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Cracker Barrel, an activist calls to remove the CEO from the board. But just who is the agitator? Is pricing relief on the way for your cup of morning brew? And my conversation today with Wall street tech bull Dan Ives. Is he a Silicon Valley evangelist or an objective Observer? For Friday, September 19th, it's Brew Markets Daily. And I'm Ann Berry. Coming up, my chat with Dan Ives. But first, Cracker Barrel has an activist investor. Many public companies do, but they're not usually another public company or the CEO of a rival business. So I wanted to take a minute to look at this one, who happens to be both. Sardar Biglery, CEO of Bigelowy holdings, is encouraging shareholders to vote against the re election of Cracker Barrel CEO to the company's board. Now, this move comes after Cracker Barrel's report this week that its customer traffic has has been down 8%, hit by recent rebranding drama. After changing its longtime logo, reversing that decision and then halting planned restaurant remodelings. Bigelry holdings holds 2.9% of Cracker Barrel stock and is itself a public company, trading on the New York Stock Exchange under the ticket BH and with a market cap of about $950 million. So what does it do? Well, it owns restaurant chain Western Sizzlin as well as Steak and Shake, of which Sardar is also CEO. His who holding company also owns insurance and oil and gas businesses. And then it owns public companies, including, as of December, a stake in Ferrari and of course, in Cracker Barrel. Now, the CEO has spent years agitating for change at Cracker Barrel and has tried seven times to get a seat on the board for himself. One of the more unusual activist profiles I've seen. So we're going to keep watching this one, if nothing just out of, for, just out of, out of curiosity. Counting down to my interview now with Dan Ives. But First Brew Markets Daily is sponsored by Public, the investing platform for those who take it seriously. Let's throw it over to our producer John, who's excited. It's the end of the week. I think we all are.
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Yes, that's very true. I love me some Fridays. And because what does Friday mean? Payday. And what does payday mean? 401k days, because one day when I'm retired, every day will be Friday.
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John definitely has that tgifi. We're all just catching up. Well, for a limited time, public users can earn an uncapped 1% match on all IRA transfers and rollovers, a 1% match. So get started. At public.com/brewmarkets that's public.com/brewmarkets paid for by Public Investing.
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Full disclosure and Podcast Description if there's.
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One Wall street analyst who's found fans among both institutional and retail investors, it's Dan Ives, the global head of technology research at wedbush securities. Dan's Analys analysis covers some of the hottest publicly traded companies in the world, from Nvidia to Tesla businesses we love talking about on this show. And he doesn't just write recommendations on where investors should put their money, he actually puts capital to work directly too. In June of this year, Dan launched the Dan Ives Wedbush AI Revolution ETF ticker I V E s if ever there was a flex with a personalized set of plates, this would be it. Your own ticker. Well, the ETF holds the stock of 30 public companies identified using Dan's research that he believes are powering, quote, the real world deployment of artificial intelligence. And as if he wasn't busy enough, earlier this month Dan became the chair of eight Co holdings, which owns a portfolio of companies in the E commerce and mobile phone sectors. Now EightCo is public and it just rebranded its ticker to Orbs Orbs after closing a $270 million private placement with the cash used to buy Worldcoin, the cryptocurrency co founded by Sam Altman and that has iris scanning as part of its verification system. Famed as a tech bull, Dan is a very influential voice across pretty much every media platform and so I'm delighted to welcome him onto the show today. There is a question we asked him. We were a little provocative. Is he an objective analyst or now that he's actually on the boards of operating businesses, is he a Silicon Valley evangelist on its payroll? Listen to our conversation and you decide. I want to start with a couple of rapid fire questions on some of the top names that are in your world, broadly defined. Number one, Adobe, it's in your etf, so it looks as though you believe it's an AI revolutionary. It's also one that other analysts believe is behind the curve on AI when you look at Figma or Midjourney or OpenAI's expansion into images. So why do you think it's enough of a winner to put it in your etf?
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Yeah, I mean, look, Adobe definitely is facing a lot of challenges, right? Just like Salesforce, I believe the install base, they're going to continue to ultimately be, you know, someone that will benefit from AI. But look, there's no doubt right now it's a Prove me moment. But this is the opportunity for them as well as Salesforce.
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Next rapid fire one intel. Not in your etf, but if you were starting from scratch today on the news of softBank's investment, Nvidia's $5 billion investment announced yesterday. Would intel make the cut?
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Look, intel is still playing single A baseball relative to major leagues now. Before they were playing 12U before, you know, as almost a 12 year old in terms of before the government as it was Nvidia, huge step in the right direction. But let's be clear, it's an Everest like uphill battle for them on AI.
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How patient would you be? As if you were an investor in Intel. How patient would you be? How long would you give it to prove itself?
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I think they have a year. They have a year to prove out that this is not just press releases and they could actually, you know, they could actually execute. Because look, Intel's been run like a motor vehicle in New Jersey the last, you know, the last five. And that's been a big part of the problem. So you need to change the culture.
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Palantir trades at over 175 bucks a share, nearly 200 times forward PE over 3 times peg ratio. For those like me who nerd out on the metrics, you're still a buy.
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Tell us why it's the messy of AI. I mean I believe it's going to a trillion dollars next two to three years because there is no better solution when it comes to AI use cases in Palantir. Do you think to me that's why you cannot just look at valuation in terms of one year.
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In terms of the adoption of Palantir on the Enterprise side, should every other ERP provider out there just run and hide? Or do you think that Palantir is a player for the biggest corporations only and that SMEs don't get a look at?
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No, I think others will benefit. But the first call on the red phone is to Carp and Palantir. They're playing a different game now. And I think when you look at valuation, you have to look at where could this be in three, four, five years? And look, and that's always been my view, right? The haters hate the bears. They can't see AI in the spreadsheets and that's how they miss Palantir Open door.
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Meme stock. Meme stock or misunderstood.
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Misunderstood. I mean, Eric Jackson's a good friend, you know, I'm, you know, and obviously I think he's, he's preached great things, you know, Anthony Pomp and others are supporters. They have to prove it. New CEO but I don't view it as a meme stock.
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Any others out there you think are misunderstood rather than memeified?
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I think it's misunderstood in terms of AMD just how much they're going to benefit from AI. I think it's misunderstood maybe a sales force, I mean obviously going through clear headwinds. But I think that's one that's going to be a huge opportunity when it comes to AI. I think CrowdStrike is another one. I think CrowdStrike's going to be a huge beneficiary as well as POW Alto. You do not bet against George or Nikesh.
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Let's talk about Tesla. Let's talk about someone who is up there as you don't bet against them in some people's eyes. So Elon Musk just bought $1 billion of Tesla stock. His sign of confidence in the company. The board just offered him a performance based trillion dollar package. We'll see if it gets voted in sign of confidence in him. So here's a question from our audience, Dan. We, you know we do follow each other on X. We saved this one from your appearance. Erie in Illinois wrote in and asked and he asked me but now I'm asking you what's the value of Tesla without Musk? Am I investing in the man or the company?
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It's a great look at Musk is Tesla, Tesla is Musk. And the reason I think this is the 2 trillion and ultimately $3 trillion market cap, it's because physical AI when it comes to autonomous and robotics, Tesla is going to be along with Nvidia, the two best physical AI players in the world. But Musk is a key part of that. That's why the board has recognized that that package I think is very fair. And I think some of those targets I think are very hittable and that's why you are investing in Musk when you invest in Tesla. And clearly we saw you know, some of the brand issues when he joined Trump administration but I think that's a contained issue that was slowly feared.
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And what do you think Dan, of the possibility or the idea of multiple of Musk's companies getting overlapping investment from all the others. Right. So whether it's X ending up sort of smushed into into all of this or SpaceX, talk to us about how you think all these private companies might converge in one or two sort of public opportunities.
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You know, in November Tesla is going to own big piece of X AI which is very important in terms of the AI piece coming more and more into Tesla, I could see down the road they'll have ownership of SpaceX some piece as well as when it comes to, I mean, I view it eventually it probably comes into some sort of broader holding structure, you know, under musk down the road. But I think that's a positive because it's all about the ecosystem that he's created.
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The musk, the musk ecosystem. Let's talk Dan, about your etf because you've done something that is quite, quite rare and in the world in which you've come, right? Global head of technology at Wedbush Securities Analyst. And you've actually decided rather than writing about companies and putting recommendations out there for how investors should think about buying or selling or holding, you've actually jumped in the deep end and said, I'm actually going to manage money myself. So you've got your etf, the Dan Ives Wedbush AI Revolution ETF ticker Ives ivs. Here's a question for you and it's from a follower on X and it's Patrick who tweeted, thank you Dan for being on the ball with the AI party. I know it's early, but so far, do AI tech companies with a hands on engineer CEO fare better than a regular CEO with a stellar team?
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That's a great question.
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That's a good question.
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Look, well first off, my view is like I don't think there's any one formula that works. I think it depends on the company. I mean part of like, you know, we do our Ives AI 30 research. That's what the ETFs based on when we launch in June. And to me it's really about identifying not just the core beneficiaries, the Nvidias, the palantirs, Microsoft, but who are the second, third derivatives of this AI revolution. But we've talked about, you know, in terms of that question, the party, it started off at 9pm in the AI party. It's now about 10:15. That party goes to 4am and the thing is, I always say like, look, could there be glass in the dance floor? DJ stops playing music, cops come, maybe break up the party for a little. That's pop. But guess what? The bears that are watching the party from the outside, through the windows, they go upstairs, read a book in their room. 6:00am, 6:00am you meet at the diner. Yeah, the bulls had a lot better night than the bears.
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Can we be both? Some of us are bookworms and like to go out too, Dan, you know we got it. We got to be from the either or. Let's talk about how bullish you are, and let's talk about the performance of your ETF so far. Launched in June. Congratulations. You crossed $100 million in your first week of launch. That's a net asset value. Now you're at about 500 million. When I checked.
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That's 700 million. So we're 700 million as of today.
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As of today.
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So about three. Three months. About 700 million, yeah.
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And talk about your performance year to date.
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Yeah, I mean, you could see the performance. You know, I think you could see me. Probably speaks for itself. I think part of it is like, look, Investors know, like, 3 million air miles the last 25 years. Like, we don't call these things from my house or from the 15th floor of New York City office building. It's being out in the world. It's the research we do, and it's picking the names and that we view as the winners now. But also it changes every quarter. We could add some, take out some based on, you know, what we think is happening, but it's a way for investors to basically bet on our strategy. It's all based on our research.
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And what's your goal for sort of assets under management? Dan, is there a world where you become too big? Is there a sort of optimal size that you want to be at? Talk to. Talk to me about how the 700 million today fares versus what your vision is.
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Yeah, I don't. Look, I mean, to me, it's not like I've ever had, like, a goal. I mean, we started out, we had a dollar, right. Like when we launched. I mean, to me, it's more about. I'm focused on this AI revolution, picking the winners and helping investors. Institutional retail, whether from Singapore or Sioux City, doesn't matter. Because the point is, for me, it's about, like. It's all the work that we do in the field and to have investors benefit from that.
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Let's talk about why someone would want to consider your ETF instead of, say, QQQ or Cathie Wood's Ark, you know, and I pulled your holdings. I pulled the holdings in qqq, I pulled the holdings in Cathie Wood. There's some overlap. Not completely, but from your perspective, why you versus others?
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C
Yeah. And Kathy's awesome. Tom Lee, a good friend, you know, same thing. I mean, like, the point is, there's a lot of ETFs. I mean, ours, it's a pure play. AI ETF. I mean, the reality is like if you want to play this team, I think it's the biggest tech team in the last 40, 50 years. That's, that's really what this ETF is about. Our research, it's our names that we view as the winners and some of the, a lot of the second, third, fourth derivatives. I think the biggest risk for investors in this is that you just own the Mag 7. I think Mag 7 continue to lead and outperform but you have to focus on the second, third, fourth derivatives. That's what we spend all of our time doing.
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When does traditional hardware become a second, third, fourth derivative? And let me give you an example, two examples. When does a John Deere or a Medtronic. These are acid intensive. This is heavy equipment. When do those sorts of companies start becoming third, fourth derivative?
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AI plays I think we're close to AI is having an effect across verticals. So when you look at traditional companies as they use more and more AI and the point where only 3% enterprise have gone down the AI path as the trillions are spent, you're going to have companies transform that today are views maybe an industrial.
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Yeah.
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But maybe a year from now viewed as almost more tech or disruptive tech. And I think that's the benefit.
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Let's, let's switch gears a bit Dan, and let's talk about some more news. As though you weren't busy enough, you've become chairman of a very sort of unusual public company. Talk to us about your role at orbs.
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C
Yeah, and eco ticker Orbs. Look, this is really, I mean I wasn't going to join as chairman of a company just to do a DAC or a crypto strategy. I mean the reason I'm doing this is because worldcoin, which is working with Sam Aldman, Alex that, that built out the Orbs, this is iris scanning technology. 16 million have signed on to it. In my opinion it's much more of an AI tech infrastructure play than a crypto play. I think there's going to be the single sign on for the AI world and I don't think AI will hit its heights without true human proof authentication. That's why I joined we buy world, we raise 270 million and I think it's something where I view this similar as I viewed Palantir 22 Nvidia 22 Tesla in 2012. Like it's my view like this is going to be a de facto authentication in a human proof way. Like I don't think there's a name specifically that I could think of that's maybe like, quote unquote overrated. What I would say is, is that just because it comes as AI 30 times in a conference call doesn't mean that they're AI and that's all the work that I do on public and private side. Right? Like, that's why, like, there's going to be like, whatever imposters or ones that kind of say they're AI and they're really not. And look, and that's all the work that we do, you know, trying to. Trying to understand, like, the winners from maybe the posers.
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And final question for you, Dan. One. One winner. Who you think people still are not getting how far it can go.
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It's messy of A.I. that's the one. It's like, who could. I think people underestimate carp. They understand. They underestimate Palantir. They. They focus on valuing. And they, you know, they sit there, look, they hate it when it's a teenager stock, despise it when it's 40, yelling from the mountaintops at 75, 150, screaming from the point. And then a trillion. They're going to be doing the same.
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By map out your recent career decisions. Analyst, money, money manager, and now on the board moving sort of closer towards what? It's not operational because, you know, it's a governance position, but closer to the operations. And so here's a question for you. You're a very famous tech bull. You're known for being thoughtful about the reasons why you're as positive on some names as you have been when others have not been as bullish and you stood your ground. But what would you say to folks who say, okay, look, now he's a board member now he's sort of on the payroll. Is he now more of a Silicon Valley evangelist than a dispassionate analyst or investor? What do you think of that?
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Yeah, it's good. Look, I mean, everyone that's known me, like, I actually view it differently. I view it as like, what I'm evangelizing and what I'm talking about with the world, it's really. It's all related to AI. It's related to the same theme. So, you know, this is one where the reason I did this, it's actually a unified theme. It's where I think the AI revolution's going to. Obviously, partnering with Sam Altman is something where I believe that is just the beginning of this next leg of the strategy. And I think ultimately it gives you even just a better perspective in terms of where the tech's trending and where I ultimately believe the second, third, fourth derivatives are in terms of AI. And that's look, and that's why even on the etf, right when I did, when the ETF came out, you know, investors like, you know, like, oh, this is different. And I think it was pretty quickly understood like, oh, this is based on the research. And, and I think that's, I'm very like, it's very proud in terms of the, the adoption that we've seen.
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When you sort of talk about partnering someone like Sam Altman, I can't help thinking of the ecosystem of very famous individuals who are partnering with Sam. And one of those is Larry Ellison. So I'd love to just touch on Oracle and Let's talk about AI and TikTok, because one set of names that's not in your ETF and I know that it's not technically in your coverage universe, are the social media names xx better, Right? It's not Reddit, it's not Snap or Pinterest and TikTok's out there and we don't know what's going to happen. What is your view on where those names go?
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C
Yeah, well, first on the Oracle side, Oracle being one of our top, you know, top memes that we're bullish on because look, I mean Ellison, Ellison's been major steps ahead of others, right, in terms of understanding the stack where everything, him and Safra, what they've been able to do. And I actually think the streets still underestimating where Oracle is going to go. I mean, that's sort of my view in terms of where they play as a role in the infrastructure side. Look, when you look at Pinterest, some of the others that aren't in there, we're not there yet. Like, I'm not saying we're not gonna get there, but in terms of you have, they have not proven the applicability right now this is much more infrastructure, enterprise, consumer. We obviously have Meta Alphabet and others. The infrastructure like G Vernova, Nevisis and other playas, Aqua on the Power, but that's what we see today. But again, the whole beauty of this, it's dynamic. Every quarter you could add or subtract names based on the work that we do.
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What is one AI name in quotes you think is overrated?
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C
I don't think there's a name specifically that I could think of that's maybe like quote unquote overrated. What I would say is that just because the company says AI 30 times in a conference call doesn't mean that they're AI driven. And that's all the work that I do on public and private side. That's why there's going to be whatever imposters or ones that say they're AI and they're really not. That's all the work that we do trying to, trying to understand like the winners from maybe the, the posers.
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And final question for you, Dan. One, one winner. Who you think people still are not getting how far it can go?
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Massive AI it's the back of Valentine and that's the one. It's like who could I think people underestimate car. They underestimate Palantir. They focus on valuing and they, you know, they sit there, look, they hate it when it's a teenager stock despise it when it's 40 yelling from the mountaintops at 75, 150 screaming from the point and then a trillion they're going to be doing the same.
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Well, huge thanks to Dan Ives for joining us. Well, here on Brew Markets, we've been following CEO Brian Nichols back to Starbucks turnaround plan. And earlier this week we tried some coffee from Luckin, the Chinese coffee powerhouse that has opened five locations in in the United States. Well, our producer John, noticed some positive news about your morning brews.
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That's right. Coffee futures just slid as much as six and a half percent to their lowest level in almost a month. The Washington Post is reporting that U.S. lawmakers plan to introduce a bill to exempt coffee products from tariffs. And it's not just tariffs. We've been paying attention to the drought. Some coffee producing countries have been experiencing no rain, but the forecast is bright or the opposite. Widespread rainfall is expected in some key coffee growing areas in Brazil next week. And Vietnam is expected to harvest its biggest coffee crop in four years following good rainfall. So, Ann, after the show, I'm going to go to Costco to buy myself some Kirkland coffee and I will report back.
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You're going to actually give us some real time feedback on what the pricing looks like. That's it going into the weekend, folks. That's all for today's Brew Markets Daily.
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Brew Markets Daily is hosted by Ann Berry and produced by John Crateau, Tarek Abdelatif and Emily Milian. Guest booking by AB Silver. Our technical director is Utena Wagu. Audio assistance by Rosemary Minkler. And the president of Morning Brew Inc. Is Devin Emery. If you'd like to get in touch, send an email or voice memo to brewmarketshoworningbrew com and wake up on Monday.
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With the Morning Brew newsletter and tune in to Neil and Toby on Morning Brew daily. Have a fantastic weekend. We're going to see you back here on Monday, same time, same place.