Buffalo Plus LIVE: The BEST, WORST and WILDCARD scenarios for the BILLS in the NFL Draft

Summary

Buffalo Plus LIVE: The BEST, WORST, and WILDCARD Scenarios for the Bills in the NFL Draft

Podcast: Buffalo Plus
Episode Date: April 24, 2025
Hosts: Mike Catalana, Jenna Cottrell, Dan Fetes

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Episode Overview

This lively episode of Buffalo Plus explores all the looming possibilities for the Buffalo Bills in the upcoming NFL Draft. With the draft just over a day away, hosts Mike Catalana, Jenna Cottrell, and Dan Fetes break down the best-case, worst-case, and wildcard draft scenarios for the Bills. They tackle the team’s greatest needs, possible front office strategies, player fits, recent team moves (notably, Tre’Davious White’s return), and fan anxieties, all while referencing behind-the-scenes conversations and media insights from One Bills Drive.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Expectations and Pressure on Brandon Beane

• The consensus is that Beane is at a pivotal moment as Bills GM, especially following several recent first-round picks (Keon, Kincaid, and Elam) that haven’t delivered star-level impact yet.
• "This is the biggest draft of Brandon Beane’s career… when you’re an NFL GM, the biggest one is always the next one." (Dan, 04:08)
• They agree: this year’s draftees must be immediate starters—“starter plus”—not just depth.

2. The Bills’ Draft Philosophy and Draft Board Process

• Beane’s approach is described as a “consensus” model, but the GM ultimately makes the call:
  • “My board, it’s not the scouting board, it’s the Buffalo Bills board… there are times I'm the minority in the room… better be right, though.” (Mike quoting Beane, 04:36)
• The hosts note, due to fewer blue-chip prospects this year, the Bills are likely targeting “starters, not stars.”
  • “Think of this draft as starters, not stars… There are plenty of starters, especially in this draft, that could make impacts in Buffalo next season.” (Dan, 06:11)

3. Draft Needs: Defensive Line, Corner, and Wide Receiver

• Defensive Line

  • Debate: Should the Bills focus on one-tech defensive tackle or prioritize edge rusher/cornerback?

  • Dan’s take:

    • Focus should be on positions that directly address the Bills’ real weakness—getting off the field on third down.
    • “The Bills’ problem is not 10 through 53 on the roster. The Bills’ problem is 1 through 9.” (Dan, 10:55)
    • Argues edge/corner is more impactful on third down than a run-stuffing DT.

  • Mike’s counter:

    • The inside of the DL does more than just stop the run. Internal disruption helps the whole line.
    • “I think you need a more disruptive defensive tackle… to open things up for Rousseau and Bosa on the outside.” (Mike, 27:01)

  • All agree: the Bills need “impactful players” up front and not just role-fillers.

• Cornerback

  • Consensus: the corner position is a major need, regardless of the Tre’Davious White signing (one-year, low risk).
    • “It’d be like saying… signing Joey Bosa means you can’t draft an edge rusher… You need as many as you can.” (Dan, 12:33)
  • Discussion of the Bills' preference for smart, coachable corners over just athletic ones.
  • Elam’s pick is dissected as a “panic pick”—the team put too much stock in measurables over fit/instinct.

• Safety (Wildcard)

  • Significant debate on whether a safety at 1st round makes sense—“self-inflicted personnel problem” given they drafted Cole Bishop last year.
    • “If the Bills took a safety in the first round… I’d just be stunned.” (Dan, 19:14)
    • “You’re creating a personnel problem, a self-inflicted one.” (Dan, 19:37)
  • Jenna and Mike allow for some logic if the staff doesn't view Taylor Rapp as a long-term answer.

• Wide Receiver

  • Surprisingly less focus compared to defense.
    • “I think the reason we’re not talking about wide receiver as much is because they need the other positions even a little bit more.” (Mike, 53:00)
  • Group consensus: it would still be a major win to get an impact WR (e.g., Luther Burden), but edge, CB, and DT may trump WR in round one considering roster needs.
  • Dan, half-joking:
    • “I don’t have the capacity to get hurt again… I sold out last year and I’m broken.” (Dan, 54:14)

4. Draft Movement: Trade Up, Down, or Stand Pat?

• Strong expectation the Bills trade down rather than up unless a drastic opportunity presents.
  • “More likely to me is move back.” (Jenna, 60:09)
  • Mike: “I don’t think there’s any question. More likely is to move back, which I hate.” (Mike, 60:11)
• If they do trade up, Minnesota (25) is the likeliest partner due to the Vikings’ lack of picks.

5. Player Profiles & Fit

• Several prospects named as likely “Bills types”:
  • CBs: Trey Amos, Quinyon Mitchell, Cooper DeJean
    • Likes: Instinctual, willing tacklers, versatile, special teams.
  • DTs: Kenneth Grant, Walter Nolen, Alfred Collins
  • WRs: Luther Burden (as a “bigger Diggs”), Ja’Lynn Polk, Malachi Corley
• Attention paid to high-floor, scheme-versatile, and “mature” players.

6. Draft Philosophy: Traits vs. Scheme Fit

• Mike: “The first trait I think they believe for corners… is up here. They want corners to be smart and able to learn and read and understand… They want their corners to be thinkers.” (Mike, 40:00)
• They stress the front office will not pass up amending missteps—if they don't see growth from Cole Bishop or others, drafting over them is justified.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Trading Up/Down:
  • “If the Bills are not on the clock by 25, they’re not trading up.” (Dan, 57:36)
  • “There’s some struggles over the last couple years to get good players early… In my opinion.” (Jenna, 37:30)
• On Defensive Line Debate:
  • “The biggest way to affect these quarterbacks is to have better corners and to get to the quarterback by an edge rusher.” (Dan, 25:23)
  • “You need good defensive line. That’s what you need… Don’t get so lost in the sauce of, ‘We need a one-tech.’” (Dan, 35:41)
• On the Old Guard/New Contract Players:
  • “You hope Joey Bosa is a Pro Bowl caliber player. You’re paying him to be an impact starter right now. You hope Tre White is a starter and honestly in a perfect world you’d hope he’s not.” (Dan, 13:27)
• On Draft Night Anticipation:
  • “When he [Bean] moves back, it’s crushing. Because you’re sitting there all Thursday night… and now you’re like…” (Mike, 61:01)
  • “Trading up has not been great, but that doesn’t mean you stop doing it.” (Jenna, 61:30)
• Running Joke: The sweltering studio leads to repeated jokes about “hot yoga” and “Barry class,” ending with, “No, Jeff, the hot yoga session is not hot yoga. It is Pilates.” (Mike, 67:16)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

| Segment | Timestamp | |--------------------------------|-----------| | Opening/Preview | 01:13 | | Bills’ recent first-round struggles | 02:33 | | Inside the Bills’ draft board | 04:36 | | “Starters not stars” philosophy| 06:11 | | QB class unpredictability | 07:48 | | Justifying/criticizing positional needs | 10:55 | | Why CB/Edge are higher priority| 24:23 | | Defensive tackle debate | 27:01 | | Corner evaluation philosophy | 38:49 | | CB criteria—instinct, IQ discussion | 40:00 | | Elam pick/panic and lessons | 41:16 | | Wide Receiver need revisited | 50:55 | | Trade up/down dynamics | 57:36 | | Hot yoga banter & closing | 67:16+ |

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“Best, Worst, and Wildcard” Draft Scenarios

Best Case

• Trade down, collect more picks, and address top needs with quality starters.
• Draft an impact CB or Edge, then fill DT and WR in Rounds 2 and 3.
• Example: Get Trey Amos or Kenneth Grant.

Worst Case

• Forced reach for position over BPA and miss on meaningful impact.
• Draft a safety in the 1st, causing personnel logjam.
  • “If the Bills took a safety in the first round… I’d just be stunned.” (Dan, 19:14)
• Miss out on top CBs by moving too far back in a trade.

Wildcard

• Bills buck trends and take a WR if a top talent falls (e.g., Burden).
• Drafting a left tackle or tight end unexpectedly.
• Potential for a trade up—though viewed as unlikely this year.

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Final Thoughts & Predictions

• All anticipate the Bills will likely trade back (reluctantly), loading up for value across multiple positions.
• Candidates named for the top pick: Trey Amos (CB), Kenneth Grant (DT), or edge rusher if the value aligns.
• Age/maturity concerns about prospects generally dismissed—production and fit matter more in this win-now window.
• The crew emphasizes the need for impact and "violence" on defense, less so for glamour picks at WR.

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Conclusion

This episode expertly balances draft philosophy, team need, and specific player targets in a chatty, engaging manner. The hosts manage a nuanced, at times humorous, but always insightful build-up to the Bills' most pivotal draft in recent seasons. Fans are left with a clear picture of each possibility—and plenty to argue about on draft night.

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Transcript

[A]

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[C]

Limited availability pickup through participating Hyundai dealer in select markets. What is the Bill's problem? They can't get off the field on third down. Does a defensive tackle impact more that more? Or does an ad rusher who can sack the quarterback or a cornerback that can cover a receiver on third down?

[A]

So, Dan, I will say that I believe you have a lot of passion with your point. I believe it is a bit reductive. Why are you looking at me like that?

[C]

I don't know what that means. This is the Buffalo plus podcast brought to you by Connors and Ferris.

[B]

Welcome, welcome, welcome. Hello.

[C]

Thanks for everybody that was here super early.

[B]

Yes, I did love the comment from every letter ever. Credit to me for being here seven minutes early.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

All right. Welcome to Buffalo plus, presented by Connors and Ferris, Mike Catalana, Dan Fates. I am Jenna Cottrell. Please be sure, comment, subscribe and share. You know how much we appreciate it. We're talking NFL draft, the draft tomorrow. We're going to get into what we expect. The Bill's philosophy, guys that we have seen that have piqued our interest. There's going to be a lot of discussion as well. We were all in the sports office together earlier on today and there was, I felt like we, honestly, Dan could have already been doing the podcast then.

[C]

Yeah, we had a mini podcast.

[B]

We had a.

[C]

We had some hot takes to get off our chest.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And something concerned me a little bit in that conversation.

[B]

He's ready, Jenna.

[A]

Non stop.

[B]

Don't you even dare.

[A]

Now, Dan and I have a lot of takes. We want yours. We want your takes. We are going to be following your. Your comments here. So we want to. We want people to respond. That's what we want.

[B]

Yeah. So in the chat, let us know your comments, your questions, your concerns, and we will get to as many as we can as we like. We talked about, talk kind of about the draft, where the Bills are at and what we expect. All right, so first things first, Michael, what are your expectations as we stand about, you know, 25 hours away from.

[A]

Night one early in the draft, Bills have to do better. I'm not going to be too hard on last year yet. The Bills have already done that. Based on what we've heard from bean and from McDermott on Keon, they need him to be better. Josh talked about it yesterday. Is talk to Keon. The best thing that could happen for this team is a Keon comes back a better player. They need it. Dalton Kincaid is a. Is a good football player. They need him to be better. These are the guys. They made moves. They made back. They made a move to go up. And the other guy they moved up with in the draft before that got traded to the Cowboys. So this is where it doesn't mean it has to be a superstar.

[C]

Correct.

[A]

Gotta be a starter. Gotta be. And I know those guys start. I'm talking about starter plus.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Is what it's gotta be for this team.

[C]

Yeah, we'll get into that. That's part of one of the questions or the comments that we wanted to raise is how much of a hit does Brandon Bean need? Especially in this first round? Because like you said, his last three first round picks have left some of my friends texting me going, what do you guys. What are you hearing? What are they doing? Because I'm anxious and I think, especially as a fan, I understand that. And then it's also being not being scared though, again, because maybe there is an opportunity again to move up and make a move, because two out of the last three years he's traded up and last year he traded back twice. But I expect some wheeling and dealing.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

But there is that sense of urgency, of, hey, this is the biggest draft of Brandon Bean's career. Because that is always how it works.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

When you're an NFL gm.

[B]

Yeah. The biggest one is always the next one. And obviously, as we stare down round one tomorrow, we were in Orchard park earlier on this week, and Brandon Bean kind of talked about his philosophy, and I thought this was an interesting note of something he had to say about how the draft board is made and what kind of goes into everything for this team.

[C]

My board, it's not the scouting board, it's.

[A]

It's the Buffalo Bills board.

[C]

There are not every player is ranked exactly how I saw. There are times I'm like, you know what? I'm the minority in the room. You know, it's painful sometimes.

[A]

Like, man, I like that guy more.

[C]

But it's like 85, 15 the room.

[A]

And.

[C]

And I'm hearing them out and I'm like, all right, better be right, though.

[A]

No.

[B]

I do love that. Better be right, though.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Well, I think sometimes the consent and sometimes when we talk to fans, they're like, well, it's Sean McDermott making the picks. Or it's, you know, it's not that it is a consensus. Obviously you rely on the scouts and Brandon Bean is constantly in conversation talking with the guys. But at the same point there is. It's not just only Brandon Bean's thought process that goes into a player.

[A]

He gives Sean homework. He did say that he didn't use that exact phrase, but he says, I give him a list of players, the guys that. And that's why you pay the scouts. Right. These guys are boots on the ground. A lot of cases they are there, they're watching them all year. And it's hard to do with the way college football is now. Then you come back to Sean and say, these are the guys and Sean's very good football guy and he wants to know the type of player. And it is a consensus when you build that board and I do believe they have to stay that way. But at the end it is Brandon Bean's call.

[C]

Yeah. And it's also tough because especially going into this draft, we've talked about it before, Jen and I are going to repeat it to sound smart over the next three days.

[B]

Yes.

[C]

Because we didn't come up with it. But it's the amount of content that we have consumed to be educated on topics like this is that you will not see as many blue chip players or prospects in this class where you. Where scouts and analysts say, hey, this guy is going to be a stud. There's maybe there feels like. There's the consensus too that Travis Hunter is going to be a phenomenal player at whatever position he is, and Abdul Carter and then everybody else is kind of. We, they're going to be good. So think of this draft as starters, not stars. That's how you want to look at this draft. There are plenty of starters, especially in this draft, that could make impacts in Buffalo next season.

[A]

Now, I did just check with the league and they got back to me. I asked, is it still possible to find a star past the first three picks? The answer is yes.

[C]

Breaking news.

[A]

Yes, there are guys heard it here.

[C]

Are you in the building, though?

[B]

No, we were in the building yesterday.

[A]

We were in the building yesterday. Yes, we were. Yeah. And I. The reason. Oh, here we go. Matthew says, I'm fine with Coleman being number two. This is for, for Dan because he says he could be Better than Gabe, at least. Lol.

[C]

I'm going to bite my tongue. For what? For that one. But yeah. And like we were talking about it a little bit before too, is kind of the broader picture of this draft and understanding it's very unique in the sense of not just the lack of blue chip players, but where the quarterbacks will or will not fall and where they go.

[A]

So Ward's going to go one. I think everybody knows that. Right. So Cam Ward goes number one from that point on. I don't even know. I guess you could bet this. I don't think it's a guarantee that Shador Sanders is the second quarterback. I think he will be correct. I don't think it's like a guarantee.

[C]

Yeah, he went from like minus 1600 to like minus 2 25.

[A]

Right. So moving back and you're right. And when the quarterbacks. Like last year was quarterback heavy. It was a pretty good quarterback draft. Like there's some pretty good ones in the draft. It. It does the nice thing. When you're a team like the Bills, it just pushes the other really good players back. That's not happening this year. You can be excited Bills fans when the Patriots go on the clock at four, unless they've made a trade to move up because they're only at 4 because of that big, big victory they got over the Bills in the last day of the regular season. Then they fired their coach 15 seconds after the game ended and they went from one to four. Now, even though you're not taking a quarterback, imagine being at one and you turn around and say, come get it. Yeah. Or you say to Tennessee at 2, you want the quarterback? I'll trade him to somebody else. They swipe, they swap, you get an extra number one. They're not getting any of that. They're going to draft a short arm tackle with their first pick. They are. That's what they're going to do. So you know short arms.

[B]

Dan has thoughts.

[C]

No, we were just talking about it. Like, yeah, like Will Campbell has his. Historically those. That was so mean.

[B]

That was mean.

[A]

And you interrupted him.

[B]

I haven't said like eight words this podcast.

[C]

So I. What do they say in the house? I give back my time towards. To the lady from Saratoga.

[A]

Gentle lady. They say that sometimes we know that.

[C]

Will Campbell as a short wingspan, short arm length, even though it measured completely different at the combine and his pro day.

[B]

Yeah. Which is interesting that they had two. They said they used to have the same guy do the measurements. I liked this comment from Diangus they said, I think two out of three first picks needs to be impactful players this year. I think that's an interesting point because Mike, obviously last season you look at who was drafted and the impact and it was not a ton of impact.

[A]

Certainly in the playoffs it wasn't.

[C]

Yeah, yeah.

[A]

When you needed, you know, when everybody will always say there aren't rookies anymore.

[C]

Right.

[A]

Right towards the end of the year, they didn't get a lot. Now they still have a very good team. They won a ton of games. They were home in the playoffs until the AFC championship. I know they had a lot of success, but you need these players. And that's why I say they've done well in other parts of the draft and they've gotten quality players. But you know, it's like they need Cole Bishop to step up. They need, you know, Dalton Kincaid to step up. Like these guys have not shown to their draft level what the Bills need them to be.

[C]

But that's also where Jen and I have been on In Agreement the Fact, and I'll say it again, and we've said it in multiple podcasts here, the Bill's problem is not 10 through 53 on their roster. The bill's problem is 1 through 9. That is where they come up short. Because dudes, because when you take Josh Allen off the roster and you say who else would other. Who else would start on other playoff teams in the afc? It's a short list. So that's where. That's where it is. I guess I can see the Bills making a move if one of those guys. And Bean says, obviously we don't have 30F first round picks, first round draft grades.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

If they want to make a move and they think there is one of those blue chip guys in their opinion to make the move to be an impact guy.

[B]

I mean, BE has talked about how much variance and I feel like that's kind of one of the buzz things going into this draft is just how differently graded so many guys are. You see in mock draft, sometimes they go in the first round, sometimes it's like late second, even third. And you don't usually see that type of swings between players. So I do think that that is something that's interesting. The fact that the bills are 30th once again, they're really back there. So I think, I think it's hard for us to predict what they do because there's just so many options with how far back. We don't know how the board will fall.

[A]

Eric DiPietro says, Does picking up Trey White have an effect on spending a high pick on cornerback? We're going to talk about the cornerbacks in a little bit, but I would say no, not at all.

[C]

Not at all.

[B]

No, it, it should not.

[A]

No. Because it's a one year deal, only a few million guarantees.

[C]

It'd be like saying, I mean it's different caliber of players but it'd be like saying Joey Bosa. Signing him means you can't draft an edge rush.

[A]

Right.

[C]

Like you need, you need a one year deal. Yeah. You need as many of them as you can.

[A]

Actually, it's a pretty good comparison.

[C]

Well, one person's hopefully in the prime of their career and one person is on hole 15 of 18, the back end.

[B]

Yeah, that's fair.

[A]

I think they're more similar than you would think. Only because actually both have been all pro players. No, honestly, both thinking about it, they've had injuries.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

That has really derailed them.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

They have played exceptionally at times and they're both here on one year deal. So I see what you're.

[C]

There's different expectations.

[B]

That's fair. Oh my God.

[A]

Just like you two things just.

[B]

Yeah. You hope on purpose.

[C]

You hope Joey Bosa is a Pro bowl caliber player. You are paying him to be an impact starter right now. You hope Tray White is a starter and honestly in a perfect world you'd hope he's not.

[A]

He's not the starter.

[B]

The expectations are different.

[C]

That's, that's where I'm talking about in the back nine of their career.

[A]

And Eugene says White is finished. Come on. I don't know if he's finished. I know they don't think of him as a starter. They said he can will compete for it.

[C]

Yep.

[A]

He may end up there early in the year depending. But they are drafting, they need, you know, they've got three picks in the first two rounds. They need to get a corner and that corner will be targeted to start on the opposite side. That doesn't me off Benford. That doesn't mean it's day one. That doesn't mean you don't need a veteran there until the kid is ready and whenever that is. But believe me, if that rookie comes in and he's ready to go, he is going to start on that other side 100%.

[C]

And I've said this before about other positions, whether it's demar Hamlin. If demar Hamlin starts, that's more of an indictment on Cole Bishop than if Trey White starts. That's an indictment on whoever the Rookie that comes in it. So. And the one thing I. They Bills always talk about and it's. They stress it time and time again, getting the right kind of people. And I can't express enough how Trey White is that type of person. He was the first pick in the McDermott era and wanting to help turn that process around. You could probably find better cornerbacks in the market. I'd argue right now you can't find a much better person than, than Trey White. And I remember sitting down with him right after Covid. Mike.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

When we did the interview and I sat down with him about he was a high school quarterback and his kind of journey and all these things. Right. And the one comment I knew that stood out to me, the one remark he said was, he finds more joy in his career. This was again three, four years ago in helping other players. It was Dane Jackson, Levi Wallace, those guys. He goes, I've had the All Pro. I've had my accolades. I now get more joy out of getting you. These guys, their talent and their recognition, their flowers. That to me is what embodies Trey White at this stage of his career. And what being a McDermott is the type of guy they want him to come in.

[B]

Yeah. But also I think they know the upside that he can have, and that's the hope is what does he have left in the tank after the injuries? And I mean, Bean even talked about how at the back half of last season, you saw a player removed from the injuries, like looking more like himself. So to me, it's like, is there any found money there? Are you going to find a. You get a guy that you know is a great addition to your locker room, will help mentor younger players. And also, is he able to play at a level that is higher than what most guys that you're signing on the. The week of the draft would bring you.

[C]

Yeah, it's a comfy pair of jeans you've had for a long time. You know, they fit well. And then you're like, oh, 20 bucks.

[B]

Yeah, this is a happen to me.

[A]

Yes, I, I agree. I think his knowledge of the defense allows him to play better in Buffalo than in other places.

[B]

Thousand percent.

[A]

So I believe that that helps. It would be great if Trey could play.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I will. No, I will say this. I know Bean said that about later in the year. I don't know. I don't know that he's saying he looked a little bit better. He did. It was rough in la, was not great. But he's back home. He's comfortable. And this defense is one he knows extremely well. He's worked with, certainly with Benford. It is funny, he talked about talking to Micah and Jordan.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

All the time. And he did say if they won a Super bowl last year, he'd expect an honorary ring, which is pretty funny. So now he can try to go get one. But yeah, I think it's.

[B]

It's a low risk, high reward move.

[C]

And the. And the contract says it.

[B]

I was to say the. You know, essentially what the floor is. You're not expecting him to be. He could be the starter, but you're not like he is the day one starter. Whatever.

[A]

I hope he's not like you said, I hope he's not the starter.

[C]

Same.

[A]

I hope that's fair. And by the way, same somebody just said about we're going to talk corners. Said about Trey Amos, I would trade back at a third round pick and hope Trey Omos is available. You watched my mock draft.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

I worry about trading back and still getting your guy.

[A]

All right, well, we'll talk corners.

[C]

That's my biggest fear.

[B]

Okay. Well, I. There was a comment earlier from TR that said I don't like our safeties. And if you look at some of the mocks, they do have the Bills taking a safety, which again, I think would say a lot about what they see in Cole Bishop and what they see out of him. But do you think that is a possibility in the first round, realistically?

[A]

Yeah, I think it's a possibility only because when you are sitting there and if there is not a really smart move to go back or other teams sitting there that aren't as interested in coming into the first round for whatever reason. You know, we always talk about that fifth year option for. For teams to move there. If you're sitting there, you say to yourself, who's the best player that's available on this list? Now, I know what Dan's going to say because he told us about it in the pre pod that if you draft a safety, what do you got there? Because you have now a third safety. But. And where does that player go on the field? You're not playing more than two safeties. Right. So he's got to beat out one of the two safeties. And are you admitting a mistake with Cole Bishop already? I don't think so.

[C]

I would be shook if. If the Bills took a safety in the first round. And there are a lot of people that are way smarter than me and analyze players and have mock drafts and that's been their career and More than a few have Malachi Starks, the safety from Georgia, mocked to the bills at 30. And I would just be stunned.

[B]

Really. But why?

[C]

Because you're creating a personnel problem. A self inflicted one. You spent a second round pick last year on Cole Bishop and he's played a handful of games and they always talk about you need time to learn the system and all that stuff and then you're already pulling the rip cord. Because if it's Malachi Starks, he's a guy that plays Cole Bishop's position. Now if you're going to try and tell me that you're going to. And listen, I'm all for taking a safety because I don't know what Taylor Rapp, his injury history. He's only got two years left on his contract. Like, if you want to tell me that you want to upgrade the position, I'm all for it, but not there. I don't. It's almost like to me it was like trading up for Kincaid. Like when they took Kincaid, I was like, what? Was it nice? It was the fact of you had just paid a tight end.

[B]

They still did it though.

[C]

But. And they tried to change and they were implementing the system and they got.

[A]

Caught without getting a wide receiver.

[C]

Okay. Right. But I'm just saying there is that. That created a little bit of an issue.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

And you then had to change your entire system.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

So you're changing things. And again, it. To me, I would be stunned. I would. If they took a wide receiver at 30, I'd be like, all right.

[A]

Because you put 4 and 5 out on the field sometimes. The other thing I will say is I think the days of it being full on strong safety, free safety, and they play almost different positions. I think you can mix and match a little bit. I think you can have similar skill sets. And I think. I don't know what they think the long term hope is for Taylor Rapp either.

[C]

And that's fair.

[B]

That's why I could see them doing it. Because I think there's not the longevity out of Taylor.

[A]

What if they took Emin Yuri, who is bigger than Terrell Bernard? He's bigger than linebackers.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

He's a freak athlete. I do not see that happening.

[C]

Just because I think that a wide. I think a safety is very plausible in this draft. I think it could happen on Friday. I'm completely out if they take one on Thursday.

[B]

Now. Okay.

[C]

What were you giggling about?

[B]

Oh, no, my dad just texted me. My parents are in Boston and they. They told me their order for Dinner.

[A]

Oh, my God. She's so focused on her parents going to Italian place.

[B]

Italian place. Egg parm. Ve parm.

[A]

You see what we put up with?

[C]

Is it 97 degrees in here?

[B]

Yes. It's so hot in here. Honestly, that makes seem like the old man. I'm sorry. Yeah.

[A]

That's not constantly whining about how warm it is.

[B]

It's very hot in our studio.

[C]

Normally I wear a hoodie and wear. Was like, I'm just gonna go T shirt today.

[B]

Do you all have a wild card first round draft pick, Ryan Braunaski, Malachi Stark.

[C]

Yes. Yeah, there it is. That would be my most surprising position.

[B]

But plausible. I don't know.

[C]

Yeah. Okay. If you want to go like.

[B]

Like if they drafted a tight end, we'd be like, what?

[C]

No, it'd be like a left tackle. You'd be like, what?

[B]

I mean, that.

[C]

Yeah, that would be the.

[B]

That would be wild. Yeah.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

I can understand a lot of positions. I can get behind corner, I can get behind edge rusher, I can get behind defensive tackle. Even though I want to get to that in a little bit. Receiver, receiver, all those things. I really can't get behind a safety in the first round.

[A]

A lot of people commenting that a draft of a safety is more of an indictment on rap than it is on Bishop. And that player would replace rap. And I don't disagree with that.

[B]

That's fair. That's fair. Okay, man.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Which also. This is darts.

[C]

Is more. Is a more. Yeah.

[B]

This is the reminder that follow what they do, not what they say, because that will show you how they feel about a position group and maybe a specific player.

[C]

That'd be a young back half of a defense.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

It doesn't mean the 32nd pick has to start right away.

[B]

Yeah, well, they love doing that. All right, where do we want to go with position now? Oh, this is perfect. Nicholas Younger saying DT is my priority. Priority.

[A]

A lot of talk about, oh, Dan's off the DTS already. He's done. He's saying no defensive tackle. Right?

[C]

Yeah. I just tweeted out right before we came on here my list of position rankings for what I would want. And to me, it 11 and 2 or 1A and 1B is. Is corner and edge rusher. And whatever you don't get, you know, like your first three picks, if you got a corner in the first round, early second round, I'd want the edge rusher. And my big point is this. There's all this talk that the Bills need a one technique defensive tackle. And whether that's Derek Harmon, whether that's Kenneth Grant, some of those guys, which I don't think they're there. Harmon may be there. I really don't believe Grant is there at 30. Well, my big point here is this.

[B]

Would.

[C]

Do the Bills need to improve their running defense? Yes. And what a big one. Tech defensive tackle do that? Yeah. Their job is to eat up double teams. Yes. But who has. How have they gotten beat in the playoffs? They've gotten beat by Mahomes and Joe Burrow by throwing the football. So if the Bill's defense, rushing defense, goes from 20th to 15th because you got some player, I think their overall defense. What is the Bill's problem? They can't get off the field on third down. Does a defensive tackle impact more that more or does an edge rusher who can sack the quarterback or a cornerback that can cover a receiver on third down. What is more impactful, in my opinion, and to me, you can get a large defensive tackle that can eat up double teams and just be a big body to free up at Oliver on day three. I am really passionate about the biggest way to affect these quarterbacks is to have better corners and to get to the quarterback by nad Drescher.

[B]

That's fair. He's so passionate right now. I can tell.

[A]

So, Dan, I will say that I believe you have a lot of passion with your point. I believe it is a bit reductive.

[B]

Ooh, interesting. Also, someone says, wolfgang, my name's Jenna. And that's fair. That's faulty. Okay, go ahead.

[A]

Why are you looking at me like that?

[C]

I don't know what that means.

[B]

What do you think it means? Reductive.

[C]

I was.

[B]

Context clues. Like it's. I thought reductive.

[C]

I thought it meant repetitive, but it's. No, but it's not.

[B]

Think about what does reduce mean? Like shrinking. Yeah.

[C]

Smaller.

[B]

You're making. You're making it too Simplified. Simplified. Thank you.

[A]

So I didn't mean to throw you off there.

[C]

Did you see my face?

[A]

Yes.

[C]

It was a deer in headlights.

[A]

Okay. So, by the way, now we know why Dan sweats in the podcast. It has nothing to do with his clothes. It's words that throw him off. The reason I say this is because you speak of it as in the D lineman affecting the run game. Because it's this idea of the one technique, the guy who's got to play more of a nose tackle and all. I believe the game has changed a little bit. I believe edge rushers are still very important, but you need impactful Players on the inside of your defense, it isn't always sacks and pressure. Pressure. It is more pressure. It is more collapsing the middle to open it up for the outside.

[C]

Yep.

[A]

I think you're looking a bit for a unicorn if you think you're just going to find this one tech and you're going to set him there. I think put a really good player next to Ed Oliver. It would help Ed Oliver, no disrespect to Daquan. I think Daquan's best time is done. He can still play there and maybe with less snaps, Daquan could become a little more effective on the early downs.

[C]

Yep.

[A]

But I think you need a more disruptive defensive tackle. So I wouldn't just say to your point, and a lot of people have said that, oh, they need this guy for the run game. I think you need a guy to be impactful on the inside to open things up for Russo and Bosa on the outside.

[C]

And. And my rebuttal.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Oh, good.

[C]

Nailed it to that is you have that disruptive defensive tackle, that's Ed Oliver. Like you have. So for people that are like, you need a defensive tackle, like you need the pressure up the middle to affect the quarterback, it's Ed. You. You have that. So if you need somebody to be. Oh, breaking news. Damn. That would have been my comment. That was my. That was a good.

[B]

That would have been reductive.

[A]

Yes.

[C]

Repetitive. Yeah. The point is, is that you have created this system where you have a small undersized defensive tackle that is supposed to be the penetrator. Like, that is what Ed Oliver is supposed to do. And when Oliver is at his game, that's exactly what he does. It was the Detroit game. Right. He had 11 quarterback pressures or whatever it was. And Sean made the comment that like, oh, whenever you guys say he can't do it, you pissed him off. And then he was great. Keep pissing him off. Like. But then why do you need to waste the first round pick? Like, if that's what you want is a guy to eat up double teams and if that's the case, get any good defensive tackle. Don't limit yourself to a one technique.

[A]

So if Walter Nolan is available, are you. Do you not want Walter Nolan on the team? I think you would want Walter Nolan.

[B]

Absolutely.

[A]

Right.

[C]

But this thought of like, there's very few one technique defensive tackles that also are pass rushers. It's Dexter Lawrence and like Vita V. Everybody else, their job is to be the fire hydrant. Like to get. It's the fire hydrant the dog show. It's the. The. Who said that? Former Bill Phillips. Harrison Phillips.

[B]

Oh, Harrison Phillips.

[C]

Okay.

[A]

Said what D tackles are.

[C]

That's what it, that's what it is. So I think you can get a fire hydrant on day three and allow Ed to do what Ed's supposed to do. That's. If you're somebody that wants and is their heart is set on A1 tech, that's fine. And I, I can't even explain the X's and O's to that level of extent. I know their job main job is to eat up double teams to free up linebackers and other edge rushers. But my thought is you have a defensive tackle that is supposed to affect the quarterback. If you want a guy that just stops to run, I wouldn't waste a first round pick on it.

[B]

My thought back though is there's a lot of depth on this defensive line in terms of the draft. So I feel like the, the ceiling is higher early on. I know like that there's depth there, but like wouldn't you want to get a higher rated ceiling player? Do you know what I'm saying?

[A]

You're saying is as opposed don't take D line in the first pick because there are multiple defensive.

[B]

No, I'm saying like there's so many good ones, why wouldn't you go get them? Now I get what you're saying. There's a. There's the supply for you to wait.

[A]

Right.

[B]

But I guess it's just you say like at all. Like, wouldn't it be great if Ed Oliver was playing next to a guy that was really good? Like wouldn't you be better than one? Do you know what I mean?

[C]

Yeah, if the Bills had all good players, that would be.

[B]

But I'm saying like, I don't think that's a knock for not having a defensive tackle. Like, I think Ed has played well, but I think he would want him to be even more disruptive and by having a guy next to him that he can eat up double teams or do whatever to free up Ed. I think that would also give you the pass rush that you want or at least impact that in that way.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

I don't disagree. It's the fact of people's infatuation with the one Tech.

[A]

Yes.

[C]

And kind of eliminating other defensive end defensive tackles saying, well, this guy doesn't fit here. Like maybe Dwayne Carter is that guy. Maybe Dwayne Carter ends up being somewhat of that rotational piece.

[A]

Well, they think he can be.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

At least thought that so?

[B]

Yeah, I guess. Wouldn't you want like you've seen Ed's obviously undersized. So wouldn't you want a guy that can kind of like balance out that and then like I said, just free up 100 to have that ability?

[C]

100.

[B]

You also invested a top 10 pick in Ed Oliver. Don't you want to see him?

[A]

And you paid him again.

[B]

And you paid him again. And I think we've said that Ed has had a nice Bill's career, but you would absolutely as. What was he eighth overall? Like you want him to be that guy. And by helping him out, I think that would allow him the opportunity to develop even more.

[A]

You know, and I wonder like a lot of people have like Grant. Right. They think that Grant because of his size and Kenneth Grant because he is that guy. The closest thing you would think there, run stopper, the third down. Bane even talked about that. Like you want guys that can be out there on third down when you need pass rush. You can't have a guy out there who's not going to impact the pass rush at all. A lot of times with these players, this is all they've done and you read about them and you think most of the scouts are thinking at some point the disruption on passing downs can come. I'm not saying he's got to be great from day one, but he can't wait three years for him to become.

[C]

Yep.

[A]

We talk about how the Eagles have done in the draft. They drafted Jordan Davis, big tackle. He's a first and second down player that hasn't gone anywhere past that. And he's got Jalen Carter in there.

[C]

Yep.

[A]

He's a big. More of a one or a three, more of a three technique, I guess guy that would be. They're probably not going to give him the fifth year option because he just hasn't. Maybe this is the year to do it. So, you know, then there's. Then you can wait if you want to wait.

[C]

There's Alfred Collins.

[B]

I was literally just about to ask your thoughts on.

[C]

Yeah, I like how massive 7, 360.

[B]

I like Al.

[A]

I don't know if he's that high. The last thing I saw it had him in the 3 forties. I still considered a 2 down player. But you may be, maybe, who knows you may be able to get him with your second pick in the second.

[C]

Right.

[A]

As opposed to taking a guy like Grant at 30.

[B]

I like Kenneth Grant though.

[C]

Yes. I just don't think he's there. I don't think he gets Past and that's fine.

[B]

And yes. We won't know.

[C]

Right.

[A]

And it's Michigan, the Chargers. Right.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Yeah. So I don't think he most of the mocks I've seen but again, I just look at it too as like, what is the Bill's biggest Achilles heel? It's getting off the field on third downs. They had been actually like historically good on first down and had been historically bad on third down.

[A]

But your point about even with Mahomes? I never think of it with Mahomes as he's back there, he's got all day. He's chucking it 30 yards down the field. He is beating you with smart, relatively quick decisions that he does. And I. We've. We've watched it. It almost feels like he can get there even before your outside pass rush.

[C]

So a corner would be great. That could cover.

[B]

That's fair.

[C]

I mean I hear you so that's why.

[B]

But what do you think? What do you think the Bills do? I hear what you're saying about what you want and I hear what you're saying about what you want. But what do you. What do we think the Bills do?

[C]

I think they want to improve their defensive line.

[B]

I agree. I completely agree.

[C]

I think they very starts up front.

[B]

You can hear like what they have to say in terms it's in the trenches.

[C]

I think the Bills very badly want to improve their defensive line. Starts up front line of scrimmage. I think they've nailed the offensive line. I think that bean hasn't done it yet on the defensive line. I think that that's part of it.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

So I. That's where I can see them going for an edge rusher as and I'd be totally fine with that. I mean they, they have to be better on the defensive line. There were times when they got out physical outmanned in that spot. Daquan Jones football's a man whooping another man and they got. They got whooped.

[A]

John Spiller, I think Alfred Collins at 66 3, he's is 320, 35 inch arms, blocks, passes a difference maker. Even if it's a difference maker early on. I do think it does help you. But when we talk about value, you know, I love Darius Alexander.

[C]

I love that man too.

[A]

I want to see him get him. I think they can get him in.

[C]

The versatile can move. And Mike and I were joking around about, you know you talk about and he made an Eagles analogy because he had to because obviously I don't know if you guys know this they won the Super Bowl.

[A]

Now, I have not even mentioned that.

[C]

Totally. But it's the fact of the defensive line and all these things and oh, this guy fits here and this guy fits here in this system and all that stuff. At some point too, wouldn't you just put out the best four edge pass rushers on the defensive line and say, just get to the quarterback, figure it out? Like, so we sometimes get so sad and maybe that's on the most, most adamant and passionate about is like, don't get so lost in the sauce of like, we need A1 tech. We need A1 tech. You need good defensive line. Yeah. That's what you need. You need guys that can stop the run, some guys that can. A large human being would be nice to pair alongside. It's the basketball like you were talking about. If you have a small shooting guard, you better have a big point guard. Yeah. Because otherwise you're. You can't match.

[B]

That's like with Ed Oliver, though, he's a bit undersized, so you want to have a big body, but you've invested in Ed.

[C]

So like you, that is where it gets to. So like you've made your bed and you've created this system.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

I don't think you're pulling the, the plug on it now.

[B]

No, I agree. That's why I'm saying I could see them going D tackle because you did invest in Ed. So give him the tools and the player next to him to help him.

[A]

And it's not just the position. Like Eugene says, that D line, I can't remember his name. He said D line from Florida. He's over 400 pounds, so there's a probably zero tech for you or one tech. Just put him over top of him. Yeah, but just because he's that guy doesn't mean like he's that guy.

[C]

Like Chris Jones lines up everywhere.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Chris Jones lines up at the end. He lines up over the center. He lines him over the guard, but he's disruptor. Yep.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Hey.

[B]

And a second round pick.

[A]

Yes.

[C]

Get good players. That's the hot take from this, this podcast, this live show.

[B]

There's some struggles over the last couple years to get good players early.

[C]

Yep.

[B]

In my opinion.

[A]

So. And Andy says Bean will find a trade and get a third. That's, that's. I think if you move back. If you move back.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

And try to pick up a third.

[C]

But the fear is, is when does that run on cornerbacks go. Okay, so let's talk about it.

[A]

We're going to Talk about. We can talk about. Bean said about corners.

[B]

Let's talk about it.

[A]

I asked Bean yesterday. So we're, this is. We're live here on. Well, I guess because some people would be watching this tape on Wednesday. I asked him on Tuesday. When you're evaluating corners. We know the Bills are a zone heavy team, though. There's, you know, a lot of people thinking they're bringing in some.

[C]

A lot of people.

[A]

There's a lot of people. A lot of people are saying it, that they'll play more man. That may be the case. But they are his own heavy team. So I asked him about evaluating players to play either man or zone. And if a player in college, like all of a sudden you look at a talent but you say this guy played a lot of man, how do you evaluate that he can make the adjustment? It didn't happen great with Kyrie Elam because they thought he could. But here's what Brandon Bean had to say about evaluating players in a different scheme than the Bills use.

[C]

So you're trying to dig in why the school didn't play them that way. It may not be the player's fault. It may be that's just the way that, that defense that coach wants to play and you get around the kid and sometimes that's where we'll do a private. We'll go out there, send the coach out there and get on the board with them, give them some things and watch their movement, how they would, how you would play them. It's still projecting.

[B]

Oh, yeah, yeah.

[A]

It's still. It is. It's a projection. Because it did not work with Kair Elam. He's a.

[C]

Well, there's again, I think what Bean is talking about is traits and fit.

[A]

Yeah, but there is, you know, it's. He, he went into a whole thing about like, why, why is the player playing a different position than you would see him? And sometimes it's just what that team wanted to do, what that coach wanted to do. It doesn't mean he can't do it. But you need to figure out because that's why I think the Bills, the first trait I think they believe for corners, obviously there has to be a certain level of physical ability is up here.

[B]

I disagree.

[A]

They want corners to be smart and able to learn and read and understand. The reason I bring that up is it's a skill in his own defense to know how to know the positioning, how to run players from your spot to the next spot, how to work with your safeties. Like there's Guys who could play man because they're physically gifted and they are just that good at it and they use it. But I do think they believe they want their corners to be thinkers.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You disagree with that?

[B]

Well, no, I feel like with Kair, they didn't think about that. I think Kair, they saw someone opposite of Trae White that had the length that could be. Be a bit more physical, could be an athlete. And he wasn't able to. Like you said, he wasn't as instinctual as you needed him to be. So maybe now again, the pendulum usually swings back. You're going to go for guys that are able to digest and look at a defense and be able to figure things out. But Dan is pensive. Yeah, tell.

[C]

You heard the Notebook.

[A]

He did, he did.

[B]

But that doesn't mean he's instinctual. I think he was a better athlete.

[A]

And they went through different coaches. You know, the first coach didn't like them. I'm talking about Butler.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Roy Collins said. I still believe Elam was a panic pick.

[A]

But they.

[B]

They did trade up to get him.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, I'm with you on that one.

[B]

So that's. But yeah, but they did trade up to.

[C]

Yeah, I'm with Jenna.

[A]

They traded up because they were like.

[C]

But they traded up two spots.

[A]

Yes. That's what that Chiefs had already traded.

[B]

Ahead of him to get Trent McDuffie.

[C]

Yeah, it still doesn't make sense to me.

[A]

Yeah, I. Oh, no, I'm not saying. I think you're right. It does. The pick itself did not make sense. I think they were like.

[B]

No, I think the pick made sense because he was a little bit. He was a taller guy. He was an athlete. He had the pedigree. His dad played in the league. Like, the knock on him was that he was too handsy, like a lot of flags. Obviously you saw that to be the case. I think they saw an athlete and they thought they could mold this guy into the corner they wanted him to be. But unfortunately he didn't have the instincts. Instincts. Excuse me. That I think were expected of him and he wasn't able to learn the defense in a way that you have to be proficient enough to do to succeed in this defense.

[A]

I agree. The only reason I say it's like they got corner on their mind. Best player available. They needed a corner. They thought they were going to try to get McDuffie. They didn't get him. They're like, oh, boy, there's only one corner we have ranked in whatever position. So I think he was on Their board. I think he was relatively high on their board, but it didn't work because there are a lot of corners to look at in this draft.

[B]

There. There are, yeah.

[C]

I didn't know if you guys had a player that you would have been or maybe a position. I know we've kind of talked about it. That you would be kind of stunned by. Like, for me, the guys we talk about the instincts and what they look for in a corner. Like, Maxwell Harrison would be the one guy that I would be surprised if they went there because of he's not a very physical corner. He's undersized at 511, doesn't tackle well.

[B]

It's the tackling for me, so, like, it's the tackling.

[C]

So, like, that's the one where I'd be like, what? Like, they went. They went corner like I was hoping, but they went the guy that I didn't think fit their system in scheme and philosophy. So I didn't know if there was enough. Like, I even think Revel would be fine. Like, I know he's a little bit of a risk.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

But I think he can play.

[B]

I like Tommy Hill, too. Plantar fasciitis. He didn't play for a little bit because of that, and I don't know what his status is with that, but I just saw what. What he. The guy, he was from Nebraska. I was like, I feel like this could be a fit. But going off of what you're saying, when I'm looking. When I'm looking at draft, like, prospects and player profiles, I'll read so much and I'll be like, nah, this guy is not a Bills guy. Hairston. I was like, this guy is not a Bills guy. To me, at least. Yeah, but you're right. I could definitely see other players. I mean, I know you guys like Amos. Amos.

[A]

Amos, yes. Or Trey, as some others call him. I think Revel is more of a man corner, but he fits the rest of a Bill's mode. Listen, you don't think of your corner as being a tackler. You want them to tackle. You want them to commit to it. It's sort of like one of Dan's favorite things. It's sort of like blocking for a wide receiver. They need. No, they need to be able to do it, and they need to commit to it. Right. But if you got a guy who can really cover.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

You just need him to show the right effort, be in the right spot and be in on the tackle. Like, hey, fellas, I need some help over here. But get there. It's great to be a good tackler, but you need him to be the corner first and foremost.

[C]

I always remember talking to Rasool Douglas and he had made a couple of tackles early on in games early in the season. Edge. I remember the one against the Dolphins because it was right in front of me. Sweep comes around the end, he sheds his wide receiver, comes down, cuts the def. The running back down. And I was like, man, that turns a second and 10 into a third and 13. Like that's a massive play. And I was like, hey, do you think you're under respected with your tackling ability? You're known as this ball hawking corner with all these interceptions, you know, do you like tackling? And he was like, I hate it. He's like, I don't want to say, I don't want to do it at all. And he's like, but the coaches tell me I gotta do it. And it was like, respect. Like you, you like this is gonna suck. I'm gonna take this guy on and it's gonna hurt. But like that's what the team needs. So the one guy too that I was thinking about, Trey White, hear me out. Because a lot of guys, if you're a really good corner in college, you play man, like the, I mean you're just that athletically talented like a kair. But Trey learned so much about the scheme and the fit and the system. So to your point Mike, like it is something too about between the years because you have to have the traits to be a man to cover one on one and say I got this guy. But you also, like you said pass them off. This is my zone read. Like I don't know, like I. Yeah, like the great corners, you know, Stingley, like they're good enough in college to just play man, like and then they have the ability to learn, adapt into the system and be coachable and then all of a sudden they can play anything and it disguises coverage.

[A]

Taron Johnson was an outside corner.

[C]

Yep.

[A]

In college.

[C]

Yep.

[B]

Where'd he go?

[C]

Weber.

[A]

Yeah, Weber State. Yes.

[C]

He got drilled with a football at the combine.

[A]

Combine. Yes.

[B]

Yes. That's so true. Another Bills guy that had something happen. Sorry.

[A]

Somebody fell, didn't.

[B]

Yeah, can't remember.

[A]

Okay, somebody's gonna put in the comments. Yeah, but look at the transition they had him do. Yeah, they put him in the slot.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Like they had to look at him and go, can he make this transition? Not only did he make the transition, now this wasn't a first round draft. Pick. Now you make the transition. He's one of the best slot corners in the league, so there are guys who can do it. That's the reason I like Amos so much, is he has the experience in the zone. He's a willing tackler. He's played special teams. I just think he fits the Bill's profile of a corner.

[B]

Could definitely see that.

[A]

I mean, he's the size the 611 95. I know you were talking about Will Johnson.

[C]

Yeah. This is very interesting because I think a lot of people, he's the cornerback from Michigan, thought for sure he's going to be a top 10 player. The way that he played. I mean, he has comical numbers. I mean, he's got like, Christian Benford numbers where it's like, hasn't allowed this pass and all this stuff. Then all of a sudden you start to see medical coming out and he starts falling and he kind of starts falling, and people are. These are red flags about his knee and things like that. I saw mock draft today from somebody I very well respect. Didn't have him going in the first round. Peter Schrager had him going 28. I texted one of my friends and I was like, hey, what if Will Johnson is still on the board? He's like, if he's still on the board at 20, I would reach up to him. So I reached out and the one person said, like, his knee is a massive red flag, that it is a cartilage issue to some respects. And those are kind of ticking time bombs. So some people don't have him going in the first round. I've seen other mock drafts that have him going, at latest 13 to the Miami Dolphins. Like, that is how wide of a spectrum that is for this guy to go from 13. Some people have him going to the saints at 9, possibly, and then you have other people that don't have him in the first round.

[A]

Isn't it wild that you think about the mindset of your GM or your head coach when you're making decisions? Like, let's just say Johnson, they look at him and go, like, after five years, you don't know what he's going to be. And you got a GM in a spot that's sitting there going, I don't know if I'm going to be here in five years.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I'm not kidding when it comes to this.

[C]

That's what Bean said.

[A]

Well, you say like, I need this guy and I need him today. And I hope his cartilage holds out as long as is. But Like I need him. He's the best player. I'm going to take him.

[B]

Or, or you could look at of the window is now and I need a guy that's going to be locked.

[A]

Down corner for if the, if the medicals on Johnson are. Might be an issue there. That puts Bean in play for that. Only because of what Janet just said. It's like the guy right now, he's.

[C]

He'S a student like his, his tape, all of those things. You watch his film from Michigan and you go, he's a top 10 pick. Like there's no question. And then all of a sudden you start to see more and more about it fascinating in that respects of, of what. What could be there. And the only other reason I wanted to bring that up is my one last thing that I had was more likely to trade up or trade down in the first round to you guys.

[B]

Okay, wait real quick. There's a really good comment and then I think we can get into that. Okay, so Stephen Jordan said, can you talk about why there is no emphasis on wide receiver? Palmer is cool and all, but we had to trade mid season last year for, for a wide receiver and we're worse off now than then. I think that's actually a very good comment because we really haven't talked about wide receiver all that much. And honestly, it was interesting yesterday. Josh Allen came out with the everybody eats hat established 2024 bean. Did you ask Bean about everybody? No, sorry. It was John Scott who asked.

[A]

I asked Josh about it.

[B]

Yes, but John Scott asked Brandon Bean about essentially saying like, yeah, if there's a good wide receiver there, we're gonna take it. And it's not just because everybody eats. Like that's a nice mantra, but we're still out.

[A]

I think it's a good point.

[B]

Yeah, I, I do. But it is interesting because, yeah, like you hope that Curtis Samuel is more healthy and plays better, but Mac Hollins is gone. What are you gonna get out of Keon in year two? You just paid Khalil Shakir, who's done very well for you. But it be silly not to say you want to add another guy that can add to your wide receiver group.

[A]

Well, that's what I asked Josh. It's like when you look at Shakir's numbers, they were pretty good. Unfortunately, on the Bills, as great as the overall offense was, they're not spectacular wide receiver numbers. But he was, you know, 25 more catches than everybody, 250 yards more. If he takes a step up, let's just say It's Khalil. Let's say they bring in a wide receiver to help. But Shakir's numbers go up to 95, 100 catches this year and 1100 yards. Is it still. Everybody eats. If one guy's eating more than everybody, I don't think it changes the mindset they want for the team. Yeah, but you better believe. And Bean did say this, you better believe if all of a sudden. And I'm just use Shakir as the example because he's already on the roster and you've already paid him. If Shakir just takes off this year, goes from being a really good player to a great one, they're not going to worry one little bit about throwing him the ball a ton.

[C]

No.

[A]

And him putting up big numbers. So everybody eats is nice until you get a guy that warrants.

[B]

But my. The point is also, though, of like, why haven't we talked as much about wide receiver? Because I think that is an excellent point of like, that hasn't you. Did they figure it out last year? Yes, they did, but you lost guys. Okay. You bring in Palmer. What's he gonna add? You still want top tier players? Like, what are we talking about here?

[A]

I'm gonna let Dan talk because it bothers me, though.

[B]

Sorry, I'm getting tripped.

[A]

Can I just. I'm gonna say one quick thing off of Jenna. I think the reason we're not talking about wide receiver as much is because they need the other positions even a little bit more.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I think that is like that. Defense needs youth and playmakers.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

And I do believe that's. It's not like there's a spot. It's not like they got. I mean, they got. They need. They need basically almost at all levels. They need some help. They. They're okay at edge.

[C]

He said it was going to be something quick.

[A]

I know they're okay at edge. They. They need a young edge. They need a tackle.

[B]

They need violence.

[A]

Yes. And they need a corner.

[B]

Never thought I'd say that.

[A]

But there are wide receivers out there that I believe could step in and play a considerable role on this team.

[B]

Well, yeah. And Again, I had C.L. shakir leading the Bills last year in terms of yards, and that was great. Oh, you just. Thank you. Yes. But it's like, what else are you going to do? You need to continue to add because you got far, but you need to go farther.

[C]

Do you know why we're not talking about it as much about the wide receiver needing it?

[B]

Why?

[C]

I don't have the capacity to get Hurt again. I don't have it in me. I sold out last year. I sold out last year.

[B]

Meanwhile, I'm like, I'm ready to get hurt.

[C]

I, I, I sold out and I had my heart broken and I don't have the heart to, to be back up and, and to, to buy into like all these wide receivers. I've been hurt too many times. I was banging the wide receiver drum for three years and we're like, well, at least if they don't get the top guy, they'll go, they'll come out of the draft with three of them.

[B]

We said at least two, and they didn't.

[C]

And I'm, I'm broken. I'm a broken man.

[A]

How about this? With the 30th pick, they traded to.

[C]

The Chicago Bears for no.

[A]

Oh, my God. Oh, my God.

[B]

God.

[A]

Could you imagine? With the 30th pick, the Buffalo Bills select wide receiver Luther Burden. Missouri.

[C]

Love it.

[A]

I like him a lot. Yeah, I know. He's a diva. Yeah. First of all, there's divas and then there's. You're coming into Buffalo with Josh Allen. Like, could we get three good years out of him? Yeah, I think the guy is, I, I think he's a, a exceptional talent. Doesn't mean he is going to be a superstar, but like, that kind of player runs through contact. To me, he looks like a bigger digs.

[C]

Yeah, I'll be great. I'm just not going to get my hopes up and sit there and say, hey, at 30, you know what they could do? I'm not.

[B]

But this is what, this is what men do when you don't want, when you expect them to. They don't. But then they'll, they'll be like, oh, you know what? I did this.

[C]

Oh, here are the flowers. Like, oh, yeah, I did it.

[B]

I, I wouldn't be, I would be happy. I'd be like, all right. They, they fixed a. That is absolutely a need.

[C]

Massive.

[A]

And isn't it. It's also a numbers need. Right. I mean, you lost from the guys who dressed every game.

[C]

Cooper, Hand, Mack, and you replaced them with Palmer.

[B]

Palmer.

[A]

So, yeah, from a numbers perspective, they need an.

[B]

Let's see some speed.

[C]

I've heard this. It's just so painful to hear.

[A]

It's just.

[C]

It'S just, it's too soon. It's just, it's just too soon.

[A]

By the way, you know, they could draft a Jordan Phillips. They could draft a Kyle Williams. You want a speed wide receiver? Is there a Josh Allen in this draft?

[B]

Oh, My gosh.

[C]

Also, if the Bills do trade up, and that's the other thing, too. We were talking about making the moves and things like that, because these players are viewed as not one. It's like there's a shelf. Right. Like, it's not like, okay, after this pick, then you get the next tier and the next year, like, after four or five, they're all kind of the same. So, yeah, if you're going to make a move, it would have to be a big move because the, the gap between talents and. And what their rankings are in the views of, you know, talent is not that much in between two or three picks. Like, you would just wait because there'd be no point in giving up the draft capital to move up to gain a guy that's just a little bit better. But if the Bills are not on the clock by 25, they're not trading up. So the two.

[B]

Two spots.

[C]

The two spots that they can make moves to is Denver at 20 and Minnesota at 25.

[A]

Denver at 20. That would cost. Yep.

[B]

I mean, Minnesota only has four picks.

[C]

Only has four picks. Minnesota's trading back. Like, they're going to trade back. They need more players.

[B]

Yeah, but everyone knows Minnesota needs picks.

[C]

Right? So. But that's the thing is that, like, hey, there's. There's the mark. Is that if they're not. I just don't see the Bills trading up to 27. I. I don't see anything like that kind of a move because the gap between the 27 player you have on your board and we gotta go in a different direction because I don't think the, The. What you're gaining is worth the cap. The draft capital it would take to get back up there.

[B]

I agree. And you also have so many needs that you can use a different.

[C]

I'm.

[A]

I'm just a little lost there with. What you're saying is, like, what if you can't get up to say you wanted to go to 20 and Denver's like, nope, we're not making a move. And that player you want. And just for the argument here, let's just say it was a wide receiver and it's golden.

[C]

Okay.

[A]

Okay. And now you're sitting there at 25 and he's still on the board. You wouldn't make a move to 27.

[B]

I hear you. I think it depends on the price.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

I mean that, you know, that their mind triggers at a certain point. They got their eyes on certain players.

[C]

And then they go like they're. I think those spots are teams that also have bigger needs. Like, I. You know, what I'm saying is that, like, the two most obvious spots are 20 and 25. That's what I'm saying, is those are the key spots. And so are you going to give up a full arm and a leg to move up two picks?

[A]

It's not. I mean, you. You're going to give up, I think, to move up. When I was doing the mock draft, I had one calculation to move up to the Rams. The rams were at 27, 26, 27. And it cost the bills of fourth.

[C]

Okay. Yeah, that's fair.

[A]

So, I mean, yeah, I think. Yeah. But I don't know. Is there a wide receiver they would move up for?

[B]

I love golden, but again, he could go to Dallas.

[C]

He could go to.

[B]

I don't expect them to, but, yeah, I don't expect them to get a wide receiver with the first pick. I expect them to go D line. All right, what was your thought? Whatever.

[C]

No, that was it.

[B]

No, it was a move up, move back. Oh, is that.

[C]

That was it.

[B]

Oh, okay.

[A]

So more likely. We never really said. What's more likely.

[B]

More likely to me is move back.

[A]

Oh, I don't think there's any question. More likely is to move back, which I hate.

[C]

So here's my only thing. Oh, we've talked a lot about teams wanting to move back. Right. That's what I want to get more picks. And we've talked about, oh, like, there's more teams at the end of the first round, teams that want to get back in, which makes it more likely. But are there teams in the teens that want to move back? And the Bills would want to move.

[A]

You know, I'm saying a lot of capital.

[C]

I'm aware, but I don't think there's a play.

[A]

I don't think there's a player. Me, maybe if you think Will Johnson or somebody is. I don't know if there's a player in this draft that you're going to move up 15 spots to get.

[C]

Agreed custodian.

[B]

Okay.

[C]

Y' all right there, Jenna?

[B]

Yeah, I just got. I was confused.

[A]

So he's. When he moves back, it's crushing. Because you're sitting there all Thursday night, and now you're like. And then last year, you move back, trade with the Chiefs. We've already determined that. I'm gonna have a Chiefs fan in the comments that'll say we're in your head. Yeah, no, Sherlock. Yeah, yeah, you are, because the Chiefs have been the Chiefs. But you traded back twice, got out of the first round. Trading up has not been great.

[C]

You giggled.

[B]

Yeah. I mean, trading up has not been great, but that doesn't. That doesn't mean you stop doing it.

[A]

Staying where you are. You got Greg Russo. I think they were kind of stuck there.

[B]

I think that was kind of a.

[C]

Yeah, we're gonna pick my hot take. Sorry, I just got distracted and I found a note that I had. It's a really good running back class.

[A]

No, they're not taking a run.

[C]

Not in the first. Not the first. Whoa, whoa, whoa. There could be one on. On Friday. There could be a running back on Friday.

[B]

Could see that.

[C]

And then the message is clear. There ain't no.

[B]

I love James so much that I drafted another.

[A]

So I. I clipped Josh's comment about Cook and saying, hey, like, I'm not the gm, and he referred to him as James. And people were commenting, oh, oh, he didn't call him Jimbo. Jimbo. Oh, my gosh.

[C]

I also had so many, though.

[A]

He does.

[C]

I also had so many people in my mentions because I tweeted the clip of that. He didn't know that Trey White was there. People like fake news. There's no way he didn't know.

[A]

There's no way he didn't know.

[B]

There's no way.

[A]

If somebody texted him, even if he's off social. Hey, we just signed. It's Trey freaking one.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Yes. He knew.

[B]

That's crazy, Dan.

[C]

He knew.

[B]

I think that's his subtle way of saying he's not on social media as much anymore.

[C]

But also, do you think that was like 20 bucks from Kevin Kearns to be like, hey, if you tell this story. Yeah, like, I do think Josh is that kind of guy.

[A]

Somebody asked, how many first ground grades do you think Bean has? I saw one. I think it was it Tony. Pauline, one of the reporters, had a thing that said Bean has. The Bills have 12 first round grades on players this year. I don't know if that's the case. I would say he didn't say it. He always says, I don't have 30, which I understand. And he made the point, Janet, that you were talking about where. It's the Bills board that we talked about. So some of it is based on them. I would say it's in the teens, max. I would say it's probably closer to 15 somewhere in that range.

[B]

Yeah. So.

[A]

But that doesn't mean your guy isn't there.

[B]

That's also true. That's true.

[A]

Oh, by the way, what did you say? More likely trade back. It is it's more likely. I know, but it'd be more fun if they.

[C]

Hell of a lot more fun.

[A]

Sucks.

[B]

I just hate it. It's so boring.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And then the next day you're just like, well, they could go in this direction or that direction or whatever. Predictions.

[C]

Staying put at 30. Trey Amos.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Trading back. Getting Trey Amos.

[B]

Boom.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Alfred Collins in the first it. I'm not saying the first. I'm saying trading back. We already talked about trading back, getting.

[A]

Him in the second round. Darius Alexander. I don't care if he's 29 years old. I think the guy can play 29.

[B]

So young. What are you talking about?

[C]

Age is just a number, right, Old man.

[A]

I'm sorry. By the way, I do want to. I do want to add one thing here. It is really hot.

[B]

Thank you. Thank you.

[A]

I was like. I was like, it's fine. And then I was like, it's hot in here. But I didn't want to admit it was kind of.

[B]

This is very big of you. Yes, you did have a take about the ages. Do you want to get that off while we're.

[A]

All they were talking about. Who is it? Amos. That's 24.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

I don't care if he's going to play corner for this team four years and then he's still really good and you re up him on a deal before his fifth year option or you get him in the second round just like you did with Benford and you move him on and he's your Corner until he's 31 years old. Let's go.

[C]

My take.

[A]

Sign up for it.

[B]

I want to trade my change my pick to Kenneth Grant at 30 or trading up a little bit.

[C]

Okay.

[A]

I could see them, too.

[B]

Yeah. All right. Sorry. I had to get that on the record.

[C]

I. My thing about age, I. I don't care about age. I just don't want that to be used as an excuse to. When you draft a player and they're not good and then you go, hey, they're young. You didn't just find out how old the guy was when you drafted him. That is part of the risk when drafting a young player.

[A]

And to the point of that it is Josh Allen's prime. This team is this close to the super bowl, okay. And I'd rather have the guy that's 24 but can contribute and is maybe more mature. Wait, I'd rather the maturity comes from playing at Alabama or Michigan or that. I'd rather.

[C]

Toledo.

[A]

He liked Toledo. He hung around Toledo for a while.

[B]

Action I'm gonna pass out.

[A]

Stephen Burns says. Stephen Burns says.

[B]

I had to put up my hair.

[A]

Burden can't run a route. I don't think that's the case.

[B]

Is this Mike's hot yoga session? Jeff Peterson.

[C]

That's not the case. Burden didn't have a quarterback or an offensive system to throw him the football beyond the line of scrimmage last year. He's really fine. He's a great wide receiver that can do a lot.

[A]

Okay, so, Amos, Pop says Elam is still young. That is true.

[B]

Again, there are reasons.

[A]

God, there's so many words of wisdom that I've imparted on you.

[B]

Do you know what I say to myself every single day? What pisses me off is what Mike told me, do what you have to do now so you can do what you want to do later. Literally putting away laundry anyway. And I was like this, mother. You were right. But yeah.

[A]

No, Jeff, the hot yoga session is not hot yoga. It is Pilates.

[B]

I'm gonna make it Pilates slash bar.

[C]

I thought it was ber. It's B A R R E. Correct.

[B]

It's bar.

[C]

That was a berry class.

[B]

I love you so much. Oh, my God. Oh, that's. That's so rich. Okay. All right. Anything else?

[A]

All we want to say is be with us tomorrow. We will. Come on. You know Jenna's going to be itching to talk early. That's the way she is. We'll be up well before the Bills are ready to pick to sort of set things up, because you never know when they're going to make a move. So we'll be up live so you can follow along. And they do the same thing on Friday when they have two picks. Who knows? They may have three picks on Friday. Like, we don't know what's going to go on.

[B]

So that's an old timer. Thought it was Barry.

[C]

Thought it was Irish.

[A]

Pop said that's the open. Look at that. We got contributors.

[C]

Okay, Cyrus Torrens.

[B]

Thank you so much, everyone for watching. From Mike Catalana and Dan Fates. I am Jenna Cottrell. Please be sure to, like, comment, subscribe, and share and join us tomorrow on the draft or day one of the draft. Like Mike talked about. We'll have plenty of coverage. Thank you so much for joining us. We'll catch you next time here on Buffalo plus, presented by Connors and Ferris.