Helping Small Business Owners Navigate Their Biggest Problems | Ep 254

Summary

Podcast Summary: "Helping Small Business Owners Navigate Their Biggest Problems | Ep 254"

Podcast Information:

• Title: Build with Leila Hormozi
• Host: Leila Hormozi
• Episode: Helping Small Business Owners Navigate Their Biggest Problems | Ep 254
• Release Date: March 20, 2025
• Description: In this episode, Leila Hormozi delves into the most pressing challenges faced by small business owners. Through real-life examples and expert advice, she provides actionable strategies to build resilient, scalable, and unshakeable businesses.

---

Introduction

In Episode 254 of "Build with Leila Hormozi," Leila addresses a range of issues that small business owners encounter as they strive to scale their operations. The episode features interactions with several entrepreneurs, including Leo Skeppy, Carson, Ben Foske, Madhu, and Laurie, each presenting unique challenges in their respective businesses.

---

Resilience and Mindset in Business

Discussion Points: Leila opens the conversation by exploring the concept of resilience and the mindset required to overcome significant business challenges. This segment is primarily driven by Leo Skeppy's query about handling personal battles in business.

Key Insights:

• Not Taking Challenges Too Seriously: Leila emphasizes the importance of maintaining perspective to prevent business problems from becoming overwhelming. She states, “I really don't take it too seriously... it’s not going to matter in a year.” (00:36)

• Defining Resilience: She defines resilience as the speed at which one can return to their baseline emotional state after a setback. “Resiliency is essentially like, how quickly can you return to baseline.” (03:31)

• Experiential Avoidance: Leila discusses overcoming the tendency to avoid difficult emotions, which hinders growth. “Most of the time I see people in their business... they’re ultimately trying to avoid something.” (04:36)

Notable Quotes:

• Leo Skeppy expresses vulnerability: “I want to know your mindset around the resilience aspect.” (01:25)
• Leila responds candidly about her coping mechanisms: “I have two routes. I go... Either I die... Or I just suffer emotionally.” (04:35)

---

Managing Equity and Accountability in Small Businesses

Discussion Points: Carson, running a talent management business, seeks advice on balancing grace and accountability within his team, specifically dealing with a partner who isn't meeting expectations.

Key Insights:

• Equity as a Strategic Tool: Leila advises that equity should be reserved for “barrels” — team members who can create value independently. “Anyone that has equity in a company should be a barrel.” (08:14)

• Proactive Management: She recommends addressing underperformance early by redefining roles and compensation structures to prevent future issues. “If you don't do it now, it's going to have to do it later and have to pay the tax on it.” (09:55)

• Setting Clear Expectations: For accountability, Leila suggests setting measurable expectations and using systems like leaderboards to track performance. “Set an expectation. You tie a measurement to that expectation or a metric... create feedback about their ability to hit or not hit that expectation.” (10:52)

Notable Quotes:

• Carson outlines his dilemma: “One team member who's a partner... he's the person you're struggling with primarily.” (07:42)
• Leila underscores the importance of high standards: “Should you have to hold someone accountable who has that kind of equity in the business? No.” (09:35)

---

Scaling and Delegating Sales Roles

Discussion Points: Ben Foske, an executive confidence coach, discusses his struggles with replacing himself in the sales process despite high conversion rates.

Key Insights:

• Authority in Sales: Leila explains that her high conversion rates stem from her authority and expertise, rather than mere sales skills. “Persuasion is stronger the more of an authority figure you are.” (13:15)

• Building Authority Within the Team: She advises integrating authority into the sales team by either featuring herself in the sales funnel or enhancing the credibility of team members. “How do you build authority with the other people that are selling for you?” (13:34)

• Edifying Team Members: Madhu adds that leveraging the credibility of experienced team members can significantly boost sales performance. “We've used his credibility and authority piece by edifying everybody before they did their presentation.” (15:45)

Notable Quotes:

• Ben Foske highlights his issue: “When I've tried to empower people to become the lead salesperson, it just has not worked.” (12:32)
• Leila suggests practical solutions: “Build your endorsement toolkit... create assets that they can walk into.” (20:40)

---

Marketing Strategies and Building Authority

Discussion Points: Laurie, involved in skincare sales, discusses the high customer acquisition costs (CAC) and the challenges of building a personal brand to reduce these costs.

Key Insights:

• Assessing the Need for Personal Branding: Leila questions whether becoming the face of the business aligns with personal preferences and business goals. “Do you want to be the face of your business?” (17:29)

• Evaluating Cost-Effective Marketing Channels: She advises Laurie to continue leveraging celebrity endorsements, like Mindy Kaling, which currently drive significant brand awareness without the extensive time commitment required for personal content creation. “If you're looking to sell your business and you have ways to acquire customers that don't involve your face, that's probably a better way to go.” (20:12)

• Systematizing Endorsements: Leila recommends creating a structured toolkit for celebrity endorsements to streamline the process and reduce dependency on internal resources. “Build a support team to support celebrities or influencers... build your endorsement toolkit.” (20:34)

Notable Quotes:

• Laurie explains her current marketing approach: “Our most expensive channel is actually Sephora. They take like 70% of every single item that we sell there.” (16:31)
• Leila emphasizes strategic alignment: “It sounds misaligned with the goal of starting the business in general.” (18:07)

---

Managing and Delegating Tasks for Growth

Discussion Points: Laurie, another entrepreneur, shares her struggle with transitioning from handling all aspects of her tutoring business to managing a team, particularly after hiring ineffective staff.

Key Insights:

• Documentation and Duplication: Leila advises documenting current processes to create a blueprint for new hires, ensuring consistency and efficiency. “Document, duplicate... something’s working right now, you’re doing it, you feel like it’s really shitty, but you'd be surprised at how good it is.” (22:36)

• Defining Clear Outcomes: She stresses the importance of defining expected results for each role, allowing for objective accountability even when she lacks expertise in certain functions. “Define the result... role responsibilities, results.” (24:11)

• Hiring Skilled Specialists: For areas outside her expertise, Leila recommends hiring highly proficient individuals who can operate independently without requiring extensive training or guidance. “Bring in more experienced people than you did in the other areas.” (24:11)

Notable Quotes:

• Laurie describes her challenge: “I am the magical six-armed woman right now in the business.” (21:40)
• Leila provides actionable steps: “Anyone they bring in, like, say you're doing the accounting right now... document how I'm doing it.” (23:11)

---

Key Takeaways

1. Maintain Perspective: Avoid taking business setbacks too personally. Maintain a broader view to reduce emotional overwhelm.
2. Define and Measure Resilience: Focus on how quickly you can return to your baseline after a setback, rather than eliminating negative reactions.
3. Strategic Equity Distribution: Reserve equity for key contributors who can independently drive business growth.
4. Authority in Sales: Leveraging authority and expertise within your team can significantly enhance sales performance.
5. Efficient Marketing Strategies: Prioritize marketing channels that align with your business goals and personal strengths to optimize customer acquisition costs.
6. Systematize Delegation: Document processes and define clear outcomes to facilitate effective delegation and scaling of business operations.

---

Conclusion

Episode 254 of "Build with Leila Hormozi" offers invaluable insights for small business owners facing challenges in resilience, team management, sales delegation, marketing strategies, and operational scaling. Leila's practical advice, backed by real-world examples, equips entrepreneurs with the tools to build robust and scalable businesses.

---

Transcript Highlights

• Resilience Mindset:

  "I really don't take it too seriously... it’s not going to matter in a year." – Layla (00:36)

• Equity Management:

  "Anyone that has equity in a company should be a barrel." – Layla (08:14)

• Authority in Sales:

  "Persuasion is stronger the more of an authority figure you are." – Layla (13:15)

• Marketing Strategy:

  "If you're looking to sell your business and you have ways to acquire customers that don't involve your face, that's probably a better way to go." – Layla (20:12)

• Delegation and Hiring:

  "Document, duplicate... something’s working right now, you’re doing it, you feel like it’s really shitty, but you'd be surprised at how good it is." – Layla (22:36)

---

This comprehensive summary captures the essence of Episode 254, providing actionable strategies and profound insights for small business owners aiming to navigate and overcome their most significant challenges.

Transcript

[Layla]

Find people that you feel like. I would choose this person to go to war with. And if you can find those people, then it makes it really hard to fail.

[Leo Skeppy]

I want to know your mindset.

[Carson]

How do I cultivate a sense of ownership within my team?

[Ben Foske]

What would be your suggestions to replacing me?

[Layla]

This kind of situation only gets worse with time, not better. You can change this part of what?

[Madhu]

I wish I had said that. I didn't say I'm excited.

[Leo Skeppy]

Holy shit. You're the first person in my life to ever make me nervous.

[Layla]

Oh, my God.

[Leo Skeppy]

Hi, I'm Leo. Wait, really? No, because we message on Instagram for years, and you're the reason that I'm here, so. I'm Leo Skeppy, and I have done $2 million a year for the past couple years, thanks to you. I do social media. Well, I wanted to point out and say thank you for all of the battles you have to fight in private. And I want to know from you, what are your top tips for the battles you have to fight in private? Because you're very emotionally independent, and I fire you.

[Layla]

Okay, well, can you tell me how this relates to you also, so I can have a little context?

[Leo Skeppy]

I fired a lot of people. Didn't work. I'm in a, like, a phase. I'm going to have to rehire and, like, hire people I haven't had before. So I'm at a point now where I've maxed as high as I can go with my threshold as a human being. I don't even have an editor. I do every thing. Cocaine don't even help. No. More like, I. When I say I'm at my limit, I've tried, babe. So I have to get some of this let off of myself so I can go higher. So that's kind of where I'm at now. But in this period of trying to onboard and hire, it's about to get really rough. I want to know your mindset around the resilience aspect.

[Layla]

Yeah. Well, I would say one thing which is, like, is it really going to be that rough? Because, like, one thing I never let myself do is, like, take it too seriously. Because I'm like, you saving babies. You know, like, for real, though. Like, I'm like, if somebody's, like, at my desk and they're like, layla, I'm so overwhelmed because I can't. And if I don't fix this with the portfolio company that they got, I'm like, oh, wait. And then they will make less money, and so will we. Oh, my God. Like, the world will end. Like, we make rich people, make less money. Like, I'm sure everyone's gonna be so sad. You know what I mean? Like. Like, and same for you. Oh, my God. I'm gonna make 1.2 million a year. Like, you know what I mean? Like, so I think the first thing is, like, I. I really don't take it too seriously. Like, I up all the time. I look like an idiot all the time. I sound like a idiot right now on stage with Kleenex. You know, my nose is running. I'm like, I don't give a. You know? And so, like, I think one just don't take it too seriously because it's like, if I zoom all the way out, I'm like, okay, so I'm upset because this person on my team told this person on my team that they don't like them, and then they went to this person, and now there's drama, gossip, and I'm like, it's the end of the world, right? And I feel like that some days, and I have to zoom out and be like, wow. I'm upset because adults, grown adults on my team are gossiping like, I'm a speck of dust on this universe. And this is what I'm worried about right now. And so I think the first thing is, like, just contextualizing it. I try really hard not to worry about the things that aren't going to kill me and aren't going to harm people that I love or people I'm trying to help. You know what I mean? Because that's all just noise, and it's all going to go away. It's not going to matter in a year. So I think that's the first piece. I think the second piece with is understanding how to define resiliency, which is, like, how quickly you can return to baseline. So resiliency is essentially like, you're what?

[Leo Skeppy]

That was good.

[Layla]

Okay, so, whoa. Like, this is your emotional state, and then an event occurs, and then your emotional state goes here or goes here. And resiliency is just. How quickly can you go back here to where you were prior? I just focus on the speed. I don't focus on not having a reaction. Like, someone can come in my office, they can tell me some really bad news, and I can be like, motherfucker. And it's like, in two seconds in my brain is like. And then I'm like, yeah, okay, we're gonna fix it. Ain't no thing, right? Within, like, 60 seconds, I'm like into mode. And so for me, it's like, you know, I look at the very beginning of my business career. If something had bad had happened, it might have taken me three weeks to regulate myself emotionally. You know, I'm up thinking about it, I'm ruminating on it, I'm stressed about it now. It's like it takes me a few minutes or even seconds to regulate myself. And so I've measured my progress for resiliency just by what's the speed that I can get back to baseline?

[Leo Skeppy]

What's your mindset for that couple seconds now? Like, how do you get back to baseline?

[Layla]

Honestly?

[Leo Skeppy]

Yeah.

[Layla]

Okay. Well, I have two routes. I go. Which is. First option is I say one of two things will happen. Either I die, in which case I don't have to worry about this anymore. And then the other side, I just suffer emotionally. But I don't die. So I don't know if that's helpful, but it sounds dark, but it's what I think because, like, it actually is because I'm like, well, I can suffer emotionally. Like, I've done that before. Like, I've. I've definitely suffered emotionally. What, some more emotional suffering? Bring it on. Right? Like. Or I'm like, die. Well, then I wanted to suffer emotionally. Maybe that'll be nice. I don't know, you know, but, like, I mean, that's really where I go with it because it's like what most people like, the resiliency, it's like, it's. All of this is just the root of experiential avoidance, which is like not wanting to experience our emotions, not wanting to feel a certain way. Why do people. Most of the time I see people in their business, it's like they're ultimately trying to avoid something, and that's what's stopping them from growing their business. Avoid a possibility of something happening. Avoid a possibility of someone judging them. A possibility of a catastrophe. And so if you can get past that, I think that that helps you become a lot more resilient.

[Leo Skeppy]

Okay, thank you.

[Madhu]

Part of what I wish I had said that I didn't say, in any company, you can't, like, think about your employees. Think about the people that work for you. You can't vent down, right? That's inappropriate. Like a boss venting down inappropriate. Well, then if you're the one at the top of the company, where do you vent to? You know, for me, personally, when I talk about my support system, I think of my executive assistant team. They are the only people that I will disclose my. Like, really how I'M feeling to or like, I'll allow myself to have more of, like an emotional reaction with. Because they're there for me, not for a function in the team, a function of the company. And so I think that getting those key hires, like, getting personal support for yourself, what I call like your nucleus, like the people who report to you and who are like your barrier in the company, you need to hire people.

[Layla]

That you'd be like, I would go.

[Madhu]

To war with this because it feels like that a lot of the days. And if you feel like somebody doesn't have your back, they're not loyal, they don't have integrity, they don't have hold the same values. It's going to get really tough because.

[Layla]

You'Re going to feel like you have.

[Madhu]

Nobody to go to, nobody to talk to, and nobody sees reality or sees the problems the same way you do.

[Carson]

My name is Carson. I. I run a talent management business. We're kind of like a marketplace. So we sell to both creators who we represent, as well as brands who the creators do marketing for. We did 600 grand roughly in revenue last year, and I would like to be at 5 mil. I think that'd be pretty nice. And I would say what's constraining me is primarily Keyman and data. And I would say my key questions around this, there's really two parts to it. The first one is within a team, how do I manage the balance between grace and accountability? And my second one is how do I cultivate a sense of ownership within my team?

[Layla]

Yeah, those are good questions. Tell me who you're struggling with on your team. So, I mean, it's always one person.

[Carson]

One team member who's a partner. He runs the messaging department in the business that we run.

[Layla]

So he's a partner?

[Carson]

Yeah, he is a partner.

[Layla]

Does that mean he has equity in the business?

[Carson]

Yes.

[Layla]

Okay, so he's the person you're struggling with primarily.

[Carson]

Yeah, yeah, for. For that question. Yes.

[Layla]

And you're trying to figure out how to motivate him to do more better work. Let's say you fast forward and you're making 50 million a year, and this person has 20% of your business. And you have to motivate them and you have to hold them accountable, and they're never living up to your standards. Are you okay with that?

[Carson]

No.

[Layla]

So your business is small right now. You're at a place where you can change this. And so, like, the. The reason why I'm going above the question is because in my opinion, this kind of situation only Gets worse with time, not better.

[Carson]

Sure.

[Layla]

There's barrels and there's ammunition. Barrels are people that you want to have equity. Barrels are people who can take something. They can create something out of nothing. They require little instruction. And all you need to do is keep giving them ammunition and they keep firing and they keep building. Right. And so anyone that has equity in a company should be a barrel. Ammunition is like, you give them ammunition so they can get more reach. Right. They can multiply themselves through the ammunition. I'm fearful that you don't have a barrel that has quite a bit of equity in your business. Based on what you're telling me right now, do you think that that sounds off?

[Carson]

This was right when I started my business. He was there from day one. He brought a ton of value then. But it's also like.

[Layla]

It changes quick.

[Carson]

Yeah, it changes quick. And I didn't necessarily know what I was doing then when I was first starting my business, so. Still learning?

[Layla]

Yeah, no, I. Dude, sure. This is totally fair. I've been like, it's one of our biggest businesses right now. Like, I came in and they had a guy, he had like 20 of revenue. And if that business had kept that when they were doing a couple million a year, now they're doing 200 million a year, they would have been fucking like, what the hell is going on?

[Carson]

Yeah, for sure.

[Layla]

You know what I mean? And so I think this is my suggestion for you. I would consider, if he has what you're looking for, to be a real barrel in your business. Because I think that if anything, based on your demeanor and what you're expressing, you're probably not holding the standard high enough because. Could you coach him? Yes. Could you hold him accountable? Yes. Should you have to do that for somebody that has that kind of equity in the business? No.

[Carson]

Sure.

[Layla]

My advice would be clean it up. Now, I would say what you could probably do is scope down his role. There's probably a different role that exists in the business that you could offer him.

[Carson]

Sure.

[Layla]

And that role comes with a different compensation plan. And if you don't do it now, it's going to have. You have to do it later and have to pay the tax on it. So I'd suggest doing it sooner.

[Madhu]

If you're going to give somebody equity in your company, that person, when you say partner, that means equal in a.

[Layla]

Way, which means that you don't need.

[Madhu]

To motivate them, hold them accountable, manage them as you would somebody that comes in to work for you that it's not going getting Equity. You know, I would never bring somebody into one of my businesses that wasn't intrinsically motivated and couldn't manage themselves or hold themselves accountable and give them equity in my company. This is something I've done. Like, I think almost every portfolio company that we have, I've had to go in and fix compensation because people have given away too much equity in the beginning and then those people are no longer worth it. I like to call it like a tour of duty. They've done their tour of duty in the business and they no longer are that valuable to the business anymore. And your business is worth more. And you need that equity to give to people who are valuable at that point in time.

[Carson]

Can I double click on one more thing?

[Layla]

You can double click.

[Carson]

Thank you. The other side of this was like the accountability piece. I think beyond just my relationship with him, I don't think I have a good framework or understanding of the best way to hold people accountable.

[Layla]

Yeah.

[Carson]

What are your thoughts?

[Layla]

Yeah, so if you really think about accountability, and this is for everybody in here, accountability is really, you set an expectation. You tie a measurement to that expectation or a metric, and then you give someone feedback about their ability to hit or not hit that expectation. So I'll give you an example of one, right? So you have an easy one is for sales. So you have a sales quota, right? And so it's like, okay, I'm going to need for you to maintain, for you to maintain a role here, you have to close 20 deals a month, right? That's what the business operates on, Right. Anything below that would be negative, net margin, whatever. So you say 20 deals a month. Great. Okay, so how do we measure that? Okay, well, we're going to have reporting in our CRM and you're going to have to log your sales every day. And then those two combined create a reporting structure. Then how do you create feedback for that structure? Well, we're going to tie my CRM to slack. It's going to ding in slack every day whenever you get a sale. And then we're going to have a leaderboard. And that leaderboard is going to be, you know, put up in the beginning of the day and the end of the day to remind people where they're sitting. So you can have systems that provide accountability, which I prefer. And then you also get to the narrate those systems which is like, oh, hey, I saw the leaderboard. Like, how you feeling? I saw this little dip this week. Oh, hey, I said leaderboard. Like, great fucking work, dude. You crushed it. This week. Well, what happens when you don't have clear targets for people is that their attention gets diluted. So whatever we measure is where they're going to focus the most, especially if you measure it in a group setting. And so for you it's like can you get some sort of, whether it be a tool or they are self measuring. Right. Like reporting. Self reporting on a daily basis what they're doing. Uh, if you can figure out what the output is of each person or role on a daily or weekly basis and then you just remind them of that output as much as possible.

[Carson]

Thank you.

[Layla]

Absolutely.

[Ben Foske]

Hi, my name is Ben Foske and I'm an executive confidence coach. We do a million dollars in revenue and I'd like to do 10. And so I'm teaching other people how to be confidence coaches now. And so what's stopping me is I'm the from lead gen through the sales so I've replaced myself with other coaches so I don't do that as much anymore. So that's the fulfillment's good and we have an assessment that we use to sell. But when I've tried to empower people to become the lead salesperson, it just has not worked. What would be your suggestions to replacing me? To me it doesn't even feel like selling. My conversion is like 80 plus percent on those calls. But other people do it in their like 5 or 10% and I'm. It's very confusing to me.

[Layla]

Yeah, yeah, that's. That's because persuasion is stronger the more of an authority figure you are. So why, why am I up here and going to say the same thing to people that they probably ask people on my team, people see me as a stronger authority figure to a degree and so that they believe the answer coming from me more. It has nothing to do with your skill.

[Madhu]

Sorry.

[Layla]

But like it has more to do with your authority and it does your skill. And that's why I think this the fastest way to get good at sales. Just become an authority. You don't even have to be good at sales. People just do what you say. Right. What this means is that for your sales process what you need to be able to do is how do you build authority with the other people that are selling for you?

[Ben Foske]

Which I've never did.

[Layla]

Right, right. And so like just like they're going through the funnel and they're seeing you, you have a couple different options. Right. So I see it as like either you could change some of how the funnel works and maybe put in like a short VSL from you. Right. Going through the assessment, doing this like you edifying the process itself. Right. And giving more authority to the assessment. Or you find a way to implement authority into the sales process from the salespersons. So what's their background? Do they have credibility? Like, how do they become a coach? Like, how do you build authority within them? I personally, even though I think it's a little harder, I like the idea of edifying people on your team. Now, a lot of people don't like to do that because, like, what if they leave? I'm like, well, what if they stay inside?

[Madhu]

Think about like this. If I call somebody and I'm like, hey, I want you to become a portfolio company.

[Layla]

But you know what?

[Madhu]

I want you to talk to Jim. Jim actually sold his company for more money than I sold mine. He sold it for a hundred million dollars. And Jim was then the CFO of this company and then the this of this company. So what I've done is I am somebody who has authority. I have transferred my authority to Jim. The second is that I've. We have said why they should listen to him. We've used his credibility and we've edified him. So an example of this is that, you know, for my team, we run workshops. The people that are presenting my team that works in the portfolio and works in the inner operations of the company, I've hired them all because they're very good at what they do and they have a lot of expertise. But if I don't tell people that are coming to attend that they don't know when I added in the credibility and authority piece by edifying everybody before they did their presentation, did their talk, did their piece of the workshop, their scores went up, so they might have been an 80 last week. And then we add in their credibility and they're 90 the next week. And it's simply because once you tell people, hey, you should listen to this person, and here's why they're more attuned to do that.

[Ben Foske]

Awesome. Thank you.

[Layla]

Absolutely. Hi, Layla.

[Laurie]

I'm Madhu. I sell skincare to 40 plus women in Sephora and we do about 2 million in revenue. I'd like to get it to 10 to unlock more funding and then 50 to eventually get acquired. What's stopping me is CAC. CAC is too high right now. 10% of people find out about us through like sampling at Sephora. 60% of people find out about us through we have a celebrity, her name's Mindy kaling. And then 30% find out about us through Broadcast, we're on the View, Good Morning America, et cetera.

[Layla]

Yep.

[Laurie]

Our most expensive channel is actually Sephora. They take like 70% of every single item that we sell there. God, robbery, Insane.

[Unknown]

Yeah.

[Laurie]

Retail, brick and mortar. Not the greatest business. Since Sephora is not super profitable, I'm moving on from that and focusing on, like, the celebrity and broadcast. There's another option which I keep hearing about and everyone keeps telling me that I should start building my own audience. The challenge that I have with that is the amount of time it will take to actually payback. And so prioritizing me ends up being sort of the last thing. Because, you know, getting Mindy to do another post is going to get me more profit, like tomorrow versus or getting a broadcast placement, which takes a little bit of time, will get me more profit next month. Me doing organic will take like, I don't know, six months, year. I have no idea. And so that's why I have a challenge. So I'm curious to hear how you think about that.

[Layla]

Yeah, absolutely. One question for you. Do you have a following right now?

[Laurie]

Not really.

[Layla]

Okay. No. Do you want to be the face of your business?

[Laurie]

Like 50 50? I mean, I would love to if it reduces CAC and I think it would. Do I want to be on camera every day? Like. No, but. Yeah, but it helps the business.

[Layla]

Yes. It sounds like your goal is to sell the business.

[Laurie]

Yes.

[Layla]

Understood. So I would think about it through a few frames. One, it has to be aligned with your personal preferences. So if people don't like being on camera making content, get. And when I say that some people like being on camera making content, you also have to be okay with being judged. People hating on you, people shitting on you, because you're going to get that too. And if you're not good at accepting that and you're just. It's going to be a thing and it's going to be like a whole thing, they don't do it. The second piece is when it comes to the business, which is if you're sitting outside of this, like I'm sitting outside looking at your business thinking, okay, well, what business would I want to buy? Right. When you get to 50 million, acquire it. Probably not the one that you're the face of, but if you have five celebrities that are endorsing it, that's much more appealing to me. Now, is it appealing that you can get somebody that's not a celebrity to endorse it? Yes. Does that need to be. You know, it is an immense time commitment to make Content. When I ran gym launch and nobody knew who I was, that was much easier because I didn't have to do anything on camera. Right. And it is a large time commitment. And so I think you're in a really great position right now that you have a celebrity that is pushing so much to the brand. And I would personally be thinking, how do I get more of that? Because could you? Yes. Do I think this is the business, given what you said, your goals are like, if you were like, I want to own this business forever, I'm so passionate about skincare, then I'd be like, okay, yeah, maybe we should do that. But it sounds misaligned with the goal of starting the business in general. So I agree with you. I think that it makes a lot of sense to go the route of finding other celebrities and even just even micro celebrities to endorse it rather than you doing it. It is going to be a learning curve because here's the thing, too. The moment you make content, you're not going to be great at it at first. Like, it's going to take time to get the hang of it. You got to build a whole social team because you're going to try agencies, you're going to realize they don't get the brand. Then you have to bring them in house, you have to train them. Then you're gonna still be sucking on camera a little bit. It's like a whole thing. I think your business is more appealing if it were the celebrity route.

[Madhu]

There's a million ways you can make a business without making content. I think you have to play to your strengths. And I know a lot of people who have very large businesses worth billions of dollars and nobody knows who they are. And I think there's actually probably more of those than you would think. So if it's not your natural strength and it's not something that you have an interest in getting good at and you don't have the time or resources to wait and get good at it, then, like, why do it? You don't need to be the phase of your business that's not gonna business better. Some businesses it will make worse. And I think specifically, if you're looking to sell your business and you have ways to acquire customers that don't involve your face, that's probably a better way to go.

[Laurie]

So with the celebrity route, there's like pros and cons to it. Working with celebrities or influencers in general, it costs money, right? So it actually does cost, like, internal staff. Like, there's a lot of you know, scripting that we have to do for them, and we essentially become their social media agency. Right. And so I'm curious if you have any thoughts on how to, like, build a support team to support celebrities or influencers?

[Layla]

You know, in that instance, I think what you have to do is figure out what's working well for the one that you have. Mindy.

[Laurie]

Yeah.

[Layla]

And then almost build out like your endorsement toolkit. So rather than having to rely so much on your team to be giving them all these things, it's like, what can you make now ahead of time as assets that you can provide to them so that they almost have like a knowledge base that they get to walk into. Because I think of it like templates.

[Madhu]

Yes.

[Layla]

Because it doesn't matter how big they are. Like, I can make a kit that is like, here's onboarding with us, here's everything to know, here's who to contact for what. Like, it's almost like onboarding a giant customer for enterprise. And then you have their toolkit that they can access that has all the things that they can go to at any point in time. Now, do you want to have someone to facilitate that? Yes. But ultimately, if you build systems, because you have one already, you can build that. Now. If you didn't have one, you would have to get the people and then they would have to build the systems. Because you have one, you can build the system and then bring people in to help implement or support the system, which is going to be a lot lower headcount and cost.

[Laurie]

Yeah, that totally makes sense. I never thought about doing that. Thanks.

[Layla]

Yeah, absolutely. Hi, Lila.

[Unknown]

Hi, my name's Laurie. I sell tutoring to college students who want to go to medical school. We do a half million in revenue. I'd like to be at a million this year and then scale from there. Main thing that's stopping me is I am the magical six armed woman right now in the business. How do you go from being the person who's doing it all to the person who's managing people who are doing it when it's not really the area that you're necessarily that great at?

[Layla]

Yeah. Are you doing the things right now and you're looking to hire people to do the things you're not that good at?

[Unknown]

Well, I'm looking to. I'm doing all the things. So other than the delivery, I'm. I am the show.

[Layla]

So you are doing them and you're also looking to bring people in to do them, but you don't know how to do them.

[Unknown]

I mean, I. I guess I know how to do it because I'm doing it. Yeah, okay, that's.

[Laurie]

That's true.

[Layla]

Yeah.

[Unknown]

But I also. I feel like I don't necessarily. So I've tried before and hired really shitty people, and then I've tried, I've hired okay people and managed them pretty shittily.

[Layla]

I would say this. Like, when you're bringing someone to do anything, if you're doing all those things right now, the first thing you have to think about is, like, you want to demonstrate, you want to document, you want to duplicate. It's like, before you have somebody, when somebody comes in, no matter what you've done or haven't done, something's working right now, you're doing it, you feel like it's really shitty, but, like, you'd be surprised at, like, how good it is compared to some people going to come in because you just, you know what you need to do for your business, and it's. You have a lot more discretionary effort that you unlock. So what I'd say is, anyone they bring in, like, say you're doing the accounting right now. I don't know, you're gonna bring them in. You're gonna say, great. You're gonna watch me do it. I want you to document how I'm doing it, and then I wanna watch you do it the way I did it. And listen, I understand there's a lot of shit we could do different. We can talk about that later, But I need you to at least do what I'm fucking doing right now. That's the first thing is like, no matter the experience, no matter how much you don't know what you're doing, like, you need them to at least do what you're doing and not deviate from that plan in the short term. That's the first thing. The second thing is I like the awareness of, like, you're like, I'm not good at these things. Great. So if you can bring people in who are good at them, that's what we want to do. The reason for it is this. If you don't really know much about the function, and you certainly don't know it well enough to teach it, then you want to bring in more experienced people than you did in the other areas.

[Unknown]

Right?

[Layla]

Because if I have more proficiency in an area, I have more wiggle room as to who I hire because I have the ability to train them in that area more than I do for, like, if I hired somebody to do, like, I don't know, engineering I'm fucked. I don't know how to guide. I don't even. Python, what the fuck? And nothing. Nothing. Fucking nothing. And so I'm like, listen, you need to be really fucking proficient because if you're ever stuck on anything, like, please look the other way because I'm not helping you. If you're going to bring people in to help you, how much support can you provide them? And if it's like, okay, I actually can't, like, I can't help you get better at your job. I can't tell you when you're doing something technically incorrect. But I can tell you if you're misaligned with our culture, if you're misaligned with our values. Learning how to manage people who are not, who do something that you don't know how to do is the art of being able to sniff out bullshit. It's like common sense. When there are no results being produced, you need to investigate that and say, like, that's, you know, because at the end of the day, it's like, if. Whether they work two hours a day or they work eight hours a day, like, you want to focus on, like, is the result occurring for the business that I need to have happen, right? And then if that's not happening, then it's like, okay, that's reason to investigate. I think what you want to do ahead of time if you don't know how to do the function, is define the result. So every job description I have, you can look on our website. I do a format where it's like, role responsibilities, results. So I want to know what are the results that they are responsible for. So if I'm hiring somebody to come in and say, it's like, run accounting. It's like, okay, deliver P L by day five of every month, right? Like, make sure all AR&AOP are taken care of by, you know, end of day every day. And by Friday, the inboxes are cleared by like, I would just go through and say, like, what are the results I want to occur as a fact of hiring this person? And then I hold them accountable to those results with the expectation that they know that I can't help them, how to get there. I'm like, listen, this needs to happen. No fucking idea how do you turn to do it, but do you know how to do this? And they're like, yeah, I know how to do that. I've been doing that for three years. You're like, great. And I can never help you train to get better.

[Madhu]

So to a degree you have to understand everything enough to know if somebody is a low performer fraudulent. You do need to know enough to that degree. So that's just what it means to be I think the CEO is like your head generalist of the company essentially like you know a lot about a lot is essentially where you get to eventually and then at first it's like you know a little about a lot but eventually it's been doing it for a long time. You know a lot about a lot if you don't know how to do a function and you're trying to hire somebody who can interview 10 people and treat the interviews like research sessions and what you'll see after you've done 10 interviews is there will be a common thread. There will be three to five things that every person says and then those are the things that are most important that the person gets done that you do hire.

[Unknown]

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense.

[Layla]

Okay, great.

[Unknown]

Thank you.

[Layla]

Of course.