Thunder Step Up In Game 7 Win Over Denver + Previewing SGA VS. Ant WCF

Summary

Hoop Collective Podcast Summary Episode: Thunder Step Up In Game 7 Win Over Denver + Previewing SGA VS. Ant WCF
Release Date: May 19, 2025
Hosts: Brian Windhorst, Tim Bontemps, Tim MacMahon

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1. Introduction

Brian Windhorst welcomes listeners to the latest episode of the Hoop Collective podcast, focusing on the recent Game 7 victory of the Oklahoma City Thunder over the Denver Nuggets and previewing the upcoming Western Conference Finals matchup between Shai Gilgeous-Alexander (SGA) and Anthony Edwards (Ant).

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2. Game 7 Recap: Thunder vs. Denver Nuggets

The podcast delves into the dramatic Game 7 between the Thunder and Nuggets, highlighting the Thunder's impressive turnaround and strategic gameplay that led to their decisive victory.

Brian Windhorst remarks, "This game is a piece of history to me" (09:05), emphasizing the significance of the matchup and its impact on MVP considerations.

Tim Bontemps adds, "If you had an all playoffs team, [Gilgeous-Alexander] would be on first team all playoffs," (05:06), underscoring his pivotal role in the Thunder's success.

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3. Aaron Gordon's Performance and Injury

A significant portion of the discussion centers around Aaron Gordon's determination to play despite a Grade II hamstring strain. Gordon's performance was commendable, yet his injury raised concerns about his future contributions.

Brian Windhorst notes, "He couldn't commit himself to his normal summer program... leading to all these soft tissue injuries," (06:08), highlighting the personal and professional challenges Gordon has faced.

Tim MacMahon emphasizes the gravity of Gordon's situation, stating, "He thought he could help them win today... he played until the game got out of hand," (04:30). This resilience showcases his importance to the team but also foreshadows potential long-term implications due to his injury.

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4. Key Players and Strategies

The Thunder's success in Game 7 is attributed to outstanding performances from key players and effective team strategies.

• Shai Gilgeous-Alexander (SGA): Delivered a stellar game with "35 points" and was instrumental in closing out the series. Bontemps praises his performance, calling it "the MVP of the series," (11:32).

• Mark Dagenau: Implemented a strategic defensive approach against Nikola Jokic, resulting in Denver scoring only seven points off turnovers. Windhorst highlights, "The Thunder scored 37 points off turnovers. Never seen anything like it," (14:37).

• Alex Caruso: His defensive prowess was pivotal, forcing numerous turnovers and significantly disrupting Jokic's gameplay. MacMahon states, "He's wreaking havoc," (13:17).

Brian Windhorst observes, "Shea came out and had a Brilliant game. He's 12 of 19," (10:43), underlining Shea's efficiency and impact.

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5. Coaching Decisions and Impact

David Adelman's coaching strategies received high praise for their effectiveness in the playoff series.

Tim MacMahon shares insights from discussions with Nuggets’ governor, Josh Kroenke, indicating strong support for Adelman’s future with the team: "They really rallied behind David Adelman. I’d be very, very surprised if he’s not the Nuggets' next head coach," (20:23).

Brian Windhorst concurs, highlighting the importance of trusting core players: "When it matters, you play eight and trust seven," (11:32).

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6. Turnover Battle: Caruso vs. Jokic

A key factor in the Thunder's victory was their ability to force turnovers, particularly through Alex Caruso's defense against Nikola Jokic.

Brian Windhorst emphasizes the unprecedented nature of the game's turnover statistics: "Thunder scored 37 points off turnovers. Never seen anything like it," (14:37).

Tim MacMahon adds, "Caruso was a part when Caruso was defending Jokic, they generated eight turnovers," (14:53), highlighting the defensive intensity and its direct impact on the game's outcome.

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7. Nuggets' Season Review and Future Outlook

The discussion shifts to evaluating the Denver Nuggets' season, focusing on their depth issues and coaching strategies.

Tim Bontemps critiques the Nuggets' roster depth: "They have to add some more depth to this rotation and give themselves a couple extra guys," (18:19).

Brian Windhorst points out the challenges faced by the Nuggets despite their strong core, mentioning injuries and roster limitations: "They have the hard part figured out, but they haven't found it in two years," (23:30).

The conversation underscores the importance of depth and strategic acquisitions for the Nuggets to remain competitive in future seasons.

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8. Previewing Upcoming Western Conference Finals: SGA vs. Anthony Edwards

Looking ahead, the podcast previews the anticipated Western Conference Finals matchup between Shai Gilgeous-Alexander and Anthony Edwards.

Tim Bontemps expresses excitement about the dynamic between the two superstars: "Anthony Edwards is such a dynamic, entertaining, ascending superstar," (34:08).

Tim MacMahon discusses the tactical aspects, emphasizing the Thunder's need to manage turnovers effectively: "You can't let them get out and run and get dunks and start feeling good," (38:23).

The hosts predict a thrilling series characterized by high-energy performances, strategic defensive plays, and the evolving narratives of emerging NBA talents.

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Notable Quotes

• Brian Windhorst: "This game is a piece of history to me." (09:05)
• Tim Bontemps: "If you had an all playoffs team, [Gilgeous-Alexander] would be on first team all playoffs." (05:06)
• Tim MacMahon: "He thought he could help them win today... he played until the game got out of hand." (04:30)
• Brian Windhorst: "Thunder scored 37 points off turnovers. Never seen anything like it." (14:37)
• Tim Bontemps: "Anthony Edwards is such a dynamic, entertaining, ascending superstar." (34:08)

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Conclusion

The Hoop Collective podcast provided an in-depth analysis of the Oklahoma City Thunder's strategic triumph over the Denver Nuggets in Game 7, highlighting key performances, coaching decisions, and strategic plays that defined the series. The hosts also set the stage for an exhilarating Western Conference Finals matchup between Shai Gilgeous-Alexander and Anthony Edwards, promising listeners an exciting continuation of the NBA playoffs.

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Timestamps Reference:

• <a id="timestamp09:05">09:05</a>
• <a id="timestamp05:06">05:06</a>
• <a id="timestamp04:30">04:30</a>
• <a id="timestamp14:37">14:37</a>
• <a id="timestamp34:08">34:08</a>

Transcript

[Brian Windhorst]

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[Tim MacMahon]

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[Tim Bontemps]

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[Brian Windhorst]

Hello and welcome to the Hoop Collective podcast. We talk about the NBA which we're doing on Sunday evening. Joining us from New York City, home of the Eastern Conference finalist New York Knicks is Tim Bontemps.

[Tim Bontemps]

Hello everybody. Bunch of riled up Knicks fans here. Very, very fired up.

[Brian Windhorst]

I feel like if you're under the age of 30 and you're a Knicks fan, you can't talk about how long it's been. If you know there's some Knicks fans with gray hair who can talk about lamenting all their losses. But if you're under 30, enjoy your team success. But I'm not going to talk about your long suffering. Joining us from Oklahoma City where he was at game seven between the Nuggets and Thunder today is Ban McMahon.

[Tim MacMahon]

Howdy, partners. Heck of a win for the Oklahoma City Thunder today and enjoyed a nice peaceful, quiet stroll from the arena all the way back to my hotel where I meet you now.

[Brian Windhorst]

And you'll be having a nice stroll to the bar in a little while as soon as we're done, I believe.

[Tim MacMahon]

Just right behind the hotel. Tipsy Tiki.

[Brian Windhorst]

It wasn't much of a. Here's the thing, which you don't know, Bon Temps, is that he's actually suffering from a wound inflicted by his, his sons yesterday.

[Tim MacMahon]

Okay, now what happened now?

[Tim Bontemps]

I happened.

[Tim MacMahon]

I, I don't know. I don't, I'm guessing. But my, my left foot started acting up on me on the stroll back to the hotel, which is a concern because I've quasi organized a media pickup run between games one and two. I kind of warmed up for that run by challenging the boys to a little 1v1v1, as they call it.

[Tim Bontemps]

Oh no.

[Tim MacMahon]

Oh yeah. And well, good news is this. I won both games. Okay. Liam, you know Liam Little.

[Tim Bontemps]

I know, I know Liam. I know both of them. Actually.

[Tim MacMahon]

Mouthy little fella might have gotten some of that from me. Told me you've never been a shooter as I drained a three right in his face. You better guard me.

[Brian Windhorst]

You gotta love McMahon who talks trash.

[Tim Bontemps]

I also don't think it was in his face because he's a foot shorter than you and he's. And he's like ted.

[Tim MacMahon]

So over his face. He's 12. Anyways, let's talk about, we talked about the NBA.

[Brian Windhorst]

All right. I gotta say, when I heard that Aaron Gordon was going to play in this game, I had to naturally flash back to last year in game seven in this round at the Garden when Bontemps and I, when, when OG Anunoby shuffled out onto the court and we just looked at it.

[Tim Bontemps]

Shuffled feels like an aggressive stance for how he wandered out there.

[Brian Windhorst]

Right. And I, I just looked at spontaneps and I was like, they're not actually going to play him, are they? And so I'm watching videos of Aaron warming up and I'm like, well, he doesn't look terrible, but he's not running. Like he's not actually going to play. Right.

[Tim MacMahon]

He didn't make a single explosive movement in his warm up or any attempt to sprint. Nothing explosive.

[Tim Bontemps]

And he didn't even in the game really, did he?

[Tim MacMahon]

There, there was one.

[Tim Bontemps]

God bless him for playing. To be clear, I'm not.

[Tim MacMahon]

And honestly, they, they didn't like, Aaron Gordon wasn't the reason they lost this game. We'll get to that in a minute. They got the doors blown off him. Aaron for, for a grade two hamstring strain separate.

[Brian Windhorst]

I mean that's brutal.

[Tim MacMahon]

About 60 some odd hours before the fact that he got on the floor and actually was a big part, like he was really good. In the first quarter. They jump out to a 21:10 lead. I mean they're hiding him in his own and like, you know, but man, I, every time he did anything that required acceleration, I was wincing. There was one time he drove to the basket and kind of miss like an awkward layup attempt. And I was just, I literally was cringing because, dude, you just. And he knew the risk. Joker told him, don't play. Nicole Yokich said, I told him not to play. You know, basically you could, you could.

[Brian Windhorst]

Make it much worse if you tear your hamstring. If you tear it.

[Tim MacMahon]

It's months.

[Brian Windhorst]

You have to have surgery.

[Tim MacMahon]

Yeah. And it's like it's a long, long rehab. Yes, that was the risk. His hope was that he could somehow help them win today. And he said, sit out the first two or three games of the next round. I mean the likelihood was he, he wasn't, he wasn't going to be healthy next round for sure. But you know, then he ends up. He basically, he. He played until the game got out of hand, which honestly was pretty early in the second half.

[Tim Bontemps]

Yeah, I mean, God bless him.

[Brian Windhorst]

Honestly, he did a great job. He got. He got a bunch of rebounds. He got 11 rebounds.

[Tim Bontemps]

Yeah, yeah. I mean, he. He did everything he could and incredibly impressive to see him give it a shot. I mean, obviously their season's on the line. You expect a guy like him to play. And it, it's such a shame because, I mean, we've talked about him a ton. I mean, he's been unbelievable in these playoffs and he's probably great.

[Tim MacMahon]

Playoffs.

[Tim Bontemps]

One of the five or ten best players minimum. Ten best players, maybe five best players in the playoffs so far this year. He's been incredible and hugely impactful for Denver.

[Brian Windhorst]

If you had an all playoffs team, he would be on first team all playoffs.

[Tim Bontemps]

Yeah.

[Tim MacMahon]

And it's really, it's such a bummer. Like his whole last year has been really, really tough. From the tragedy of his brother dying in a car accident, through the calf injuries that he managed all year that cost him 30 some odd games to this hamstring. And sadly, it's all intertwined because, I mean, think about it like, dude, this guy couldn't commit himself to his normal summer program. He's dealing with unspeakable grief, right?

[Brian Windhorst]

And his brother has these kids that he's now basically helping raise.

[Tim MacMahon]

His entire life was thrown into disarray so, like, he couldn't train like he usually does. And that leads to all these soft tissue, or at least factors in to all the soft tissue injuries. He managed. He still was managing the calf, but you know, the way through the playoffs, but he manages all that. Has the best two playoff rounds of his career. And this is a guy who is a huge, huge piece of a championship team. Hits three of the biggest shots of his career. Two game winners and one that's in overtime for a win in this series. And then just. It's in the last couple minutes of a game they've essentially got put away. And that hammy just grabs at him. He thought it was. He. He didn't think grade two surprised him. He said the MRI surprised him. And then he just refused to listen. He just refused to accept that he couldn't play through it. And he did. And it didn't matter because one thing.

[Brian Windhorst]

He couldn't do, he did look much better than I thought he would like. He was able to somewhat move, but.

[Tim MacMahon]

He could not sprint. And let me tell you, there was a lot of sprinting required because there was a whole lot of Oklahoma City transition because that Thunder defense was spectacular. More Hoop Collective podcast after this.

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[Brian Windhorst]

This game is a piece of history to me. You know, the Gordon thing was fascinating, but it's a piece of history because you have two guys who are going to be one two in the mvp. And if the Nuggets and Jokic had won this game and Jokic had had like a 40 point triple double and Gilgis Alexander gets the MVP next week. You know, no matter what anybody would have said because I would have defended everything but it would have been days.

[Tim Bontemps]

Of discussion about the deserving and forever.

[Tim MacMahon]

That would have been tough.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yeah, 20, 30, 37 people would be like well yeah, Jokic won blah MVPs, but he really won that one in 25 and that was a fraud.

[Tim Bontemps]

So weird. It hasn't been handed out yet. I'm just gonna say so.

[Brian Windhorst]

I did talk to the league about this. I did talk to league about this and and they just basically said we would never hand out any of the awards in the second week of round two. And I go I get that. But. But you always handed out you always handed out, you always handed out the first week of round two, right?

[Tim Bontemps]

Yeah, that doesn't.

[Tim MacMahon]

They just didn't want to hand it out during this series, clearly.

[Tim Bontemps]

I mean, that goes back to David Robinson and Akeem Olajuwon 30 years ago. That was literally this matchup in the second round of the playoffs.

[Brian Windhorst]

So, so anyway, that was on the table, like there was history on the table here. And look, I'm not the fact that. And so here, here's. Here's what needs to be said. What needs to be said is that Shea came out and had a Brilliant game. He's 12 of 19. He gets to the line, he. He has 35 points. And you know, they, the, you know, David Adelman pulled his starters. He probably would have goes for 40 if he had to go to.

[Tim Bontemps]

Well, and look what happened in Game 6. Game 6 was lost for Oklahoma City right in the final three minutes of the second quarter when they're up big double digits and they implode at the end of the quarter. Shay gets his fourth foul. They give up the 120 run. They go from up double digits to up three because Lou Dort hits the three at the buzzer. But all the momentum shifted back to the, to the Nuggets and they take over the second half and they go away and win. Right? What happens in the final three minutes of the game today? They go on an 18 to 5 run. It goes from a one point game to a 14 point game. They route them in the second half. Like you said, the game's over by the end of the third quarter. And it all came back to that same stretch, the end of the second quarter and the way the Thunder went into halftime and it put the foot down after that. And the deeper younger team look like the deeper younger team as Game 7.

[Tim MacMahon]

Went on rotation shortened. But go on OKC's rotation because when.

[Brian Windhorst]

It matters, no matter what anybody says, you, when it matters, you play eight and trust seven. I, I don't care what anybody says. History thousands of times say that. And today Mark Dagenault played eight. All right, so it needs to be said that Shea had a brilliant game in an all chips on the table moment, not just for the series, but.

[Tim Bontemps]

Historically the biggest game of his career, he delivered.

[Brian Windhorst]

And the reason why the Thunder won this series, I mean there was a number of reasons, their depth, etcetera, is because they won Game 5. Game 5 was where the rubber met the road in this series and Shea brought him home. I know there was other factors, but.

[Tim Bontemps]

Shaker had that Lead the start of the fourth quarter. That that's what they're going to think about all summer. They had the chance to close that game out just like Dallas did last year. McMahon was there for both of them. And if Denver wins that game five, they weren't going to win game six at home. Series is over.

[Brian Windhorst]

So Shea will be getting that MVP trophy next week. And he was the MVP of the series as well. And so that's what's number one. The second thing I want to say is that Mark Dagenau went to a different strategy on Nikola Jokic.

[Tim MacMahon]

Oh boy, did he.

[Brian Windhorst]

Which I assume it's been in his back pocket. McMahon, you know that maybe he's like, do I need to go to this? He had Alex Caruso as the primary defender on Nikola Jokic in this game.

[Tim MacMahon]

Running the hell out of him. By the way started the second half over Isaiah Hartenstein. And one of the trimmings from the rotation was J. Will Jalen Williams, who actually, you know, considers pretty well had held up okay defensively against him. That statistically held up well.

[Brian Windhorst]

Here was the stats, ESPN Stats Information had Caruso defended Jokic 37 possessions, points per play, 0.78.

[Tim MacMahon]

Now it's not one on one to be clear. Of course it's Caruso fronting them, packing the paint, spraying out. But man, Caruso, it's the one champion, proven champion on that OKC roster. It and you know, this goes back to. This is the guy who they got for Josh Giddey who by the way was benched in the second round last year, was pulled from the starting lineup last year. But Caruso just, I mean his stat line, what was he, a plus 40?

[Brian Windhorst]

Well, that's.

[Tim MacMahon]

He just had like yes. Box score line, aside from plus minus does not begin to explain the impact that he had. He's so tough, he's so smart, he has such great hands. He wreaks so much havoc. The most important stat in this game.

[Brian Windhorst]

Oh, I know what you're going to say.

[Tim MacMahon]

Turnovers Force for 37.

[Brian Windhorst]

I've never seen a. What the stat here. You just start. You just told half of it. I've never seen a spread this big in an NBA game. It's obviously happened, but I cannot remember it. The Thunder scored 37 points off turnovers. The Nuggets scored seven.

[Tim Bontemps]

Yeah, and by the way, it was a 32 point game and that's a 30 point spread.

[Brian Windhorst]

Never seen anything like it.

[Tim MacMahon]

And it's so.

[Brian Windhorst]

And by the way, Caruso was a part when Caruso was Defending Jokic, they generated eight turnovers. Not all of them were Jokic's turnovers. They did eight turnovers and that, that.

[Tim MacMahon]

Is so big for a million reasons. What was the other. What was a huge storyline from game six and even the couple games that.

[Tim Bontemps]

The Jalen Williams wasn't good.

[Tim MacMahon]

Jalen Williams is really struggling. You know how know what the best way is to get him going. Get transition dunks like that bad dude out in transition.

[Tim Bontemps]

Yep.

[Tim MacMahon]

Create a turnover or even a long rebound block shot. They can run over off a lot of different ways, but especially turnovers get them. And he is so good in the open floor. He had two or three dunks early in the or you know, second quarter I believe and next thing you know he's in a rhythm and. And there and she. Gilgis Alexander has his all star sidekick. I thought Shake played a great patient game. He didn't come out forcing stuff. He didn't come out feeling like I've got to take over from the get go. Everything was in the flow of the game. He was great. But this, this was the Thunder formula. Dominant swarming defense fuels the offense. Brilliant efficiency from Shea and J Dub is, is a. An all star sidekick. That's how they won 68 games. That's how they set an NBA record for point differential. That's how. Yeah, they had 54 double digit wins in the regular season. Now this series did test them in crunch time. They lost two crunch time games. They had to come through and win those two. Where Shea really did come through and close the door for them. But then they closed it out in the same fashion that they, they cruised the top seed in the NBA.

[Tim Bontemps]

Well and that, that's what they did all season. Right? It was, it was forcing turnovers and getting easy baskets. When these guys get in a half court game and they can't create turnovers, they do really struggle at times offensively. And Jalen Williams had an awful series for the most part. But like you said when he was getting out in transition and getting dunk after dunk after dunk as this game went on makes you start feeling a lot better. Right. And when they, they got out and ran and kept like the end of that second quarter, it was just one steal after another to a wide open transition dunk. And it was the same thing at the start of the third quarter and in a five minute stretch it went from a one point game to a 20 point game and it just at that point you just didn't see a way for Denver back into it. Like you said, by the time the third quarter was over, it was like Joe Missoula in Game 6 at the Garden. He was pulling his starters and, you know, there just. There was just a party for 12 minutes and.

[Tim MacMahon]

Okay, see, so still going to the tipsy tiki.

[Brian Windhorst]

Michael Porter Jr. I understand that he has been dealing with this shoulder thing, but this was his last four games of this series. One of seven, one of seven, four of nine. And what was he today?

[Tim Bontemps]

He was three for eight and he's over four from three.

[Brian Windhorst]

I mean, this guy. I mean, this guy. I mean.

[Tim Bontemps]

And it's like you said, it all goes back to Game 5. They're up eight at the end of the third quarter of Game 5. If they win Game 5, they're in the Western Conference finals and they're probably the favorite to win the title.

[Brian Windhorst]

But, but seriously, when you. When you got down to today with Aaron Gordon compromised, because, you know, I always talk about how many players can you trust? So you're in game seven. How many players could Jokic trust with him out there? Christian Brown, was that it? Was it was that. Christian Brown, Jamal Murray. That was it by the end.

[Tim Bontemps]

Yeah, yeah. And Jamal wasn't even good today.

[Brian Windhorst]

Not. But. Yeah, but you trust him.

[Tim Bontemps]

Yeah.

[Tim MacMahon]

Russ was a minus 34 and 22 minutes. Actually hit a couple. That's all he did.

[Tim Bontemps]

They just. I mean, their issue all year was a lack of depth. We talked about it a billion times. This was a team that had played something like 12 or 13 games in 25 days at this point. And even though there was the extra day between games, between the Aaron injury, the Porter injury, and just the wear and tear of the series, they look like they just ran out of gas as this game went along. And look, that first round series felt like a conference semifinal. This series felt like a conference final. I don't think there's anything for Denver for this team to feel like they left anything on the table. I think they had a good playoff run. Certainly whatever they do, front office wise, I certainly think we all agree David Adelman will likely be the coach. Certainly think. I think he deserves to be the coach after the way this run went, 100%. They've got to add some more depth to this rotation and give themselves a couple extra guys. Nicole Jokic, I thought, said it perfectly. When you look at across the playoffs, Minnesota's got a rock solid eight guys. Oklahoma City might be the deepest team in the league. Indiana's playing a whole bench unit in the conference finals, and even the Knicks, the Knicks are deeper than this Denver team. They've got a rock solid seven. Guys like Denver's been barely at six all year. That's just not good enough.

[Tim MacMahon]

And I, I did, I spoke to Josh Kroenke, the Nuggets governor for a little bit in the locker room. He didn't want to make any Graham proclamations about David Adelman. As far as his, his future potentially as the head coach there, I, I will say that kind of the word was, hey, if he wins a playoff series, it's almost certainly going to be his gig. He obviously won a playoff series. They pushed the top seated Thunder to the, to the brink, you know, to, to seven games. His, his zone schemes defensively were a big part of the, he did a great job.

[Tim Bontemps]

They gave the Thunder a ton of problems in the series.

[Tim MacMahon]

His, his players by and large.

[Brian Windhorst]

Well, that's what I've noticed there.

[Tim MacMahon]

I mean, strongly praised him.

[Tim Bontemps]

Yeah, yeah.

[Tim MacMahon]

Aaron Gordon straight up said, I hope he's here next year. Joker gave me that, you know, it's above my pay grade. But really praised him. Josh Kroenke did tell me, you know, the one thing he was willing to say on the record was outside of the championship, this is the most proud I've been because these guys have really rallied and when you talk about really rallied, they rallied behind David Adelman. He made the decision to, you know, fire Michael Malone, put David Adelman in a really tough spot. Three games left. I'd be very, very surprised if he's not the, the Nuggets next head coach. But there's a, it's a roster with clear flaws.

[Brian Windhorst]

That's a telling statement too because like Bon Temps just said, like, no matter what anybody wants to say, not all playoff runs are created equal. And at the end of the day, like, you know, this was not last.

[Tim Bontemps]

Year when they blew a 20 point lead. Game seven at home.

[Brian Windhorst]

That's right.

[Tim Bontemps]

And they really could have felt like they left it on the table. They didn't leave anything on the table today.

[Brian Windhorst]

Right. And when you look at the ledger, it has a cold, hard fact like up second round exit, second round exit, you're like, you know, but this was, this was a brutal playoff run. And considering the, again considering the hand they're holding at the end, this was, this was, this was still a game in the balance midway through the second quarter.

[Tim MacMahon]

I mean, let's not praise him too much for Game 7 when they got the door. No, but it's the series, but the run for sure.

[Tim Bontemps]

Yes, they're close. Like They're. This is not some situation where they need to totally remake the team. They need, I don't know. Depth.

[Tim MacMahon]

Yeah, they need to add significant depth.

[Brian Windhorst]

They need. They need two more players. I don't know where they're going to get them.

[Tim MacMahon]

Well, and then you get into, hey, if you're making a move, a significant move to shake things up, you know, Michael Porter jr. Is probably where you start. He was in trade rumors this year. They need. What's his new Julian Strother to build on what he did in Game six that, you know, they need, you know, Pickett to perhaps become rotation player. We'll see if Russ is back. I would say that's pretty shaky. I mean, he's got a player option, but as we saw last summer, just because he picks it up doesn't mean necessarily that he'd be back.

[Tim Bontemps]

They have a. They have a. They have an awesome starting five. Yes. You. You want to try to do something with Porter Jr. Fine. But Christian Brown is a terrific player. The other three guys are awesome. Porter is a solid fifth player. I mean, I give him a ton of credit. He's playing through the shoulder injury. I know it's not a shooting shoulder, but still, they're a toughness. They're a tough, hard nosed team. Jokic at this point, I mean, I was talking to a couple people about it this weekend. He feels like LeBron at this point. I expect him to win every game. Like, the pressure he puts on the opponent every single game. It's not like he's going anywhere anytime soon.

[Brian Windhorst]

You're right. He's like LeBron, where, like, when he has a game that we're like, boy, that wasn't. It wasn't a great Jokic game. He only, you know, he was pretty good 6.

[Tim Bontemps]

Game 6. It was like 29, 16 and 9.

[Tim MacMahon]

And it was like, yeah, 29, 29, 14 and 8. You're like, yeah, that was pretty dominant, you know.

[Tim Bontemps]

Yeah.

[Tim MacMahon]

Special by his standards.

[Brian Windhorst]

Right.

[Tim Bontemps]

Oh, so they're gonna be like, they're gonna be in the mix and like, if all you got. And again, all you got to do sounds strong, but, like, if what you got to do is add depth pieces, like you can find depth pieces. Two years ago, they went and found Bruce Brown, they found Jeff Green, they went and found guys. Like, they can do that. Well, they have the hard part figured.

[Brian Windhorst]

Out, but they haven't done it in two years. They haven't found.

[Tim Bontemps]

Well, I understand. It's why they have a new GM or will have a new gm. But it's. They have the hard part figured out. They've got the best.

[Brian Windhorst]

Well, that I agree with. I will say this. It's. It kind of felt like when. When it was all over for. For the Celtics, it was like, well, they lost Tatum. Porzingis was a shell of himself. And Jalen Brown, according to Ronnie Shelburne, had as a. As a meniscus injury. And then now you, like, look at the Nuggets and like, well, that was done. Look at. Look at this. Was Michael Porter Jr. Stats. In the regular season, he played 77 games, by the way, the most he's ever played. Actually, he played 81 last year, so I take that back. He averaged 18 points, shot 50 from the field, shot 40 from three. Okay. Average seven rebounds. That was his regular season. In the playoffs, he averaged nine points. He shot 38. He shot 36 on three and averaged six rebounds. He was literally a shell of himself.

[Tim MacMahon]

And he's playing. It's not a shooting shoulder, but, like, you're playing with one arm, basically.

[Brian Windhorst]

So. So they're already. They're already, like, down, essentially. They've got. They're missing half of a starter there because he's putting up half the numbers. Yeah, he was before, so that's. That's what happens. I mean, by the way, part of the reason that winning the championship is so hard is because you have to be able to withstand things like this happening to you.

[Tim Bontemps]

You got to get lucky. You got to avoid injuries, got to avoid bad luck on shots, by the way, avoid all this stuff there.

[Tim MacMahon]

They made a. Somewhat of a desperation move to add depth last summer or last, you know, all season. Signed Russell Westbrook. It was a minimum contract, but still somewhat of a desperation move. And for a while, it really worked. And at the end, it really didn't. He was -92 in this series.

[Tim Bontemps]

Yeah, I mean, we. We said that going into the playoffs, like, at some point the rusting was going to bite him, and it did and that. But again, like, that's. If what you have to do is add a sixth, seventh, and eighth guy, that's a lot harder than finding Nicole Jokic. Like, oh, sure, they're going to be. I know I'm not telling you guys that, but they're. They're going to be in the mix by default because they've got the core. They've got. And Aaron Gordon took a massive step forward this year, his best year of his career. He was awesome. Like, they're. They're going to be heard from again. And, like, I said I just, I came away from these playoffs just having immense respect for Denver for the way they fought through and dealt with everything they dealt with. And like Cronky said, I mean, he said it perfectly. They really rallied together. And if you'd said on April 13th or whatever day it was, they got rid of Michael alone and Calvin Booth that they were going to be in seventh game of the Western Conference finals against the Thunder with a chance to win, you would have said, I mean, maybe, maybe Jokic, but you just don't, you wouldn't have expected it. And they, they deserve a ton of credit for that. And we sort of, we've talked a lot about Denver, understandably. But like we talked about the other night, about how much fun it looks like Pacers, Knicks is going to be like Wolf's Thunder, I think is going to be an incredible series. And you've got four teams that. There's one of them that's won a title ever in the Knicks, and that was in 1970 and 73. So you've got new blood in the finals. You've got new blood for winning a title and you've got what I think are two super awesome conference finals and what should be a really fun finals afterward.

[Brian Windhorst]

Right. So no. 1, somebody like obviously the Wolves have never won a title. The Pacers have never won.

[Tim Bontemps]

The Pacers, Thunder and Bulls have never won a title and the Knicks haven't won it in 50 years.

[Brian Windhorst]

Okay. Yeah. So that's what we talked about. All right, let's take a look at this series coming up. Of the teams in the Western Conference, at least that gave the Thunder issues this year, the Timberwolves were at the top. Now, I think a couple of at least one of those games, the second night of a back to back they.

[Tim MacMahon]

Played, they played each other in a home road back to back, which was with the. A late tip, early tip. I mean it was ridiculous.

[Tim Bontemps]

The Wolves are deep. The Wolves are deep. The Wolves are long and the Wolves are big across the board. And they like we saw in this series, yes, they got Isaiah Hartenstein, the Thunder, yes, they can play big, but this is a team that generally is small across the board. And we saw the size small very well. No, I, I agree, but I'm just saying they, they play small, they lean small and the Wolves lean big across the board. And that style, that, that stylistic clash between the two is probably what's going to define the series. And I'm just super excited from a basketball standpoint to watch. I think it's going to be absolutely awesome.

[Tim MacMahon]

More Hoop Collective podcast after this.

[Unknown]

Out here, there's no one way of doing things, no unwritten rules, and no shortage of adventure. Because out here, the only requirement is having fun. Bank of America invites kids six to 18 times golf with Us For a limited time, sign them up for a free one year membership, giving them access to discounted Tetons at thousands of courses. Learn [e-mail] golf with us what would you like the power to do? Bank of America restrictions apply. See BFA.com golf with us for complete details. Copyright 2025 bank of America Corporation. This episode is brought to you by State Farm. Knowing you could be saving money for the things you really want is a great feeling. Talk to a State Farm agent today to learn how you can choose to to bundle and save with the personal price plan. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there. Prices are based on rating plans that vary by state. Coverage options are selected by the customer. Availability, amount of discounts and savings and eligibility vary by state.

[Tim Bontemps]

Hey there travelers. Kaley Cuoco here. Sorry to interrupt your music, great artist BT Dubs, but wouldn't you rather be.

[Tim MacMahon]

There to hear it live?

[Tim Bontemps]

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[Unknown]

Go to your happy price, Priceline.

[Brian Windhorst]

All right, so they went two and two against each other in regular season. Julius Randle didn't play in three of the four games. One of the things that stats and info came up with was Minnesota running a ton of zone against Oklahoma City and it being relatively successful.

[Tim MacMahon]

That's what Denver did in this series.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yes.

[Tim Bontemps]

And you know Chris Finch was watching.

[Brian Windhorst]

That and nothing to do for days on end. I'm sure they want every possession.

[Tim MacMahon]

Wendy, that home road back, back to back. Remember we saw the Wolves fresh off that and they were riding high. We saw them. We were in la. Yes, they were riding high because that's when they came back, I think like 16 down in the last four minutes of regulation, forced overtime. This was in Oklahoma City to steal that game. And that's the game where they just, you know, they ran that funky little. I don't even know what you call it, like a 2, 1, 2, I guess. Really just threw two at. At the ball force out of Shay's hands and scrambled behind it. I'm sure there's going to. The Thunder will see a lot of that in film session. The Thunder did today seem to really be able to. I'm seeing like their stats against the zone today. They were ugly going into, into game seven.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yeah, well, today's game was defined in transition.

[Tim MacMahon]

I mean, right. But they did seem to start, they seem to start picking it apart. They got a bunch like check, got three or four baseline cuts for lobs and stuff like that. They seem to be able to get to the middle of it better today.

[Tim Bontemps]

But I think, but I think that's your point about transition. I think that's what's going to define this series too. Like the Thunder always want to run their half court offense is not great. It's Shea and then it's hoping they hit shots a lot of the time. And then Jaylen Williams has shown to be very up and down again. Right. This has not been the most encouraging playoffs through two rounds for him. But if they get out and run in transition, they're lethal. And as we know, Minnesota, they're bigger, they're more physical, they, they're comfortable in the half court. With Julius and Ant operating, they're going to be able to attack the glass with their three bigs crashing inside like that. Who can control the pace in both these series in different ways, I think is going to play a huge part in who wins because you've got, you know, two teams in the Knicks and the Wolves that probably are going to prefer to mash it a little bit and two teams in Indiana and Oklahoma City that are going to want to make it attract.

[Brian Windhorst]

Well, the thing about the Wolves is that Ant and Randall are both doing such great playmaking. I mean they're averaging like double doubles with assists so they each can, you know, can score. But the fact that they've got two playmakers which has made their offense way more potent.

[Tim Bontemps]

Really happy. Julius Randall, by the way, like, he's a guy who's taken a lot of, a lot of stick over the years for how he plays and he did a great job with the Knicks and really helped turn that team around. I mean the Knicks were, I mean it's easy to forget, but the Knicks, yes, they took a big step when Jalen got there, but the beginning of them turning around was when Julius signed as a free agent. And like that year under Tom, that first year, like they were a playoff team basically because Julius was, you know, a monster on the ball all season for them and sort of dragged them along and they had a rough series against the Hawks. He's had some rough moments in the playoffs before, but he's been awesome in these playoffs, and it's been cool to see him really get a chance to shine in a big spot. And we do have on the table the funniest outcome left, which would be the much discussed Nick's Wolf trade. Small towns for Dante DiVincenzo and Julius Randle becoming a finals matchup, which would be just an unbelievable thing if it happened, given the percentage chances of that happening back in September would have been very small.

[Tim MacMahon]

Is that a prediction? Oops. Bontem's Bricktown scholarship has just.

[Tim Bontemps]

No, I didn't. I didn't. I didn't say that was a prediction. It would be the funniest outcome, though.

[Tim MacMahon]

That's what I heard. Listen, we've talked about ants improved decision making, especially down the stretch in games. His decision making is going to be crucial in this season.

[Tim Bontemps]

Turn the ball over against this team.

[Tim MacMahon]

Yes. Turnovers are deaths against the Thunder. They are so good at creating and converting turnovers. And man, and I tell you what, Ann is going to. This is going to be so fun to watch. He's such a dynamic, entertaining, ascending superstar, and he's going to deal with Lou Dort, and when he gets a breather from that, it's going to be Alex Caruso or Kayson Wallace, and then there's going to be Chet Holmgren or. And. Or Isaiah Hartenstein on the back line. Like, this is going to be a massive challenge to Anne, and I cannot wait to see how he's going to handle that.

[Tim Bontemps]

Gonna be awesome.

[Brian Windhorst]

Yeah. Interesting little stat. Just gonna toss this in there that Stats Williams came up with.

[Tim Bontemps]

Shout out to Stats Williams. Okay.

[Tim MacMahon]

As always, much better than Jackson stealing his stuff. Go on.

[Tim Bontemps]

All right. That's not very nice.

[Brian Windhorst]

Jackson's Jackson Max was also our guy. Elite.

[Tim Bontemps]

They're both great.

[Brian Windhorst]

Elite. Oh, sorry.

[Tim MacMahon]

Sorry. Jackson.

[Brian Windhorst]

Jalen Clark. They're the Jalen Clark, the Wolves rookie.

[Tim Bontemps]

Thought you said Caitlyn Clark for a second. I was going to talk about Caitlyn Clark's 2010.

[Tim MacMahon]

Draymond Mike flavor Fever.

[Brian Windhorst]

I think there's some fever games during the Eastern Conference finals, people.

[Tim MacMahon]

And we're Paige Becker's fans around here. Go on.

[Brian Windhorst]

Oh, really?

[Tim Bontemps]

All they do is get number one picks in Dallas.

[Tim MacMahon]

Dallas.

[Brian Windhorst]

That's right. Of course. I forgot. I forgot she was a Wing. I'm sorry. Anyway, Jalen Clark, the rookie from the Wolves who's Basically not played in their playoff rotation. Had a lot of success guarding Shakeless Alexander this year and didn't just do it for five seconds. Had 70 half court matchups against him and. And SGA had a 25 effective field goal percentage when he was guard.

[Tim MacMahon]

Does it say what Nikhil Alexander Walker's numbers are? His cousin.

[Brian Windhorst]

It says that Jaden McDaniels defended him most on the Wolves.

[Tim MacMahon]

I know, I remember. Remember when the Wolves got. I'm sorry the Thunder got bounced by the Wolves in emphatic fashion from the play in a couple years ago. I remember Nikhil Alexander Walker having a strong defensive performance in that game. Listen, they've got, you know, Shay. You're not stopping Shay one on one. Obviously it's team defense and all that, but they, they've got. I would be surprised to see a rookie get a whole lot of minutes in this series. Well, they do have some options on.

[Brian Windhorst]

I'm just going to point it out. I'm just going to let it sit there. Is that, you know, he defended him a lot. Now there was a. There was a stretch in the season that due to injuries, he was having to play a lot. Like, remember there was a time when the Wolves were thin on the perimeter because Dante DiVincenzo was out with the foot near a toe injury. So anyway, I thought that was interesting from stats to come up with that. I'm sure that's not going to be on the top line, Chris Finch's game plan, but just put it in your little back pocket, okay? That's Williams doing his thing.

[Tim MacMahon]

All right.

[Brian Windhorst]

He's played six minutes total this, this postseason. Jalen Clark. But I would tell him to get extra loose before these games just in case.

[Tim Bontemps]

Not loose. Extra loose.

[Brian Windhorst]

Extra loose. Yeah. So I do expect, you know, there to be moments in this series where it's going to be Ant and Shea going back and forth, not unlike it was Jokic and. And Shea going back and forth in.

[Tim MacMahon]

Yeah, because it's going to be interesting because Ant has to be careful about getting caught up though in a. In like some kind of duel, you know. Again, I thought one of the great things about Shea's performance today was he didn't feel like, okay, I'm gonna put a cape on right away. It was a very patient, efficient, dominant performance where, you know, he didn't come out and get, you know, feel like he had to get up 12 shots in the first quarter. I think Ant's got. Ant's gotta. There's gotta be. Because sometimes, you know, some as His.

[Tim Bontemps]

Julius both can get very loose with the ball. And like you said against this war, against this Thunder team, you cannot get loose with the ball and let them get out and run and get dunks and start feeling good. Especially in the games at okc, getting that cauldron of crowd going like, then they're off to the races and good luck trying to keep up with them.

[Tim MacMahon]

And as an told me actually in OKC on New Year's Eve this year, I asked him about Finch constantly hammering on him to make the right play. And he says, you know, he's just trying to coach winning basketball. But sometimes I just feel like the right play is me. And you know, Finch will tell you he's got a point, but there's, there's that balance of, you know, putting your imprint on a game without forcing it. And when you force it against the Thunder, man, whether it's turnovers, long rebounds, whatever, things can go, things can snowball real quick against that team.

[Tim Bontemps]

Well, by the way, the Thunder have played three, six games at home in these playoffs. They won one of them by 51, they won another one by 43, and they won another one by 32. So when they get going and running in that environment, it can get away from them, from the opponent really, really fast and where you've got to take care of the ball.

[Tim MacMahon]

The one loss, they blew a double figure fourth quarter lead.

[Tim Bontemps]

Yes.

[Tim MacMahon]

Which they did the last time. They did the last time they played the Wolves in Oklahoma City.

[Tim Bontemps]

Yes. And you just cannot give them easy baskets to get their others feeling good. You know Shea's going to cook. You know Shea's going to score the other guys. When the other guys get going and start making shots and feeling good, that's when the Avalanches happen. You, you can't let those guys get energy. You can't let the crowd get into it. You got to keep the game slower. You got to take care of the ball. That's going to be on Julius and ant to make good decisions, be sound with the ball and not give up those live ball turnovers like what got the game out of hand today.

[Tim MacMahon]

I will go ahead and predict right now that Julius Randall will be sick and tired of Alex Caruso by the end of this year. Seriously, Caruso did, I mean, Caruso, honestly, he, he ate Jaren Jackson Jr. Alive in the first round. And Jaren Jackson Jr. Is probably going to be potentially an all NBA player this year. I think probably even really good player.

[Brian Windhorst]

He's going to be all defense.

[Tim MacMahon]

I'll tell you that Caruso ate him up. And I'm not going to sit here and tell you Crusoe ate up Nicole Yoko today because that's not what happened. But he was damn sure a massive, massive factor in closing the series out. He. The guy's ability to guard up in size is really, really impressive.

[Tim Bontemps]

I will also say, by the way, one thing, one thing you saw as the series went along. Obviously, Lou Dort had the incredible fourth quarter in Game 5, but Casey Wallace got more and more minutes as the series went on. I'm a huge Case Wallace fan, and it would not surprise me if that continues to be a trend as this series goes on and as the playoffs go on and as we go into next season. Because he is awfully, awfully good and has a lot of, I think, a lot more juice with the ball than Lou Dort.

[Tim MacMahon]

Oh, yeah.

[Tim Bontemps]

In general. And that's a trend. Yes, yes. I mean, that. That is to watch going forward.

[Tim MacMahon]

Yeah.

[Brian Windhorst]

Or game five, where I swear to God, from. From foul line to foul line, he might be top three in the league in terms of.

[Tim MacMahon]

Dude, he grew up in Texas. I don't know how he wasn't rushing for 2,500 yards for Richardson. Well, I do know because Richardson high school's football team sucks. But my, I mean, like, dude, his, like, he really. His explosiveness, it's unbelievable acceleration. And in terms of like the ability to leap. He had two dunks in transition today. One of them was like, kind of on Joker. I'm like, oh, my goodness sakes. With a 6 4.

[Tim Bontemps]

I don't see that.

[Tim MacMahon]

I don't think he's 6 4. I was talking to Cruz earlier this year and he pointed out, like, his ability to block jump shots. Like, I saw him block a Lucas, step back three, just straight up block it, which you don't see happen. And he and Caruso, it's amazing how he can get to the block jumpers at 6 foot 1. I think he was kind of digging them a little bit. He was within ears.

[Tim Bontemps]

I don't think he's quite that small. I mean, the guy he reminds me a lot of is a young Jrue Holiday. And like, I think long term, he's got a chance to be at both ends a Drew Holiday type player. And Drew Hot is one of my favorite players ever. If he becomes Drew Holiday, that's one hell of a player.

[Tim MacMahon]

Yeah. Now, I, I don't think that Drew Holiday had that sort of athletic explosiveness. Like, this guy is a. I don't know, man.

[Tim Bontemps]

Drew. Drew Young Drew Holiday was.

[Brian Windhorst]

Drew Holiday was, was an all star by his third.

[Tim MacMahon]

No, Drew Holiday is a heck of a player. Drew Holiday is, is a. Much like. We'll see if Case Wallace can have the kind of ball skills Drew Holiday has had in his scoring ability. He said, I'm just saying.

[Tim Bontemps]

Young, you think about Drew now. Drew looks like a linebacker back, back when he came in the league. If you like, look at Drew, he was, he was built like Case and Wallace.

[Tim MacMahon]

He was. Now Case and Wallace, when he tries to throw lob passes, they too. They do tend to end up in about the fourth row. I'll say that that's something. Maybe there's a little bit of polish.

[Brian Windhorst]

Five star. I mean, I don't know. I, I didn't know about. I knew about Drew Holiday in high school. I had not.

[Tim MacMahon]

I'm just saying Case and Wallace, in terms of acceleration and vertical explosiveness, I think He's a top 2% athlete.

[Tim Bontemps]

Yeah, he's awesome. He's awesome. That's just a trend. I think that's worth watching, especially going into this series with the athletes that the, the walls have on the perimeter.

[Tim MacMahon]

I do agree with that. I also think that Lou Dort's linebacker type of play and physicality is going to be a critical element against Anthony Edwards. You're going to have to try to wear Julius both.

[Tim Bontemps]

Yeah, I'm sure I'll spend time on Julius too. I mean those are two of the strongest dudes in the league. I mean that's, that's going to be some slug fest going back and forth.

[Tim MacMahon]

When you talk about the variation shot making, Lou Dort has developed himself into being a 40 plus percent 3 point shooter. But there are playoff games where there's no way in hell you'd believe it.

[Tim Bontemps]

He's like Danny Green. Danny Peak. Danny Green. When he was playing for the spurs like in the 2013 finals, he shot like, felt like 95% from the field and might have been MVP if they didn't let Game 6 get away from him. And then there were other times when he would go, it felt like one for a million and just miss everything for games and games and games. And Lou is the same way. Like, like game five. He starts making those threes in the fourth quarter and you think he's never going to miss again. And then he might go two more games and not make a shot. It is funny how he's a lot.

[Brian Windhorst]

Like that, but he's a lot better than he used to be.

[Tim Bontemps]

Lee Dort, it's an incredible development. I mean, it's one of many incredible developmental stories for the Thunder. I mean, it's guy was an undrafted free agent and has turned himself into an absolutely monster player. And, you know, I mean, yeah, it's just these two series are going to be awesome. I'm so pumped. Like, it's fun. Athletic, young teams, new blood in the conference finals. Three of the four teams, or two of the four teams are new. Three of the four never won a title. It's going to be. Going to be pretty awesome.

[Brian Windhorst]

Oh, we'll be here for it. And I don't know, we'll see how our, our next podcast will publish on Wednesday. We're entering into the phase where we're not sure when podcasts are going to publish.

[Tim Bontemps]

Here's the real truth. Windy, our guy Wendy on the street the other day. Oh, well, needs, needs his sleep. And so McMahon, who takes a billion hours.

[Tim MacMahon]

Don't, don't, don't do that.

[Tim Bontemps]

You might just get moved aside for a while.

[Tim MacMahon]

You haven't written a story since, I think, 2012.

[Tim Bontemps]

That's definitely not true. I wrote multiple stories last week.

[Tim MacMahon]

Nobody clicked on them. I know. Here's the thing, though. Wendy's coming west. He'll be with me, so he's going to be working those. You know, he's going to be working. We got Tuesday, Thursday this week. So we might adjust for Wendy's schedule. I promise you this. He's gonna be just fine in Bricktown. I'll escort him around. Big Rich. Big Rich, you know, I'll introduce you to Big Rich. We'll get you. You know, he's pretty good guy to know around these parts if, if your buddies.

[Tim Bontemps]

He's a good bodyguard to have.

[Tim MacMahon]

Ain't no one going to mess with around here if you're, if you're down with Big Rich, I can promise you that it'll be all right around here.

[Brian Windhorst]

All right, well, all I'm saying is check your feeds in the morning because you never know when. Jackson worked all night to get one posted, so. And it'll be that way through.

[Tim Bontemps]

That's code for Brian's not waiting after these west games all the time. From man slow ass to pods.

[Tim MacMahon]

I don't even take that long. Number one.

[Tim Bontemps]

No, that is not true.

[Tim MacMahon]

Blame Teddy Tumbleson's dad. Tell him get those OKC Thunders quicker.

[Tim Bontemps]

That is. That is not true. We know that is not true.

[Brian Windhorst]

Anyway, the pods could be a little erratic about when they're posting, but you won't have a problem with volume.

[Tim Bontemps]

All right.

[Brian Windhorst]

Thank you.

[Tim MacMahon]

Either in quantity or decibels.

[Brian Windhorst]

I didn't say anything about quality. All right. Thank you to McMahon and Bontemp. Thank you to Jackson. Thank you for listening and watching the Hoop Collective. We'll talk to you later this week.

[Tim MacMahon]

Adios amigos. Calling all daydreamers and date nighters. Come immerse yourself in the rich culture of Texas and dig into our mouth watering barbecue. Trailblazers can explore our natural wonders and beach lovers will wonder why they've never felt so relaxed before. You're invited to discover experiences you can only find in Texas. Visit traveltexas.com and plan your trip today. Let's Texas.