6/9/25: Kash Patel Epstein Coverup, Trump Caves On Abrego Garcia, Israel Raids Gaza Flotilla

Summary

Breaking Points with Krystal and Saagar: Episode Summary (June 9, 2025)

Hosts: Krystal Ball and Saagar Enjeti
Release Date: June 9, 2025
Episode Title: Kash Patel Epstein Coverup, Trump Caves On Abrego Garcia, Israel Raids Gaza Flotilla

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Epstein Coverup and FBI Director Kash Patel

The episode opens with Krystal Ball and Saagar Enjeti delving into the contentious handling of the Jeffrey Epstein case by the Trump administration. They critique the release of Epstein's files, labeling it a "bot" move that lacked substantive new information. The discussion intensifies with the spotlight on Kash Patel, the current FBI Director, whose recent appearance on Joe Rogan's podcast has sparked controversy.

Saagar Enjeti criticizes the FBI's inconsistent statements regarding the surveillance of Epstein:

"Kash Patel, now that he is the FBI director, is directly contradicting many of the things that he himself said only just two years ago about the circumstances of the Jeffrey Epstein case." (07:19)

Kash Patel's remarks on the Epstein case are scrutinized as he suggests the FBI won't release incriminating footage to avoid re-victimizing women:

"We're not gonna release any of that video to the public cause, quote, they don't wanna re-victimize women." (03:57)

Krystal Ball challenges this stance, arguing that technological advancements now allow for the responsible release of sensitive materials without causing additional harm:

"With technology, we can redact sensitive information while releasing the perpetrators' footage." (08:26)

Trump's Connection to Epstein and Handling of Files

The hosts shift focus to former President Donald Trump's ties with Jeffrey Epstein, highlighting Trump's evasive responses when questioned about the Epstein files. They reference an edited Fox News interview where Trump appeared to support the release of the files but later contradicted his stance.

Krystal Ball points out Trump's reluctance to fully commit to releasing the files, contrasting it with his affirmative responses to other declassifications:

"I did a lot of it. Would you declassify the Epstein files?... I would, but I'm worried about their privacy." (11:09)

Saagar Enjeti speculates on external influences, suggesting that Israeli intelligence agencies like Mossad may be impeding the disclosure of these files:

"I think it's Israel. I think it's Mossad. It's obvious, considering the original comments by Alex Acosta." (09:19)

Allegations Against Israeli Mossad and Influence

Krystal and Saagar explore the theory that Israeli intelligence is involved in suppressing information related to Epstein, potentially to shield high-profile individuals. They discuss various connections, including investments by billionaires like Peter Thiel and historical ties between Epstein and prominent figures.

Saagar Enjeti asserts:

"Intelligence gathering works so you may have to use it in the future in case you need to."

Kilmar Abrego Garcia's Deportation and Return

The conversation pivots to the legal saga surrounding Kilmar Abrego Garcia, who has been deported to the U.S. to face criminal charges related to human smuggling and abuse. The hosts analyze the political and legal implications of his return after assurances from officials that he would never be allowed back.

Krystal Ball emphasizes the narrow scope of the indictment:

"He's being charged with conspiracy to unlawfully transport illegal aliens for financial gain and unlawful transportation of legal aliens for financial gain." (24:29)

Saagar Enjeti critiques the Trump administration's handling of the case, comparing it to past controversial deportations and highlighting the potential for political motivations:

"This is a massive L for the Trump administration. They said they weren't gonna do it, but they brought him back." (21:03)

Gaza Aid Flotilla Seizure

A significant portion of the episode is dedicated to the recent seizure of the Gaza Freedom Flotilla by the Israeli Defense Forces (IDF). The flotilla, aimed at breaking the blockade of Gaza, was intercepted in international waters, leading to the arrest of all aboard, including notable figures like Greta Thunberg.

Hueda Arif, spokesperson for the Gaza Freedom Flotilla, provides a firsthand account:

"We were intercepted and kidnapped in international waters by Israeli forces. We urge our families and comrades to pressure governments to secure our release." (34:23)

Krystal Ball and Saagar Enjeti condemn the actions as violations of international law and highlight the broader context of the Gaza blockade, calling it a war crime aimed at starving the civilian population.

Hueda Arif further elaborates on the human rights abuses:

"Israel is instituting a comprehensive blockade designed to starve an entire civilian population. This is a war crime." (38:40)

Conclusion and Insights

Krystal and Saagar underscore the recurring theme of governmental and institutional overreach, whether in the Epstein case, the deportation of Abrego Garcia, or the blockade of Gaza. They advocate for greater transparency, accountability, and adherence to international laws to protect human rights and uphold justice.

Saagar Enjeti concludes:

"This is part of what you will eventually see. The court matters still, public pressure, media as well. It was undeniable." (29:36)

Krystal Ball echoes the need for due process and public oversight:

"Federal courts are not a joke. Even if it's a political prosecution, you have to produce it." (24:38)

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This episode of "Breaking Points with Krystal and Saagar" provides a critical examination of high-profile legal cases and international conflicts, emphasizing the necessity for independent media and vigilant public scrutiny to challenge and hold powerful entities accountable.

Transcript

[Crystal Ball]

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[Sagar Enjeti]

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[Tom Brokaw]

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[Lester Holt]

We hope to see you back here.

[Sagar Enjeti]

I'm Lester Holt.

[Tom Yamas]

It's carried forward.

[Jenny Garth]

Tom Yamas is there for us.

[Tom Yamas]

Firefighters are still working around the clock. As the world changes, we look for what endures. We are coming on the air with breaking news right now. We look for a constant and from one era to the next. Trust is the anchor for NBC Nightly News. I'm Tom Yamas. A new chapter begins NBC Nightly News with Tom Yamas evenings on NBC.

[Hueda Arif]

Hey, this is Jenny Garth from I do part two, Ozempic in a pill. It's oral semaglutide and is now available from Future health. Go to futurehealth.com to get affordable access to Oral semaglutide, Ozempic and zepbound for only $3 a day. No insurance needed. Visit futurehealth.com future without the e to start losing this week, Future Health weight loss data based on independent study sponsored by Future Health. Future Health is not a healthc care services provider. Meds are prescribed provider's discretion.

[Jenny Garth]

This message comes from Greenlight. Ready to start talking to your kids about financial literacy? Meet Greenlight, the debit card and money app that teaches kids and teens how to earn, save, spend wisely and invest with your guardrails in place. With Greenlight, you can send money to kids quickly, set up chores automate allowance and keep an eye on what your kids are spending with real time notifications. Join millions of parents and kids building healthy financial habits together on Greenlight. Get started risk [e-mail] iheart hey guys.

[Sagar Enjeti]

Sagar and Krystal here.

[Crystal Ball]

Independent media just played a truly massive role in this election and we are so excited about what that means for the future of this show.

[Sagar Enjeti]

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[Crystal Ball]

So if that is something that's important to you, Please go to BreakingPoints.com, become a member today and you'll get access to our full shows unedited ad free and all put together for you every morning in your inbox.

[Sagar Enjeti]

We need your help to build the future of independent news media and we hope to see [e-mail] all right, let's go on to Jeffrey Epstein. And there's been some. I mean, the way the Trump administration has handled this from day one has been clownish. You know, we had the original release of the Epstein files to A bunch of influencers. Even though there was no new information in there and in fact there was publicly available information that was redacted in the so called Epstein files. The release of that was certainly a bot. But more recently, the appearance of Kash Patel, the FBI director on Joe Rogan's podcast has just been nothing short of insane. Because Cash Patel, now that he is the FBI director, is directly contradicting many of the things that he himself said only just two years ago about the circumstances of the Jeffrey Epstein case. This surrounds multiple things. Okay, so number one starts with Jeffrey Epstein himself and the so called suicide where we were told a couple of things. We were told the camera was off. We were told as well that there's reams of information and hours of footage that was seized by the FBI in the initial raid of the Epstein mansion that has been held by the FBI. The infamous black book and so many of this other stuff the FBI had and had not yet been released to the public. And yet now we are told by Kash Patel a couple of things. They say that the camera allegedly was on this whole time. By the way, we were not told that. That's actually the opposite of the original story for the way this so called suicide went. Told by the top levels of the FBI that actually Epstein did kill himself. After all, they're 100% certain they can't release the whole file to us because we're not allowed to know as the public. And we're also not gonna see any of the footage that was seized by the FBI cause quote, they don't wanna re victimize women. So let's take a listen to 2023 Kash Patel and today's Kash Patel. Why is the FBI protecting the greatest pederist, the largest scale pederist in human history?

[Kash Patel]

Simple. Because of who's on that list. You don't think that Bill Gates is lobbying Congress night and day to prevent the disclosure of that list? And why is it that the Senate, you know, and good for Senator Blackburn to try to get it out, but then Dick Turbin comes over the top and says no, we're not going to release the names. I don't care about the list itself, but if released the names, right, And I've said it, Dan Bongino said it. We've reviewed all the information and the American public is going to get as much as we can release. He killed himself. Do you think let's play out the logical conclusion of this. Do you think that myself, Bongino and others would participate in hiding Information about Epstein's grotesque activities or do you think we would also participate in not prosecuting people? We had evidence to prosecute people on. Where's the videotape of a Nepstyn island of X, Y and Z committing these frauds? Why haven't you given it to us? Do you really think I wouldn't give that to you if it existed?

[Sagar Enjeti]

No, it's like. Do you. I think you would participate in a cover up if you're the top level of the FBI and subject to a massive blackmail machine at the top of an international intelligence apparatus. Yeah, I do think that. And in fact, because all of history vindicates that looking at literally the history of the FBI, but broadly, I mean we can just compare all of the same things that they said to what they're now saying. I mean the craziest thing he's saying is that we were not going to re victimize women. And I understand the. I would understand if we're saying that in 06 now we have what we have technology to be able to, I mean, listen. Murder and other images which are ghastly and devastating are released to the public all the time. They redact images, you know, for example, of like actual victims. But very often especially in fact in cases like this, they will make sure to protect the child, underage women or the victim's identity while at the same time releasing footage of the perpetrators. Remember, we still to this date do not have an accurate accounting of the island, of the files and everything that went on inside of that mansion. So called hidden cameras. And I know all of this quote sounds crazy but like this is documented fact at this point. So here we have Kash Patel saying he won't re victimize women, but most importantly saying that the cameras were on in the Epstein prison. Again that is a direct lie then told previously by the Bureau of Prisons and by the Trump administration. The initial time around itself. Let's take a listen. What about the video of. From the island?

[Kash Patel]

Oh, that's. Sorry, so you're talking about two different. Yes, so sorry. So. Yeah. So again we're gonna give you everything we can and people have to remember we're not going to re victimize women. We're not gonna put that shit back out there. It's not happening because then he wins. Not doing it. You want to hate me for it, Fine. Again, logical play out. If there was a video of some guy or gal committing felonies on an island and I'm in charge, don't you think you'd see it?

[Sagar Enjeti]

If you have access to it.

[Kash Patel]

If I have it. Period. If I have it. If I have it. So where else would it be?

[Sagar Enjeti]

Right? If you have it.

[Lester Holt]

Right.

[Sagar Enjeti]

But you can't say that you have it.

[Kash Patel]

No, we're giving you everything we have so far. Everything we have so far is.

[Sagar Enjeti]

Have you guys gone over all the video that's available?

[Kash Patel]

Yeah, that's what I'm telling you. That's what takes so much damn time. But the problem is there's been, like, 15 years of people coming in and creating fictions about this that doesn't exist. Where's the videotape of an Epstein island of X, Y, and Z committing these frauds? Why haven't you given it to us? Do you really think I wouldn't give that to you if it existed? I'm working my ass off along with the leadership at the Bureau and DOJ to get you what we're allowed to give you. And you're gonna get the video of the cell, and you're gonna see for yourself. And we will never be able to convince everyone what.

[Sagar Enjeti]

You know, it's like, don't you think I would give that to you? No, actually, because you're not gonna get the video.

[Crystal Ball]

We're gonna see if ours are.

[Sagar Enjeti]

He said the camera was on. That's literally not what we were told. He said the camera was off and the guards were sleeping and like, oh, yeah, okay.

[Crystal Ball]

I think Pam. Bonnie in this administration said that, didn't she?

[Sagar Enjeti]

Well, she said that they had been reviewing hours of video. We can actually. We may even have that. I'm not sure. No, we don't have it today. But she previously had said that we are reviewing thousands of hours of video, and now they're like, well, actually, we can't release any of that video to the public.

[Crystal Ball]

And also, there's not the video you want. And also we have definitive proof even though we didn't before.

[Sagar Enjeti]

Look, there's an easy way to solve all of this. Release it all to the public. Okay? You can easily release all of this to the American public. We will make up our minds for ourselves. And you can do that while being sensitive to the victims. I also would honestly like to have a poll and a survey of all the Epstein victims and ask them, hey, is it okay for us to be able to see this while we do all the sensitive work of making sure we redact you and privately and keep your privacy? I guarantee you these people would be willing to have it out in the public because they were horribly victimized and they want the people who took advantage of them to be held accountable to the public. This also is where the Elon tie in comes, where Elon claimed that it was that Trump himself was implicated in the Epstein files. And that's part of the reason why that Trump has not released them yet to the date. So pretty extraordinary accusation.

[Crystal Ball]

Before we play what Trump. Cuz every time Trump gets asked about this, he gets real squirrely.

[Sagar Enjeti]

Right.

[Crystal Ball]

Going back to his first administration when he got asked about Ghislaine Maxwell, I.

[Sagar Enjeti]

Was gonna say the infamous I wish her well.

[Crystal Ball]

I wish her well. Epstein said that Trump was his bestie for 10 years. Whether that is fully accurate or not. We know they were friends. We have video and pictures of them together. We know Trump was on the plane seven times according to the flight logs. We know Trump in an interview was like, yeah, he likes him young. So like 100% Trump is quote unquote in the Epstein files. What all that entails is another matter. But yeah, I mean, this is why it's always been so funny. The right had a deep interest in this. I think there's good reason to have a deep interest in it, especially in particular how it ties into all of these wealthy and powerful people and potentially, you know, Israeli Mossad activities as well.

[Sagar Enjeti]

No, we haven't even touched on that.

[Crystal Ball]

Yeah, and that's the other reason why very likely the government doesn't want to release everything that's available because then it will be abundantly clear that he was a intelligence asset, maybe, potentially. And for the lawyers, whatever. But you've got those two things. You've got this very pro Israel administration. You have a guy who spent years entangled with this man and you think you're gonna get all the goods on him. Even though repeatedly when Trump gets asked about this, he dodges. And so let's go ahead and play this video of him getting asked on Fox News. And this was crazy too. So Fox News, in the run up to the election, they asked him like, what about UFOs? What about JFK? And he's like, yes, release it. Yes, release it. And they're like, what about Epstein? And he's like, yeah, well, and they edited it originally to cut down all the rest of the like, well, nah, I probably actually won't do that. And there's some problems, et cetera, to make it sound like he just was like, yes, we're gonna release it. Let's go ahead and take a listen to the unedited version of what he actually said in that Fox News interview.

[Sagar Enjeti]

Would you declassify the 911 files?

[Crystal Ball]

Yeah.

[Sagar Enjeti]

Would you declassify JFK files?

[Crystal Ball]

Yeah, I did.

[Sagar Enjeti]

I did a lot of it. Would you declassify the Epstein files?

[Crystal Ball]

Yeah, Yeah, I would. All right. I guess I would. I think that less so because, you know, you don't know. You don't want to affect people's lives if it's phony stuff in there. Because it's a lot of phony stuff with that whole world. But I think I would. So Lot different than just an affirmative. Yes. And he always, every time he gets asked about it, it's something similar. Well, I'm worried about their privacy and people are involved, et cetera. Yeah, people are involved.

[Sagar Enjeti]

I mean, look, no matter who is president, just at this point, you know, we all genuinely do deserve to know. I mean, I think there are. I actually genuinely believe that it's not Trump which is holding all this up. I think it's Israel. I think it's Mossad. I think it's very obvious, considering the original comments by Alex Acosta and by the initial prosecutors. Quote, intelligence was involved. I mean, this is a direct quote. You can go and read it for yourself if you want to. Back from 2019. I think that's the only reason that we don't know. In a sense, we don't even. Like, without the files, we know everything that we need to know. Israeli agent gathering intelligence on all of the highest levels of American society. For what purpose? You can only guess. And that's another thing. People are like, well, how did they use this information? I don't think people understand how intelligence gathering works. The whole point is that you gather it so that you may have to use it in the future in case you need to. Ehud Barak, the Prime Minister of Israel, literally spending multiple nights a week at his mansion. Okay. These are documented facts, like using his money to invest with all of the world's billionaires. From Peter Thiel, which is one more recently revealed to Leon Black at the Apollo. I'm not even worried about people suing me. This is fact. Like Leon Black, he reported it out, literally had to resign from his company. One of the most private or one of the most powerful billionaires in the world had to resign from his company because of his, what was it, $200 million payment via his private jet LLC. That was being paid by. Or being paid to Jeffrey Epstein. Over 150 million. Yeah, definitely for jet maintenance. I'm sure that's what it was all about. Bill Gates and the Nobel Prize. I mean, this is obvious.

[Crystal Ball]

And the Peter Thiel piece is the new.

[Sagar Enjeti]

That he had a bunch of money, I think, in one of his funds. It's apparently now yielding incredible results to the Jeffrey Epstein estate. The point is just that the money was a tool, obviously. Oh. So, yeah, Leslie Wexner, who I think is still alive to this day, who just miraculously gifted him all this money for no apparent reason or any of that whatsoever. This is obvious. And, like, I know it sounds like Eyes Wide Shut, but it's all real. Like, this is documented. It exists, you know, president or Bill Clinton on the plane multiple times. RFK Jr by his own admission, on the plane a couple of times. I mean, that's the part I don't get either. When you're filthy rich. Why are we accepting gifts like this from questionable people? When you have the money, just fly yourself. I don't get it. I'm just a YouTube host. I don't want to accept gifts.

[Crystal Ball]

I always wanted to ignore his ties and how closely linked he was with Epstein and all the documentary evidence, and then think that he was gonna be the one that finally, between how pro Israel he is and his own linkages, Like, I never thought we were gonna see any of this. And it's just wild to see cash out there. Like, well, you know, it's just not there. And we've determined conclusively he definitely killed himself, but we can't, you know, we're not gonna show you. And now the cameras are on. Whatever it's wild situation. The last piece here is Elon has now deleted his posts accusing Trump of being in the Epstein files. And there were some other things that he had posted where he was saying, I will fully apologize to Trump once he fully releases the Epstein files. I think he also deleted those ones, too. Although double check me on that, I'm not 100% sure, but, I mean, I don't even understand this behavior. Once it's out there, it's out there. It's not like anyone's gonna forget that he posted this. It's this sort of childlike like, oh, if I delete it now, I can take it back. Which you can't really take that back. But I don't know what's going on with. Elon's also out tweeting a bunch about what's going on in LA in a way that's very favorable for and for MAGA and supporting the National Guard being brought in, whatever. So I don't know if he's trying to mend fences. I don't know if that's possible at this point because I don't think you can really come back fully from what has been said and done at this point. But it is interesting to me as well that we'll talk about this in the Theo Vaughn segment. Apparently Trump advised J.D. vance to be diplomatic when it comes to Elon. I found that very odd, very weird. I mean, not the way that Trump typically behaves. Like normally once you cross him, that's it, scorched earth. Right. I expected him to have some story equivalent to the remember the whole story tell about like Desantis coming, tears in his eyes. I thought we'd have something like that and some like elaborate display of humiliation. He's been pretty low key. Maybe it's because he does hold all the power, you know, and can punish him in all of these various ways. But it's just interesting to me how differently he's responded than what you would normally expect from Trump where Elon has gone fully nuclear and Trump has been like kind of conciliatory, honestly.

[Sagar Enjeti]

Yeah, I agree. There's some weird stuff that is going on.

[Hueda Arif]

Hey, this is Jenny Garth from I Do Part 2. Ozempic in a pill. It's oral Semaglutide and is now available from Future health. Go to futurehealth.com to get affordable access to Oral Semaglutide, Ozempic and zepbound for only $3 a day. No insurance needed. Visit futurehealth.com future without the e to start losing this week, Future Health weight loss data based on independent study sponsored by Future Health. Future Health is not a health care services provider. Meds are prescribed at providers discretion.

[Sagar Enjeti]

NBC Nightly News Legacy isn't handed down or NBC News.

[Tom Brokaw]

I'm Tom Brokaw.

[Lester Holt]

You hope to see you back here.

[Sagar Enjeti]

I'm Lester Holt.

[Tom Yamas]

It's carried forward.

[Jenny Garth]

Tom Yamitz is there for us.

[Tom Yamas]

Firefighters are still working around the corner. As the world changes, we look for what endures. We are coming on the air with breaking news right now. We look for a constant and from one era to the next, trust is the anchor. For NBC Nightly News, I'm Tom Yamas. A new chapter begins. NBC Nightly News with Tom Yamas.

[Lester Holt]

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[Crystal Ball]

All right, we've alluded to this a number of times in the show. Let's go ahead and break down the news for you. Kilmar Abrego Garcia is coming back to the US if he's not here already. Let's and put this up on the screen from Axios wrongly deported Kilmar Abrego Garcia returning the US to face criminal charges. So he's on his way back, according to a newly unsealed indictment. His deportation, they say, to El Salvador has been a flashpoint, you might say, in President Trump's immigration agenda. That indictment alleges that Abrego Garcia, who lives in Maryland, made more than 100 trips transporting undocumented immigrants between Texas and Maryland, among other states. According to Attorney General Pam Bondi, citing co conspirators testimony, Abrego Garcia also allegedly abused undocumented immigrant women and solicited nude photographs and videos from a minor. Let's go and put this indictment up on the screen. I did read through it. You know, we'll see what evidence they they proffer. But here USA Today says attorney general says Kilmar Abrego was part of international smuggling ring. This goes back to there was some footage that was released of him where he was stopped while he was driving and he had a number of people in the car. It was a vehicle that had been modified to allow more people to be there. He wasn't apprehended or anything at the time, but they considered it sort of fishy because the people did not seem to have luggage with them. I believe he said that he was bringing them to a job or something like that. So that's sort of the context of what the indictment centers around. We do know that there was one prosecutor who was meant to be involved with this put D4 up on the screen who resigned over the decision to pursue this indictment led to the abrupt departure of Ben Schrader, high ranking federal prosecutor in Tennessee. Shredder's resignation was prompted by concerns the case was being pursued for political reasons, according to sources. I think this was NBC News that reported this out, but I can't remember specifically. So, anyway, we'll see what happens with the charges. We'll see whether they have sufficient evidence to actually find him guilty of these alleged crimes. But obviously, the fact that they felt after they said absolutely no way is this man coming back, that they felt enough pressure to bring him home, both from the public and from the court system, is quite extraordinary. And so now he will go through the court system, he will have his due process, a jury of his peers will evaluate the evidence against him, and he will have his day in court. And ultimately, Sager, that's really all that anyone was asking for.

[Sagar Enjeti]

I think it's extraordinary that they buckled and they ended up bringing him back. I mean, it is pretty crazy because they said he wasn't going to, but, I mean, at the end of the day, the Supreme Court order was pretty unambiguous. They're like, he needs to be returned to the United States of America because he was deported in violation of this order. I mean, you know, even for me, somebody like me, considering how many twists and turns we've had here with Abreco Garcia, I'm like, I wonder how much of the. I wonder whether he stands a pretty damn good chance in court because they have alleged all kinds of things, right? I mean, even if you look at the original, it was like he was being deported. He was a member of Ms. 13. I mean, like, maybe. But then he was a human trafficker, and then he was a wife beater. I mean, look, it's complicated, right? He's never been accused or whatever of any of these things. But this is another step where they're alleging effectively that he's like some master human trafficker. And they had never originally said that. Now, it's possible that it's true because they've probably spent the time since to gather evidence. Maybe they thought it was a PR victory to be able to gather, you know, use the full force of the FBI, gather all this evidence. I will say, if he does get convicted of this, it's not gonna look good, right? And stuff can be a narrative violation for a lot of people. It's not some Maryland father or whatever that they're trying to use here. But broadly, look, this is what I was talking about with la, what they did with El Salvador. And then eventually, the falling apart of a lot of the narrative around El Salvador really burned a lot of Their credibility, I wouldn't say necessarily with the public, but definitely the media, because at that point, look, he had a situation where everybody knew Trump was gonna pursue deportations. He knew he was gonna do some extraordinary action, et cetera, et cetera. But with the falling apart of many of the cases, and in particular with a lot of the evidentiary stuff that they used, and then the eventual defeats over and over again at the Supreme Court level for the actual process by which this was done, I mean, I think it's basically comparable to 2002, Guantanamo Bay, like, if we really think about it, where anybody who was in Afghanistan or anybody who was like, that guy's a terrorist, eventually ended up in Guantanamo. And, I mean, it's kind of crazy, because what, some 23 years later, you would have thought, especially for an administration that kind of prides itself as being anti. The Bush administration, effectively recreated a lot of this stuff. It's something Glenn Greenwald in particular, really talked about. And, I mean, obviously, that's what changed a lot of my thoughts on this, and in particular now, since the fallout. But the fact that they did have to bring Kilmar Abrego Garcia back is evidence that the court matters still, I think public pressure, media as well. It was undeniable. Like, let's be honest, it was genuinely undeniable. It's like, you're not supposed to be deported. He got deported. I mean, and I'm not saying not supposed to. I'm saying, as in legally had a hold on him. He can come back to the United States. He will now face a jury in a trial. We'll see how it all works out. But, yeah, just broadly, you cannot look at this. They're trying to play it as like it's a victory. No, this is a massive L for the Trump administration. Like, you said you weren't gonna do it, and you brought him back. There's no getting around it, period. End of story.

[Crystal Ball]

And I wanna be really clear about what he's actually being charged with in this indictment, which, again, to see the evidence, because Lord knows that it's possible they ginned this up because they needed some sort of pretext to make it look like they're not completely full.

[Sagar Enjeti]

But that is the benefit of going through the American federal system. It's like, look, the federal court is not a joke. Even if it's a political prosecution, you have to produce it.

[Crystal Ball]

They're going to have to prove their case.

[Sagar Enjeti]

You have to produce it. And now, I mean, this is another. Look, I mean, Abrego Garcia can do what he wants but go to trial because then we'll all see it. If you just plead guilty, we're not going to see any of this. But yeah, you should go to trial for a public interest or at the very least his defense attorney should release all the discovery and all that stuff that they have because at this point that is obviously owed to the public.

[Crystal Ball]

Yeah. So they're indicting him on conspiracy to unlawfully transport illegal aliens for financial gain and unlawful transportation of legal aliens for financial gain. So basically the core of the indictment alleges that he was transporting people that he knew to be undocumented between different states. So this is like a nitpicky thing. They keep calling him a trafficker. Trafficker is someone who's doing this against people's will. There's no allegation here that these were people who were being smuggled against their will. It's more that he was transporting them and knowing that these were undocumented immigrants. That's what the indictment says. But the reason I wanna clarify that is because Pam Bondi in the news conference about this made all sorts of wild allegations tying him to a murder and this and that different thing. Even though none of that is in this indictment whatsoever. Again, to try to project this image like he's some high level MS.13 gang member and going way beyond what they were even able to obtain an indictment for. Let's go ahead and listen to a little bit of that press conference and some of the pushback she got at the end.

[Sagar Enjeti]

Maybe I misunderstood you, but you were mentioning that he had some involvement in a murder or was connected to groups that had involved with this other smuggling ring.

[Tom Brokaw]

But to be clear, the only charges.

[Sagar Enjeti]

He'S facing right now are the like, you know, human smuggling charges.

[Tom Brokaw]

Just the, that's the one offense.

[Sagar Enjeti]

But the other things that you have talked about are not actually in the indictment. No, co conspirators allege that and we were clear to say that he is charged with it's not only very serious charges of alien smuggling.

[Crystal Ball]

So those are the specifics. The other thing that I would say Sagra about this is because you know, you have Kilmar Brego Garcia, you also have some 200 plus other people who were shipped to CCAT with zero due process, many of whom we already know had zero criminal record. You know, according to the analysis that's done by multiple news organizations, the vast majority of them did not have criminal records either here or abroad. They searched the databases of a number of countries and you know, there's an effort in the courts. There was a ruling, actually, from the judge here in D.C. judge Boasberg, to say you've got to give them a chance to also, you know, like, file habeas corpus. They have to be able to challenge their detention as well. They have to be able to get some sort of due process. Supreme Court has said they were entitled that, and they did not receive it. So the other thing that I think is significant here is kind of a crack in the foundation, because previously it was just like, once you're gone, you're gone, and that's it, and we're not doing nothing about it. So the fact that they did and are bringing this one person back, I think also opens up a crack in terms of the narrative here. And then the last thing we mentioned a couple of times, just so you can see for yourself, they were adamant. There is no way, under no circumstance is Kilmar Abrego Garcia coming home. Here is Secretary Kristi Noem saying exactly that. Let's take a listen. Should never have been in this country and will not be coming back to this country. There is no scenario where Abrego Garcia will be in the United States again. If he were to come back, we would immediately deport him again because he is a terrorist, he's a human smuggler, and he is a wife beater. There is no scenario where he will be coming back to this country. Guess what? Here we are a few weeks later, and he is coming back.

[Sagar Enjeti]

It is nuts. I mean, it's literally Gitmo, right? We went worst of the worst. How many, what percent of people have been released from Guantanamo? I forget. It's like probably 70 or 80%. They're like, we're gonna prosecute him. And then they're like, oh, actually, we have to drop all the charges because there was torture involved here. And actually, we can't prove a lot of this stuff. I agree. I mean, this is basically. If we're following the Same playbook we have 02, then by 03, you start to see some releases and some legal justification, and eventually the bar cracks in the legal system. 2006, I think it's Ham DV Rumsfeld, or about habeas corpus now that they don't even need to go through all of that. Right. Because that's already here. Law of the land. There's gonna be some legal process. The fact that you haven't had some sort of seacot level removal since that time has you know, is obviously also evidence of what's happening. But I mean, I know there's been some. I forget. I was vaguely aware. What was it Djibouti or something? Like they were sent South Sudan or something. But I think it's not the same. But especially legally. You can correct me if I'm wrong. They're taking a lot of problems in the court system and I think that that's. That this is part of what you will eventually see.

[Crystal Ball]

Yeah. So extraordinary development all the way around. So listen, guys, we'd planned to talk about the Ohan, but we've got our guests waiting. We have the spokesperson from that Gaza aid flotilla who we really want to talk to. So I'll let the bros handle the Broke Pocket. Well, I was gonna say it's appropriate. I'll exempt myself from that conversation.

[Sagar Enjeti]

Although I think Theo gets unfairly lumped into. Into the manosphere. I think he's actually very funny. Like not even in a bro.

[Crystal Ball]

I say he's not funny.

[Sagar Enjeti]

No, but I'm saying the New York Times people kind of put him in a manosphere. He's not like a creatine body, you know what I'm saying? To me, Rogan is much more of a bro just in terms of his life and kind of the podcast and ufc. But. And I know Theo attends all of that, but like, I actually think he's a very funny person who does not rely on like bro comedy genuinely.

[Crystal Ball]

I don't really consume his content outside of the things that are political. And I would tell you, I think.

[Sagar Enjeti]

You would like his. Out of of all of the major ones, his is probably the least political. To me. He only goes viral for.

[Crystal Ball]

But I only. I'm not interested in anything that's not political.

[Sagar Enjeti]

Oh, it's funny. I'm telling you, it's funny. He had like Timothee Chalamet on his podcast. They actually had good conversation.

[Crystal Ball]

How would you compare him with Tim Dillon?

[Sagar Enjeti]

I think Tim is a lot. I mean, Tim is a very. Tim is to me is more of like a George Carlin esque figure, like intellectual. Well, he's a very. He is political in that. I've seen his standup and actually was surprised the first time I saw his whole set. It was not nearly as political as a lot of his podcasts, but he is like Carlin esque and he likes to point out the absurdity of a lot of politicians and a lot of like public facing media. I have not ever seen Theo any of his standup, like live or anything like that, but I would be willing to guess just based on his podcast and all that. It's a little bit more of like a societal observation. So. Yeah. Anyway, I think out of all of the so called bro podcasters, I actually think he's the least political in terms of his normal content. He does have a lot of politicians on, but I think it's noteworthy. If we remember when Trump came on, that's when Theo was talking about like being a drug addict and cocaine and stuff like that.

[Crystal Ball]

Yeah, that was a funny thing.

[Sagar Enjeti]

That's really more of his thing. You know, he has on like therapists and he has actually on some pretty interesting people. I think he has some good guests. So Theo, keep it up, man. I actually think you're very good at what you're doing.

[Crystal Ball]

All right, all that being said, that convo will happen tomorrow. Let's go ahead and get to the latest with this Gaza aid flotilla.

[Hueda Arif]

Hey, this is Jenny Garth from I Do Part 2, Ozempic In a pill. It's Oral Semaglutide and is now available from Future health. Go to futurehealth.com to get affordable access to Oral Semaglutide, Ozempic and zepbound for only $3 a day. No insurance needed. Visit futurehealth.com future without the e to start losing this week, Future Health weight loss data based on independent study sponsored by Future Health. Future Health is not a healthcare services provider. Meds are prescribed at providers discret.

[Sagar Enjeti]

The NBC Nightly News legacy isn't handed.

[Lester Holt]

Down or NBC News.

[Tom Brokaw]

I'm Tom Brokaw.

[Lester Holt]

We hope to see you back.

[Sagar Enjeti]

I'm Lester Holt.

[Tom Yamas]

It's carried forward.

[Jenny Garth]

Tom Yamas is there for us.

[Tom Yamas]

Firefighters are still working around the clock. As the world changes, we look for what endures. We are coming on the air with breaking news right now. We look for a constant and from one era to the next, trust is the anchor For NBC Nightly News, I'm Tom Yalis. A new chapter begins NBC Nightly News with Tom Yamas. Evenings on NBC.

[Lester Holt]

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[Crystal Ball]

So we have some pretty dire updates coming from that Gaza Aid Freedom Flotilla that was attempting to break the siege in Gaza. All the members of that aid group, including Greta Thunberg, have been arrested by the IDF and are now being held in Israeli prisons. So in order to give us an update, we're really fortunate to be joined this morning by Hueda Arif. She is actually the spokesperson for the Gaza Freedom Flotilla. She also is a human rights attorney, and she joins us now. Welcome.

[Tom Brokaw]

Thank you.

[Crystal Ball]

Yes, of course. So let's go ahead and start with some of the images that we were receiving from the ship yesterday. Let's go ahead and play. I'm gonna show you a video of quadcopters that initially intercepted the ship and dropped a strange subject substance on board so people can see what was going on here. Let's take a look at that.

[I]

Okay, we have. We are masking our place right now. We have copters right above our heads, the most dangerous ones, and they are. They are all blind.

[Sagar Enjeti]

We don't.

[I]

I don't know what this is. We don't know what this is. If this is paint or some chemical. No idea who, but please sound the alarm. They did say that they want to intercept us in a very calm way, but this is not what's happening. There is another war crime about to happen. We will keep you updated. Please put pressure on the government. Tell them that we are here because they are aiding and abetting this genocide. They are upholding illegal blockade. They're using starvation as a weapon of war. This cannot go on. We cannot live in a future like this. You need to do everything in your power. In your power. Use your bodies, use your voices. Amplify the voice of Palestinians and do tell them that we are here because they're not doing their jobs.

[Crystal Ball]

Hueda, what do we know about what has happened?

[Tom Brokaw]

Yeah, Crystal, those images that you just showed were some of the final images and sounds that we had from our colleagues aboard the Medlean. It was, well, in international waters, some 110 miles still outside of Palestinian territorial waters, where they were headed to Gaza. Shortly after, we saw lights from Israeli commandos and the boat was hit. And then the communication was cut off. And we have not heard from them since it has been over 13 hours, we have not heard from them. We hear the Israeli government saying that they are being brought to the Israeli port of Ashdod. We need to stress that they are being taken against their will. They have been abducted unlawfully from international waters and are being taken against their will to the Israeli port of Ashdod, where the Israeli government will presumably process them. We hope that they do not further abuse them. And we continue to call on all governments, but especially the governments of these states, to sanction Israel because it continues to commit these blatant violations of international law aggression. We see what's happening in Gaza. Why we were at sea is because of our government inaction as to what is happening to Palestinian people in Gaza. And it is enough, enough silence. Israel has no legal authority to intercept a peaceful vessel sailing from international waters into Palestinian territorial waters. It says it had to uphold or defend its maritime closure of Gaza. It has no authority to enforce an unlawful blockade that is designed to starve a civilian population. Population. And there is no security threat from a sailboat that is carrying 12 civilians and baby formula for babies who are being starved to death. So our governments need to stop accepting these abuses and pretexts from Israel as it continues to trample all over international law and genocide a people while they're at it.

[Sagar Enjeti]

Hueda, can you tell us about that seizure in international waters? So this was one where the flotilla was actually outside of any recognized territory. What was the justification that was given to the flotilla for this arrest? And have you been notified yet if they're going to face prosecution and detention inside of Israel for this?

[Tom Brokaw]

Thank you for that question. Because it is so important under the UN Convention on the Law of the Seas, there is freedom of navigation on the high seas. This ship, the Medlean, was unarmed, carrying 12 civilians, including a member of the European Parliament, including a doctor and journalists and human rights advocates, and it was carrying humanitarian aid. For a people under siege, it constituted no threat. Israel had no authority to intercept it, nor to use violence to intercept it, certainly not on the high seas. But even if it had reached Palestinian territorial waters, because the International Court of Justice last year advised us that Israel's occupation, its presence in all of the occupied Palestinian territories, is unlawful. And governments have an obligation not to recognize the illegal situation that Israel has created and have a further obligation to do as much as they can, everything they can to end this illegal situation. And on top of that, Israel is instituting this comprehensive blockade that is designed to Starve an entire civilian population. That is a war crime and it is not new. We're seeing the dramatic effects of it now, of denying everything, food, water, aid, medicine to a people who have been bombarded for nearly two years. We are seeing emaciated children. We are hearing reports of countless babies who have already died of starvation. All of this being done before the eyes of the world while our governments do nothing or are actively complicit. So it is important to stress that no government has the authority to enforce an illegal blockade. And that is exactly what this is. Israel says it it's a lawful maritime closure. It is absolutely not. And no serious legal authority will tell you that this is a lawful maritime closure. And we were not even close to that border. It went out into, well into international waters over about 100 miles from Palestinian territorial waters, which is not too much different from what it did just a month ago. We had another ship that was going to head towards Gaza carrying humanitarian aid. That ship was named the Conscience, and it was right outside of Malta and in European waters, some 2,000 miles from Israeli territorial waters. And Israel sent its drones to bomb that ship. And so Israel is using this kind of unjustified force against civilian objects, against humanitarian aid workers, all to stop people from trying to get to Gaza. Again, an unlawful blockade. The Freedom Flotilla Coalition is trying to break it, but our government should be doing the same. And if they don't, we invite people all over the world to join us for the next vote we're going to send because we can't stop.

[Crystal Ball]

To that point, Greta and others on board released prerecorded videos calling on people to pressure their governments. Let's go ahead and take a listen to a little bit of what they had to say.

[I]

My name is Grifa Tber and I am from Sweden. If you see this video, we have been intercepted and kidnapped in international waters by the Israeli occupational forces or forces that support Israel. I urge all my friends, family and comrades to put pressure on the Swedish government to release me and the others.

[Crystal Ball]

As soon as possible. So my name is Reva Sefervia, I from France. If you see this video, it means that we got intercepted by the Israeli forces or complicits and we made maybe in a very bad situation now. So I do ask our comrades, our family, friends to please share this video and put pressure on the French government so that we could be with my friends released.

[Sagar Enjeti]

And also, of course, that this genocide ends.

[Crystal Ball]

Houeda, two questions for you. First, following up on what Greta was saying there, what Are you calling on people around the world to do, to support these activists and their work? And also I saw reports that there may have been coordination with some other attempts to break the siege. So what happens next?

[Tom Brokaw]

Yes, we recorded those videos because we anticipated this kind of violent interception by Israeli forces. They have attacked us before. They have seriously injured and even killed our volunteers before. Most notably in 2010, a flotilla that I was on, Israel violently raided that one and killed 10 of our volunteers. And so we pre recorded these and put this out as soon as we lost connection with them. We are asking people all over the world to call on the government of these countries to put pressure on Israel to release them immediately to guarantee their safety. And also, as you heard Reva say at the the day end of also to undertake their obligations under international law to stop this genocide. Because the very reason that we have these 12 international civilians, our colleagues now abducted by Israeli forces, is because they had to be at sea doing what our governments should be doing. And I want to stress that these 12 are now abducted or disappeared. We haven't heard from them in nearly 14 hours. Now, thousands, thousands of Palestinians, 10,000 Palestinians are also disappeared and are in Israeli dungeons. But we know that because of the privilege of the passports of the internationals and because the eyes of the world are on them and because we have thousands, tens of thousands of people mobilizing to put on these pressures, we know that they have more safety than the thousands of Palestinians and the 2 million Palestinians in Gaza, no government to speak up for them and protect them. So we are asking people to put this pressure to ensure the safety of these civilians. But also we need to keep pressure and remember why we're doing this. And that is to stop the genocide and protect the people of Gaza. And that requires governments upholding their obligations under international law. And so I mentioned that they attacked us now, but we're not going to stop. So we will be organizing to send another mission as soon as we can. We invite organizations, people and institutions that have more resources than we do to also mobilize boats and come with us. But we are also in coordination with other civil society initiatives that are aiming to break the blockade in other ways. Today, June 9, a land convoy left from Tunisia and is making its way through Libya to Egypt and hopefully on its way to Gaza. And in just a few days, thousands of people will be coming, flying into Cairo from around the world and attempting to march to Rafah, the border of Gaza with Egypt, and demand that they be let through. Because we have a situation where Israel has turned Gaza into a GAP death camp. And we have to do everything we can to break down these walls, to break the siege in any way we can. And that is civilian, nonviolent, direct action, but also the pressure of people all over the world calling on our governments to also sanction Israel and hold it responsible for what it has been doing and continues to do.

[Crystal Ball]

Hueda, thank you so much for joining us this morning. We really appreciate it.

[Sagar Enjeti]

Thank you.

[Tom Brokaw]

Thank you so much for having me. Thank you.

[Crystal Ball]

It's our pleasure.

[Sagar Enjeti]

Thank you guys so much for watching and it's great to be back. Crystal we will be back with you all tomorrow.

[Crystal Ball]

Bro show tomorrow.

[Sagar Enjeti]

Oh, is it Bro show tomorrow?

[Crystal Ball]

We're giving people a Bro show. Ryan's got something going on. We switched days this week so we'll get a Bro show ladies show and then you and me back on.

[Sagar Enjeti]

Lots of fun. Okay? We're gonna have fun this week. We're breaking things up and that's the best part of all this. BreakingPoints.com try out that free month trial. You can BP free for all of that, but otherwise it's been a pleasure. It's been great to be back with all of you and we will see you all later.

[Hueda Arif]

Hey, this is Jenny Garth from I Do Part two Ozempic in a pill. It's Oral Semaglutide and is now available from Future health. Go to futurehealth.com to get affordable access to Oral Semaglutide, Ozempic and Zepbound for only. Only $3 a day. No insurance needed. Visit futurehealth.com future without the e to start losing this week. Future Health Weight Loss Data based on independent study sponsored by Future Health Future Health is not a health care services provider. Meds are prescribed at providers discretion.

[Jenny Garth]

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[Lester Holt]

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[Crystal Ball]

This is an iHeart podcast.