← Breaking Points with Krystal and Saagar
Breaking Points with Krystal and Saagar
5/29/26: Bessent Threatens Kinetic Action, Jill Biden Gaslights, Spencer Pratt Surges, Dr. Adam Hamawy
01:28:42
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- [00:00]
Griffin
This is an Iheart podcast. Guaranteed human.
- [00:04]
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- [00:38]
Spencer Pratt
All?
- [00:38]
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- [01:59]
Ryan Grim
Independent media just played a truly massive role in this election and we are so excited about what that means for the future of the show.
- [02:06]
Emily Jaczynski
This is the only place where you
- [02:07]
Griffin
can find honest perspectives from the left
- [02:09]
Emily Jaczynski
and the right that simply does not exist anywhere else.
- [02:12]
Ryan Grim
So if that is something that's important to you, Please go to BreakingPoints.com, become a member today and you'll get access to our full shows unedited ad, free and all put together for you every morning in your inbox.
- [02:23]
Emily Jaczynski
We need your help to build the
- [02:24]
Griffin
future of independent news media and we hope to see you@breakingpoints.com hello everybody.
- [02:29]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
It is Friday, May 29, for another breaking Points Friday show. Griffin here, of course, joined by Emily Jaczynski, I totally slaughtered your last name. I never do that.
- [02:39]
Emily Jaczynski
It's fine. It's anti Russian bias, but.
- [02:42]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
It is. And Ryan Grum, I'll get you both wrong today. Big show. I just wanted to say at the top, thank you all memberships for your patience. We are working on getting every one of the last stragglers into Supercast. If you are having trouble connecting to Spotify, logging into your membership supportupercast.com we are working extensively with the customer service team over at Supercast to get you all in. And by next week we should be all done and dusted. We thank you for your patience and we're excited to release some new exciting stuff that we've been working on behind the scenes and in the coming weeks. But with that, we've got a big show. We've got some Iran updates with Scott Besant coming out to make some new clarifications on the deal. We have Jill Biden coming out to talk about that infamous debate, finally beat Medicare and so on. And we have a much requested topic here at Breaking Points, One, Spencer Pratt running for Los Angeles mayor. We are going to break down the Latest as the June 2 primary for Los Angeles mayor is right on the horizon. Then we are joined by Ryan. Our guest this week is who Adam
- [04:01]
Ryan Grim
Hamaway, who has been on the show before. People may remember him from when he was serving a volunteer tour in Gaza as a, as a surgeon there. He's now he's, he's also kind of famous for being the combat surgeon in Iraq who saved Tammy Duckworth's life. She actually credits him also for he had, he had just learned this new technique, some vascular technique that allowed him, allowed her not to be a triple amputee. He is the leading candidate in a New Jersey congressional race now. And Jewish insider is running a campaign to, to call him al Qaeda. And they're teaming up with none other than Josh Gottheimer so we can talk to him about that as the as the race goes into its final few days.
- [04:49]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
All right, exciting, jam packed show. But why don't we get to the topic that continues to be the main topic of all of our lives, the Iran war. Scott Besant coming out to give some clarifications on the tolling system here. I'll read it for everyone. Scott Bessant says the United States government will not tolerate any effort to impose a tolling holding system in the Strait of Hormuz. Oman in particular, should know that the US treasury will aggressively target any actors involved directly or indirectly in facilitating tolls for the strait, and any willing partners will be penalized. All nations should reject outright any efforts by Iran to disrupt the free flow of commerce. Tehran's days of terrorizing the regime and the world are over. Ryan, what is your reaction?
- [05:36]
Ryan Grim
The funny thing, of course, is that Trump himself suggested that he would partner with Iran in overseeing a tolling system. So Trump is obviously not opposed to tolls in principle. Oman also recently reached a bunch of new kind of agreements with commercial agreements when it. With Iran, which was seen by a lot of people as Oman and other countries kind of preparing for a post, kind of, kind of post US Hegemonic role in the region. The, you know, I think we can expect to have more clarity on whether or not there is an agreement when the markets close tonight. So I think, I think Iran in particular is quite nervous. They have said very publicly that they are. They do not trust President Trump. They particularly don't trust his word during the hours that the markets are open. They've said that. They've said that repeatedly. And so, you know, Golubov has said today. Let me see if I can find his, his remarks. But effectively he was saying, you know, we'll believe it when we see it. Iran is, you know, prepared to lock in the gains that they made in the war through the negotiating table. But we are, but we continue to be prepared for the resumption of war. But he said we will not shoot first. Like, as long as the US doesn't attack us, we're not attacking them. Iran insists on getting economic relief as a result. You know, in, in this deal, Trump is trying to figure out how he can release Iranian funds. And again, they're Iranian funds that we have frozen. How he can release those without it being totally humiliating. So they're trying to find circuitous roots that the Iranian money can take that eventually gets to Iran. But by the time it gets there, Trump can say, I had nothing to do with this money getting there.
- [07:37]
Emily Jaczynski
You can't fool Mark Levin.
- [07:39]
Ryan Grim
Yeah. Can't fool Mark Levin.
- [07:41]
Griffin
No.
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Ryan Grim
And so allowing, quote, unquote, allowing some tolling also gives Iran some of the economic, you know, relief that they want out of this, these negotiations. I put allowing in quotes because how are we not going to allow it? Like, what are we going. What is the US Going to do to stop it? Like, Besson can put out a tweet, but if Iran reaches an agreement with a ship and the ship sends Iran money and then goes through the strait, we have shown that we don't have a military answer to that. Are we then going to stop that ship and double fine them or something? I suppose we could do that. But like, that kind of defeats the purpose of opening the strait. Which is what, which is what Trump really needs. You know, fuel inventories across the world are approaching, you know, the bottom of the barrel. The strategic reserves have been largely been emptied. We are approaching genuine shortage, gas line and crisis territory. So Trump really doesn't have the room to be like, hey, did you charge that guy a toll or not? It's like in the, for the first time since like World War II, it's like it's not up to the United States. We can have an opinion. That's all it is.
- [08:56]
Emily Jaczynski
Well, I mean, it's up to us if we want to escalate dramatically. Right.
- [08:59]
Ryan Grim
We can do that.
- [09:01]
Emily Jaczynski
Right.
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Ryan Grim
But we clearly have decided that. We have clearly decided that that's not in our interests because that doesn't stop them from like, more war doesn't open the strait. More work closes the strait. The fucking straight, you crazy bastards.
- [09:19]
Emily Jaczynski
So Scott Bessant, well, Caroline Levitz on maternity leave. It started with obviously Marco Rubio doing a briefing, then J.D. vance did a briefing, the Vice President, United States. And now we had Scott Bessant, Treasury Secretary, doing a briefing yesterday. And Griffin, he was peppered with all kinds of questions about what the heck is actually happening with this deal and Oman now being at the center of the Strait of Hormuzzi conversation. We have a little bit here of Besant getting pressed on it. Let's take a listen.
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Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
Yesterday also at the cabinet meeting, President
- [09:48]
Ryan Grim
Trump said Oman will behave just like everybody else for we will have to blow them up. Are you guys back there in the
- [09:56]
Scott Bessant
West Wing making plans for a new war with Oman Again? I think the president wanted to punctuate freedom of navigation in the street. I had a call with the Omani ambassador this morning and he assured me that there were no police plans for tolling the strait. As he said, our countries have had 200 years of good relations. He wants to have another 200 more. And I told him that this was a non starter and he did not want to risk either the Omani individuals or Omani financial institutions getting sanctions.
- [10:32]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
Now, question for both of you. There's a lot of talk about removing Iran's nuclear deal dust and that being the top priority. But it almost seems to me like control of the straight is an even bigger card for Iran that they wouldn't want to give up.
- [10:48]
Ryan Grim
Yeah, I think so. I, I think there's been. You know, they've spent decades with their kind of nuclear program being at the center of their kind of national identity. And. And the middle of these negotiations like this was always. They always saw this as their ticket, something that they would trade away to get the kind of Iranian revolution kind of recognized as a. As a part of the kind of world order. Like, they just. They wanted to be treated like any other country. And they thought. And some people. Some people within Iran thought, build this program and then we'll trade it away in order to get recognized. But you're right that what. What. What the US has allowed to be to happen is something that they couldn't really have done without a US Attack, because if they just all of a sudden belligerently and offensively took military control of the Strait of Hormuz, like, the world would lose its mind, and you'd have an actual, like, coalition of the willing that would include, like, China, Russia. Like, everybody would be like, no, no, no, no, no, you're not doing this. And so it was only them getting attacked. It kind of enabled them to make that move. And. But now, now that they have that bird in hand, I. I think you're correct that it's actually more powerful in a lot of ways than a nuclear threat, because it's a threat you can actually follow through on. Like, Russia's got nukes. They'd love to be nuking Europe right now, but they can't because it's just. It's uncivilized. And also there's wind. Like, you can't do that. And they might get nuked themselves. So, like. But Iran can do this to the straight. And so I think. Yeah, I think you're right. I think it gives them a lot more leeway now. I think it might be hard for them to get to the place of recognizing that it's not that. It's not an issue of pride anymore.
- [12:35]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
You can.
- [12:35]
Ryan Grim
You can. You can move away from that and move to this. What do you say?
- [12:39]
Emily Jaczynski
Well, I was just gonna say, I mean, they might get nuked themselves is the real key, because same thing with. The same thing goes with Israel. The. The civility question, I think, is out the window. It's actually what we see is these different countries doing everything up to the brink, bas. Re. Shattering the nuclear taboo, and that results in these. You know, I. I'm the opposite of somebody who believes in nuclear proliferation, so that's not what I'm arguing for here. But that is the. Is why I think we see so Many of these protracted conflicts in and many of them proxy conflicts in the last 80 years of human history is that it's just barbarism, protracted barbarism because of the nuclear shadow that hangs over everyone.
- [13:23]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
And Emily, you, you also put this other one in from the Axios reported deal here. Is that what you wanted to get to next?
- [13:31]
Emily Jaczynski
Yeah. And, and yeah, let's talk about this a little bit because there was another Axios deal meltdown yesterday and Ryan and Dropsite was following this really closely. This is a New York Post reporter saying the Axios reported deal Trump is considering is basically the same in Iranian media. Yesterday the White House denied just dressed up in different clothes. I'm told each side has to sell it to their own people and the international audience gets caught middle then Bessant came in once again from this White House briefing and I think we can pull this up as well. Griffin of him commenting on the deal. I love Ryan's market hours framework. I think this makes a lot of sense. But I'm also curious what you made of this Ryan yesterday as Dropsite was covering it closely. Let's take a listen to Treasury Secretary Scott Besant on the deal with the Iranian government.
- [14:18]
Scott Bessant
We did not have regime change, but we change the regime. As President Trump said at the cabinet meeting. As we've said other times, the first layer of leadership was eliminated. The second layer, and we're now at the third layer and eliminated, is the Iranian government, such as it is three pillars, it is the elected government, it is the IRGC and it is the clerics. And they are having trouble communicating. So we are being patient. We do not have unlimited patience. President Trump always prefers a peace deal. So everything we have done thus far has been defensive and at present that is what we will continue doing. But if President Trump doesn't think he can get a peace deal, then Connecticut is back.
- [15:07]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
All right, Kinetic is back. So we make it that.
- [15:11]
Emily Jaczynski
Yeah. Brian, is this a. He's he's sort of trying to put the onus on Iranian communication failures for the deal being maybe confusing or muddled or hard to reach.
- [15:24]
Ryan Grim
What's. Yeah, and what's interesting is that Jeremy Scahill last Friday reported on what Iran had offered in response to the MoU and Iranian media then confirmed that several days later. And you know, according to Axios, the, the current kind of deal as, as it's coming together is very similar to that. So we're now a week into and very little has changed back and back and forth. It's hard to Kind of watch this, these negotiations unfold and come away with the idea that it's the Iranians who are disorganized. In Trump's press conference yesterday, no, he's. He said, on the one hand, we have a deal. On the other hand, we don't. He doesn't care if we have a deal. And on the third hand, actually, maybe he'll just go back to war, and then also he's going to bomb Oman. So, like, from the Iranian perspective, it's like, we're not. We're not the confused ones here. So I. I do think that there's a chance that something, you know, it comes together later. But Trump has zero credibility with his kind of interlocutors here on the other side. This is also a guy, remember, what is the art of the deal? Fundamentally, what he argues in Art of the Deal and what he has practiced throughout his life is that the way that you reach a deal is you give significant concessions to the other side that you have no intention of ever following through on, and then you break your word, and you don't pay your contractors the last 20, 30%. You don't do the thing you said you're going to do, but you pocket the concessions from the other side. That is Trump's actual theory of how to do negotiations that he has articulated and that he has effectuated. And the Iranians understand that that's who he is, so they're only going to take things that they can pocket. As they've repeatedly said, words don't matter at this point, like, only, like, serious commitments matter. So. But I think we'll know more later today.
- [17:31]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
And, Emily, you know, one thing that does seem to strike true from what Besson said there is that we don't have unlimited patience. It does read to me like Trump just does not have the attention span and has grown tired and weary of even thinking about this. I mean, he's a little more focused on building the UFC fight on the lawn of the White House right now and seems like he'd much rather be talking and focusing on that. So it seems like Besson's out here trying to play cleanup, trying to keep some sort of, like, message standard about what we're doing here, while Trump is sort of mia. What is your read on that right now? And does Trump want to get a deal before he has his big 250 UFC bash?
- [18:17]
Emily Jaczynski
I'm sure he does want to get a deal. I think what is interesting now, Trump has relied on cheerleaders, including Mark Levin and others in that same vein, to do a lot of cleanup on the war in the media. And if you imagine, just dream with me here, you're Donald Trump right now. And those same people that you have been really relying on as this war gets even less popular, it's never been a popular war, but as it gets less and less popular, those are the same people that are saying absolutely no to any deal that would include like what we have in this next element. Griffin, this investment fund, I think we can toss this one up on the screen. Yes, this is, I mean he wants to, he badly wants to. So here he says this is a New York Times report, a post war investment fund for Iran. Perhaps the most surprising and apparently recent addition to the agreement is a reference to an investment fund for Iran. The Iranian official and one diplomat put it at $300 billion. But other officials involved in mediation would not confirm the amount. Iranian official, an Iranian official described it as a reconstruction program that would be promised to Iran in the event a final agree was signed. Earlier in the negotiations, Tehran had demanded reparations from bombardment damage that some Iranian officials estimate at $300 billion to $1 trillion. So the people who have been helping Trump sell this war most as the war gets even less popular as midterms, which Trump says he doesn't care about. That quote, I promise you, was pinging around like Republican consultant circles all week after Trump said that he doesn't really care about the midterms, but in some respect he does care about. And to Griffin, to your point, the amount of money that is being poured into, I mean, if you're in D.C. right now, Ryan, you've probably noticed it. I don't at all object to the beautification in honor of the 250th anniversary, but it is like nothing I have ever seen here. And I've been here for a while. Like it's an all out effort to make D.C. look amazing. And to now we have reports, actually not reports basic confirmed that there's a plan to try and get a $250 bill with Donald Trump's face on it. So obviously he is trying to do some legacy shaping here and the people who are preventing that from happening, Netanyahu, Mark Levin, are the people who were the ones that convinced him to go into the war and have been the only people really selling the war on its merits in the public for a long time. So that dynamic I can imagine has left. I mean, it's his own fault to put himself in that situation. But obviously that dynamic would probably exhaust anyone if every time you inch closer to some type of peace agreement, that would get this albatross off his neck as he sees it, at least I don't know that it really would. But it's being blocked. Every effort to try and come to terms with it. This is like literally the escalation trap. I mean, it does have to be enormously frustrating for him.
- [21:36]
Ryan Grim
Yeah, it's, it's ironic that Trump on the one hand tried to block D.C. from spending like what, $1.1 billion of its own locally raised tax revenue through a congressional restriction. There was eventually able to get a deal and a workaround on that. While then he's also using this National Park Service money from around the country to then beautify D.C. and yet, like the Malcolm X, we have this, we have a park called Malcolm X Park here. It's like 16th street down by the U Street corridor. There's the fountains are flowing, there's water running like it's beautiful. Nobody's ever seen it before. Like it's.
- [22:15]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
I need to hear Trump talk about Malcolm X.
- [22:18]
Emily Jaczynski
Actually he'll call it Meridian Hill.
- [22:20]
Ryan Grim
He'll call it Meridian X Park. It's incredible. Looks great. But yes. What else is like, where is he stealing it from? How much of that is he using for the ballroom as well? I was talking to a source at the National Park Service and actually the Washington Post reported this too, that we're looking at something like a 45 minute firework display. Like hundreds of thousands of pieces of artillery, which God only knows what the like environmental and safety repercussions will be of that. And like your fireworks, fireworks are amazing. But after like 10 minutes. Right, okay, I get it. You imagine sitting through 45 minutes of fireworks, your kids are gonna want to like, I don't know my kids, my kids be done after like 15. Like it's like more like explosion.
- [23:17]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
It's like, I do love this $250 bill thing too. This would be the first still alive president to be put on, on money, if I'm correct.
- [23:28]
Emily Jaczynski
It's not allowed.
- [23:29]
Ryan Grim
Yeah, it's not allowed.
- [23:31]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
But, but that's what, but that's, that's the kind of stuff we wish Trump was working on. Right? That's that stuff. I also, Sager sent this that apparently in, in China the number 250 is A, is a joke slang for idiot or something like that. Which, which they're, which they're finding really funny that it's like, it's some so saying that they, so they're loving the 250.
- [23:52]
Ryan Grim
That's their 6 7.
- [23:54]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
That's a bench. Yeah, that's China's 6 7, apparently. And, and you know, maybe this is how we fix the tolling problem, is that Iran can toll the straight, but they have to use the 250Trump bill to do it and then we get to world peace.
- [24:10]
Ryan Grim
That's a lot of Trump bills, but sure. All right, if that's the deal, fine.
- [24:14]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
I'm, I'm feeling optimistic about it.
- [24:17]
Emily Jaczynski
It's just all it's. But to that point, I mean, I think he probably does want to have this behind him by the time that happens because it's like everything this second term has been building up to the 250 and it just, every time you get close it gets blocked because there's no way to release any funds without Netanyahu and Mark Levin losing their minds. And I'm just using them as stand ins but like kind of also leaders of that movement to create more escalation.
- [24:53]
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- [27:29]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
Emily, we have one Dr. Jill Biden here who now is chatting about her time in the post debate of Biden. Is there anything that you would like to set up here before we listen to Jill?
- [27:46]
Emily Jaczynski
Yeah, well, yeah, let's set this. She has a memoir coming out. This woman had the audacity to write a memoir because I think the Biden family, this is my like Freudian read if I put them on the analyst couch for a moment. Has always wanted to play with the lobbyists and the consultants that if you're a politician you run with and it's true, Biden was had one of the lowest net worths in Congress for a really long time. But I think they want to get paid. And so Joe Biden, Jill Biden, I should say, as her husband is, per Hunter Biden, dealing with some tough cancer. We all know that it was diagnosed, I think stage four. But Hunter Biden was on soft white underbelly recently talking about how it makes him have a hard time sleeping and there are all kinds of issues with it. Jill Biden is out on a media tour to promote her memoir and had the audacity, Griffin, to say this in a preview of an interview that's going to drop this Sunday on CBS Sunday morning. So this is Jill Biden's explanation for what happened on the debate stage when we were all sitting in the studio watching the debate with fried chicken or whatever you ordered Griffin that night. And this is what Jill Biden people can go back and watch the clip of like Crystal and Sagar's jaw dropping during the. The Trump Biden debate that made Biden drop out. This is what Jill Biden said she thought.
- [29:07]
Jill Biden
Ever see signs that he was falling into cognitive him decline? No. No, no. Truly? No. I mean people were saying he wasn't the same Joe Biden. Well, I don't think that's true. He was the same. The essence of the same Joe Biden. But yeah, he was the essence.
- [29:31]
Emily Jaczynski
The concept of the plan of Joe
- [29:32]
Jill Biden
Biden, we all observe that when you know it's a very intense job, I think it ages you quickly.
- [29:41]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
Then we got one more here. We'll, we'll play these back to back here because that was not enough for my taste. Let's do it.
- [29:49]
Emily Jaczynski
Gets better.
- [29:50]
Jill Biden
Were you horrified as you saw it unfold? I wasn't horrified. I was frightened because I had never ever seen Joe like that.
- [30:02]
Emily Jaczynski
The. With the COVID Excuse me, with dealing
- [30:07]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
with everything we have to do with.
- [30:10]
Emily Jaczynski
Look, if we finally. I hate watching here.
- [30:16]
Ryan Grim
Thank you, President Biden.
- [30:17]
Jill Biden
Before or since? Never. Or since. Yes. Or since. Never seen him like that. Never. No. What happened? I don't know what happened. I mean when I, as I watched it, I thought, oh my God, he's having a stroke. And it scared me to death. Joe, you did such a great job.
- [30:36]
Emily Jaczynski
This is after the debate. Every question, Joe, you graduated kindergarten.
- [30:45]
Spencer Pratt
What did Trump do?
- [30:51]
Emily Jaczynski
I mean, she was so hyped for that moment after an hour before apparently she thought her husband was having a stroke on stage. These are the lies that Joe, that Jill Biden is peddling to sell a memoir. And I heard the pod save guys making an interesting point about how they were reacting to Zelani who posted on X that people underestimate how much there's a trust problem in the Democratic Party because so many top Democrats and pundits that are Democratic leaning or outright Democrats spent months saying that Joe Biden was fine. And then even some after the debate someone was circulating the New York Times scoring of the debate and I think it was there were a couple of people who had rated it a draw. And again, there were some people spinning after the debate that it was fine. And that's a serious problem for Democrats. Not in the narrow sense that people are going to go pull the lever one way or the other. As I think it was John Favreau was making this point because they were lied to about Joe Biden. No, that's not what was happening. It's that Democrats are digging out of a deep trust Deficit, specifically, in some ways, because of this. And so then to have Jill Biden going out, I mean, all of the sources to Alex Thompson and others are coming out of the woodwork now, not still not by name. And saying this is not true. Like she did not like none of this, that none of what she is saying is true. And people. Ryan, I'm curious what you're hearing in Dem circles, if anything, about how this is just incredibly unhelpful for Democrats in the middle of a midterm cycle.
- [32:29]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
Ryan, let's get your reaction to this. A former senior Biden campaign adviser tells me Jill Biden's comments are revisionist history. She and a handful of other close advisors around President Biden kept gaslighting us, telling those of us on the campaign we were the ones who are wrong and that he just had a bad night. I think she saw the reputational harm this caused her and is therefore taking a new position. What do you make about that?
- [32:51]
Ryan Grim
Reminds me of how Hoover, President Hoover, former President Hoover, appeared at every Republican convention for, like, decades after he was out of office. He was former president. He's like, I want to speak at the Republican Convention. And people are like, hoover again. Jesus. And I think things move much faster now, but I think people are like, oh, no more Biden. No more Jill Biden. No more Joe Biden. We need to just move this back into the, into the past. Let. Let the river of time, you know, wash this out. Doesn't help that. Like, because it's like, yeah, sure, she has her own motivations, but also like, no, there's nobody left kind of in the party establishment that has any motivation to help her with this project, it's fine. If she wants to do a project of restoring her self image. And if a publishing house thinks that they can move some books based on it. I was wrong about the Kamala Harris book. I didn't think that would sell. It sold a ton. Maybe this will move. But nobody in the party, including in the party elite, you know, has any real interest or motivation to play along.
- [34:05]
Emily Jaczynski
I think a difference with the Kamala Harris book is that she still has people in the party elite who were willing to, like, do bulk book buys for events and that type of thing. That's my impression of how that book, because she went on a tour to sell it. Like, she actually went and did all of these live events. And when you do that, you get bulk sales. And there are people who are willing to sit down with her, like very prominent people who did these interviews on her Book tour. I don't think there's anybody like that with Jill Biden remaining, especially after now saying she thought he was having a stroke. And you have this juxtaposition that everyone remembers really viscerally, it just seems. And the Biden family, this is another. I mean, it's kind of sad and tragic in the way that the Biden family is tragic, but they can't give anything to anyone anymore. Whereas if Kamala Harris one day runs for president again, who knows what happens? Whatever. She may be in a position to scratch other people's backs, so they have incentive to scratch her back. The Biden family doesn't have that anymore at all.
- [35:01]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
Yes. And to Ryan's point about Democrats desperately wanting to leave this in the past, but we are living in the current present of the wreckage of both of their decisions, Jill and Joe Biden, to stay in this race for so long, to not have a primary. And. And we're all living in the reality that occurred from that to. To this day. And I. I guess it's like with Trump, you know, he want. He wants to be in office, to do all these deals to enrich himself, all this corruption. But, like, what did Jill get out of still wanting to stay in the White House longer? Is it just, like, ego? Like, you know, like, it's not like she was cashing in a ton at all. What is she. So she could rearrange the floral arrangements at the White House? Yeah.
- [35:46]
Ryan Grim
Oh, no. I think you're totally underestimating the potency of just being in the White House. It's the most powerful position in the world. And if. If he's only working from 10 to 4 or whatever, somebody's got to be. That's true. Fielding. Fielding requests and calls. And like, she was. She was becoming an, you know, an increasingly central part of that administration. And that would have only increased in a second term. So. Yeah, I don't think any mystery there.
- [36:18]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
And there's this refrain that she keeps saying that this was the only moment, that this was just like a snafu. In fact, some of the reporting from the Atlantic says that Jill thought that he was drugged. That someone had drugged him before was another claim that she made. But I mean, just.
- [36:35]
Emily Jaczynski
Yeah. McKay Coppins got an early copy of the memoir and wrote a piece based on it. And apparently that is actually part of Joe Biden's claim is she thought, wow, maybe he was drugged. Maybe he had, like, cough syrup or something, is what. Yeah, it's crazy.
- [36:48]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
I mean, maybe he was drugged for years because I mean, there was clip after clip before this debate even happened. And I would like to play just my favorite one, the classic we all know as Earthrider.
- [36:59]
Emily Jaczynski
Here it is.
- [37:01]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
Used to make the crew be fine. Oh, Earth Rider, thanks for the Great Lakes. Oh, Earthrider, thanks for the Great Lake.
- [37:14]
Emily Jaczynski
I mean, this was in the 2020 election. First of all, in the 2020 primary, people didn't want to say this. Other Democrats that were running against him really didn't want to say this. It kind of harkens back a little bit to Bernie and Hillary on some of Hillary's obvious vulnerabilities that Trump took advantage of in 2016. But people did not want to talk about the fact that Joe Biden seemed senile then, and they didn't want to. Media didn't give it a lot of coverage in the lead up to the 2020 presidential election. People just didn't want to talk about it, though. I think it was pretty clear. I mean, some of these clips were going very viral at the time. And what we watched was over the course of his first year in office, then his second, third, fourth, it was getting so much worse in front of everybody's eyes, and it became really hard to deny. But if you're Joe Biden, you still have Joe Scarborough coming out on one of the most watched News shows in D.C. and saying, this is the best Joe Biden I've ever seen. Talking to Joe Biden, then going out on a media platform and saying, that is the best Joe Biden I've ever seen. And so if you're Joe Biden, that stuff is meaningful because it shows that people are buying it. They're still kissing the throne, they're sucking up to power. And I mean, it's just, you can see how, as Ryan said, how intoxicating that is if you're Joe Biden in this situation.
- [38:36]
Ryan Grim
Yeah. What I wonder is how did Medicare get beat by that guy?
- [38:43]
Emily Jaczynski
Well, the dumb civil war broke out on his watch. So because he was his. He was not capable of being the leader of the Democratic Party, despite being the Democratic President of the United States. He couldn't lead the party, and he couldn't understand what was happening internally with the backlash to his Israel policy. He just couldn't. He was not capable of understanding that. And the. The party is in disarray, as is the Republican Party, of course, but that's in no small part thanks to Joe Biden being a poor steward of the position that he was in as the leader of the party.
- [39:18]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
Well, I think we can all say we're so sick of talking about these people, so why don't we move on? EMILY let's, let's move our lens, our our perspective over to the sunny city of Los Angeles where There is an LA mayoral and gubernatorial race occurring June 2, primary in just a few days. Emily, from an outsider perspective, break it down for us for a second. What are you seeing over here in la?
- [39:47]
Emily Jaczynski
Well, first, if you haven't watched Griffin's interview with Tom Star, he did a fantastic job. It was a great interview, so go and check that out. But a Berkeley poll came out yesterday. A lot of people remember when Michael Shellenberger, as sort of an online phenomenon, launched a bid for for governor. I forgot how many years ago that was. And he was getting a ton of attention on the Internet, but people were curious how that would actually materialize, if it would materialize into votes. And it didn't. I mean, it was he got a very, very, very minor percentage of the vote at the end of the day. But there's a Berkeley poll that came out yesterday that had Bass at 26%, Nithya Raman at 25% and Spencer Pratt at 22%. And that was of likely voters in the city of Los Angeles. Pratt responded as Griffin has up on the screen as a Trojan. I would never go off a UC Berkeley poll fight on my strong guess. I'd have to go look at the margin of error, but I would guess that they're all clustered. I mean, that between Bass and Ramen, that's almost certainly margin of error territory. And Pratt is probably close to margin of error territory. But all this is to say we can see he's not purely an online phenomenon. We can see that he's not just at what, like 1%, 2%, 3%. He's not to sound like Dr. Seuss, but he's actually at 22%. So we now see this is a serious candidacy as the election is on Tuesday. Right. Griffin. And Griffin's in. Griffin's based in la. And Griffin, you're also, what, DSA adjacent or full DSA in la. So you've been following this as close as anyone. That's coming up in just a couple of days. So this poll is a little bit of a wake up call, probably.
- [41:39]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
Well, I identify as a political podcaster that calls balls and strikes, and I'll be doing that on this segment as well. And this segment I do think is designed to make I think no matter what you say about the LA race, someone's going to get really Mad at you. So I will try to take this from a neutral what's going on in the race perspective. But, yeah, I mean, it is really surprising to see someone that a lot of people view as. As MAGA coded, like Spencer Pratt rising so much in the polls. And it does seem like there might be a silent Pratt voter that maybe doesn't say they're voting for Pratt, but. But is going to. And I. You do say he said. You said he's not just an online sensation, but it is quite an online sensation what he's been doing. Now, some people are making fun of his AI Slop ads. Some of them are created by fans of the campaign. Some of them are billboards that he puts up around town, which people think is very funny to put up AI Slop in a city of creatives that are about to all lose their jobs to AI Slope. But regardless of that, he's also really making actually a lot of compelling videos of him all over Los Angeles, you know, grabbing a lot of attention in a very Trump 2016 way against a unpopular Democratic incumbent. So I think that he's probably going to get into the top two of the primary, or it might be likely. But for those who don't really know the stupid California system we have here, it is a jungle primary. So essentially Republicans, which sounds fun.
- [43:16]
Emily Jaczynski
Yeah, sounds fun as hell.
- [43:18]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
It was designed apparently originally to try to create a system that would create more moderate candidates. But essentially what occurs is Democrats and Republicans all run together. There's not a Democratic and Republican primary. They all run together, and then whoever gets the top two goes on to a general. Now, often in California, that means it could be two Democrats running against each other, or it could be, you know, it could be in the governor's race, two Republicans running against each other, which seems unlikely now, but there was a moment where we thought Steve Hilton and Chad Bianco might be the top two for California governor. That doesn't look likely anymore, but, yeah, here we are here. And Ryan, what is your perspective? You know, we covered the Zoron race in New York for a long time, and, and Zoron's videos really did put him almost on a national stage in a way that Spencer Pratt seems to as well.
- [44:15]
Scott Bessant
What.
- [44:16]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
What is your. What do you make of all that?
- [44:17]
Ryan Grim
Yeah, I mean, he was already a national figure from his reality TV days. Right. You know, if the, if the videos at the kind of pop culture linkages kind of line up with your politics, then it works together. And I think that's the case with Pratt, like, he's, he's going for this like, what upper middle class, every man kind of, kind of vibe.
- [44:42]
Emily Jaczynski
I don't know.
- [44:43]
Ryan Grim
Like what?
- [44:44]
Emily Jaczynski
I don't know. I guess I think that's how he's like himself, but I also feel it. And Griffin, actually. You too, Ryan. Like, there's something I would imagine that people missed with, with Trump and like working class Hispanics where if you are hitting on the biggest vulnerabilities, Karen Bass and some of these Democratic candidates and just talking about cleaning up the city, helping people who are homeless recover from their addictions, like, it just seems as though he's perfectly positioned to take on those very serious, grave vulnerabilities. Not just with the upper middle class Democrats who are sick of paying so much in taxes and then walking in, walking over needles, but also the kind of like everyman who's like, whoa, why was the mayor gone during the fire? Like, what the hell's going on?
- [45:38]
Ryan Grim
It's certainly the kind of candidacy that you can imagine appealing to people who are just like kind of at the end of their rope and, and just very frustrated at how things are. You're like, let's, this is totally crazy. Let's try this.
- [45:51]
Emily Jaczynski
Yeah.
- [45:53]
Ryan Grim
So, yeah, it certainly seems, seems plausible. I saw that Nithy was trying to get another left wing candidate to drop out. Like if, if enough. If, if Democrats were really kind of strategic about who was in the final race, Griffin, would they be able to box him out? Is, Is it really the kind of like candidates who are gobbling up like 20 of the vote all among them, that. That is kind of giving him the shot at, at squeaking through and then once he's in, then he has a one on one shot.
- [46:26]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
Yeah. So right now it's a tight three way race between the incumbent Democrat, Mayor Karen Bass, who I would describe as kind of like a center right, liberal, ish, kind of former Cuban terrorist.
- [46:39]
Griffin
Right.
- [46:40]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
Well, Spencer talks about all the time that she was training terrorist tactics in Cuba, which, which is great.
- [46:48]
Emily Jaczynski
She says she wasn't.
- [46:50]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
Oh, okay. Well, that, that maybe she should admit to it might help, but maybe not. Maybe not. And then we have Nithya Raman, who is technically DSA coded, but the DSA did not endorse Nithya for like a medley of reasons, including sort of her work on the LA City Council, where they found her to be a little lackluster. So there was a little bit of drama about not endorsing anyone for the primary. So. But Spencer does seem to be really into coding all of the problems of LA on the dsa, and I think maybe that's because Zoron has made the DSA more of a national topic. So now more people know what that was. I don't think this would have worked even a couple of years ago. But let's take a listen to a recent video of Spencer calling out both Karen and Nithya Ramen.
- [47:48]
Spencer Pratt
I'm Spencer Pratt. We're here at the 6th Street Bridge in downtown Los Angeles. It is beautiful, if only you could see it. But all the lights have been allowed to be stolen from our taxpayer money because Mayor Basura and Nithya Rahman, City Council, let criminals run the streets. But don't worry, Mayor Basura is planning to take more million dollars of our tax money to get solar power lights.
- [48:18]
Jill Biden
Oh.
- [48:18]
Spencer Pratt
Because the criminals won't steal those. But don't worry, Nithya Rahman has suggested putting cages around the lights. That's right, cages. That, that'll stop them. So if you're sick of your tax money getting burned by these criminals, better vote for Mayor Pratt. The ballots drop May Ford.
- [48:37]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
All right, so, yes, he loves to call her Karen Basura, which. Which people find very funny. It's very Trumpian in coming up with nicknames, if you will. And I do think that to Ryan's question of if the Democrats could consolidate around someone. But unfortunately, I think that Neitha Raman has stumbled during these debates. Nithya has not been able to cut videos that are, in my opinion, very charismatic and engaging and hasn't been able to really own the media environment, which has led the Democrats to be in this kind of standstill where they're like, well, people really hate Karen Bass. I mean, she has an insanely low approval rating. But Nithya really isn't getting out there and grabbing the moment and doing mic drops and capturing people's attention either. So it's, it's this area where, you know, these people want to run for these positions, like LA Mayor and stuff. But we're in a new realm where if you can't cut a vertical, if you can't talk to the camera and make constant interesting 60 second videos that got people's attention. You really, you can't be, you can't win as mayor. And maybe she still will. But I do think we're in this new era now where you have to be able to be a confident media content creator to, to really grab people's attention.
- [49:57]
Emily Jaczynski
Well, I was gonna say two things on that. First of all, I don't think anybody wants to be in this era where you have the reality television stars who can master media, being able to kind of dominate conversations because institutional trust is so low. But we are in that moment. I am sorry, but there are a whole lot of people in this country who are just going to say. Or in our cities who are just going to say screw it. But Karen Bass, you're telling me like you're appealing to my institutional trust and what you've done as mayor or Nithya Raman, who I think was like tasked with on the city council, the homelessness issue. Griffin, correct me if I'm wrong, that's a huge, huge vulnerability for both of them. And you can't just appeal to expertise or authority when people think your expertise and authority is failing. So we are in that era and I don't know anybody who particularly likes it or loves it, but, but it's what we're in. And secondly, that does become a really big problem because Mamdani was very clever about how he dealt with his past on criminal justice reform. Right. Like that's, it's been pretty interesting to watch him navigate that. And I think he's done it just about as well as anybody could. But that's a real problem for Nithya Raman and Karen Bass because people want a new, especially I think working class people, if you look at polling, want a new approach that isn't just the progressive criminal justice reform experiments that played out in some our cities, even in California. What did they. They recalled a couple people who were like, it was San Francisco. I'm trying to remember exactly who it was. Yeah, Ryan, it's. His name is escaping me.
- [51:35]
Ryan Grim
Not a terrorist.
- [51:37]
Emily Jaczynski
Yes, Ches. Yes, yes.
- [51:38]
Ryan Grim
Yeah. Bad. Yeah, very bad timing for him. And I'm joking about terrorists. But his, his parents were in the Weather Underground. That's what I mean.
- [51:47]
Emily Jaczynski
But yeah, that's. I think that's a problem.
- [51:49]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
Yeah. Yeah. I mean there, there, there are serious issues with, with Los Angeles. And yeah, people don't really care about this experience line that both Nithya and Karen are touting as the reason that you should vote for them. Spencer's been really smart, I think about saying, oh, this is. If this is their experience, that's no good. And I also think that, I mean, listen, this is like a very long shot thing. This is liberal la. So even if Spencer makes it through the primary, it's unlikely that he would win in, in the general just because the, the odds are, are simply stacked against him. But he was doing this really smart thing early on of saying, I'm not Democrat, I'm not Republican, I, I just care about the city, which I thought was really smart. But in the recent weeks he's like going on Gutfeld, he's going on Fox News and it's like, brother, that's not going to help you. Like, like he was in New York,
- [52:41]
Emily Jaczynski
cleared the last couple days on a meeting.
- [52:43]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
He needs, he needs to be going on Pod Save. He needs to be going on Alana Glazer. Like, he needs to be going on those, like, and maybe they wouldn't have him. But honestly, I, I, I do think there is a certain charm to him. I mean, I, you know, I personally find him to be a little bit of a, you know, reality TV show huckster, much like Donald Trump. But, you know, there's a charm to him and I do think that he would win over some of these liberals if he went on and talked about the things he's going to do. Trump kind of did a soft endorsement. Erica Kirk did an endorsement. It's like, guys, you are not helping him.
- [53:18]
Ryan Grim
And I know we got, I think we got to move to Dr. Hamilton a second. But one other federal related point is that assuming he does get into the, into the general election, that's actually very good then for Republican House turnout in the Los Angeles area. A lot of these California races are often decided by, you know, five, 10,000 votes or less. And so if there are two Democrats on the governor gubernatorial ballot and two Democrats on the mayoral ballot, then Republican turnout in the general election just plummets because Republicans are like, like, why bother? And then the House candidates deeply suffer as a result, the Republican House candidates. But if there's Pratt and gives Republicans a reason to come to the polls while they're there, they're also going to vote for the Republican House candidate, which could actually, you know, which could potentially matter in some of the further out depending on how the districts are drawn races.
- [54:15]
Emily Jaczynski
He's running a good campaign and his opponents are running bad campaigns. That's my assessment of it. Like a really good campaign juxtaposed with a couple really bad campaigns.
- [54:22]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
So yes, and he is already plotting a reality TV show that is following him around for the race. I don't know if that would start in the general, but it was leaked that it could potentially continue rolling if he becomes mayor.
- [54:37]
Ryan Grim
That'd be cool.
- [54:39]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
So yeah, there, there's that as well. And yeah, I guess it's just kind of an example of the, a very deeply Democrat city not really having strong Democratic candidates or a Zoron of their own and in some ways just structurally and aesthetically, but not politically. Spencer Pratt probably is the closest to the Zoron of LA in terms of his ability to create media and videos that people are reacting to regardless of the politics right?
- [55:12]
Emily Jaczynski
And that happens every once in a while in these like deep one party areas. I think it's partially what happened in Texas in the Senate primary. Like you end up with two really bad candidates of the party that has such dominance in a particular state or city. So there's a little bit of that probably happening too.
- [55:27]
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- [58:02]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
and with that note, why don't we bring on our guest. Ryan, will you introduce Adam Hamawi?
- [58:08]
Ryan Grim
Joining us this morning is Dr. Adam Hamaway, a plastic surgeon from New Jersey who is running in New Jersey's Dr. Is it the 11th district, 12th district. New Jersey's New Jersey's 12th district. Kind of a crowded field replacing the outgoing progressive Congresswoman Bonnie Watson Coleman. People might remember Dr. Hamaway was on this program maybe a year plus ago when you were a guest of Representative Watson Coleman for the State of the Union. She brought you because you had volunteered in multiple war zones throughout decades, but most recently had done a rotation through Gaza actually, during this war. Have you been there multiple times?
- [58:53]
Griffin
Yeah, I've been to Gaza twice and to the west bank twice in the last two years.
- [58:58]
Ryan Grim
Got it now. So you also kind of came to prominence in Congress, like, oh, wait, this is the guy who actually operated on Tammy Duckworth when her helicopter was downed. You were an army combat surgeon. Can you talk a little bit about when, when you joined, when you joined the military and what your experience was like? Because that also I think then flows into this, this, the, the attacks that you're getting recently for some of the volunteer work that you did while you were enlisted.
- [59:31]
Griffin
Sure, yeah, I enlisted in the New Jersey National Guard and I GUESS it was 1989. I was like right when I just got into college. And then I later got a ROTC scholarship and was commissioned as an officer and served in the regular army active duty for eight years after, you know, I, you know, it got an educational delay, was an individual ready reserve for a while and then after completing my medical training came in on active duty and served in the Iraq War as a combat trauma surgeon in 2004 and five and for several years after that.
- [60:08]
Ryan Grim
Got it. And so that, that leads us to one of the more kind of shocking articles I'VE seen written by a, by a news outlet and in all of the time that I've been kind of covering politics. And this is, this was published by Jewish Insider. Let me share this here. Leading New Jersey Dem congressional candidate Adam Hanaway volunteered with Al Qaeda Tide group in Bosnia. You read that headline, you're like, what, what on earth is going on here? So can you give us a little background about, you know, what this, what this Bosnia volunteer effort was that the Jewish Insider is now turning into allegations that you're linked to Al Qaeda?
- [60:56]
Griffin
Yeah, I mean, things are getting more absurd as we get closer to elections. I've been volunteering now for almost 30 years with medical missions around the world. And that was one of my earlier ones. I was a medical student between my second and third year and the genocide in Bosnia was happening at that time. I reached out to the Boston mission and said, listen, I got a summer and I'd like to volunteer. And they directed me to the un who directed me to one of the organizations working with them, and I spent the summer delivering medical supplies with the countryside and that was it. And, and apparently now like they're, they're grasping at straws and, and we got crazy allegations because they have nothing else to talk about.
- [61:43]
Emily Jaczynski
Yeah.
- [61:43]
Ryan Grim
And Emily or Griffin, if you have a follow up question, like, so about, about a decade after you were there, one of the organizations that the UN directed you to was raided and accused of or found to be operating as a front for, for Al Qaeda, which I think in 1994 probably a lot of people may not even have heard of, except for maybe this CIA. And so I guess you would have had to have had a time machine to know that this was going to happen a decade later. Like, and can you talk a little bit about like, what you saw while you were in, in Bosnia and what this, what the situation was like.
- [62:21]
Emily Jaczynski
But yeah, I'll just build on. So sorry, I was just going to build on Ryan's question a bit because John Schindler, the national security journalist, built on the Jewish Insider report and said that at the time you were in the Zenica area, it was crawling with foreign jihadists, many of them followers of Bin Laden, including the infamous Al Mujahed Mujahid Battalion, which BAF Benevolence International foundation supported with funds and logistics. Those terrorists committed numerous crimes against Christian civilians and prisoners of war, including decapitations on film. Many notables in the global Salafi jihad movement, including Osama bin Laden himself, spent time in Bosnia during that troubled period. What was the good doctor really doing in Bosnia? Schindler writes, in 1994 as a guest of BIF and bin Laden. So just I wanted to add that to Ryan's question. Dr. As well.
- [63:05]
Griffin
Well, it's, it's, it's almost laughable, just kind of like hearing you talk about this. It's, you know, I've been talking about my mission to Bosnia since I was a medical student. And when I came back, I mean, it was one of the things that, you know, highlighted my time in medical school that I was able to volunteer. And what I saw is initially when I was in Sarajevo is, you know, snipers shooting people in the street and then to different clinics and hospitals throughout the countryside that were short on medical supplies. I flew in on a chartered UNHC United nations flight into Sarajevo, got into an armored personnel vehicle that a Ukrainian force that was there, UN force picked me and the workers up from the airport and took us downtown. And every day we would go to a warehouse that again, run by the United nations, and we would deliver supplies around the countryside. And that's what I did for the summer. And, and that really what's prompted me to do many of the missions that I've been doing since then, that's, that's the extent of it.
- [64:14]
Ryan Grim
Yeah. And something that, and I've been, you know, kind of fighting back and forth with the reporter on this Jewish insider piece because while the reporter linked to a, a federal document that included what I felt was like something that should have been included, he did not reference that thing. And that is that an envoy to President Bill Clinton this, the same year that you were working with this organization, visited a separate office and, quote, appraised BIF and its efforts to provide humanitarian relief. So this is kind of a UN recognized organization where the special envoy to the White House is, you know, visits and finds to be doing impressive work. And they, they're somehow raising questions about a medical student, that a medical student should have known more than the United nations or the White House at the time. And so I'm curious just from a personal level, you know, as somebody who has spent so much time kind of serving the country, you know, eight, eight years active duty and a lot, lot more IRR and National Guard and, you know, spent your life doing volunteer missions around the world, what's it like? What's been like to get into this partisan politics and have even your Democratic, you know, future colleague Josh Gottheimer, you know, raising questions about kind of your loyalty to the country? I just, I can't imagine what that, what that must be like after 30 years of a life of service.
- [65:49]
Griffin
It's not. This is not new for, for Muslim candidates jumping in on day one. I knew that I was going in as someone who was a witness to the genocide in Gaza and that I would be facing a lot of resistance. I've been, you know, facing criticism from. For several years now, since I came back, and I've been speaking up to my practice, to my person. You know, we've been getting attacked and I've been getting attacked now, and it's just increased. It's not a new narrative. You know, calling a Muslim a terrorist has been a go to, you know, backstory for years. I've been called the anti APAC candidate since day one. The last person in Congress that they want is someone who's actually been there and has been speaking up boldly and is not afraid. And so to have these attacks come in the last, you know, few days is just showing their desperation. They have nothing else to talk about. You know, my, my service to the country is clear. I've been, you know, I've served in uniform. I've taken care of hundreds of American, you know, men and women in combat, in battle. I took care of a U.S. you know, sitting senator. I was at 911 on Ground Zero on that day, you know, helping first responders and actually climbed on the rubble to help someone that was trapped there. So, you know, they have nothing to say except grasp at straws now and start making up stories and connecting dots that really don't even exist. So that's the only thing they got to say. And again, let's look at the narrative and what I'm talking about. I'm talking about let's stop war, let's stop atrocities that we're funding, you know, let's save lives. And what they are pushing is increased funding to a foreign country that is breaking international human rights law, that is breaking U.S. law by U.S. supporting them, that we want to continue a genocide and killing children, innocent civilians, that is continuing on to this day despite a ceasefire. And they're calling me the terrorist. So, you know, I think it's very clear for anyone who looks past the sensational headlines about where the truth is.
- [67:58]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
Yeah. And it does seem like a tactic that has been used for many years, especially right now during the Gaza genocide, you know, labeling human rights workers or aid workers at the Red Cross or World Central Kitchen as Hamas. And I don't think that stuff really is gaining a lot of traction anymore, or we hope it's not, but we solve that. But because that stuff seems ultimately a distraction from your campaign. So could you tell us a little bit about the core tenets of your campaign, what you want to do in New Jersey, and a little bit about the opponent you're running against?
- [68:34]
Griffin
So I'm running in a crowded field, so there's multiple opponents. And I've been running on basically, as a doctor, as a physician who works here every day in New Jersey and has seen war, you know, working in uniform, and also as a volunteer around the world, that we should be funding healthcare, not bombs. We have a healthcare system that's falling apart. We have insurance companies that are really pressing our patients every day, you know, denying surgeries, denying, like, you know, tests, and at the same time making a profit off it. And we're told that we can't have Medicare for All because we can't afford it. And yet we could see all the wars that we've been funding over the decades and the one continuing to go on right now. I've been saying that we need to abolish ICE because they've been terrorizing our communities. And I was just at Delaney Hall a couple days ago as, again, they're gassing senators and representatives and. And the people are being, like, attacked and kidnapped by, like, you know, mass stormtroopers, which is, you know, really strange to see in my own country right now, and that we need to unrig this economy that's being run by corporations, billionaires, and corrupt special interests and really make it work for working people. That's basically. That's my. Been my message since day one. And apparently that makes me, you know, a radical, because I'm saying that.
- [69:52]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
And you said you were an anti APAC candidate. Have you noticed APAC get into this race at all yet?
- [69:58]
Griffin
Surprisingly, no. I mean, they've been working through again, their. Their right wing, you know, media and, you know, obviously Jewish insider has been putting out an article on me every other day, attacking me. But I think they've been busy around the country. We just saw their $32 million race against Massey in Kentucky. And, you know, they're fighting a battle on multiple fronts. Maybe they didn't see me as big a threat as what they're beginning to notice right now, but I'm happy they didn't jump in. And it's a few more days to go. It's not over yet. And as we see the attacks are continuing, and I'm going to keep pushing and giving my message till the last day.
- [70:42]
Emily Jaczynski
And what's people have different visions for what it would look like to abolish ICE and, you know, do immigration enforcement in particular cases. What do you think immigration enforcement would look like without ice?
- [70:54]
Griffin
Well, there was, there was life before ice. You know, we had the INS before. And what we need is an orderly system that respects human rights, that respects civil liberties, that allows people to enter this country legally and, you know, bring their talents and abilities that have really made this country what it is with generations of immigrants coming in here. And it's not like we have to reinvent the wheel. This exists, exists in other countries. And we have to look at just around us. We are surrounded by immigrants that are neighbors, that have pay taxes and really provide services that we really need here. So let's go back and stop pointing fingers because both parties have dropped the ball about this. It's not just Republicans, it's Republicans and Democrats. And we need to get this system so that we don't have these long lines waiting for our lottery system. Or I have neighbors that have been waiting over a decade to have family members join them because our process is so broken. So it doesn't mean that we need to have this rogue, you know, force that is going and terrorizing communities and kidnapping people in broad daylight. You know, even in this district, Trenton, you know, they've been. There have been over like 30 abductions in the streets in broad daylight. Trenton is not the southern border. They're not protecting anyone here. What they're doing is attacking black and brown people. And, and, you know, we are every day moving towards a fascist country and losing our democracy. And we need to get our heads on straight about which direction we are heading for and what we want this country to look like for our children.
- [72:48]
Ryan Grim
And last question for me, without AIPAC coming in and spending millions of dollars, articles like the ones that have been targeting you, I don't think reach, you know, can reach people in the same way. But I'm curious, has, like, as you've been out on the doors or at campaign stops, has anybody come up to you and said, wait, I read somewhere that you're Al Qaeda?
- [73:10]
Griffin
Not yet.
- [73:12]
Ryan Grim
Not yet.
- [73:12]
Griffin
So I, you know, I, I've most, I've been knocking on doors, you know, greeting people at train stations, standing at coffee shops. And I'm getting a lot of positive feedback. So I don't think people have heard it. And I know they've. I've heard more words of support saying, I've seen that garbage that they're saying about you, and it's Ridiculous. So people, I'm happy I live in a district that is as diverse as we live in here and is as intelligent, where people could see through the garbage and know that what we need in this country is bold new leaders and not those beholden to AIPAC that funds their campaigns and have put them in office and keeping them in office.
- [73:58]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
It, it struck me that you mentioned earlier that you were at 911 rescuing people. And of course there was a mass explosion of Islamophobia post 9 11. Tell me more about that day, your experience trying to rescue people and the weeks and months after.
- [74:22]
Griffin
Well, that's a day I will never forget. I was a resident at New York Presbyterian in the Upper east side. And in the morning we all reported to the emergency room. We had a rush of patients that came in from the initial collapse. And after I think 11 o' clock everything stopped and the NYPD asked for some volunteers and some of the doctors and nurses like myself jumped on a bus and under police escort went all the way down to Ground Zero. We set up a field hospital in Stuyvesant High School which was down there at the time and worked through the night, you know, taking care of mostly first responders who were, you know, getting injured, getting injured and had like smoke inhalation as well and, and, and eye injuries. And then it was around midnight, they said that there was someone trapped on the rubble. They needed some surgeons up because they were thinking that we might have to amputate to extract them. Thank God we didn't have to do that. But we did climb up onto the rubble to help and we were finally able to get him up and down. So that's a crazy night. At the same time my wife was in our apartment and I called her and you know, it was hard to reach because the signals were all down that day. Told her to stay in her, in the apartment and she didn't leave the apartment for about two weeks because of the, the anti Muslim hate that was around that time. Even I on, on that day got, you know, yelled at and screamed at by some of my doctor colleagues telling me it was my fault even there, even though I was physically there and helped other doctors. Other doctors? Yeah, I would say doctor, it was one doctor. It wasn't all my colleagues. And living in New York was tough after that. You know, we lived in the city, walking through the streets, you know, you know, people spit at me and my wife and called us names and would shove and push us in the street. That's the environment that we lived in. And, and unfortunately some of that still exists today. Most of it is gone. But you could see that, that some of the attacks right now are trying to pull on that fear and pull on that hatred that, you know, is really a right wing tactic of about, you know, whether it's fear of immigrants, whether it's fear of Muslims, whether it's fear of some foreign threat that's going to, you know, that we need to go into another war. That's how they work. And when all else fails, that's what they're falling back to.
- [77:04]
Ryan Grim
Yeah, I think. No, go ahead.
- [77:07]
Emily Jaczynski
No, go ahead.
- [77:07]
Ryan Grim
Yeah, I think for people who didn't kind of live through that period, those, those first weeks and those months and then those first years, it's very, very difficult to probably put your, you know, put yourself, put yourself there. But it was, there was a profound shift in that moment and it, yeah, I'm sorry that you experienced that from other New Yorkers, but it's not surprising given what the mood was like at the time. But I also wonder if in a way the field experience that you had at that point doing volunteer work not just in the Balkans but around the world by then prepared you in a way that maybe some other American doctors weren't prepared because we hadn't had an attack on continental U.S. you know, since unless you count some DOC attacks in World War II, you know, since, you know, for 200 years or so. So in order for an American doctor to have experience with a field hospital in a crisis situation like that, you would actually have to go overseas.
- [78:13]
Griffin
It's going overseas and, and working with mass casualties. You know, a mass casualty currently in the United States is usually, you know, a car or a bus accident that happens, you know, thank God, very rarely. And to actually have like more injuries which include a combination of blast, burn, you know, penetrating injuries on a mass scale, and to be able to triage it besides field exercises where you're simulating, it's, it's an experience that most people, thank God I don't have and that's again, one of the reasons that I keep going is because I feel I have this experience. And even though, for example, in Gaza we've had several hundred doctors from the United States now volunteer, for most of them it's the first time. And going there with a team and being able to lend a hand and give my perspective about, about this is how you triage in a situation where you have very little resources and you have to move a lot of people through. I think it's important And I think those hundreds of doctors that have been there now and have come back and are working now all over the countries in ERs and hospitals, in cities and rural settings, they're a huge asset now to the United States because of the experience that they've had over the last few years.
- [79:43]
Emily Jaczynski
And I was just going to ask, I mean the. You've been getting tons of questions for years, not before the campaign, about obviously Omar Abdel Rahman, known as the Blind Sheik. And I was in the Midwest on 911 and after 9 11, of course, I can't imagine what it was like to be there in the area in the days and weeks and years after 9 11, how sensitive people were, how what it was like to be Muslim in the area, what it was like to feel like you were in danger in the area. And I wanted to ask just how you sort of have dealt with some of those, what I imagine are difficult conversations. One quote recently, as you said, he did speak about violent things. This is in reference to the blind cheek. Even though you say that I think most people disagree with and most people condemn, including myself. But it wasn't the only thing he spoke about. And I imagine that you've had conversations about your association with him over many years with many different people and just trying to kind of get along with your fellow Americans. What has, what has that been like in this campaign and before this campaign?
- [80:49]
Griffin
Well, you know, at that time there was very few, you know, religious figures for Muslims in New Jersey, New York area at the time. And he was a well known figure that was basically everywhere. I mean, you know, he went to different mosques and different, you know, locations and people, you know, you know, saw him because he was just around. And when I first met him at that time, again, I was, you know, just, you know, I was already in the military, I was already serving and he was in the area. What I was called to testify on is there was a last minute carpool I joined. Not just him, but it was several community members and other religious figures at that time. And what I was called to testify on is a particular time. What I saw and what I heard. It was not as a character witness. It was not anything. You know, I've been condemning the violence for years. I've been condemning what he said and any violent actions. And the reason I was called as a witness is because I had nothing to do with it. I was never accused of anything at the time, before or after. It was a small 15, 20 minute testimony in a very long trial. I went and gave my testimony and left. And really no one said anything about it at the time because it was so insignificant. Again, it's one of those things about grasping at straws and trying to make something out of nothing because they have no other story to talk about.
- [82:21]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
All right, well, Adam, where can people learn more about your campaign race? Follow you? We'll put a link in the description.
- [82:29]
Griffin
Well, the race is almost over, so it's crunch time right now. Second is just four days away. Now, you can learn that at The Hammaway for NJ.com H A M A W I F O R N J. And you could volunteer. We need canvassers. We've been knocking on doors every day now, and we have phone banking all across the country. So whether you're in California, all the way to New Jersey, we could put you to work. And in New Jersey, if you're in the district, the polls are open. So early voting is happening right now till Sunday. And please, if you haven't filled out mail in ballots, fill them out, put them in the mail. It's not doing you any good on the kitchen table.
- [83:09]
Ryan Grim
All right, election is Tuesday. If you live in New Jersey's. Well, wherever you live in New Jersey, elections are on Tuesday. Go out and do your civic duty. We'll stay in touch and we'll talk to you soon.
- [83:19]
Griffin
Dr. Hamwitt, thank you very much for having me.
- [83:22]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
It wouldn't be a Friday show without some questions from our audience now on supercast.com. so let's see what we've got here from the people who have put on our new thread here at the top. And it will also be a link in the description. If anyone ever wants to submit a written question here. I'm just scrolling through some of them right now. Sagar, can you make another I will eat my sock prediction? Listen, you gotta, you got to save these for the live stream because that's the only one that Sagar does. All right, this one from Walter Zika. Now, Zikanowski, why do you think AOC avoids alternative news shows slash podcasts like Breaking Points?
- [84:05]
Emily Jaczynski
Ryan?
- [84:06]
Ryan Grim
I think she, I think she doesn't see the upside and only sees a downside. That's my, that's my kind of sense of it. She, she does. Do you know, she'll. She answers questions fairly, very openly on Capitol Hill, you know, for anybody who comes up with a camera, whether it's mainstream or drop site or anybody else.
- [84:30]
Emily Jaczynski
Yeah, she talks to Julian all the time.
- [84:32]
Ryan Grim
Yeah. And she'll talk to Pablo and she'll talk to literally anybody on Capitol Hill, trolls, anybody else, and she'll do what. But, you know, cable hits that are shorter, you know, the independent media hits, I think they, they generally significantly longer. More room for something to be, like, clipped and cause problems. But I, But I don't know. It's a, It's a, It's a good question. You know, she's always had this, like, I'm gonna. I'm gonna create my own audience. And she know she's got, what, 12 million Twitter followers, millions on Instagram.
- [85:09]
Emily Jaczynski
That's a good point.
- [85:10]
Ryan Grim
So she has this ability. She does these Instagram lives where she's, you know, creating an intimate, direct, parasocial connection to that audience. I selfishly, I think that independent media is a good place for all politicians, and it's a good place to hone the ability to have longer conversations. But, yeah, that's my, that's my sense
- [85:33]
Emily Jaczynski
and to build trust with those audiences. But, yeah, it's. It's odd. It is interesting. I hadn't thought about the fact that she. If you come up to her with a camera and a mic, doesn't matter if you're the Daily Caller drop site, like, she will talk to you on Capitol Hill. So the risk aversion. I get it. I actually, I do understand that you're going to get a really tough interview on independent media of people who are, like, maybe more connected to the grassroots, where there have been. There have, has been like a lot of fighting about some of this stuff and best tactics and the like. But it is kind of interesting that she takes the Capitol Hill question.
- [86:04]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
Yeah, I've changed my mind a little bit since the last time we all talked on a Friday show about this because, you know, getting. I don't know if you get tougher questions on independent media. I think there's only, like, three places that do confrontational interviews, like, adversarial interviews,
- [86:20]
Emily Jaczynski
like us, but, you know, I mean,
- [86:21]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
maybe Mehdi Hassan, but like, you know, like we. But like, you know, people are like, oh, well, Trump went on all the podcasts, but those podcasts were not adversarial. They were. They were meat riding. Trump on all of them. Like, none of them were adverse.
- [86:35]
Emily Jaczynski
Well, she did a lot of Glazer, and that's not going to be adversary, right? Like, it wasn't at all.
- [86:40]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
Yeah, exactly. So I think there's this confusion where it's like, oh, you need to go on independent media and you need to go on podcasts to have these adversarial conversations. But that doesn't really exist in the independent media sphere either. Like, if, like, if AOC goes on Pod Save America, it's, it's not going to be adversarial.
- [86:56]
Emily Jaczynski
They've been doing some decent internecine.
- [86:59]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
It's. It's not going to be adversarial, though.
- [87:01]
Emily Jaczynski
Like, I don't know, I think that I assume this question was about us and, yeah, like, Mehdi Zatto.
- [87:08]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
But I, but we are unique in the independent media space that we ask hard questions to even people that we may be politically inclined to support. And I think that makes us, like, unique and different and kind of makes sense why people don't want to have an Alyssa Slotkin moment or something like that. But that doesn't necessarily mean that they're not going to go on podcasts, because I think most podcasts are not going to be like us.
- [87:33]
Emily Jaczynski
I don't know. My assumption is Alyssa Slotkin probably saw that as a success. I think we've talked about this before, but, like, just being in front of the audience and looking like you can do it.
- [87:42]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
Yeah. I just think that there's like, honestly, in the independent media landscape or in the podcast landscape, you might get tougher questions on CNN or with sometimes, like, I think that, wait, what's her face? Who's the main.
- [87:58]
Emily Jaczynski
It depends on if we're talking about, like, podcasts like Alana GL Glazer or podcasts like, Breaking Points.
- [88:04]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
Well, look at, like, even, like the question, obviously, like, Sean Hannity glazes Trump all the time. But, like, Sean Hannity is going to ask real questions that the Nelk boys are not going to ask. Right.
- [88:16]
Ryan Grim
Like, I feel like, I don't know.
- [88:19]
Emily Jaczynski
I mean, sometimes Trump's best interviews are the ones that aren't adversarial because he just starts riffing and he's had some of his best, like, moments on Hannity, actually, because he's so comfortable with him. But sometimes then the Nelk boys, because he or the Knuck boys are Rogan, maybe it would be an Alana Glazer. But because they don't really know what they're talking about, they also don't know what the third reels they aren't supposed to touch are. So sometimes they stumble into those conversations that they don't mean to be having. So I don't know. I think it could go both ways. But I also think, like, the good indie shows, I agree with you. Are very distinct from the bad indie shows. And the bad indie shows, it is possible they may be worse than cable that is, is, that's probably true.
- [89:00]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
I, that's, that's, that's, that's at least my view on it. Okay, next one from Kevin Njedley. Ryan, if Rona WINS Presidency in 2028 and wants you to be his Secretary of State. Okay. Two crazy, two crazy things have to happen there for this to work. Would you do it? I hope this is not just fantasy world.
- [89:17]
Ryan Grim
It is.
- [89:18]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
I think you'd be great choice for Secretary of State.
- [89:22]
Ryan Grim
Only if I'm also National Security Advisor, head of USAID and also head of the Pentagon.
- [89:30]
Emily Jaczynski
They're not giving you clearance.
- [89:33]
Ryan Grim
Ro could give the clearance. He can wave it right through. What else? I mean, because I want no rivals, you know, unchecked.
- [89:41]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
Yeah, right, right.
- [89:42]
Emily Jaczynski
I would definitely put you in charge of the National Archives. We would know immediately what happened to jfk.
- [89:48]
Ryan Grim
Oh, dea. I want DEA too. Some heads are going to roll in there.
- [89:56]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
All right, so he will be the everyman Marco Rubio of the Rokana administration. And our final question comes from Nicholas El Salvador.
- [90:05]
Ryan Grim
Oh, I'm going to be Viceroy of El Salvador.
- [90:09]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
All right. Ro Khanna, get to work. So from Nicholas Jurista, not a supporter of the Iran Ward all. But you guys used to do an amazing job on having multiple viewpoints points. Now it appears to me one sided Again. I don't agree with the war at all but it would be nice to have others on that have a difference of opinions. Truly appreciate all that you guys do. Now I have asked before, should we get some, some pro Iran war people on the show? But you know, that will just turn kind of like a, like a shouting debate.
- [90:44]
Spencer Pratt
Right?
- [90:45]
Ryan Grim
I don't know. I, I, I think that's good. And we were asked, we, we were also talking about, you know, internally, you know, booking. It's you know, the proactive booking takes, you know, takes time to, you know, set aside time to think like okay, three days from now who, like, because it's, it takes a little bit. If you want like Mark Dubowitz, you gotta like reach out and schedule him and you know, he's not going to come on the next day necessarily. But I, I think, think, I think that's a fair point actually.
- [91:17]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
Yeah.
- [91:18]
Emily Jaczynski
Now, yeah, I agree with that.
- [91:19]
Ryan Grim
The show's premise has been not, not, it's not a both sides show. It's like yes, it's like the views from regular people who disagree on some things but are just, you know, regular people. Doesn't mean you have to then carve out space for the donor class to, to get their say. And yeah, so and in the Iran war, like there's not a whole lot of grassroots public support for it. So that segment of the population is not really being ignored. The population that's being ignored is the like donor class that loves the neocon class that loves the war. We never really promised to give them a voice.
- [92:00]
Emily Jaczynski
Well, I like what you just said about how it's not a both side show because what the show is really bad is we all, what we all share the foundation that we all build the show off of is that the establishment is corrupt and broken. And so, so our job is not to do what everybody else in the quote unquote mainstream media does, which is take them credibly and seriously. But we from the left and from the right approach everything through the lens of that the political establishment is corrupt and broken and the system isn't working. So sometimes that means on the tax code, for example, I'm going to say that we should have a flat tax and you guys are going to say no, we need a taxation to be more progressive. But what we're not going to do is be like actually we need more corporate carve outs for the sake of gdp. And that then applies to, if you apply that to foreign policy, it means we're really not going to have the, the type of, of pundits on and treat them credibly unless it's really adversarial in a, in a debate that they don't buy into the premise of our establishment being corrupt and broken and the like. But I actually agree with the viewer who submitted this question that it's not a bad idea to have debates when it makes sense. And so there is, there are people in MAGA because I do a SiriusXM show where I take calls every day from right leaning people. And there are people in MAGA who make arguments that we really disagree with, but they feel like it's actually the corrupt elite who hasn't pushed back against Iran since 1979. I don't agree with that viewpoint, but they feel like the foreign policy establishment has actually been cowardly when it comes to Iran. And so that's a viewpoint that I think might be worth debating because none of us agree with it. But that's a, that's the type of thing that we probably could set up with someone.
- [93:46]
Ryan Grim
So I think that would be good. I think that's great. That's more work.
- [93:49]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
Okay, well it's a fair criticism. And now I am booking Mark Levin for Monday so everybody get excited for
- [93:56]
Ryan Grim
that I would love to hear his reaction. Although we can get it Saturday Night on Fire.
- [94:01]
Emily Jaczynski
Ryan Grim. Ryan Grim.
- [94:06]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
All right, well, that's going to do it for us this Friday. Again, for those who are still dealing with struggles connecting their Spotify account to their new Supercast, trying to get into Supercast, trying to get your daily show email and it's not showing up. There's a few reasons that might be happening. It might be going to your promo or spam form folder. You may have notifications turned off in your settings. But regardless, we are here to help support@supercast.com I'm working very closely with all those people and I know it's annoying. I'm so sorry that you're going through any technical inconveniences for the membership and your hard earned money that you give us to support the show. We really support, we really thank you and are grateful for your support and, and honestly, it's stressful getting so many emails saying things aren't working. But it's also nice to see people really care about the show and care about getting the show every morning. It means that you guys care a lot. So I am going to spend the rest of this weekend making sure as many people as possible get access and supportupercast.com is there as well to help you. And by next week this whole ship should be smooth sailing. And again, we're working on something behind the scenes that I think all of you are going to like that we are going to announce sometime next week or the week after. And yeah, big stuff in store. We're going to continue to book big people, maybe some Iran war debates in the future and if anything breaks over the weekend, someone will be here to inform you of what happened. And we hope you all enjoy your weekend. Bye Bye.
- [95:44]
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- [96:18]
Paramount Plus Advertiser
home of all your BET favorites.
- [96:20]
Emily Jaczynski
What? Yes.
- [96:21]
Paramount Plus Advertiser
With all new episodes of Tyler Perry's Divorce Sisters you've always liked a little drama, plus a whole new world of movies like Gladiator 2 now will control an empire original series like the Shy.
- [96:32]
Spencer Pratt
Just make sure we protect each other
- [96:34]
Paramount Plus Advertiser
in live sports like ufc.
- [96:36]
Host (likely Ryan or Griffin)
Welcome to the History books.
- [96:39]
Paramount Plus Advertiser
New home, same family. Your BET favorites are now on Paramount plus Subscribe now.
- [96:46]
Martha Stewart
This is Martha Stewart from the Martha Stewart Podcast. Ever wonder how to make hosting look effortless? Here's a secret Getting ahead of the mess with New Reynolds Kitchens Countertop Prep Paper Just lightly wet the counter beforehand so the paper grips and stays in place. Then lay down the Reynolds Kitchen's countertop prep paper so drips and spills stay on the paper, not all over your kitchen counter. You can roll out dough, prep a party spread, or cook alongside family. When you're done, cleanup is as simple as lifting the paper and revealing that clean counter underneath. Effortless. You can use it for cooking and baking, prep, prep and even crafting, especially when you need extra working space. Because when the mess is already handled, you can focus on what matters the food, the people, and the moment. It may look effortless, but now you know it's Reynolds Kitchen's countertop prep paper. Take a tip from me. Wet it, set it, prep it. Done. Make it easy. Make it with Reynolds Kitchen's Countertop prep paper. Available now in the Reynolds Wrap aisle in Walmart, Target, Amazon, and Costco.
- [98:02]
Emily Jaczynski
This is an Iheart podcast.
- [98:04]
Griffin
Guaranteed human.