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What they're saying in Arizona with Bo Brack (Bills vs Cards preview)
00:22:42
Bills vs Arizona Cardinals preview with Bo Brack in Phoenix
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- [00:00]
A
I don't know if you're aware of this, but the national media doesn't like the Cardinals. Have you heard anything about this? Have you, have you got any sense of this?
- [00:09]
B
If you, if you follow me on Twitter, you'll see that we're very well aware of it or you watch the show on a daily basis. Yeah, we're always, you know, fighting the good fight as far as we feel.
- [00:26]
A
Hey, everybody. Welcome back to Buffalo plus, presented by Connors and Ferris, Mike Catalano along with Jenna Cottrell. Please make sure to, like, comment and subscribe. I get to say it. Jenna gets to go along with it. That's the way it goes for this because this is our what they're saying in. And in this case, we're talking about Phoenix, Arizona, to get set for the opener. And we'd like to welcome our guest for this week, Bo Brack from phnx All Cities Sports in Phoenix. Welcome to Buffalo Plus.
- [00:57]
B
Hey, thanks for having me. Excited to actually break down and kind of preview week one of this NFL season. It's exciting time.
- [01:03]
A
Yeah, it really is. Everybody is excited and, you know, there's extra attention obviously on, you know, opening game and what's going on. And before we were on, I said, you know, fan base wise, Bill's fans would have no particular reason to know a ton about the Cardinals outside of hail Murray that they remember, still lives in their nightmares, does in 2020. Tremendous play. But let's start with that because he's still there and he's in his sixth year. I'm going to ask you, coming into this year, is Kyler Murray a good quarterback?
- [01:37]
B
Flat out, yes. But I think there is a lot to, you know, from that moment, right, where, you know, I think the fam, the organizations went two different directions and you wouldn't believe, you know, what direction the Cardinals went and which direction the Bills went from that game. Bills made it to the postseason, have had a ton of success and have solidified themselves with as a perennial, you know, contender to make a deep run in the postseason and maybe do a Super bowl at some point. But, you know, Kyler Murray and this Arizona Cardinals team went the other direction, right? And you would have thought Kyler Murray could take advantage of that moment and parlay it into, you know, consistent success. But I think at that point, people were naive to, you know, the infrastructure, lack thereof from the front office standpoint and the coaching staff standpoint with Cliff Kingsbury and Steve Keim and Kyler Murray still had a long way to go maturation wise. And I don't know if he was necessarily given the correct tools to, to go from there. They did go to the postseason the next year with 11 wins, but really just kind of the wheels fell off after that and the team had to pivot, hit the reset button. And I think for the first time in his career, guys, Kyler Murray is set up from a play calling standpoint and in organizationally and from a just playmaking standpoint, set up for success going into, you know, it's 27 years old and entering his prime. I think we haven't seen his best football just yet.
- [02:56]
C
It's crazy to me that he's entering year six. I feel like I just remember, you know, a couple years ago, him coming in. You mentioned earlier though, the tools to succeed. This team drafting Marvin Harrison Jr. What that did for this organization. Canal, we haven't really heard outside of a lot about him. What have you seen from him and, and what do you expect? What expectations are you going to put on him this season?
- [03:19]
B
I mean from Marvin Harrison Jr. Standpoint or Kyler Murray?
- [03:22]
C
I'm talking about Marvin Harrison Jr. Yeah, MHJ.
- [03:25]
B
Yeah, I mean fourth overall. And you know, I think this was somebody that a lot of people view not only is just pro ready as the fourth overall pick out of Ohio State, but star ready. Right. Just because who his father is and he's got a bust in Canton and he was Peyton Manning's number one receiver for so long. But Marvin's a bigger, maybe more imposing physical specimen. Nearly 6 foot 4, but is a harder worker. As you know, the stories of his father were Marvin Harrison Sr. And you know, I think that he's delivered as far as the hype's concerned to this point now it's tough to do much beyond that, but since they selected him fourth overall and there's questions about his pre draft process, how he opted out basically of everything from know the NFL scouting combine to doing the interviews with the media there he did it with teams but not with the media and then not having his pro day. But you kind of hear all the different pieces that go into that and him wanting to avoid the rookie wall and kind of crunching the numbers as far as where he could fall in this draft with the run on quarterbacks early. But Kyler, you know, Kyler Murray has a legit ex wide receiver here who's going to really command a lot of attention from opposing defenses right out of the gates. And I think that the playmakers, you know, outside of MHJ and Trey McBride and Michael Wilson and Greg Dorch and then the run game are going to benefit from that. But, you know, we talked to offensive coordinator Drew Betsing today and he said that, you know, the biggest thing with Marv is that his, the learning curve wasn't as steep, like, you know, what the physical tools are. But what they weren't expecting is him to come in and get a grasp on what he's doing on a down, down basis in this offense. So that's exciting. But then you talk about the expectations, like there's Justin Jefferson, there's Jamar Chase and putting up those gaudy numbers where I don't think the pressure is on Marvin Harrison Jr. To necessarily be the, you know, the top guy in this offense, like 1400 yards and 10 touchdowns, you know, those are big numbers. So I think he, like, let's, let's kind of ease those back. I still think he's going to have a great rookie season. 1100, 1200 yards and maybe about six, seven, eight touchdowns. And he's just going to be a part of what they view as a strength in this offense.
- [05:28]
C
Yeah, it's so funny. We talk about Keon Coleman, the Bills rookie wide receiver as well. Like, where do you set the expectations for some of these guys because the hopes are so high for some of these players. Obviously, Marvin Harrison Jr. Drafted a lot higher. But going into what you were talking about, about all the weapons that they do have, you know, what do you think is the, the outlook on Kyler Murray now going into this year and what do you think the expectations are in terms of just what people in the Arizona Cardinals fan base feel about him? Do they believe that he has now all the tools to succeed or kind of. What is that outside perspective?
- [06:01]
B
I think locally, especially within the fan base, the organization has done a good job in empowering, emboldening Kyler Murray, who was a polarizing figure for far too long and might have been a victim of, you know, the previous regime and an ugly contract negotiation and not a whole lot of success on a national stage. But I think that, you know, as far as the expectations go, I mean, as I mentioned, like kind of an embarrassment of riches. We'll see how the offensive line does. But he's never been in a position offensively from a scheme standpoint that to play within an offense and I think that's what Jonathan Gannon and Drew Betsing have set up and also have like a really strong run game where he can hand the ball off to James Conner and they can set up, you know, second and third and manageable where, you know, I think early in his career the expectation was, hey, go into the phone booth and come out as Superman each and every play. Because we don't really have much, you know, offensively, you know, set up for you to have consistent success and for things to kind of be conducive to sustaining drives and putting up points. So, you know, in the eight games we saw from him last year playing within the offense, sure there was some changes as far as getting under center more and playing a little bit different as far as just, you know, his footwork. But he, you know, he's such a great athlete. Drafted in the top 10 in two professional sports leagues, like that was easy for him. Now it's just like, okay, can they get to the higher level stuff? And everything that we've heard from this organization from their, you know, the offensive coordinator, the head coach is, you know, he's asking the right questions, he's got a good grasp on it, he's got a command of it. And now it's just a point of going out there and proving it. And I think along with that, he'll change the narrative nationally as he's already started to do here locally.
- [07:39]
A
Yeah, Bo, when we go back to last year, look, they, the Cardinals were out of it, but at the second part of the year, that offense started to be really effective and they were playing well. And, and I start to look and think, is this a case of what was working for them at the end of last year and can be impactful for this year and continuing that? Because the guys didn't play really in the preseason, they didn't show anything. How much of that do you think is now? We've got Marvin Harrison. Now things can open up a little bit more and we don't want anybody to see one snap of it before we start the season in Buffalo.
- [08:18]
B
Yeah, I think there's a bunch that goes into them not playing really anybody in the preseason, but, you know, especially when you look at that quarterback position and Kyler hasn't played a full season since 2020, so, you know, I think protecting him, keeping your number one asset ready to go, and then you'll deal with, you know, kind of knocking the rust off. But they anticipate this thing to kind of click early on because of what you saw at the end of last year, things kind of start to click offensively where, you know, they, they like to kind of establish the run and then they like Kyler Murray to, to show off his arm talent once defenses start to kind of creep up on him. But it really just does set up, you know, pick your poison for opposing defenses. But we did see them statistically climb up there while he was in the game for those eight, eight games as a top 10 group rushing the football, it was be hard pressed to find anybody that that ran the ball better than them. And it just sets them up for overall success. And the one thing that they were missing is you know that that wide receiver that was going to make plays, it was Trey McBride. It was the run game and there wasn't like Greg Dortch emerged and you know, at a necessity but there wasn't anybody else Michael Wilson was doing dealing with an injury and then we saw over the last two games that rapport really lock in and I think that that's one that's kind of under the radar going into the season with all the hype from Marvin Harrison Jr. Is Michael Wilson had a pretty nice rookie campaign. 38 catches over 500 yards and in the last two games he and Kyler really developed that a strong relationship and should be a good solid duo in.
- [09:47]
D
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- [09:50]
B
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- [09:53]
D
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B
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- [10:00]
D
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- [10:06]
C
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- [10:09]
A
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- [10:10]
D
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- [10:18]
A
Yeah, I wanted to continue with the weapons because I think McBride was a revelation last year for what you had in offense and in Buffalo. Dalton Kincaid coming off his rookie year. When you look at the numbers between the two, they were similar but McBrides were a little better and he got in the end zone more often. Do you expect a jump from him? Because those are pretty substantial numbers he put up without the great help on the outside and without a full season of Kyler.
- [10:47]
B
Yeah, you know it's, it's tough because then trying to play that play forecaster and you look at all the weapons and then the fact that there's one football right. And can Trey McBride parlay a breakout 2023 three where he actually had to buy his time early in the season because Zach Ertz was kind of blocking him for some playing time. So he did it really in 12 games, 80 catches, 800 yards and in the trips to the end zone. But you know, I think it's going to be more quality over quantity with, with a guy like McBride and he's going to still take advantage. And I don't think Kyler Murray is going to shy away from the mismatches that they feel when McBride's going up against opposing safeties or even on a lot if a linebacker's on him. I think that they're absolutely going to try to expose that and that he might just have a little bit more benefit from, from open space with Marvin Harrison Jr. And Michael Wilson in that run game. So I think McBride has the chance to replicate those numbers, but it's over a full season's worth of time. So like 80 catches, 800 yards, you know, you can get that, you know, pretty close to some pretty eye popping numbers, 100 and 1000. So I don't think that that's, he's going to take a significant, you know, decline just with the additions of, of other playmakers.
- [11:55]
C
Yeah, definitely a guy to watch. He is a lot of fun to watch for sure. Now we talk a lot about the offense, but I know there's so much optimism going in on the other side of the ball. I just saw a Bleacher Report ranking the worst defenses in the NFL. Cardinals were up there.
- [12:09]
B
What do you, what do you make your eyes.
- [12:13]
C
I didn't want to say it. I didn't want to say they were number one. But what do you, what do you make of that?
- [12:18]
B
Yeah, you know, I think that it's tough to, especially with a natural audience and you know, you don't get the benefit. You're not tuning in to watch a team that goes four and 13 and they got a lot of changes on the defensive side of the football and they give up the second most points and it's, it's. You're going to have to find unique production from unknown places. Right? They're, they, they did revamp their defensive line which was one of the worst position groups in the NFL last year. They were elevate the floor level but talent floor level. I just don't know. You know, it's not going to be like, hey, you've got Aaron Donald a game record but you got guys that can actually slow down the run and make play. That NFL caliber defensive lineman, the edge group is, it's a, it's gonna probably be, you know, this, this defense, like if they don't produce, it's probably gonna. Because of the lack of people Getting pressure off the edge. They've got Xavin Collins, who is a converted off ball linebacker playing edge. And they've got Dennis Gardek, who was a special teams ace for so long. Like fan favorites, don't get me wrong, but are you going to get consistent production from those guys? They're going to have to prove a lot of people wrong. They rework the defensive secondary. They've got three, three top, you know, 100 picks in the last two drafts that they've got that they like and Max Melton from Rutgers and Garrett Williams from Syracuse. And then you've also got Sean Murphy Bunting, who won a Super Bowl a couple years ago with, with Tampa Bay. I think that they're going to be better in the COVID department. I think they're going to be better up front with the defensive line, the edges, the unknown and then consistent as far as the linebackers go. But they're going to have to have a strong, consistent scheme from offense or defensive quarter Nick Rollis to really kind of make up where they lack in true proven commodities on this defensive side of the football. Outside of Buddha Baker, who's been playing at high level at the back end of this defense.
- [14:04]
A
Well, he's the one I wanted to ask you about because he's become the stable guy and he's a Cardinal like when if you ask fans around, they'd be able to know Kyler now they know Harrison and they talk about Buddha Baker and I think there was a lot of thought that at some point, you know, would he move on or could a team try to make a deal for him and he's, he's there and he has been a very effective player in his role.
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B
Yeah.
- [14:31]
A
What is he like with this organization? Because when you're trying to build it up off of two, four win seasons, you need those rock guys that are going to help be there. What has Baker been like for this team?
- [14:42]
B
I mean, he's been their rock. He's been their heart and soul of this defense. And he's been a guy that has hard to endure. You know, of his, all of his seasons since 2017, one playoff team. I mean, and he's, he's been a guy that's been steady. And no matter who the coach staff is, from Bruce Arians to Steve Wilkes to Cliff Kingsbury, now Jonathan Gannon, you know, he's been the guy that's been consistent all the way through now, things got off on, you know, tough footing when Gannon took the job. Buddha Baker and his representation at that Time last off season, had requested the trade. And I think that, you know, it wasn't just a true indictment on the new coaching staff, but Buddha wanted to go on and win somewhere. But now, you know, I think once he kind of got in the building and started working with Jonathan Gannon, the head coach, they're very like minded in their competitive nature, what they want to do. And he's helped, you know, not only be a holdover, but also helped change the culture around this organization that desperately needed it. He was like the outlier and in a good way when things were a little bit, you know, in darker times for this team. So I think that Buddha Baker, even though he's going into a contract year, he continues to be, you know, the, the, the, the heart and soul of this team. Like he just continues to play at a high level. And I think he fits the mentality of what Gannon wants and what Rallis wants. And I think he, he wants to be part of this team, to kind of take it out the doldrums and into, you know, the sunshine a little bit.
- [16:08]
A
You know, it made some moves. They had some injuries, obviously on the defensive line. I liked Cam Thomas is there. It seemed like he would be the kind of guy they would hold on to, but they moved on from him. Did that surprise you at all?
- [16:23]
B
I think a lot of people were surprised, like BJ Ojalari, who is a second year player at lsu. They had high expectations for him making a jump and unfortunately towards acl, he's out for the season. So with that injury and then them kind of returning the status quo from a group that was shut out getting to the quarterback with sacks over the last six games. Last year you were kind of, it was kind of a head scratcher, right? So Cam Thomas didn't have any sacks last season. He seemed like, seemed like he wasn't a scheme fit, but then came into otas and training camp and produced and played well, led the team in sacks in the preseason. And then next thing you know, before the roster's initial 53 or set the night before, he's traded for a seventh round pick, which is nothing, you know, to the Kansas City Chiefs, a team that's, you know, expectations, you're in your house to compete for a Super bowl. So you're like, okay, what's going on here? But I think at the end of the day, he just wasn't a scheme fit no matter what. And they were doing some things to help, I think, really showcase him to other teams. And they found a bidder in the Chiefs and they moved on. So I think that they had. The team has a sense of conviction in this edge group that I don't think myself. The fan base has and we'll have to be proven wrong and in their skepticism, thrown off by, you know, results people aren't expecting come, you know, the start of the season. But Cam Thomas, absolutely. A head scratcher.
- [17:42]
C
Well, I gotta ask you, I saw the Nick Rallis video you posted on your Twitter of him being super jacked up watching the film. He said he had to compose himself. Football guys, guy, I just, I'm curious from your perspective, what is the, what is the outside perspective of this Bill scene? Obviously, Stefan Diggs is on. He, Gabriel Davis is gone. They have Joe Brady now full time offensive coordinator, you know, Bobby Babich's defensive coordinator. What do you think is kind of that perspective on Buffalo?
- [18:10]
B
Yeah, it's a great question. I think that is the long term is everybody views them as this team that's going to click and that's going to make a deep postseason run and contend to, to come out of the AFC as the, as the representative in the Super Bowl. I think anytime you've got a player like Josh Allen, you've got that chance. And the Cardinals are well aware of that as anybody is who watches football. But you know, I think that they also realize, hey, week one, this team was all the changes, all the, you know, the, the captains leaving for various reasons and the, the facelift that the receiving corps undergone and key players on the defensive side, you know, injuries like, could be very vulnerable. Week one that, you know, with, with blood in the water, could the Cardinals come across the United States and steal one? And I think that, you know, there's momentum on, you know, for, for both sides of the football that they can get in there and potentially get the job done. Even though, you know, they're six and a half point underdogs.
- [19:07]
C
Yeah.
- [19:08]
A
I don't know if you're aware of this, but the national media doesn't like the Cardinals. Have you heard anything about this? Have you, have you got any sense of this?
- [19:17]
B
If you, if you follow me on Twitter, you'll see that we're very well aware of it. Or you watch the show on a daily basis. Yeah, we're always, you know, fighting the good fight as far as we feel. But yeah, I mean, but that's not that we understand that. Right. I mean, it's fun to be the underdog, but also you, you feel like, hey, are they. It's Rodney Dangerfield. We get no respect here, but at the same time, like, it's earned, right? I mean, you guys saw it for so long that. That slump, you know, that. That just brutal slump, not being in the postseason, it's similar. Like, you have to. The only way you're going to change the narrative is by winning football games, and the organization understands that. But, like, let's be realistic. This is year two of a rebuild where the. The first move of it was to tear everything down and then build it up from the studs. And, you know, I think they've made some really good moves. I think the direction of this organization is finally trending in the right. The. Trending the right way. But, you know, year two, I think that. Can you get a signature win against, you know, a Super bowl contender, Week one? That'll help things. Can you. Can you just. Can you win some division games? Can. Can you start to win some games that nobody expected and beat the teams that you're supposed to beat? Like, that's how you start to change it. And it starts with, you know, Kyler Murray and him kind of leading the charge with that.
- [20:30]
C
Yeah, no, I, I agree. It's like you talked about, those signature wins building off of those, beating the teams you're supposed to beat. Now, obviously, the Bills are favored in this game, but what do you think it's going to take for the Cardinals to win this game? And do you. Do you see that they. They could do it?
- [20:45]
B
Yeah, I mean, it would take really, this. The offense coming out a little bit stagnant on the Bill's behalf. Like, there's the. The overhaul of the receiving core, maybe some of the stuff that. That Brady's trying to install. Does it click immediately with your elite quarterback play and that you can get stops and maybe get some of those Josh Allen interceptions that he has before he gets to the playoffs. Right, Those ones that, you know, hurt during the regular season, like. Yeah, absolutely, like. But he seems to kind of work them out before, you know, the lights get a little bit brighter in the playoffs. So I think that, like, if you can get. You can strike on a team that comes out of the gates just a little rusty, but at the same time, a team that didn't play the bulk of their starters on either side of the football, they have to come out and click, and that's going to be key for both the offensive and defensive side of the Arizona Cardinals in order to kind of pull off this upset. Norther Park.
- [21:36]
C
Yeah.
- [21:37]
A
Well, this has been great, and it's going to be great for Bills fans, our Buffalo plus viewers, because they're really getting caught up on a team they're going to see. 60 minutes maybe. Plus on can you let everybody know where they can find you? Find more information on the Cardinals as we get set for the game itself.
- [21:54]
B
Absolutely. I appreciate it and it's been a blast catching up with you, but ph and exports on YouTube, we're talking about this team every day. Ph and x underscore Cardinals on Twitter in bobrock. You can follow me see some of those clips. Just watch Nick Rollis talk about how he had to calm himself down as far as watching, you know, game film, which is ridiculous, but you got to love it if you're a fan of the team.
- [22:16]
C
No real football guy.
- [22:18]
B
Yes, no doubt about exactly.
- [22:20]
A
Hey both, thanks again very much. We'll be checking in, watching all your stuff this week, getting ready for the game, and good luck to the Cardinals the rest of the way.
- [22:29]
B
Thank you so much. It was a blast. Thank you so much.