Breaking Points with Krystal and Saagar – Episode 2/3/25: Trump Smacks Canada & Mexico With Tariffs, Elon Musk DOGE Gov Takeover

Release Date: February 3, 2025 | Host/Creators: Krystal Ball and Saagar Enjeti | Produced by iHeartPodcasts

Introduction

In this riveting episode of Breaking Points with Krystal and Saagar, hosts Krystal Ball and Saagar Enjeti delve deep into two monumental events shaking the political and economic landscape of the United States: former President Donald Trump's imposition of hefty tariffs on Canada and Mexico, and the unprecedented takeover of federal government systems by Elon Musk and his allies, associated with the DOGE Gov movement. Joined by special guest Jeff Stein from The Washington Post, the episode unpacks the implications of these developments, offering insightful analysis and heated debates.

Trump's Tariff Assault on Canada and Mexico

Overview of Tariffs

At the outset ([02:12]), Krystal announces that President Trump has officially initiated a trade war by imposing 25% tariffs on both Canada and Mexico, similar to previous tariffs on China. These measures are a direct response to existing trade deficits and are expected to escalate, with additional tariffs slated for implementation on February 23 ([04:15]). The tariffs cover a broad spectrum of goods, with exceptions like Canadian oil being taxed at a lower rate (10%).

Impact on the Economy and Consumers

Krystal emphasizes the widespread impact, noting that Canada, Mexico, and China are the three largest trading partners of the U.S., contributing to approximately 40% of U.S. imports. The tariffs are anticipated to raise the price of cars by about $3,000 and significantly increase costs for produce and building materials, particularly affecting regions like the Midwest that heavily rely on imports from these countries ([07:52]).

Krystal's Critique

Krystal challenges Trump's rationale, questioning how tariffs, which typically lead to increased consumer prices, align with his campaign promise to reduce costs and curb inflation. She argues that without a comprehensive industrial policy to accompany the tariffs, the measures will likely fail to achieve their intended goals and may instead harm the American economy ([05:15] – [16:46]).

Notable Quote:

Krystal Ball [05:43]: "You promised Americans to try to reduce costs... How would you expect to have prices come down?"

George M. Johnson's Defense

Contrasting Krystal's perspective, George M. Johnson defends the tariffs, citing the International Economic Emergency Powers Act (IEEPA) as a legal basis for President Trump's actions. He argues that the tariffs are a strategic move to renegotiate trade agreements like the USMCA more swiftly than the standard three-year renegotiation window ([11:53] – [12:51]).

Notable Quote:

George M. Johnson [11:53]: "We're not going to renegotiate that until 2026. If we stick with the current policy... we can accelerate renegotiation."

Jeff Stein’s Analysis

Guest Jeff Stein from The Washington Post provides a nuanced breakdown, affirming the seriousness of Trump's tariff threat and debunking claims that the tariffs are merely a negotiating tactic. He highlights the substantial economic implications, including potential retaliatory tariffs from Canada, Mexico, and China, and discusses the legal robustness of Trump's authority under IEEPA, suggesting that court challenges may not succeed ([20:42] – [31:13]).

Notable Quote:

Jeff Stein [23:14]: "Trump's economic policy is increasingly untenable."

Elon Musk's DOGE Gov Takeover: A Constitutional Crisis

Overview of the Takeover

The episode takes a dramatic turn as Krystal and George discuss the alarming developments regarding Elon Musk's infiltration and control over critical federal government systems associated with the Treasury Department. Musk's allies have gained access to systems responsible for disbursing trillions in federal payments, including Social Security and Medicare, without any electoral mandate or Senate confirmation ([31:20] – [33:03]).

Jeff Stein’s Reporting

Jeff Stein elaborates on the gravity of the situation, detailing how Musk's associates coerced senior Treasury officials to grant them access to sensitive payment systems. This control potentially allows Musk to unilaterally decide which federal payments are disbursed, effectively bypassing Congress and undermining the constitutional separation of powers ([31:46] – [33:49]).

Notable Quote:

Jeff Stein [31:46]: "This is a tool of US soft power... it's not up to Elon Musk or Donald Trump to just say, we're done with this."

Constitutional Implications

Krystal vehemently argues that Musk's actions represent a blatant breach of constitutional norms, equating it to a hostile takeover of the government. She underscores the unprecedented nature of an unelected billionaire exerting such control over federal systems, highlighting the lack of institutional pushback and the erosion of democratic safeguards ([33:03] – [62:39]).

Notable Quote:

Krystal Ball [56:25]: "No one voted for Elon Musk. It is brazenly unconstitutional."

George M. Johnson’s Perspective

George acknowledges the constitutional breach but offers a counterpoint, questioning the depth of public outrage and suggesting that a significant portion of the population may be indifferent or even supportive due to deep-seated distrust in governmental institutions. He predicts that unless critical federal programs like Social Security or Medicare are directly impacted, public outcry may remain subdued ([66:25] – [73:37]).

Notable Quote:

George M. Johnson [66:25]: "Absolutely, yes, I do [agree that it's a problem]. But most people are not principled. Most people don't care at all."

Public Reaction and Institutional Trust

The discussion delves into the erosion of institutional trust, with both hosts expressing concern over how such unilateral actions by private individuals can undermine the foundations of democracy. They explore the societal shift towards consumerism and the diminishing importance of democratic processes in everyday life, highlighting how this shift contributes to the populace's apathy towards governmental overreach ([74:00] – [80:00]).

Notable Quote:

Krystal Ball [65:58]: "People do believe that the federal government should be investing in the American people and helping to support people in their time of need."

Conclusion on the Takeover

Krystal and George culminate their discussion by emphasizing the severity of Musk's actions, shading them as beyond a constitutional crisis and bordering on authoritarianism. They stress the irreversible nature of such a takeover, questioning the future of democratic governance and the capability of elected officials to reassert control over the federal systems now under Musk's influence ([82:24] – [86:00]).

Notable Quote:

Krystal Ball [65:59]: "Having somebody who is unelected, billionaire... take control... is brazenly unconstitutional."

Final Thoughts and Future Implications

As the episode wraps up, both hosts reflect on the intertwined nature of tariffs and Musk’s government takeover, pondering the long-term effects on U.S. economic policies and democratic institutions. They warn listeners of the potential for further destabilization and call for increased awareness and advocacy to safeguard democratic processes against such unprecedented overreaches by private entities.

Notable Quote:

Krystal Ball [66:33]: "No one voted for Elon Musk. That is the issue that is at hand."

Key Takeaways

1. Economic Turmoil Through Tariffs: Trump's imposition of 25% tariffs on Canada and Mexico is causing significant concern regarding increased consumer prices and potential disruptions in key industries like automotive manufacturing and oil imports.

2. Debate Over Tariffs' Efficacy: Krystal Ball criticizes the tariffs for contradicting promises to reduce costs, while George M. Johnson defends them as strategic moves to renegotiate trade agreements and bolster domestic manufacturing.

3. Constitutional Crisis via DOGE Gov: Elon Musk's unauthorized control over federal payment systems marks an alarming breach of constitutional norms, raising fears of a power grab by an unelected individual with substantial economic influence.

4. Erosion of Institutional Trust: The episode highlights a growing distrust in governmental institutions, exacerbated by unilateral actions from powerful private figures and a consumerist society indifferent to democratic processes.

5. Future of Democracy Under Threat: The hosts express deep concern over the future implications of these events, calling for vigilant protection of democratic institutions and processes to prevent further overreach and ensure the government's accountability to its citizens.

Notable Quotes with Timestamps

• Krystal Ball [05:43]: "You promised Americans to try to reduce costs... How would you expect to have prices come down?"

• George M. Johnson [11:53]: "We're not going to renegotiate that until 2026. If we stick with the current policy... we can accelerate renegotiation."

• Jeff Stein [23:14]: "Trump's economic policy is increasingly untenable."

• Jeff Stein [31:46]: "This is a tool of US soft power... it's not up to Elon Musk or Donald Trump to just say, we're done with this."

• Krystal Ball [56:25]: "No one voted for Elon Musk. It is brazenly unconstitutional."

• George M. Johnson [66:25]: "Absolutely, yes, I do [agree that it's a problem]. But most people are not principled. Most people don't care at all."

• Krystal Ball [65:59]: "Having somebody who is unelected, billionaire... take control... is brazenly unconstitutional."

Conclusion

Episode 2/3/25 of Breaking Points with Krystal and Saagar delivers a compelling and urgent analysis of two critical issues: the resurgence of protectionist trade policies under Trump and the alarming emergence of Elon Musk's influence over federal governmental functions. Through insightful discussions and expert guest commentary, the hosts illuminate the profound implications these events hold for the U.S. economy and the very fabric of its democratic institutions. Listeners are left with a pressing need to stay informed and engaged in safeguarding the nation's democratic processes against unprecedented private overreach.