SGA & Thunder Make A Statement, How A Suspension Created ‘A Nicer Draymond’

Summary

Podcast Summary: "SGA & Thunder Make A Statement, How A Suspension Created ‘A Nicer Draymond’"

Released on January 17, 2025, Brian Windhorst and The Hoop Collective delve deep into recent NBA developments, focusing on the Oklahoma City Thunder's impressive performance and the transformative suspension of Warriors' Draymond Green.

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1. Oklahoma City Thunder's Dominant Performance Against the Cavaliers

Overview: The Thunder delivered a commanding performance at the Paycom Center, overpowering the Cleveland Cavaliers with a decisive victory marked by strategic defense and exceptional player contributions.

Key Discussions:

• Defensive Prowess:

  • Bobby Marks highlighted the Thunder's intense defense, likening their first-quarter pressure to a similar defensive display in Miami that affected Jeremy Lynn's performance:
    "Number one absolutely is intense, high level activity defense as I've seen in years." [04:57]
  • Brian Windhorst emphasized their ability to generate turnovers, stating:
    "Best 22 points off of turnovers in the first half. They lead the league in that category with 23 and change per game." [05:01]

• Strategic Gameplay:

  • Tim MacMahon pointed out the Thunder's effective three-point shooting, citing Lou Dort's evolution into a premier shooter:
    "Dort developing into a premier three point shooter is shocking given, like, if you saw his jumper when he first was trying to break into the league." [05:49]
  • Bobby Marks commended the acquisition of Alex Caruso and his immediate impact:
    "Alex Caruso, who's having a terrible shooting season, just coming back from injury, he immediately hit two threes to break the zone." [06:21]

• Player Highlights:

  • Tim MacMahon recounted Shai Gilgeous-Alexander's stellar performance:
    "Shake. Alex Alexander had 40 points on 17 for 26, shooting 5 for 5 at the line, 1 for 5 on threes, which means he was 16 for 21 on twos, just under 80%." [06:47]
  • Brian Windhorst praised Gilgeous-Alexander's composure and control on the court:
    "He never looks like he's going full speed, right? He just... glides and he's always on balance." [07:57]

Statistical Insights:

• Point Differential: The Thunder maintained a significant lead, peaking at a 42-point advantage by the third quarter.
• Turnover Impact: Accumulated 22 points from turnovers in the first half alone.
• Shooting Efficiency: Lou Dort improved his three-point shooting to 41.5% for the season before the game.

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2. Draymond Green's Suspension and Path to Redemption

Overview: The episode shifts focus to Draymond Green of the Golden State Warriors, exploring how his suspension served as a catalyst for personal and professional growth, resulting in a more composed and effective player.

Key Discussions:

• Impact of Suspension:

  • Ohm Youngmisuk shares insights from his exclusive interview with Draymond Green, revealing the psychological journey post-suspension:
    "Draymond said the therapy that you did during the suspension help you to where you are today to come in more locked in." [29:18]
  • Draymond’s Therapy Sessions:
    "He felt like all the therapy he had gone to with his two therapists and all the things he had talked to them were now playing out on these calls, and it was working." [31:57]

• Behavioral Changes:

  • Ohm Youngmisuk observes noticeable improvements in Green's demeanor and playstyle:
    "The measure is basically one ejection so far compared to four ejections last year." [38:08]
  • Brian Windhorst notes Green's enhanced control and strategic on-court decisions:
    "By this time last year, he had had three ejections, basically. So he was obviously dealing with a lot of stuff last year, and this year he looks to be in a better headspace." [41:05]

• Future Outlook:

  • Ohm Youngmisuk discusses the sustainability of Draymond's improved behavior and the potential for continued growth:
    "Steve Kerr said every time it could have boiled over, it didn't, and he didn't cross that line. And that's why we won the game." [39:33]
  • Tim MacMahon speculates on the possibility of Draymond maintaining his progress:
    "One bad game against this team does not erase what the Cavs did last week, nor does it erase anything we said about their legitimacy this season." [53:14]

Notable Quotes:

• Draymond Green on Therapy:
  "I've never been on a couch with my feet up. Maybe I need to try it." [35:00]
• Tim MacMahon on Green’s Progress:
  "He hasn't completely crossed it yet. He hasn't had that incident like a Nurkage incident." [39:00]

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3. Golden State Warriors' Trade Strategy and Team Dynamics

Overview: The discussion transitions to the Golden State Warriors' approach to team building, emphasizing a cautious yet strategic stance on trades and player acquisitions to maintain championship contention.

Key Discussions:

• Trade Philosophy:

  • Ohm Youngmisuk analyzes Warriors' reluctance to make significant trades without guaranteed superstar additions:
    "They are not going to take a massive swing. Before holding their assets for a true superstar becomes available." [44:26]
  • Tim MacMahon agrees, highlighting the importance of preserving assets for potential high-impact trades:
    "The way they are playing, it's very easy to look at it and say there's no point in trying to make a... middling upgrade." [47:17]

• Team Composition and Future Prospects:

  • Bobby Marks reflects on the Warriors' history of aggressive trades and player development:
    "They have made major acquisitions. Kevin Durant being grade A example." [50:52]
  • Ohm Youngmisuk discusses the balance between immediate improvements and long-term strategy:
    "They don't want to look like they're asking for major trades that don't fully align with their championship aspirations." [48:08]

• Player Development:

  • Brian Windhorst emphasizes the Thunder's focus on player development as a cornerstone of their success:
    "If you just talk about player development and a franchise that is turning pieces into players, you know, again, you look at this roster." [16:54]

Notable Quotes:

• Steph Curry on Team Improvement:
  "My thing is as long as they're showing the type of effort that I show on the court." [51:19]
• Ohm Youngmisuk on Trade Timing:
  "Saving your assets for when the moment arrives that such a player becomes available." [52:08]

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4. Concluding Insights

Brian Windhorst wraps up the discussion by reiterating the Thunder's exceptional season, noting their pace towards a historical win record and the challenges they face with key player injuries:
"This team is 34 and 6, which puts them on pace for rounding up 70 wins. Their point differential is 13 per game." [19:17]

Final Thoughts: The episode underscores the importance of strategic defense and player development, exemplified by the Thunder, while also exploring the personal growth of Draymond Green as a testament to the transformative power of accountability and therapy. The Warriors' cautious yet hopeful approach to trades highlights the delicate balance between immediate success and long-term championship aspirations.

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For listeners who missed the episode, "SGA & Thunder Make A Statement, How A Suspension Created ‘A Nicer Draymond’" offers a comprehensive analysis of key NBA narratives, enriched with expert insights and engaging discussions from ESPN's insiders.

Transcript

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[Bobby Marks]

Welcome to Collective Podcast. We talk about the NBA, which we're doing on Friday morning. We thought we were going to be doing it on Thursday night, but McMahon apparently was hanging out with Tyler Ford after the game and made us wait till Friday morning, joining us from Miami, Florida, where he's going to the Heat Nuggets game on Friday, ostensibly because Jimmy Butler's coming back from suspension.

[Tim MacMahon]

Tim Bottemps It's a good word, Brian. Hello everybody. I don't think it's ostensibly because Jimmy Butler is coming back. I think it's because Jimmy Butler is potentially coming back and that's about it. So we'll see what happens.

[Bobby Marks]

Continue to fight through laryngitis because I'm a champion. Joining us from Joining us from Oklahoma City, Oklahoma, the site of a absolute beatdown by the Thunder tonight at the Paycom center where he is Bat McMahon.

[Brian Windhorst]

Howdy partners. And I will tell you it is still Thursday here you guys are complaining because I was taking my time getting the job done post game, getting things written up was not hanging out with Tyler Ford. Did bump into him. We're talking about our favorite little wee fellow ref. We all know him, the recent podcast guest an inspiration for the minimum height requirement that I had softened on. I had softened on because Tyler had just grown up in front of our very eyes. Or so I felt. Then I run into him in the hotel lobby this afternoon. That little punk is wearing an Oklahoma, I'm sorry, an Ohio State sweatshirt right here in SEC country. Just fresh off Ohio State beating Texas in the Cotton Bowl. I knew there was another reason I didn't like them. I let them know that and it just got me thinking, you know, Ohio State here in Oklahoma. Kind of ballsy because Baker Mayfield's the original flag planter. And Wendy, you might know this as an Ohio guy. Those those politicians up there that are lobbying to make it like a, you know, death sentence felony for planting the flag right in the middle of that O. How tall are they?

[Bobby Marks]

That was an it's embarrassing. I agree. I'm, I'm with you on that. It's an embarrassing law.

[Brian Windhorst]

They're probably about five foot five and a half and claim five seven.

[Bobby Marks]

I was going to tell you that since we did that podcast where there was some drama between James Capers and Tyler Ford over whether you wear your whistle on a lanyard or you hold it. I ran into a veteran ref recently and he didn't say anything to me. He only looked at me and he goes, no self respecting referee uses a lanyard and just walked away. I would use a lanyard if I was a referee. All right.

[Brian Windhorst]

By the way, speaking of little folks, what a victory for the little people tonight. Those wee little Oklahoma City Thunder. Chet Holgren still out. No. Isaiah Hardenstein. Here come the big bag. Cleveland Cavaliers. Jared Allen, Evan Moby. Those boys bullied them in Cleveland. Well hell, you look up midway through that 30 to 2 run in the first half. Well, it was 12 to 12 and then it wasn't. And then it was a whole lot to not much. And both Bigs were sitting on the bench in the first half. They decided to go small and try to match up with the Thunder.

[Bobby Marks]

Whoopsie daisy, the Cavs wave the white flag on that. They let the Thunder totally take them out of the game. This, this one was check marks across the board for the Thunder. Number one absolutely is intense, high level activity defense as I've seen in years. For a short stretch that first quarter, what it reminded me of was the night Lynn Sanity died here. So I'm so sorry to our friend Rob Perez. Jason Concepcion referencing Lynn Sanity in Miami. Yeah, the Miami Heat had seen enough of Jeremy Lynn and applied such a defensive intense pressure in that game that essentially the Knicks waved the white flag in the first quarter and Jeremy Lynn was never the same. He also got hurt on his knee. But so number one, absolutely. The Thunder at their pesky ball hawking pass, lane crunching, high intensity.

[Brian Windhorst]

Best 22 points off of turnovers in the first half. They lead the league in that category with 23 and change per game. Just to put that in perspective. And Kenny Atkinson said it was like there were seven pit bulls out there, not five. That's. That was his exact quote.

[Tim MacMahon]

Seven turnovers for 10 points in the first quarter. First quarter of the game.

[Bobby Marks]

And by the way, there were other possessions that weren't turnovers that essentially were because the Cavs just, you know, called mercy. So Thunder. Absolutely awesome on defense. Secondly, Thunder, Thunder crushing it from three point range. Crushing it just three, three, three Lou Dort, pump fake, Relocate. Firing up a three like he's Steph Curry. Splash, splash.

[Brian Windhorst]

Dort developing into a premier three point shooter is shocking given, like, if you saw his jumper when he first was trying to break into the league. And just a huge development because he's obviously a dominant defender. He's one of the very best 3 and D players in the league. And asked Don part of that.

[Bobby Marks]

Chip England, their shooting coach, who they hired away from San Antonio. So that was going on.

[Tim MacMahon]

Well, yeah.

[Brian Windhorst]

And then they said, Chip said, hey, I can't help you with Gideon. They traded him for Carusa.

[Bobby Marks]

Yeah. Well, at one point in the first quarter, the Cavs went to desperation zone. Now, they do play a lot of zone, but they kind of like just couldn't stop the thunder. So they went to zone. And Alex Caruso, who's having a terrible shooting season, just coming back from injury, he immediately hit two threes to break the zone. Like that's the kind of night it was. And so check mark, check mark. And then the third one, Number two.

[Tim MacMahon]

Read the stat line for number two in the game.

[Bobby Marks]

He was number two in your MVP vote last year. I don't know if he's going to be number two this year. Go ahead.

[Tim MacMahon]

So in 29 minutes through three quarters, Shake. Alex Alexander had 40 points on 17 for 26, shooting 5 for 5 at the line, 1 for 5 on threes, which means he was 16 for 21 on twos, just under 80%. Not bad. Three boards, eight assists, two steals, two turnovers, plus 32 in 29 minutes. And by the way, in the first quarter of this game, as the game was over at the end of the first quarter, this was Che G. Alexander's line in the first quarter of this game. Cavs 14 points. Shea, 15 points.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yes.

[Tim MacMahon]

Six for nine from the field, couple free throws, four assists. He scored or assisted on 10 or 12. Ten of the 12 baskets in the corner. One steal, one turnover, plus 18. Playing every minute of the quarter and leading the evisceration of the cast.

[Brian Windhorst]

Just in complete control. And, you know, watching him, it's so remarkable because he never looks like he's going full speed, right? He just. All the time he just glides and he's always on balance.

[Tim MacMahon]

And.

[Brian Windhorst]

And like, you don't. It doesn't look like he's going full speed and he's blowing by people. And like, the ability to change speeds is so amazing. The ability to just stop on a dime, be on balance. I mean, and like I said, just complete control of this One. And, you know, he is as even keel as you'll find as far as, like, a star in the league goes. But, you know, he. He knows when. It's.

[Bobby Marks]

It's a.

[Brian Windhorst]

It's a national TV game. He knows when. Okay. Hey, they got us last week and want a little bit of payback. And you can tell by his fits tonight, the man was wearing some fancy cowboy boots.

[Bobby Marks]

Cowboy chic.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yeah, little. Yeah, cowboy chic with the little chaps and all that. The IT department reached out and wanted me to find out where he got those chaps. Thought I might look good in them.

[Bobby Marks]

Oh, my God.

[Tim MacMahon]

Definitely has better taste than that.

[Bobby Marks]

So many things could be said right now, but I will not say them.

[Brian Windhorst]

She reached out to me. I didn't. I didn't even know the man wore chaps in until she informed me.

[Bobby Marks]

Anyway, there was a moment in the second quarter of this game where the Cavs cut it. I mean, I am being very generous. Jerry Scarland, who was the only really impressive Cav starter, I guess Jared Allen was okay, but he got.

[Tim MacMahon]

He got pulled.

[Brian Windhorst]

But, yeah, he.

[Tim MacMahon]

He.

[Brian Windhorst]

He played well for the first few minutes. And then the Avalanche.

[Bobby Marks]

So the Cavs made some sort of attempt to feign, like, they might try to come back. They got it to, like, 16 points. Mark Dagono calls timeout. Shay realizes this ain't happening tonight, and they come out of timeout. He scores on three straight possessions. You got the impression he might have scored on 10 straight if he really wanted to on this night. And that was it. Over. Over. I want to point something out.

[Brian Windhorst]

I don't.

[Bobby Marks]

How big was the lead? Did it get to?

[Brian Windhorst]

40, 42. By the way, the lead was 26 at halftime. It was 23. And then they're like, oh, Max Drew stepped out of bounds on a three. Make it 26.

[Bobby Marks]

Tyler Ford, no mercy.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yeah. Like, as bad as the first half was for the Cavaliers, it got worse after they went to the locker room. But that the 26 point deficit was the worst of the season to that point for the Cavaliers. And then it increased to 42 before benches were cleared.

[Bobby Marks]

Okay. Last week, Donovan Mitchell went up against Lou Dort. And I understand it's not a mano a mano. These are team defenses. But Lou Dort was a primary defender last week. Donovan Mitchell was 3 of 16. You remember that? That game was defined by how awesome the Cavs were with their bigs. You know, playing off each other big to big, passing, whatever. Garland was good. Dean Wade was good that game, but really was about Mobley and Jared Allen and Max Drew.

[Tim MacMahon]

Inside your own. Going crazy off the bench tonight.

[Bobby Marks]

After three of 16 last week. Tonight, Donovan Mitchell three of 15, minus.

[Tim MacMahon]

28 in 20 minutes.

[Brian Windhorst]

And Donovan totally owned it. Donovan Basie said, yeah, I'm paraphrasing, but wasn't. Didn't come ready to play. They set the tone. Put this one on him. This is too straight. You know, this is twice against this team that. That he was bad, and that when, you know, the leader of a team doesn't show up, then it trickles down again. That's paraphrasing. But Donovan completely stood up and owned it, and he gave credit to Lou Dort. Like, listen, we've talked about. The fact that Lou Dort's not been all defensive in his career is nuts. And if it doesn't change on my ballot. Buddy, I hear you. If it doesn't change this year, then, honestly, like, I don't know to say it, it just would be completely nuts. But I. I asked old mark D. Whose LinkedIn page just keeps looking better and better. The resume's really looking sharp. I asked him, hey, you know, two straight games that Donovan had really tough nights, and he says, we've got the whole team amped up on their main guys, but, I mean, Lou Dort's a monster. Every night he takes those matchups, and sometimes people get the best of them. But he's so hard to shake, and he's so relentless on that end. And, you know, that sums up, like, again, the. The impact that Lou has on this. He's the best player on the best defense in the league, and he's become a good, complimentary player, and he's a massive culture guy.

[Tim MacMahon]

Well, and look, we should say, and I think we all agree on this, like, one bad game against this team does not erase what the Cavs did last week, nor does it erase anything we said about their legitimacy this season. However, what I will say is, if you watch this game and you watch how easy it was for Shea, who is maybe the MVP of the league, to get wherever he wants, and you talk about the impact Lou Dork can have on the other side, my biggest concern about this Cavs team, when you're talking about them trying to get to the absolute apex, you know, getting to the finals, winning a title with this group, they really don't have any perimeter, defensive athleticism on the team.

[Brian Windhorst]

And a coral, but, boy, was he rough tonight.

[Tim MacMahon]

Isaac Okoro is not so Coru hurt.

[Bobby Marks]

His shoulder a couple of weeks ago. Since he's come Back his. He's never. His percentages have been okay the last couple years, but he really has looked rusty shooting the ball.

[Brian Windhorst]

He airballed two threes tonight. I mean, it was really, like I.

[Bobby Marks]

Said, he's a fine.

[Tim MacMahon]

He's a fine player. But, like, that's not. Isaac Koro has not been the answer in the past in playoff matchups. He's not going to be the guy to put on Che Gallas Alexander or Jason Tatum or whoever in the playoffs like that. If you're looking at this game from a cast perspective and you want to say what's a. What's one takeaway from it? If you're playing it against the absolute apex competition they do not like, yes, they're going to lean on the bigs to do that. The bigs can only do so much with that.

[Brian Windhorst]

Right.

[Tim MacMahon]

And if that. That is something I think that is a legitimate concern to take away from it. But it's, you know, I. This certainly shouldn't be anything more than that. And look for the Thunder coming off that game last week where we talked about them struggling with the size of the Cavs inside. You know, it certainly looked like a team that took the rematch of this personally, especially without Isaiah Hartenstein. And plenty of people, including me, thinking they were going to have a lot of trouble in this game without both him and Chet. And they came out and made a heck of a statement with the way they just completely overwhelmed these guys.

[Bobby Marks]

So I would want to say that when the Thunder made that trade for Alex Caruso, there were people in the league who. And nobody in Oklahoma City ever said this, just to be clear that I heard. But there were people in the league who thought, well, that's such a good acquisition and they're going to extend him, which they did. You know, Lou Dort might be a guy who could be available. They may, you know, look to flip Lou Dort into a. Some sort of big guy.

[Brian Windhorst]

I thought it too, and I heard, heard, you know, heard people just connecting dots, speculating on it.

[Bobby Marks]

Lou Dort, I would say, is virtually. Because, you know, no one is very few, is virtually an untouchable player. His value, he. Plus he's got two years left on his contract at $17 million each.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yeah.

[Ohm Youngmisuk]

And.

[Brian Windhorst]

And again, I just wrote this story on, like, this culture they've built here. He is a huge, huge part of that. He is the only guy other than Shay Gildas Alexander who has been here for this whole. Was here on the first, you know, the last playoff team they had under Billy Donna the bubble playoff team for the whole tear down and the whole build back up. He's the only one who's been here the whole time. And if you just talk about like what are the Thunder about? Ultimately they are about toughness and they are about player development.

[Tim MacMahon]

Yep.

[Brian Windhorst]

And he epitomizes and, and they're about, you know, their business. He epitomizes all that, you know, and, and Shade, look, Shade does too. And when you talk about culture, your superstar is going to be the biggest factor in it. But again, Lou is just a huge part of that. And he gets toughest defensive Simon every night and, and he can guard so many different guys because he is so strong. And for his guy who's as wide as he is, unbelievably quick feet.

[Tim MacMahon]

Well, look, he, he's a guy who was, you know, played at Arizona State, went undrafted, was on a two way with this team, was a guy who came in the league as a guy who couldn't, wasn't seen as much of a shooter and that was a big part of why he ended up drafted.

[Brian Windhorst]

No, no, he, he had a terrible jump shot.

[Tim MacMahon]

Well, yes, no, I know. That's why he, that's why he went undrafted despite being a, you know, a six four tank of a human. And like last year he shot 39% from three. This year before tonight's game he shot, he's shooting 41.5% from three. And like we talk about all the draft picks the Thunder have and you know, getting Jamin Williams and Che and you know, Kayson Wallace is another lottery pick starter. Chet Holgren obviously lottery pick starter. Like this guy was an undrafted guy who was signed to a two way and they has turned into one of the best wing defenders in the league and one of the best three and players in the league. Like you said, when you talk about player development and a franchise that is, you know, turned pieces into players, you know, again you look at this roster, Aaron Wiggins, Isaiah Joe, like Alex Caruso once upon a time came up through the Thunder system before he went to the Lakers. Kendrick Williams, another undrafted guy like they have, they have done a great job of developing depth behind these lottery picks they've had and it's a huge part of why they have such a deep team.

[Brian Windhorst]

And look, you look at their rotation right now, there are four first round picks in the rotation. The rest are second rounders, undrafted guys. Of those four first round picks, and I'm counting Chet, only one was a single digit lottery pick. Chet is the only single digit Lottery pick on this roster. Now, if you wanted 34 and 6 is scary enough right now. Big picture, what's really scary is the Thunder are probably going to have at least a handful of lottery picks over the next several years. I mean, it gets pretty scary.

[Bobby Marks]

They could have lottery picks this year.

[Brian Windhorst]

They are. Yeah, they could.

[Bobby Marks]

So they lost to the Cavs last Tuesday. Last Wednesday.

[Tim MacMahon]

Wednesday.

[Bobby Marks]

They've played four games since they lost that game. They've won by 20. But this is a 20 point win. But that, that was really not even accurate. I mean, it could have been hours.

[Brian Windhorst]

Again, it was 42 late in third quarter. Okay. It was an absolute.

[Tim MacMahon]

They played part. They didn't play anybody for the Sixers. They didn't play anybody but the Wizards. The two games they played played against big time teams, the Cavs and the Knicks. They won by a combined thousand points in the competitive portions of the game.

[Bobby Marks]

Anyway. The four games since they've lost to the Cavs, they won by 41, 25, 16 and 20.

[Brian Windhorst]

Fellas. Again, this team is 34 and 6, which puts them on pace for rounding up 70 wins. Their point differential is 13 per game. The NBA record is 12.3 by the 71, 72. Lakers. Yeah, I'm just trying to like give you a picture with numbers of just how dominant this Oklahoma City team has been this season.

[Tim MacMahon]

Yeah.

[Bobby Marks]

By the way, out of their next, out of their next 13 games, nine of them are home.

[Tim MacMahon]

Yeah.

[Brian Windhorst]

And they've, they've got some soft ones in there. Now listen, Artenstein is going to be, you know, reevaluated in about a week. They don't think it's a serious injury, but they'll be out for a little bit. Chet's his, you know, he's making gradual progress. It's not like you're going to see Chet on the court or playing, I should say he's gotten on the court, but you're not going to see him playing probably during Hartenstein's absence, certainly. So, you know, they're going to have to manage this stretch again. And now they are now four and three in games when they don't have one of those two guys for the full game. They are 30 and three when they have one or the other 30 and three.

[Tim MacMahon]

And in the early stretch of the season when they were missing those guys, they didn't have Jalen Williams either, who.

[Brian Windhorst]

Is the backup center.

[Tim MacMahon]

Right. Who's a, you know, was like the 34th or 35th pick of the draft and is a perfectly serviceable rotation. Big and so like that they at least have a real center they can play out there now for a chunk of the game instead of what they were doing before, which is basically trying to play a bunch of six, six guys the entire game, which is clearly wearing them out.

[Brian Windhorst]

Well, and we found out tonight, or at least there was an accusation made post game. And I'm just telling you it was. There was some friction. You know, we talked about this great Thunder chemistry. I think it was threatened tonight. Post game, Shagil just. Alexander called Jalen Williams, J Dub, 6 foot 4, which, you know, they do their little post game side by side. J Dub bowed up. Well, I'm six six. And he said, hold on, it's going to sound better this way. His point was at six foot four, this guy guards one through five like he's guarding Evan Mobley tonight when Mobley just was a total two of seven. Yeah, Mobley had as many turnovers as buckets and didn't play a whole lot anyways. And they had a kind of a funny little back and forth. You know what though? The Thunder did play a seven footer tonight. Brandon Carlson. And if you feel bad because you've never heard of him, don't. It's okay. This is a guy who was on a non. Garen. They picked him up. Whatever. I forgot off whose G league team. And he was on the Raptors. Okay, well, listen to. How do you spell Brandon? Do you even know? With an e. I don't know. Take that. I, I found that out because I typed in the wrong way in Basketball reference and had to figure it out the hard way anyways. They are now. Well, first of all, he played all of garbage time, but in the five minutes of early action, first quarter action that he was in, he was plus 18. He came in and you know, and he's on a 10 day deal now. He's on a non guarantee. They cut him, signed him back to a 10 day. You know, just kind of one of these thunder finds been hanging around and pressed dagger all because he like picked up the playbook like that. But listen, I think they should play him more because you know why? Here's some numbers for you. I don't have the average margin of victory, but it's massive. It's like maybe like 20s per game. I didn't do the math, but I did this Math. They are 110 when Brandon Carlson plays.

[Bobby Marks]

Now that's kind of like a very human victory cigar.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yeah, that's kind of like the. Hey, when teams run the ball 25 times per game, you know, their. Their record's awesome type of thing, but.

[Bobby Marks]

Yes, well, it was a damn impressive performance by the Thunder tonight. If they keep playing like that, they will win the title, I'll tell you that. Because that was just. And, and it really, you know, the Cavs, and I don't know if it was the Hardenstein injury that, that. That dulled them. The level of. Of competitiveness that last week's game featured was absolutely not there. From the Cavs early on in this game, they, you know, ex. You know, the Thunder, we're going to win this game no matter what, but you know that they're going to play physical, aggressive defense. The Cavs were ready for that last week. They were not ready for it in this game.

[Brian Windhorst]

Kenny Atkinson quote here. Yeah, this Kenny Atkinson quote pretty much sums up this night. They impose their will in every sense. We knew it was coming. We knew their force was coming. That's their identity. They impose their identity. It was an Avalanche and we never responded.

[Tim MacMahon]

Yeah, I mean, they're. It's. It's funny you brought up. I hadn't thought about that insanity game, Brian. And, and like, once you said it, I was thinking about it. And like, watching that first quarter, just watching the second half, because again, it was 12 to 12, six minutes in. It's like. It's not like this started out with them on a 20 to 2 run and they were off to the races. But then like, once they got in a rhythm defensively and they like, put the clamps on. I mean, they do some stuff as a team with their athleticism and their pressure and their physicality. Like, it's as good as I've ever seen a team guard. And it, It. It's really unbelievable to see them get into. Especially like we saw. We were so impressed with this casting last week with, with the way they were able to attack this defense and get to their stuff, and the Thunder were just like, yeah, your guys are not going to do that again. And it just. They would. They. And we've been joking about. You know, I know our guy. You mentioned him earlier. Our guy. Worldwide WOB has come up with the Cavalanche thing with the Cavs when they get on these offensive runs. And it. It felt like the Cavs were caught in an avalanche and they just couldn't. They just had no answer for it. It was really, really impressive to watch.

[Brian Windhorst]

Oklahoma City's defense gives up 103 points per 100 possessions. The gap now is 3.9 points to the number two team, which is the Orlando Magic.

[Tim MacMahon]

Wanted to highlight that. Right, so that's the gap from first to second. That is the same gap from second all the way to eighth.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yeah.

[Tim MacMahon]

And really it's the gap all the way to 10th because it's basically a three way tie for eighth. So like it? It's just staggering how much better they are than everybody else.

[Bobby Marks]

All right, well, I look forward to reading this piece that you wrote off this game, McMahon.

[Brian Windhorst]

Oh, awesome.

[Bobby Marks]

I do.

[Brian Windhorst]

You know what, Ty? You got it.

[Bobby Marks]

And I definitely enjoyed reading a piece from Olm Young Masuka, which we're going to talk about. OM is going to join us in a minute. We'll be right back here on the Hoop Collective.

[Brian Windhorst]

More Hoop Collective podcast after this.

[Bobby Marks]

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[Ohm Youngmisuk]

I don't just stand on business. I live it 24 7. Because you don't become a young entrepreneur by staying stagnant. Whether I'm chasing deals, networking, or taking calls from behind the wheel of my Toyota Crown, I'm always in motion. You may think launching a successful startup is enough to be satisfied, but me, I'm just getting started. It's a new day at Toyota, led by a new generation of drivers. And we want you to know one thing. You can't stop my drive. Toyota. Let's go places. Don't miss the first Marvel movie event of the year. The country needs Captain America.

[Brian Windhorst]

You asked for me. Here I am on February 14th. Get the suits ready. Experience a brave new world. Let's go. That's made for imax. Stand by for proof of death.

[Ohm Youngmisuk]

You want me? Come and get me.

[Brian Windhorst]

Brave new world. See you to IMAX February 14th. Get tickets now. Rated PG13, this film may be inappropriate for children under 13.

[Bobby Marks]

Okay, joining us now from Los Angeles, he was in Minneapolis on Wednesday night watching the warriors beat the Timberwolves is our man, Ohm Young Masuk. What's up, Olm?

[Ohm Youngmisuk]

What's going on, guys?

[Bobby Marks]

The warriors are always interesting. I definitely want to talk about them. But I want to give special attention not to McMahon's story today about the Thunder, just a typical McMahon story. No reason to pay extra attention to it. But your story that came out earlier this week on Draymond Green, how an indefinite suspension revitalized Draymond Green's career, which is dating back to a year ago when he got that suspension for the Rudy Gobert choke out. Oh, this is a absolutely fantastic story. We thought we'd talk about the Warriors. You got a lot of people in here to reveal a lot of things specifically about what was going on behind the scenes when Draymond was suspended, including talking to people at the league office about these zoom calls that were going on when he was basically on double secret probation. And I thought it was a. I've written. There's been many Draymond Green pieces written over the years, quite a few of them about dramatic stuff that went down. This was a particularly insightful piece, and I just thought you could tell our listeners about it.

[Ohm Youngmisuk]

Thanks, man. You know, Draymond posted on social media, I want to say maybe like a month and a half ago or two months ago, at the end, they just said, hashtag, therapy works. At the start of the season, Draymond looked to me more locked in. And also I thought he was moving better. It was clear that he lost a lot of weight. You could see in his face. And what I saw in his game is you could see him contesting shots and like, you know, running at them and jumping and blocking three point shooter shots. And I even had the great stat Williams look it up. And I think he was like. I think they called it a blow by contest. And he was like, I think third in the league and blow by contest. And so I went to Draymond and I said, you look more like. I don't think I've seen you move like this in a long time. And you look really locked in. And I said, let's I go. Let me take a guess. Did the therapy that you did during the suspension help you to where you are today to come in more locked in? He said, 100%. So I said, take me into your therapy session. So we sat down and talked, and I think it's the longest sit down I've ever had. It was an hour. I think the great Ray Ritter clocked it at an hour and 17 minutes. And when I tell you that an hour and 17 minutes, I didn't get in that many questions. Draymond did a lot of talking, and I think for him it was probably maybe a little therapeutic. I was expecting to talk about. He has two therapists and One sports psychologist and I thought we would go into a lot of those therapy sessions, but it ended up becoming that. He was telling me that when he talked to Adam Silver, when he got suspended, he was telling Adam Silver that he was thinking about retiring. Not right away, but maybe after the following season, which will be this season. And Adam Silver said, you need to just get away, focus on yourself, take some time off. But I'm going to have you do these lead check in zooms with a seven person panel.

[Bobby Marks]

I mean, and this was crazy. Seven people were on this panel. He said he thought he was at, like, a tribunal or something.

[Ohm Youngmisuk]

Yeah. I asked him, I said, did it feel like a tribunal? And he was like, yeah, you know, it felt like he was being judged. And the first two times he went.

[Bobby Marks]

In, he didn't want to Harry Potter in that one. Sorry.

[Ohm Youngmisuk]

Yeah. I mean, like, they're all familiar faces to him. I mean, Kathy Barron's from the league, Dave Weiss from the warriors was Mike Dunleavy, Rick Celebrini, David Kelly, their legal counsel. Rich Paul was on it. And Carissa Chan, who, you know, people may not know who she is, but in the nbpa, to players, a lot of people, she's very popular. Players.

[Bobby Marks]

Three people from the Warriors.

[Ohm Youngmisuk]

Yeah.

[Bobby Marks]

Draymond's agent, Draymond. Two people from the league office.

[Ohm Youngmisuk]

And.

[Bobby Marks]

And one mbpa, one person from the union.

[Ohm Youngmisuk]

Yeah. And. And John Moran had to do the same thing. He had to go through these calls, too. It was the end. It was Adam Silver's way and the NBA's way of checking in on you to make sure that you are doing whatever they want you to do during that suspension to be able to return to play. You have to prove to them like, I am going to see. In Draymond's case, it was, I am going to see my counseling. I'm doing this, I'm doing that. And the first few times Draymond got on, he said he barely even spoke. He didn't want to talk. He was angry. I think Kathy Barrons had said he was pissed off. He was pissed off at the league, he was pissed off at himself. He's pissed off at everything. And then by the third time he was on, Draymond said for some reason, he started talking, and then all of a sudden, it was like he was talking about this experience and that experience, and all seven people were chiming in with their own experiences. And he said, this is effing incredible. He was like. He started feeling that all the therapy he had gone to with his two therapists and all the things he had talked to them were now playing out on these calls, and it was working. He could feel it. Like, he could feel the growth coming. He could feel like he was on this panel of seven successful people in all different fields, and all of them were providing their personal experiences to him about different things or challenging him or saying, like, hey, have you tried this? Or different things. And so he felt like these things were starting to help. So I guess after about. He started doing these about. They were about half an hour long. And I think he. The first couple of weeks he did two week. And maybe it went from two weeks to, like, one, maybe a month once he returned to play. He played, like, in 14 straight games, and that was all star breaking. Kathy Barron said, look, I think we've done enough. Maybe it was about, like, six or seven of them, and, you know, you've kind of, like, fulfilled what you need to do. And Draymond said, oh, hell, no.

[Bobby Marks]

I'm not.

[Ohm Youngmisuk]

I'm not ending these. These are beneficial to me. He called them accountability therapy sessions for him because he said, when you go onto a zoom with that many successful people, he said, you have to feel like you come out of it unscathed. I had to go in and show them I've been doing X, Y and Z. And if I didn't, like, he felt like it was, you know, maybe he had failed or something like that. So he went in looking to, not only you know, get approval from them, but basically, like, I've done this and that. But then he was learning from them. And so they continue the sessions. They've done, like, over a dozen. The last one was in October. This is well past whatever he was supposed to fulfill and obviously came back from suspension. And he's like, I'm due for another one, and I'm going to get the gang back together soon. So he. He basically said that these sessions that, like I said, John Moran went through were really beneficial for him in helping him kind of get his head in the right place. Because he said the night that, like, I asked him, I was like, take me back to certain nights of certain episodes. Like, I said, where was your head when Jordan Pool happened? And he was like, you know, look, it was training camp. You know, he's like, you know, excuse my language. Pops off in training camp all the time, and, you know, things like that happened. And then I was like, what about, like, go, Bear? And he was like. He was like, I was ready to play that night. I was in a great Mood. And he was like. And then Clay gets into. Clay gets into a McDaniel's, and he goes. And I got to get into the mix. But he said, with Nurkic, he said, my head wasn't there that night. I wasn't in the building. He's like, I physically was in the building. I had to be in the building. But mentally, I was not there at all. He's like, I was not there that entire night. And I think that it was, you know, emblematic of, like, whatever he was dealing with at the time. And I also think what was interesting to me as we talked about the. The stereotype and stigma of. Of. Of going to, say, a psychologist and seeing therapy. And he said, as you know, NBA teams often have their own team psychiatrist or team therapist, and before every season, they'll have a meeting with the players, and they'll say, you know, look, I'm here. I'm available. We can talk about whatever you want. And Draymond always said he wanted to see therapy, but he was scared. He was scared, you know, he said, in his words, scared shitless. He said he kept making himself go up during these team meetings to talk in front of the team and say how he needed therapy and all that, and he thought that that would help him go see a therapist. But then he never would go because he said, growing up as a black man in Saginaw, he was like. It was viewed as being weak if you went to go see a therapist. And so for years, he didn't go until finally, a couple of years ago, he got the nerve to go out because he said he was dealing with something very heavy. He wouldn't say what that was. And he said when he finally saw a therapist, the therapist told him, you know, you. What you're telling me is what you're going through. I feel like you are grieving, whatever. Whatever this issue was. And he said, what are you talking about? Like, nobody died. And he was like, no, but like, what you are dealing with, it doesn't take, like a physical death. Sometimes when you are dealing with a situation and you have to move on, you're grieving, and you don't know, and that's why you're acting out in certain different ways. And he said that was a major breakthrough for him. And so that's why he started seeing therapy. And so he would see a therapist maybe once or once or twice a week when things get busy, maybe it's once a month, a lot of times on zoom. Because I said, you know, when people hear Draymond Green, the NBA's bad boy, going to see a therapist. I'm sure they picture you up on a green couch with your feet up, you know, and talking your feelings out. And he was like, I've never been on a couch with my feet up. He's like, maybe I need to try it.

[Bobby Marks]

So you have a quote in here where you asked about how. How he is this year compared to last year, and he said, things are totally different. I'm different. Right. I assume as a result of this process, he's second the league in technical fouls with eight. And he has. He's one of about 10 guys in the league who has multiple flagrants. Not that that's the only measure, but you've been around almost all the warriors games, training camp. You've known him for a long time, Michigan State. Do you think that's true?

[Ohm Youngmisuk]

I think the measure is basically one ejection so far compared to four ejections last year. And the ejection that he got was for like, two quick texts at the end of a game against Memphis, where he was. She had a raft and the ref just didn't want to hear it anymore and just kicked him out. Besides that, I think he still pushes the envelope for sure. I mean, he'll, you know, like, he grabs Zach Eady's ankle and that got elevated to a fighting trial the following day. You know, he's gotten into. With Zach Eavey, he's gotten into other players. He still barks at the refs, but what. And he still feels he gets a different whistle than anybody else. He'll still argue that because he's Draymond Green, he gets called for things that other players don't. I think where it's working for him is that he's. He knows where the line is and he hasn't completely crossed it yet. He hasn't had that incident like a Nurkage incident. He hasn't had a Gobert incident. He's faced Gobert three times in the span of, like, basically two weeks. And outside of a little incidental contact with Gobert's eye, there was nothing else. Like, he knew when he went returned to Phoenix, he knew all eyes would be on him, even though Nurkic did not play in that game. But there was another game where he saw Jordan Poole in D.C. and they exchanged, like, little finger taunts. But in each case, he didn't. He didn't escalate it. He didn't escalate it beyond. He didn't let it boil over and I think Steve Kurt said this. There was a night in against Memphis where he got into it with Zach Edie and he fouled Zach Edie really hard and then grabbed him and then Edie pushed him away. It could have boiled over there. It could have boiled over when Jaren Jackson scores 19 points on him in the second half. To which, you know, that's the kind of stuff that Draymond Green takes personally if someone's scoring on him, let alone his youngster from Michigan State, basically. And Steve Kerr said every time it could have boiled over, it didn't, and he didn't cross that line. And that's why we won the game. I think that's where the growth is for Draymond Green so far this year. Not to say that it won't happen this year. Prime it can, right? This is a guy that.

[Tim MacMahon]

That certainly has eight technical fouls and is on pace to probably get suspended for a game. I think it's probably a little much to say that it's all solved.

[Ohm Youngmisuk]

One ejection compared to four last year. He had four last year, so he has one ejection so far. I think that is the difference. Not the technical fouls. I think it's the ejections and the fights and the. Basically the extracurricular activities. You haven't seen that so far this year.

[Bobby Marks]

So. All right. Encourage you to read the story.

[Tim MacMahon]

There's a great story. It was a great story. I just don't know. It just. I. I think we're also. We're grading on quite a curve. I think also when. Well, of course, with your Michigan State guy. But you are correct that there have not been the egregious instances this year.

[Ohm Youngmisuk]

I mean, by this time. By this time last year, he had had three ejections, basically. So he was obviously dealing with a lot of stuff last year, and this year he looks to be in a better headspace. And let's also remember, he's had a variety of tests so far, like I mentioned, but also in a. In a slump where they basically went 7 and 17 since a 12 and 3 start. You would think at some point Draymond Green would probably lose his mind because of the way they had been playing on this roller coaster. Even Steph Curry has been extremely frustrated and shown signs of that. Draymond Green has yet to be ejected during a time like that.

[Brian Windhorst]

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[Ohm Youngmisuk]

Um, I think I just won my taxes. Yeah, I just switched to H and R Block in about one minute. All I had to do was drag and drop last year's return into H and R Block and bam. My information is automatically there so I don't have to go digging around for all my old papers to switch.

[Brian Windhorst]

Switch.

[Bobby Marks]

Nope.

[Ohm Youngmisuk]

Sounds like we just leveled up our tax game. Switching to H and R block is easy.

[Brian Windhorst]

Just drag and drop your last return.

[Ohm Youngmisuk]

It's better with block.

[Bobby Marks]

All right, so we talked on the pod earlier this week about Steph's comments the other night in Toronto. He came out in Minnesota attempting to clarify those comments. I think he didn't like the perception that he was. Just because he did, he wasn't pushing the team to like make a major trade in this moment. That it was received by some as if he was okay with being 500 or at that point he was actually below 500. That he had accepted this sort of mediocrity of this team. And he was like, you know, anybody who knows me knows I don't accept that. But he also said, I stand on what I said the other day. It's been a kind of a really. I mean, compared to last season when there was all these suspensions and it was Klay Thompson brooding much of the year. I'm not sure that it's been a more difficult season for the warriors, but it's definitely been an up and down season. Do you accept the concept that Steph and Draymond and Steve Kerr have said that they don't want them to make a deal if it's only going to marginally improve them?

[Ohm Youngmisuk]

I understand, I think where they're coming from, which is. And, and I would say this if I were Mike Dunleavy Jr. Obviously I'm not. He's a much smarter individual than I am. But if you only have so many assets, I'm holding them for whenever a true superstar, that is a franchise altering superstar becomes available to take that swing.

[Tim MacMahon]

Ding, ding, ding.

[Ohm Youngmisuk]

If you go and give up some of these assets now for a Nicola Vucevich, a Jimmy Butler, which I don't think, I don't think there's interest in Butler, but if they were to do that, you can't take a swing then if things go bad in Milwaukee with Giannis this summer. And that is why you have to hold on to your assets to make a run at a guy like that if he becomes available. Because I think Golden State is uniquely positioned for someone like Giannis because of Deaf's friendship with Giannis, and Giannis having kind of like hinted in the past that, you know, the Bay might be intriguing to him with the warriors, you got to then hold on to your assets for that. Also, I think, look, Jonathan Kaminga, he's hurt right now, but he just showed just enough in those six games prior to getting hurt. Enough where he scored 34 in consecutive games that Steve Kerr said it looks like he's turning the corner and understanding how to play with Draymond and Steph on the floor and not really kind of being this guy that just goes to his bag and gets his points, but scoring within the flow of the Golden State offense, that you might want to hang on to that and see where it goes. So I think what they're going to do is they're going to wait to the trade deadline, see if a guy like Nikola Vucevich and the price goes down where you might be able to get him for just expiring contracts or something like that, not have to give up a lot of picks or, you know, your three first round picks you can trade, certainly hold on to your young assets. I think that's what he means. I think that's what he, Steve Kerr and Draymond Green mean, that you don't go ahead and give the farm up for basically someone that is not quite on that superstar level that is going to make you guys immediately contend for championship or championships down the road.

[Tim MacMahon]

It's what you said earlier, it's very, it's very simple. The warriors are not good enough right now to win a title. The way they're going to be good enough to compete for a title is if they get a player that's better than Steph Curry. And the only way they're going to do that is if they save their ammunition for when the moment arrives that such a player becomes available. And until then, they are going to try to, like you said, they're going to try to make more moves like the Dennis Shooter move. I'm sure they'll try to find ways to improve before the trade deadline with maybe some second round picks and some of the expiring contracts they have, but they're not going to fire any of these big chips. They've got into the pot unless there's somebody that's really going to make a difference. And as of now, it's. It does not seem like that player is going to become available. And as you know, you've been around them all the time with the way they're playing. It's very easy to look at it and say there's no point in trying to make a, you know, marginal upgrade or a, you know, middling upgrade for any real cost because the team has shown it's not worth investing that kind of capital in right now.

[Ohm Youngmisuk]

Right. It does like they are going to try to improve the team. It is just they're not going to take a massive swing. Before this trade deadline, I actually sat down with Steph for a story I'm doing for Monday kind of about like the state of the championship window before, you know, three weeks before the trade deadline as they face the Boston Celtics, obviously a team they beat two years ago for a championship. And Steph and I talked about like, for example, I found it interesting that the Warriors, I know this is probably their mo They've only made one significant trade at the trade deadline in the Curry era and that was to get Andrew Wiggins back In, I think 2020 when Steph was hurt. The other trade they made was to trade away James Wiseman in a deal that brought back Gary Payton. So that was like not a significant trade. But really don't.

[Tim MacMahon]

The Wiggins wasn't trade was an asset acquisition trade, not a load up for the stretch.

[Bobby Marks]

It was to get. It was to get the pick. They took on Wig, which ended up.

[Ohm Youngmisuk]

Which ended up becoming Kaminga.

[Bobby Marks]

Right. And the pick ended up. And the Wiggins ended up being a surprisingly great fit for them and helping them win their championship. Yeah, Wiggins was this. Wiggins was the, was the tax that they paid to get the pick.

[Ohm Youngmisuk]

Yeah. So basically, I mean, you know, they don't make any moves historically in the Steph Curry era during the trade deadline, they tend to do it in the summertime. And he understands that. But I thought the one thing he said to me was, listen, you know, he, he doesn't, he doesn't want to basically look like he's a guy that's calling, don't leave you saying, give me this, give me this, give me this. That, that's not really his Persona anyways. He basically chimes in when he's asked if there's something imminent and they run it by him. But he was like, my thing is as long as they're showing the type of effort That I show on the court, which is like in order trying to improve the team, I can live with whatever happens. And so I think like they're trying, obviously I think they were being diplomatic with saying, you know, we got, we got to, we got a responsibility to the future of the franchise. And I think people took that as in they're waving the white flag. And Steve Kerr said, by no means are we waving the white flag. We are definitely trying to win with Steph Curry and get him some help. It just may not come at the trade deadline, that's all.

[Tim MacMahon]

Yeah, I don't think anybody realistically said that. I think everybody said realistically what we just said, which is that like, if you just having a clear eyed look at the warriors, there are not players available that can make them a championship level team. And if the goal is championship level team or not, it's very easy to say we're going to wait to see if that player comes along also.

[Bobby Marks]

The warriors franchise has always been aggressive with Steph Curry. They've made mistakes like everybody, but they have made major acquisitions. Kevin Durant being grade A example. They have made aggressive trades, they have spent enormous sums of money. They have gotten very creative with draft picks dating all the way back to. They did one of the first modern salary dump trades to acquire Andre Iguodala. So the track record for Joe Lacomb and Peter Goober's ownership is they are not going to leave stones unturned with Steph. They may not have this season work out like they wanted to. And by the way, they've raised the trophy four times. They've gone to the finals, what, six times.

[Tim MacMahon]

Six times. Yeah.

[Bobby Marks]

And they've had some years where it's gone south and they've had bad years. This may end up being the latter, but it's not because they were derelict in trying to surround Steph. So, you know, the track record matters. It was just a refreshing thing. Honestly, I thought it was refreshing for Steph to be so honest. And I don't want him to not be honest. I want him to be honest. So.

[Ohm Youngmisuk]

Well, I think that's why he said, like, for anybody that thinks that I'm okay with being on an average team is insane. You know, I think that's where the clarification came. But yeah, I mean, again, I think if there's a deal to be made that can improve this team along the lines of a, of a Dennis Shooter type, another one type of that, I think they're going to make it. Could they get like a Nicola Vucevich, who would definitely help. I think that if the price is right, but like outside of that, save your assets for a massive swing if something becomes available next summer.

[Tim MacMahon]

And by the way, if they make a trade like the Vusovich trade that gives them especially if they sign out expiring money. Right. If you look at any moves you're going to try to make this summer, you need to have money to send out in trades. And Vucevic not only gives them a shooter at the 5, which as you know, home they're playing all these guys that can't shoot.

[Ohm Youngmisuk]

Yeah.

[Tim MacMahon]

He also 20 million. 20 million gives them $20 million in expiring money they can use this summer to potentially do something in the deal. So there are. That does give them optionality in a variety of ways. But yeah, like I mean look to your point about honesty, go back to the fall. I One of my favorite quotes in recent memory was Steph saying we could be a relevant team, right? It was like Steph is one of the smartest guys in the league. He's very aware of where they're at. And again, that's why this all comes back to where I'm sitting in Miami. The warriors in the Heat have a very similar track record in that they are always looking for the next big fish to come along. Right. And for the warriors, if they're going to get back to being the team they want to be, they're going to have to find that guy and sacrifice. And chips. Now like you said, you said it perfectly before, they sacrifice chips now they're not going to be in position to do that in six months or a year or whatever. And to really have one more true bite at the apple, especially with the way Oklahoma City looks for the next few years, especially with the way the Celtics are in the Cavs, some of these other teams look in the Knicks are lined up for a while. You got to have the ability to really go get a difference making player.

[Ohm Youngmisuk]

Bontiffs. I thought you would say your favorite quote from training camp would have been the quote that I loved, which was Draymond telling me that when I asked him about them going after marketing and Paul George and were you okay with not getting them? He was like, yeah. He's like. Because it could have been trash. He's like, we don't know how the marketing thing would have turned out. How are we supposed to know it could have been trash.

[Tim MacMahon]

I forgot about that one. That was all Draymond. Whatever else you want to say about Draymond, he's always good for a great quote. As he was in your story.

[Bobby Marks]

All right. Great job. Thank you very much for coming on with us. And we'll talk to you soon.

[Ohm Youngmisuk]

Anytime. Thanks for having me, guys.

[Bobby Marks]

Okay, thank you very much, om Young Masook. Thank you very much, Tim McMahon for pulling double duty. Thank you to Bontemps. Thank you to Jackson, our producer, for staying up late. Thank you for putting up with my voice. Hopefully, by the next time we talk on Monday's podcast, I will be doing better. And thank you for watching. Listening to Collective. We'll talk to you soon.

[Brian Windhorst]

Adios, amigos. In case you didn't know, these young men are driven, quite remarkable, magnificent and unmistakable. These are the prodigies, the savants, the ones we've been waiting for. And they are not asking for you to pass the baton. They are methodically planning the perfect moment to take it. A new generation of Toyota drivers are here, and they want you to know one thing. You can't stop my drive.