Summer League Debuts, Huge Salary Cap Development + Kyrie’s Future

Summary

Podcast Summary: Brian Windhorst & The Hoop Collective
Episode Title: Summer League Debuts, Huge Salary Cap Development + Kyrie’s Future
Release Date: July 7, 2025

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Introduction

In this episode of Brian Windhorst & The Hoop Collective, host Brian Windhorst, alongside ESPN Insider Tim Bontemps and guest Jackson McMahon, delves into the latest developments surrounding the NBA's Summer League performances, significant salary cap changes, and the future of Knicks' star Kyrie Irving. Released on July 7, 2025, the episode offers in-depth analysis and insider insights for NBA enthusiasts.

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Lakers’ Offseason Moves

The discussion kicks off with the Los Angeles Lakers' recent activities:

• Multiple Press Releases:
  Brian Windhorst highlights the Lakers' intensive press release operation:

  "I received four press releases from the Lakers today." [00:55]

• Rob Pelinka's Statements:
  Tim Bontemps shares insights from Rob Pelinka regarding player acquisitions:

  "Acquiring a starting caliber center was the top priority for us this offseason. And we believe DeAndre is an amazing solution to that objective." [00:34]

The conversation underscores the Lakers' strategic moves to strengthen their core, particularly focusing on center DeAndre and prospects like Jake Laravia and Ayton.

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Analysis of the Utah Summer League

The panel shifts focus to the Utah Summer League, providing detailed observations:

Ace Bailey's Performance

• Positive Contributions:
  Jackson McMahon praises Ace Bailey's attitude and performance:

  "He had some defensive plays that were impressive, some rebounding, you know, had a clutch rebound that sealed it after sitting six minutes of crunch time." [07:08]

• Areas for Improvement:
  Critique is offered on Bailey's offensive contributions:

  "That's not why he was the fifth overall pick in the draft... he was projected there because the guy's supposed to be a potentially, you know, big time scorer and you didn't see a whole lot of that." [07:33]

• Coaching Feedback:
  Wojciechowski mentions feedback from Jazz assistant Scott Morrison regarding Bailey's shot selection:

  "They can do a better job getting him more involved offensively and then, you know, maybe he could do a little bit better job on, on shot selection." [08:54]

Vijay Edgecombe's Performance

• Athleticism Highlight:
  Tim Bontemps emphasizes Edgecombe’s athletic prowess:

  "He is a high, high, high-level athlete. Like he might be a top 10 athlete in the league when he steps on the floor." [11:52]

• Game Statistics:
  Jackson McMahon shares Edgecombe's Summer League stats:

  "VJ Edgecombe, fourth top five pick to have a 25 point, 10 rebound game at Summer League since 2017." [13:18]

The segment showcases the promising talents of both players while acknowledging areas where they can grow.

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Contract Moves and Salary Cap Developments

A significant portion of the discussion centers on recent contract signings and their implications on the NBA salary cap:

DeAndre Ayton’s Player Option

• Brian Windhorst analyzes Ayton’s contract structure:

  "DeAndre Ayton's second year of his contract is a player option. [...] I think anything that incentivizes and activates Ayton to really press the gas pedal at all is a good thing." [38:54]

Sam Merrill’s Signing

• Tim Bontemps covers Sam Merrill’s contract:

  "They gave Sam Merrill a 4-year deal for $38 million, fully guaranteed, no options at all... he's going to be a key piece for them next year." [38:56]

Gershon Yabaselli’s Contract

• Tim Bontemps discusses Gershon Yabaselli’s signing:

  "He signed for 5.5 million this year, which the Knicks are bang up against the second apron again like they were last year." [40:36]

These contract analyses reveal teams' strategies in managing their rosters within the constraints of the evolving salary cap.

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Jonas Valenzunas Trade and Nuggets' Strategy

The panel examines the potential trade involving Jonas Valenzunas and its impact on the Denver Nuggets:

• Trade Speculation:
  Brian Windhorst expresses confidence in the trade’s likelihood:

  "I have seen extensive reporting that this trade is going through no matter what." [33:07]

• Nuggets’ Roster Enhancement:
  Wojciechowski comments on Valenzunas as the best backup center in Jokic's career:

  "He is the best backup of Joker's career." [29:57]

• Trade Benefits:
  Tim Bontemps highlights the financial aspect for the Nuggets and the Kings:

  "Nuggets are getting rid of Dario Sarge, who did not have a role on their team last year, and saving $5 million." [33:07]

The discussion underscores the Nuggets' aim to optimize their roster depth while maintaining financial flexibility.

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Kyrie Irving’s Recovery and Future with the Mavericks

A focal point of the episode is the status of Kyrie Irving's injury and his future with the Dallas Mavericks:

• Injury Timeline:
  Brian Windhorst outlines the timeline of Irving's ACL injury:

  "He did have the injury on March 3rd... didn't start his recovery until April." [48:25]

• Recovery Expectations:
  Wojciechowski discusses Kyrie’s realistic recovery timeline:

  "The most realistic hope is that, hey, he can come back sometime around the All Star break." [47:03]

• Team's Guard Situation:
  Tim Bontemps critiques the Mavericks' lack of guard acquisitions despite Kyrie's injury:

  "It's strange to me that we're sitting here in July and they did nothing to help the guard spot besides sign d' Angelo Russell." [47:05]

• Kyrie’s Commitment to Health:
  Wojciechowski emphasizes Irving’s focus on recovery:

  "I do think he's going to be turning 34 in March, coming back off a serious injury... he absolutely should take his time to make sure that he's completely healthy before he returns." [45:28]

The segment reflects concerns about the Mavericks' guard depth and the impact of Irving’s prolonged absence on the team's competitiveness.

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Al Horford’s Potential Trade and Impact

The possibility of Al Horford joining different teams is examined:

• Trade Speculation:
  Brian Windhorst identifies Horford as a significant remaining trade piece:

  "Al Horford is the biggest domino left on the board." [37:03]

• Nuggets’ Position on Horford:
  Tim Bontemps discusses the potential fit of Horford with Denver:

  "He's the biggest one left." [37:04]

The analysis highlights Horford's value as a versatile player who could sway playoff outcomes for contending teams.

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Salary Cap Projections and Market Impact

The panel delves into the implications of revised salary cap growth:

• Cap Growth Reduction:
  Brian Windhorst and Tim Bontemps discuss the unexpected cap growth reduction from 10% to 7% due to declining regional sports network revenues:

  "The league has lost a ton of money because the regional sports networks have cratered across the board." [53:52]

• Impact on Contracts and Extensions:
  Brian Windhorst elaborates on how reduced cap growth affects team planning:

  "Teams were thinking that the cap was going to go up 30% the next three years... now they're being told maybe only seven next year." [55:23]

• Specific Contract Adjustments:
  Tim Bontemps mentions adjustments in player contracts like Devon Booker's extension:

  "Devon Booker was in line to get a two-year, $150 million extension... it's now going to be two and $138, maybe." [58:36]

These insights reveal the broader financial challenges teams face in managing their rosters amidst a tighter salary landscape.

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Conclusion

The episode of Brian Windhorst & The Hoop Collective offers a comprehensive analysis of key NBA developments as of July 2025. From the strategic movements of the Lakers and Nuggets to the uncertainties surrounding Kyrie Irving's return and the implications of a reduced salary cap growth, the discussion provides valuable perspectives for fans and analysts alike. The conversation underscores the intricate balance teams must maintain between on-court performance and financial management in a shifting economic environment.

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Notable Quotes:

• Brian Windhorst:

  "I received four press releases from the Lakers today." [00:55]

• Tim Bontemps:

  "Acquiring a starting caliber center was the top priority for us this offseason." [00:34]

• Jackson McMahon:

  "He had some defensive plays that were impressive, some rebounding..." [07:08]

• Wojciechowski:

  "The most realistic hope is that, hey, he can come back sometime around the All Star break." [47:03]

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Note: Advertisements, intros, outros, and non-content sections have been excluded from this summary to focus solely on the podcast's substantive discussions.

Transcript

[Wojciechowski]

Have you ever spotted McDonald's hot crispy fries right as they're being scooped into the carton? And time just stands still.

[Brian Windhorst]

Hello and welcome to the Hoop Collective podcast. We talk about the NBA which we are doing on Sunday, Sunday evening. Hope everybody had a lovely July 4th weekend. Joining me from New York City, Tim Bontets.

[Tim Bontemps]

Brian, you'll be happy to know that Rob Polinka said in a statement today that quote, acquiring a starting caliber center was the top priority for us this offseason. And we believe DeAndre is an amazing solution to that objective and is an ideal player to add to our current core.

[Brian Windhorst]

I will let you know that I received four press releases from the Lakers today. Oh, four of them. So their press.

[Tim Bontemps]

Don't spoil my bit, Brian, your press.

[Brian Windhorst]

Release operation is in fact just fine.

[Tim Bontemps]

Don't spoil my bit, Brian.

[Brian Windhorst]

Joining us from Dallas, Texas, freshly back from Salt Lake City where he managed to go to one day of summer league is band McMahon.

[Wojciechowski]

Howdy, partner. Listen, you know, just a little in and out of Utah. I want to read to you though the full Rob Pelinka quote on the LeBron James opt in. Here we go.

[Brian Windhorst]

I will say this. Jackson Hay. The Jackson Hayes. We got, we got a Polinka quote on Jake Laravia.

[Tim Bontemps]

Jake is a high IQ two way player with ideal skills for a JJ Redick basketball system. What about another basketball system? Glad he fits that system.

[Brian Windhorst]

We got a quote on Ayton and we got a quote on Laravia. What was. Jackson Hayes was not afforded a quote.

[Tim Bontemps]

Jackson Hayes got. The Lakers have resigned. Jackson Hayes.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yeah, that's right. What was the fourth press release? I know I got a fourth one.

[Tim Bontemps]

I think summer league stuff.

[Brian Windhorst]

Okay, anyway.

[Tim Bontemps]

Oh, the, the, the, the draft trade for I do Thoreau, the second round pick.

[Brian Windhorst]

That's correct. Right. Thoreau the guy.

[Tim Bontemps]

No quoting that either. No, Peyton and Laravia got, they got the, the blessing of the. The Rob Pelinka quotes.

[Brian Windhorst]

It's been a week since the opt in. We have no press release.

[Wojciechowski]

All right. I do want to make one mention of my trip to Utah. We'll discuss a little bit later. But held on the campus of the University of Utah due to some renovations at the Delta Center. Alex Jensen, former Mavs assistant, Jazz assistant, among other places, a gracious host. Got me some free baby.

[Tim Bontemps]

Huge legend. Most importantly, congrats to Alex on his new gig.

[Wojciechowski]

I know, not a legend as I pointed out to him. Lot of retired numbers up there. His ain't up there.

[Brian Windhorst]

Also a guy I've known for over 20 years. Wes Wilcox, former GM of the Atlanta Hawks, former assistant GM of the Kings, is now the general manager of Utah, the Utes.

[Wojciechowski]

Wendy, you'll be happy to know that I had salmon in the hospitality room.

[Brian Windhorst]

Lovely. They knew you were coming. Well, we should just start right there. Since summer league has started. Okay, real quick. I don't mean to be a spoil sport. I've been, I've been known, I've actually been known to be a spoil sport. But I don't want to be a spoil sport here. But let's. Before we get here, we talk about what 22 years of covering summer leagues has taught me. And I'm sure you two guys as.

[Wojciechowski]

Well, you haven't covered for 22 years because I haven't seen you one in a while.

[Brian Windhorst]

That is actually correct. I haven't been there in about six years since pre pandemic. You're right. But many years of summer leagues have taught me. And if you guys disagree with me, please step in. Number one, being good at summer league is less relevant than being bad at summer league.

[Tim Bontemps]

Ding.

[Brian Windhorst]

Okay. In other words, if you. Which by the way, sometimes you're good at summer league and it is an indicator that you're going to be a dynamic or impact player in the NBA.

[Tim Bontemps]

Donovan Mitchell, one of the best examples of that. Donovan Mitchell went to summer league, had a giant summer league, and it was like, wow, this guy's something. And then he showed up and was great from the jump.

[Wojciechowski]

And I will also say there are exceptions to the being bad thing. Like Trae Young had a terrible summer league and he's had a pretty good career.

[Brian Windhorst]

Well, there's exceptions to every rule. But what I'm saying here is being.

[Tim Bontemps]

Bad at summer league is not a, it's not a death sentence either. But it means more if you're a high pick and you show up and you're not good.

[Brian Windhorst]

Right. It's. It tends to be more relevant to the fall when you play poorly at summer league than when you play well at summer league. Number two, if you're a sophomore or older, you really, really need to be dominating. Like, you really need to put up good numbers. In fact, the basics, if you're not.

[Tim Bontemps]

Showing up and playing a couple games and being really good and stopping, that's usually not a great sign for your long term future.

[Brian Windhorst]

Absolutely.

[Wojciechowski]

Yeah.

[Tim Bontemps]

Not always. Again, not always, but usually.

[Brian Windhorst]

And third, while I understand that these teams were put together in the last week and they go through practices and there's a, you know, there are things that happen in summer league that, you know, these teams are coming together and they're trying to win and a coach can be sort of, can sort of show off their like in game ATO plays and all this kind of stuff. Winning Summer League means 0.0, not a lot. So doesn't mean that you can't have a nice July afternoon or evening taking in a summer league game. Doesn't mean that you shouldn't go to Vegas and have a great time over there. Doesn't mean that there isn't, you know, value be taken out of it. Just be very careful at the play by play analysis. That is done. That's all. Having said that, McMahon, you attended the big game to kick off the Utah Summer League that featured Ace Bailey of the hometown Utah Jazz, going up against Vijay Edgecombe, the number three overall pick of the 76ers. What did you learn from that experience?

[Wojciechowski]

Well, I learned that VJ Edgecombe, with NBA spacing can get to his spots with relative ease. Didn't have the best shooting night, 1 of 7 from 3, but he got up 27 shots and knocked down 13 of them. And man, does that guy got a turbo button which you knew. But I, you know, he didn't have a great year at Baylor. The space was awful. He's playing traffic the whole year, him. And with some space and the open floor especially is fun to watch, you know. Ace Bailey. Let's start with the positives. He was there, right?

[Brian Windhorst]

Yeah.

[Wojciechowski]

There was no drama. There were no like, indications of discontent or attitude.

[Brian Windhorst]

Like he was smiling. The, the Jazz media reported Ace Bailey.

[Tim Bontemps]

We should point out Ace Bailey has always been known to be a very high energy, positive guy. It's not like he was some malcontent guy. I mean, that was a weird situation for a variety of reasons, but nobody ever was like wondering if the guy was going to show up and be.

[Wojciechowski]

You know, I talked to a lot of people with Jazz, you know, including Will Hardy, and you know, Will said, hey, every bit of feedback that he's gotten from the, you know, from the time he showed up, you know, with Will, met him at the plane. Ace wanted to get right to the facility, you know, get some shots up. Four days of practice, you know, all the feedback's been good. You know, he had some defensive plays that were impressive, some rebounding, you know, had a clutch rebound that sealed it after sitting six minutes of crunch time, by the way, which was interesting. And that's not why he was the fifth overall pick in the draft. That's not why he was Projected at one point to be a top three pick. You know, he was projected there because the guy's supposed to be a potentially, you know, big time scorer and you didn't see a whole lot of that. 8 points, 3 of 13. Not going to overreact to an 18 year old kids summer league opener. I think that one really good thing about Ace Bailey is he can get his shot up whenever he wants to. Also one bad thing about Ace Bailey is he can get a shot up whenever he wants to. And there are times where it's like, you know, and, and Scott Morrison, friend of the pod, a defender of all Canadians, a guy who really did not like me saying that Shea was the weak link of the Oklahoma City Thunder defense, which I meant as a kind of a backhand account.

[Brian Windhorst]

You stand by that statement? I believe I do.

[Wojciechowski]

And she'll be the first to tell you, but I've been chastised by Scott Morrison, Jazz assistant, former Celtic assistant, very good dude, summer league coach and proud Canadian. I've been chastised by him. But anyways, you know, he point out like they can do a better job getting him involved. It's an interesting situation. You know, there's a lot of guys that are on the Jazz roster that are playing for their summer league team. Cody Williams, by the way, also sat out all of crunch time. But it's not like, you know, Ace wasn't, wasn't a featured attraction necessarily. Offensively they weren't like, they weren't, you know, he. Scott said they could do a better job of getting him more involved offensively and then, you know, maybe he could do a little bit better job on, on shot selection. But those two things kind of go hand in hand. But again, they were, they were choosing to emphasize the positive of, you know, the, the effort, the athleticism, the length defensively, his ability to cover a lot of ground defensively to close out, you know, like to be able to help and close out big distances, you know, his willingness and ability to rebound, those kind of things. And as Will told me, he says that stuff doesn't get talked about enough with him and the offense will come as he learns a new system and new people and all those kind of things.

[Tim Bontemps]

Yeah, he's a guy that's going to probably drive Will insane at times this year with his shot selection and, you know, the shots he'll take. But that's fine. That's the whole point. It's why Utah is such a good fit for him. They have plenty of shots for him to get. They got Plenty of playing time for him to have. That's exactly the kind of situation he needed to go to a place where he can grow into his game, grow through the mistakes, play for a great coach. I think, I do think, you know, he's obviously got a lot of upside. I do think that's going to be as good a situation as it could have been for him and it was good to see him out there playing and all. San Vijay Edgecombe is Chris demarco another friend of the pod coach the Bahamian national team the last several years. Coached them in in some international tournaments last summer and Vijay was playing with Eric Gordon and deandre Ayton and several other NBA players.

[Wojciechowski]

They were a win away from being in the Olympics.

[Tim Bontemps]

And, and that's right.

[Wojciechowski]

Argentina, he was their best player.

[Tim Bontemps]

Yeah Speed Argentina were in a competitive game in Spain with Spain and, and Vijay was as you said, big Bam. He was at times their best player and was really good. And Chris came away from that experience just last summer I talked to him when they beat Argentina raving about how impressive he was. So yeah, I mean you can. He's got big time athleticism. You could see it in that game. And obviously he's another guy who's got some growing pains to go through. But the idea of him and Tyrese Maxey long term in the backord together is pretty interesting for the Sixers.

[Wojciechowski]

I mean Edgecomb just like you watch him and he is a wow athlete. Like I said, the turbo button, the leaping ability, just. It just felt like, I mean he got up 27 shots and there weren't a lot where you like that was a, that he forced out one like he was just getting the spots he 10 rebounds. He's in a. He is a high, high, high level athlete. Like he might be a top 10 athlete in the league when he steps on the floor.

[Tim Bontemps]

We should point out too. One, one new piece of news that just came in is that the Bucks resigned Ryan Rollins young guard, a three or $12 million deal according to Shamps. I like that deal for Milwaukee. It's going to go under the radar because he didn't play a ton last year. But he's a pretty interesting. It's a pretty interesting young player and he might end up starting for them based off depending on what their roster looks like. So I like that move for the Bucks.

[Brian Windhorst]

I would be remiss to talk about the Utah Summer League, which is pretty much two days old of their three days without mentioning Dalton Connect or just the Lakers in general.

[Tim Bontemps]

Well, they're not in the Utah Summer League. So that would, that would probably not.

[Brian Windhorst]

Be this, that would be the Sacramento Summer League. That's right. Yeah.

[Tim Bontemps]

I think it's called the California Summer League and it's in, it's in San Francisco.

[Wojciechowski]

We'll get there in a second. Jackson just had a nice little stat addition here. VJ Edgecombe, fourth top five pick to have a 25 point, 10 rebound game at Summer League since 2017. The others. Are you guys looking at this or do you want to guess?

[Brian Windhorst]

Yeah, I see it, but go ahead.

[Tim Bontemps]

I didn't see it. Who are they?

[Wojciechowski]

Wimby, Jalen Brown, Jason Tatum.

[Tim Bontemps]

That's a pretty good list.

[Wojciechowski]

So no guarantees, but not bad company to be in. Also saw. Well, there's one other thing I want to mention with the Ace Bailey situation. There were some eyebrows raised when it was revealed that Omar Cooper Jr. Would be a guest coach for the Utah Jazz during Summer league. His dad, Omar Sr. Is the, I'm going to say advisor because I don't believe he's officially an agent, but the guy who's been advising Ace Bailey throughout, you know, last couple years, including a pretty messy pre draft process, I would say. So again, there were some eyebrows raised there. It's an unpaid, it was an unpaid deal and Omar Jr did just wrap up his college career at McNee State. He's going to go into coaching. I was told he'll be on Will Wade's staff at North Carolina State next year. But some of those eyebrows that were raised were at the league office. They reached out to the Jazz and raised some concerns and the unpaid internship, I guess you could say, was ended before summer league started.

[Brian Windhorst]

That is, I actually didn't know that was the outcome. So good reporting by you.

[Wojciechowski]

Well, thanks for eating.

[Tim Bontemps]

I read Big Band Story today. I guess somebody didn't.

[Brian Windhorst]

I did not. What do you want me to say? It was July 4th weekend.

[Wojciechowski]

He was too busy hobnobbing with Omaha mayor.

[Tim Bontemps]

He sure was.

[Brian Windhorst]

I had. I thought the Lakers were in the Utah Summer League.

[Tim Bontemps]

That's where I'm at in the Utah Summer League and Sacramento Summer League. That's in San Francisco today.

[Wojciechowski]

I did see Nikola Topic play basketball.

[Brian Windhorst]

All right, so Nikola Topic was the lottery pick by the Oklahoma City Thunder in the 2024 draft. He is a Serbian teenager, regarded as the best European prospect last year had a torn ACL that he suffered during the season playing for his Serbian professional team. So he skipped this whole year recovering from that. And so he played his first basketball in a long Time over a year, I believe. And so that's the backstory. This, you know, during this year, you know, they didn't have room really to play another young guy anyway, so they were able to take a flyer on a guy who sank in the draft a little bit. If he had been healthy, there's a decent, I mean, there were times where he was projected as a top five pick, and I don't know if he would have gone there, but I think the Thunder had like, the 13th or 14th pick. They took him right at the back.

[Wojciechowski]

Yeah, okay, well, pick and, you know, 14 points, four cysts, seven turnovers. Like his stat line won't wow you, but you see, you see why he was a lottery pick. He's six, six and smooth and kind of get where he wants to go. You know, again, the, the turnovers, I, I don't, I don't sweat those too much in a, in a summer league situation. I don that there's going to be any minutes for him. But you see why people were so high on him, you know, in the draft and especially before he had the knee injury. And I, I, he's not, he's. Dagenault had mentioned during the finals that he hadn't played five on five yet. So he's like, very, very fresh back into, you know, scrimmaging and now summer league, you know, into five on five action.

[Tim Bontemps]

He also walked out there and was being guarded from the jump by a guy who finished third rookie of the year last year in Jalen Wells, who was good to see back after his injury at the end of the regular season. And that's a, that's not an easy way to walk back into 5 on 5 for the first time in about 15 months, I would say either.

[Brian Windhorst]

But a good, a good test.

[Wojciechowski]

Very good test.

[Tim Bontemps]

More Hoop Collective podcast after this. Close your eyes, exhale, feel your body.

[Wojciechowski]

Relax, and let go of whatever you're carrying today.

[Jackson McMahon]

Well, I'm letting go of the worry that I wouldn't get my new contacts in time for this class. I got them delivered free from 1-800-contacts. Oh, my gosh, they're so fast.

[Tim Bontemps]

And breathe.

[Jackson McMahon]

Oh, sorry. I almost couldn't breathe when I saw the discount they gave me on my first order. Oh, sorry.

[Brian Windhorst]

Namaste.

[Jackson McMahon]

Visit 1-800-contacts.com today to save on your first order.

[Brian Windhorst]

1-800-Contacts.

[Jackson McMahon]

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[Brian Windhorst]

Francisco, Lakers have played two games so far. And Dalton Connect is I believe 5 of 22 in those, 2 for 5 of 25 of 20 in those two games. So I didn't watch them. I'm just telling you the stats, so I couldn't tell you. Jackson. Jackson was very excited to tell us about Cole Swider, former Laker. Who else did he play for? Please? Play for the Raptors.

[Tim Bontemps]

Played for Miami. He's played for a bunch of teams. Yeah, he, Jackson probably knows all the teams by heart.

[Brian Windhorst]

He averaged 22 points and shot 63% on threes the first, these first two games. And Bronnie James played one of the games, only played 10 minutes and went three of seven, had two rebounds and a steal, so scored 10 points, hit two threes.

[Wojciechowski]

Yeah, connect.09 from three point range. You know, again, I'm not going to overreact too much to a summer league, but for a sophomore who got a decent amount of playing time as a rookie, he's certainly not passing the second summer league domination test.

[Brian Windhorst]

Well, the thing about connect, actions over words. The Lakers have already traded him once. All right, so that's number one. The second thing is, as the season went along, J.J. redick stopped playing him. Yeah, and look, he's a rookie. You know, I'm not. Lots of rookies have struggled to get playing time early in their careers, but there was a time where, where people thought this was one of the steals in the, the steals of the draft.

[Wojciechowski]

I mean, LeBron was, was mocking all the GMs who passed on him early in the season.

[Brian Windhorst]

That's correct. Yeah. Which again Like, I. I'm all fine for a star player praising his teammate. Like, that's totally fine. I'm not going to judge that. But, you know, for all I know, he'll hit his. Hit his next 12 threes. But I just, you know, I'm monitoring that development, especially since, you know, there's a chance he could be traded again, you know, depending on what the Lakers want to do with their roster. So, you know, this is not.

[Wojciechowski]

This was not a weekend where his value was boosted.

[Brian Windhorst]

Exactly. I think that's exactly the point. So I just got another Lakers release.

[Wojciechowski]

Oh, great. What's it say about LeBron?

[Brian Windhorst]

Nothing.

[Wojciechowski]

Oh, damn.

[Brian Windhorst]

Not mentioned. We'll keep waiting.

[Wojciechowski]

What's this one on?

[Brian Windhorst]

This is another release about their.

[Tim Bontemps]

They signed their second round pick. They traded for their second round pick earlier.

[Brian Windhorst]

Now they've signed him.

[Wojciechowski]

Oh, great.

[Brian Windhorst]

He got two releases today.

[Wojciechowski]

Wow.

[Tim Bontemps]

There will not be a release about the player option, just so people know, as we've talked about before, because teams don't do that. However. What? Hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on. That does not preclude Rob Pelinka from putting out a statement about all this and ending all this. So I'd like to see it. It'd be great. I'm waiting for it, too.

[Brian Windhorst]

Wow.

[Wojciechowski]

Hey. LeBron's playing golf. Been a lot of coverage of that.

[Brian Windhorst]

I saw that. I saw that. He was back in Ohio this week. I was trying to figure. I think I know a course he was playing, but.

[Tim Bontemps]

Of course you do.

[Brian Windhorst]

I will say that I saw him play golf when he was with the Heat. The Heat had like a golf thing and it was horrific. He has gotten. He has gotten markedly better in the last decade as a golfer.

[Tim Bontemps]

You can afford lessons, I think.

[Wojciechowski]

Yeah. I'll acknowledge that. I've never played a whole of golf outside of like putt putt. I have done like top golf a couple times. If I go back, I'm gonna try left handed.

[Brian Windhorst]

It's a shame because you could probably absolutely freaking move it off the tee with your body type.

[Wojciechowski]

I'm. I'm a righty, but I did hit lefty in baseball, so maybe there's hope, but right handed, it, like there's swinging and missing going on. It's not good.

[Brian Windhorst]

Well, it happens. I'm just telling you, it's. You know, if you'd chosen golf instead of basketball, you might have been able to do something with your sports career.

[Wojciechowski]

You mean I didn't. I didn't do something with it?

[Brian Windhorst]

Well, what are you gonna say? What are you able to say, I'm just telling you, you could have hit it up probably a ton. You probably could have absolutely routinely hit a.325.

[Wojciechowski]

Based on my limited golf experience, I don't think I had a whole lot of potential.

[Brian Windhorst]

All right, well, that's. That's your opinion. All right, so there was. Today was the first day of the new league year, and there was dozens of transactions that were all lined up. They're still happening. But I will just say, as we're recording this, approaching 11pm Eastern on Sunday night doesn't mean that it won't happen tonight, doesn't mean whatever, but unless you guys have seen a release that I haven't seen or seen official data from the league, but I don't think the Jonas Valensunas Dario Sarge trade has actually happened yet.

[Tim Bontemps]

I don't believe. I. I don't believe that is among the transactions that have been announced yet, though. That doesn't mean. Because as it isn't technically the first day of the league year, that was a week ago, but it's the first day that the moratorium is over, so transactions can happen. So. So that. So, like, as Bobby jokingly put out a tweet this morning, it's like there are 10,000 planes lined up at the Runway to leave all at the same time, and you have to wait for everyone to go. Like, for example, this, you know, ridiculous 17 trade that was attempted to be made into a thing by people this week that began with the Kevin Durant trade, which was on game seven of the finals, which feels like seven lifetimes ago, but it was two weeks ago today. So you have a whole lot of stuff, including a lot of draft trades that all happen before you get to any free agency stuff and any trade stuff that happened.

[Brian Windhorst]

So that's not necessarily. It's not done in chronological order, for example.

[Tim Bontemps]

I just mean there's. I. I just was saying there's a mil. I just mean there's a million things they have to do. It doesn't. I don't mean the order.

[Brian Windhorst]

Okay, well, maybe they'll happen tonight. But, I mean, it was my way of getting into talking about Jonas Valenciunas.

[Wojciechowski]

Yeah. Bond amps.

[Brian Windhorst]

I suppose that's explaining to people we could get a release in the next 60 seconds that that trade went through, but it hasn't come through as of 11 is almost 11pm on Sunday night. And so there was this unique thing. And before we get into this, we are talking about a backup player here, no offense to Jonas, who I, you know, I have respect for guys who dominate international basketball, which he has.

[Wojciechowski]

Well, and he's been a starter for a long time in the league.

[Tim Bontemps]

He's had a great career. I, I also, I would also. Well, we'll get into this, I guess. I, I have thoughts on the actual impact he's going to have on the Nuggets, but that's a, that's another.

[Brian Windhorst]

All right, but what I'm saying is we're not, we're not talking about transformational part of the league here as we have a right. A non LeBron James Giannis Atenokounmpo podcast on July 6th. Okay, sure.

[Wojciechowski]

But we're talking about the biggest hole on the Nuggets roster for Joker's entire career.

[Brian Windhorst]

It is interesting that Jonas Valensunas within a day or two of being traded, which presumably the Kings didn't know he was thinking about leaving the NBA or the Nuggets didn't know he was leaving the NBA. Maybe they did, but I would be surprised. He is linked by multiple reports in Europe to be interested in an offer for Panathenikos, which is one of the larger powerhouse teams in the Euroleague. Olympiacos and Panathenikos are the two Greek legacy teams.

[Wojciechowski]

Pronunciation bond temps. Is that what.

[Tim Bontemps]

Oh, it just reminds me. It. It wasn't correct, but it reminded me of when McBan gave a swing at this on TV last week.

[Wojciechowski]

No, it wasn't on TV. It was.

[Tim Bontemps]

That's why I was on the call. That's right.

[Wojciechowski]

I forgot. I said, like Panthanacos.

[Tim Bontemps]

It wasn't, it wasn't Panasonicos, which is what the team name is. But I enjoyed, I enjoyed Big Bad's attempt.

[Brian Windhorst]

It was. It was a.

[Tim Bontemps]

It was a game effort anyway. Game effort.

[Brian Windhorst]

So in fact, he, I believe, was even spotted in Athens.

[Tim Bontemps]

Oh, he was. That is correct.

[Brian Windhorst]

The interesting thing about this is, of course he's under contract for another year and his contract next year is non. Guaranteed. That's one way you could, you could get him to make sure he stays in the NBA. You could guarantee next year's $10 million. I'm sure he would.

[Wojciechowski]

But let's, let's spell it out though. It. It's not up to him. He can't break his contract. Like.

[Tim Bontemps]

That's right. So rules. That's right. So here. So this is, this is. These are the rules on it. So Brian and I wrote about this in our piece on Friday, but laid this out. So if you're a player like Jonas Valchunas and you Want to go play? You're under contract and you want to go play in Europe. You want to go to Panathon Icos and play. You can't just, to McMahon's point, you can't just do that if you're under contract. So last year, Sasa Vzenkov, who was a former yearly MVP or one of the top players in Europe, he was on the Kings, also was traded to the Raptors. He forego. He let go the rest of the money on his deal. I believe he was owed $8 million and he went back, I think, to play in Greece. I don't remember which team he went to play for. He was given a letter of clearance by the league saying, you can go back and play. It's okay. The Raptors were cool with him leaving. They took the money back and then he left. So if you're for Jonas Valunis, you can sign any agreement you want with Panath and iOS. You can go, hey, I'm going to. I want to go play for you guys. But to do that, the team has to say it's cool for him to leave. And then the NBA has to say, you're under contract, but we're clearing you from that so you can go back to Europe and play.

[Brian Windhorst]

By the way, the same goes the other way around. If you are playing for Real Madrid and you want to sign with the Nuggets, you got to get a letter of clearance. And the way you get that usually is by the NBA team sending money over there.

[Wojciechowski]

Yeah, that's why.

[Tim Bontemps]

Or the deal has a buyout in it and they negotiate like last year. That's what happened with Gershon Yabaselli, who we'll probably talk about later. He was playing for Real Madrid and he agreed to a buyout so he could get out of his deal and go sign with the Sixers after he played well in the Olympics.

[Brian Windhorst]

Right, so. But the Nuggets, at least ostensibly, which were counting on, you know, part of the reason that the Nuggets were getting such high praise for their off season was because they were able to acquire a well regarded backup center. And maybe he's not going to the hall of Fame, but it's certainly a better regarded backup center. Is it. Is it the best backup he's had since?

[Wojciechowski]

Dude, it's the best backup of Joker's career, which.

[Brian Windhorst]

Well, what about when Yousef Nurkic was there?

[Wojciechowski]

The best backup of Joker's career.

[Tim Bontemps]

And also he's not as good as. He's not as good as Nurkic was.

[Wojciechowski]

That dude, in recent years, here was the problem. Nurkic was miserable and made everybody else.

[Brian Windhorst]

Miserable because Nurkic thought he was totally disregarding DeAndre Jordan. But okay.

[Wojciechowski]

Player, I am. All right.

[Brian Windhorst]

Anyway, so the Nuggets have their new backcourt and you know, I was told that, you know, and Mr. Jokic has not spoken on the record, at least in English about this that I've seen. But I was told through secondhand that Jokic was very pleased with the Nuggets moves.

[Wojciechowski]

So they brought back his guy, Bruce Brown, huge piece of the championship team. Hardaway is a nice shooter for the bench. And then, you know, this, this like Valentunas isn't an all star, but he's a. He averaged 10 and 8 and 19 minutes last year. Like he can give him.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yeah, he is a game. He's an elite offensive rebounder. He has.

[Tim Bontemps]

I do think it's. I do think it's very strange that they went out and traded for when $400,000 into the tax. A and B, traded for a guy who has no hope of being on the court in the playoffs. Like kind of a problem.

[Brian Windhorst]

I don't think that's fair. But I do think that you don't look at him as being a guy who is play eight and trust seven. I'm not sure he's in your trust.

[Wojciechowski]

Set bond tips. Here's the thing. They don't need the backup center in the playoffs because Joker plays 40 minutes and the other eight, Aaron Gordon shifts to the five. What they need is for Joker to be fresh and not completely worn out by the time layoffs start.

[Tim Bontemps]

Yes, I understand the guy who can.

[Wojciechowski]

Eat 14 to 16 minutes a night and they're not bleeding points like they've done Joker's entire career. Yes, I am the biggest regular season rotation problem.

[Tim Bontemps]

I am aware of that. I just find the combination of going $400,000 into the tax for a team that ostensibly did not want to be in the tax and getting a guy who is not to me going to make much of a difference, if any, in the playoffs. An interesting combination.

[Wojciechowski]

I'm just going to say that you said ostensibly twice. That's a once a pod max word. Okay. And second of all, you've about their depth for years now. They address it and you about their depths.

[Tim Bontemps]

I, I still don't. I'm not sure they actually got much better.

[Brian Windhorst]

Well, I will say this.

[Tim Bontemps]

You'll get sort of what I'm hitting at.

[Brian Windhorst]

Jokic played 37 minutes in the regular season this last year. That's the most he's played in his career, so.

[Wojciechowski]

And he had to sit late in the season because he was just beat the hell up.

[Brian Windhorst]

So that trend has to reverse. Now, let me just say this. If they do agree to a buyout and, and Valentunas does go to Europe, they would not only get out of the tax. Yes. They would get access to their mid level.

[Tim Bontemps]

Well, the part of this that we're leaving out, they would also get rid of Dario Sarich, who is absolutely not at this point an NBA player, and they would have got him off their books for free.

[Brian Windhorst]

Well, so here's the thing, everybody. I have not spoken to anybody about this, but I've seen extensive reporting that this trade is going through no matter what. So you may ask yourself the question. Well, why would this trade go through if Denver wasn't sure about this deal? Why would this trade go through? And in the case of the Nuggets, they're getting rid of Dario Sarge, who did not have a role on their team last year, who's guaranteed $5 million.

[Tim Bontemps]

This year and saving $5 million for free in that case.

[Brian Windhorst]

Right. And if you're the Kings, you're trading a $10 million player for a $5 million player. So you're saving money too. And they've even been linked to Gree be apparently trying to retrade Sarich already in other deals.

[Wojciechowski]

Well, and, and they needed that money to be able to sign Schroeder. So you know that the flexibility that that created allowed them to sign Schroeder, which has been their biggest move of the all season. But as Shams reported today, the Nuggets have informed Valentunas, his reps that the franchise fully expects him to honor his contract. They are not planning to buy them out. They're not planning to let them out. They're not planning to have anything but Valentunas be Joker's backup center. Now, there has been speculation. It's not information. It's been speculation. Hey, you know, with what you're talking about, you know, are the Nuggets lurking? Why? Why isn't a Horford signed? Why isn't Horford gone to the warriors yet? Could he land in Denver? But all indications right now are the Nuggets saying, hey, buddy, you're under contract with us. We need you, so we'll see you at training camp. To Valentunas, to be clear, more Hoop.

[Tim Bontemps]

Collective podcast after this.

[Jackson McMahon]

With a Venmo debit card, you can Venmo more than just your friends. You can use your balance in so many ways. You can Venmo everything. Need gas? You can Venmo this. How about snacks? You can Venmo that. Your favorite band's merch? You can Venmo this or their next show. You can Venmo that. Visit Venmo Me Debit to learn more.

[Brian Windhorst]

You can Venmo this or you can Venmo that. Yeah, you can Venmo this or you can Venmo that. You can Vemo.

[Jackson McMahon]

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[Unknown]

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[Wojciechowski]

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[Brian Windhorst]

Yeah, so something to monitor. I do think Al Horford is one of the more interesting pieces that's still out there. We have some restricted free agents that haven't signed. Jonathan Kaminga being at the top of that list, though. The Warriors. Of all the teams in the NBA, the team that has had the least impactful offseason at this point has been the warriors. But they have Kaminga. But other than that, Horford, who has been tied to Golden State pretty significantly in the last week. Horford's a big domino.

[Tim Bontemps]

He's the biggest one left.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yeah, depending on how depending happens with Kamingo. Certainly if you're a contending team and you're trying to get a piece.

[Tim Bontemps]

Al Horford's the biggest domino left piece. Al Horford is the biggest domino left on the board.

[Wojciechowski]

Okay.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yeah. Well, anyway, so that is something to to point out. Okay, so the first batch of player signings came in today and Bobby sends us all the details. And this is one of the things that we do. Take a look at the, the ins and outs and all of the finer points of each contract to sort of see, you know, what's relevant going forward. Because sometimes when you hear, you know, contracts you're like oh, so and so signed for three years and something million. And then you, you know, get the numbers later and it's like actually was only like a year guaranteed.

[Tim Bontemps]

So years, they're interesting. Some years they're less interesting.

[Brian Windhorst]

So there's a few, there's just a few things. First off, like deandre Ayton's second year of his contract is a player option. You know, he can become a free agent again in a year, which I actually think is a good thing for the Lakers because I think anything that incentivizes and activates Ayton to really press the gas pedal at all is a good thing. And the idea that he can play for free agency next year, I think that's actually a good thing. And if he opts out, then they'll, they'll deal with it and stuff like Nikhil Alexander Walker the, the four year deal that he signed in the sign and trade with the, with this, with the, the Hawks the last year. That's a player option. He can get out of that. Stuff like that. I found it, you know, somewhat interesting that you know, the Cavs gave Sam Merrill a 3 or $38 million contract and there's no, it's fully guaranteed, no options at all. But four years.

[Tim Bontemps]

Just for people listening.

[Brian Windhorst]

What did I say? Three? I'm sorry.

[Tim Bontemps]

Yeah, four for 38, but fully guaranteed, no options.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yeah.

[Tim Bontemps]

So there's still sign of faith in him. He's going to be a key piece for them next year.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yeah, the Lakers, I'm not sure what their strategy here is, but the contract that they gave Jake Laravia and the contract that they gave Aiden do not have raises in them. They're flat. Which is an indication that they're, they're keeping their eye on 2026. They're trying to, you know, they have.

[Tim Bontemps]

No, they have, they have currently one player under contract, Nick. Well too. They have Jake Larry under contract and Jared Vanderbilt under contract for next year.

[Brian Windhorst]

Right. So they're trying to maximize that. Even if picks up his option, they're. I know some people have been talking about the lakers looking at 2027 as like a big, big free agent year. Well, their actions are indicating that. They're also eyeing 2026.

[Tim Bontemps]

First off, they got to convince a certain dude to sign between now and next summer. Well, they should probably be focused on that.

[Brian Windhorst]

Oh well, of course they are. But you know, like they didn't, you know who everybody's got their story, you know, the LeBron side is very clear that they didn't ask, you know, they didn't ask for extra years. I'm skeptical of that. I. Whether they asked for it or whether they wanted it or two different things.

[Tim Bontemps]

But they expected it to be offered.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yes. Right. So you know, there's this whole term about offer and ask and all this stuff. But long story short, the lakers don't have LeBron under contract for next year and then the contracts that they have signed are protecting next year's money already. So just note stuff like that. But Bontemps, you noticed something that you mentioned earlier with Gerson Yabaselli that I.

[Tim Bontemps]

Yeah, full credit to Stefan Bondi from the New York postpone the Nets beat who reported this first either today or yesterday. But Gabacelle took a couple hundred thousand dollars less on. He signed for the taxpayers mid level exception which is supposed to be about 5.7 million. He took a couple hundred thousand less. He signed for 5.5 million this year, which the Knicks are bang up against the second apron again like they were last year. We've talked about Brock Holler, their cap guy before. He does a great job lining things up and by taking that little bit of money less, I double check with Bobby Marks to make sure this is accurate. They now have the ability to sign an extra player to the vet minimum this off season, which if he hadn't done that, they'd had to do some maneuvering to be able to do so. And for a Knicks team that, you know, getting Jordan Clarkson, you know, we'll see how much of an impact he can make. I think Yabaselli is going to be really good piece for them. He had a really good year last year for the Sixers has gotten way, way better than his failed first stint in the league when he was in Boston after they drafted him in the first round back. I think it's 16, but I think it'll help them a lot off the bench. But they've got minutes to play on the second unit. There's still some interesting players available for the minimum that they could potentially go get and that gives them the ability to go sign an extra guy which could prove quite useful for the Knicks this offseason under Mike Brown.

[Brian Windhorst]

And by the way, that contract that Yabaselli signed, which was two years and 11 million, he has a Player option. So he can be a free agent next summer as well.

[Tim Bontemps]

Probably part of the give back on getting that done too.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yeah, I'm sure. So those are the kind of things that we're musing about on July 6, 2025, to be honest with you. We're looking at these types of things and there'll be more in the next because not everyone, not all the stuff are done.

[Tim Bontemps]

This is only the first tranche of contracts coming through. Get a lot of emails next few days.

[Brian Windhorst]

McMahon in your corner of the world. Something interesting passed through social media on Sunday. Maybe it was Saturday night, Sunday involving newly re signed Dallas Mavericks point guard Kyrie Irving. Which looking at his contract, by the way, he has a player option in year three, which we already knew, and it's for three years, $118.4 million. He will make 36.5 this year. He opted out of how much?

[Wojciechowski]

43.

[Brian Windhorst]

43. So he's taking roughly a $6 million reduction in the first year to add roughly 80 million in guarantee.

[Wojciechowski]

Well, and more. So the reason he took that reduction was to add d' Angelo Russell to the roster.

[Brian Windhorst]

That was nice of him.

[Wojciechowski]

I mean, that's why they needed him to take a pay cut.

[Tim Bontemps]

Did they need him? Did they need him to do that? Did they need him to do that?

[Wojciechowski]

I mean, I guess you can argue there are other ways they could have gone about it, but that's the way.

[Tim Bontemps]

That I. I also mean, like, what was the market for d' Angelo Russell really?

[Wojciechowski]

Well, the market was taxpayer mid level because that's what he got, clearly.

[Brian Windhorst]

All right. But Kyrie, was something that happened on Social was a comment that he made during a. Was it a Twitch session? I know he.

[Wojciechowski]

I believe so. It was one, I think, I don't know. Twitch. I've never been on Twitch, but a streaming session. Yes.

[Brian Windhorst]

Okay, go for it. Go forth.

[Wojciechowski]

Oh, you want me to read it now? All right. I didn't realize I was the one who was going to be tasked with reading this. I don't have it.

[Brian Windhorst]

You are tasked.

[Wojciechowski]

Okay, Okay. I don't have a Ready to roll, but I will find it and I will say that I've been informed that this is not like a fresh comment. He apparently made this comment weeks ago. I don't, you know, I don't know why. The aggregation machine.

[Brian Windhorst]

I think I think I know why. I think because in the excitement over just the Mavericks in general and you know, his, his contract in general, there was like some belief that. I don't know who said it first, but there was like, you know, he could be back, you know, around the All Star break or.

[Wojciechowski]

Well, no, January is what Sean's reported.

[Brian Windhorst]

Oh, Chom said that. Okay.

[Wojciechowski]

And that. And not that he would be, but that he could be back as soon as the goal was to be back by January, which always was like, man, that's, that's a really optimistic goal.

[Brian Windhorst]

It's a nine month window.

[Wojciechowski]

And the people I talked to with Mavericks, like, hey, man, if he's back by the All Star break, you know, we'd be very happy with that. We'd feel good about that. But this is Kyrie. He's asked if he'll be back by the playoffs and he said, don't hold your breath on that. I don't want to make any predictions on when I'm going to be back. I just want to be back 150,000% better.

[Brian Windhorst]

Me too.

[Wojciechowski]

Yeah, that's tough math. But so I'm taking my time right now to really get healthy and you know, listen, I think if first of all, this is just Kyrie kind of like speaking freely, right. It's not like he's not in like a press conference mode. He's just kind of, you know, babbling, as Bondemps might say. And I think, you know, if you ask him, his answer might change day to day, I would agree. And you know, hour to hour. But it is a, like he's, he absolutely should take his time to make sure that he's completely healthy before he returns, however long that takes. And you know, and for Jamal Murray, it, you know, very similar time frame in terms of an acl. He missed the entire next season, including the playoffs. That I'm not, you know, in no way am I trying to predict anything on Kyrie, but I'm just saying, like, hey, you know these things, there's the physical recovery, there's the mental hurdle they've got got a clear to come back. And I do think there's been a lot of presumption in the discussion about the Mavericks that Kyrie is going to be back to being Kyrie this season.

[Brian Windhorst]

Right. I'm just, I'm seeing a lot of that. Like, oh, man, I mean, like, you.

[Tim Bontemps]

Know, we got asked about it. We got asked about it 17 different ways on TV last week. All three of us did.

[Brian Windhorst]

Right.

[Tim Bontemps]

Are the Mavericks contenders. There's kind of a. The fact that d' Angelo Russell is the only guard, first of all, fact that d' Angelo Russell is the only guard on the roster. Essentially, yeah.

[Wojciechowski]

They did resign but sure, I mean.

[Tim Bontemps]

Dante Exum is not an on ball guy at this. I mean he's a, he's a nice role playing defender at the guard spot, but he's not an on ball guy.

[Wojciechowski]

Can I interest you in Jaden Hardy?

[Tim Bontemps]

Like I said, shoot. The fact that d' Angelo Russell is the only guard on the roster, basically, it, it baffles me, continues to baffle me that in February when the Mavs made this trade, they then traded Quentin Grimes for Caleb Martin who couldn't walk. And they never went and got another guard then, which you could argue helped play a role in what happened with Kyrie later because he's playing the most minutes in the league over the next month. But they still haven't addressed it now, really. And now they're going to in theory go into next season with Cooper flag running point. JC's talking about like, I think that would be good for Cooper Flag for a team that's allegedly got a three to four year window and we're in year two of it, that does not seem like the best way to try to have a contending team this year because they're going to have to win games.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yeah, and one other thing on Kyrie, when you're counting up the months, which I'm sure people will, he did have the injury on March 3rd. Bad day for the Mavericks. He didn't have the surgery until three and a half weeks later at the end of March. So. And look, there's much different reasons for that, but the key is he really didn't start his recovery until April.

[Tim Bontemps]

You basically, you're basically, you got to count, you got to start basically from April 1, not from March 1.

[Brian Windhorst]

Exactly. So when you, so even if you're going to count the optimistic window, just keep that in mind.

[Tim Bontemps]

You know, look, the Mavs are, the Mavs are a fascinating team and if Kyrie can be back healthy, like if they're healthy in March, in April, they will be an interesting team. I mean, I, I mean they were going to be an interesting team last year. I mean, that's the craziest thing about the Luca trade to begin with is that, you know, we kept getting asked like again, I'll refer back to TV last week. You can't get asked about the Lakers and Mavericks rosters. Like the Mavericks roster is dramatically better than the Lakers roster. Like they got a bunch of good players. So, you know, like it's, it's like it's easy to forget because of everything that's happened. They were in the Finals a year ago.

[Brian Windhorst]

Like, it's not.

[Tim Bontemps]

It's not like they were bereft of talent at any point. So if they can get Kyrie back healthy, they are going to be awfully interesting. It just, again, it's why it's strange to me that we're sitting here in July and they did nothing to help the guard spot besides sign d' Angelo Russell.

[Wojciechowski]

Well, and when he looked at the roster, you know, there was like, it was reasonable to wonder, okay, hey, are they going to take some of this front court depth and, and make a deal to address the backcourt? You know, are they going to trade Daniel Gafford for a. An offensive creator? And they signed Gaffer to an extension. It is an extension that makes him trade eligible immediately. But, you know, certainly seems that their plan is to move forward with Gafford at least this season, which, you know, I get like, Derek Liver, the second's really good and has had some real durability issues. And then PJ Washington, you know, I'm not so sure PJ Washington's not starting alongside Cooper. Flag. Nico Harrison made a comment about, you know, Cooper coming in for his workout when he visited before the draft, and PJ was there and Nico said, you know, he looked over. PJ said, you think you can play with this guy? PJ's like, oh, yeah, I can play with him. And I think pj, he's eligible for an extension next month. I think there's a pretty good chance that gets done. So, you know, for the Mavericks to have any real hope of being a contender, they do need Kyrie back to being something close to himself. He's going to be turning 34 in March, coming back off a serious injury. You know, I think, like, the most, like, realistic hope is that, hey, he can come back sometime around the All Star break. That would give him a couple of months to kind of ramp up at the end of the regular season. You know, you can kind of steadily build him up in terms of minutes, you know, his. His rhythm, chip off the rust, and then hopefully come playoff time, you know, he's gotten himself to a point where he's playing at the kind of level that we're used to seeing from him. But it's, you know, I just think to be fair to Kyrie, you can't, like, bank on that and count on that and consider it a disappointment if he doesn't get back to being that guy this season.

[Brian Windhorst]

Fair enough. All right. So as we watch the remaining things in free agency, in addition to Al Horford, I'll just Bontemps mentioned Quentin Grimes before. He's restricted free agent with the 76ers. Josh Giddy, a restricted free agent with the Bulls. Kuminga a restricted free agent with the Warriors. There's one more significant one I'm forgetting.

[Wojciechowski]

But we're not three most interesting.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yeah, we're not seeing anything get done there yet. Also after we saw Jabari Smith Jr. Whose contract came across today too. He is five year $122 million, which is what it was to the penny extension. We haven't seen any of the other guys on their rookie deals coming, getting any of those done. And the only thing I want to say is last week something happened deep in NBA, in the NBA weeds that I think has chilled the market a little bit longer term, which is that after the projection was that the salary cap would increase by 10% next year, that it is now only projected to increase by 7%. Now you may say, I mean if you've stuck with us this deep into this particular podcast, you probably care about this. Now you may say, well, 7%, 10%, whatever. But the thing about it is is that right now is when the new media rights deal is coming in. This is the first year of it and the salary cap is only allowed to go up by 10% a year. And so with, with it's, you know, the media rights deal is increasing by over two times. It's more than twice the increases, more than doubling it. And so there was this belief that the NDA salary cap was going to go up 10% for three straight years just to fit this in. And the reason it's limited to 10% by the way, is because way back in 2016, the last time this happened, there was the famous cap spike where all of it came in, the Cap exploded in one year with the new.

[Wojciechowski]

Meteorites deal or the 73 win warriors got to sign KD.

[Brian Windhorst]

Exactly. That's why the famous cap spike.

[Tim Bontemps]

So they, they this time there was planning, right.

[Brian Windhorst]

So but the fact that it came in at 7% and so, and, and so you may say, well, why did it come in at 7%? Why not? Why not 10 if there's this new media rights deal. And the reason, from what I have been told and Bobby contributed to this is that the regional sports networks, yeah, all of those that are struggling, you know, in baseball it's been a big thing. But regional sports networks, uncertainty and lack.

[Tim Bontemps]

It's not just, it's, it's not uncertainty. It's the league. I mean the answer is the league has lost a ton of money.

[Brian Windhorst]

Right.

[Tim Bontemps]

Because the regional sports network have, have cratered across the board.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yeah.

[Wojciechowski]

You got a bunch of these teams doing the do it yourselfers like the Mavericks. You know, the Valley's deal went up in smoke.

[Tim Bontemps]

They had to do Mavericks. The Mavericks used to get $90 million a year for their, for their local rights deal. They're not, they're getting a fraction of that now.

[Wojciechowski]

That's just $1 million last year.

[Tim Bontemps]

Right. That's just one of. There's probably half the league that is in a situation like the Mavericks. Now. They weren't all making $90 million a year. Some of them were making less. A lot of them are making less. The Mavericks had a really good deal. At least I think it was $90 million. But the point is the league has lost a lot of money in that area and they have not found ways to replicate it yet. And so because of that, the projections are in lower than they were originally going.

[Brian Windhorst]

Right. So initially when teams were thinking about their next three years, Bobby talks about this a lot as a front office. It's typical to think in three year increments. And as they're negotiating these contracts, they were for a long time thinking that the cap was going to go up 30% the next three years. 10 this year, 10 next year and 10 the year after that. And now they're being told maybe only seven next year. And then when you think about that third year from now, like, what if it's less? So I was talking to a team over this weekend that says they have revised all of their projections and they're now only assuming 5% growth the next two years. Right.

[Tim Bontemps]

And just for, just for hard math. Right. So people understand this. So if as this year, the cap went up 10%, so the tax or the salary cap was $154.6 million this year. Right. So if the cap had gone up by the full 10%, it would have been basically $170 million. It would have gone up about $15 million. Right. Next year the salary cap is at 165. So it's 4 or $5 million less. And the luxury tax line is now at 200 and almost 201 million flat. It was, it would have been at 206.6. So when you look at, when you're, when you have teams trying to project forward on what they're doing and there's a lot of teams that are like that have a hard line of we're not going to go in the tax or we're not going to go much over the tax. Five and a half million dollars is the mid, is the taxpayers mid level exception. That's Gershon Yabaselle. Right. Or if you have teams that are banging up against the second apron, that's the difference between adding a player like that or not or making a trade or not. So that's where this stuff compounds and matters because all those things are tied to how much the cap goes up. And if it goes up less than people think, it sends a lot of stuff over to the side from where it was supposed to be.

[Wojciechowski]

Okay, but like Paulo Banchero, that's one where you figure that's like going to be a, you know, as soon as they can, boom, it's done type of deal. Like what are they negotiating? How can they, they can, I, I.

[Tim Bontemps]

I, I suspect we're going to hear about that pretty soon.

[Wojciechowski]

Well, the only thing that makes sense is if they're negotiating, hey, if they're holding a firm line on the, on.

[Tim Bontemps]

A player option, I suspect we're going to hear about that pretty soon.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yeah, that has been floated. But beyond the bankeros of the world, you know, like if you're, if you're thinking about, you know, what you're going to sign, you know, like if you're the Thunder and you're, you're, you're, you've been, you've spent a bunch of time computing how you're going to fit Jalen Williams and Chet Holmgren in to your, into your planning with Shakers Alexander and Alex Caruso and other guys that you have.

[Tim Bontemps]

Well, their situation actually works a couple different ways because like their extensions are going to be a little bit smaller than they were going to be because they're going to go online next summer in what's a little bit less money environment than you would have expected. Same for, you know, potentially down the road, David Booker, whenever he gets done sometime in the next few days, yes, his extension will be a little bit lower than it was.

[Brian Windhorst]

So yeah, again, to put hard numbers on this, you know, for, for months now we've been talking about how Devon Book Booker was in line to get a two year, 150 million dollar extension. And there was that real simple man, 75 million dollars a year, like, you know, richest. Now it's Shay Gildis Alexander who's actually beyond that. But, but the revision of that salary cap number, Bobby said it's actually not going to be 2 and 150. It's going to be 2 and 138 maybe. So a $12 million difference in that two years. So, anyway, I just want to point out that's one of the things that's potentially that. That. That staggered the league a little bit.

[Wojciechowski]

Yeah.

[Tim Bontemps]

Lastly made my eyebrows go up when it came over because that was not. That was not at all what people were thinking, you know, and then for.

[Wojciechowski]

For guys like Holmgren and. And J Dub, like, there's this supermax escalator conversation as well. And, you know, like Evan Moby was, is an example of a guy who. There were supermax escalators, but it wasn't like if you're eligible, you get full boat. I forgot all the different clauses that were in there. But, you know, based on how you qualified, he was going to get, you know, certain percentages of it.

[Tim Bontemps]

He got defensive player of the year, so he got all of them for all 30, but for all NBA, it was. It was a tiered thing. I don't remember the exact numbers either, but it went up by team that he was on.

[Wojciechowski]

Well, and, you know, J Dub just came off an all NBA season. Like, certainly he's, you know, he's obviously a candidate for that. And.

[Tim Bontemps]

And you've got two guys already off the board next year and Jason Tatum and Tyrese Halliburton and frankly, a third in Kyrie Irving just off the top of my head, who are all not going to be eligible, who typically would have a shot at.

[Wojciechowski]

Yeah, and Chad's going to be, you know, if he can stay healthy, I think he has a chance to be in the all NBA conversation and he certainly has a chance to be in the defensive player of the year conversation. As great as Lou Dord is, and he was first team all defensive this year, Chet, if he stays healthy, will be their best defense player of the year candidate.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yeah. So interesting little tidbits worth monitoring. Who knows what will happen this week in the NBA. We really didn't get a lot of action over the weekend. That's typical of the league over the Fourth of July when it falls over a weekend, people need a little bit of a breather.

[Tim Bontemps]

Hey, also, just not that much business left, really.

[Brian Windhorst]

McMahon. Breaking news. The Mavericks just officially signed Russell.

[Wojciechowski]

Oh, good.

[Tim Bontemps]

I'm glad.

[Brian Windhorst]

So, yeah, that's. That's big. All right, thank you very much to Jackson, who's back from his break. And thank you to McMahon and Bontems. Oh, by the way, tickets still available.

[Wojciechowski]

Oh.

[Brian Windhorst]

Saturday night coming up. Hoopcollectivelive.com 6pm Pacific at the MGM grand, the Brad Garrett Comedy Club. McMahon will be there. Bon Temps will be there. What Bon Temps is doing this next week is pretty remarkable. We won't give it away. We'll talk about it later. But Bon Temps has got an interesting schedule this next week and Special guests. Right?

[Tim Bontemps]

Special guests. Yeah, it's true.

[Brian Windhorst]

All right.

[Tim Bontemps]

Past the thousands.

[Wojciechowski]

Yeah. The IT Department and.

[Brian Windhorst]

That's right.

[Wojciechowski]

Method ones.

[Brian Windhorst]

That's right. You can. Well, I'm not going to say that. All right.

[Wojciechowski]

Thank you.

[Brian Windhorst]

No, I was just gonna say somebody else was gonna be there, but then I decided not to say it. That's all. Nothing to do with the IT Department.

[Wojciechowski]

Okay, good.

[Brian Windhorst]

All right. Thank you very much for watching. Listening to who Collective. We'll talk to you later this week.

[Wojciechowski]

Adios, amigos.

[Jackson McMahon]

In 1979, the first words spoken on ESPN weren't just an announcement. If you're a fan, they were a sports prophecy.

[Wojciechowski]

What you'll see in the next minutes, hours and days to follow. Glad you're with us tonight. May convince you you've gone to sports heaven, and right now, you're standing on the edge of tomorrow.

[Jackson McMahon]

This fall, the next era of ESPN begins. Sports forever.