← Breaking Points with Krystal and Saagar
Breaking Points with Krystal and Saagar
8/7/25: GHF Whistleblower Exposes Gaza Starvation, Trump Mysterious Answer On UFOs, Krystal Ends Cory Booker, US Labor Leader Kidnapped By Israel
00:51:41
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- [00:00]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
This is an iHeart podcast.
- [00:05]
Az Fudd
Hey guys, it's Az Fudd. You may know me as a gold medalist. You may know me as an NCAA national champion. You may even know me as a people's princess. Every week on my new podcast, Fut around and find out. I'll be talking to some special guests about pop culture, basketball and what it's like to be a professional athlete on and off the court. Listen to Futaround and find out. A production of iHeart Women's Sports in partnership with Unanimous Media on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you your podcast.
- [00:35]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
I'm Dr. Joy Hardin Bradford, host of the Therapy for Black Girls podcast. I know how overwhelming it can feel if flying makes you anxious. In session 418 of the Therapy for Black Girls podcast, Dr. Angela Neil Barnett and I discuss flight anxiety.
- [00:50]
Krystal Ball
What is not normal is to allow it to prevent you from doing the things that you want to do, the things that you were meant to do.
- [00:59]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
Listen to Therapy for Black Girls on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcast.
- [01:05]
Sagar Enjeti
It's Black Business Month and Money and.
- [01:07]
John Hope Bryant
Wealth podcast with John Hope Bryant is tapping in.
- [01:10]
Sagar Enjeti
I'm breaking down how to build wealth, create opportunities, and move from surviving to thriving. It's time to talk about ownership, equity.
- [01:18]
Krystal Ball
And everything in between.
- [01:20]
Sagar Enjeti
Black and brown communities have historically been lasting.
- [01:22]
Krystal Ball
Line.
- [01:22]
Sagar Enjeti
Let me just say this AI is moving faster than civil rights legislation ever did. Listen to Money and Wealth from the Black Effect podcast network on iHear radio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [01:35]
Krystal Ball
Hey guys, Sager and Krystal here.
- [01:36]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
Independent media just played a truly massive role in this election and we are so excited about what that means for the future of this show.
- [01:44]
Krystal Ball
This is the only place where you can find honest perspectives from the left and the right that simply does not exist anywhere else.
- [01:49]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
So if that is something that's important to you, Please go to BreakingPoints.com, become a member today and you'll get access to our full shows unedited ad free and all put together for you every morning in your inbox.
- [02:01]
Krystal Ball
We need your help to build the future of independent news media and we hope to see you@breakingpoints.com all right, let's get then to the next part here with Anthony Aguilar.
- [02:10]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
So GHF whistleblower, former Green Beret Anthony Aguilar, who we had on this show, just recorded another interview with Tucker Carlson. It was in person. It was longer than the first portion that he put out. I really recommend you go and listen to it. He reveals a lot of stunning things. He also just has so much experience in the field. The way he can describe the issues that he saw there to me was quite striking. But one of the pieces that I think needs to be explored more is what GHF is. Who is this leader? Quote unquote, Reverend Johnny Moore, evangelical leader and entrepreneur, who's at the head of it? Where has the funding been coming from? There are just so many basic questions around GHF and what it even is that I think it requires a lot more digging in. He gets into some of that with Tucker. Let's go ahead and take a listen.
- [03:00]
Anthony Aguilar
Gaza Humanitarian foundation with Johnny Moore, who, you know, if he wants to say that, that I am a liar, I think that that's, that's fair.
- [03:08]
Krystal Ball
That you're a liar.
- [03:08]
Anthony Aguilar
He has said that I'm a liar, and that's. That's unfortunate because I served in the army for 25 years, answered the call not just once, twice, three, four times, but 12 to fight in battle for the ideals of this nation. So for him to call me a liar, I think that all veterans and all Americans should take pause and think about who's calling me a liar. Someone that has spent his entire life self serving with PR firms and selling Bibles and whatever else it is he does on the side. So what's interesting is that this entire time that this operation's been going on now for, you know, operating since the 26th of May till now, so breaking 70 days. He's only been there one time for a photo op. I find it appalling.
- [03:56]
Krystal Ball
He doesn't work out of Gaza.
- [03:57]
Anthony Aguilar
Absolutely not.
- [03:58]
Krystal Ball
He's. I should say. We've put in three interview requests for Johnny Moore.
- [04:02]
Anthony Aguilar
He's not even in Israel.
- [04:05]
Krystal Ball
Oh. So how is he running the Gaza Humanitarian foundation from.
- [04:10]
Anthony Aguilar
From his flat in Virginia, I guess. What it feels like to me is that the Gaza Humanitarian foundation is a side project, resume item for Mr. Johnny Moore. It's not something that he's dedicated to and it's not something that he has the expertise and the acumen to understand how to run.
- [04:35]
Krystal Ball
Does he have any background in distributing humanitarian relief that you know of?
- [04:39]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
No.
- [04:40]
Anthony Aguilar
It's so many things that the, the experts within the United nations that, that are educated, that, that spend their lives to become experts in, are very, very, very good at doing so. To think that we can just take that on and do it is. It's very. It's a very arrogant way of looking at.
- [05:01]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
And one of the things that he said in that interview to Sagr is that in all the members that. And all the meetings he had with members of Congress, they asked the same thing. So now there's been $30 million from the state Department that has gone in. That's all we know of the funding. Johnny Moore, who is the. This evangelical Christian leader of GHF who took over after the original head, Jake Wood, resigned before the thing was even operational, basically was like, I'm not gonna be associated with this. So Johnny Moore got asked about the funding, refused to reveal what the sources were, and said that to the best of his knowledge, it was not being funded directly by the Israeli government, which.
- [05:41]
Krystal Ball
They'Ve now acknowledged is not even true. But yes.
- [05:43]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
And so. And Tony, what he attested to as well is that functionally on the ground, they consider the IDF the client. They do whatever the IDF wants them to do, down to here's how many trucks, here's what time you're opening the distribution center. And then when he was asking about, hey, what are the. You know, what are the operating for? Like, how do we operate in this arena? They, oh, we'll just do what the IDF is doing. And he was told directly they are the client. So you have American mercenaries with zero legal protection coming in on a tourist visa being handed fully automatic weapons, which. Another extraordinary part here is he talks about how they never qualify on these weapons. They're handed these guns that they've never used before, and just like, just do what the IDF is doing out there.
- [06:29]
Krystal Ball
Yeah, it is, Abs. So that part, increasingly, I remember it struck me in our interview, I was like, wait, what? I was like, you're on tours. What did he say? He was like a J1 visa. And then he's like, next thing I know, I'm in an up armored Humvee with a fully automatic weapon with a uniform. One of the things actually we talked about a little bit with Tony afterwards is that he. In his uniform, they had American flag patches that were put on them. He's not an American soldier. It's like, what's going on here?
- [06:54]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
He wanted them intentionally to look like. And it was the Israelis who insisted on the American flag on the fake military uniform.
- [07:00]
Krystal Ball
So they're flagging them. I mean, they're basically trying to dress them up in all of the uniform of the US Military. And then he talked previously about the IDF being the client. You know, that was one of the revelations that came out of that. I think this is a very important interview for people to just understand how absolutely Insane. It is. And especially as we continue to talk about Israel occupying Gaza, Trump gave the green light yesterday. He's like, israel can do whatever it wants to do. It'll be up to them. It's like, well, this is what it looks like when it's up to them. Yeah, this is what it all looks like.
- [07:28]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
Well, and not to mention, go ahead and put C4 up on the screen. So Bezalel Smotrich, who is one of the most extreme members of an extraordinarily extreme government in Israel, previously was completely opposed to any aid going into the Gaza Strip. He was opposed the Gaza humanitarian fashion, opposed to any and all aid going in, and was so outraged by it that he was extracting concessions from Netanyahu after he was put under pressure to allow a little more aid in. He was extracting concessions from Netanyahu to allow that plan to go forward. He's now done a 180 and says, well, actually, I now understand that the quote, unquote, Gaza Humanitarian foundation, this isn't about feeding the population. He says, quote, it's not money for humanitarian aid, it's money for winning the war. Had we controlled the humanitarian aid to Gaza, we would have won the war a while ago. This fits directly with what Aguilar has been attesting to, which is that this is not an aid operation, this is a shaping operation. And these are designed intentionally as death traps to lure people in, to control them, to force them into, you know, dangerous situations. I mean, of course we know about the outright massacres that are occurring on a near daily basis in the context of the so called distribution of aid. But this is all about pulling and pushing the population and controlling them. That's what this is. And that's what Smotrich is just saying now, out in the open. Oh, you know, actually now I get it. This isn't money for humanitarian assistance. This is money to win the war. So that's what they're saying. Which again, wholly and completely backs up what Anthony Aguilar saw when he was on the ground. He also made a really interesting comment about what he thinks is likely to happen again. Remember former green beret, served 12 different tours of duty, nine combat tours, like, has seen everything you can see in I don't know how many countries around the world. And he says they need to think about, okay, there's a difference between when you're in an offensive military position versus when you are in a permanent occupation and what you're likely to see on once you shift to permanent occupation is actually Much more violence, much more of the guerrilla warfare. And that, that's, you know, exactly what happened in Iraq that he experienced directly. Let's go ahead and take a Listen. This is C2. Let's go ahead and take a listen to what he had to say about that.
- [09:55]
Anthony Aguilar
In the coming days and weeks as this operation, as Operation Gideon's Chariots has ended and the Israeli army has to refit into this restructuring for occupation, which is a whole new ball game. I mean, Occupational Army, US Army, World War II, US Army Post Invasion of Iraq. That's when things get really nasty. That's when things get really gray. We think that things are complicated and complex now. Wait until you put an occupation army under the streets of Gaza. So right now, if I were Hamas, while the active war is going on the offensive, I'm laying low, I'm hiding, I'm gonna come out and get killed. When the occupation begins, that's when the, the insurgency presents itself in armed violence.
- [10:43]
Krystal Ball
Yeah, that's when you have permanent bases.
- [10:45]
Anthony Aguilar
It's going to get blown up, violent, and it's going to get deadly and as the. Well, more deadly. And if the United States doesn't set a firm tone of what's acceptable and what's not, no longer can we have this IDF do what you will, and we'll just kind of, we'll play back up. No, we cannot. The president of the United States needs to set clear, firm expectations and boundaries with our ally. Because this occupation, two things will happen. One, it's going to become extremely violent, grotesquely violent. Markava tanks being blown up on the Salah Ad Din road going into Gaza. The Israelis won't like it. But then also when forces begin to go into Gaza City and people, other people start to see the amount of starvation and destitute and destruction, it's going to bring the world to its knees. And it's not going to be a year from now, it's not going to be months from now, days from now.
- [11:54]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
It's going to bring the world to its knees, is what he says. And you know, the point he makes there about the occupying force and the level of violence that's likely to spike. It's incredibly obvious. It just had. It wasn't something that I had really thought through as a civilian. But of course, that would follow the pattern of past invasions that we've seen unfold.
- [12:12]
Krystal Ball
Yeah, it is true. Well, I mean, part of the reason why I'm not so sure is that the Israelis have never behave this way insofar in their conduct of Gaza, they just have determined that starvation and mass bombing is easier. So when they say occupation, is it going to be the type of occupation that a normal Western army would pursue or would it just be complete mass expulsion from whatever area they're so called occupying? I think that's part of the problem. And my baseline assumption is that considering the way they've conducted themselves now over the last two years, that's probably the way they would go just to minimize their own casualties. But it would, of course, be the most barbaric and the horrific. But I think Tony's point broadly about what people will see as that happens is already materializing with the pictures of the aid drops. With the pictures. I mean, what else? Like the pictures of the aid drops with even some of the photos of the aid distribution and others that's coming out, it's already stomach turning. I mean, it's already to the point where, you know, I have never seen anything like the collapse of support around the issue just in the last two weeks. Yeah, it's extraordinary, shocking. And that's just from the images that are coming out. And because of people like Tony.
- [13:23]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
Yeah, it's just a question of, like, the public is repulsed, the world is horrified, but is anyone gonna do anything? And that's the question. And that's where I'm not hopeful. I mean, Trump has said Israel Trump has apparently given the green light for the complete occupation invasion expulsion plan. He's been giving it publicly for however long he's been in office at this point, talking about, you know, the Gaza Lago plan. And at first we were like, oh, you can't take him seriously. Like, clearly you should take him seriously. And that is exactly what's being effectuated now today in the Israeli security cabinet, they are voting on the complete annihilation plan. On the, okay, we're going to just occupy the whole thing that's happening today. So again, when people try to play plausible deniability, oh, no, they're really trying to feed them. They're just, you know, they've just in over their heads and they don't know what they're doing. No, they have a plan. They are effectuating that plan and they are doing it quite expediently. They are accomplishing exactly the goals that they want to accomplish, and it is not an accident whatsoever. Zatteo also had a scoop regarding some of the leaders involved in this whole Gaza humanitarian foundation and contractor ecosystem. We could put C3 up on the screen. And this was candidly, this was something that Tony had mentioned to us off camera when we were in studio and Zateo was able to chase down the details here. So they say contractor leading security for Gaza aid sites is part of the Infidels biker group that seeks to fight Islamic extremism. And basically this is like an Islamophobic motorcycle club. And this guy's involved with it and now he's the lead of one of the contractors that is under the Gaza Humanitarian Foundation. Tony also pointed out that this dude had been temporarily debarred from contracting with the US Military at all. According to military documents, he was debarred in June of 2005 after he received non judicial punishment pursuant to USC MJ Article 15 for conspiracy to commit bribery, larceny and making false official punishment statements. Just to give you a sense of some of the characters who are involved with this supposed aid distribution, let's go ahead and put C5 up on the screen. This speaks to what I was just talking about, about what they're voting on in the Israeli security cabinet today. And Dropsite pulled this and you've got the translation on the screen here. But I'll just read you a little bit of what this Israeli reporter is saying. So this is Amit segal on channel 12. He reports Israel is preparing to occupy Gaza City in a phased operation beginning with a mass evacuation of its residents, currently estimated at roughly a million people. Plan will be presented to Israel's security cabinet today. He says they're going to issue an advance evacuation notice, delay combat for several weeks to allow construction of camps and field hospitals in central Gaza. Gaza City is described as the symbol of the Strip. Its capture is the first step in what Siegel calls a good few weeks of operations, not months. Trump is expected to give a speech in parallel announcing an increase in GHF aid centers. As for the Israeli captain, Siegel claims most are no longer in Gaza City and that Hamas has previously moved captives when IDF forces approached. That's attempt to assuage the, you know, logical conclusion that, oh, probably a lot of captives are going to end up dead here. Plan stopped short of a full Gaza reoccupation for now, but is intended to bring Hamas to surrender after the fall of Gaza City. So that's what we can expect to unfold here shortly.
- [16:56]
Krystal Ball
Yeah, it's really, I mean, it's just, it's one of those where we just, we don't fully know yet what's going to happen. But I just think it's going to be completely insane because Trump continues to give the blank check. And I mean, in some ways like have the way that it was currently being sold, Gaza, Lago and all that. It would be horrific. But the current policy is to basically just give Israel a blank check and total freedom of action. And that actually could lead to the worst outcome where obviously we'd have no journalists who are inside of the country, no scrutiny for looking at it. A total blank check from America. So it would be all the devastation and no even like small d Democratic check from our own government over what's going on.
- [17:38]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
Yeah, and just to be clear, there are. I mean, there are plenty of Palestinian journalists on the ground. It's just they're routinely disbelieved and so, you know, unfortunately. And also routinely murdered. I mean, we've had hundreds, hundreds of Palestinian journalists targeted and murdered with scarcely a word from their colleagues in the Western press.
- [18:01]
Krystal Ball
Except. Yeah, so Trey Angst and a few people at the Committee of Professional Journalists. That's basically.
- [18:05]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
That's about it. Yeah, that's about it. Oh, and by the way, Fox News just put out this whole GHF propaganda piece. Guess who wasn't the reporter on that.
- [18:11]
Krystal Ball
Yeah, I know.
- [18:12]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
Was not Trey Yings.
- [18:13]
Krystal Ball
I know.
- [18:13]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
I saw. Very noteworthy there. Yeah, of course, I think they had Bill Hemmer go and like, oh, the Israeli propaganda line with regard to what's going on there. But in any case, unfortunately, because the Palestinian journalists are just so routinely invisibilized, slaughtered and disbelieved, I do think it will matter if Western journalists were actually allowed in. And the fact that we've gotten these few aerial photos, aerial videos, the fact that you have this former Green Beret coming forward in shock and horror at what he's seeing on the ground there, I do think that it is starting to break through in terms of the public consciousness. But it's also like, here we are with them voting on the complete annihilation, complete ethnic cleansing, final solution plan. And Trump certainly doesn't seem. He embraces it. They're not at odds. He embraces it. He supports it. He has told Bibi that he can do whatever he needs to do. So that's where we are.
- [19:09]
Krystal Ball
Yep. It's not good. Tomorrow. Yeah, as you said, we'll cover. So there's some great Bill Ackman posting where Ryan got him to back down, which is pretty fantastic.
- [19:19]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
Ryan's so goat.
- [19:20]
Krystal Ball
Ryan is the goat. Yeah, we can agree certainly on that.
- [19:24]
Az Fudd
Hey, guys, it's Az Fudd. You may know me as a gold medalist, you may know me as an NCAA national champion and recent most outstanding player. You may even know me as a people's princess. But now you're also going to know me as your favorite host. Every week on my new podcast, Fut around and Find Out, I'll give you an inside look at everything happening in my crazy life as I try to balance it all, from my travels across the globe to preparing for another run at the natty with my YouTube UConn Huskies, to just trying to make it to my midterms on time. You'll get the inside scoop on everything. I'll be talking to some special guests about pop culture, basketball and what it's like to be a professional athlete on and off the court. You'll even get to have some fun with the Fudd family. So if you follow me on social media or watch me on tv, you may think you know me, but this show is the only place where you can really fut around and find out. Listen to Fut around and Find Out. A production of iHeart Women's Sports in partnership with Unanimous Media on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [20:25]
Dana Schwartz
In 1920, a magazine article announced something incredible. Two young girls had photographed real fairies. But even more extraordinary than the magazine articles claim was the identity of the man who wrote the article. Sir Arthur Conan Doyle. The man who wrote Sherlock Holmes. Yes, the man who invented literature's most brilliant detective was fooled by two girls into thinking fairies were real. How did they do it? And why does it seem like so many smart people keep falling for outlandish tricks? These are the questions we explore in Hoax, a new podcast from me, Dana Schwartz, the host of Noble Blood, and me, Lizzy Logan. Every episode we'll explore one of the most audacious and ambitious tricks in history, from the fake Shakespeares to balloon boys, and try to answer the question of why we believe what we believe. Listen to Hoax on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [21:31]
Radhi Devlukia
Hey, I'm Radhi devlukia and I'm the host of a really good Cry podcast and I have the opportunity to talk to Dr. Julie Smith. Julie is a clinical psychologist, a best selling author, and one of the most trusted voices in mental health online. She was one of the first therapists to use TikTok as an educational platform and since then she has built a global audience of nearly 10 million people by making emotional support accessible, honest, and deeply human.
- [21:56]
Julie Smith
You know, resentment isn't something that the world owes you, it's that, you know, something that you need to work on. I would say with this stuff is look out for those feelings of resentment because they're a sign that there was some sort of boundary that wasn't held before, you know, that, that if you're not asserting your own desires or wishes or needs and then resenting your partner or your friend for filling the space for you, then it comes back to, okay, well what do you want? That's not this.
- [22:26]
Radhi Devlukia
Listen to a really good cry on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [22:33]
Krystal Ball
All right, so we don't have a lot, but thanks to Miranda Devine over at the New York Post, recently sat with Donald Trump and with Tulsi Gabbard and to her credit, actually followed up on the New Jersey drone situation and got some very mysterious answers from the two of them. Let's start with Trump's.
- [22:52]
Julie Smith
I wanted to ask you about drones. You know, we had the issue in.
- [22:56]
Krystal Ball
New Jersey before the election where there are all these people thought UFOs or an attack of the killer drones.
- [23:03]
Julie Smith
And I believe you're doing something about.
- [23:06]
Krystal Ball
Yeah.
- [23:06]
Julie Smith
What are you doing?
- [23:07]
Krystal Ball
I, I, well, I know who, I can't tell you what, who it was and what it was, but I can't really tell you. I'd love to tell you actually, but it's not a, it's not a big deal.
- [23:15]
Julie Smith
It's not, not, not something frightening.
- [23:18]
Krystal Ball
No. But I just, you know, so obviously it's some, something that I know about and it's not a problem at all. It was legal. Oh yeah. That was Lego. So as you can see, just overwhelmed.
- [23:29]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
By the transparency of this administration.
- [23:31]
Krystal Ball
Well, UFO people are mad because, you know, here's the thing that I've realized what the Trump people did, cuz this fits with Epstein. They winked at large parts of the Internet and they made people very excited.
- [23:41]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
Yeah.
- [23:42]
Krystal Ball
And then they came in and it's the same old crap. Right? So here he says, I can't tell you what it was. I'd love to tell you actually, but it's not a big deal. It's not a problem at all.
- [23:51]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
Okay.
- [23:52]
Krystal Ball
I mean, you can't take a whole lot of that to the bank. But I actually thought that Tulsi Gabbard's comments were the most interesting. Obviously she's the Director of National Intelligence. Here's what she had to say. Strange objects over New Jersey were drones. I still have a lot of questions around that. Yeah, you know, I've, I've heard, I've heard what the, the public official line is. I, I just Personally still have a lot of questions that are unanswered. Yeah. Because it wasn't just New Jersey. It was happening in different parts of the country. Oh, really? Yeah. Happened in different parts of the country. Wasn't just New Jersey. I mean, you'll remember we covered it here. Remember, we had Rich, by the way, for the skeptical, as I know you are. Remember what Rich McHugh had to say here about how the state cops, local police were all freaked out. The orbs, the drones, whatever they were. Then it eventually came out from Trump. And what did he say? He was like, oh, well, we knew what they were all along. We couldn't just tell you. I don't believe that for a second. There was also. What was it? An Iranian mothership was off the coast at one point, which was floated by a Republican congressman. Yes, the Iranian military, which really proved itself during the 12 Day War. If he put that all together. We still have no idea. I mean, listen, everyone. Everyone I know is going to the Black Project theory, you know, the secret government and all that. It is theoretically possible. I remain deeply skeptical just because, again, of the way that we saw movement, of the way that the federal government also initially reacted. It was incredibly sketchy. There was no, like, FAA guidance or anything that had been issued. Also, just in the way that the drone, whatever the objects, the way that they operated whenever they were approached, you know, by the state and local aircraft and by law enforcement. It remains one of the craziest episodes, I think, you know, in more recent, like, UFO memory. And of course, you know, it just gets totally put under the rug. What do you think?
- [25:48]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
Yeah. And to your point about winking at the Internet, you know, with Epstein, specifically with Trump, it was more of a wink because he always was a little like, well, I don't know, and privacy and maybe not UFOs. He was explicit.
- [26:01]
Krystal Ball
Yeah, I know.
- [26:01]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
I pulled up the quote from 2024, Lex Friedman podcast. He promised, if elected, he would push the Pentagon to release more UFOs footage. He stated, oh, yeah, sure, I'll do that. I would do that. I'd love to do that. I have to do that. So this isn't one where he was kind of. And people around him were more pushing it. No, he. Whenever he got asked this question, he was very direct. And so here we are in August of 2025 and August 7th of 2025, and now it's. Well, I can't tell you, but trust me, there's nothing to worry about here.
- [26:33]
Krystal Ball
I mean, one of RFK jr's Advice. Do you remember Bob Malone? He was on the RFK podcast or, sorry, on the Joe Rogan podcast. He's the guy who did the mass psychosis.
- [26:42]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [26:43]
Krystal Ball
The inventor of mRNA, whatever. All right, so he's, he's a. I believe he was appointed to a position by RFK Jr. So he recently said on a podcast that RFK Jr. Had, quote, received a classified briefing on UFOs, UAPs and whether they could be interdimensional beings or time travelers. Malone said that a federal investigator told him, quote, alien encounters are ramping up and confirms that they are real. Listen, you can, you know, I don't know whether that's true or not. RFK Jr. Has come out. He has himself. You know, we could take a look at his credibility. But he's definitely somebody who is in the room on the issue. And if I put it together with the public comments, it still remains one of total mystery. Just in the way that they ran on the issue. They said they would release it. There has not been one thing that has been released yet. We got the MLK files before we got the ufo and the MK was asking files. So we're all aware. And there is still quite a lot of movement at the whistleblower and other level inside of Congress. There has been multiple pieces now of legislation. We're just supposed to compel the Pentagon. By the way, I've been checking up on this. I haven't heard yet whether Pete Hegseth or anyone on their team is doing really much on the UFO issue. I don't think that. And you have to dig deep on this stuff as we're all showing. You know, with the Epstein files, it took hundreds of FBI agents weeks, if not months to compile all this stuff from everywhere. And then apparently they were finding things in different areas. That's what they're claiming about Russiagate too. And that's, you know, surface level political scandals or just imagine on this particular issue. But anyway, I mean, I think it's an issue for transparency. The vice President recently was on a podcast talking about it as well. Here's what he had to say. There are stories that I am particularly focused on in part just because you talk with your buddies about it. Like I'm obsessed with the whole UFO thing. What's actually going on?
- [28:32]
John Hope Bryant
What were those videos all about?
- [28:34]
Krystal Ball
What's actually happening? I haven't gotten to the bottom of.
- [28:36]
John Hope Bryant
It yet, but we're only six months in.
- [28:37]
Krystal Ball
We've been very busy, actually. The August recess is in part me going to Try to dive to the bottom of the whole UFO thing last year. So, I mean, you got to have us back. Okay, I'll let you know. So will we ever hear about it again? I'm still, you know, remain a bit skeptical. One of the reasons why, and I've talked about this before, John Podesta, who was the White House chief of staff under Bill Clinton, huge UFO guy. He actually tried to figure it out. He writes about it in his book. Basically at every turn, they were like, don't worry about it. And Bill Clinton, he even said it himself. Bill Clinton was like, I'm embarrassed to say. I tried to find out. And they basically didn't tell me what was going on.
- [29:14]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
You two should. Bill Clinton, how's my just learning this?
- [29:17]
Krystal Ball
Well, I don't do it very often. It's, you know, we're not on the 90s. Imagine if we were broadcasting on Lewinsky. He's like, oh, embarrass. A second thought was going on. But that's what he said. Obama, remember in his interview on. He was like, well, I can't tell you, you know, in terms of what he had to say about the issue. And now we have Trump and basically every successive person, even the vice president, top level political appointees. You genuinely do need, like a strike team of people. Plus, you need more people in the government to come forward.
- [29:44]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
I like Tulsi. Tulsi's my favorite. She's literally the Director of National Intelligence. And she's like, I still have a lot of questions.
- [29:50]
Krystal Ball
See, I hate when you do that.
- [29:51]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
See, it pisses me off, too, because.
- [29:53]
Krystal Ball
Now you have power.
- [29:54]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
This is so common, not just the Trump administration, with all sorts of politicians who, oh, gosh, I wish someone in power would do something.
- [30:00]
Krystal Ball
It's like, that's your job.
- [30:01]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
This is your fricking job. Like, what are you talking about? You still have. Good. Then go ask the questions. Go get the answers. That's the whole reason you were supposed to be put in there. And yet there she is, just playing helpless, like she has no power, no ability to do anything, which maybe she doesn't. I don't know. But if she doesn't, then she should admit that, too.
- [30:18]
Krystal Ball
I was gonna say, though, she remembers she said that about the Epstein thing as well. Whenever I think it was Charlie spearing shout out who asked her. He's like, do you have any, you know, information that Epstein is an intelligence asset? And she's like, well, I haven't seen anything like that. It's like, well, have you looked for it, you know, have anybody asked about it?
- [30:34]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
I don't say that. Yeah, I don't know. I haven't seen anything. It's like haven't looked, wouldn't look for it.
- [30:40]
Krystal Ball
Right? It's like, well yeah, you're not going to know unless you try to look for it. And yeah, anyway, I mean if you just look at the history and the way that they're all talking about the issue, they're winking, they're nodding and I don't know whether it's to drive up actually, I don't think so because they are not volunteering the information. It's Miranda Devine who pressed on two of them. Both of them basically gave cover up like answers. JD's always had kind of an interest in the UFO issue. But also we have to be honest. It's like the Vice President doesn't have the power. Like you need a full on commitment from the dni, from the sec, def. You know, who knows what Pete Hegseth has going on in his building right now. Would his generals even tell him the truth? I do not have any confidence basically in the way that he is running his building right now.
- [31:22]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
He's got other problems.
- [31:23]
Krystal Ball
Yeah, he's got way bigger problems in terms of how he's operating inside. So anyway, I think that's really all we unfortunately have. I would ask, you know, people in the White House and others if you do have public pressure or you know, future hearings, things like that. I know that there's some rumbling about that, but almost all of them really have been stopped in their tracks. And there are well meaning people in Congress who have been trying on the issue, but an individual member of Congress, as we've shown repeatedly, they have no power.
- [31:50]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
Little power.
- [31:50]
Krystal Ball
Yeah, very little. You know.
- [31:52]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
You know what I think they should do, Sagar, if they really want to put this to bed?
- [31:55]
Krystal Ball
What?
- [31:55]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
I think they should issue a two page memo that says there's nothing to see here.
- [31:59]
Krystal Ball
Well, they've done it close.
- [32:00]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
They were put down a video that they claim is raw footage but is actually highly edited and missing key portions of the video and lie about that as well. I think that will really tamp down publications.
- [32:09]
Krystal Ball
What you're describing is literally what they have done on the UFO issue. They did that before with the Pentagon. Remember the headline? They do it every time. No evidence of aliens. It's like, well there's no evidence. It's not. There's no evidence of what the fuck it is. All right, so you can't tell us what it is. And they're like, well, there's 14 incidents or whatever, which we can't explain in any way whatsoever. But there's no evidence that it's aliens. And it's like, well, what is the evidence of what it is? Finally. God. What is the name of the James Fox documentary? I always want people to watch this one. I'll look it up. Is it Moment of Contact? I think that's what it's called. Moment of Contact.
- [32:42]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
Moment of Contact, Yep.
- [32:44]
Krystal Ball
I dare you to watch that and not believe in UFOs. I dare you.
- [32:48]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
That's the one about Brazil, right?
- [32:50]
Krystal Ball
Yeah, the Brazil Bargini. I'm serious. You have 10 minutes. You cannot watch it and tell me that UFOs are not real. You can't. You can't. All right. And then he's got multiple follow ups. The phenomenon, so many others. All of James films are absolutely incredible. So that's my last plug. Go ahead and watch it for yourself and you make up your mind.
- [33:07]
Az Fudd
Hey, guys, it's Az Fudd. You may know me as a gold medalist. You may know me as an NCAA national champion and recent most outstanding player. You may even know me as a people's princess. But now you're also gonna know me. Me as your favorite host. Every week on my new podcast, Fut around and Find Out. I'll give you an inside look at everything happening in my crazy life as I try to balance it all, from my travels across the globe to preparing for another run at the natty with my UConn Huskies, to just trying to make it to my midterms on time. You'll get the inside scoop on everything. I'll be talking to some special guests about pop culture, basketball and what it's like to be a professional athlete on and off the court. You'll even get to have have some fun with the Fudd family. So if you follow me on social media or watch me on tv, you may think you know me, but this show is the only place where you can really fud around and find out. Listen to FUD around and find out. A production of iHeart Women's Sports in partnership with Unanimous Media on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [34:08]
Dana Schwartz
Have you ever looked at a piece of abstract art or music or poetry and thought that's just a bunch of pretentious nonsense? Well, that's exactly what two bored Australian soldiers set out to prove during World War II when they pulled off what was either a bold literary hoax or a grand poetic experiment. Publishing over a dozen intentionally bad but highly acclaimed works of expressionist poetry under the name Ern Malley. In an incident that caused a media firestorm and even a criminal trial, the Ern Malley episode made fools of believers and critics alike and still fascinates poetry lovers to this day. We break down the truth, the lies, and the poetry in between on Hoax, a new podcast hosted by me, Lizzie Logan, and me, Dana Schwartz. Every episode, Hoax explores an audacious fraud or ruse from history, from forged artworks to the original fake news. To try and answer why we believe, listen to Hoax on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [35:07]
Radhi Devlukia
Hey, I'm Radhi Devlukia and I'm the host of a really good Cry podcast and I have the opportunity to talk to Dr. Julie Smith. Julie is a clinical psychologist, a best selling author, and one of the most trusted voices in mental health online. She was one of the first therapists to use TikTok as an educational platform, and since then, she has built a global audience of nearly 10 million people by making emotional support accessible, honest, and deeply human.
- [35:32]
Julie Smith
You know, resentment isn't something that, that the world owes you, it's that, you know, something that you need to work on. I would say with this stuff is look out for those feelings of resentment because they're a sign that there was some sort of boundary that wasn't held before. You know, that. That if you're not asserting your own desires or wishes or needs and then resenting your partner or your friend for filling the space for you, then it comes back to, okay, well, what do you want that's not this.
- [36:02]
Radhi Devlukia
Listen to a really good cry on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [36:09]
Krystal Ball
Crystal, what are you taking a look at? Wow, I haven't said that in a while.
- [36:12]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
Well, in a Senate that is full of amoral psychopathic monsters, it can be difficult to choose among the various odious figures who should truly reach the S tier of villainy. You've got your proudly genocidal types like John Fetterman. You've got your Islamophobic pro crypto sellouts like Kirsten Gillibrand. But in terms of the Democratic caucus, at least in my humble opinion, Cory Booker is the worst. He is just the fucking worst. Booker combines theatrical vacuous preening with corporate slavishness with moral horrors for a total package that is thoroughly and completely repugnant. Please, for the love of God, someone decent primary this man. So the problems with Cory Booker of course, they're nothing new. I actually attended a wedding that he officiated once and I swear to God, the first maybe 20 minutes of the ceremony he spent describing his own personal faith journey. Leave it to Cory Booker to make a wedding about himself instead of, I don't know, maybe the bride and groom. I am also old enough to remember when Booker went on Meet the Press as a top Obama surrogate to decry that campaign's attacks on Mitt Romney's Bain Capital private equity record. This was really something as far as.
- [37:25]
John Hope Bryant
That stuff, I have to just say from a very personal level, I'm not about to sit here and indict private equity. To me, it's just we're getting to a ridiculous point in America, especially that I know I live in a state where pension funds, unions and other people are investing in companies like Bain Capital. If you look at the totality of Bain Capital's record, they've done a lot to support businesses, to grow businesses. And this, to me, I'm very uncomfortable. This kind of stuff is nauseating to me on both sides. It's nauseating to the American public. Enough is enough. Stop attacking. Stop attacking private equity. Stop attacking Jeremiah Wright. This stuff has got to stop. Because what it does is it undermines to me what this country should be focused on. It's a distraction from the real issues. It's either gonna be a small campaign about this crap or it's gonna be a big campaign, in my opinion, about the issues that American public cares about.
- [38:11]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
Nauseating. Okay. The Obama campaign and Democratic based backlash against Cory Booker was swift. After those comments, I remember a sweaty, nervous Rachel Maddow interview he did in the aftermath of those comments to try to clean it up. But he never really fully recanted. It was a very revealing episode because it broadcast that he was willing to take the heat even against Obama, the most beloved figure in the Democratic Party, in order to defend the honor of capital. His mentality is donor first through and through, but wrapped in a shoddy veneer of supposed progressivism. Booker's not stupid, though. Unlike some of his duller compatriots who thought that there was political advantage to be gained from playing footsie with MAGA like, let's say, Gavin Newsom having Charlie Kirk and Steve Bannon on his podcast or all of the Doge caucus people, Booker recognized pretty quickly in Trump 2.0 that the Democratic base was desperate for figures who would stand up and fight the Trump administration. So what did Cory Booker do? Well, he strapped on an adult diaper and took to the floor of the Senate for an epic filibuster, boldly speaking truth to power for hour after hour after hour, excoriating the Trump administration, promising to fight their power grab at every turn, eventually breaking the record for the longest ever floor speech. Maybe we thought this man has turned a page, maybe he's decided to rise the historical moment to put grassroots democracy over donor driven capitulation. But even in this speech marathon, the red flags were pretty clear. First of all, it wasn't actually a filibuster as it wasn't blocking any actual action. Second, he used some of his time to embrace abundance, the big money backed neoliberal rebrand dedicated to putting a glossy new sheen on status quo politics. Finally, he swiftly moved from declaring all out war on the Trump administration to voting to confirm justice involved person and Trump family relative Charles Kushner as ambassador to France, demonstrating just how committed Booker really is to actually fighting Trump administration nepotism and thuggery. The Kushner vote was particularly egregious given that he was convicted of some pretty wild crimes in Booker's own home state of New Jersey. You guys can go and look that one up. In fact, only a handful of Senate Democrats have supported more Trump nominees than Cory Booker has. The man who theatrically pledged to fight the Trump administration relentlessly. Booker is apparently all resistance in the streets, but capitulation in the sheets. The dude is also utterly shameless too. When the Newark mayor and New Jersey congressional members were arrested attempting to examine an ICE detention facility, Booker of course nowhere to be found. When other members were flying to El Salvador to demand the release of innocents from a slave labor camp, Booker was reported to be planning a trip, but seemingly quashed it when Hakeem Jeffries told Democrats that they needed to back off the case. So while substantive action has ranged from non existent to outright complicit, theatrics have certainly continued. Most recently, Booker got into an intentionally noisy spat with Senator Amy Klobuchar. Apparently Booker was looking to grandstand over some provisional policing bill. Klobuchar was pissed off and disgusted with this little performance because he actually couldn't be bothered to show up for the committee vote when said provision was actually being discussed and voted on. So here is a snippet of Booker's outburst.
- [41:22]
John Hope Bryant
I was just called out by name and I want to respond. I don't need somebody implying in any way that this is not vital to me and my state, that we have resources for our police officers. But what I am tired of is when the President of the United States of America violates the Constitution, trashes our norms and traditions, and what does the Democratic Party do? Comply? Allow him beg for scraps?
- [41:55]
Krystal Ball
No.
- [41:56]
John Hope Bryant
I demand justice. It's time for Democrats to have a backbone. It's time for us to fight. It's time for us to draw lines. And when it comes to the safety of my state being denied these grants, that's why I'm standing here. Don't question my integrity. Don't question my motives. I'm standing for Jersey. I am standing for my police officers. I'm standing for the Constitution. And I'm standing for what's right.
- [42:20]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
Standing for what's right, you say? Well, it will surprise no one to learn that shortly after this tour de force of moral preening, I believe in front of an empty chamber, by the way, Booker would once again vote to ship offensive weapons to Israel so they can continue their campaign of terror against starving Palestinian children. What clarity, what courage, what incredible moral leadership. And truly it is With Israel's genocide in Gaza, where Booker has reached his final, most despicable form, it will not surprise you to learn that he is a top recipient of Israel lobby funds. And he he votes and acts accordingly. In seemingly every instance, he's been enthusiastic in efforts to criminalize criticism and boycotts of Israel. He goes that extra mile by attending AIPAC policy conferences. He even gushed in leaked audio about how he texts back and forth with AIPAC's president like they're a couple of teenagers. Par for the course, I guess, for someone with an apparent multi decade close friendship with the utterly reprehensible Rabbi Shmuley. Here they are together horsing around at a Purim party at Oxford in 1993. By all accounts, the two were extremely close friends for decades, falling out, according to Booker, over Shmuley being so self promoting that even Cory Booker couldn't quite take it. I guess the man does have some limits, apparently. But Booker's ironclad commitment to Israel has outlasted his Shmuley bromance. In fact, perhaps nothing so accurately encapsulates the putrid essence of Cory Booker as this photo with wanted war criminal Benjamin Netanyahu back when he was in town just a few weeks ago. Corey has the intellect to know a photo op with BB probably a bad look while babies are literally being starved. So he hides his face, but he lacks the integrity to actually buck his donors. So there Corey is in the photo, lamely trying to hide behind someone. Now he claims the photographer positioned him this way. Okay, now it goes without saying you'd be hard pressed to identify a more monstrous and destructive figure in the entire world than Netanyahu. And yet here is self anointed moral warrior Cory Booker meeting with modern day Hitler so he can hear the latest Hasbara talking points about how children with pre existing conditions don't really count as starving. Or how American Jews voting for Zoran are actually Hamas. Speaking of Zoran, guess who refuses to get behind the Democratic nominee for New York City in spite of a resounding 12 point victory? You guessed it, Mr. Courageous himself, Cory Booker.
- [44:46]
Krystal Ball
About mom, Donnie, are you going to support him?
- [44:48]
John Hope Bryant
I have learned a long time ago, let New York politics be New York politics. We got enough challenges in Jersey. I got a governor's race, I'm supporting Mikey Sherrill, I got legislative races. That's where my energy is going to go going into November. New York City, I love you. You're my neighbor. You're about 10 miles from where I live. You guys figure out your elections, I'm going to focus on mine.
- [45:08]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
Would you be surprised if I informed you that his don't endorse in New York rule is not some consistent Booker anti meddling policy? In fact, for years Cory Booker ran a PAC that endorsed Democrats in races across the country. And he currently sits on the board of the PAC Democrats for Education Reform, a group founded by billionaire and former mayoral candidate Whitney Tilson and which endorses candidates who are against teachers unions and generally in favor of charter schools. He's got no problem endorsing candidates in New York or in any other state, by the way. He just doesn't want to support this particular candidate. Given Cory's delight at texting like a teenager with AIPAC and his close association with billionaire Zionist Whitney Tilson, who made his whole mayoral campaign about Israel. I think we all know why the supposed progressive just can't bring himself to support the progressive Democratic nominee for mayor. To top off all the self congratulation and cash grab and really wrap it all in a bow. And Booker has decided to turn his 25 hour speech into a book called Stand. On the publisher's website they describe Stand as quote, a celebration of the Americans who chose to get up in the face of injustice, who championed the uniquely American values central to making our nation a more perfect union despite seemingly insurmountable obstacles. It's also, they say, a guide for today. Leadership is not derived from position or title. It comes from action. An example. Action. An example? Really? Booker's actions have been grandstanding his example has been support for a genocide, co opting progressive language to run cover for a rogue ethnostate. For these reasons and so many more, I do hereby declare that Cory Booker is just the fucking worst. Watching him out there still doing his little I'm glad you Obama impersonation, moral preening and then turning right around and voting for an offensive weapons package to Israel. You've got to be kidding me.
- [47:04]
Krystal Ball
Well, remember his big filibuster? I mean, this is the problem with these guys. This is what they're all about. And if you just scratch the surface a little bit, it's like the pro is. I mean, listen, obviously I know the pro Israel thing, that's big for the left, but look at the money stuff that goes back now for decades. Oh, yeah, like with his private equity.
- [47:21]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
That's what I'm saying.
- [47:22]
Krystal Ball
That was what, 2002?
- [47:23]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
I've been a longtime Cory Booker hater, just for the record.
- [47:26]
Krystal Ball
But it shows people that is what it takes, the superficiality to be beloved by the media as some sort of Democratic star, or at least was for years. I'm hoping there's a corrective.
- [47:38]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
Here's the thing that Booker exposes. It's not an accident that the very same people who would be the type to go out and be like, these attacks on Bain Capital, I just can't. Are the same people who would be voting still to send offenses of weapons to Israel. Like, they are the same people. And the reason is because they put donors first. And so wherever the most amount of money is for campaign contributions, that's where their positions are going to align. And so Cory Booker, I don't know that it was his unique innovation, but he follows the model of he really wants to position himself as like he's some sort of progressive. But then if you scratch underneath the surface and you say, oh, well, when the progressive values don't align with what the donors want, which direction do you go?
- [48:19]
Krystal Ball
Yeah, that's right.
- [48:20]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
We know which direction.
- [48:21]
Krystal Ball
That's well said. That's very true. Yeah. Yeah. And somehow his veganism also fits into this, like the personal, like, I'm just saying, it's like for me, there's something about the pro Israel vegan. Like, that is a guy. And specifically it just fits with Cory Booker. So I don't know what that is.
- [48:37]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
That's an interesting point.
- [48:39]
Krystal Ball
Well, it's about the person, you know, like if you're vegan, which, I mean, there's not really a health reason to be vegan, but like, if you want to be vegan. A lot of it is about, like, stopping the suffering of the world and all of that. Right. And so then, you know, to be pro Israel, especially now today, and supposedly progressive on top of that, like that just fits.
- [48:58]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
Well, yeah, you won't slaughter a cow, but you allow, you know, thousands of babies to be slaughtered.
- [49:04]
Krystal Ball
You won't even, you know, eat cow based products like milk or anything. But. Yeah, exactly.
- [49:08]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
Will you slaughter a red heifer?
- [49:10]
Krystal Ball
So that's my question.
- [49:11]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
We'll get Ryan on that one.
- [49:12]
Krystal Ball
I'll eat a heifer burger. Somebody sent it to me. I'll eat it. I'll eat it today. Is that sacrilegious? I'm not sure. For Hindus, I guess it is. For Jews, I don't know.
- [49:21]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
True.
- [49:21]
Krystal Ball
All right. Okay, guys.
- [49:23]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
All right, let's get to Chris Smalls. So as you guys likely know, the Freedom Flotilla Coalition has been trying to break the siege in Gaza. They've sent a number of ships at this point. One had Greta Thunberg on board and other activists attempting to bring in basic aid and break that siege. Both ships have at this point been. The activists were kidnapped off the ship. And we're now joined by Chris Smalls, who many of you longtime viewers of the show, Will Noe is the founder of the Amazon Labor Union. He was on board that second flotilla and was not only arrested, essentially kidnapped off the high seas, but was beaten and detained in Israeli prisons for a number of days. So first of all, Chris, welcome back. Welcome home. Welcome back to the show. It's nice to see your face.
- [50:04]
Krystal Ball
Good to see you, man.
- [50:05]
Sagar Enjeti
Thank you.
- [50:05]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
Thank you.
- [50:06]
Sagar Enjeti
Thank you for having me.
- [50:06]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
Of course. So just take us through why you wanted to be a part of this and what your experience was. And we've got time, so take your time. Explain to the audience what happened.
- [50:16]
Sagar Enjeti
Yeah, absolutely. Well, I want to. I want to definitely just touch on this. This mission was actually. This was actually boat number 37. I know a lot of people gravitated to the mad lean. They thought it was like the first mission. They've been doing these flotillas since 2008. There's only in the last two decades, really only five flotillas actually made it to the Gaza Strip. So it was very important for me to join this last mission on the Hondela. As a labor activist, as an American taxpayer citizen, I wanted to take a stance that was more direct. I've done a lot of protests. I've been to a lot of student encampments. I've been heavily involved with the pro Palestine movement since the very beginning. And as a labor leader, once again, labor unions in America, in the US Specifically, have been very complicit, if not participating in this genocide with shipping arms and manufacturing weapons, still with no resolution since October 7th. And once again, as a taxpaying citizen, we all need to be outraged of where our money is going. The killing and slaughtering of half a million Palestinians in less than two years. It's just inhumane. So for me to join this mission, I hope that it spread awareness. It seems like it did. Of course, the legacy media didn't touch on it. Certain politicians, you can name them, they didn't touch on it. But I'm hoping once again that the awareness that we have on the left and the awareness that we have in the community will get this story out there and also help push the narrative, like you said, to break the illegal siege that Israel has imposed for the last two decades.
- [52:02]
Krystal Ball
So, Chris, as you said, you're an American citizen. Describe your treatment after you're detained by the Israelis.
- [52:09]
Sagar Enjeti
Well, of course, not just that. I'm a black man from America, and there's been a history there for a very long time. And as one of the only black passengers on the Hondela, I was kind of aware of what situation I was going into prior to going. But you know what I said, it doesn't matter. People need to see the truth. And unfortunately, they bit the bullet. As soon as we were transferred over from the Iowa to the immigration port authorities, I didn't consent to their propaganda stories. I put my hands up over my face to cover my face from the camera crews that they have. They had pretty much camera crews the entire time trying to film propaganda like they did with Greta Thunberg with the sandwiches and things like that. And when I did that, I was attacked by seven authorities. They threw me to the ground, they put their knee in my back, they twisted my arms behind my back. And they had three guys on each side. They levitated me. And one of them was pulling my hair and using my chains as a noose to choke me until I couldn't breathe. Then they took me to a separate room. They threw me against the wall a few times, and they were saying some racist remarks in my ear, saying that they're the furthest thing from my brother and, you know, nowhere close to being brothers. And they kept me isolated from the rest of the passengers and volunteers for the whole time. They guarded me with five guards. And, yeah, once again, I was treated differently from the rest of the crew.
- [53:45]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
Were there any. While you were arrested and after you had been assaulted, were there any American politicians who intervened to try to get you back? Talk to us about the. Yeah, because, I mean, you are an American citizen. You would think this would be something that this administration, that various politicians would care about. Did anyone speak out? Did anyone intervene on your behalf?
- [54:07]
Sagar Enjeti
No, not to my knowledge. I did. When I returned home, I did see that the only rep that really spoke out was Summer Lee and I believe Rashida Tlaib, of course, who I spoke to on the Hondela on a live stream. But as far as the embassy, the US Embassy never showed up for us. I was one of seven Americans. We were one third of the crew, which was. You know, that was unprecedented by itself to have so many Americans on board. The embassy didn't do anything. I spoke to the consulate while I was in custody. He promised that he was supposed to take care of my safety, but he failed at that. I was already assaulted by then. And every other embassy, for all the other countries that was with us, they showed up in person and they made sure that their people got home. The US did not. Wow.
- [55:03]
Krystal Ball
I mean, so nobody at the consulate, nothing was. They did not assist you?
- [55:09]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
Incredible.
- [55:10]
Krystal Ball
That's crazy.
- [55:11]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
Chris, what was your goal? What was the goal of bringing this aid? What did you have on board? And did the Israelis have any legal authority to intercept this ship?
- [55:24]
Sagar Enjeti
Yeah. So, you know, we know we didn't have enough aid. The goal was never to deliver humanitarian aid. The goal is to break illegal siege. The aid that we had was very minimum. But we had prosthetic parts, we had medical supplies, baby formula, baby diapers, women care products, and a whole bunch of hope and solidarity. You know, we knew that we can never feed everybody in Gaza. But once again, to break the seed is what the message is about and the goal is about. And as far as Israel's jurisdiction on international waters, they have none. The ICJ ruled over a year ago with the case versus Israel and South Africa that humanitarian aid can continue to be delivered to the people of Gaza. They cannot block that in any way, whether it's land or sea. So we were in our legal right as civilians to deliver this humanitarian aid in Israel. Fake maritime blockade is not a real thing. They have no jurisdictions on international waters. This is why it's deemed a kidnapping.
- [56:27]
Krystal Ball
And, Chris, just broadly reflecting on your experience, what does it tell you about your own treatment and the silence from politicians here in America? Because we hear a lot about hostages held in Hamas, which is fine. Some of them were American citizens and of course we should care about them. But you were effectively held hostage, you know, by Israel and you received no contact from anybody in our government.
- [56:54]
Sagar Enjeti
Well, once again, this is, you know, silence equals death. And that's exactly what our American government has shown us, is that they rather be complicit and participate in the genocide than actually stand on the right side of history. And it's not just the government, it's these labor unions who passed zero resolutions, is these corporations like Amazon who invested $7.2 billion into the Nimbus project. They essentially are the Iron Dome. I mean it's all of them, it's all, all these dots are connected. And you know, I hope the people paid attention to who exactly who they call their so called progressive politicians. They were silent, completely silent. You can't tell me that, that they didn't catch wind of what was going on. Especially with me, as you know, Crystal and y' all been reporting on me for the last five years, ever since I was fired. I've been in major headlines, I've made every major publication in the country, in the world. So there's no excuse for why they've been silent, but the fact that they are complicit.
- [58:02]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
And finally, Chris, you know, I think a lot of people who see these images and are horrified, I think a lot of people struggle with what their moral responsibility is in their this moment. How do you think about that question?
- [58:16]
Sagar Enjeti
We all have a role to play and that's exactly what I'm doing. As a labor leader, I chose to take more of direct stance. I'm not encouraging everybody to do that because it's not meant for everybody to join these flotillas. We shouldn't have to put our lives on the line. This was a life or death situation and I have children of my own. I wanted to return home and make sure that they have a future to live in. And that's what people need to think about, especially American citizens once again who taxpaying dollars are going towards this. We all need to be outraged. And if whatever way you feel like showing your activism, it's the time, the time is now. And that's what we have to do. We have to hold these entities accountable and we have to hold these people in power accountable right now.
- [59:03]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
Chris Smalls, always great to see you, Great work here. Incredibly courageous as you said. I mean you, you put your life on the line for something you believe in and that is truly to be commended. So thank you so much for joining us. Thank you for the work you're doing.
- [59:17]
Krystal Ball
Good to see you, Chris.
- [59:18]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
Thank you.
- [59:18]
Sagar Enjeti
Thank you, thank you.
- [59:19]
Krystal Ball
Thank you guys so much for watching. We appreciate it. Great Friday show for everybody tomorrow. See you then.
- [59:24]
Az Fudd
Hey, guys, it's Az Fudd. You may know me as a gold medalist. You may know me as an NCAA national champion. You may even know me as a people's princess. Every week on my new podcast, Fut around and find out, I'll be talking to some special guests about pop culture, basketball and what it's like to be a professional athlete on and off the court. Listen to Fut around and find out. A production of iHeart Women's Sports in partnership with Unanimous Media on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [59:54]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
I'm Dr. Joy Harden Bradford, host of the Therapy for Black Girls podcast. I know how overwhelming it can feel if flying makes you anxious. In session 418 of the Therapy for Black Girls Girls podcast, Dr. Angela Neal Barnett and I discuss flight anxiety.
- [60:09]
Krystal Ball
What is not normal is to allow it to prevent you from doing the things that you want to do, the things that you were meant to do.
- [60:18]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
Listen to Therapy for Black Girls on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.
- [60:24]
Sagar Enjeti
I'm Jeff Perelman.
- [60:25]
John Hope Bryant
And I'm Rick Jervis. We're journalists and hosts of the podcast Finding Sexy Sweat.
- [60:29]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
At an internship in 1993, we roomed.
- [60:31]
Sagar Enjeti
With Reggie Payne, aspiring report reporter and.
- [60:33]
Krystal Ball
Rapper who went by Sexy Sweat a couple years ago.
- [60:36]
John Hope Bryant
We set out to find him, but.
- [60:37]
Krystal Ball
In 2020, Reddy fell into a coma after police pinned him down and he never woke up. But then I see my son's not moving.
- [60:44]
John Hope Bryant
So we started digging and uncovered city officials bent on protecting their own.
- [60:48]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
Listen to Finding Sexy Sweat on the.
- [60:50]
Krystal Ball
Iheartradio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [60:54]
Dr. Joy Harden Bradford
This is an iheart pod.