Impact Of Wemby Out For Season & Concern For Luka’s Slow Start With Lakers?

Summary

Podcast Summary: Brian Windhorst & The Hoop Collective – "Impact Of Wemby Out For Season & Concern For Luka’s Slow Start With Lakers?"

Release Date: February 21, 2025

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Introduction

In this episode of "Brian Windhorst & The Hoop Collective," host Brian Windhorst, along with co-hosts Tim MacMahon and Bobby Marks, delve deep into the latest developments within the NBA. The primary focus centers on the significant impact of Victor Wembanyama’s season-ending injury and the concerns surrounding Luka Doncic’s performance with the Los Angeles Lakers. The discussion is enriched with expert insights, player updates, and strategic analyses, providing listeners with a comprehensive understanding of the current NBA landscape.

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Victor Wembanyama’s Season-Ending Injury

Bobby Marks provides an in-depth overview of Victor Wembanyama’s unfortunate diagnosis:

"Victor Whitman Yama announced his doubtful status with an illness... It is deep vein thrombosis, essentially a blood clot in his right shoulder."
(02:10)

Wembanyama’s injury not only sidelines a potential Defensive Player of the Year candidate but also halts his promising trajectory in the league. The Spurs organization remains optimistic, believing this is an isolated incident with expectations for a full recovery by the next season.

Tim MacMahon shares a personal perspective on blood clots:

"Blood clots are scary. I had a blood clot about 15 years ago... When you are on blood thinners... it's not a matter of if, it's when."
(05:40)

The conversation emphasizes the severity of Wembanyama’s condition, the typical treatment protocols, and parallels with other NBA players like Brandon Ingram and Chris Bosh.

Impact on the San Antonio Spurs

The Spurs face a challenging period without Wembanyama, leading to discussions about their playoff prospects and draft lottery positioning.

Brian Windhorst analyzes the Spurs’ current standing:

"The Spurs right now are in the 10th spot in the lottery... They are projected to win 32 and a half games and be seventh in the lottery."
(07:45)

Bobby Marks elaborates on the organizational challenges:

"Victor really wants to win. Victor is competitive... he's not going to be on the floor, and the Spurs are not going to be a challenger for that playoff spot."
(05:40)

The team’s strategy moving forward includes leveraging the upcoming draft picks and reassessing their roster to compensate for Wembanyama’s absence.

Luka Doncic’s Performance with the Lakers

Shifting focus to Luka Doncic, the hosts express concern over his recent performances with the Lakers, citing his shooting struggles and high turnover rates.

Bobby Marks critiques Doncic’s current form:

"Luka is not himself... shooting 20-point something percent for the Lakers... 11 turnovers over the last two games."
(26:00)

Tim MacMahon discusses the potential adjustments Doncic needs to make:

"He throws the ball to Austin Reeves and stands on the wing. That's not how it's going to go. It's going to go, Luka. Take the ball, dominate the usage and be yourself."
(28:23)

The conversation highlights Doncic’s adjustment to a new team environment, his integration with LeBron James, and the emotional and physical toll of his long-term injury absence.

Mark Williams and Los Angeles Lakers

A notable segment covers the controversy surrounding Mark Williams’ failed physical with the Lakers, leading to his suspension and the subsequent statements from his agent, Jeff Schwartz.

Brian Windhorst summarizes the situation:

"Jeff Schwartz released a statement that the Lakers should not have failed Mark Williams on his physical... trying to protect his value."
(33:07)

Tim MacMahon provides context on the implications for both Williams and the Lakers:

"Mark Williams is in his third season... the Lakers gave up a lot to make that deal, and now they're dealing with the fallout."
(34:48)

The discussion underscores the delicate nature of player trades, the impact of failed physicals on team dynamics, and the potential long-term effects on Williams’ career.

Additional NBA Updates

The hosts briefly touch upon other NBA news, including Bobby Portis’ suspension for violating the drug policy and updates on Anthony Davis’ injury status with the Lakers.

Bobby Marks comments on Portis’ suspension:

"Bobby Portis was suspended for 25 games for violating the drug policy... he was dealing with his elbow injury and it ended up getting caught in a drug screen."
(40:42)

Tim MacMahon reflects on the Bucks’ season challenges:

"The Bucks are dealing with injuries and now losing Bobby Portis, which shrinks their margin for error."
(40:16)

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Concluding Thoughts

The episode wraps up with the hosts reflecting on the tumultuous nature of the NBA season, the importance of player health, and the strategic decisions teams must make amidst unforeseen challenges. They emphasize the resilience required to navigate through injuries and underperformance, underscoring the unpredictable yet thrilling essence of professional basketball.

Brian Windhorst concludes:

"To win the title, you have to get lucky... having your team available is incredibly hard."
(48:24)

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Notable Quotes

• Bobby Marks (02:10): "Victor Whitman Yama announced his doubtful status with an illness... It is deep vein thrombosis, essentially a blood clot in his right shoulder."
• Tim MacMahon (05:40): "Blood clots are scary. I had a blood clot about 15 years ago... When you are on blood thinners... it's not a matter of if, it's when."
• Brian Windhorst (07:45): "The Spurs right now are in the 10th spot in the lottery... They are projected to win 32 and a half games and be seventh in the lottery."
• Bobby Marks (26:00): "Luka is not himself... shooting 20-point something percent for the Lakers... 11 turnovers over the last two games."
• Tim MacMahon (28:23): "He throws the ball to Austin Reeves and stands on the wing. That's not how it's going to go. It's going to go, Luka. Take the ball, dominate the usage and be yourself."
• Brian Windhorst (33:07): "Jeff Schwartz released a statement that the Lakers should not have failed Mark Williams on his physical... trying to protect his value."

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Conclusion

This episode offers a thorough examination of pivotal moments affecting key NBA players and teams. By dissecting Victor Wembanyama’s injury and Luka Doncic’s adaptation with the Lakers, the hosts provide listeners with valuable insights into the current challenges and future prospects within the league. Whether you’re an avid NBA follower or a casual fan, this episode delivers engaging and informative content that encapsulates the dynamic world of basketball.

Transcript

[Brian Windhorst]

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Because in business, it's all about having the experienced team on your side. At Robert Half we know talent. Visit robert half.com today. Hello. Welcome to Hoop Collective podcast. We talk about the NBA which you're doing on Thursday afternoon. Joining us from the center, Philadelphia, where the. I don't even know who the Sixers are playing tonight. Bon Temps. Who are they playing?

[Brian Windhorst]

They're playing the Boston Celtics and everybody. A lot of the main characters on both sides are playing. So. So here we go.

[Tim MacMahon]

Well, that's sort of a referendum on where the Sixers are that I. That's a really a big game. It's sort of like coming out of the premium game, coming out of the gates. Is that, is that the first TNT game tonight?

[Brian Windhorst]

It is the first TNT game tonight and I believe our guy is at the second game.

[Tim MacMahon]

That's right. Well, that one I knew. Joining us from Austin, Texas from the Moody center where the spurs are playing the Suns tonight. But it's a somber day in Austin and all spurs Nation is band McMahon.

[Bobby Marks]

Howdy partners and hook them.

[Tim MacMahon]

You're not banned from there. You're hanging out with all the Longhorns.

[Brian Windhorst]

He's helping fund the Longhorn Nation.

[Bobby Marks]

Hanging out with with two last night, my daughter and her new boyfriend. Very polite man.

[Tim MacMahon]

Oh, I'll bet that was interesting. That'll be for the. The post pod discussion. All right. Rough news today, McMahon. You were there when it went down.

[Bobby Marks]

Yeah. Really unfortunate. Obviously. Yesterday Victor Whitman Yama announced his doubtful with an illness and he's like, wow, that's a bummer. He's him and kd. Those are the featured attractions here. Word started percolating as I arrived for shoot around like, hey, this is not just an illness. It's something significant. The spurs, before their shoot around opened, announced that he will miss the rest of the regular season. It is deep vein thrombosis. I believe I'm pronouncing that correctly. Essentially a blood clot in his right shoulder. Now this is something that they believe is an isolated situation and they are very optimistic that Wimy will be fully recovered by the beginning of next season. But you know, his brilliant sophomore season is going to be. It's, it's over. It's, it's Cut short now, he played in 46 games. You know, obviously the runaway favorite for defense player of the year will not be eligible for that. He will not be eligible for all NBA. You know, certainly the most important thing is they are confident and very optimistic that this isn't something that is going to be a long term issue just for his general health especially, but also for his, for his basketball career. But you know, one of the rising stars in the NBA, you know, a likely face of the next generation in this league is unfortunately not going to be able to play basketball after the all Star break this season.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yeah, I mean my probably the thing, the moment that probably stood out to me the most from being in San Francisco over the weekend. So we haven't potted since I was there was Saturday afternoon being back at Oracle for the first time since Game 6 in 2019, which was a trip down memory lane for a lot of reasons. But in the media room Saturday afternoon and Anthony Edwards strolls in with sunglasses on and very carefree attitude per usual.

[Tim MacMahon]

And surprise.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yes. As he's going through his media session, he gets asked, what do you think you could be the future face of the league? And he immediately says, no, not really. And the reporter says, well, why don't you think that? He said, well, that's what Wemby's and obviously it's just a little moment during sort of a nothing media availability, but we all know Ant's a pretty confident guy. And the fact that he just like basically has said, yeah, like this guy's going to be the guy even I'm sure he thinks he's going to win games on the court. It sort of just spoke to the overall theme of the weekend, which is that LeBron James, who didn't play in the game is on his way out. Victor Wembanyama, who is, you know, trying to break the rules of Chris Paul on Saturday during the stupid skills challenge and cause silliness with that didn't rise.

[Tim MacMahon]

To the level of being discussed in the podcast, but it was a fascinating little.

[Brian Windhorst]

That whole thing was crazy. And then, you know, he's out there blocking shots. There was a, you know, one crazy sequence in the game where he blocks a shot at one end, dunks it at the other, sets up a fast break at the other end. Like, you know, it was really a coming out party for him. Obviously he's already a huge star, but it was sort of an announcement of him as being on the level of these other guys at the true top of the.

[Bobby Marks]

It was a moment. It was a moment for him. It was his first all star appearance. And we all have seen, you know, Wendy being in Paris both for the Olympics and for the, you know, the games over there this year. Like when you put Wimby on a stage, he almost always responds he love and that's part of being a quote unquote face of league. You know, kind of the polish and you know, the willingness to, to be insightful. And I think when Ant says that's what Wimby's for. Ants also saying they keep finding me for being myself and know if I can't cuss. But, but, but when he has, he has the game, he has the personality, he has kind of the, the polish already at, at 21 years old, you know, and we all think this guy is going to be the most dominant player in the league in the not too distant future. But we won't be able to watch him try to lead the spurs into the play and next this season because, you know, he's not going to be on the floor. And unfortunately, I don't think that the spurs are going to be a challenger for that playing spot. And 35 and a half is the over is in a, in a bit of jeopardy.

[Tim MacMahon]

First off, I want to talk about. Blood clots are scary. I had a blood clot about 15 years ago. Okay. No situation is the same and I don't have any insight other than what the spurs announced, which was that it was in his shoulder. There's several different ways you can deal with the blood clot, but almost always you're going to instantaneously be on blood thinners.

[Bobby Marks]

Yeah.

[Tim MacMahon]

The fancy term for it is anticoagulants. It doesn't actually thin your blood even though they call it blood thinners. It just means that your blood can't clot as well. Okay. So when you are on blood thinners, you're all first off, they. And maybe the drugs are better now than they were 15 years ago, but they interact with everything and make you feel terrible, frankly. I mean, I hated when I was on it again. Maybe the, I think the drugs are maybe a little better now, but. And if you get, get a cut or something, you know, or you have any sort of, you know, you have to tell everybody that you get treated or touch by that's going on and you can't do any physical activity. I mean, you can do physical activity. You just can't really play contact sports because the last thing you want is to get hit, you know, hit your head or something. And yeah, internal Bleeding. Okay. So that's why as soon as you have a blood clot, you see people ruled out for like months. Usually it's at least six months. Does not always ironclad. Depends on the type of clot that you have. You might be able to have a procedure to remove the clot. That was the case with Brandon Ingram, who had a clot in his upper arm and his shoulder six years ago.

[Brian Windhorst]

Almost the exact same announcement, by the way. D. Vombosis in his shoulder came back at the start around the same time of the year. Came back to start of the next season. Absolutely no issues going forward. So if you are a Spurs fan or NBA fan, that's certainly the right. The optimistic view is that this is a one time thing. He comes back, he's fine and he has a incredible career.

[Tim MacMahon]

Right. And so that's what we're all hoping for. By the way, you remember Michael Jordan missed his whole second season at the broken turned out okay.

[Bobby Marks]

Yes.

[Tim MacMahon]

So while this is a bummer, it is. It is not the end of the world.

[Brian Windhorst]

Hopefully you go back at spurs history. Right. It's a different stage of his career. But David Robinson missed virtually an entire season, I believe because of a back injury. Right. And that allowed the spurs to get the number one pick in the draft.

[Bobby Marks]

A back injury that really lingered.

[Brian Windhorst]

Well, that's fine. But the point is they won the lottery with a generational talent in the lottery and could pair David Robinson and Tim Duncan together and they won two titles and Tim Duncan ended up being with them for almost another 20 years. Right. And if the spurs, if you're being the absolutely most optimistic scenario. Yeah, Tim, you're probably not winning your bet now. But if the spurs struggle down the stretch and jump into the top three or lo and behold end up with the number one pick in the draft.

[Tim MacMahon]

That was a humble break.

[Brian Windhorst]

And Cooper flag playing together for the next decade. That's going to be.

[Tim MacMahon]

Well, well, first off, hold on, let me just cover one more thing in the, in the event of Chris Bosch, because I know that's what people may be thinking about. Chris Bosch is. So one of the things is if, if you get a blood. Like I've had a blood clot. I was on treatment for six months. The blood clot cleared, I was off treatment. I can still remember where I was when they called and told me that I could dump the pills. I was, I was in Denver for covering a game. I was so excited because I hated those pills. If you get another blood clot, there's a decent Chance that you will be on the blood thinners the rest of your life. Again, not everybody is that case, but that is generally the case. Also when a blood clot, they can tie it to something. You know, I remember Serena Williams had a blood clot and it and it got into her lung and it what they call pulmonary embolism when it gets into your lung. She stepped on glass or something, she was in Germany I think, and she stepped on glass and she cut her foot. And long story short, that injury led to her having a blood clot that went to her chest. Sometimes you have blood clots after surgery. Okay. If they identify sometimes what happens with with young athletes. Stefania Bell, our medical specialist at ESPN was talking about this. People who do things over their head, you see it in pitchers, you know, repetitive motion where they're throwing basketball over the over the head motion. Sometimes with young athletes especially there's some action with the rib and the movement there that can cause clots in your shoulder. So that is probably why. Probably, I don't know for sure. But that is probably why the spurs are so optimistic because they know an exact cause of it. They can tie it to that. It's not a chronic condition, which in the case of Chris Bosh, the medical people thought that it was, which meant he would have to be on the medication. Okay, I just want to cover that.

[Bobby Marks]

More Hoop Collective podcast after this.

[Tim MacMahon]

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[Brian Windhorst]

In case you didn't know, these young.

[Bobby Marks]

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[Tim MacMahon]

Now, as far as the spurs getting Cooper flag bottoms, I'm not sure they're really in position to. To tank very much. They still have De'Aaron Fox. They still have Chris Paul. They still have Devin Vassell. They still have Harrison Barnes.

[Brian Windhorst]

Well, hold on. I mean, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on. I mean, this is.

[Bobby Marks]

Hold on, hold on.

[Brian Windhorst]

This is some silly talk. I mean, the spurs right now, I believe, are in the, what, 10th spot in the lottery.

[Bobby Marks]

Oh, in the lottery. Okay.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yeah, I'm just talking about the lobby. Like, right now. They are. They've got what, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8. Yeah, they're in the 10th spot in the lottery right now. And now Atlanta's ahead of them by several games. I mean, they're. They've got the. I mean, they. My point is, I'm not saying they're going to end up in the top three, but if they go from, like, they might have made the playoffs, they're not making the playoffs now. I mean, I. I agree. I don't think it was likely they're making the playoffs, but they could have gotten the plane in one, two games wouldn't have been out of the question.

[Bobby Marks]

It was pretty. It was pretty unlikely.

[Brian Windhorst]

Unlikely, but not impossible. They just traded for Darren Fox. They're three games out of 10th. Like, they could have got into 10th and won two games.

[Bobby Marks]

Sure, sure.

[Brian Windhorst]

Now it's much more likely they finished seventh in the lottery than 13th in the lottery, and they could very easily jump up and get lucky. I'm not saying they're going to be in the top three, but it improves their lottery situation by a lot.

[Bobby Marks]

And then, you know, the Hawks misfortune also helps the spurs odds. They have that Hawks pick. Unfortunately, Jalen Johnson's also out for the year. You know, the Hawks are likely to fade down the stretch right now, I.

[Tim MacMahon]

Think the Hawks aren't. Are not. They're. They're holding on to us to a spot. Right. They're. They're in the play in.

[Brian Windhorst]

The Hawks are currently in 8th in the east and I believe, I believe Overall it'd be 13th or 14th in the. But still, look, they could fall off again. They're. They've got multiple bites at the apple here.

[Tim MacMahon]

I'm just saying, as of right now, San Antonio, assuming The Hawks finish eighth, if, if it froze right now, they have a 3% chance at the top pick, which is their own pick for going first. If they were.

[Brian Windhorst]

Sorry, go ahead.

[Tim MacMahon]

They are three games ahead of Portland, who are ahead of, you know, ahead. Portland has three more losses than them, but they're tied in the win column, so they could control it. And they're four losses, quote, unquote, ahead of Chicago and five losses ahead of Brooklyn. It's not out. And Philadelphia, it's out of the real possibility if they try, they could get to like, sixth, which would increase their chances to 8% and 34% to be.

[Bobby Marks]

In the top four, which it makes sense to do. The reason, the reason that we were talking about tanking last year for the spurs, like Victor really wants to win. Victor's competitive. Victor, unfortunately, is not part of this the rest of the season. It makes sense to ease up on the gas pedal now for the spurs for the final, whatever, third of the season.

[Brian Windhorst]

I mean, to me, it's not even about easing up on the gas pedal. It's just that the team is just not going to be very good. I mean, be. I had, I had Dean Oliver and Stats Williams run our BPI projections after this to see where the spurs would land.

[Tim MacMahon]

I'll bet you did. I'll bet you did.

[Brian Windhorst]

I was just curious because. Because of this very question. And they went. They were Projected to win 37 games by BPI as of this morning. And after running the numbers again, they're projected to win 32 and a half and be seventh in the lottery.

[Bobby Marks]

So I don't know if you saw the fine print on our bet, but the stipulation was Wimby plays 50 games minimum.

[Tim MacMahon]

Yes. There is no. Okay, let's deal with this. I had a friend of mine who said to me a couple days ago, he goes, hey, what what was the bet number? He was like, very interested in it. And I was like, I don't know where they left it. He's like, how do you not know? Like 30.

[Bobby Marks]

35 and a half was the actual number.

[Brian Windhorst]

35 and a half. After a lot of attempts by McMahon to lower it.

[Tim MacMahon]

All right, so 35 and a half. It's okay. So they have 30 games remaining. They are 23 and 29. They need to go. What?

[Brian Windhorst]

They need to go 14 and 16.

[Tim MacMahon]

I don't know. McMahon.

[Bobby Marks]

Not. That's not an accurate.

[Brian Windhorst]

That's not.

[Bobby Marks]

No, they need to go 13 and 17. 13 and 17, which they no longer have any motivation over.

[Brian Windhorst]

35 and a half, 36 games.

[Bobby Marks]

There was the win, the 50 game minimum that was implied in a bet.

[Tim MacMahon]

They have 23 wins. They.

[Brian Windhorst]

I did the math in my head wrong. Correct.

[Tim MacMahon]

13, 13. So they have the 11th hardest schedule left.

[Brian Windhorst]

And by the way, they're. They're eight points per 100. They're. They're negative eight on the season with Victor off the court. And they're ten and a half points worse with him off the court than on the court, naturally, because he's awesome. But, like, they're going to be a really bad team now, which, like, in the long run is totally fine. Even if they end up with the seventh pick in a loaded draft instead of the 13th pick, like, that's a win for them, assuming Victor is fine.

[Tim MacMahon]

Here's the thing, McMahon. They got two games. They haven't played the Cavs yet at all. So they got two games left with the Cavs, they got a game left with the Thunder, they got a game left with the Celtics, a game left with the Grizzlies, a game left with the Knicks and a game left with the Nuggets. It's not.

[Bobby Marks]

It's a good. It's a good thing that the bet's off the board.

[Brian Windhorst]

Okay. And just for context sake, by the way, a two and a plus two and a half net rating, which is what they are with Victor, that. That would be 12th in the league where Houston is minus 7.9, would be 28th, just ahead of the Nets at minus 8 per hour. Okay, so now, as you know. Games now.

[Bobby Marks]

Yes.

[Tim MacMahon]

As you know, when you have a situation, when you're like holding a ticket in Vegas with any sportsbook that's likely to lose, sometimes they'll negotiate trying to buy their way out of the bet. Is there any negotiation now, like McMahon, if I were you, what I would try to do is I would surrender the bet. But I would try to get the terms of the meal agreed to, because the terms of the meal were not really agreed to. And he could. He could get you on this.

[Bobby Marks]

So 50 game minimum, the bets.

[Brian Windhorst]

I don't. I don't. First of all, I. I'm not really concerned about this meal anyway, but it's going to be. It was just a fun bet anyway to me.

[Tim MacMahon]

Okay. If that's the case, McMahon, now's your time to negotiate. Do I have to do it for you?

[Bobby Marks]

He agreed to the 50 game minimum for Wimby. It's over. Like, it was a fun bet. Unfortunately, the. The. The terms weren't reached to make it an actual wager.

[Brian Windhorst]

Look, the amount of squirreling around you've done on this, when this began with you declaring that the spurs are going to be over 500, and then sprinted away from that faster than Usain Bolt, and it turned into you dropping it farther and farther down as it went, and then tried to lower it below 35 several times.

[Bobby Marks]

That last part's true. I said I thought they had 40 win potential, and they were disappointed. You know, the other thing is Wimpy. And in all seriousness, real quick, the. The spurs had started to really struggle, like, for, I don't know, the month or so, leading in the All Star break. And, like, people have been noticing, like, man, Wimby looks fatigued. Wimby looks tired. I mean, there were times where he was lagging behind the action and kind of run up the court. You could tell when he's tired because it's like his limbs kind of start flailing everywhere as he's, you know, 10ft behind the action.

[Tim MacMahon]

I thought he looked really tired the second game in. In Paris, but then again.

[Brian Windhorst]

Well, he got sick. Didn't he get sick there and was dealing with that for a while.

[Bobby Marks]

He got. He got sick in Memphis, right?

[Tim MacMahon]

Well, he was. I felt he was under the weather, and, I mean, he sounded under the weather to me, but then this person's like, no, no, he's fine.

[Brian Windhorst]

Right.

[Bobby Marks]

But now all. All this. All these fatigue makes sense.

[Brian Windhorst]

Well, maybe you don't. I mean, who knows how long he's been. I don't really want to turn into the doctor thing on that. I mean, the one thing that's disappointing that we haven't.

[Bobby Marks]

I went to college for eight years, dude.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yes, you certainly did. The one. The one thing that we haven't talked about with this whole thing that I think is the one disappointing part of this for the Spur. Well, I mean, beyond him Being having an issue, but they just make this the Aaron Fox trade.

[Bobby Marks]

Right.

[Brian Windhorst]

And I mean, the other parallel to Chris Bosh, which hopefully is the only parallel to the Chris Bosh thing, was I remember also being at that all star game in 2016 and talking to Chris and being around some people in the Heat and they were really excited to see what the Dwayne way Goran Dragic, Chris boss team was going to look like. And I remember correctly, Brian, I don't think Gorandragon, Chris Bosh ever played one game together because right after that, yeah, I think that's forever. He might have played one or two, but it was like it was the same kind of thing. They made the trade right at the deadline, then they go into the All Star break and right before the deadline, then they go into the All Star break and it was like they wanted to see what this is going to look like. And now the Aaron Fox of Chris Bosch or Chris Bosh, Darren Fox, Victor Wimanyama play three or four games together. And now that growth process is on hold. And the next couple months for the spurs really going to be about watching that partnership form and start to see how they fit together, having Stefan Castle play with those guys, seeing where they all fit together, figuring out the kind of pieces you want to have around those guys going forward. And I mean, you could still talk about that stuff and think about that stuff, but that is the one real negative on court downside is that you lose a couple months of, I think, really important time to assess your roster going into what could be a pretty interesting off season for San Antonio to figure out exactly the kind of players you want to have around those guys. Now you have a big chunk of that missing. And it's, you know, the spurs are obviously going to play far differently without Victor than they will when they hopefully have him back in the fall.

[Bobby Marks]

Well, Chris Paul, as CP3 said, you can't replace Vic. He said, I can't stand on somebody's shoulders and block every shot in the pain.

[Brian Windhorst]

By the way, Chris could do that. He would have done that very.

[Tim MacMahon]

He's thought of that season for the Spurs. Pop has the stroke, which no one's really talked about. Pop had the stroke at the arena before a game. You know, I. What do you want? You know, it was not a good day. All right. Thankfully, he's okay in recovering. This is a difficult situation. I'm not comparing the. The De'Aaron Fox trade to a medical situation, but that, you know, the spurs don't typically make major trades in season that was a, you know, you know, destabilized them. They've had some other stuff happen that I'm not going to go into, that I won't publicize, but they had some other stuff happen. It's not important to the basketball team, but it happened to the spurs family. And so it's just been. It's been a rough year for such. Be such a celebratory year. They make the trip to Paris, it's a huge success. And, you know, this was a year they thought maybe they could make the playoffs. They go get Chris Paul. Some. Some years things go really well and some years they don't. And fortunately, everybody is going to be okay after this. But, you know, it's just. It's been a traumatic year. And in talking to people with the spurs today, that was what they referred to like, man, this is. This has been a rough year.

[Bobby Marks]

Yeah. And Chris Paul, who's the lone member of the organization who spoke after shoot around, you know, he's the guy who they said, okay, hey, this is going to be our essentially spokesman. You know, he mentioned that. And obviously the pop situation, everybody hopes that he, that he recovers fully, but, you know, that is, I mean, a legend in this league who suddenly is just gone. There's just tremendous uncertainty around that. And then Wimby is the guy that the entire franchise is being reconstructed around now. Much more optimism. It's a very scary thing, a blood clot. But they are very optimistic that this is again, isolated, full recovery, but still a very scary thing. And the guy you're building everything around is now just gone for the rest of the season. And a guy who, like, as CP3 mentioned, just. I mean, this dude cares, this dude competes, this guy lives and breathes this stuff and basketball is being yanked away from him. So just, you know, like there's CP3 said he knows that. That wimy will attack everything in the best possible way. But just from kind of a middle and psychological standpoint, this sort of a situation is a massive challenge for a young guy.

[Tim MacMahon]

You know, I was watching the Court of Gold documentary on Netflix, which I have been told that we have a cameo in the hoopa.

[Brian Windhorst]

I have been told also I haven't seen it yet, though.

[Tim MacMahon]

I hope. I hope we were properly, you know, hope Bontemps was cut out of it.

[Bobby Marks]

Is that aggregated?

[Brian Windhorst]

I was told. I was told it was a perfectly on brand pod moment in a positive way. So.

[Tim MacMahon]

Okay, good.

[Brian Windhorst]

I think we came off well.

[Tim MacMahon]

I think maybe it was when I was in the. The Rage room or whatever, the seven deadly sin room.

[Brian Windhorst]

It was, it was about, it was. It was going into a part about the turmoil around the French national team. And I believe is when we were discussing are the French. Is the French national team any good at the Olympics? I believe is the part that was in there.

[Tim MacMahon]

Well, anyway, clearly we were. We were wrong because they made the final. But seeing Pop, you know, give interviews in that, you know, it's like, you know, I haven't heard from him in a while. You miss them, you know, even when the, Even when the spurs are irrelevant as a team, which obviously they are not. Now, Pop always made his presence in the, in the league felt so, you know, you miss him.

[Brian Windhorst]

He's a part of the league our entire adult lives for sure. So it's quite a.

[Tim MacMahon]

Quite a. I've been an adult for a long time too. Got it. Starting to.

[Bobby Marks]

Starting to feel I've never been one.

[Tim MacMahon]

That's true. All right, well, best of luck to. I. I bet this is, you know, obviously I haven't talked to him, but knowing Victor a little bit, I'll bet this is absolutely devastating to him.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yeah, it's driving anyone. Brian.

[Tim MacMahon]

Right. All right, now we're going to pivot to the Wonder Boy, which is a book coming out. Luka Doncic and the Curse of Greatness.

[Bobby Marks]

Damn it. I don't have my copy to hold up right now.

[Tim MacMahon]

You. You should do a signing in Austin. That would be. You should arrange for that. The Hachette Book Group.

[Bobby Marks]

I actually have some hardcover copies that were delivered. I signed one for my daughter and she's like, oh, my roommate might be interested in this. And I gave one to old Michael Cor.

[Tim MacMahon]

What about her boyfriend?

[Bobby Marks]

The guy wears cowboy boots. I don't think he's a big basketball fan.

[Tim MacMahon]

Good. That might be good for you, actually. All right, so I watched this game that the Lakers played against the Hornets on Wednesday. Was the only game in the NBA. McMahon Luca just is not himself.

[Bobby Marks]

No, this is the Luca that the Mavericks had for the five and eight start this season. And you know, it's. It's very similar. That time he was coming back off a 25 day absence for what we later found out was not just a calf contusion, but also a calf sprain. This one, I, I don't know how many days it was, but it was whatever. Six weeks. This is the longest absence injury absence of his career. Now, it does not appear that the, the weight is an issue like it was early in the season. But he doesn't have his legs. Like when Luca doesn't have his legs, he's a really poor three point shooter, you know, and we're seeing that he's shooting 20 point something percent for the Lakers. He, he doesn't have his rhythm. You know, the guy's got 11 turnovers over the last two games, which are, by the way, losses to the Charlotte Hornets and Utah Jazz. You know, like Luca so far for the Lakers has been a poor offensive player. That's not going to continue. I mean, come on.

[Tim MacMahon]

No, I mean, the man, the man can score 35 without even feels, if you know what I'll say about Luca is that when I've watched Luca games where I watch it and it's like, okay, he lumbered around out there for 35 minutes. He. Yeah, I remember him throwing in a few shots. Yeah, I remember him having a couple of assists. Let me see what is. Oh, he had 37, 12 and nine. Oh, I guess he played pretty good.

[Bobby Marks]

Like this is a guy who, he's had a, a 60 point triple double. You know, just right before he got hurt, he had a 45 point triple double against the Warriors. You know, he's had 50 point, 15 assist performances. He will get back into that form, but he's not there now. He's going to probably need some time. He's sitting out tonight in what they play in Portland, I believe. Correct. So he's, he's, he's, he's resting on a back to back. Like he's very. This is essentially a second preseason for Luca just because of, of the circumstances now. He's, and he's, you know, it's, it's a new system. It's new teammates, it's new surroundings. You know, the, the emotional devastation, frankly, of him basically getting dumped very publicly by the Mavericks and kind of the shock. So there's a lot going on and I think it'll be a little bit before he's the Luca that people are used to seeing. Although I would not be shocked if we got a glimpse of that next week when the Mavericks are in town.

[Tim MacMahon]

I actually think it could be the best thing for him. I mean, you don't want him to overdo it. But like, because one of the things I'm seeing, absolutely, his legs are not under him. No doubt about that. He's deferring, which is, which is the most predictable thing ever. Which, of course he's deferring. He's coming into this team. LeBron James is on it. Austin reaves the 10 games before Luka got There, Austin Reeves is averaging like 26, 27 points. Not that Luka doesn't see himself as higher on the food chain than Austin Reaves, but I watch it. He throws the ball to Austin Reeves and stands on the wing. Okay, that's not how it's going to go. It's going to go, Luka. Take the ball, dominate the usage and be yourself. That's what eventually is going to need to happen. I don't know what's going to happen, but it's going to happen on Tuesday in la.

[Bobby Marks]

Yeah, I would, I think that we might see, we'll definitely see full blown sneering Luca on Tuesday in la. Now listen, I will point out playing with Luca is a major adjustment, right? And the one time that a co star was brought in and plugged right in the lineup at the trade deadline, the Mavericks ended up tanking down the stretch of that season. And I'm talking about obviously when Kyrie came in. And honestly, if you looked at their numbers as a duo, the Mavericks stunk. Defensively was the biggest problem. Like they were still scoring a lot of points. Like their, their offense, break and all that was actually very good. With those guys on the floor, they were just such a bad defensive team. They had such a bad supporting cast, but there was a lot of that and they couldn't win clutch games. And a big factor of them not being able to win clutch games was. It was kind of that deferring. And you know, man, I really respect, you know, kind of the, too much mutual respect, not want to step on each other's toes. There was that, the, the, that moment. I don't know if you guys remember, but it was Kyrie's first home game. Kyrie goes. They're down against the Wolves. Kyrie has an unbelievable fourth quarter. I mean, just one of the best like shot making scoring quarters that I've ever seen to bring him back in it. And then down the stretch there, you know, with the game on the line, Luke and Kyrie kind of bounced, you know, pass the ball back and forth, back and forth, back and forth until, you know, it becomes a turnover because Kyrie coughs it up. And so now Luke has to go through that same kind of adjustment period with LeBron while coming back off of a long injury absence and trying to, you know, he's still got to try to play his way into normal regular season condition. More Hoop Collective podcast after this.

[Brian Windhorst]

Get in the zone.

[Bobby Marks]

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[Brian Windhorst]

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[Tim MacMahon]

Yeah, happy to be here.

[Brian Windhorst]

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[Tim MacMahon]

With the rotors free?

[Brian Windhorst]

Really, really free.

[Tim MacMahon]

Okay. I also need some oil.

[Bobby Marks]

Would you like an oil filter with that? Yeah.

[Tim MacMahon]

How much is that?

[Bobby Marks]

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[Tim MacMahon]

With five quarts of oil. Free.

[Bobby Marks]

Really, really free.

[Brian Windhorst]

It's part of the A to Z savings event. You might as well call it a to free at AutoZone. Get in the zone. Auto zone restrictions apply. I can say to my new Samsung.

[Tim MacMahon]

Galaxy S25 Ultra, hey, find a keto.

[Brian Windhorst]

Friendly restaurant nearby and text it to Beth and Steve.

[Tim MacMahon]

And it does without me lifting a finger so I can get in more.

[Brian Windhorst]

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[Tim MacMahon]

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[Bobby Marks]

So you can do you get [e-mail].

[Brian Windhorst]

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[Bobby Marks]

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[Brian Windhorst]

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[Tim MacMahon]

Check responses for accuracy.

[Brian Windhorst]

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[Bobby Marks]

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[Brian Windhorst]

Visit betterhelp.com today to get 10% off your first month. That's betterhelphelp.com foreign I certainly agree with all that. I mean, the other thing that was just amusing about that game in the last, you know, couple weeks is this ongoing saga involving Mark Williams. Mark Williams, who played, started and played in the game Wednesday night without incident, was on the court down the stretch as the Hornets won in crunch time and beat the Lakers on their home court. And then we had, I would say, a fairly interesting statement from Jeff Schwartz disseminated to the media this afternoon. Brian, you know, we talked about that earlier.

[Tim MacMahon]

Yeah, Jeff Schwartz is one of the top agents. Long standing agent. Jeff Swartz does not bs. You know, he is, you know, he can be a pleasant guy, but I certainly wouldn't want to negotiate against him. And so he put out a statement kind of, kind of out of nowhere. I don't know why. Now, this was his statement. The overwhelming sentiment after conferring with multiple nationally recognized doctors is that the Los Angeles Lakers should not have failed Mark Williams on his physical. And, you know, you might say, well, what's the point of that? The point of it is to send a message to the entire league that the Mark Williams is not damaged goods, because that's the premise that comes out of it. And, you know, the truth is Mark Williams is in his third season. At the conclusion of this season, he can negotiate a contract extension with the Hornets or maybe they trade him. I mean, they already traded him once, maybe they'll trade him again. I don't know. But, you know, basically what's happened, whether the Lakers, you know, were correct or incorrect and passing a physical isn't binary. It's not yes or no. I mean, ultimately that's what it comes down to. But the. It's subjective. The doctors have to decide. You know, they. Jeff Schwartz obviously feels that the Lakers damaged Mark. Mark Williams's reputation and damaged his value. And he's trying to fight back to protect against his, you know, his value being damaged. And he's doing it by releasing a statement to everybody. And he doesn't do that normally. You know, Jeff Swartz is not, not a, not a guy who gets quoted very often.

[Bobby Marks]

Well, and then there was, you know, last week, the statement from the Hornets. And basically the implication here is the Lakers had buyer's remorse. They gave up a lot to make that deal.

[Tim MacMahon]

You know, Mark Williams himself pretty much said the. Now, he didn't use those words, but he gave quotes in LA Wednesday night, and he pretty much said that they, you know, they changed their mind.

[Bobby Marks]

I, you could certainly say it was an overpay. Again, I think you had to look at it as kind of connected to the Luca trade. But they gave up everything that the Mavs allowed. Point Nico Harrison allowed Polinka to keep in his pocket in the Luca trade, basically.

[Brian Windhorst]

Look, the near universal opinion around the league was that the Hornets got a hell of a deal for Mark Williams, not that Mark Williams can't be a very good player. And maybe this turns out to be the failed Tyson Chandler trade, like we've talked about before, where they, the Thunder failed his physical on the toe issue and he went on to have an incredible career. And it's one of the real sliding door what if moments of the past 20 years. What if Tyson Chandler was on that Thunder team with those young fellas? Like that would have been. They would have been the perfect center to play with those guys. But, you know, at the same time, Mark Williams has missed 60% of the games he could have played so far in his career, roughly. And he's enormous and could become a really good player and certainly would be a fun lob threat for Luka Doncic. But it also was a lot to give up for a guy who's missed a ton of games and is certainly a, a far from finished product at both ends of the court. Like that's, you know, it was a big bet on Mark Williams and won the Lakers for, you know, whatever reason ultimately decided after the physical they weren't ready to make and has led to everything that's happened since.

[Bobby Marks]

Yeah, by the way, looking forward again to the Mavericks visit to LA to face her old pal Luca next week. We did get an Anthony Davis update today and it's, you know, not necessarily a definitive update, but it's the first official update from the Mavericks since his diagnosis of a left adductor strain. And that is he will be, he's making good progress in quote and will be reevaluated in two weeks. So he's going to miss at least seven more games by the way. Also means he's not going to be all NBA eligible defensive player of the year. All that he will not play in the return to la. Now Max Christie, old super Max Christie, the only supermax that Nico wants in Dallas, you know, he's hey, I'm telling you man, this guy has been a really, really, really good player in his brief Mavericks tenure and I think there's a very real chance that he was going to be the primary defender on Luca. My assumption is PJ Washington gets the LeBron assignment and I think Max was.

[Tim MacMahon]

A PJ Washington update today too, which was positive.

[Brian Windhorst]

He should be the, he should be the primary option on Luco Jay practiced.

[Bobby Marks]

They listened to his question. I think there's a pretty good chance that he plays tomorrow against Pelicans today for the people listening to the podcast. But yeah, super Max Christie defending just regular Max Luca I think is a, is an interesting little subplot there.

[Tim MacMahon]

Can I just say that, you know, the, the last 10 or 12 games before the trade, as you know, the lakers had gone 101 in that stretch. They were the number one defense in the league. Now AD did miss some of those games. Then they traded their two best defensive players.

[Brian Windhorst]

I don't know, maybe Max Christie was really coming. I think you would think they were the two best defense players. Max Christie had already become a very good player and had a great couple of months there and was really emerging. Has only continued that. I mean my question McMahon just to shift back to the Mass for a second and we talked about at the time of the trade when these guys are whole, I feel like he's going to be starting over Klay Thompson At.

[Bobby Marks]

I don't, I don't. I. And I think you can, you can make a case for why that would make sense. But there's an understanding of how important that status as a starter is to Klay Thompson, especially after having it briefly taken away from him last year with the Warriors. Now Klay Thompson's a 25 minute per game player. I think he will continue to do that as a starter. And, you know, I think Max Christie will be closing games over him. You know, Clay might close games, but it's a very case to case basis and it has been for a while now. AD's out at least two more weeks. You know, they say Live and Gaffer are going to get reevaluated in two weeks, that those guys are going to be out for a while longer after that.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yeah, I mean, this is when they have AJ Washington and a center. So then it's like, who's the fifth starter with Kyrie?

[Bobby Marks]

That's the question. I believe that if they get to that point where they are, you know, relatively healthy and they have the option of playing that big lineup, Clay will continue to start. Max Christie will continue to play a lot of minutes and likely close.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yeah, I mean, I guess my point is he should be starting whether he is or not. And I think the fact that he'd likely be closing most, if not all games would be a recognition that he's the better player at this point and should be the guy doing that whether he starts or not. Like you said, there's other factors that potentially go into that.

[Tim MacMahon]

Did you guys hear that crazy stat that Bill McDonald was giving on the Lakers broadcast last night about Jackson Hayes? I know it's a bit of a non sequitur, but I wanted to get it in there since I was talking about Laker stats before I was so rudely interrupted. Jackson Hayes has made his last 16 baskets, his last 16 attempts, and all of them are dunks.

[Brian Windhorst]

I mean, again, Mark Williams is probably the best, one of the best dunkers in the league. And you could see at least the theory of why they would trade for him because.

[Tim MacMahon]

Right.

[Brian Windhorst]

Lucas sets up a lot of dunks and Jackson Hayes getting passes from LeBron and Luca has gotten a lot of dunks.

[Tim MacMahon]

So I know, I'm not stunned by.

[Brian Windhorst]

That stat, I guess, just from watching it a little bit.

[Tim MacMahon]

Yeah, so there was a lot of updates on players on Thursday. One of them was very, well, the victor. One was the most upsetting, but the one that was really the most, you know, lasting, I guess, was that Bobby Portis was suspended for 25 games for violating the drug policy. And that's a. You know, he's. He's not a starter, but he's an incredibly important player to the Bucks.

[Bobby Marks]

He's one of the best six men in the league.

[Tim MacMahon]

And he's just, you know, Brook Lopez, his role is just smaller than it's been. They need. They need him. He was their third leading score before they traded for Kuzma. You know, he was their third leading scorer after Damon Giannis. And because. Because Middleton and Lopez just have. Have had deteriorated a little bit. And when you hear that's a drug suspension, you're you first. Your mind goes, oh, it must be peds. But no, it's. It was for a painkiller. And from what I understand, you know, Mark Bartlestein, his agent, was very proactive on trying to explain what happened here, as was Bobby. It was over Thanksgiving and he. He was dealing with his elbow injury and he wasn't able to go. He had been getting this treatment of painkiller that was allowed and some. He was like, oh, man, I. I'm going to. I don't know if I'll be able to play tomorrow because I wasn't able to get this just treatment, you know, closed for Thanksgiving. And his assistant said, oh, I've got. I've got a pill like that. And the story is that that's was, you know, a similar, but. But banned medication. So he takes some medication over Thanksgiving that ends up getting caught in a drug screen. And. And now, you know, you look at the Bucks, the Bucks are in fifth place. They've got some breathing space between them and the play in. And I'm not saying that losing Bobby is going to cost them to plummet, but, you know, it just shrinks their margin for air, which is already. Which is already not that big because they started the season two and 12. You know, you start the season two and 12, you know, and then Giannis, you know, tweaks his calf and misses six or seven games. It's hard to overcome. Then you got this happen. It's not the kind of news that the Bucks needed bond temps.

[Brian Windhorst]

No. I mean, and again, if we're just looking at, you know, where people are in the standings, I don't think that the Bucks are in a position to fall all the way out of the top six in the East. They're five losses ahead of the teams in seventh and eighth. I guess they're four losses out of Miami in ninth, but because of games played, they're Five ahead of Orlando and Atlanta who are tied for seventh but in the loss column. But they are only two losses up on Detroit. And if you're Milwaukee, if you're looking at possibly playing Indy and Cleveland in the first two rounds of the playoffs, that is a. I'm not saying Cleveland is an appealing option, but having to play the Knicks and then in theory Boston after that, that's definitely a harder path if they fall the sixth. So I don't know.

[Bobby Marks]

Can they be.

[Tim MacMahon]

Think about that.

[Bobby Marks]

Can they beat Indy? What's the season series this year? Last year they sure could.

[Tim MacMahon]

Indy. Indy own them last year and the Cavs are 30 against them this year.

[Bobby Marks]

Give me the Bucks.

[Brian Windhorst]

I understand, I understand that. I think the Bucks. I think they've done better against the.

[Tim MacMahon]

Cavs are 30 against the Bucks.

[Bobby Marks]

Yes.

[Brian Windhorst]

Two of the, at least two of those games were without significant players for.

[Tim MacMahon]

Okay, fine. I'm just, I would just say that one time when the Cavs corner alert one time when, you know, the same week that the Bucks beat the Thunder in the NBA Cup Final and Giannis dominated in that game, like four days later they played the Cavs and the Cavs beat them and Giannis was like this is a harder team to play. Obviously the Thunder are different because they now have Holmgren back, but I'm just saying that I wouldn't necessarily agree with your premise there.

[Brian Windhorst]

Well, the Bucks have beaten the Pacers both times they've played so far this year. I'm trying to see when they play again. Don't think they play again till March. Yeah, they play twice more in March. I think on the aggregate you'd rather play Indiana and Cleveland than Boston and New York, even if for no other reason. New York is I think, pretty clearly seen as a.

[Tim MacMahon]

You are. You would rather play the Cavs and the than the Celtics. That's just true.

[Brian Windhorst]

And you'd rather play that you'd rather play the paces in the Knicks. It's just, it's a harder path. Like doesn't. Again, not saying they're going to beat any of them the way their season's.

[Tim MacMahon]

Gone, but I, I don't know for the Bucks if I would. I, I don't know if that's an automatic yes, but okay, it's.

[Brian Windhorst]

I think if you, I think if you ask non Cavs corner residents they would say the other two.

[Tim MacMahon]

I'm just saying I'm, I'm, I'm in Pacer's corner right now. I'm not, not so much in cast corner I agree. You'd rather play the Cavs and the Sun.

[Bobby Marks]

That's Pacers Parkway regardless.

[Brian Windhorst]

That is to me the interesting thing to watch is where it is Milwaukee. And look, Milwaukee is only one game back of Indiana right now and home court could matter in that series too. And you know, be honest is dealing with this calf issue. They're going to basically have not have Bobby Fortis for the entire rest of the regular season. They don't have a lot of depth as it is. You know, it's, it's just something to.

[Tim MacMahon]

Look, I don't know how this season is going to end up for the Bucks, but they've gotten pretty unlucky. They won the title in 21. In 22, I think they had 58 wins. They're the. No, that's where the Celtics.

[Brian Windhorst]

Middleton got hurt against the Bulls.

[Tim MacMahon]

Middleton got hurt against the Bulls. They lose. Were they, they couldn't have been the top seed because Boston had home court in game seven.

[Brian Windhorst]

They were the second and they were the either they were two and three seeds, I believe.

[Tim MacMahon]

Okay, well, they were a great team and I, I think they would, I, I covered that series. I think you covered some of that series. Bondemps. They would have won in my view. Even though Jason Tatum had an iconic game six to force Game seven. I think the Bucs win that series and that would have maybe meant they went to the finals.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yeah, they didn't. They got to game seven. And Khris Middleton, their second best player or third best player, depending on where you ranked him. And Drew Holiday, he didn't play the entire series. So yes, it's fair to say they would have been favored to win if he was able to play.

[Tim MacMahon]

Then the following year they were awesome. The number one overall seed, if I'm not mistaken. And Giannis didn't win the mvp, but he probably could have easily could have.

[Brian Windhorst]

And then got hurt in the first round.

[Tim MacMahon]

He got hurt in the first round. So they won in 21. I don't know. Like I, I, I brought up this theory in front of Bob Myers recently like in the green room at Countdown, and Bob gave me the strongest side eye you could possibly give because I was, you know, implying that the warriors might not have beaten the Bucks because they beat the Celtics. So I don't know what would have happened, but I think they would have had a fighting chance in 22. In 23, they were the number one overall seed. You know, Denver was an absolute load. Maybe they don't beat Denver, but in either those three years they Arguably could have won two or three and they got one.

[Brian Windhorst]

Just a reminder that to win the title, you have to get lucky. And part of lucky is being healthy.

[Tim MacMahon]

Last year, I don't think anybody was beating the Celtics in the East. I don't think so. But we'll never know because Giannis gets hurt right there at the end of the regular season. So they win in 21 and then 22, 23, 24. Either Giannis or Milton are hurt when it matters, and now they're, you know, going to be struggling potentially to, you know, have to play without home court advantage in the first two rounds.

[Bobby Marks]

Yep, Bob has a. Bob has a lot of rings. I Wonder if that 20, 22 one was fitted for one of his middle fingers. Would have been appropriate response for him to show you it.

[Tim MacMahon]

Well, listen, I don't ever want to take anything away as, you know, winning a championship means ever saying you're sorry.

[Bobby Marks]

And winning four means telling you to go.

[Tim MacMahon]

And that one, you're right. And that one was especially meaningful to the warriors organization because they had gone to rock bottom and built themselves back up.

[Bobby Marks]

Well. And it was, it was post kd. You know, like, let's just be real. Not there's bitterness from the warriors to KD or anything, but it was that group at before and that group after kd.

[Tim MacMahon]

Steph could have night nighted the Milwaukee crowd just as easily as he Knight knighted TD Garden. So. But I'm just saying we'll never know. And I see, I just. There's this ramping up of people saying, well, the Bucks, blah, blah, blah, the season's a failure, blah, blah. The Bucks had a. Have been championship contenders for six or seven years. They had this three year run where they were absolutely in the center of it and they did get one. They raised a banner like they did good, you know, and they've had some bad luck. They could have, they could have had some good luck maybe and gotten another one. They had bad luck.

[Brian Windhorst]

It's very hard. Look, people, people sort of just the people like to gloss over the fact that it's just incredibly hard to win and you have to get really lucky. And a huge part of that is just having your team available. Like, look, the warriors, the Cavs needed a lot of breaks to win in 2016. They got them all. Like, that's okay. Doesn't make anything less important. The, you know, certainly, you know, you look at some of these other runs that teams have had. You know, last year Boston played a bunch of teams that had guys injured, their guys are relatively healthy doesn't mean any less. Same with when the bucks won in 21. Like, that's. Again, that's part of it is just getting through the thing healthy and surviving. And if you give your. The whole. That's why the whole goal is to try to give yourself as many chances as possible and to be in the mix as many times as you can. And it's a big part of why. To go back to the Luca stuff.

[Bobby Marks]

Yes.

[Brian Windhorst]

It's why so many people in the league think the Luca trade was insane, because you automatically have dramatically shortened your championship window for no other reason than you traded a guy who's 25 for a guy who's about to be 32. And like, you just. There's a reason that never happens.

[Bobby Marks]

And Nico Harrison's own words. They're built to win now and in the future. And the future is a three to four year time frame. Whereas, hey, maybe they end up being right about Lucas Body breaking down and all that. But you look at a guy who's 25 years old and you think you got probably a decade long Runway with him.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yeah. You have a guy like Giannis or that's why you're one of those guys. It's. You're. That's the kind of window you and.

[Tim MacMahon]

Yanis still has Runway left. And that's why people are watching that, because the. The Bucks organization is. They've. They've robbed Peter to pay Paul. They've traded all the picks. They're spending tens of millions of dollars. They're losing all kinds of money. They're way into the luxury tax. So. But that's either here nor there. We'll see how that plays out. We'll just keep an eye on that in the second half. They're playing tonight against the Clippers. Okay. Giannis is supposed to come back. All right, you guys got to go to work. Thank you, Mr. Bontems. Thank you, Mr. McMahon. Thank you to Jackson, our producer. Last chance, McMahon to settle on a restaurant. We've settled Olive Garden.

[Bobby Marks]

The bet. The bet. The bet is off. Is that a sponsor? The bet is if McMahon is going.

[Brian Windhorst]

To get obliterated when people hear him.

[Bobby Marks]

Read the fine print on the bet ticket.

[Brian Windhorst]

That's all I'm going to say.

[Bobby Marks]

Read the fine print on the bet ticket.

[Brian Windhorst]

I'm going to say.

[Bobby Marks]

All I'm gonna say.

[Brian Windhorst]

I'm gonna. People are gonna just sprint, just laugh at you, just attempt. Nobody sprint away again.

[Bobby Marks]

Nobody will ever sprint to your defense. I can promise you that.

[Tim MacMahon]

All right. Thank you. We'll talk to you later or actually next week.

[Bobby Marks]

Amigos and hokum.

[Tim MacMahon]

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