2/10/26: Trump Demands High House Prices, Olympic Athletes Trash USA, AI Medical Device Backlash, Trump Whitewashes Sudan Complicity

Summary

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Breaking Points with Krystal and Saagar

Episode: "Trump Demands High House Prices, Olympic Athletes Trash USA, AI Medical Device Backlash, Trump Whitewashes Sudan Complicity"

Date: February 10, 2026
Hosts: Krystal Ball and Saagar Enjeti
Guest: Nathaniel Raymond, Executive Director, Humanitarian Research Lab at Yale School of Public Health

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Episode Overview

This episode features an in-depth exploration of four major topics:

1. Political battles over U.S. housing policy, with a focus on Donald Trump's stance and congressional dynamics.
2. The controversy surrounding U.S. Olympic athletes' criticisms of their country, and the ensuing media and political backlash.
3. The dangers and regulatory failures in the rapid adoption of AI-enhanced medical devices.
4. A detailed interview on the escalating crisis in Sudan, including U.S. and international complicity in the ongoing violence.

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1. Trump’s Housing Policy and Political Gridlock

[02:32–20:20]

Key Discussion Points

• Congressional Resistance to Investor Ban:
  Saagar reports on a proposed White House measure to ban certain investors from the housing market—aimed at stopping big firms from snapping up homes and “locking up housing stock.” The measure faces strong bipartisan opposition in Congress, revealing, as Saagar puts it, “what they are actually willing to fight about isn’t you or I, it’s the big investors” (03:13).

• Trump’s Contradictory Position:
  Trump is described as playing both sides:

  • He claims to want to ban investor overreach, but also wants to “keep housing prices high” for existing homeowners—especially older, wealthier voters.
  • Quote – Trump:

    “Existing housing, people that own their homes… We’re going to keep them wealthy. We’re going to keep those prices up… I don’t want to drive housing prices down. I want to drive housing prices up for people that own their homes.”
    — Trump, as quoted by Saagar [05:06–05:43]

• NIMBY Politics & Financialization:
  Both hosts blast Trump’s openly “NIMBY to his core” attitude (06:58), pointing out how home-owning boomers are a politically powerful, well-organized constituency.

  • Krystal:

    “He truly is a NIMBY to his core… It’s just crazy to hear him say it out loud that, no, I love the housing bubble, I want to continue to inflate it forever.” [06:58–07:41]

  • They discuss the proliferation of exotic mortgage products (e.g., 50-year mortgages) as a “band-aid” that prolongs unaffordability instead of promoting affordable housing.

• Affordability Crisis Data:
  Shocking statistics highlight the severity of the housing crisis:

  • New homebuyers now face a 70% down payment relative to annual household income—up from 45% in 2000 (09:12).
  • First-year mortgage payments now eat up 25% (vs. 18% in 2019) of annual household income—not including other rising costs (09:20).

• Generational Divide & Housing Scarcity:

  • Young adults are increasingly forced to live with parents—18% of 25–34-year-olds in 2023, up from 8% in the 1970s (14:54).
  • Krystal critiques property tax breaks for senior homeowners as a “class war,” depriving revenue from schools and services while benefiting the already-wealthy (18:45).
  • Saagar’s frustration peaks:

    “It’s the principle… I’m sick of this bullshit. My dad...can’t afford the property tax payment anymore. It’s $8,000. Somebody did the math: He’s sitting on a $1.6 million house. Okay? Fuck, you actually sell it. How about that?” [15:50–16:10]

Notable Quotes

• Saagar:

  “All anybody wants to talk about: Oh, well, somebody please think of these people who worked hard and played by the rules. It's like, well, part of the rules is called a property tax.” [05:45–06:00]

• Krystal:

  “It is nothing to do with [good policy]. It’s because this group of people, property-owning boomers, are very, very politically powerful. They are important to the base of both parties. And so they get super-served.” [18:45]

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2. Olympic Athletes, Free Speech, and Outrage Culture

[22:30–41:47]

Key Discussion Points

• Athletes Speak Out:
  Several U.S. Olympic athletes made moderate statements expressing discomfort representing the country during the Trump administration, especially regarding ICE and human rights (23:05–24:53).

  • Quotes from athletes:

    “It brings up mixed emotions to represent the US right now. There’s a lot going on that I’m not the biggest fan of.”
    — Olympic Skier Hunter Hess [23:05]
    “Just because I’m wearing the flag doesn’t mean I represent everything that’s going on.” [23:15]

• Political & Media Backlash:

  • Trump, politicians (e.g., Rick Scott [25:55]), right-wing media figures, and social media personalities attacked these athletes, calling for their removal from Team USA.
  • Trump:

    “U.S. Olympic skier Hunter Hess, a real loser, says he doesn’t represent his country... If that’s the case, he shouldn’t have tried out for the team… Make America Great Again.” [25:22]

• Patriotism, Free Speech & Hypocrisy:

  • Krystal notes that “one of the great things about the United States of America is you have free speech. Just because you criticize the government, it doesn’t mean you hate the country.” [26:07]
  • Saagar elaborates on the hypocrisy:

    “Great countries don’t care what other people have to say… Is anyone shocked that an upper middle class white skier is a lib? That’s the least shocking thing of all time.” [26:56–27:45]

  • They point out that U.S. Olympians are not even funded by the government but by private sponsors, so outrage over "representing the country" is performative (29:39).
  • Saagar:

    “If you’re so butthurt about some skier who says I’m semi-conflicted about wearing the flag, like, you have…you’re beyond lost.” [33:08–33:18]

• Consistency in Political Judgment:

  • Both hosts agree that the way people root for (or against) athletes is often deeply inconsistent and hypocritical, depending on the politics of the athlete.

• International Angle – ICE at Olympics:

  • U.S. sending ICE agents to Olympics sparks Italian protests, leading to a broader discussion about the globalization of U.S. politics and global criticism.
  • Saagar:

    “Italians – worry about your own fucking country. Like, I’m sorry, this annoys the crap out of me.” [40:39]

  • Krystal pushes back, noting the U.S. has global impact and it’s understandable for others to be concerned (41:03).

Notable Moments & Quotes

• Saagar:

  “You look like a little bitch…deep weakness in the way people have reacted to this.” [38:07–38:17]

• Krystal:

  “If you have to agree with every political sentiment that is expressed with someone to root for Team USA…to me that feels un-American.” [36:18]

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3. AI Medical Device Risks and Regulatory Breakdown

[45:01–54:45]

Key Discussion Points

• AI-Driven Medical Device Mishaps:
  Both hosts review a Reuters investigation into AI-powered surgical devices causing serious patient injuries due to system errors, including misidentified body parts and botched surgeries (45:01–46:15).

  • Examples include patients suffering from accidental strokes, cerebrospinal fluid leaks, and similar preventable injuries due to faulty AI guidance.

• Regulatory Failure:
  The FDA is described as “overwhelmed” and “degraded,” unable to properly scrutinize new AI devices, especially as manufacturers claim “minor updates” to bypass lengthy approvals (48:02–48:38).

• Conflict of Interest and Patient Safety:
  Physicians with financial ties to device manufacturers are sometimes the ones adopting dangerous new medical AI—raising alarms about conflicts of interest [46:15–47:15].

• AI’s Wild Variability:
  The hosts highlight an example where AI gave different health grades—from B to F—on the same Apple Watch cardiac data, demonstrating the unreliability of consumer-facing AI advice (50:46–51:00).

• Solutions and Skepticism:
  Saagar insists on a much stricter, trial-based approach for AI in medicine:

  “You gotta prove it before you use it…unless you can prove with explicit patient consent and everything, it should not be used.” [51:02]
  Krystal expresses political skepticism, arguing that current power structures ensure AI's benefits won’t flow to ordinary people but will “further immiserate us, extract profits, and funnel power and wealth to the top” [52:30].

Notable Quotes

• Krystal:

  “We have this system where Big Pharma can average, ‘ask your doctor, blah blah blah.’ Now we’re talking about integrating that directly into the medical care you’re receiving from an AI doctor.” [54:20]
  “No one would want this if we had free healthcare like the rest of the developed world.” [54:29]

• Saagar:

  “I just think we need stuff to be banned. I’ve come around to a much more Luddite view…What social benefit could come from that?” [51:02]

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4. The Sudan Conflict and Western Complicity

Interview: Nathaniel Raymond [56:48–68:20]

Key Discussion Points

• Situation Overview:

  • Sudan is embroiled in a devastating conflict between the official Sudanese Armed Forces (SAF) and the Rapid Support Forces (RSF)—a paramilitary group with roots in the Janjaweed militia infamous for mass killings in Darfur (57:40).
  • The UAE is arming the RSF with advanced “suicide drones” and other weaponry sourced from China (57:40, 62:38).

• U.S. and Western Complicity:

  • The U.S., UK, and Europe have prioritized diplomatic and economic ties with the UAE over intervening to stop the flow of weapons fueling atrocities, according to Raymond.
  • Quote:

    “The United States…has prioritized the diplomatic, economic, and security relationship…with the UAE over the lives of these people. If the West wanted to, they could stop this war in about 10 seconds…by turning off the spigot of advanced weapons.” [61:13]

• Drone Warfare Escalation:
  The RSF has rapidly advanced from basic weaponry to operating a full drone force; drones are used to attack civilian sites including a World Food Program aid convoy (57:17, 62:19).

• Internationalization of Conflict:

  • A Reuters report revealed Ethiopia is hosting secret camps to train RSF fighters, confirming fears of the war becoming a regional proxy conflict (64:26).

• Avoidance of Blame by U.S. Officials:

  • Krystal observes that official U.S. statements on attacks avoid naming the RSF as perpetrators, which Raymond attributes to political sensitivities about the UAE (60:36).

• Humanitarian Disaster:

  • “Between 60,000 to 100,000 civilians were massacred…by the Rapid Support Forces in an act of genocide, probably the last major killing of the Darfur genocide.” — Nathaniel Raymond [60:36]

Notable Quotes

• Raymond:

  “This is not just a civil war. It is a fight of regional proxies where the main victim…are the lives and bodies of Sudanese civilians. Like the movie Die Hard, what you think is a terrorist action is actually a bank robbery…the people being robbed are the Sudanese people.” [66:01]

• Raymond on complicity:

  “If the West wanted to, they could stop this war in about 10 seconds…that’s turning off the spigot of advanced weapons to the Rapid Support Forces from their sponsor, the UAE…” [61:13]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• 02:32 – 20:20: Housing Policy—Trump, Congress, generational/class conflict, data
• 22:30 – 41:47: Olympic Athletes, Free Speech, and Political Outrage
• 45:01 – 54:45: AI Medical Device Failures and Regulatory Capture
• 56:48 – 68:20: Sudan Crisis—Interview with Nathaniel Raymond

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Memorable Moments

• Saagar's sarcastic mock-sympathy for wealthy homeowners:

  “All I want to do is cap their property tax and pay for their dialysis… That is justice, fairness, and the American dream at its heart.” [05:45]

• Krystal’s summary of generational/class politics:

  “It is a class war, because if you’re giving these benefits to property owners, those are disproportionately going to be better-off people than the renter class…” [18:45]

• Saagar on reactions to athlete dissent:

  “You look like a little bitch… deep weakness in the way people have reacted to this.” [38:07]

• Nathaniel Raymond on U.S. complicity in Sudan:

  “If the West wanted to, they could stop this war in about 10 seconds… instead, they’ve prioritized the relationship with the UAE over the lives of these people.” [61:13]

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Tone and Style

• Candid, irreverent, and often exasperated—especially regarding American political dysfunction and hypocrisy.
• Both hosts mix data-driven analysis with pointed, impassioned commentary and dark, biting humor.
• Guest segment on Sudan is sober, heavily detailed, and indicts Western power (in line with the show's anti-establishment perspective).

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Conclusion

This episode of Breaking Points is a comprehensive, sometimes scathing dissection of the intersection between economics, politics, and global conflict—grounded by personal commentary, data, and expert testimony. Saagar and Krystal’s willingness to challenge both major parties and established interests shines throughout, whether on domestic housing issues, cynical patriotic outrage, the perils of “AI everything,” or U.S. complicity in humanitarian disasters abroad.

For further details or to follow up on any of the topics, listeners are encouraged to review timestamped sections based on their interests.

Transcript

[Krystal Ball]

This is an iHeart podcast.

[Sagar Enjeti]

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[Krystal Ball]

Hey, this is US.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Olympic gold medalist Tara Davis Woodhull and.

[Krystal Ball]

I'm US Paralympic gold medalist Hunter Woodhull. As athletes, our lives are about having a clear path and a team that you can absolutely trust. So when it came to getting the best mortgage, we chose PennyMac. PennyMac is proud to be the official mortgage provider of Team USA and you learn more at pennymac.com PennyMac Loan Services, LLC equal housing lender NMLS ID 35953.

[Sagar Enjeti]

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[Krystal Ball]

And Innovation under the California Residential Mortgage Lending Act. Conditions and restrictions may apply.

[Sagar Enjeti]

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[Krystal Ball]

Sagar and Krystal here.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Independent media just played a truly massive role in this election and we are so excited about what that means for the future of this show.

[Krystal Ball]

This is the only place where you can find honest perspectives from the left and the right that simply does not exist anywhere else.

[Kyle Kulinski]

So if that is something that's important to you, Please go to BreakingPoints.com, become a member today, and you'll get access to our full shows, unedited ad free, and all put together for you every morning in your inbox.

[Krystal Ball]

We need your help to build the future of independent news media and we hope to see [e-mail] Moving on to housing. This is a story we've been wanting to cover for quite a long time. And of course, here in Washington, you will see Republicans kiss Trump's ass on any number of things. Then he tries to do something good for once. And what happens? Let's put it up here on the screen. Proposed ban on investors in the housing market hits a wall in Congress. White House is pressuring GOP Congress to add an investor ban to existing housing bills, but lawmakers have pushed back. Now, let's just think about this. Bomb Venezuela in violation of the law. No problem.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Yeah.

[Krystal Ball]

Bomb Iran. No problem. Let's extend massive tax cuts. Oh, yeah, of course. Here you go. Anything else? Didn't see the tweet. Sorry, what was that? I'm not aware of it. Let's ban investors. Oh, no, we can't have that. We couldn't possibly allow something like that. We'll have to start at a subcommittee level before we start to consider something like this. So this is Washington, people. This is Washington. If you try and do something even marginally good, you're dead. And look, my sources tell me they're going to continue to fight on this, but I'm not going to hold my breath. But the biggest problem and most revealing part of all of it is just to show you where power really lies, what they are willing to hold the line, if anything. That's. That's everything, right? What are they actually willing to fight about? And this is one of them. And what they talk about here specifically is that, for example, lawmakers in both chambers have resisted adding the investor ban, which traditional free market advocates say they oppose. Any such amendment would derail a bipartisan momentum behind current housing packages. The House overwhelmingly voted in favor of a current bill by 390 to 9. The two chambers will then have to reconcile later. However, the OMB issued a statement reiterating the administration's insistence on this investor ban. But it was immediately had huge pushback back. And all of this is because the people they work for are not you or I. It is the very big time investors themselves, the people who are locking up housing stock. Part of the other problem, Crystal, is Trump himself is all over the place. So at the very same time that he wants to. What does he want to do? He wants to ban investors from buying houses. He also is a slave to the boomers who wants to keep their housing prices high. His words, not mine. Here's what he had to say.

[Nathaniel Raymond]

Existing housing, people that own their homes.

[Kyle Kulinski]

We'Re going to keep them wealthy.

[Nathaniel Raymond]

We're going to keep those prices up.

[Krystal Ball]

We're not going to destroy the value.

[Nathaniel Raymond]

Of their homes so that somebody that.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Didn'T work very hard can buy a home.

[Nathaniel Raymond]

We're going to get. We're going to make it easier to buy.

[Kyle Kulinski]

We're going to get interest rates down.

[Nathaniel Raymond]

But I want to protect the people.

[Sagar Enjeti]

That for the first time in their.

[Nathaniel Raymond]

Lives, feel good about themselves. They feel like they've, you know, that they're wealthy people. And I want them to understand it. You know, there's so much talk about, oh, we're going to drive housing prices down.

[Krystal Ball]

I don't want to drive housing prices down.

[Nathaniel Raymond]

I want to drive housing prices up for people that own their homes and.

[Kyle Kulinski]

They can be assured that's what's going to happen.

[Krystal Ball]

Yeah, you can go ahead and stick a gun in my mouth. All right. For the first time in their lives, these people are wealthy. Really. They've been wealthy for a long time, actually. All right, well, somebody please think of the person who bought a Santa Monica piece of real estate for 200,000 and now it's worth 2.4 million. I mean, I weep for that individual. In fact, all I want to do is cap their property tax and pay for their dialysis and then continue to pay for their retirement. And then whenever they die and they pass it on to their children and we don't get a single dollar of it because of the step up basis. I mean, that is what makes me proud to be in America. That is justice, fairness, and the American dream at its heart. I mean, this is. This is the problem. This is the problem. We're slave to these people. All anybody wants to talk about, oh, well, somebody pleasing these people who worked hard and played by the rules. It's like, well, part of the rules is called a property tax. Except what do they do? Because they write the rules, they try to make it go away. If you try to do anything that might marginally decrease the price of housing, then, oh, no, we can't have that because it would hurt a little bit of their stock. I mean, a little bit of their gains. It drives me insane. But this is. That's actual the government policy. Well, and Trump that's what's so maddening.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Yeah, and Trump, Trump is a NIMBY to his core. Like this is not the first time, this is the most overt that he's laid out his view of like, I don't want housing prices to go down. Are you crazy? Those people vote like, I want their housing prices to continue to go up and like, we'll give you a 50 year mortgage. Remember that was one of their, his, his ideas. So since housing prices are wildly unaffordable and there's no way you can do, you know, stomach a mortgage payment for 20 or 30 year mortgage, how about we do a 50 year mortgage? That'll get you in the door. Those are the sorts of ideas that are most appealing to him because he truly is a NIMBY to his core. I mean, there have been plenty of campaign rhetoric from him talking about how Democrats wanna destroy the suburbs. They wanna destroy your neighborhood and bring in all these undesirables. And this is very like deep in New York politics, especially in like the New York City suburbs. Jeanine Pirro comes out of some of these like NIMBY fights and it's a bit of, I mean he is, in a sense, he's very brazen about it. He's not wrong about some of the politics though, because they are very powerful and influential and mobilized group of voters. You know, the fact that they are homeowners means that number one, oftentimes there's some money that they can throw to campaigns. But number two, you know, they're locked in, they're in a neighborhood, they put roots down in a community. That's one of the important things about homeownership is it allows that, that dynamic to take hold. And if you're more transient, you're less likely to be engaged in your local political culture. So if you're a renter, you're sort of inherently less likely to be as influential at the ballot box. Older people vote in larger numbers. This is his core base. So that's what he is reflecting here. It's just crazy to hear him say it out loud that, no, I love the housing bubble, I want to continue to inflate it forever. And instead I want to come up with these like exotic financial instruments that keep you indebted and enslaved for your entire life rather than actually trying to create, to surge more affordable housing. The thing that's this bipartisan housing legislation in the House and the Senate, which I don't have a lot of hope that it's going to really change the game on Anything, whatever. It's a lot of sort of abundance style ideas of hey, let's roll back regulation here, let's roll back red t there. Let's explore some different housing construction methods. All things that I'm for. All fine, right. But you know, again, it's, I think there's a demonstration of the limits of what can be done with that. If you don't have more sort of aggressive and direct government intervention to surge affordable housing, just letting the free market do its thing is not going to be enough to overcome what is a massive housing deficit and what is a, you know, insane increase in housing prices for young adjustments.

[Krystal Ball]

I should clarify, I'm not a total yimby either. I mean I don't like a lot of the yimby abundance people. They want us all to live in 1200 square. 1200 square foot glass boxes that are run by developers. Like I'm good with that actually, you know, so I think there's a role for community and all that. Now I'm not going to take it as far as some people do who every time you want to build something new, they're like, but what about the public parking? I'm just like, shut up, okay? In my neighborhood they genuinely put up a, they put up a sign that said if we build a new apartment building then a 911 will get overwhelmed. And I'm like, I think that's a problem that we could figure out. You know, 911 is not going to get overwhelmed. Just say you don't want more people living here. That's. You can say it, okay, we can all say it. Let's just not make up fake numbers. And in a, in the current environment. No, sorry. Like just because you own a house, like there's people out there paying 25, $3,000 a month for studio apartments. Like I can't be having this. Like at a certain point we have to balance this stuff out as a society so we can be a little bit nimby. If, if, you know, if things too far, I'll tell you, but that's my point is that we can, let's be reasonable. Let's say if rent is at a place where it's going to eat up 40, 50, 60% of after tax income, then yes, I'm sorry your community aspects are not going to be taken as seriously. If it's 20 and 30, sure, let's talk about beautification or public spaces or parks. Things are so out of control that, you know, we're at a place where the land Owning class is so dramatically in power, all they are doing is trying to protect their own assets. So let's put C3 up on the screen. For example, Trump says voting housing prices are too high. Trump wants them higher. He said he wants to drive housing prices up, not down. Speaking to the conundrum that has flummoxed policymakers for decades. And what they point to is that poll after poll after poll just shows you that people are very upset about the price of housing and specifically interest rates and how much it would take to be even able to enter the door. So to give you a good example of how dramatically things have changed just in the last six years, let's go to the next one. Goldman Sachs just ran a new analysis for young married couples considering buying their first home. The average down payment is now 70% of annual household income. In 2019 it was 58%, still way too high. 45% in the year 2000, the first year mortgage payment is then about 25% of that annual household income versus 18 in 2019 and 20% in 2020. Now keep in mind this is just housing inflation. So your portion of your after tax income having to be spent on food, on health care and let's child care, if you are have a child, is also dramatically inflated, which means that your room and your budget starts to approach zero very, very, very quickly. So those numbers I think make it all very obvious about what's happening here. Like we have a massive undersupply of houses. And again, I'm not one of these people who's like, oh, let's build glass or anything. I think we should probably make it so the feds grant huge. We could give huge grants state by state and then the states can figure it out. Texas has by the way, done a very good job of this. It's not all just glass. If you go down to, you know, some suburbs or people sent me pictures like from Dallas suburbs, these are, you know, decent houses, a couple hundred thousand dollars, nothing crazy. It's also, you know, something you can actually own, place to park your car, decent lawn, couple bedrooms. That's all anybody really needs, right? And so you can see. And that's all. It's like, that's the other thing. People are not desiring like multi McMansions or any of that. I really don't think people are being all that unreasonable. The only reason that McMansions get built is because the rich people are the people who buy houses and the boomers and all these other people. Apparently, even though you have no Children at home, they're like, oh I have to have a seven bedroom house in case my grandchildren come to visit at Christmas. This is the stuff that you hear from this crowd. But currently what we see right now, C5 for example. Can we put this on the screen? I thought this was a good article. Just to show the scale of the problem. Experts currently say the US needs between 2 million to 20 million to fix the current short term.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Glad we've narrowed that down.

[Krystal Ball]

Underscoring the challenge of meaning. So I love because you're, you know like they point to the, the Goldman Sachs analys that puts the number 3 million. Zillow's estimate tops 4 million. Brookings projects 5 million. McKinsey says 8 million. Meanwhile, congressional Republicans say the shortfall is 20 million. And so economists who contend that there's no. And then there are quote, economists who contend there's no shortage at all. And you know, this is one where we have 146 million homes, 8.1 million are doubled up households, people sharing space with non relatives, 3.4 million vacant homes available to rent or buy. This is probably the misallocation stuff though a lot of that is going to be a more undesirable area. So the desirable areas, high cost of living areas have a massive shortage. This, I mean look, it's just one of those where we have to figure out interest rates, affordability and being able to buy housing, which there's no way the free market can solve this. It will take massive government intervention, period, end of story. There's just no getting around it.

[Kyle Kulinski]

One of the things they point to in that article too, part of why they think economists, they're making the case that economists sometimes underestimate the housing need is because you have doubled up households like Sagar was talking about where the assumption is kind of like, well if they could afford it, they probably would rather live on their own, have their own home. Not in all cases, but in many cases they would prefer to have their own space. And then you also have a comparatively High percentage of 25 to 34 year olds who continue to live in their parents home. So in 2023, 18% of adults 25 to 34 still living in their parents home. It's compared to 8% in the 1970s according to a Pew Research center report. So when you have that high level of housing cost and housing stress, you're naturally going to see more and more young professionals. I mean 34 years old is not all that young. 34 year olds who are still living with mom and dad. Because that is the best financial option for them, and nothing else may be even possible at that phase in their Life.

[Krystal Ball]

I'm turning 34 this year and already feel old. I agree. It's not that bad. I agree. Let's go. Okay, final thing. You can already guess where I'm going with this. Red state, blue state, we are united in one goal. Let's put C6 up here on the screen. As the world crumbles, as the price of everything skyrockets, what are these people focused on? Governor Gretchen Whitmer. With property taxes going up year after year, Michigan seniors deserve stability. They've worked hard and earned the right to relief in their golden years. She continues. That is why I am proposing property tax relief for 355,000 seniors, saving households of an average of $345 a year by refunding 10% of their property tax. That's money back in their pockets to pay bills and to put food on the table. Now, look, 345 bucks. Sure, it's. That's like one trip to the grocery store, but the. It's the principle. First of all, the state comptroller already says you shouldn't do this because you're gonna shortfall our overall budget. But Second, this is $90 million explicitly written in the budget for seniors to make it so that they don't have to pay as much of their property tax. I'm sick of this bullshit. I don't know if you've seen this so many viral tweets. Somebody recently put it up. My dad, who's only on Social Security, he can't afford the property tax payment anymore. It's $8,000. Somebody did the math. He's sitting on a 1.6 dollar house, okay? It's like, fuck, you actually sell it. How about that? Pull yourself up by your bootstraps. You should have planned better for financial, For. For your retirement. So now if you don't have the money to pay for it, you could sell it to somebody. And then not only could you pay it, you could make sure, and you could buy yourself a nice little condo in Boca Raton, Florida, and live very comfortably for the rest of your life. It's like, why are we deluding ourselves into thinking that this is some great crisis? And yet Texas, Michigan, Florida, I mean, almost every state in the country is moving towards either zero property tax. Zero is the worst. But I mean. Or maybe I'm not so sure. Carve out for Boomer is also really bad. But Colorado, even, that's, you know, the tweet that they were talking about. They have a property tax allocation there specifically already written out for boomers. It's like this. It's literally age discrimination in the opposite direction of where it is needed. And nobody, nobody has the courage to actually speak out and not only defend the mechanism of a property tax, but specifically to talk. And yes, I know it's uncomfortable to say that churn in the housing market is important and good in order to make sure that inventory turns. We know this whenever it comes to retail, we know this whenever it comes to any other business sector. This is the one where we decide that there's an age exemption. And again, it discriminates against the people who aren't even doing anything. It's crazy.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Yeah, well, and even, I mean, it's also class war, because if you're giving these benefits to property owners, those are disproportionately going to be better off people than the renter class. And then what are you doing? That's tax revenue that's not coming in to go to the universally used programs, the schools, the roads, the fire department, the police department, all of those things that, you know, the community and the state has to fund and everybody benefits from. So, you know, it's. Yeah, and it goes back to Trump's view, his NIMBY view of like, we gotta raise the housing prices. The reason politicians go in this direction is not because this is like the best use of money or is gonna benefit the most people or the most advantageous. It is nothing to do with that. It's because this group of people, property owned, home owning boomers, are very, very politically powerful. They are important to the base of both parties. And so they get super served.

[Krystal Ball]

Yeah, that's right. And apparently, you know, this is another problem for Michigan. I was talking to somebody, I go, dude, what's going on here? Like, why is Whitmer doing this? They go, oh, man. Michigan actually has a very elderly population. Well, guess what, guys, this causes brain drain. So if you don't have a decent economy or if you have something that's continuing to go down, the state is working largely on behalf, let's say, of the elderly property owning class. What are, what are the young people gonna do? They're gonna move, they're gonna leave, and then your economy's gonna continue to dwindle.

[Kyle Kulinski]

It's like, well, especially if you're robbing, like the school system.

[Krystal Ball]

Exactly.

[Kyle Kulinski]

To give Boomer proper tax break.

[Krystal Ball]

Yeah, exactly. And so this is the, like, this is not a way to protect your state. If anything you're setting yourself up for failure and making sure that you're going to be remain non competitive. But look, this is the people work for and we are doomed to this for a while. All right, let's get to the Olympics.

[Sagar Enjeti]

Support for the show comes from Public, the investing platform for those who take it seriously. On Public you can build a multi asset portfolio of stocks, bonds, options, crypto and now generated assets which allow you to turn any idea into an investable index with AI. It all starts with your prompt. From renewable energy companies with high free cash flow to semiconductor suppliers growing revenue over 20% year over year, you can literally type any prompt and put the AI to work. It screens thousands of stocks, builds a one of a kind index and lets you back test it against the S&P 500. Then you can invest in a few clicks. Generated assets are like ETFs with infinite possibilities, completely customizable and based on your thesis, not someone else's. Go to public.com podcast and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio. That's public.com podcast paid for by Public Investing Brokerage Services by Open to the Public Investing Inc. Member FINRA and SIPC Advisory Services by Public Advisors, llc SEC Registered Advisor Generated Assets is an interactive analysis tool. Output is for informational purposes only and is not an investment recommendation or advice. Complete Disclosures available at public.comDisclosures Military life isn't predictable, but earning your master's degree can be. With American Military University's 40 plus flexible online master's programs, you can stay mission ready while you get market ready ready. Learn anywhere, anytime with an education built to keep pace, steady, reliable and always accessible. Plus, military service members, veterans and their families can save up to 45% on master's tuition with AMU's special rates and grants. Learn more at AMU apus.edu. steady through every Mission Owning a home is full of surprises. Some wonderful, some not so much. And when something breaks, it can feel like the whole day unravels. That's why HomeServe exists for as little as $4.99 a month. You'll always have someone to call a trusted professional ready to help, bringing peace of mind to four and a half million homeowners nationwide.

[Nathaniel Raymond]

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[Sagar Enjeti]

To HomeServe.com that's HomeServe.com not available everywhere.

[Krystal Ball]

Most plans range between 499 to $11.99 a month.

[Sagar Enjeti]

Your first year terms apply on covered repairs.

[Kyle Kulinski]

All right, so Continuing this week of Breaking Point sports coverage to take a look at what was happening at the Olympic soccer found that really funny because it's definitely not our specialty. Anyway, um, you've had a bunch of American Olympic athletes who have been speaking out in relatively, frankly, mild ways, clearly uncomfortable with a lot of what is going on with the Trump administration, specifically, probably with regard to ice. I think it's fair to read into a lot of these comments. The person who kicked this off is a skier named Hunter Hess. But there were some other athletes that had follow on comments when they were asked about it. Let's go ahead and take a listen to some of those comments.

[Krystal Ball]

It brings up mixed emotions to represent the US Right now. I think it's a little hard. There's obviously a lot going on that I'm not the biggest fan of, and I think a lot of people aren't. If it aligns with my moral values, I feel like I'm representing it. Just because I'm wearing the flag doesn't mean I represent everything that's going on.

[Kyle Kulinski]

In the U.S. it's been a hard time for the community overall under this administration. It isn't the first time that we've had to come together as a community and try and fight for our human rights. And now especially, it's not just affecting the queer community, but many other communities. I know that a lot of people say you're just an athlete, like, stick to your job, shut up about politics. But politics affect us all. It is something that I will not just be quiet about because it is something that affects us in our everyday lives.

[Krystal Ball]

I feel heartbroken about what's happened in the United States when, you know, I'm pretty sure you're referencing ICE and some of the protests and things like that. I think that as a country, we need to focus on respecting everybody's rights and making sure that we're treating our citizens as well as anybody with love and respect. And I hope that when people look at athletes compete in the Olympics, they realize that that's the America that we're trying to represent.

[Kyle Kulinski]

My parents being immigrants, this one definitely hits pretty close to close to home. And I think in moments like these, it is really important for us to unite and kind of stand up for one another for all that's going on. And I think that I'm really proud.

[Krystal Ball]

To represent the United States. The US has given my family and.

[Kyle Kulinski]

I so much opportunity, but I also think that we are allowed to voice our opinions on what's going on. All right, so relatively in my opinion, mild comments. In any case, cue the total freakout from everybody. From the President on down on the right, we've got D3. You can put Trump's truth social up on the screen here. In response, I think specifically to Hunter hess, he says U.S. olympics gear. Hunter Hess, a real loser, says he doesn't represent his country in the current Winter Olympics. If that's the case, he shouldn't have tried out for the team. And it's too bad he's on it. Very hard to root for someone like this. Make America great again.

[Krystal Ball]

Your Trump voice is getting better.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Is it? My Trump voice is an impression of Kyle doing his impression of Trump. So it's not great, but I feel like when you're reading his words, you kind of got to give it a little bit of the Trumpy humor.

[Krystal Ball]

I like it.

[Kyle Kulinski]

In any case, Senator Rick Scott weighed in. This is D0 guys with a similar sentiment, saying they should be pulled from the team. How dare they speak against the great US Of A. Let's listen to that one.

[Krystal Ball]

Any person who goes to the Olympics to represent the United States and then says they don't want to represent the United States should be immediately stripped of the Olympic uniform.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Immediately stripped of the Olympic uniform. And I mean, my commentary on this is very obvious. Sagar. Like, one of the great things about the United States of America is you have free speech. And just because you criticize the government, it's giving me like war on terror flashbacks where, like, if you don't love what George W. Bush is, you hate our troops, you hate America, blah, blah, blah, you're not a patriot. Like, you're supposed to be able to be critical of the government. That's fine. That doesn't mean you hate the country and you don't wanna represent the country. And then the other piece that I don't know is sort of driving me crazy is who is stripping? It's not like the government even supports them to go to the Olympics.

[Krystal Ball]

I'll get to that.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Right, so like, who is stripping them of their ability to. To be there and compete? The whole thing is absurd. It's a total freak out. It reminds me of the super bowl freak out. Like complete snowflake fake outrage behavior here from the right.

[Krystal Ball]

You know, it's interesting. I feel very similarly, and I feel actually very similar to the super bowl halftime show. It reminds me of a conversation which I once had. I won't name the government, but I once had a very interesting dinner with a very senior government official of a foreign country. And this country was pursuing a lot of censorship against critics. And they were asking me what I thought about it and I said, well, with great respect, great countries don't care what other people have to say. Yeah, great countries are confident in who they are enough to the point where is anyone shocked that an upper middle class white skier is a lib? Like, that's the least shocking thing of literally of all time. That would be like if I told you your average NFL athlete is like a mid tier Charlie Kirk conservative.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Well, the white ones, anyway.

[Krystal Ball]

Well, yeah, well, actually a lot of the black ones too, actually, kind of shockingly enough. But anyway, my point is just like, wow, what a absolute shocker. So I don't know, I don't know why this really does. I don't know why this really does not offend me at all. I mean, I get where some people are coming from. There is a liberal tendency to pretend like you're James Baldwin and be like, I love my country so much, I'm going to criticize it. It's like, no, you actually hate a very large part of the entire country and don't really believe in many of the founding ethos or believe in its greatness. So I understand where many right wingers are coming from because there is a general tendency of a lot of left wingers who hold that belief, I think, pretty structurally and fundamentally. I'll give you an example, because this is also tied into the press. The press loves this shit, by the way. A lot of the athletes have even complained. They're like, we didn't come here to talk about this. You asked us and we're asking, we're giving you our opinion. Does the press care? For example, Eileen Gu, who is an American born who's competing for the Chinese, she's a traitor, in my opinion. Nobody asked her shit about what's going on with Jimmy Lai in Hong Kong. Because you know why? She would literally lose. Like, their government actually does control what they do. That's why I think we're better than the Chinese system. But there is a structural disadvantage with our press where nobody apparently asked that. Everyone's like, oh, hey, you're literally a traitor to the United States and you're competing for a foreign government, and even though you've benefited and are funded like millions of dollars, and we're all just okay with that. So that's like a press criticism and not of the athletes themselves. There's also the Olympics criticism here, where, again, I actually was not even aware of this. So can we put up this D6. Where is it? D6. I didn't even know that we don't fund our Olympics. So then a lot of this is actually moot, apparently. Again, I'm ignorant. It is fully funded by corporate sponsorships and private donations. So IRL then. Yeah, they literally can say whatever they want. Okay. And apparently I was the only fool who wasn't believed belief. Who was under the belief that the government had some role in Team usa. I guess we just adopt Team USA and it becomes its own thing. So obviously we should have no say over what these athletes are saying. If. Especially if they're. Especially if they're not funded or supported by the taxpayer in any way. Again, I'm not going to sit here and say. Let's just say, for example, because there's been a lot of discourse. They're like, they say that they're just upset for love and everybody knows what they're talking about. If In June of 2020 I said all lives matter, you know exactly what I'm saying.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Yeah.

[Krystal Ball]

So, like, there's. Let's not pretend that there isn't subtext there. Oh, how could you disagree with that? You know exactly what the fuck I'm trying to say. So, like, let's not bullshit about the actual political.

[Kyle Kulinski]

There's definitely political context for it.

[Krystal Ball]

That's what this is about.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Although it is. I mean, the things they're saying are. It's funny, always funny to me how athletes and celebrities are judged by this difference standard where they'll say like, the most mild thing possible. And it's like, oh, my God. Right? And that's sort of how I feel about this. They're like, yeah, I'm not really that comfortable with everything that's going on. And, you know, I think we should have compassion for each other. And it's like, oh, this is crazy that they said that.

[Krystal Ball]

You know what that means?

[Kyle Kulinski]

Of course.

[Krystal Ball]

Just like all lives matter. You know what I mean?

[Kyle Kulinski]

Yeah, I get what you're saying. There's obviously political context there. I mean, that's what we talked about with Bad Bunny too, right?

[Krystal Ball]

Sure.

[Kyle Kulinski]

His performance was obviously political. There's no doubt that it's political. The other thing that I would say, though, to your point about, like, it's no surprise that upper middle class or upper class white libs are critical of the Trump administration. That's true. But I think what is noteworthy is, number one, just the sheer number of them who are saying they're asking. I know, but they're not talk about it.

[Krystal Ball]

They're. The press wants I've watched them to say it.

[Kyle Kulinski]

I've watched so many of these, like, you know, the Australian. But none of the Americans there said shit about shit. Right. So the number of them that are saying anything to me is noteworthy. Number two, look, we look at the polling like it's not just white libs.

[Krystal Ball]

True.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Who feel this way. I mean, this is an overwhelming sentiment among Americans. You know, outside of like hardcore maga, there's a lot. And even their New York Times just did a big, you know, focus group with a bunch of the Trump voters that they've stayed in touch with. And a number of them are like, I'm not really comfortable. I feel like there's an assault on the Second Amendment going on. I feel like there's assault on the First Amendment going on. I support the idea of getting immigrants out, but I'm not sure how things are going. So I also don't wanna pretend like, yes, these are mostly white upper class or upper middle class people who are saying this, but their sentiment is also very reflective of what's going on in the country. And I think that's part of why we can put some of the D4, we can put some of the different reactions up on the screen here just to get a sense. We've got Megyn Kelly, another turncoat to root against. I think we've got Byron Donalds here. You chose to wear our flag. You ch. Represent our country. If that's too hard for you, go home, blah, blah, blah, you can continue rolling them here. But you know, I think part of why you are having this like meltdown, freak out moment with regard to the super bowl and with regard to this is because there is a sense of sort of fragility where if you felt very confident, like maga's got the vibes and we're winning and everybody loves us, et cetera, it'd be easier just to kind of brush this off. That was my point. Yeah.

[Krystal Ball]

Whatever structural weakness is that if you're.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Yes, that's right.

[Krystal Ball]

If you're so butthurt about some skier who says I'm semi conflicted about wearing the flag, like you have, you're beyond loss. Okay? You have no idea what you are in for. And I mean, that's kind of the way I'm operating from, is that you can see very clearly that there is a massive political backlash and that this kind of behavior is that of a losing of a movement. And not only losing movement culturally, which is somehow downward after a year ago being in a, like a. Generally at its Heights, literally. Right. And it was like a total cultural revolution. Fumbling the bag on that one has gotta be well studied in the history books. But that was my point is when I talked to that foreign official and they were defending. They said, you don't understand our politics. And I said, no, I do. I just think you're acting like a little bitch, basically. I was like, I think that you're very not. I said, you're very. You're not confident in who you are. And your lack of confidence is coming across to me and to the entire world as so fragile that you can't allow any criticism. Yeah, that's basically how I feel about these people. I don't need to agree with my athletes about anything. I think it's great. Every single one of them wins a gold medal. That is. Is that a nuanced view? Right. At the same time, I do recognize that there is a very annoying tendency of the modern left to where only patriotism is, when you are critical of it, is that everything must be couched in nuance. Is that. And while look blind, patriotism has plenty of its own problems. Again, just like if with All Lives Matter, everyone knows exactly what I'm talking about.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Yeah.

[Krystal Ball]

1619, Project DEI is a core basis of.

[Kyle Kulinski]

I don't even know that you like, like disagree with the sentiments they're expressing, do you?

[Nathaniel Raymond]

What?

[Kyle Kulinski]

Do you disagree with anything they say, though?

[Krystal Ball]

Well, if you were to ask me what makes me not proud to be an American, sure. The ICE stuff would definitely be part of it. I would talk to, let's say, much more of the structural degenerate parts of our society. Right. So I could give you a great. But I'm not proud to be an American.

[Kyle Kulinski]

I'm just saying, like, you don't even really disagree with what they're saying. I mean, and that is a. That is.

[Krystal Ball]

What do you mean?

[Kyle Kulinski]

I mean any of this. Do you disagree with any of the sentiments that they're expressing here? Again, they're pretty like mild, like the gay one.

[Krystal Ball]

Yeah, actually, I forgot to get to that one because the idea that this is some horrible time for gay people is literally bullshit. Okay, so everybody knows what she's trying to say, which is about trans people and in particular trans children. And no, I'm not going to cry tears because 9 year olds can't get puberty blockers. So let's be very clear about what that one is saying. So that was the only one, as you can tell, that's the only one that actually made me mad because it's Ridiculous. It's completely ridiculous that, well, gay people are being hunted in the streets.

[Kyle Kulinski]

No, but there's, I mean, they've definitely been made a target.

[Krystal Ball]

Both gay people have been made.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Yeah, no, absolutely. Both rhetorically and through legislation. There's certainly been a scapegoating of trans people in particular.

[Krystal Ball]

But I said gay people.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Yeah, I mean, you're moving the goalpost. There's plenty of an attempt to roll. You actually brought a trans woman. Whatever. There's.

[Krystal Ball]

Because that's what rollback all about.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Gay marriage. There's been.

[Krystal Ball]

No, that's ridiculous. No, it's not.

[Kyle Kulinski]

In any case, in any case, with the ICE commentary, I don't even think you disagree with their sentiment. But my bottom line here is for all the people who are like, I'm gonna root against them because I disagree with their political take. To me that feels un American that you have to agree with every political sentiment that is expressed with someone to root for Team usa.

[Krystal Ball]

Let's test the moral purity. Let's say that there are many liberal Chiefs fans who root against Harrison Butler, who is massively pro life, who stands with Trump every time that guy misses a field goal. Libs cheer across the field.

[Kyle Kulinski]

But that's different than Team usa.

[Krystal Ball]

No, I agree with you, but there.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Are choosing not to cheer for that team. Sure.

[Krystal Ball]

But there are Chiefs fans I have seen who are like, fuck Harrison Butler because of his political beliefs. Again, is there gonna be any real consistency on behalf of the. If we had a deeply conservative Olympian who was like, I love Trump and I support ice, everyone would be rooting against, against him. Let's not lie, all right? Like, let's be very honest about how everybody would also react. So I, I'm not going to grant.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Some like, special but I would not say how fantastic. I would not say that that person should be like, they shouldn't be allowed to compete and they should be stripped of their like Olympic status in the Obama era.

[Krystal Ball]

You might love Obama, you might be wrong. Now currently I would hope that maybe that that would, that that would hold up again, it's unfalsifiable. I don't really know, but it's one of those where when I look at this entire thing, I see weakness from Bad Bunny to the way that they have reacted to. By the way, that's the other problem. It's not like Hunter Hess was like, he didn't say anything all that provocative. He like you just said he was trying to talk frankly in a very like mealy mouthed way and trying to like give A bar. He was like, well, trying to be a little uncomfortable.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Yeah. Acknowledge if you're gonna have a full.

[Krystal Ball]

Blown meltdown over something like that, like, you look like a little bitch. And like, that's generally how. Look, I see deep weakness in the way that people have reacted to this. I also think that any purity test for athletes, like, yeah, I can sit here and criticize Eileen Goo, but, you know, I mean, what's so different if our lawmakers, like, if she can't say anything about Jimmy Lai and we, and you know, our athletes are going to say something and then lawmakers all the way up to the top or say they should be removed. I mean, what, you know, we don't have a lot of standards like you're to be sitting on. In fact, that's one of the, often one of the, one of the conservative critiques is you don't go on foreign soil to trash America and that America's held to a higher standard, which it obviously is. No one's asking Iranian Olympics how they feel about the protests. If they say something, they'll be killed. You know, if you ask somebody from, if you ask somebody from a lot of these authoritarian countries how they feel and they express a dissonant view. Remember North Korea and their whole soccer team situation. Like, they had a real problem if you get embarrassed on the world stage. So there are real examples where it's actually disastrous to speak out. If anything, it's kind of a privilege of the United States where the worst you're gonna get is a bad tweet from the government. They can't really do anything to you.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Yeah, well, I mean, they did like arrest people for writing op eds, but I don't think that these, I don't think these Olympians are in danger of. I don't think they're in danger.

[Krystal Ball]

Hunter Hess is not gonna be jailed, killed. He'll probably make a shitload of money off of sponsorships and he'll be fine. And most of the, you know, I mean, literally, we are a country which allows traders to go and represent a, compete for a foreign government, and then we still allow her back in and massively enrich her. Apparently everybody's like, fine with that. I think that's bullshit, by the way.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Here's the other thing is Trump is extremely critical of the US all the time.

[Krystal Ball]

I am too.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Extremely critical of the US all the time and on foreign soil and all of those things. And it's part of the reason why he was appealing to begin with because he was willing to say like, hey, things are not, you know, American carnage. Like, things are not going well here. So in any case, that's a free gun. There's one last piece to mention here, which is that the US made the decision to send some ICE agents to the Winter Olympics D5 to supposedly provide security. I don't know why you would choose ice agents. That's not really what they're meant to be doing. But there have been huge protests in Italy over the presence of these ice agents. The protests aren't just about that, but that's part of what is fueling that. So you know, the zone. I think, in this context, to your point, Sagar, political game being played here from the. From the Trump administration.

[Krystal Ball]

Italians. Worry about your own fucking country. Like, I'm sorry. Like, this annoys the crap out of it.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Yeah, but now this is in their country.

[Krystal Ball]

But the globalization of our politics is so annoying. My wife is abroad right now. The amount that these foreigners pay it, like, she literally has.

[Kyle Kulinski]

I totally disagree with that, Chris. These people pay attention to Texas. I know, but elections, Sagar, we have so much impact on the whole world. Like, of course. Of course people around the globe care about what happened.

[Krystal Ball]

I don't want to listen to these fucking. You guys are literally. Your GDP is nothing. You have. You make.

[Kyle Kulinski]

No, I mean, again, think of the way you have much bigger this country and threatening Greenland and whatever. Like, of course they have to pay attention to our politics. We give them no other choice.

[Krystal Ball]

But, you know, protesting around ICE like, Jesus Christ. Like, you people have so many bigger structural issues. If anything, the reason you're in that position is because you're so obsessed with us as the global superpower. Try and become one yourself.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Well within their rights to protest.

[Krystal Ball]

I didn't say Trump.

[Kyle Kulinski]

It's not their rights. Secret police coming to your country and, you know, unaccountable.

[Krystal Ball]

It's not a question of rights.

[Kyle Kulinski]

No impunity, you know, total impunity. Secret police coming to your country, which, by the way.

[Krystal Ball]

What does that police force resemble? Oh, right, European police forces, which, again, no due process, no rights, no First Amendment. Shut the fuck up.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Up.

[Krystal Ball]

If you live over there, you people literally, basically already live in the exact same system and they're trying to criticize us. So I'm sorry. Like, I'm not gonna.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Well, they maybe are criticizing and protesting that, too.

[Krystal Ball]

I don't want any. No, they're not. They live. They love it. They love their censorship regime. These are the biggest hypocrites on the planet. So that's the one thing. I will. I will stand for my countrymen who criticize us. I will not stand for these fucking Europeans.

[Kyle Kulinski]

When you send ice to a foreign country, the people in that country are allowed to protest.

[Krystal Ball]

Sure, they can protest, but you basically live the same occupied regime, except you have no due process, no system to actually do anything about that. Most of.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Are they murdering Italians in the streets who protest.

[Krystal Ball]

Listen, they once did. All right. Where do you think it all originated?

[Kyle Kulinski]

Yeah, but in the modern, in the modern era, do we have the level of.

[Krystal Ball]

Do they really have a huge leg.

[Kyle Kulinski]

To stand on from the Italian police as we do from Islam?

[Krystal Ball]

Do you really think they have a moral leg to stand on? In terms of. We're talking about comparing our.

[Kyle Kulinski]

We're talking full history.

[Krystal Ball]

Yeah, we should.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Okay. They have to be who invented imperialism. They have to constantly atone for the sins of their grandfathers.

[Krystal Ball]

Okay.

[Kyle Kulinski]

All right. Then let's talk about slavery.

[Krystal Ball]

Fine. I've told you I've been toying with the idea of.

[Kyle Kulinski]

You're 16, 19 pilled now.

[Krystal Ball]

It's not that I've been toying with the idea of collective guilt in an interesting way which I'm sure people will.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Call Hannah Jones on for a conversation with you.

[Krystal Ball]

People will.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Let's get Ibram x Kendi on to talk with you about. I like to see that overlap.

[Krystal Ball]

I see over differently and then that's. That's the whole point. But that's. That's a different conversation.

[Sagar Enjeti]

Support for the show comes from Public, the investing platform for those who take it seriously. On Public, you can build a multi asset portfolio of stocks, bonds, options, crypto and now generated assets which allow you to turn any idea into an investable index. With AI it all starts with your prompt. From renewable energy companies with high free cash flow to semiconductor suppliers growing revenue over 20% year over year year. You can literally type any prompt and put the AI to work. It screens thousands of stocks, builds a one of a kind index and lets you back test it against the S&P 500. Then you can invest in a few clicks. Generated assets are like ETFs with infinite possibilities. Completely customizable and based on your thesis, not someone else's. Go to public.com podcast and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio. That's public.com podcast paid for by Public Investing Brokerage Services by Open to the Public Investing Inc. Member FINRA and SR Advisory Services by Public Advisors llc. SEC Registered Advisor. Generated Assets is an interactive analysis tool. Output is for informational purposes only. And is not an investment recommendation or advice. Complete Disclosures available at public.comDisclosures Military life isn't predictable, but earning your Master's degree can be. With American Military University's 40 flexible online master's programs, you can stay mission ready while you get market ready. Learn anywhere, anytime with an education built to keep pace, steady, relax, reliable and always accessible. Plus, military service members, veterans and their families can save up to 45% on master's tuition with AMU's special rates and grants. Learn more at AMU APUS. Edu steady through every mission.

[Kyle Kulinski]

This message comes from Greenlight. Ready to start talking to your kids about financial literacy? Meet Greenlight, the debit card and money app that teaches kids and teens how to earn, save, spend wisely and invest with your guardrails and plan place. With green light. You can send money to kids quickly, set up chores, automate allowance, and keep an eye on what your kids are spending with real time notifications. Join millions of parents and kids building healthy financial habits together on Greenlight. Get started risk [e-mail] iheart let's find some common ground on hatred of our AI overlords here. Horrifying story from Reuters and kudos to them for doing the digging into this. So they say as AI enters the operating room, reports arise of botched surgeries and misidentified body parts. So the background here is that obviously you have AI now is the new hot way to grow your company, including medical device companies. So you have companies trying to push these devices into the market. You have an FDA that has been degraded drastically by dogecoin and patients now basically being used as guinea pigs. So let me give you some of the specifics here from this article. Let's put this first piece up on the screen. They found that at least 10 people were injured between late 2021 and November 2025, according to reports. Most allegedly involved errors in which the True dye navigation system misinformed surgeons about the location of their instruments while they were using them inside patients heads during operations. Obviously, the company denies any wrongdoing. Put the next one up on the screen here. They say cerebrospinal fluid reportedly leaked from one patient's nose. In another reported case, a surgeon mistakenly punctured the base of a patient's skull. In two other cases, patients each allegedly suffered strokes after a major artery was accidentally injured. With the next one up on the screen, the FDA has received reports involving dozens of other AI enhanced devices including heart monitor said to have look overlooked abnormal heartbeats and an ultrasound device that allegedly misidentified fetal body parts. So in one of the examples that they identified here, first of all, the doctor had a consulting contract with the company that makes this device. So you inherently have questions about a conflict of interest in the doctor choosing to use this technology. To start with, what they, what they talk about here is the patient was being treated for chronic sinusitis. The procedure involves, it's a relatively non invasive procedure, should be sort of cut and dry, relatively straightforward. They inflate a balloon inside your sinus cavity to create additional space. But the allegation is that this technology, because it did not properly inform the surgeon where their medical instruments were, that they accidentally nicked an artery that goes to the brain. This caused a stroke and there were a couple strokes that they identified because that they're attributing to this technology. Again, the company denies that it is ultimately their fault. But you know, to me, Sagra, the bigger story is we have put E5 up on the screen. We had this doge assault on the fda. Some of the, I remember us talking about this at the time. About 15 of the 40 AI scientists in the special unit that had been spun up in the FDA to evaluate exactly these types of devices were laid off or opted to go. Another unit that crafted policy on devices using AI, the Digital Health center of Excellence, lost about a third of its staff, around 30. So they are overwhelmed. And what the device makers try to do in order to avoid like a lengthy evaluation process is they'll say, oh, this is just like this other device that's already on the market. We've just updated it. But the update may be completely changing the way the device works, works and implement an AI, whereas the device previously did not have that. And so a lot of these devices are sort of getting approved with relatively minimal scrutiny. And all of this is being done at an FDA that's completely overwhelmed.

[Krystal Ball]

Yeah, it's not only regulatory, it is really just like the runaway nature of the way that these people are rolling stuff out. And you know, you pointed out these concrete ones, but just at a very basic level. Remember the promise here was that they were gonna cure cancer. That was the promise. And by the way, if anyone's watching the pit, there's a good, good, there's a good plot line currently of a doctor who's pushing generative AI, which immediately runs into problems in the actual er. I thought it was a good like artistic representation of some of the way that this is currently already happening in medicine. Let's put E6 up here on the screen. I love this piece, which was this. This author let Chachi BT analyze a decade of Apple Watch data, then called his doctor. He said, chatgpt says it can now answer personal questions about your health and fitness trackers. The new chapter help says it can help you understand patterns over time, not just moments of illness. So with my 10 years of Apple Watch data, I uploaded it and asked the grade, asked the bot to grade my cardiac health. It gave me an F. I freaked out and went for a run. I sent the report to my actual doctor. Am I an F? My doctor said no. In fact, I'm at such low risk for a heart attack, my insurance probably would not even pay for an extra cardiovascular fitness test. Test to prove that the artificial intelligence is wrong. I then showed the results to a renowned cardiologist and he said, quote, it's baseless. This is not ready for any medical advice, period. So there you go. In terms of what our initial diagnoses and all of that are.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Well, and he would keep asking it. He'd go back and be like, okay, evaluate it now. And they'd be like, you get a B. Evaluate it now, you get a D. Evaluate it now. You get an F. Like it was same data asking the exact same question. Getting everything from a B to an F, I believe was the range.

[Krystal Ball]

I don't know, I just think we need stuff to be banned. Like, I really have come around to a much more Luddite view where any image generation ban it. What social benefit could come from that? Whenever it comes to medicine, you gotta prove it before you can use it. Like, that's one of those where I'm gonna treat it like a drug trial. Which I know that everybody, you know, there's pharma and all this criticizes it. And fine, I agree. If anything, it's probably too corrupt and not more, you know, available for scrutiny. But I think it's gotta be drug trial related where unless you can, until you can prove with explicit patient consent and everything, that over a long period that you've worked out all the kinks that you've, you know, made and redone developments and triple, quadruple tested it, it should not be able to be used in the format that we're like currently looking at. Because. Because you're playing with people's lives here. And I'm somewhat sympathetic. Like, there's a ton of human error too. I recently saw this thing. There's a new study that when cardiologist conferences are happening and you go into the hospital that you are more likely to live. And the reason why is that the cardiologists are the people who are approaching you when the senior cardiologist is out of town is because they do things kind of the old way and that the newer doctors will do something. It's either in the new way or they won't apply, like the stuff that's more routine. And I was like, oh, wow. Well, that's a real argument for disruption and all of that in medical education. And that definitely is something that's like a product of human error. But I don't think that this is the answer.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Right.

[Krystal Ball]

You need a more rigorous culture or something like that.

[Kyle Kulinski]

I miss when I was just enthusiastic about new technological development. Like, I miss that. And the reason that I don't have that now is not because I don't think that the AI development has promise. I do think it's has potential and promise to improve people's lives. It's because we don't have a political system that is going to do anything other than, like, you know, use it to further immiserate us, extract profits, and, you know, funnel power and wealth to the top. So for me, it's there. Obviously, there's serious technological issues and questions, et cetera, that we talk about on this show. But the bigger problem for me is a political problem. It's an ownership problem as well. Because if you have this technology, which is. Which is if it's nearly as powerful as they're projecting in the hands of a few, that is inherently an issue. But to that point of the political problem, put the E7B up on the screen. I mean, this is just like Lotus Health. This company has just raised $35 million for an AI doctor that will see patients for free. And the way they're pitching this is basically like, look, you can get your, enter your information, our AI doctor will diagnose you, it can write prescriptions, it's et cetera. And at the very end, we're gonna have a real doctor come in and just make sure that it's okay. So it's not completely free of doctors. And then you ask, okay, well, what's the profit model? And of course, what they're looking at right now, they're saying, oh, we're not gonna worry about that. But what they're looking at is paid sponsorships. So you're gonna be. I mean, we already have this system where pharmaceutical big pharma can average, oh, ask your doctor, blah, blah, blah, blah. Now we're talking about integrating that directly into the medical care that you're receiving from an AI doctor. And no one would want this if we had a free health care like the rest of the developed world. This would not be a money change. It would not be appealing, et cetera. But because we have this screwed up political system, screwed up healthcare system, you know, I can, I can absolutely see that. I understand why they're able to raise $35 million where I can see why they this could get traction. Because if you have no other alternative, then yeah, you're going to go to the AI doctor and watch the pharma ads and you know, hope that cross your fingers and hope it works out okay.

[Krystal Ball]

Yeah, I think very, very true. All right, thank you guys so much for watching. We appreciate it. Let's get to our guest who's going to talk about Sudan.

[Sagar Enjeti]

Support for the show comes from Public, the investing platform for those who take it seriously. On Public, you can build a multi asset portfolio of stocks, bonds, options, crypto and now generated assets which allow you to turn any idea into an investable index. With AI, it all starts with your prompt. From renewable energy companies with high free cash flow to semiconductor suppliers growing revenue over 20% year over year, you can literally type any prompt and put the AI to work. It screens thousands of stocks, builds a one of a kind index and lets you back test it against the S&P 500. Then you can invest in a few clicks. Generated assets are like ETFs with infinite possibilities, completely customizable and based on your thesis, not someone else's. Go to public.com podcast and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio. That's public.com podcast paid for by Public Investing Brokerage Services by Open to the Public Investing Inc. Member FINRA and SIPC Advisory Services by Public Advisors llc SEC Registered Advisor Generated Assets is an interactive analysis tool. Output is for informational purposes only and is not an investment recommendation or advice. Complete Disclosures available at public.com disclosure Military life isn't predictable, but earning your Master's degree can be. With American Military University's 40 flexible online master's programs, you can stay mission ready while you get market ready. Learn anywhere, anytime with an education built to keep pace steady, reliable and always accessible. Plus, military service members, veterans and their families can save up to 45% on master's tuition with AMU's special rates and grants. Learn more learn more at Amu Apus Edu steady through every mission, homes.com knows.

[Kyle Kulinski]

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[Krystal Ball]

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[Kyle Kulinski]

Homes.com, we've done your homework. So, as you know, on the show, we've been covering the war in Sudan, which is both a civil war spilling into a regional war. It is a proxy war and is also creating the worst humanitarian crisis on the entire planet. Our next guest has been focused on that aspect in particular. Nathaniel Raymond is the executive director of the Humanitarian Research Lab at Yale School of Public Health, and he joins us now. Welcome, sir. Great to have you.

[Krystal Ball]

You.

[Nathaniel Raymond]

It's good to be here. Thank you.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Yeah, of course. So you're out with this new report. Let's put F2 up on the screen here, guys, about the extensive use of what are called suicide drones. You said you've identified 51 suicide drones loitering munitions at a new launch point. Could you break down the research that you have discovered here and why this is significant to the current state of the war in Sudan?

[Nathaniel Raymond]

So the war in Sudan is basically a fight between the Sudan armed forces, the army of Sudan, and a paramilitary group called the Rapid Support Forces, which is basically an ethnic militia from the western part of the country in Darfur and the United Arab Emirates, According to US Intelligence, as reported by the Wall Street Journal, has been arming the Rapid Support Forces, especially with these, what's called suicide drones or loitering munitions, which are Shahid style delta wing, meaning that they look like a V, and you fire them from a launcher like a slingshot, and they can go between 12 to 1700 kilometers and they blow up on target. And right now, the Rapid Support Forces have been using them to harass civilians, including a World Food Program convoy, a market and hospitals just in recent days.

[Krystal Ball]

So where does the United States fit into all this? This?

[Nathaniel Raymond]

Well, that's a heck of a question. The United States has been negotiating as part of what's called the Quad, a supposed humanitarian truce. But the fact of the matter is that neither side has fully agreed to the humanitarian truce. And at this point, there's been a stunning reversal of fortune in the past three weeks where Sudan armed forces really, for the first time since they retook the capital, has broken out of being stuck in what we call a turtle, a siege posture in several cities and they're now attacking the Rapid Support Forces, meaning that they have no reason to agree to a deal right now when they are beginning to take the advantage.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Let's go ahead and put F1 up on the screen. This is in reference to that attack on the World Food Program aid convoy that you were discussing. So we have a statement here from the US Embassy in Khartoum saying the US Condemns the latest drone attack that targeted a convoy of the World Food Program in North Cordofan which was transporting food supplies to people suffering from famine and resulted in the killing of one person and the injury of many others. This comes in the wake of an attack that occurred earlier this week in Blue Nile State, resulted in the injury of one World Food Program employee. The destruction of food intended for those in need and the killing of humanitarian workers is utterly reprehensible. The Trump administration will never tolerate this destruction of lives or of U.S. funded aid. We demand accountability and we extend our deepest condolences to all those affected by these unjustified incidents and this horrific war. One thing I note in the statement, and you tell me if I'm reading too much into this, but they don't actually name the RSF here as being the perpetrator of this, you know, of this war crime. And it seems like, you know, the language is intentionally vague. Can you talk about why the US Is sensitive to naming the party to blame here in this incident?

[Nathaniel Raymond]

I put a tweet out as soon as I saw that statement, which was copied from Boulos, the Special Advisor for Africa from the Trump administration. And I said, you wouldn't know it from this tweet that this attack was committed by the Rapid Support Forces. And so we have to put this in context for your audience. In the end of October, after we were monitoring the city of Al Fasher, which was under siege for two and a half years, we believe between 60,000 to 100,000 civilians were massacred inside, basically a kill box, an earthen wall, by the Rapid Support Forces in an act of genocide, probably the last major killing of the Darfur genocide. And so what you have to understand here is the Rapid Support Forces aren't just bad guys with guns. They are genocide heirs who have been killing civilians en masse and civilians from the Zagawa, the Four, and the Masali, which are the indigenous black African Muslim tribes of the West. And so the fact of the matter is that the United States has made a decision decision, as has the United Kingdom and Europe, that they've prioritized the diplomatic, economic and security relationship between the west with the UAE over the lives of these people. If the west wanted to, they could stop this war in about 10 seconds. And that's turning off the spigot of advanced weapons to the Rapid support forces from their sponsor, which is the uae, which is a major defense partner of the United States and of the United kingdom.

[Krystal Ball]

Let's put F2 up there on the screen. This was flagged for us where a new report that you guys put out identifies some 51 suicide drones loitering munitions at a new launch point. Can you just explain the significance of some of these drones and the technology that enables some of this massacre?

[Nathaniel Raymond]

So to launch a weapon like this, you need to have four things. One, you need the weapon itself, which we can observe the actual munition, which is likely consistent with a Sunflower, which is a type of drone manufacturer by a Chinese company called Norinco. And there's several similar types and they're known as Shaheed style or Delta Wing. You need the launcher, the physical slingshot shot. You need to have a ground control station in satellite uplink and you also need to have anti aircraft surface to air missiles to protect that installation. We know that they have all of the above. And just to put it in perspective, the Rapid support forces when they were The Janjaweed about 20 plus years ago had camels, rusty pickup trucks, old Enfield rifles and really junky AK47s. Now they have an air force and they have a air force that was provided to them, we know from Defense Intelligence Agency and the Intelligence Research Bureau of State Department by the uae, according to the Wall Street Journal. And in that Wall Street Journal article it confirms US intelligence, confirms the finding of our lab that these RSF forces also have advanced Chinese fixed wing drones called Ch95s which are not present in that image. And so basically in the space of 18 months, they've gone from being in the back of pickup trucks to being able to fire munitions anywhere in Sudan within two to three hours.

[Kyle Kulinski]

There was a report from Reuters this morning that I just saw that I wanted to get your reaction to. They confirmed what has been sort of rumored and theoried in various intel circles, that Ethiopia is hosting a secret camp to train thousands of fighters for the RSF paramilitary group in neighboring Sudan. Reuters reporting has found the latest sign that one of the world's deadliest conflicts is sucking in regional powers from Africa and the Middle East. Can you help us understand the significance of Ethiopia getting directly involved here? Why there are so many fears of this war spiraling into a regional conflict. And what these regional proxy powers, why they have such an interest in what happens in Sudan?

[Nathaniel Raymond]

Well, there's a lot of questions.

[Kyle Kulinski]

I threw a lot at you.

[Nathaniel Raymond]

Yeah. So I'll do my best here. Yesterday, I reviewed imagery related to that alleged RSF base in Benishingle on the Ethiopian side of the border. And I've been in that area before near Asaso. So I know that that terrain. Well, what you have to understand is that it's thick jungle with a lot of hills. So things don't just pop up there. You have to really want to build something there. And we see, not just in the sites that Reuters identified, but we can give you a little bit of new news this morning, is that we think there's additional sites beyond what Reuters identified, and we're working to verify that.

[Krystal Ball]

That.

[Nathaniel Raymond]

That really start to appear mid to late October to early November in that area, and they appear near Ethiopian National Defense Force bases in that area. So the big deal about this is a. It shows likely that Abe, the Prime Minister of Ethiopia, is basically siding with rsf. Additionally, what it shows is that the rsf, as we've seen in recent days, has been trying to build basically an eastern front to try to pull the Sudan armed forces off from attacking RSF bases in Darfur and trying to reclaim cities in the west. So they're trying to get SAF to attack towards the east so they can bog them down. Why is this happening? Well, as you said, you know, when people say Sudan is a civil war, I balk at that. It is a fight of regional proxies where the main victim in the battlefield are the lives and bodies of. Of Sudanese civilians. And like the movie Die Hard, what you think is a terrorist action actually is a bank robbery. And so the people who are being robbed of their resources are the Sudanese people. And so really, Ethiopia Watch what's happening now with Eritrea. Eritrea, who was sided with saf, is now threatening action in the north and Tigray. And so this is all part of a regional neighborhood battle by about six to eight countries.

[Krystal Ball]

Wow.

[Kyle Kulinski]

Well, Nathaniel, I thank you so much for joining us this morning. I really thank you for your work on this and keeping the focus on, as you said, and as I said, the worst humanitarian crisis unfolding on the planet right now. Could you let people know where they can follow the reports that you're putting out and the information that you're sharing? Sharing?

[Nathaniel Raymond]

Yeah. Just type Yale, HRL and Sudan into Google and reports and it will be the first thing that pops up.

[Kyle Kulinski]

All right. Thank you so much. We're really grateful for your time.

[Sagar Enjeti]

Military life isn't predictable, but earning your Master's degree can be. With American Military University's 40+ flexible arm online Master's programs, you can stay mission ready while you get market ready. Learn anywhere, anytime with an education built to keep pace steady, reliable and always accessible. Plus, military service members, veterans and their families can save up to 45% on master's tuition with AMU's special rates and grants. Learn more at AMU Apus Edu Steady through every mission.

[Krystal Ball]

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[Sagar Enjeti]

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[Krystal Ball]

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[Sagar Enjeti]

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[Nathaniel Raymond]

Work.

[Krystal Ball]

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[Sagar Enjeti]

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