these are the good guys, these are the bad guys. And then these guys we don't know too much about. But the, that is how the highest levels of Washington initially were apprised of what Angola was and what it meant at the beginning of what became a secret CIA covert action, or at least near the start, if not the very beginning.

[Jake]

And I think that's an appropriate way to kind of start a segment about Angola for an American audience. But it's a truly embarrassing way for the United States to start its own kind of involvement in the region. And so in that map, people saw South Africa, which at the time was apartheid South Africa and which at the time occupied Namibia, which was just to its northwest there. Namibia had been the victim of Germany's first genocide in the early, early 20th century. And after that, South African. South Africa ended up occupying it. And it's fending off an insurgency to throw South Africa out of there. North of that you've got Angola. North of that, importantly, you have what was then Zaire, which is a Democratic Republic of Congo, which, and we've talked, Emily and I interviewed the guy who wrote the recent biography of Patrice Lumumba. His assassination plays a critical role here as well, because the CIA's man Mobutu coming into Zaire plays a huge role in the history as you talk about here, because it allows for the CIA and the insurgents that it's backing to have a base of operations to kind of constantly mess with Angola. The reason that this is interesting today, I think two reasons. One, Cuba and Venezuela, because I think there's actually a shadow there, but also Jeffrey Epstein. So let's roll the Jeffrey Epstein portion of I think this is episode eight or so, this is season six, and then we'll unpack this. So let's. Let's roll that clip.

[Noah Colwyn]

One particular irony of the scandal was that when Eugene Hassanfus had been shot down over Nicaragua, he had been flying a plane for a CIA front company called Southern Air Transport. As it turned out, the MPLA government in Luanda, which was fighting the CIA, was also contracting with Southern Air Transport, having very few options for air cargo in Angolan skies.

[Podcast Announcer]

Apparently unaware of the company's history, reports the LA Times, the Soviet and Cuban backed Angolan government in 1984 paid Southern Air Transport to run a busy airlift that kept two Lockheed L100 cargo planes flying nearly around the clock. According to diamond industry sources, the Angola contract accounted for about 65% of Southern Air Transport's income.

[Noah Colwyn]

Luanda, after learning more about Southern Air, promptly canceled its dealings with the airline. But while Angola's business with Southern Air was done, One of the CIA's most notorious proprietaries, or front companies lived on.

[Podcast Announcer]

A Decade later, in the mid-1990s, Southern Air Transport relocated to Columbus, Ohio. There it fell into the control of Les Wexner, CEO of the parent company of Victoria's Secret and Abercrombie and Fitch. Wexner used the airline to bring merchandise from Hong Kong to the States. And the person who reportedly arranged the sale and relocation of Southern Air Transport, Jeffrey Epstein, Les Wexner's financial advisor, suspected spy, reported blackmailer and convicted pedophile.

[Jake]

So Jeffrey Epstein brings this CIA backed airline, after it's done with its Iran Contra business to Columbus, Ohio, to work for Les Wexner. And then. Interesting. And you can put up G3B. We had reported this in our piece that after it was done in Columbus and right as the kind of CIA IG report is coming out and exposing that, it actually was doing the things that, you know, we now understand that it was doing. They sell, they declare bankruptcy, but before that they sell half their planes to a UAE based airline which does business in Angola and it begins, they begin again trafficking blood diamonds. And so, and so in the middle of all this, the entire time is, is Jeffrey EP, is Jeffrey EPstein. And so at one point he had said that, how did you make your money? He told a journalist, guns, drugs and diamonds. So before we get into all of the Epstein part, which is utterly fascinating, and let's talk a little bit about the Cuban element of this because.

[Noah Colwyn]

Sure.

[Jake]

So the mpla, which is the kind of socialist government, you know, after the Portuguese leave, you know, they're consolidating, they're consolidating control. The South Africans feel like having a leftist anywhere in southern Africa is a threat to apartheid. And so they start to invade, they're blocked, shockingly, by Cuba. So what was Cuba's current situation and what advantage was there at all to Cuba intervening militarily in Angola?

[Noah Colwyn]

There was none. Which is why, I mean, in a longer sense there was because Cuban, Fidel Castro and the Cuban leadership had for many years outlined a policy by which they understood that part of the goal of supporting revolutionaries and guerrillas in other foreign countries was that it was a way of combating capitalist forces more generally, a way of hemming imperial ambitions that they viewed as part of a global system. And that there was, you know, in that broader sense, it was a way of fighting and applying pressure against its own enemies, namely the United States.

[Ryan Grim]

You.

[Noah Colwyn]

Know, through, through acts of solidarity. But in, you know, but that's, that's a pretty abstract thing. The reality was that Cuba in 1975 was faced with a moral Dilemma. The Angolan nationalists who had competed amongst themselves various factions to be the ones who would take power after the Portuguese Left in late 75, the left wing Marxist faction, the MPLA, was in control of the capital city and was poised to be able to actually assume the responsibility of government. And they were the favored sons, or at least they were the favored inheritors of that authority by the Portuguese, the departing Portuguese, who were now part of a, you know, a recently installed left wing junta, and the Angolans, the remaining two Angolan factions. One was the fnla, which was very strongly CIA supported, very much aligned with Mobutu in Zaire and led by a guy named Holden Roberto. And then you have Jonas Civimbi, who headed a more unknown faction at the time called unita, but we'll hear more about him later. And the Cubans were, you know, they were, they were told explicitly in mid 75 and they understood because they were in contact with the Angolan, the MPLA leadership that essentially the CIA and the South Africans had begun arming and mobilizing against the mpla. There were already border incursions, there had been huge fighting across the country. And neighboring South Africa had a huge interest in not wanting to see a commi, you know, what they viewed as a aggressive communist government coming to power in part because as you said earlier, South Africa occupied Namibia and through its occupation of Namibia, its occupation, Namibia would be exposed to Namibian rebels who would be able to take sanctuary in southern Angola. And so the South African interest rears its head at this time. So all these threats are rearing their heads against what in November 75 is the new government, the new nation of Angola, led by the left wing MPLA and the South Africans immediately invade, immediately invade from the south they launch two different divisions and the FNLA from the north and the central area, they attack. And the FNLA is wiped out because they're pretty incompetent and threadbare. And the CIA operation to fund them is revealed as a big, it's a, it's a huge, it's a fiasco. But UNITA and South Africa are this really dramatic threat that the Cubans, in an act of sort of immediate daring, do send an emergency detachment of armed forces to support the Angolans, who then are able to successfully repel the South African advance. And although the Cuban hand is shown in the US condemns Cuba in, you know, world four, like the UN for, you know, expanding Soviet, you know, and then Soviet arms, of course, that are fueling all this combat or at least fueling the mpleas ability to make, you know, fight this battle, you know, and the US is claiming that, oh, wow, well, we, you know, there's this, you know, so world Soviet communism is on the march again. A CIA operation is revealed that we had been secretly arming these people. And this is at the height of anti, you know, the post Vietnam church committee scrutiny of the national security state. And as a consequence, the Angolan operation gets immediately hemmed in. And as a result, that also means that, you know, because the US refuses to commit to fighting the, you know, to advancing further, and South Africa is at capacity at that moment, the Cubans are able to be this very decisive force. And it doesn't end at this emergency detachment, however, because the new Angolan nation is, you know, desperately poor. They have no expertise. The departing Portuguese colonists and settlers, you know, they poured cement in elevators, they threw away the keys to their cars. They. The Angolan population was incredibly rural, and there were very few people who were able to, you know, take up the means of governance. And it was a detachment of cubicle, Cuban technical and humanitarian advisors and doctors who are able to, you know, essentially help provide some kind of aid in a meaningful way and in building this new nation immediately afterward. All the while, a Cuban security detachment is necessary, you know, is committed there again at great expense and cost to Cuban society. Essentially, until that point, it had been donated, although eventually they work out an arrangement to just meet cost with the Angolans. They're not profiting from it. They weren't mercenaries. And it begins this, you know, almost 15 year or about 15 year mission that is at once military and humanitarian to support an embattled Angolan government which is subsequently opposed by both South African military forces as well as secretly funded and armed US Proxies.

[Ryan Grim]

The show's called Blowback. What do you think the legacy of this is that kind of remains with us today?

[Noah Colwyn]

The two main pieces, I would say, are first, that the nation of Angola and the people of Angola suffered enormously. And the legacy of that suffering, I mean, we're talking about a conflict that at some points in the late 80s and early 90s was considered perhaps the deadliest in the entire world. Thousands and thousands and thousands and thousands of people dying, whether it's from malnourishment or disfigurements from landmines. It is not a conflict many people know about. It's a conflict I certainly knew very little about until we began researching and really. And learning about it for this season. And so I think that Just the first piece of the legacy that's with us is that this is a country, like many other poor countries in the world, that has been wounded by the legacy of nationalist and anti imperial struggle, frankly. And then the second piece of it, I would say, is that Angola today, or at least the, the way in which the actions and the legacy of things like Angola operate and as pertains to sort of why Ryan asked me on, I think is not something just about Angola specifically, but about something that it represents, which is how America involves itself in foreign conflict to advance a perceived American interest, which in the time of the Cold War was often structured around, you know, and had this huge anti communist ideological component as well as obviously, you know, rank material interest, if we want to call it that. But it is, I think if you look at the Angola story and we, you know, you trace the lineages of it, obviously you arrive at very, you know, strange and weird facts like the fact that Jeffrey Epstein was involved with, you know, corporations that had been arming Angolan rebels. Obviously Southern Air Transport did a lot more than just Angola. But also it's about, you know, how even when these wars are over, when there's money to be made, when there's tons and tons of money to be made, particularly in diamond smuggling, in the case of Epstein, the ways in which, yeah, like the, you know, even if the conflict is over, we've put, we've moved out, we've pulled up stakes. We're no longer, you know, going, you know, supporting our proxies. We fucked things up enough or destabilized them enough that some of the, like, world historical villains who, you know, who walked the earth until pretty recently are able to profit immensely from it. Like Jeffrey Epstein.

[Jake]

The other legacy, the positive legacy, you know, you talk about on the podcast, Nelson Mandela and a lot of other people cite the defeat of South Africa in Angola as the turning point in apartheid. That, that is where apartheid had its, had its, had its back broken. They did successfully liberate Namibia and knock, you know, knock the South Africans out of that and allow an independent Namibia to emerge. And then broke the back of a. And then broke the back of apartheid. But so you're, you were in the 70s and 80s. That's, that's where Iran Contra and Epstein come in. Because as you talk about the CIA operation is exposed. It's the late 70s, early 80s. People don't have the appetite for these wars like these CIA dirty wars all over the country. So Congress is like, we're not doing this. You're not backing a secret insurgency in Angola anymore. And of course the CIA is like, no, we are. We're going to find a way to do it. And that's where Iran Contra comes in. And so what we had reported over at drop site is that Epstein had all of these wild around Iran Contra connections. He was tight with Adnan Khashoggi, who was the financier and the arms trafficker at the center of Iran Contra. He was a protege of Douglas Leese, a British arms trafficker who had connections with China, which plays an interesting role that maybe we can get into in Angola, like on the side of the US like China often was, because they're hostile at the time with the Soviets was able to kind of arm US allies when the US could not. And we would with a wink and a nod situation like, hey, we can't give weapons directly, maybe China can. That's where a guy like Douglas Leesk sometimes comes in. And then Stan Pottinger, who was a lawyer and a business partner of Epstein, helped set up a lot of the kind of legal structures through which the money laundering and such was done for Iran Contra. And for people who don't know, the middleman in Iran Contra was Israel. So Israel would send weapons to Iran and then the US would replenish Israel's supplies so that the US was not directly arming Iran. Ironic that it's okay for Israel to be directly arming Iran, given that they want to go to war with them constantly.

[Noah Colwyn]

Well, at that time it was a very. I mean, I actually think that's a good. Before I jump to the point, the direct response, what you're just saying. I do want to say, respond to what you were saying a bit earlier about the legacy of the Cuban intervention, which is absolutely right. And probably what I should have open, led with, which is that the Cuban intervention, which is there's not really a precedent for the historian Piero Glasses, whom we interview in the show. He's the, the, the eminent historian having worked through the archives of South African, Cuban and American governments to sketch a portrait of these 15 years in his book Visions of Freedom. You know, he calls it the one time in history that a poor country comes to the defense of another poor country and that it was successful, that the Cubans helped the Angolans not merely outlast but successfully repel South Africans. It was one of the decisive, you know, like it was one of the decisive, it's indisputable factors that led to the South African apartheid regime ultimately agreeing to, to, to end itself. You Know, there was a. There were a number of other factors. There was, and what is still not so well understood in the west today, a functional civil war and violent insurgency being led against the white rule, against white rule within South Africa. But the Cuban victory at the city of Cuito Cuanavale, you know, where you have Fidel Castro issuing battlefield commands over the phone. It's an astonishing scene and it was an unbelievable at the time and obviously totally rational. The actual account of the battle makes it clear how it happened, but it is a very special and important historical understanding of the significance of the Angolan struggle and the Cuban role in it in why apartheid fell and how it really, it suggested the South African apartheid regime was just overmatched in so much of what was doing in southern Africa. Now to your more recent and the specific part about the 80s and sort of how Iran Contra comes in. I think it's helpful. And reading your coverage of this really affirmed this for me. The heart of Iran Contra and the specific Iran Contra deal was this convoluted arrangement by which, as you say, the Americans were supplying arms to the Iranians and using Israel as an intermediary and then using the funds generated from that deal to arm the Contra rebels in Nicaragua. And that is where the name Iran hyphen Contra comes from. But Iran Contra as, as kind of like a signifier for this period of time also kind of works because I would argue that the late 70s and Angola is one example of this into the early 80s. It represents, you know, we think of it as sort of the moment, you know, these, these birth pangs of neoliberalism in America. It's represented by this horrible economic calamity that begins to come, you know, that's affected both by existing inflation issues and then with the Volcker shock. And then abroad, though, when Reagan comes into power, they're both at home and abroad. There are all these different kinds of policy changes and shifts among the attitudes of the American people that allow for both a kind of rearmament, which was not really possible in the 1970s, and a certain kind of appetite for, you know, foreign intervention. And that also coincides with, you know, all sorts of different deregulation and expansion of rule by finance throughout different sectors of the American economy that also enables profit to take place from these sorts of sordid deals and these secret wars that pop up in all sorts of parts, primarily in the third world over the course of the 1980s, Angola being one of them, Afghanistan being another, Central America being another. We could go on and, you know, The. The savings and loan banks crisis is one example of where you can look to see how these kind of converge, where you see savings and loans banks which were deregulated dramatically and eventually have to get bailed out by the government as a sector at the end of the decade. The, you know, spies, drug runners, white collar criminals, you know, immediately take advantage of the deregulation and are able to use them. In some instances, it was shown to get to people like, you know, Adnan Khashoggi was connected in part to one, at least one I know. Bcci, the Pakistani bank, is another financial entity that comes into being during this period or at least rises to prominence and participates in a lot of these deals. And I think you can look at Jeffrey Epstein and the involvement of somebody like Les Wexner years down the line and their connections to these kinds of figures as sort of an example of what is happening more generally in this period in the 1980s, where you have, as a matter of, you know, the policy shifts of the Reagan administration and what we think of as sort of, you know, I would argue, like, the beginnings of the neoliberal era involve, you know, allowing for the rise of, you know, these kinds of entrepreneurs, not just of war, clearly, but also of intelligence and who straddle the, you know, like the world above and, you know, give rides to people like Bill Clinton, but who are. And who were able to make their money by, you know, their adjacency, by dint of their adjacency and their relationships to people who were tied to and ran some of the much darker stuff.

[Jake]

And the key detail there, I don't know if we've said it yet, the money, the profits from Iran selling the weapons to Iran went not only to the Contras, but also to Angola. And so. And into that is rides Jeffrey Epstein out of it. The uae, as we mentioned, the uae, we gotta leave it here. But Epstein linking up with the UAE and the uae, getting involved with Angola is a nice transition point into the way that our contemporary kind of mafias operate. And we're born out of that Iran Contra.

[Ryan Grim]

Super interesting. Yeah, yeah, Noah. Where can people find out more?

[Noah Colwyn]

Yeah, so our show, our full season, our full 10 episodes, they're now coming out weekly. But if you want to listen to all of them now at once, you can go to Blowback show and hit the button that says subscribe. We'll have a. We have a special limited series about the history of the US Israeli relationship coming out this spring. We'll have another full season later this year. But we have full archives of our seasons about the Iraq War, Korean War, Cuban Revolution, Afghanistan wars, rise of the Khmer Rouge. And we got a lot more in the we got a lot more in the hopper. So thanks for having me.

[Ryan Grim]

Yeah, you're very welcome.

[Jake]

And we'll put it.

[Ryan Grim]

I'll listen to the Khmer Rouge one. Yeah, I don't know enough about that one.

[Jake]

Yeah, yeah.

[Noah Colwyn]

All right.

[Jake]

I'm going to ask me that one, too.

[Ryan Grim]

Appreciate it. Thank you guys so much for watching. We appreciate it, Ryan. Thanks for having me, man.

[Jake]

Thanks for coming in.

[Ryan Grim]

Appreciate it. That was Blowback's super interesting. I'm definitely going to listen.

[Jake]

I like it.

[Ryan Grim]

All right, I guess we'll see you all tomorrow. I'll be on the show with Crystal.

[Noah Colwyn]

Foreign.

[Ryan Grim]

This is an iHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.