← Brian Windhorst & The Hoop Collective
Brian Windhorst & The Hoop Collective
THE HOOP COLLECTIVE: Celtics BIG WIN over Lakers | Thunder dominate the WEST | Brunson + Lebron injury reaction
01:12:24
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- [00:00]
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- [00:36]
Tim Bottevs
Hello and welcome to the Hoop Collective podcast. We talk about the NBA which we're doing on Sunday afternoon. Joining us from Philadelphia, where he's at the Wells Fargo center where the Sixers are playing the Jazz. One of the biggest games of the NBA calendar is Tim Bottevs.
- [00:54]
Dave McMahon
I might have been at the most exciting and relevant game of the regular season on Saturday night with our guy Mac 10 and our guy the machine, Kevin Pelton. And I might be at game 1280 of 80 today.
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Tim Bottevs
The room that you're in at the Wells Fargo center, which is a, a very nondescript room, is a perfect symbol for the 76.
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Dave McMahon
I had to do a lot of work to find a room for the pod because the Flyers are playing this afternoon and a lot of the rooms in the center were booked, so.
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Tim Bottevs
I see.
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Dave McMahon
I found one though, eventually.
- [01:28]
Tim Bottevs
Well, here's a guy who's I'm sure rooted for the Flyers, growing up Philadelphia native joining us from New York today where he is with the Los Angeles Lakers, our lakers man, Dave McMahon.
- [01:41]
Brian Windhorst
Happy to be here with you both. And I didn't really root for the Flyers because they were always the team with the ridiculous payroll. Lindross and LeClaire and Brenda Moore. But they were the team with the crazy payroll that always failed. And I rooted for like the underdog teams in Philadelphia that failed anyway. But, but there wasn't. They didn't fail because of money. The Flyers failed. They had the most expensive roster but couldn't do anything.
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Dave McMahon
The most Philadelphia take ever. I, I rooted against a team for this reason, even though it was in my hometown.
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Tim Bottevs
I, I don't find ice hockey very relatable either. Well, I don't, I don't know anything about it, to be honest with you. I don't know anything about it. I can't, I can't.
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Dave McMahon
The guy does have a Phillies hat on today.
- [02:26]
Tim Bottevs
He does. It's a good looking Phillies hat.
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Brian Windhorst
Overachievers, the 93 Phillies. Underachievers, the Flyers.
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Dave McMahon
The Phillies spend no money on their team. I don't think I was gonna say.
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Tim Bottevs
I think Bryce Harper makes.
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Brian Windhorst
Things have changed I live in Los Angeles now. I've changed my standards back in the day when I a kid, you know.
- [02:48]
Tim Bottevs
All right, well, we had a high standard. How'd you like that? How about that, guys? A game on Saturday night and halfway through the fourth quarter I thought we were going to get it. Luca was in the game, making the run. The Celtics were doing the thing that they do, which is they play brilliantly and then they take their foot off the gas. And they were in the process of having a very Celtics game. And then midway through the fourth quarter, but LeBron pulled up lame Dave and it was still a very interesting game. We're going to talk about it. We learned some things from it. But now the. One of the biggest questions in the NBA is the severity and what sort of lingering effects LeBron's leg injury is going to have. So I saw what you reported yesterday. Who knows what you may know by the time this podcast runs, but LeBron having a groin injury is obviously concerning. It's going to be something that they're going to have to manage.
- [03:42]
Brian Windhorst
Brian, it was a big blow and you knew that was somewhat serious when he goes to the back and doesn't come back and go into the game because as he told us post game, he lives for moments like that. A four point game at Boston Garden. You can count on one hand how many games he has left in that building in his career. You know, maybe if there's some finals matchups you would. That's going to require more than one hand. But this is a precious commodity to be in that situation and the injury kept him out of things and I'm reporting that it's going to be most likely multiple weeks. He's going to let that kind of injury calm down a bit and then there's going to be some further evaluation to get a full extent of the severity of the strain. But it's a tough moment because Rui Hachimora is out for at least another week, as JJ Redick told us on Saturday. Jackson Hayes, they hope to get back on this current road trip, but obviously he's dealing with knee sort of. And Luka is a little banged up himself from a fall that he took in the New York game. And he was wincing as he was working his back out against the Celtics. So they are not in a great place health wise. It's a good thing they did all this work up to this moment to surge up the Western Conference standings. They still won 20 of their last 25 games. Even with this loss to the Celtics. But now it's a different math that we're talking about for the remainder of the season. It's, it's about what you can do to perhaps still host a first round playoff series. While the biggest priority is having LeBron James right for the start of the postseason.
- [05:32]
Tim Bottevs
Yeah, this is the nature of the NBA, specifically the Western Conference right now. It's just fragile. So you know, they're absolutely flying high. They look great. Jackson Hayes going down really affected them. You know, especially with Rehatchamer out. You know, when you watch this game, we'll talk to you about this in a second by attempts. But you watch this game. Even though Chris Apps Porzingis didn't play for the Celtics, you could very clearly tell the Celtics game plan was to take advantage of the Lakers lack of size in the interior. I mean LeBron was playing center for big stretches of the game. Luca was playing center at times out there. And so now that they're just really just, frankly they're just really thin with big bodies. They, I felt that they lost the game because of their lack of offense. Despite how they were able to. The Celtics were able to take advantage of mismatches. It wasn't like the Lakers got cooked on defense. Jason Tatum was Great, he had 40 points, but I just, they couldn't, they couldn't generate, generate enough points. And so that's going to be on Luca's shoulders. Maybe Lucas sore back a little bit because he's going to have to just score. Bontevs, what did we learn from this matchup? What do you take away from how that game, that 10 point win for the Celtics played out?
- [06:50]
Dave McMahon
I mean, you know, certainly I think watching the game, you know, like you said, we saw the Celtics again get a 20 point lead against one of the other five best teams in the league. They've done that against the Cavs, the Nuggets, the Knicks and now the Lakers. And they have the Thunder coming in the other of the top six teams in the league on Wednesday to the garden. So we'll see how it goes in that game. So I thought more or less we saw the Celtics be who they've been all season. I do think from the Lakers side, you know, seeing them in person for the first time since the trade. J.J. redick deserves a ton of credit for how hard he has these guys playing defensively. Like they don't, like we've talked about, they don't have a lot of, you know, necessarily they don't have an overwhelming, a lot of defensive talent, especially when they're going to try to have, you know, the combination of Luca and Austin, Reeves and LeBron all out there. At the same time though LeBron's been really engaged at that end of the court. But you saw in this game, to me the, the thing that's allowed them to be so good defensively is that they've been playing so hard and with so much energy and flying around and you know, really being committed to the scheme that J.J. watson to play and I think as you saw this game go on, saw the Lakers get a little heavy legged in the second half, being down a couple of guys having to play to.
- [08:06]
Tim Bottevs
I thought LeBron looked, I thought LeBron looked tired even before the groin injury. I thought, I thought he, I thought he.
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Brian Windhorst
There was one point we looked up and four of the five Lakers on the court, this was early in the fourth quarter, all had their arms at their sides like holding them.
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Tim Bottevs
Sorry to interrupt you, but they were.
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Dave McMahon
Gassed and the Lakers have done a good job in transition over the past few weeks and the Celtics got out and transitioned a bunch in this game as it went along too. But you know, it, you did see the wear and tear on, on the Lakers as the game went on. And yes, they're obviously Redown, Jackson, Hayes and Rui and having two, two of your, you know, top seven guys not playing, you're going to feel it from an energy standpoint. But I do think we saw a little bit of the challenges that they're going to have when they're playing in a seven game series against higher level teams because they're going to have to play at that kind of frenetic pace to really be able to hang, I think defensively and you know, we'll see if LeBron can hold up. I mean it's remarkable. We're talking about a guy in his age 40 season, he missed four games. Like, you know, it's, it's impressive he'd made it this far without any kind of muscle injury. And certainly, hopefully this is on the shorter end of the timeline because it's been great to watch these guys play. But you know, there are, they're, I think one loss ahead of Denver, two ahead of Memphis and three ahead of Houston. And you know, those four teams are going to be jockeying for position over the next couple of weeks and we'll see where that lands. But like I said, I thought the Lakers defense was impressive and their energy level was impressive. And as you mentioned as the game went on, there's a lot of shots that have to be made by guys who are not necessarily reliable three point shooters. Those shots went in in the first half. They didn't, especially in the third quarter. And that ultimately was the difference in the game.
- [09:59]
Tim Bottevs
Yeah, Dave, in your reporting, you, of course, you had to mention the fact that LeBron had that groin injury like five, six years ago, that Christmas Day game. I think the late were the Lakers. I know you. We repeated that stat like a hundred times. Because they weren't they like famously in second place in the West?
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Dave McMahon
I think they were.
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Brian Windhorst
They're fourth. They were fourth.
- [10:20]
Tim Bottevs
Oh, they were fourth. Okay. LeBron was going across the lane on defense. He took a funny step and basically the Lakers season was never the same. They ended up missing the playoffs. He came back and then shut it back down. That was a great. It was the first time he'd ever really had a significant muscle injury in his career. It was sort of an indication that his late 30s or his mid-30s, I guess, had arrived when that happened. But you asked him about that or somebody asked him about that, and you had it in your reporting what he said, comparing the, the feel of the injuries.
- [10:50]
Brian Windhorst
Yeah, he said that it did not feel in the moment as severe as that one that caused him to miss 17 straight games and really compromised the rest of his season and the rest of the Lakers season that they didn't make the playoffs that year. After he said it though, he turned around and knocked on the wooden locker behind him to not jinx his self diagnosis. Listen, it wasn't like he was dour and completely upset and frustrated. I, I think he was presenting kind of a. A veneer of confidence that we've already proven that, that this group can do a lot. We are up for the competition. This is the next challenge that we have to tackle while I take care of my body. And his kind of parting message was, I'm waiting for the moment that we're all whole and we can compete together. And certainly he anticipates that moment coming before it's too late. And so there's still a lot of noise that this team can make. It's just a different pathway than it had been hoping it would be taking. And I guess you want to go glass half full. This is a brutal stretch of the season coming up, and it could have taxed LeBron in ways other than this groin injury popping up. And so while he will be rehabbing it the groin, perhaps it saves some energy in his legs that he can apply to a postseason run.
- [12:19]
Dave McMahon
The other thing, the other thing I should say that we learned about the game was that Al Horford still's got it as a player. You know, that's what you wrote Celtics earlier. Yeah, I mean, look, it was noteworthy. Knew Joe Missoula was going to try to win this game when Al Horford played 11 minutes in the first quarter. Al Horford had played over 35 minutes in two games this season before Saturday night's game. Played 37 minutes, just under the 37 and a half he played against the Cavs A couple weeks ago, another game the Celtics, you know, played their guys in in part because Chris Esperzingus wasn't available like he wasn't last night. But the, the numbers from Sats Williams that I wrote about on Al Horford's defense in this game were awfully impressive. He defended 23 isolation plays according to Second Spectrum, all against Luka Doncic, LeBron James and Austin Reeves, the three perimeter stars for the Lakers, and gave up the second lowest points per play on them. 0.39 in the player tracking era. And the 23 he guarded was the second most anyone's ever guarded in a game in the player tracking era, which goes back to the 2013-14 season, which is an awfully long time ago. And LeBron James and Luka Doncic were 3 for 14 in their 14 shots against Al Horford in this game. And we have seen Al Horford, all of us have covered Al Horford for a long time. And last night was his 18th season. Well, it's his 18th season. It was his 68th game against LeBron. It's the most, most times any two players currently have played against each other. Not surprisingly, given they're both two of the older players in the league and were both in the same conference for most of their careers. But it's just, it was remarkable to see Horford doing what he did in that game. And it's a reminder that for all the other talent the Celtics have, Al Horford's ability to switch and protect the rim on defense and to be a excellent floor spacing 3 point shooter on offense really remains one of the very most critical things that makes the Celtics who they are as a team. And despite the fact that the guy is 38 and going to be 39 in the summer, he is still a gigantic part of their team and was a gigantic part of them winning this game. And you know, it's a sign of what is still going to be a really big role for him in the spring, whether Christophs Porzingis is healthy or not.
- [14:45]
Tim Bottevs
Well, that's one of the things, it's one of the reasons why Porzingis's acquisition was so important. Because two years ago, Horford's last game sort of is the start. Not last game, but his. He was the start. He was their starting center. He wore down in the playoffs. It got to the point where he, he basically was only defending on offense. He was kind of resting. Maybe he could hit a shot, but like he, he like basically couldn't. You know, he just couldn't. He wasn't effective down the stretch and especially that Miami series where they lost. He just so being able to be more of a spot contributor and conserve his energy within games. This is one of the reasons why they identified Porzingis as the guy they wanted so bad. And you know, the trade that they made for Porzingis just, just before the guys was just before free agency in 2023. You know, the, the deal was going to be before the draft. The deal fell apart and they hurried and re. Put it back together and did it with Memphis instead of who was. It was going to be with Washington and ended up.
- [15:46]
Dave McMahon
It was the same trade. It was the same trade. They just couldn't trade Marcus. They traded Marcus Smart instead of Malcolm Brogdon in the deal because they had to get it done before the day before the draft because Kristaps had a player option and he opted either in or out and signed a new deal. I don't remember exactly how it went, but they, they.
- [16:01]
Tim Bottevs
That ended up being a very important trade in, in this current era of the NBA. We didn't totally understand at the time. I mean, we understood why they were doing it, but we didn't really know what the impact would be. But anyway, your point is correct on Horford. He was clearly a major part of that game plan. And that was the thing. Dave. Like, obviously, you know, the Lakers are small, but okay. So it's one thing to only have Jackson Hayes when they didn't, when they, when they, when they didn't have Hachimura. Like, not having Hachimura just takes a tool out of J.J. redick's belt. And I agree that they are. You know, I remember the, the heat teams that LeBron was on in the, in the early teens, they would play a very, very aggressive style of defense was one of the reasons Chris Bosh was so important to that team. They would play Bosh at center and he was so mobile. They would ask him to do a lot. They would ask him to really move his backside on defense and they would trap aggressively and you know, basically the way to, to handle that Heat defense was to pass your way through it. And the Heat's basically long term wager was that you couldn't pass your way through it as much as they could create a problem. That's why they would create all these turnovers. And the Lakers don't play the exact same way, but it's kind of the same concept which is their athleticism, which is what they have. They don't have great size to defend the rim, but they have athleticism. And their wagers at their athleticism and their transition opportunities are going to cause for it, are going to, are going to on balance beat you. And by the way, it was working for the Heat. It led them to two championships and they were in the finals in the third when they faced arguably the greatest passing team we've ever seen. And the spurs also were just super hot shooting. Danny Green was like untouchable for the first like three games of that series. And you know, but one of the.
- [17:57]
Dave McMahon
Things the spurs slightly different, there's a slightly different level of defensive talent on this Laker team compared to the prime.
- [18:05]
Tim Bottevs
LeBron but, but it wasn't the prime Heat. The Heat were, were worn out and the spurs were the perfect team to undercut them.
- [18:14]
Dave McMahon
Sure.
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Tim Bottevs
And so I think, I think the point here is, is if you can pass, you can move the ball, which the Celtics do. You can move the ball, you can, you. That's what you're gonna have to do against the Lakers. You're gonna have to move the ball to beat their athleticism. Now when they're, when they're thin Dave, they're gonna, you're gonna give up inside interior matchups and there were times where the late the Celtics were able to get to the rim and there was nobody there to provide to provide.
- [18:41]
Brian Windhorst
There were a couple times there's a closeout where they over commit and the Celtics player puts a ball on the floor. And now the health defender trying to cut off the lane to the rim is someone like Austin Reeves or even Jared Vanderbilt who's a very active defender but he doesn't have the size. And Trey Jameson the third, the Lakers had been 130 when he played before Saturday night against the Celtics. A lot of that was garbage time minutes but he was actually carving out a bit of a backup center role during that eight game winning streak. But all of a sudden he's thrust into a bigger role with no Jackson Hayes he's not as effective. And so they're gonna, they're really gonna need to have Jackson and Rui to give them some more size to contend with that stuff. So. So it's not just all switching dependent where you can. Because some of the success they've had or a lot of the success they've had since January 30th, when they've been the number one defensive rated team in the league since then has been defending shots at the rim. And Jackson Hayes is in the top three in terms of opponents field goal percentage on layups and dunks in that time under 40%. So that's a big piece that they're going to need to get back. But it does kind of underscore the rescinded trade.
- [20:02]
Tim Bottevs
If they had Mark Williams in this game.
- [20:05]
Brian Windhorst
Right.
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Tim Bottevs
If they had Mark Williams and I kind of feel like at the end of the Lakers season, wherever that is, it's going to end up being a relevant question. If they had Mark Williams would. Would have gone this way. We don't know.
- [20:16]
Dave McMahon
I mean, Mark Williams is. Mark Williams is much more of a skilled offensive center than a skilled defensive center. I know he's big, but, you know, I almost think the way.
- [20:28]
Tim Bottevs
But there were times where their tallest guy last night on the court was six, eight.
- [20:31]
Dave McMahon
I understand that. But I would, I would almost argue that the way Jackson Hayes has played is sort of a reminder that investing a lot, which they were going to be doing, investing a lot in a center with both injury questions and developmental questions. As a guy like can he actually be the kind of rim protecting force that you want if you're going to invest that kind of capital in them? It's a reminder that if you've got luka Doncic and LeBron James, two of the smartest and highest IQ players ever, and you've got a guy like Jackson Hayes who's been a journeyman player who can, what the one thing he's always been able to do is jump out of the gym. Like could probably manufacture a lot of production from the five spot.
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Brian Windhorst
But the point was they didn't have Jackson Hayes. That's the point. They didn't have Jackson Hayes.
- [21:17]
Dave McMahon
That's why you wanted. I don't mean last night. No, I don't mean last night. I'm saying, I'm saying in general, like, yes, last night they didn't have any center. But I, I'm saying from a broader, like Brian said, that the end of the season is going to be a relevant point of whether they had Mark Williams on the team. I, My point, I guess is, what I'm saying is if you Have Luka Doncic in particular, he can boost the level of a center in a way that almost no other player in the league can. And so the Lakers have limited trade resources. They go out this summer and use those trade resources to improve the rest of the roster, and they find a couple different centers that can do different things for cheap. I just think that would be a better allocation of resources than pouring them all into one guy who has had trouble staying on the court and is not a guaranteed effective defensive option.
- [22:09]
Tim Bottevs
That's all fair point. That's all a fair point. But when they did the Mark Williams rescind, when they rescinded it, we didn't really know how good they were going to be. And so ultimately, medium term, what they can use those assets for, what they do at the center position, they may end up being better off, but they also could have had Mark Williams. The trade was agreed to. And so, you know, that's. I'm not even debating whether they should have rescinded or not. I'm just saying when they get to their. Where they're going in this season, it's a. It's going to be a thing that. It's a fair thing to ask. It's not a hypothetical. They. They had him. He was. He was acquired, so. All right. So, Dave, things have changed since the last time you were in New York City A little bit. Wasn't. Wasn't that where you were when the Luca trade went down?
- [22:56]
Brian Windhorst
That's right.
- [22:57]
Dave McMahon
We were at the gate. We were both at the game.
- [22:59]
Tim Bottevs
Yeah.
- [23:00]
Dave McMahon
Best game of the season for the Lakers. That was such a. That was such a night. Remember talking to all the Lakers. That was their best win. They're all fired up to get AD Back in the next few days. They were feeling great. Everybody was in a great mood, then walked out of the building, and Dave called me and said, check your phone. I looked at my phone and everything changed.
- [23:24]
Tim Bottevs
Yeah, you guys both called me within like seven seconds of each other. I was getting ready. I'm not taking these calls. Why are you both calling?
- [23:33]
Dave McMahon
We all ended up. There wasn't a lot of sleep for. Not a lot of sleep for Window that night.
- [23:37]
Tim Bottevs
That's true. All right. Neither for you guys. All right, we'll see how the Lakers road trip continues. We'll see how. What the reports are on LeBron. They play in Brooklyn on Monday, and then it's off to Milwaukee and Denver.
- [23:51]
Dave McMahon
So hardest remaining schedule in the NBA for bpi. The Lakers.
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Tim Bottevs
Yeah.
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Dave McMahon
So they got.
- [23:57]
Brian Windhorst
They got a stretch of six games and eight days that starts with that, that Denver, Milwaukee back to back or Milwaukee, Denver, I should say. And there's two games against Denver and two games against the Bucks in that stretch. So you had to imagine they come back down to earth a little bit in the standings. I'm just questioning beyond the idea of, okay, you want to be healthy come April 15th or whatever the start of the playoffs is. And that's the most important thing, I truly believe that is have they really gotten a sense of continuity with this group yet? You know, I know they had the eight game winning streak, but even in that eight game winning streak, Austin Reeves was missing for a couple of games. So there hasn't been a ton of time for LeBron Luca and Austin Reeves in particular, who are going to be all the decision makers. Ball is going to be in their hands to coalesce as best as they could. That could be the ultimate thing that, that hits them the most from this time. That LeBron misses, assuming he comes back healthy and ready to contribute, is just, you know, they're a team that doesn't have the experience with one another and they're going to miss a couple weeks of that experience on the positive end, on the optimistic end.
- [25:11]
Tim Bottevs
Meanwhile, if you're Boston, you're still sleeping well. I think you're still feeling good about yourself.
- [25:17]
Dave McMahon
They feel, they feel great. I mean, it'll, you know, again, they're three and one against four of the five best teams in the league. The fifth one is coming on Wednesday and they've had their whole team available for one of the games and they've let all of them by at least 20. I think it's, I think it underscores what they're capable of doing. And the one thing I will say you mentioned the second half of that game, Joe Missoula played Jason Tatum 45 minutes, Jaylen Brown 41 minutes, Al Horford 37 minutes. You saw in the Cavs game, he played those guys heavy minutes. Cows played the normal rotation. Celtics got tired down the stretch of that game. Now they were missing Drew Holiday, they were missing Chris Esperzingis, but they got tired. Cavs came back and got him. That was certainly the direction that game was going again Saturday night before LeBron got hurt. And then the Celtics hit some shots late and won. But you know, the minutes are going to be different across the board in the playoffs. But it's just interesting to see that happening. And you know, Joe Missoula playing Jason Tatum 45 minutes and Saturday, well, Tatum.
- [26:17]
Tim Bottevs
And Brown's minutes for the season are up right from last year.
- [26:20]
Dave McMahon
Yes, they are.
- [26:21]
Tim Bottevs
So. Yes, they are. Dave loves talking about minutes. It's one of his favorite topics. Okay, I will say this. Celtics are the Celtics. We'll never know what would happen if LeBron came in for his last shift. So Celtics are my favorites. They should remain the favorites. But don't turn off the TV when they get up 20. Oh, the Lakers when they get up 20 because they will.
- [26:45]
Dave McMahon
I thought you were going it. I thought you were going to the. To the stock ESPN position of the fat. The path to the finals is there for the Lakers, baby. Sign it up.
- [26:53]
Brian Windhorst
Well, all right, Charles Barkley, can you just chill out?
- [27:00]
Dave McMahon
I just, I just thought he was going to. But the Lakers were right there and that's all.
- [27:05]
Tim Bottevs
The Lakers are an underdog.
- [27:07]
Dave McMahon
Lakers have been. Lakers have been awfully impressive, in case you didn't know.
- [27:10]
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- [27:43]
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- [28:47]
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- [29:16]
Tim Bottevs
Awfully impressive because of the team we're going to talk about right now. The Thunder win by 24 today at home against the Nuggets. The game was closer than the actual final. The Thunder had a huge fourth quarter pulled away. I I almost feel like this game was more about the Nuggets than about the Thunder. Not to focus on the team. The big thing coming out of this game for Denver. Well, first off, I let's just pause for one second before we talk about this game and discuss what happened on Friday night. Now, now granted this was an overtime game, so there were a few extra minutes in this let's not minimize.
- [30:03]
Dave McMahon
Let's not minimize the 30, 20, 20.
- [30:05]
Tim Bottevs
I understand but in case you missed it, I don't know how you could Phoenix was I think was in Denver and on Friday night Nikola Jokic did something had never happened before. He played 45 minutes in that game so it wasn't like he played 53, 31 points, 21 rebounds, 22 assists. Absolutely jaw dropping. 30, 20, 20 performance after the game was kind of nonchalant about it and.
- [30:42]
Dave McMahon
What is he not.
- [30:44]
Tim Bottevs
I know, I know I clearly. But you know things. It's just things haven't worked out for Phoenix at all this year and they lose a game where the other guy goes 30, 20, 20 after.
- [30:58]
Dave McMahon
I mean well and after they make this crazy comeback in the final moments of the game and drew up this unbelievable the bud drop, this incredible out of bounds play where basically they threw it into Devin Booker and there was only a one or two seconds left. So you think, oh, Devin Booker is definitely going to shoot the ball. So Denver just collapsed to him and they designed it to where they were going to collapse to him and he just did a touch pass to Kevin Durant in the corner who had a wide open corner three. It was. I hadn't really seen a play like that before. Is an incredible design. Ties the game thinking, man, is this going to be a huge win for Phoenix. And then Jokic comes out in overtime and Just says, yeah, it's time for me to dominate.
- [31:37]
Tim Bottevs
They had a unique play design for Durant on a last second play about 10 days ago. I don't remember who they were playing, but I remember I was. It was the night of the, the Mavericks Lakers game, because I was watching the end of it at Crypto, and they, they needed a three to force overtime. And they had Durant stand at the foul line and catch the ball because they weren't guarding him inside the foul line. They designed the play to have him catch the ball at the foul line so he could get a clean catch. And then he by design, dribbled outside the three point line and got off a three. It was kind of weird, but that was the way they designed it. So somebody's doing some inventive stuff in the huddle for Phoenix, but it's not resulting in wins, unfortunately. But yeah, Booker had 34 in that game and Durant had 29, and they still lost. And that's another. Another bad night for Phoenix. But anyway, so Denver goes to Oklahoma City today. The big thing in this game, other than Shay has another. I mean, it was being billed as like the showdown of the two MVP performers because they play twice. It's a baseball series. They play today, Sunday afternoon, and then tomorrow they play again. And so it was sort of being billed as this mvp, you know, who's gonna, who's gonna take the edge? I never looked at it that way. But why?
- [33:00]
Brian Windhorst
Why?
- [33:01]
Tim Bottevs
Because I don't judge MVP voting on one or two games head to head.
- [33:05]
Texas Tourism
Well, sure.
- [33:08]
Dave McMahon
You know, Dave, you know, his position on this is going to be. Come on.
- [33:13]
Tim Bottevs
Anyway, it's actually interesting.
- [33:16]
Brian Windhorst
Come on, man.
- [33:18]
Tim Bottevs
No, I think it's interesting because the potential Western Conference finals matchup, that's why it's interesting.
- [33:22]
Brian Windhorst
It could be both. It can be interesting for both reasons.
- [33:25]
Tim Bottevs
It's not. So let me just ask you this. So Shea had 41 points today. If Jokic had 42, would I be like saying, oh, in a way, which is the favorite now in a win.
- [33:37]
Brian Windhorst
Where his team won, outscored the other team by 20 points in the fourth quarter? Yeah, I think that would be something that you should note when it comes time to filling out your ballot. When it comes time for Tim knocking on your door, asking for what your bout's going to look like for his next drop off?
- [33:51]
Dave McMahon
Yeah, well, listen, I would have noticed, but for as great as the game was on Friday, I mean, the, the thing that, like you said earlier, this game was more about the Nuggets Than the Thunder. It was more about the Nuggets than the Thunder because Aaron Gordon hurt his calf again.
- [34:05]
Tim Bottevs
That's right.
- [34:05]
Dave McMahon
And Nicola Jokic had 14 points on 6 for 11 shooting in the first quarter. Landed on his right elbow. Funny. And then was.
- [34:12]
Tim Bottevs
That's right.
- [34:13]
Dave McMahon
Not very good. I mean, he had put up huge numbers because he always does. He was pedestrian and hit a shot. Yeah, he didn't hit a shot for. Until, I think, midway through the third quarter. And did not look like nearly the same player. And for the same reasons we were just talking about with the Lakers. Right. Denver has a hard schedule down the stretch. They've got the fifth or sixth hardest schedule. Memphis just loses. Jaren Jackson Jr. They've got one of the 10 hardest schedules remaining in the league. They're a game back. Also, you've got all these teams jockeying around with potentially significant injury questions. And by the way, the Rockets have a pretty soft schedule and are only one game back from there. So.
- [34:52]
Tim Bottevs
Did you see the Rockets play a.
- [34:54]
Dave McMahon
Huge part of this? What's that?
- [34:56]
Tim Bottevs
You know, what happened Saturday night with the Rockets? Did you see that?
- [35:00]
Dave McMahon
I mean, I was a little busy, but I know what you're talking about.
- [35:03]
Tim Bottevs
Okay. Yeah. Yeah. You were covering the Lakers. I get it. The Rockets were comfortably ahead by 20 points. And Ime Udoka put Amen Thompson in the game to try to get. Did he need. He needed a rebound. Right. He did one rebound for his first ever triple double. And he put him in the game. On, you know, there was a free throw going on and the Rockets were defending the free throw, whatever. And literally on the. The following possession, he sprained his ankle, made a drive. Nino. Just a freak, classic freak play.
- [35:39]
Dave McMahon
Yeah.
- [35:40]
Tim Bottevs
He went up to take, you know, John of camera if we jumped to pass or jump to shoot, but he landed on another player's foot and rolled his left ankle. I don't think it's like a severe ankle injury. However, he's. You know, the Rockets have been in a bit of a free fall because of injuries to Fred Van Vliet and Alperin Shingoon. And now, you know, I mean, I. It was quite blatantly plus 39 and.
- [36:00]
Dave McMahon
33 minutes against the Pelicans on Saturday. Kind of an important player for them. That.
- [36:05]
Tim Bottevs
Yeah. Quite. Quite blatant. I mean, the broadcast acknowledged when he came in the game. The Rockets broadcast acknowledged that's why he was coming in. It's not a. It's not like a controversial statement to say that's why.
- [36:17]
Dave McMahon
No, no. For sure.
- [36:18]
Brian Windhorst
No for sure.
- [36:20]
Dave McMahon
Ricky.
- [36:20]
Brian Windhorst
Ricky Davis hunting that triple double.
- [36:22]
Tim Bottevs
I did.
- [36:23]
Brian Windhorst
Was that when he was on. You did.
- [36:25]
Tim Bottevs
Yeah, yeah. But I. I covered some of the games that the beat writer didn't want to cover. I covered also the Olympics were that year, and our beat writer and the beat writer for the Akron B Control at the time went to cover the Olympics because the Cavs were such a bleep show, he would much rather spend a month in Salt Lake City. And so, yes, I covered that game. And the best part about the game was, Jerry, to be honest with you, when I saw it happen, I didn't compute what Ricky Davis was doing. It didn't. Let me tell you who it computed for Mr. Jerry Sloan, because he was enraged. And after the game, this was a different era, 2002. Like, we didn't have social media or anything. I didn't know that he had. He went crazy to the Jazz beat writers. You know, I went to talk to Ricky Davis about it. Meanwhile, he. He'll. At the time, like, the coaches could do press conferences at the same time. Anyway, long story short, Jerry Sloan writers from that night who covered that game won awards for their stories because of how. I'm not even exaggerating because of how amazing Jerry Sloan was. And I wish I had the quotes up now, but he obliterated Ricky Davis in a way that you just don't see ever. And I didn't get it. I had. I think, you know, I was young and stupid. I didn't. I didn't. I'd only covered maybe 12 NBA games in my career at that point. I didn't understand what he was doing. But The Cavs had 17 wins that year. They. They had, like, nothing good happen to them, and they actually were winning that game. And. And I think, like Duan Wagner, who was their rookie, had a big game that night, too, was like this big night for the Cavs. This could be their future. And. And, yeah, so, yes, I was there for that. And that would have been a. More appreciated, I think, than the guy spraining his ankle. But the point that you're making Bon Temps is, is that these contenders have injuries to some of their key players. That's happening, you know, and, you know, and so Aaron Gordon already missed a whole bunch of time this year with the calf injury. He leaves this game in the first quarter with a calf injury, and you could just see that Denver was just playing from a deficit the rest of the game. They just. They just couldn't match up, even though Chad Holmgren was in foul trouble. You know, they basically had to play Michael Porter Jr. Well, they played Zeke Naji a lot as sort of filling in. And Zignaji had three points and one rebound in 23 minutes. And so they played Michael Porter Jr. Like they sort of needed more out of him. And he did, you know, try to rebound more. You could definitely tell that he was, you know, trying to play more of a rebounding role. And he had 15 rebounds, and that's great. But clearly Oklahoma City attacked him. And all you need to see is the plus minus because Aaron Gordon plays seven minutes. He's plus four now. Okay, look, you know, seven minutes, you know, Jokic plays 41 minutes. He's minus 13. Okay, all right. Porter is minus 33. And it's not necessarily just about him, but it has to do with the fact that when you don't have Aaron Gordon and you have to, you have to take Jokic off the court for a few minutes any game. That's always been the issue. You take Yokich off the court when you also don't have Aaron Gordon, their team just collapses, especially in a night where they're not having it. Like Jamal Murray had an off shooting night. And, you know, look, I am not looking to enter the world where I'm quarreling about the value of Russell Westbrook, because he undoubtedly brings certain things to that team, especially speed, and he has a good chemistry with Jokic. But when Westbrook is out there, it makes it easier for the defense. It just does. I don't, you know, it just is. And then this game, he's one of nine. And when he's out there, the other team. Dave, you saw this last week when the Lakers won in Denver.
- [40:32]
Brian Windhorst
And he took the bat.
- [40:35]
Tim Bottevs
Well, he always takes. Well, I shouldn't say always, but he frequently takes.
- [40:39]
Brian Windhorst
Yeah. And that allowed the Lakers to pack the paint the way they wanted to. And, you know, he did make a couple in a row. That game was remarkable that the Lakers disciplined to stick with JJ's game plan after he made a couple. I think Gordon even made a couple as well. But Russell Westbrook, yeah, I agree. He's brought an edge to that team and a preparedness every night. And certainly the athleticism is still there at this stage of his career. But there are some major gaps in his game that can be exploited.
- [41:10]
Tim Bottevs
Yeah, Tim, you and I, in our, in our, our story that we run every Friday where we talk to people across the league, we had some stuff about Westbrook's minutes this week, too.
- [41:20]
Dave McMahon
Yeah, we. I mean, you know, we Talked after watching the. The Nuggets play last Sunday in Boston. I, you know, we talked a bunch of people about Christian Brown and Russell Westbrook getting left open and the. The Nuggets trying to deal with that. And, you know, there was some mixed opinion about whether that would be an issue. You know, and certainly having a. A cheat code like Nicola Jokic can fix a lot of things, right? But the one thing that has been always consistent about Denver is that Aaron Gordon is the one guy outside of Jokic. But you got Jamal Murray, Aaron Gordon, and Jokic, and they don't really have a replacement for any one of those three guys. And if they're missing any one of them or like when Jamal Murray wasn't playing to the level earlier this season, they have huge problems. And, you know, Zeke Naji has been better lately. He's had. He's gotten some extended run with when Gordon was hurt the last time, and he's had some good productive minutes for them. But if they're relying on Zeke Najee to play instead of Aaron Gordon against the Thunder, they're going to be in trouble. And like that. You know, that's obviously an automatic thing to say, but this is the second or third time Aaron Gordon has hurt his calf. And, you know, he's talked a lot about Luca's calf injury injuries this season and over the last couple years. It's a very tricky injury. Jamal has dealt with that in the past, too, and it's going to be something to monitor no matter how long he's out going forward, because he's obviously such an enormous piece of their team. And this is the kind of thing that even if you come back from it, it can pretty easily flare up again. And if that happens in a month, then. Or two months, then Denver's hopes of a deep playoff run are going to be in a whole lot of trouble.
- [43:01]
Tim Bottevs
The Lakers had this incredible midseason trade. There are two top 75 players playing with each other now in the major market where people all over the world care. That is why we talked about two.
- [43:13]
Dave McMahon
Top 75 players playing together. And now there's only one.
- [43:17]
Tim Bottevs
I understand. Just let me talk about the big picture here.
- [43:20]
Dave McMahon
I'm just. I'm just messing around.
- [43:22]
Tim Bottevs
I'm not.
- [43:22]
Dave McMahon
I'm not. I don't want to give short shrift to Dave sky ad.
- [43:26]
Brian Windhorst
That's right.
- [43:27]
Tim Bottevs
Okay, but it's true. They were 270, you know, but the. The ceiling. The ceiling was right.
- [43:33]
Dave McMahon
Yes.
- [43:33]
Tim Bottevs
Okay, that's a fair point. That's. That's A fair point. Fair point.
- [43:38]
Dave McMahon
Of course.
- [43:38]
Tim Bottevs
Okay. Just because we talk about the Lakers a lot and because there's a lot of interest in the Lakers, at least for me, does not mean that anything has been taken away from the Thunder. And I've been saying for weeks, and I'm not saying you haven't been bon temps. I've been saying for weeks. The Thunder. The Thunder. The Thunder, Yes. It's very interesting with the Warriors. It's very interesting with the Lakers.
- [44:03]
Dave McMahon
A lot of. I've heard a lot of from Brian that the Thunder are not necessarily feared by everybody for that.
- [44:11]
Tim Bottevs
And I'm just saying why. I mean, chet Holmgren played 26 minutes in this game. Now, granted, Aaron Gordon went out. He was in foul trouble the whole game there. And if you're a. If you're a Denver fan, you've been screaming, what about the Westbrook foul? Yes, there was a foul in this. In the fourth quarter of this game. Was it the third? It was the early fourth quarter.
- [44:32]
Dave McMahon
No, it was about 10 minutes ago. Into fourth and he hit him in the head and should have fouled out and didn't get called. And then Malone got attack and was not out.
- [44:40]
Tim Bottevs
All you need to know is that Steve Javi came in and admitted it was a missed call. I respect Steve Javi, but we don't hear from him very often that it was a missed call. Steve Javi came in and said, yes, that was a foul. Yes. Holmgren should have fouled out with 10 minutes left. Yes. Got it. Check. He played 26 minutes in this game. He was plus 32. Shay missed nine threes in this game. He. He has weeks where he doesn't miss nine threes. They win by 24. This team is a beast.
- [45:15]
Dave McMahon
They're really good. Yeah, they're really good. It was interesting, though, because we did talk about the Lakers, and I do think, you know, the. The interesting ripple effect of this LeBron, LeBron injury is. I think it makes. Like we've just discussed with the schedule, right. There's a very real possibility the Lakers are not. Could be falling all the way to fifth. That wouldn't be shocking at all if the Ron misses a while. But it certainly is very plausible that they're not going to finish second or third anymore. And, you know, it was interesting watching the Lakers play the Celtics. They did not let the Celtics just bomb away from three, which they've basically been doing throughout the past six weeks. They've given up, you know, as Dave knows better than anybody, they've given up more Threes just about than any team in the league as they've been on this hot streak defensively. But you watch this Thunder game today and yes, they ended up winning by 20, but Denver went to some zone in the second half and especially at the end of the third quarter and they got themselves back in the game because the Thunder got some clean looks from three and just couldn't knock any of them down. And that does remain the thing that we have to watch with the stunner team when they get in the playoffs is are they going to have, you know, are these supporting players Lou Dort and Aaron Wiggins and no Chad Holmgren, you know, all these guys around Shea, are they going to hit enough threes to prevent teams from just saying, hey, we're going to pack the paint, we're going to let Shay, you know, try to limit Shay from doing everything he can and we're going to dare some of these guys to hit shots. That was a formula that saw Dallas beat them last year. Certainly a formula. If they play the Lakers, say in the second round, the Lakers are certainly going to say, I'm sure, hey, like we're gonna dare Alex Caruso and you know, Lou Dort, some of these guys to hit shots and beat us. And it's going to be interesting to see if the Thunder could do so in a big spot.
- [47:04]
Brian Windhorst
They got two, they have two over a three day span in Oklahoma City similar to this kind of OKC deal. Yeah, it's like the, it's right. I think it's right before they go to Dallas for the return game for Luca. So it's something like, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, it's April 6th and 8th and then they play the 9th in Dallas. So yeah, big, big moment right there. And they played them pretty early on in the year and Max Christie made mistake late in the game, misheard what JJ was asking for, fouled when they didn't want to foul and you know, they ended up losing a tight game and I know that, you know, it's a much different Lakers team now, but that Lakers team prior to the trades that they made, that took some wind out of their sails because it was a game that they were kind of getting amped up for as the measuring stick game. And the Thunder out executed them out tough them, they, they went and took the fight to them in la. And yeah, again, I don't know how much we'll be able to glean from these games in April until we see what version of the Lakers are on.
- [48:21]
Dave McMahon
The court and what version of the Thunder are, too. Just talking last week of the regular season, who knows how many guys the Thunder are going to be playing, right? Like they're going to have everything more than wrapped up by then. They're already 10 games up, so. So, you know, that's going to be interesting to see too. By the way, while you were talking earlier, Brian, I found these Jerry Sloan quotes from the Ricky Davis game.
- [48:40]
Tim Bottevs
Okay, great.
- [48:41]
Dave McMahon
Thank you.
- [48:41]
Tim Bottevs
Yeah. I want to hear, is my memory flawed or is this good?
- [48:45]
Dave McMahon
No. Oh, no. Oh, no. Your memory is often flawed. It wasn't flawed on this one. Here's the quote. Quote. So you're talking about DeShawn Stevenson, who fouled Ricky Davis. Quote, DeSean Falcon. I would have fouled him too. I would have knocked him on his bleep. If you try to embarrass a team after a 20 point lead, you're bleeping. Right. I'd knock him down. I was glad desean tried to knock him down. They can put me in jail or whatever they want for saying that. That's the way it is. The best part.
- [49:21]
Tim Bottevs
This is the best part.
- [49:22]
Dave McMahon
The best part isn't even. You might. You also probably remember this. Like, those Jerry Sloan quotes are great. The best part is the quote that Ricky Davis gave as an apology to the Associated Press later, which was quote, they should be mad. Any team that gets beat that bad shouldn't be happy. But I wouldn't do it again. I just wouldn't.
- [49:41]
Tim Bottevs
It's like, all right, yeah, I remember that. They. They brought him out to apologize. I'm telling you.
- [49:52]
Dave McMahon
Wow. Who got down to this? Later? Mark Davis was doing the game.
- [49:56]
Tim Bottevs
How was he.
- [49:58]
Brian Windhorst
So was that. John Lucas was the Cavs coach then.
- [50:00]
Tim Bottevs
He'd been fired already.
- [50:02]
Dave McMahon
Smart.
- [50:03]
Tim Bottevs
Okay, he's smart. I'm pretty sure it's possible that those quotes from Jerry Sloan did not have. This is. You want to know why? Bon Temps? I wasn't made the Cavs beat writer immediately and I was interim for like a year when LeBron got there. I'm pretty sure I didn't have those quotes in my LeBron story or in my cab story that night. And I'm pretty sure either the news desk called me or maybe they took the Sloan quotes from the Associated Press and stuck them in there. I seem to remember that the. The, you know, arguably quotes of the year, you know, post game from the coach. And. And I did not have them.
- [50:40]
Dave McMahon
Well, this is from the Desiree News, and this is actually a funny paragraph too, for where. Where things came. Came later, the Cavs even have been accused of tanking games in an effort to land high school Sensation Projected number one all overall draft choice LeBron James. And the Cleveland plane dealer newspaper actually runs a weekly graphic dubbed quote, the race for LeBron that updates the progress, or lack thereof of the league's five worst teams. Sunday, though, the Jazz look like they were chasing LeBron. They just dominate us, dominated us all the way around. Sloan said. That's great.
- [51:08]
Tim Bottevs
Yeah, well, delightful, by the way, as long as you're going down memory lane during that season, like during the year, or maybe it was in the off season, but right before that season. Oh, it was right before the season. It was like in the preseason workouts, like in September. The Cavs invited LeBron. I always want you, you know, NBA coach, NBA personnel is not allowed to talk to or about potential players in the draft. In fact, that rule's still in existence over. When I was over in Paris in January, I was talking to a high ranking spurs official and AJ Debanza, who is the, you know, potential 2026 number one overall pick. He and his father, I had arranged, we were going to do an interview on espn. They came over to me and I went to introduce, just to be nice, because I'm standing there courtside, I went to introduce AJ to this high ranking spurs official and the spurs official had turned and run away. I can testify to the NBA like they, they like, they're like there was. So I was just trying to be polite. I didn't want to break any rules. So just, just to be clear, like, those are the hard and fast rules and they've been around forever. The Cavs invited LeBron into workouts with their team like in 2002, like, or like in the fall of 2002, like come on in and like work out with our team. And the media was there and wrote about it.
- [52:44]
Brian Windhorst
Oh, I didn't realize the media was there. Oh, that's. I didn't know that with Kobe Bryant. So John Lucas invited LeBron to practice with the Cavs. He also invited Kobe as a high schooler to practice with the Sixers.
- [52:58]
Tim Bottevs
Maybe. Let me walk that back. It's possible. The plane dealer reported Branson Wright was ready at the time. I'd maybe need to check with him. Anyway, it appeared in the paper like, as a. Like, not even like, like sources said, like it was sort of a happenstance. By the way, LeBron's been working out with the Cavs and John Lucas was suspended for two games that year. LeBron would sometimes come to games and would just come into the Cavs locker room. I. LeBron's senior year of high school, he definitely was in the Cavs locker room after a game in his Saint V Letterman's jacket, sitting at a locker, like, waiting to talk to his friends on the Cavs. Like that was happening. So that's the time that we're talking about here. All right, well, before we go, by the way, I want to talk about.
- [53:50]
Dave McMahon
To bring it back. Yeah, just really quick to bring it back to the present. While we were talking about the Thunder, I got a text from our pal George Sedano, who, unprompted, didn't text him at all today. He just texted me and goes, I had OKC on the radio today. Anyone doubting them, meaning the Thunder is doing so at their own peril. I said, can I quote you on that? Because we're literally talking about the Thunder right now. He's like, yeah, go for it. So, yeah, our guy George is impressed. On the scene today.
- [54:14]
Tim Bottevs
I am not a doubter. I'm a believer in the Thunder. All right, Dave, the game. It was a game you were at on Thursday night where there was some significant news that happened. The Knicks started their west coast trip against the Lakers in la. It was a much anticipated game. Lots of excitement in and around the Laker bench in that game. And what I mean by that is you talking to Larry David pregame, which was. Which made the pot on Thursday night. Dave, I hope we covered that in.
- [54:45]
Dave McMahon
Depth on the who collective on Friday.
- [54:47]
Brian Windhorst
I had a listener of the pod come up to me at the baggage claim at Logan around midnight. I got in pretty late on Friday, and the first thing he wanted to talk to me about was the interaction. I assumed, oh, he must have saw it on my Instagram. Okay. No, I heard the guys talking about it on the pod.
- [55:04]
Tim Bottevs
So, yeah, I just have to say. I just want to. I want to Frame this Dave McMenamin in his vows at his wedding last summer, which were beautifully written. Dave, I'd like to say that.
- [55:20]
Brian Windhorst
Thank you.
- [55:20]
Dave McMahon
They were great.
- [55:22]
Tim Bottevs
I'm not even. I'm not joking. I'm being. I'm being real. I'm just being real.
- [55:25]
Dave McMahon
As am I. Whole thing was great.
- [55:27]
Tim Bottevs
Quoted Larry David. Quoted Larry David. This is the kind of status. This is accurate that, you know, that, you know, his. His father was standing right there. But I think Dave, like, you know, sort of sees Larry is like, you know, this, this.
- [55:42]
Brian Windhorst
Oh, he's like my muse. For sure. Yeah. 100. My role model. Yeah. So I got a chance to meet him in 2009. He comes to NBA games pretty regularly. I'm sure I've covered a dozen games over the years that he's been at, and he's been at many more that I wasn't covering. 2009, he was sitting in that same seat courtside, right next to the Lakers bench. And he gets there very early. And he was Talking to Alex McKechnie, who was the Lakers head of kind of training and performance at the time. Now he works for the Raptors. And Larry was standing up courtside going over a golf tip with McKechnie and my.
- [56:25]
Tim Bottevs
Which could be a Curb Enthusiasm episode. Oh, and absolutely there was a Curb youb Enthusiasm episode where Larry was sitting in those exact seats. Seats. And he tripped Shaquille O'Neal, like, 20 years ago.
- [56:37]
Brian Windhorst
Shaq has to go to the the hospital and miss his time, and Larry makes it up to him by giving him every single episode of Seinfeld on a VHS tape. That's how long kirb's been on there. But so I, I, I was that my fandom burned just as bright back then as it does now. And I'm like, I want to go talk to McKechnie in front of Larry. So now I have one degree of separation, and that will allow me to voice myself upon Larry.
- [57:09]
Tim Bottevs
This is Dave. So I just, I could, I could do this for another hour. I'm just gonna sit back.
- [57:13]
Brian Windhorst
So that day, though, Larry is now just going through his golf routine. Still an hour to tip off. Isn't even watching the guys work out. It was before a playoff game. And, you know, Kobe's on the Lakers at that point. No, he's engrossed in his New York Times crossword puzzle, legs crossed. And I had to, like, peer over the newspaper to get his attention. And I go into the whole, I'm the biggest fan. I love Seinfeld. I love.
- [57:41]
Tim Bottevs
Yeah, I'm sure he never hears that.
- [57:43]
Brian Windhorst
Yeah. And he just looks up at me and just goes, okay, okay.
- [57:49]
Tim Bottevs
So, okay, okay.
- [57:52]
Brian Windhorst
Longtime NBA writer Ken Burger used to refer to that as the not. Okay, okay. Is what he gave me. So that.
- [58:01]
Dave McMahon
That was the moment I had to.
- [58:02]
Tim Bottevs
Live with for years and years.
- [58:04]
Brian Windhorst
Yeah. Okay. So this time around, he's there very early. Once again, one of my buddies, Jim Porton, who's a longtime NBA photographer and content maker. Yeah. Jim Ice. Yep.
- [58:23]
Tim Bottevs
If you saw him, you'd recognize him. He's in right 100.
- [58:27]
Dave McMahon
Jim Ice is a legend.
- [58:29]
Brian Windhorst
And Dan Wake of the LA Times, both of them. I, I had already gone to the back to transcribe pre game quotes from J.J. redick, and they're out in the court and they see Larry, they're all by him lonesome, and they're both blown up. My phone come out to the court, come out to the court and they're like, you got to do it, man. You, this is your moment. So I, I mustered up the, I guess the temerity to approach him again. This time did not come with the fan angle, did not reference that, that lost opportunity. 16 years ago. I pitched him on a story. I'm not gonna tell you what the story is on this podcast because I, hopefully the story comes to fruition. But then I told him that when the Lakers were in Miami earlier in the season, I went to his show. He's with Curb being off air. He's doing kind of like a give back An Evening with Larry David where he does a bit of a standup routine and then he brings on cast members from the show onto the stage and they do a Q and A. And I told him how weird some of the, the people in the audience were asking questions. And he started laughing that like full body chuckle that he has and say, oh, just crazy.
- [59:44]
Dave McMahon
Oh, oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. By the way.
- [59:50]
Tim Bottevs
Okay, okay. This time you made Larry David laugh.
- [59:54]
Dave McMahon
I didn't know what was going on the other day. I didn't know what you were doing. All, all I was told was live on the pod. I was told you were talking to Larry David. And I was like, dave, having a full conversation with Larry David is a top X moment in life. And the X is a single digit number.
- [60:10]
Brian Windhorst
Oh, yeah, it's be. Yeah, it's going to be. Maybe we have kids someday.
- [60:15]
Dave McMahon
Don't get in trouble, Dave. Don't get in trouble.
- [60:17]
Brian Windhorst
Right on the level of the wedding.
- [60:20]
Dave McMahon
See, now you're gonna get in trouble.
- [60:22]
Texas Tourism
I said, right on the level.
- [60:23]
Brian Windhorst
I didn't.
- [60:24]
Dave McMahon
Yes, sure.
- [60:26]
Brian Windhorst
So, like, there was some engagement in the pitch that I, I, the story I wanted to do involving him, and it involves someone else in the NBA as well. And so we were leaving and I said, okay, so I have a tacit agreement from you, and I'm going to take it to this other guy. Wait, there's no tacit agreement. Don't.
- [60:48]
Tim Bottevs
There's no tacit agreement.
- [60:49]
Brian Windhorst
Push me over. Don't be trying to push this over the goal line. I'm like, all right, can I say, is it percolating? Are we percolating here? Okay, we're percolating. And then he shook hands.
- [61:01]
Tim Bottevs
Yeah, you should never win an Emmy for playing that character because he's just himself. He's not playing any character now. The writing. Different story. All right, look, it's Ari Emanuel.
- [61:10]
Dave McMahon
Seats.
- [61:11]
Tim Bottevs
He's got four seats right there. And that night, Larry David, Ari Emanuel and Stephen A. Smith sat in those seats and nothing happened. The most important, most relevant thing that.
- [61:19]
Dave McMahon
Happened was Dave's conversation with Larry David.
- [61:23]
Tim Bottevs
Before that.
- [61:25]
Texas Tourism
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Dave McMahon
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Tim Bottevs
Do double G Snoop.
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Brian Windhorst
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Brian Windhorst
That's quite a deal, Snoop.
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Texas Tourism
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Brian Windhorst
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Texas Tourism
When we up out of here, see.
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Tim Bottevs
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- [62:54]
Tim Bottevs
Unfortunately for the Knicks on the court that night something did interesting newsworthy happened and that was Jalen Brunson turning his right ankle. The Knicks I don't think announced it As a grade 2 sprain bond attempts but their, their, their press release implied that it was a grade two sprain. Yeah, it's a, you know, multi week injury.
- [63:17]
Dave McMahon
Yeah, wasn't, wasn't great. And obviously now we've talked about it a lot. I mean Jalen Brunson is everything for the Knicks and His, his play in the clutch this year has been exemplary. He's carried an enormous load for them. We've talked a ton about, you know, why he, you know, I would probably have him fifth on my MVP ballot as of today because of the, the, just the immense work he's done in clutch time all season for them. And if the Knicks don't have him for, I mean, they already don't have him for, I think, jobs report at least a couple weeks. I mean, that looked like it could be easily the rest of the month. I mean, if he's out for that kind of stretch, you know, you could be talking about the Knicks sliding back to fourth to fifth to sixth in the east pretty quick. And again, like we were talking about the beginning of the pot with the Lakers and these other teams in the west, you know, if the Knicks somehow wind up in the four or five in the first round and they avoid being on the same side of the bracket as Boston. I'm not saying they're going to beat the Cavs, but we have talked plenty about the matchup with the Celtics and that we know it's going to go a certain direction. So if they can get Jalen Brunson back at some point and they can have him ready to go for the playoffs and they end up in the four or five, maybe it's a blessing in disguise. But the Knicks could be in an awful lot of trouble without him. They're already starting to show some signs of wear and tear. It dropped a couple games in a row before he got hurt. Now, without him, it's going to be very difficult to generate enough offense and, you know, we'll see what they look like over the next few weeks.
- [64:53]
Tim Bottevs
Well, this is what happens when you have. Yeah, go ahead.
- [64:56]
Brian Windhorst
I was just saying Cat was. He brought nothing to the table that night. I recognize he had just spent some time away from the team, dealing with, you know, a family friend passing away, and so he could have maybe not been in the best mental space to perform. I don't want to speculate, but they're going to need Cat to be much, much better than he was the other night for them to withstand this time.
- [65:21]
Tim Bottevs
Yeah, Jalen Brunson's been the number one performer in the clutch this season. He would be a strong. I haven't seen the numbers. He would be a strong favorite to win the. I think, unless you think.
- [65:31]
Dave McMahon
I can't imagine somebody else is winning the award as of today.
- [65:35]
Tim Bottevs
Yeah. So that's. It's a bit of a double edged Sword though. Because one of the reasons why he is there is because whenever the Knicks are in a close game, the ball's in his hand and he does everything. And so when you lose that player, you're in real trouble. In fact, that's one of the things, you know, the Cavs I made. I got it in bot temps. I got it in.
- [65:54]
Dave McMahon
Got it in. Listen, I wanted to do the pod for the listeners. For the listeners and viewers. I want to do the pod tonight. Brian's like, I can't, I can't do it, can't do it. I got things to do. We know he's gonna be flying to.
- [66:10]
Tim Bottevs
LA in a couple hours. That's why. Yeah, you act like I'm hosting a.
- [66:14]
Dave McMahon
So you say you're gonna have some popcorn or soda. You're gonna be locked in for Cavs Bucks pivotal game. It's gonna be gonna be.
- [66:23]
Tim Bottevs
I will be in the air. I'm not even sure who's playing that game for Milwaukee. It's a second. I have a back to back, but the Cavs. Okay, good. The cats have a 13 game winning streak. The last four games. They've barely won their last one.
- [66:40]
Dave McMahon
We're definitely going to wake up at the Bucks winning tomorrow after that.
- [66:43]
Tim Bottevs
Yeah, they won by one point in, in Charlotte on Friday night. And they're, you know, some like they're beating these teams that really frankly they should handle like, you know, Chicago, the Heat portion, he was missing three starters. I know Portland's been better recently, but that game was at home. But the takeaway from those games is that they've won all those games in clutch time and they've done it all different ways. There have been times where it's DeAndre Hunter being the, being the player. There's been times where it's been Darius Garland. There's been times when it's been Donovan Mitchell. Kenny Atkinson has played different lineups, different strategies. They've done a whole bunch of different things. And so while I do think there's a, you know, a few orange flags, not red flags, there's a few orange flags with the Cavs right now that, you know, are kind of getting hidden by this 13 game win streak. They have demonstrated throughout the year that they can go a whole bunch of different directions and that's not something a team like the Knicks is demonstrated. So Jalen goes down and it just compounds the, the, the injury. So 100 and the Knicks just are, you know, it's the same thing with, with, with the, the Nuggets. The Nuggets are not a deep team. So Aaron Gordon goes down and you just, you just feel it so much more. The Knicks are not a deep team. You have a player go down and just feel a lot more. And you know, to the Lakers, to a certain extent, at certain positions, they have depth on the wings, but certain positions, they're thin. So again, Jackson Hayes goes down, all of a sudden you're leaning on Trey Jameson to, like, play like, a lot more than you need them. And so that's what happens. So, you know, you know, teams that are in the middle of the, of the contender pack are in the middle of the contender pack for a reason, but it's just the worst. You know, I've. You guys have covered teams before. When you're on a long road trip and a player gets hurt and then like, and then they had a game the next night, like the, the Lakers that had to. Or the Knicks had to turn out and play the Clippers the next night. Of course, it just works out that way. Like, that's why you can never, in my opinion, you can never evaluate a team during a long road trip. Like, if it's struggling. Like sometimes during long road trips, stuff happens and you just take flesh wounds and you just got to kind of carry your way through. And so I would apply that to the Lakers over this next week, Dave, with their injury condition. And I apply it to the Knicks right now as they're dealing with it on this west coast trip. So. All right, Bottoms has a game to cover. Dave has an off night in New York City. I'm not going to deny him that. Thank you to Rafa, our producer. Thank you to to BonTems and to McMenamin. Thank you for watching Listening Hoop Collective. We'll talk to you later this week. Foreign.
- [69:48]
Texas Tourism
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