A (2:31)

And J. Sean had the famous line.

C (2:34)

In that there are players on this roster.

B (2:36)

There are players on this roster.

C (2:37)

Incredible sound bite.

B (2:38)

I remember I almost lost it because Rex famously said, is this thing on? Because it's about to be. And then Sean answers his first question, goes, is this thing on? And I remember being like, oh, my gosh, it's happening again.

C (2:50)

So.

B (2:50)

So it would be very fitting if.

A (2:52)

Joe Brady gets up there and goes, is this thing?

B (2:54)

Is this thing on?

C (2:55)

That's funny.

A (2:56)

What do I expect? I. I think it's going to be. It was contentious in the last news conference with. And that was mostly because of Terry Pula and some of the things that he said. We don't hear from him very often. I don't think we're hearing from him in this news conference. Maybe he's there to introduce Joe Brady. I don't think he's taking questions and he probably feels like he needs to take a break from doing that. What will it be like? I think it'll be more of a normal news conference setting. I think Joe Brady will look the part and feel the part like he's going to be a head coach. Like, we see him a lot of times in T shirts and shorts. He's going to be in a suit tomorrow, right? I would think.

C (3:38)

I would imagine it is funny, though.

B (3:43)

Suit up top, shorts on the bottom. He had the sport coat, the button down and the shorts and Jordans.

A (3:49)

Yeah, that'd be very good wearing.

C (3:51)

He will definitely be wearing Jordans.

B (3:53)

Yes.

A (3:53)

And look, I think we've been a little critical of the move in general because of the way it was set up. But in. I'm happy for Joe Brady, like, this is a massive moment for him to step up there as a head coach at 36 years old, head coach of a franchise that he's been part of for four years. So in that setting, different than what we saw when that was more of about a firing, it should be at least in tone to begin a celebration of the coach. And then from that point on, Dan, it's just questions about what we're expecting them to do.

B (4:27)

I expect it to be forward. Moving press conference. The Bean Pula press conference felt rehashing postseason failures the biggest picture of hitting the proverbial playoff wall. I think Joe Brady will instill what we're doing moving forward. What I want to accomplish going forward. Brandon being talking about what he wants to do to make changes moving forward and supporting Joe Brady in all of those things. I hope and expect it to be forward thinking, not revisionist of where things came up short. I'm sure there will be questions about because, because you're already kind of hearing it of like was Sean holding back Joe's offense and was Joe. Was this Joe Brady's offense or was this Joe Brady's offense to fit with Sean McDermott's philosophy? So I expect it to be some of that, but I expect the majority of it to be moving forward. What I want to bring, what I want to instill his vision as they were kind of talking about what wowed the Bill's brass was the CEO vision that he has moving forward for the staff and moving forward from top to bottom.

C (5:33)

Yeah, I am curious about the tone because I, I do agree. I think it'll be like Joe very happy for him what he will sound like as the new head coach of the Bills. But I do think that there will be questions after that of like, what went into this move? What was the interview process like? I'm curious if it will be asked or if it will be answered. Like how much Josh was involved and what that did look like and how much input he had on the decision. And I'm also curious if Bean will like, hey, this was. This was my call or and take like complete ownership of. Of the. The decision. I, I think it will be though it's going to be a tone setter for this new era. But I do think, I agree. I think for the Bills and for it to. To land the way they want, it needs to be about the future and not looking back on the past.

B (6:24)

Remember, press conferences, especially for introductory introducing a head coach, they're not always easy to win. And I mean that in the sense of you don't want to stub your toe, you don't do. That's kind of what I was thinking. Or you know, some coaches that have just kind of made I even think about Dan Campbell of biting kneecaps. But that did, to your point, set the tone for what we're going to try and be. It's almost like you just don't want to have. You actually just don't have a viral clip. Like you just want this press conference to be smooth. You want it to be. And again, you can do that by saying what we want to set and what we want to establish moving forward and kind of avoiding that because like I said, the press conferences I think we see around the league a lot that, that really like, I don't think I've ever heard Kevin Stefanski talk like, like, you Know, like, I don't remember Kevin OConnells introductory or Sean McVeigh's.

A (7:24)

Right.

C (7:24)

Like, those ones so true.

B (7:26)

Like the bad ones get remembered. And again, you can lose an introductory press conference and win the rest of it. Like, wasn't Sirianni's really weird?

A (7:34)

It was during COVID He was talking to a empty room of screens and. And it went poorly. And two years later, he won the Super Bowl. So I guess just like Dan Campbell, like, he got criticized a lot.

B (7:47)

Yes.

A (7:48)

For that news conference. And he turned the franchise around.

B (7:51)

Yes.

A (7:52)

He's got room to do it, but more. But he turned the franchise.

C (7:55)

I think the huge benefit, though, for Brady is he already knows what Buffalo, what Bill's mafia. Like, he can read the room because he's been in that room. So I think he can hit the right notes in that way. And I do expect, if he does come out the way that we expect him to and we've. We know he's a good talker, that he can kind of win people over and have it be this fresh start of, okay, maybe you didn't like how the Bills handled this situation, but Brady is a different guy and there will be a new set of coaching decisions made based on that.

A (8:28)

That's a very fair thing to say because my criticism of it was not specific to Joe Brady. Like, Joe Brady as a candidate is a good candidate. If he was coming from another place, he would be like, wow, this guy had an mvp. He had a number one defense. He's got the experience in college. Like, okay, he's been around. He's been a play caller, and now you're making him the head coach. Our issue, at least my issue, was more of the message they sent when they fired Sean McDermott, which led you to believe that it was going to be a sweeping change. And it wasn't. Yeah, but I also, first of all, I was going to say a question. I want to know if Joe's had any Contact with Sean McDermott. John McDermott hired him with the Bills. Sean McDermott promoted him with the Bills. Probably we will hear that Sean McDermott didn't want him and didn't want to promote him, because we're going to find out everything was Sean McDermott's fault. And that's the part I understand a little bit of them wanting to set a narrative. The blaming of Sean McDermott at a certain point needs to end. This is about. You've already blamed him in the biggest way possible. You fired him. He's out the door. The only Connection he's got right now is you're still paying him a lot of money to sit at home. The next step is all about Joe Brady. So to Jenna's point, it's like he's been in the building. He knows. But to me, he does owe a little bit to Sean McDermott. And now you replace the guy when he gets fired. I'm just curious if they've had conversations what he thought about it because it was a big move to get hired by the Bills and an even bigger move to get the OC job. And in the middle of a season, I'm trusting him to do that.

B (10:10)

Taking, you know, the 36 hours or 24 hours and not having my kids on my lap right now. Has I tried to, like we said, like you said in the beginning, decompress a little bit. And I think about at times where this offense felt stagnant this season. Right. And we've talked about whether the roster and the offense seemed to struggle at times this year. And both Bean and Brady got promotions from it. And trying to zoom out a little bit sometimes I feel like the national media, as we've talked about, looks at box scores, analytics, and doesn't see how much we see because we're so microscopic view of it.

C (10:51)

They're so macro. We are in the literal every day.

B (10:54)

Right. And. But at the same time too, where we talk about offenses being stagnant. You know what other offenses go stagnant at times? All of them.

A (11:01)

Yeah.

B (11:02)

And so it is something to say that Joe Brady has had a number two ranked offense in scoring and they were fourth in yards per game this year and all that stuff because I even think about the Rams don't score in every drive and they have Sean McVay. The Vikings struggle at times. Quarterback's a problem there to begin with. But like you look at some of these teams and I get upset when I feel like people are. Are helicoptering in and they don't. They're only looking at it from the 3,000 foot view. But then it's also like, I think we need to also sometimes take a step back and see it because. Because you're right. And you just saw what Denver did. They fire their offensive coordinator and Mike Lombardi, who for all we've seen from the outside, like great offense, Bo Nix, like this team on the rise, young guys, all these things. But they didn't want Davis Webb, it feels like to. To leave the building. So it feels like Davis Webb will get the promotion by the time you listen. Right.

A (11:59)

He's already interviewing with three other teams.

B (12:01)

Right. So that, that's kind of how it feels like. So I think that's how the Bills viewed Joe Brady. As you said, he, he went on six or seven interviews. He's been viewed around the league as this future head coach from his time obviously with the Saints, lsu. I kept, I, I'm very upset at myself. I kept saying he failed as the Saints offensive coordinator. He was the passing games guy with Sean Payton. Then went to lsu.

A (12:26)

Right.

B (12:26)

Then went to Carolina with Matt Rule. I was wrong there. So he failed as the offensive coordinator in Carolina. That's when Sean brought him in to be the quarterback's coach. So I was wrong there. He wasn't calling plays when he was with the Saints and I think I've said that a couple times now on the podcast, so just wanted to say that. So I guess that's where at times we feel, we thought there would be this big swing and at times in the fan base as well. It's felt maybe a little bit underwhelmed, but outside perspective maybe he wasn't as viewed as, you know, Yudinsky were across the league of like this whiz kid. But he's a really well respective offensive coordinator that has worked his way up through this organization. And I don't think Josh gave, I don't think Josh had final say and we may never know the truth in that. I think Josh gave his approval on a bunch of guys they interviewed. Nine guys. I think Josh may have said I like this, this, this and this. And then I, I'd like to think that it was Bean and Pula makes the final decision and not your 30 year old quarterback because that's a massive move for the entire franchise. I think Josh had to sign off on a couple of things, but that's just my thought of when I've had time to decompress and I sat there and I go big picture. We've seen Joe Brady's failures because we at times, in every offensive coordinator, every head coach, every defensive coach has had failures. But we look at it so much through with a fine tooth comb because we're in it every single day to zoom out and go, yeah, guess what? Every offense has struggled and every coordinator has struggled at times. So you'd like to think there will be still some change and we're already seeing some of that with coaching staff decisions as coaches are taking jobs elsewhere.

A (14:07)

Yeah. You know you mentioned about Josh Allen and him. Obviously he gave his approval of Joe Brady. I don't think they're hiring. I will say this about Josh, like, he gave us a. He was all in on Joe Ken Dorsey, then all in on Joe Brady. He was all in on Keon Day Ball. Well, I don't want.

C (14:27)

I don't know.

A (14:27)

I'm just saying I think that's a little. I personally, even at the time, I thought it was a little overblown. To me, it's like, here's a list of the guys. This is a guy we like. I.

B (14:38)

But that's how I think a lot of the decisions.

A (14:39)

Josh. Josh publicly is really supportive.

B (14:44)

Exactly. That's what I'm saying.

A (14:45)

But in this specific case, I think they would have known. I. There is something between pounding the table, saying, I'll only play for Joe Brady and saying, yes, you know, I can play for Joe Brady.

C (14:59)

Yes.

B (14:59)

Right.

A (14:59)

And so they make their decision. They can't make it that Josh decides who the head coach is. But. But he did. But he. He has shown like he was all in on Dorsey, all in on Brady, and now maybe all in on Brady again.

C (15:15)

I think the setup of expecting there to be someone outside of the building is why people also are having the reactions that they've been having, myself included, because I. I felt like that it was talked about hitting a wall and how different voices and all that. And then to have that and then have the promotion of someone already in the building. I feel like that disconnection is why people were kind of like, wait, what?

B (15:41)

Which is why we were surprised because it was. You hadn't gotten over the hump. You hit the proverbial wall. And Joe Brady. And like you asked Terry Pula about how do you separate this failure and success between McDermott and Bean.

C (15:55)

Yeah.

B (15:56)

How do you evaluate the failures and success of this offense that has also hit the proverbial.

C (16:03)

Because it is. Well, it is funny. People like, well, under. Under Joe Brady, Josh Allen's been an NFL mvp. And under Joe Brady, James Cook has led the. The rushing to like, has the rushing title. I'm like, yeah. And then under Joe Brady, Sean McDermott, like, Sean McDermott also was a piece.

A (16:19)

You know what I mean?

B (16:19)

So a lot of those things. And that's what I said. It's hard to. Where we talked about, like the practice squad, the, the Pula's comments. It's. You can view them.

A (16:27)

Yeah.

B (16:28)

Two different lenses.

C (16:29)

Yeah.

B (16:29)

Our opinion doesn't matter nearly as much as the owner and the president of football operations, because we are not in the building.

C (16:37)

Thank you. I do think. Yes. And that's why it's like, Joe Brady can be the answer for this team. And they're obviously putting these stock into that as well. But I just think the. The messaging of how we. We got here is I think, why a lot of fans are like, wait, really?

A (16:54)

Yeah. The way you described that just made me think of it this way. They talk about the voice, the voice changing. We thought, and maybe justifiably so, that it was the new voice coming in. What the Bills have done is create an atmosphere where it's about the old voice going out. It is about Sean not being there. That is the change they have made. If you look at it, Brandon Bean is there, Joe Brady is there. There'll be a lot of continuity. And I know Dan loves the word continuity because everybody thinks it's always positive, but their message about the voice changing, we thought it was going to be outside voice. It's eliminate a voice and then go from there.

B (17:42)

Yeah.

A (17:43)

So that's what. That's what they have done here, taking Sean out of the mix.

B (17:48)

Continuity is great when it works.

C (17:50)

Yeah.

B (17:51)

And then when it's not, it's, well, we got to change up. Right. Right. And then when. And then when there's too much change. Well, we need continuity. It's a fine line to try and thread that needle to find the success, to get over the hump.

A (18:04)

It's like they say about, we need continuity in the offensive line. We want the same five guys. Unless that guy really stinks, then you need a better guy, even in like, five minutes. Just put him out there and let him play. So, yeah, makes a difference.

C (18:17)

I am fascinated by how much, now that a day has gone by, like, the talk of. From, like, national NFL reporters, insiders about the alignment, how much it's. It's been focused on the alignment and how important that piece was and what that means. And did that strike you as. I mean, a lot of times it's. What happens is you hear it from a source and then that source tells other people. So that makes sense. That's the normal standard operating procedure of how things work. But I did think it was interesting, the constant use of alignment.

A (18:50)

So a lot of the national people, they have connections with the teams and then narratives that get out there and that the team would like out there. The Bills are not the only ones who do this. That's why when you see a lot of these reports, every team.

B (19:05)

Every team does this.

A (19:06)

Yes. They are very similar. It's like this guy crushed the interview. The one that struck me, when you talk about the alignment, it is the alignment of coaching and roster. Sean McDermott did not see that alignment correct. He did not think the roster was good enough. Now you can pin blame on coaching and I'm sure in many cases or some cases it was that. I think what the team sees in Joe Brady is a person who will appreciate the alignment of the roster. That's fair with his coaching.

B (19:42)

Yep.

A (19:43)

That's what they appear to want.

B (19:45)

Yeah.

A (19:45)

They want a coach that.

B (19:46)

And they think that's going to lead.

A (19:48)

To more success and it might be the case.

B (19:50)

Absolutely.

A (19:51)

Especially if the roster is actually better.

B (19:54)

That would help as well.

A (19:54)

Yes.

C (19:55)

I think that's. That's honestly the biggest piece going forward is what they do in terms of roster building.

A (20:00)

And those will be questions for Brandon Be.

C (20:03)

Yeah, yeah, that is.

B (20:05)

I was thinking about it too. The changes that we thought would be made in voices. Right. And you talked about how it's. It's a similar voice but it's in a different position now. Right. So you're going from a voice in the offensive room to now a voice throughout the entire organization. Do you think Bean makes changes in his approach in the sense of we have heard we're going to be shopping at the discount stores again and all these things. Does this make Bean more likely to max out a credit card? Does this make Bean more likely to make a splash which we've thought. We've been kind of waiting for the last few years and he's kind of stayed pat and he said he's not going to. The credit cards come due eventually and I. And he's always kind of felt and respected it. The fact of we're not one player away. I remember last year at the end of the oppress conference, he said that if you think you're one player away, that's a dangerous game to be in. Right. Do you think that he is willing to play that dangerous game and be more aggressive and make the changes with the alignment of the new head coach to make that splash?

A (21:21)

I would ask you that because at the deadline the Bills were reportedly going after Waddle from the Dolphins and the report was that they didn't want to give up the 26 first round pick. On the plus side, now I'm sure he's very happy while Jaylen Waddle is a really good player that they still have that draft pick to operate with this year. And I thought about that at the time because I was like, well, a lot of times if I didn't think. If Brandon Bean thought he was out the door at the end of the year I think you might be, you wouldn't really care if he thought, man, if I don't have something happen, I'm out the door. You wouldn't be as concerned about trading the 20, 26 first round pick. Yeah, you would have gone.

B (22:16)

Well, I love that. That was beans great line at the combine a few years ago was like, hey, if we, you gave up a lot to get Josh. And he was like, well, if we don't hit on Josh, I'm going to be without a job anyway.

A (22:26)

Right.

B (22:26)

Like, so it is a little bit of that, that sense of pushing your chips in at the right time to make things work.

A (22:34)

But Jenna, I'm saying is he's now in charge.

C (22:38)

I mean, yeah, I'm, if I'm being, I'm way more motivated because it is your ass on the line. You made this decision, you, you made this disruption and this could be the right move for the Bills, but you're damn straight I would want to be like, all right, we got to make this work. We absolutely need to make this work. Because you can't blame it on the other guy. The other guy's not here anymore. So for me, if I'm being, I'm like, I, I talk with Joe Brady. Looking at the draft, how can we best assess what players would be best in this system and get some game records, game players, weapons, all that stuff that the Bills, especially on the outside, we've talked about all season long. Wide receiver, having someone that is a legitimate threat, that can help take some stress off of Josh Allen. But that also makes everything else work so much better too. But it's, you got to draft the right guy, you got to sign the right players. But if I'm being, I am not to say that before I wasn't motivated, but extra motivated because this is his team.

A (23:36)

I also have to take a step back and see this a little bit from Terry Pula's perspective. If I'm Terry Pula and I have these two Alpha guys, Sean McDermott and Brandon Bean, and after a while they're both in my office complaining about each other because to some extent, whether it's specifically about the person or what that person is doing may not be as personal. It might be more work related after a while. I'm a billionaire. I get tired of that. Right? I am tired of it. You two work it out. It was probably said more than once. I can say this, I give Terry this. It's now aligned. Brandon, you got it. You come talk to me and you deal with it's.

B (24:23)

A really good point.

A (24:24)

And I don't think that's from his perspective. I don't think that's terrible because Joe Brady has also. I will say this in fairness. He's just starting. He hasn't earned the right to report directly to the owner.

C (24:35)

Yeah.

A (24:36)

He's a brand new head coach.

B (24:37)

That's a really good point, Mike.

A (24:38)

So I just look at it.

B (24:39)

Even though that's why John Harbaugh said, I've earned it.

A (24:43)

He's earned it. I have the cash, Shane hasn't.

B (24:45)

Yep.

A (24:46)

But in this case, as critical have we been of Terry because of the way he expressed it, that had to get old after a while. And that's on both of those guys, I'm sure. Now, probably one would tell you it's on the other, but that's the way it goes with arguments. So to have this alignment.

B (25:03)

It's like when we are arguing about somebody else on the channel, you know.

A (25:08)

Do you ever complain about me? Is it ever a reason?

B (25:11)

Never.

C (25:12)

Only the interrupting. Interrupting. And what do you have to do?

B (25:17)

Soccer stories.

A (25:19)

They better keep the content coming or Dan's gonna be out talking to. Because I think the Ratchet. What's our team called?

B (25:26)

Are they Lancers still?

A (25:28)

No, no, they're not.

B (25:30)

FC Flower City.

A (25:31)

We got a bunch of teams.

C (25:33)

I would say. I don't know.

A (25:34)

It's going to be out there soon. Hey, Sabers, way to go. We'll be up at Sabers soon.

C (25:38)

The driving. You're driving.

A (25:41)

Yeah. Dan's worse than me.

B (25:43)

That is erroneous.

C (25:44)

Sorry, that was my foot.

A (25:46)

That's all right. Yeah.

C (25:47)

What were we talking about?

A (25:49)

Just. Just.

B (25:49)

I think that's a really good point. I think that's a really good point. That eventually that wears on the owner. It's his team. And that gets to a point where. And it doesn't even. Also. That doesn't mean. That doesn't mean that it was a power play. That doesn't mean that it was a power play. It was Terry saying like. Like to your point, Mike, I'm saying.

A (26:14)

That contributed to it.

B (26:15)

I'm just saying.

A (26:16)

Yeah.

B (26:17)

Where you're saying there's two people that keep coming to you with frustrations and. And wanting to solve things. Now you have in. In one way that it can work. Streamlined kind of things. It's what Terry's done with the Sabers.

A (26:32)

Yeah.

C (26:32)

I just think also too naturally you're so close to winning that there's going to be frustrations. And then with not getting over the hump, there's going to be the pressure that comes with it. And with that, that can dissolve relationship. Like, that's just. That's how things work, especially in a high stress environment.

A (26:48)

And then for. That's why I said to. To move, you know, because we'll be at the news conference. I want to get my analogy in. I said it to you yesterday. What, what the bills did was if you watch the show, love it or list it. Right.

B (27:03)

Love that show.

A (27:04)

It's a good show, right? Yeah. So she's always the one that's rehabbing the place and the guy.

B (27:09)

And the guy always has an advantage because moving is so such a pain.

A (27:13)

It's a pain. Well, wait a minute. But though he's getting the new place, right?

B (27:17)

Oh, you're right. Sorry.

A (27:18)

He's getting the new place.

B (27:19)

Yes. He's got the uphill battle because the people got to move.

A (27:21)

They got to move. But it's all new. A lot of times it's got the stuff, right?

C (27:25)

Yeah.

B (27:26)

But she makes the house look brand.

A (27:27)

She does. But I'm always a little frustrated when they go, we're just going to stay here. And I'm like, oh, that's fine. But man, that new place looked really cool. I think that's the part now once you're back living in that new house and if it's done the right way.

C (27:41)

Yeah.

A (27:42)

You're happy. You loved it instead of listed it correct. I wonder was how those things work. I got to give them. They got to pay money. They're not doing it for free.

C (27:50)

No, they. They give them a budget.

A (27:52)

Yeah, but is that all their money? They're not helping them out at all. Oh, I got to be.

C (27:56)

Oh, you're saying they like the show is giving. Yeah, I would hope so.

A (28:01)

Anyhow.

C (28:01)

Would love to have lover listen.

A (28:03)

Right?

B (28:04)

So.

A (28:04)

And you're like, listen.

B (28:08)

I wanted to bring up one point. It was something that I talked to Jenna about before, and it was a page from a book. And again, this is if there's one thing I have learned over the last three months, three weeks, because this is really. Mike, you've been through a lot of these for us. When Sean got hired, it was 2017, I think we had been covering the team Jenna for a year, two years. We had one year of Rex.

C (28:35)

Yeah.

B (28:36)

Okay. So like this dynamic. And we have seen coaching searches that have happened from the outside in other perspectives of teams. First time it's really happened for us. And. And to see how it all plays out. And Bill Walsh, I mean, was he Belichick Before Belichick was that kind of how he was viewed.

A (28:56)

He was feel. Viewed as brilliant play caller, single minded. I mean, he. He tried. He alternated Joe Montana and Steve Young, and they were both. They're both in the hall of Fame. Looked at differently, but a little bit of. More of a brilliant science.

C (29:12)

Cerebral.

A (29:13)

Yeah, very cerebral guy.

B (29:15)

So what was Shula like?

A (29:17)

Old school football.

B (29:18)

Okay, so that was like Lombardi.

A (29:20)

And he made the adjustment, though, which is wild. From three yards in a cloud of dust to Dan Marino, four. That's what.

B (29:26)

Okay.

A (29:27)

That's what made Shula so.

B (29:28)

Again, trying to understand this for, you know, Jen and I going through the. And just kind of seeing the narratives.

A (29:34)

But you're talking about personalities.

B (29:36)

I'm talking about the dynamic of power and ego like we've never seen in the NFL. So. So here's this. So in Bill Walsh's book, In the Building of a Champion, he talks about. This is from one of the pages I just wanted to read just a bit. Bit of it. It talked about how at the top of the club, you have the owner. He doesn't. He doesn't have the knowledge. This is gonna be tough because I'm not a good reader.

A (29:59)

Do you want. Janet?

B (30:00)

No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. I. I want to hit this. I want to get this.

C (30:03)

Okay.

A (30:03)

Okay. Brace yourselves, folks.

B (30:05)

At the top of the club, you've got the owner. He doesn't have the knowledge he should. He has the knowledge of business. He made it quickly. He wants things to be done quickly without quite knowing how. In the middle somewhere is the GM general manager. Nobody knows how, why he's gotten to that position. He's firmly within the owner's comfort zone. He demands quite. Then there's a personnel man, often a frustrated player or coach. He justifies his position by sending the scouts out. And then there's the coach. He's in there with his assistance at midnight, looking over the film again and again, trying to figure out what's wrong. And while he's in there, the owner and the GM and the personnel men are having dinner over martinis, and they're discussing the team. The GM says, quote, look, we've got the best facilities and administration and schedule. We've set up every possibility to do the job. The personnel men says, well, we certainly have gotten the players. We had a great draft. And I know because I read it in the papers, look, everybody knows that so and so is a guard. This person's the quarterback. They put. They all put their heads together. What do we do. So they get a new coach, obviously in the GM's comfort zone, but not too much of a threat. The personnel man's going to side with the GM on everything. He knows where he got his job. So the cycle starts over again. Every seven or eight years, a GM is sped out and the situation continues to exist. Why tv? The hype? NFL Films, NFL properties? Well, it should go to the hype. It's a great sport, but it's tough on the coaches. That's from Bill Walsh, what he said in his book, which I think for the first time for. For me, understanding that dynamic of. Of the power.

A (31:34)

I think everybody in every job can relate to that in a certain way. Right. Salespeople don't get what we do. Right. The managers sit in their office and look at numbers and they don't do it. I do believe that is there. I do think this. I think coaches are just so different. And if you think about it, people don't usually go from coach to general manager. It does. It has happened. Right. It's not always, you know, but like you're. It's in your blood to be a coach. Right. And then general manager is a different thing. Now, I will say this. Even from Bill Walsh's time, the role of general manager has changed even more.

B (32:16)

That's what that was. The one like when reading that because.

A (32:19)

The rosters were kind of set, you pick these guys.

B (32:22)

Free agency was not.

A (32:23)

The agency didn't come around really until the later in the 90s where it was like first that plan B, free agency and all. So it was kind of like you add your guys.

B (32:32)

Yeah.

A (32:33)

You drafted him, you brought him in and then that was it.

B (32:35)

Not bad reading.

C (32:36)

That was actually real. That was way better than I was expecting.

B (32:39)

I had read. Read it over, like three times. Not as much as I read over the wedding ceremony script, but for a guy that's dyslexic, that wasn't. That wasn't too bad.

C (32:49)

That was really good.

A (32:50)

But, Jenna, you can sense that that goes on currently with coaches, too. And the way they. Even if they have a good relationship with the general manager.

C (32:58)

Yeah. I just think it's like what Dan alluded to in the book. It's, you know, like, perfect example for the Bills. Like Terry Pula and Brandon Bean watch the games together.

A (33:09)

Yeah.

C (33:09)

You know, and that's pretty common in terms of what the setups is like. Setup is like in other NFL teams as well, where Sean is on the field and so Sean is making decisions. Sean is also in front of the Media or was in front of the media. So much more like it's just a different dynamic. But obviously it's, it's, it's a different relationship because of that too.

A (33:30)

It's like if a guy comes home and his wife's been with the kids all day every day, and it's just dealing with everything. She's the coach. And the guy coming home.

C (33:40)

Yeah.

A (33:41)

He's going to grab the kids and go get ice cream. Kind of the general manager.

C (33:45)

I don't have children, but I'm like.

A (33:48)

I'm angry about, you know what I'm talking about. Dan knows right now. There's times you, you sweep in and it may be very helpful, but, you know, it's a lot easier on you. You didn't have hours. You just came in, you got them.

B (34:02)

Yeah, I come in and do damage control.

A (34:05)

Yeah.

B (34:05)

Like, I'm not in the trenches. My wife's the hero in the trenches.

A (34:09)

Right?

C (34:09)

Yeah.

A (34:10)

That's the coach. That's the coach. It is a lot. A lot.

B (34:14)

But when I raise my voice, oh, daddy means business. That's what it is. Renee yelling and me yelling. Two totally different reactions from the kids.

A (34:25)

Well, my mom used to always say, wait till your father comes.

B (34:27)

That was the worst. That was the worst.

A (34:30)

Father comes home.

C (34:31)

Thinking my dad running up the stairs after I like, slam the door is terrifying. Oh, my God.

B (34:37)

Anyhow.

C (34:37)

All right.

A (34:37)

It's just made me think of it.

C (34:38)

That is actually, I, I think that.

A (34:40)

Is a. I'm on a roll today.

C (34:41)

All the analogies.

A (34:42)

I'm going.

C (34:43)

Okay. All right, so should we mention some of the changes that we know are coming? Okay, so I do want to mention this. So Joe Brady is going to maintain play calling duties.

A (34:53)

Yeah.

C (34:54)

What's your take on that?

A (34:55)

Yeah, 100.

C (34:56)

Yeah.

A (34:56)

If he's, he's in this job because he was doing that, that is his strength. He's got to evolve into the other stuff, which is big stuff. His strength is calling plays. Working with Josh. That should not change.

C (35:10)

Yeah, Yeah. I think some people were confused because it's a CEO job, but then the play calling. How can you kind of explain that? Because it makes sense. It's. It's his offense. You're going to continue that because he is the head coach.

B (35:21)

Yeah. And I think a lot of it had to do with he's getting the job because he was calling the plays and because of his relationship with Josh. And you want that person to be in lockstep and Josh's right hand man. So I wouldn't want to change that continuity for as much as we can talk again about the stagnant offense, like, you kind of want to keep that going with better pieces around. Yes. So you want to keep that same voice now.

A (35:47)

Liam Cohen does it. Andy Reid does it. Sean McVeigh does it. Shanahan does it. Like, this is what the. Not every coach like Harbaugh is going to the Giants. He doesn't call plays on either side of the ball. So it is different. But yes, to that point, it still is. In that first year and the first time. It's a lot.

C (36:06)

Yeah.

A (36:07)

That is a lot for him to adapt to.

C (36:09)

All right, other moves. Adam Henry, the wide Bills wide receiver coach, leaves for the Steelers and then Bobby Babich leaving for the packers defensive pass game coordinator.

B (36:19)

I was just thinking out loud, you know, first time head coach and obviously we're still trying to figure out, like, who Joe Brady. Who Joe Brady's staff would be. I wonder if there is like, I thought in my head, like, I don't know why, like Coach O is an offensive line coach. I. Hear me out. I'm just saying to have some. What does that look for?

A (36:46)

He's not coming to Buffalo.

C (36:49)

That would be hilarious.

B (36:53)

One elite content. Like, that's what I'm.

C (36:57)

But like, okay, it would be like. So that would be like Rexish.

A (37:00)

Yeah. Yeah. They don't need that.

B (37:03)

Let me just throw something at the wall. Sorry for having. Oh, sorry. I don't care about your hopes and dreams. Like. Okay. But I guess I'm seeing there is that when Sean brought in Leslie, that was an experienced guy that had been a head coach before to kind of help with the whole picture.

A (37:23)

Yeah.

B (37:24)

And so just thinking of who else would Joe. Who else would Joe have that he could also bring in to be a little bit of that. It's not babysitter. It's a little bit of that mentor that I thought Leslie Frazier was really good at when Sean needed it to be that guy that had gone through it. The highs and lows, understanding what it took. So I just don't know. And again, we're whether that's the Sean Payton tree, whether that is more of the Matt Rule tree that kind of Brady has kind of come up through. Through the college and the pros. I was just thinking myself and yeah, maybe I thought it would be awesome if coacho came back as an offensive line coach. For content, Michael.

A (38:08)

Yes, for content.

B (38:09)

Just pull your glasses.

A (38:10)

Do you think there's a chance that Ronald Curry gets elevated to.

B (38:13)

Yes, I could see that he's been with him since the Saints.

A (38:16)

So yeah, he's been with him. He's got a lot of experience. He's been around. That is not a play calling role. I don't know. We'll see if that's the case. He does have connections with other people in the league, so you never know.

B (38:29)

That's what I was saying.

A (38:30)

Yeah. Who he wants to bring, who he wants to bring in.

C (38:34)

Can't unhear it now.

A (38:35)

I know.

B (38:36)

Just make a shirt. Just who big who fans.

A (38:41)

Bobby Babbage. First of all, shout out to Bobby, who I, I think is a really good coach and I hope he has success going forward. And to Bob Sr. Bob Senior, if you're watching this, this camera, you can still be a subscriber and a watcher. I know Bob's going to be coaching in Green Bay, but I know you're still connected to the Bills, so we got your back. Subscriber always get a chance to talk to him. We will miss seeing him when he comes into camp and other times, but Bobby will go. He goes to Green Bay. I would not be surprised if at some point he ends up back with Sean McDermott.

B (39:19)

Yep.

A (39:19)

I guess the Bucks talk to Sean.

C (39:20)

McDermott about T.O.. Yeah, well, it's. The report also said Sean is expecting to take a year off and then.

A (39:27)

He gets back in it.

B (39:28)

I thought Bobby did an Admiral, can.

A (39:31)

We say, admirable job.

B (39:33)

I thought he did a good job. Because if we're talking about how Sean did a good job with piecing together this defense, with the injuries, the lack of players, all of that stuff, if we're talking about the talent in the defensive side, the second half adjustments that Bobby made in the second half.

A (39:46)

Bobby and Sean.

B (39:49)

That's what I'm saying. So if we're gonna, if we're going to give Sean credit for it, I also want to make sure Bobby gets his flowers too. Because those adjustments and games in the second half, they were elite, elite shutting down. Whether it was New England going back to Atlanta, Atlanta, Houston and even the Denver for six drives holding them to 36 yards.

A (40:08)

So also I want to say Bobby had a big influence on this franchise coaching. You talked to Hyde, Poyer, all those guys in the secondary at different times.

B (40:18)

On his way up from position coach.

A (40:19)

Yeah. And so he had a big impact there. Maybe it didn't go as well as he would have wanted as the D.C. but, but you know, that's a guy who had a big influence on a lot of players and was very well liked and now he Goes to another place.

C (40:33)

Yeah. So Bills changes, obviously a new head coach. They'll have a new oc, they'll have a new DC they'll have a new special teams coordinator, new wide receiver coach and a new offensive line coach. So there's going to be a lot of new.

A (40:44)

That is a lot of new. Yeah.

B (40:47)

Aaron. Or was it Gund? Austin Gunn is obviously the guy.

A (40:52)

They think he had an interview with Jacksonville. Jacksonville brought him in.

C (40:58)

Jacksonville. Yeah.

A (40:59)

But I think there's a good chance that he stays with them.

B (41:02)

And a lot of these guys, like you said, have worked with Brady. They may have been brought in by Sean, but they've worked with Brady since. Yes. You know, 2022.

A (41:09)

Those guys like tight ends. All those guys that have been around for a while. So.

C (41:13)

Yeah. Okay. Just some other NFL stuff. Todd Monkin taking the Browns job and then that's a.

A (41:21)

That's a good coach. But like, man, if you're the Browns, like, you can't get one of these young guys that wants to just come in. I mean, Todd Monkin is. Monkin is a good football coach, but like, that is not going to get fans. Like, I mean, Cleveland's got it rough.

C (41:40)

I don't blame other.

A (41:42)

I'm not, I'm not disagreeing with you. That's on the Browns. That's why I was happy Sean McDermott stayed away from the Browns if they had any interest at all.

B (41:50)

Do you want to. The craziest thing I heard today when I thought about it was do you know who had. Who got paid the most money this year on Denver Broncos staff? The roster.

A (42:02)

On the roster.

B (42:03)

Yeah. Biggest cap hit for Denver.

C (42:06)

No.

B (42:08)

Russell Wilson.

A (42:08)

Oh, yeah.

B (42:11)

Like credit. So don't. Hey, salary cap isn't real because you can't do that. They went to almost the AFC Championship game with a backup quarterback. Like, oh, yes, because of. They went to AFC Championship game with.

A (42:25)

A backup, Sean Payton. And he took the heat for a couple of the decisions that he made in that game. By the way, did you see what he said about Davis Webb potentially going to the Raiders?

B (42:35)

He's going to make it a hell on him or something.

A (42:37)

He said something about it's going to be hell for him to come against that. That is full on Shawn Payton. That only a little bit of a laugh in there. He's serious about it. Yeah, that guy. The guy almost got it done.

B (42:49)

Did you hear the story about obviously Davis Webb got the recommendation from D to go on Sean Payton staff and it brought him in as soon as he was done Playing to be the quarterback's coach. But I guess he called the driver, like after the interview. The driver was taking him to the airport and he called the driver and told him to bring him back so he could sign the contract. Like, it was like one of those, like you have the don't let him leave the building. And then you have the pull the car back around. It was like, I will turn this car. It's just very funny to think of like Davis Web just like sitting in the back seat on his phone. He's like, why is the car turning around? And then like, Sean Payton's just waiting outside. Like, sign this.

A (43:24)

We can't let you leave the other one. I don't know if you were going to mention here about the defensive coordinator. Obviously they got to hire Jim Schwarz is available. Jim Leonard. We'll see other teams are interested. He's never been a full on D.C. in the NFL, has he?

B (43:38)

Not in the NFL.

A (43:39)

Yeah. But was it Wisconsin?

B (43:40)

I think it was Wisconsin. Very good.

A (43:42)

Former Bills player safety.

B (43:45)

Chargers are interviewing him as well.

A (43:47)

Yeah, I gotta tell you, that's Charger's got a pretty good staff.

C (43:53)

Yeah, good staff.

B (43:56)

A little more cap room. Personnel is probably a little bit better.

A (43:59)

Yeah, yeah.

B (44:00)

And again, you're weather.

A (44:02)

Yeah, they got nice weather, great stadium, so be interesting. Oh, Bill's got a new stadium, so there you go.

C (44:06)

That's true.

B (44:07)

Also, I thought my tweet about the basketball games that got delayed because of the snowstorm that hit. And I had tweeted that it's very.

A (44:14)

In Buffalo to know that.

B (44:16)

That the NBA team should have built a dome.

C (44:18)

Oh, I didn't even see that tweet because the games. Yes. Yeah.

A (44:21)

You know.

B (44:21)

Did you get it?

C (44:22)

I got it.

A (44:23)

But not everybody always.

C (44:25)

I got it.

A (44:25)

That tweet. And that's why I say because we always hear, why doesn't Buffalo build a dome? When the game got canceled, when there was a state of 100 inches, there.

B (44:35)

Was a state of emergency. Nobody could like, well, if they built a dome.

A (44:39)

So it'd be an indoor facility that nobody could get to.

B (44:42)

Yeah, I just thought it was very funny.

C (44:43)

You have to go outside to get to the indoor again.

B (44:46)

It's one of those where we think we understand social media. And I was like, this is a good tweet. It did not do as well as I thought.

A (44:52)

Yeah. Because.

C (44:53)

Yeah, there's not a lot of nuance.

A (44:55)

There's not a lot of nuance out there.

C (44:56)

That's fair. All right. Anything else before we wrap up?

A (44:59)

No, I'M looking forward to going in the room tomorrow.

C (45:02)

We.

B (45:03)

Hey, Buffalo.

C (45:06)

Do you think they have five pound weights?

A (45:08)

No. Well, actually a lot of people work at. I don't know. They might be. Yeah, I'm sure the.

C (45:13)

I'm gonna find them.

A (45:14)

Is that the way you hold?

C (45:15)

No, I was just being. No, no. My Pilates workout crushed you guys. Oh, we also need to figure out.

A (45:24)

It did, but you know, at your age now might be a little harder for you.

C (45:31)

Also birthdays tomorrow. I'm not there yet.

A (45:33)

We want the emails. Heybuffaloplus.com little life advice.

B (45:39)

Hey, Buffalo plus. What am I saying?

A (45:41)

Dot com.

B (45:42)

We made a website now. Now I'm in charge of building a website. I put it on the screen and then I put in the description.

A (45:50)

Yes. Hey, Buffalo plus at Gmail.

B (45:52)

Yes.

A (45:53)

Or you could do dot com. Maybe you get somewhere with it.

C (45:56)

I don't know. I. I don't know.

A (45:57)

But we do have buffalo plus store.

C (45:59)

Buffaloplast store.com if you want. We have the starter stuff up there.

B (46:04)

We're getting more.

C (46:05)

We're getting more as well.

A (46:06)

Stuff.

C (46:06)

Yeah. Plenty of mugs, magnets, all that stuff.

A (46:10)

Yes.

C (46:10)

Okay, that's it. All right. We'll be in Orchard park tomorrow. Bill's introduced Joe Brady as their next head coach. We'll see who's there. We'll see who talks. We'll see how it goes. We'll have plenty more coverage on Buffalo Plus. YouTube channel Weight Room. All right. Please be sure to, like, comment, subscribe and share. We'll catch you next time here on oh for Mike and Dan. I'm Jenna.

A (46:33)

Yeah.

C (46:36)

See ya.

B (46:45)

Now from the Connors and Ferris podcast studio, this is the Buffalo plus podcast.