← Brian Kilmeade Show
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- [00:00]
A
Chairman Michael McCaul joins us now. Congressman, welcome back.
- [00:04]
B
Hey, thanks for having me, Brian. Good to be back.
- [00:06]
A
Hey dude. The mou, I think you and I both agree, was a prescription for disaster. And it seems the Iranians didn't know how good they had it and they were abusing it and they shot at merchant ships. And now finally, I think it's history. How would you characterize where we're at right now in this conflict?
- [00:25]
B
Well, I think we're going back to plan A. I mean we were. The military was very successful at achieving the objective. They were put on hold, you know, pending this negotiation, this mou. Look, I understand the President wanting to negotiate this. I think it's very important to recognize who are you negotiating with and it's the regime. And quite frankly Brian, you and I don't have a lot of trust in them. Reagan talk about trust verify. I was never really sanguine they were going to come to an agreement on this mou and if they did, they would violate it. So now we're going back to where we were prior to the cease fire. It is my sincere hope that the President unleashes the full strength of our military to achieve its objective and that is to wipe out all launch pads from which they can launch shahed drones missiles and then open up the straits, take out the IRGC as much as possible, both by strikes and internally inside of Iran. Israel has assets in Iran. I think with this regime you're always going to have a problem negotiating any sort of deal. So I hope the President's back on track. If you're going to do this, do it right. I'm with the Cold Powell Doctrine. You either go all in or you don't go in at all.
- [01:52]
A
Here's what Alex Gray said. The former NSC Chief of Staff Cut
- [01:55]
C
seven Look, the Iranian people, this is ultimately their fight. And the Iranian people for years have been under the thumb of this murderous regime. And the only way, ultimately the final, you know, the solution to this 47 year conflict is for the Iranian people to rise up and to reclaim their country. And to the extent that the United States can help facilitate that, that's ultimate way that this is going to be resolved once and for all is to give the Iranian people the freedom that they deserve. If there's a way for the US to help make that a reality, that's certainly in our long term interest to do so.
- [02:30]
A
I know you can't give intelligence, but we just got to know if the, if the Iranian people can get armed, we know, they're brave.
- [02:37]
B
You know, your guess is absolutely correct. This does not end until the Iranian people rise up and take out this theocracy. Is since the Ayatollah came into power in 1979. And, you know, I've had briefings in that space, and I've asked them, you know, what plans do we have? I knew the plans to take out the nuclear capabilities, where I always thought we were a little bit of a deficit, was on the issue of empowering the people to take their government back to. To free Iran from the theocracy of the Ayatollah. And, you know, we never really had a good plan, Brian. We didn't have a. There was never a leader ready to go like the Ayatollah was with the Shah. We didn't have a source of weapons to go in to arm them against the irgc, and we didn't have a lot of good communications. Now we can still recover. You know, I think getting Starlink in full in Iran, I think, you know, there was a plan by the CIA to get weapons in that was held back for some reason. And, you know, Israel is very good at this. I think if we just assisted them through our intelligence community inside of Iran to, number one, take out the irgc. Without the irgc, the Ayatollah has no power at all. And. But I haven't seen that happening to date.
- [04:07]
A
And we bombed their barracks. We bombed the IRGC barracks. I don't know how many were sleeping there at the time. Hopefully all of them. But we took that and they came back and hit our barracks in Jordan. Now, I'm wondering, Chairman, from what you know, do you believe that for them to be this precise, someone like China or Russia has to be giving them coordinates?
- [04:26]
B
Oh, I know they are. Russia is giving them targets, targeting sites to kill Americans. In fact, they have, and it's worked. China is giving them technology. China's giving them Russia, all the technology for their weapons. I saw that in Ukraine. They're also giving that to the Russians and Iranians. Russia is all in this fight with Iran. So that's why I think, again, going back to the Lindsey Graham sanction bill that I've worked on, and we're still trying to get it to a good place to get it done this week is so important because, you know, if you're hurting, if you're hitting Russia, you're also hitting Iran. I think a lot of people don't realize that, you know, Russia and China are aligned, and they're also aligned with Iran. All three of them are in this together and North Korea. And North Korea is in there as well.
- [05:22]
A
So what you're saying is leave the bill as it is because the president said, I want to add Iran to that sanctions bill. Anyone's got anyone doing any commerce, any business with Iran, we're going to sanction them. So. And then I saw Senator Blumenthal said, I think we kind of like it the way it is. So where do you stand, Chairman?
- [05:43]
B
Well, that's where we are right now. We are good to go. I think the President I understand. I fully support further sanctions against Iran. Now, Lindsey's bill had secondary sanctions that would cover Iran's acquisition of defense articles from Russia, but it would also include any energy coming from Russia that was already in the bill. The president wants to add tougher sanctions on Iran and that personally, I'm all in favor of that, Brian. I think it's a delicate balance with the Democrats. I think Lindsey always wanted this to be, you know, bipartisan, bicameral. That's why he brought me in. And he wanted the White House behind it. And he worked to he worked his magic, you know, getting this done. Of course, you know, the Iran thing is what's changed. And we're in current negotiations with the White House right now on that very.
- [06:42]
A
But you worry that if you have to do a rewrite, you're not going to get a vote this week.
- [06:47]
B
Well, we have to. If we're going to change it at all, we have to either reintroduce it or add an amendment onto it in the Senate. And that decision has not been made yet.
- [06:58]
D
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- [07:12]
A
So I'm watching now the president, United States with the president of Lebanon, at which time I think this is on the table that Lebanon's going to get some training and work with Syria and I guess with Israel pulls out and then Syrian troops, highly trained, will move in and in theory push out Hezbollah. But a lot of people look at this and say, man, there's they're going to be more loyal to Hezbollah than they're going to be even to the Lebanese government. Where are you going to find troops that are going to be loyal to loyal enough or brave enough to Push back this Iranian finance terror group. How do you feel about this plan?
- [07:48]
B
Yeah, well, we've always supported in Congress the Lebanese military against Hezbollah, you know, that fight. I know Israel is very much involved in that. You know, Syria's in a very delicate position right now with their new president after Al Sharra was taken out, and so. And then you got the rise of ISIS in there. It's very, very complicated, Brian. I mean, Turkey has more of a presence in Russia. I mean. Yeah, the proxies of Iran are part of the bigger equation here. You can't talk about Iran in an isolated vacuum and not talk about Hezbollah, not talk about Hamas, not talk about the Houthi rebels, because they are the tentacles of Iran, and they're extensions of Iran and Lebanon and, you know, in the Gaza Strip and also in Yemen. And now the Houthi rebels are talking about shutting out the Red Sea, you know, against Saudi Arabia. So this. It's complicated. And I'm always of mindset that, look, it's a very serious decision to go in, but once you do it, you got to do it right, and you have to go all in. Otherwise to do this back and forth and stop and start type thing. Negotiate, stop, hit them, stop, negotiate. I'm with Gerald Jack Keane on this one. Like, just go in. Our military can finish this. And then let's work on getting a new regime in power, because that is the head of the snake, Brian. If you can take the head of the snake, which is the Ayatollah, and the regime out, you will kill the tentacles. And that is Hezbollah, Hamas, and the Houthi rebels.
- [09:40]
A
Yeah, I mean, I think you're 100% right. The Houthi rebels take over the Red Sea. That's gonna complicate things. We'd have to get involved, even though that their main problem is with Saudi Arabia. They had a preexisting rivalry there, but the result's gonna be Saudis can't get their oil through, and it's a global market, so it's gonna affect all of this. Have you seen a military plan, Congressman McCaul, that shows how we open up the strait regardless of Iran's permission or not?
- [10:07]
B
It's been described to me. And we had a Pentagon visit scheduled this morning, but we had our conference. It's getting rescheduled. But, you know, I was with Senator Roger Wicker yesterday, the Senate Armed Services Chairman, and, you know, we talked about this, that, look, there's a plan to do this. I think Cooper, the, you know, CENTCOM commander, has a plan to do this. And you know, part of the problem is that they have taken their launchers and their missiles and they put them back into these, you know, these underground storage facilities where they have the nuclear material. So getting to that is going to be the tricky but achievable goal that I think has to be done to then finally get the straits open. And I personally believe there should have been and there should be be some sort of clandestine operation. I think that Israel can obviously take the lead on this, on getting this regime out of power. I don't. It will continue to be a problem as long as this regime's in power.
- [11:13]
A
So I was talking to someone involved. Yeah, I would talk about Ukraine. You got this honor in Ukraine because you've been steadfast in supporting this cause. It is the cause of the West. And the way they're fighting five years later has just been phenomenal. How would you characterize what you saw on the ground two weeks ago when you were in Ukraine?
- [11:32]
B
Well, I went farther than any US official has gone on the front lines and astounding. All I can say is remarkable. I was watching in underground, undisclosed locations these live feeds of drone operations taking place, recapturing Russian occupied territory. The average lifespan they told me of a Russian soldier is days to hours. And I actually saw that taking place. Also they had their command and control center operations outside of Kyiv that I went to. That's a massive facility. They I went to one drone manufacturer, Skyfall, making 7,000 drones per day on a massive scale. Think about one $1,000 drone can take out a shahed drone. Whereas before Brian, we were using $1,000,000 interceptor to take out a $25,000 shahed. This is where we can learn something from Ukraine. I think we should be co producing drones with the Ukrainians. And what they need desperately is what President Trump has given them and that is these, these licensing agreements to manufacture Patriot interceptors. Because right now they're pounding Kyiv with these ballistic missiles.
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A
So are you going to number one of the contracts been is that a done deal and it's just the licensing
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B
or is it just Lockheed, Lockheed Martin? I just got information yesterday or moving forward with these agreements. I think the question now, Brian, is going to be where are they going to co produce these interceptors?
- [13:11]
A
Where? Yeah, out of the country so they can do it and not get bombed. So there was a deal on the table where the Ukrainians publicly offered, probably privately, more specific, hey, we know how to stop the shahed drones. We'll provide that to you. And Ukraine is helping the Gulf states. Have we given them an answer? Because it seems like we would benefit that too, especially present, protect our bases.
- [13:36]
B
I mean, absolutely. I did meet with the military and other officials are working on Golden Dome, you know, operations. And I asked them, are you, are you, are you using some of these Ukrainian counter drone, you know, drone missiles that they have? And they said, yeah, they are starting to deploy some of those in the streets of Hormuz because it's really the same militarily. The strategy is similar, Brian. And Ukraine has taken out launch pads in interior Russia that deliver the shaheds and the ballistic missiles. And the same thing happens with the Straits of Hormuz to take out the shahed drones themselves, but also the launchers in Iran and the launchers for the missile capability. So in a way, the two conflicts are similar and certainly the offensive military defense articles being used by Russia being used by Iran, and that is the Shahed drone.
- [14:41]
A
So much, so much on the table. It's going to be a critical time. I think the president's going to decide whether expand the war or, I don't know what the option would be, or continue to hit these targets, but I think it's sending a good message to Iran. In case you think we're just going to quit or that it's over or we're going to cut a bad deal. No, we're not. So they gave it a shot just because I think it's the right thing to do. But now I think it's back to kinetic Action. Congressman Michael McCaul, thanks so much. Always great to talk to you, sir.
- [15:09]
B
Thanks for. Brian, thanks for having me.