Build Your Tribe | Grow Your Business with Social Media
Episode: How To Beat the Instagram Algorithm in 2025 | Reacting to My Interview with Adam Mosseri - 829
Release Date: April 17, 2025
Host: Brock Johnson
In this compelling episode of Build Your Tribe, host Brock Johnson delves deep into his recent interview with Adam Mosseri, the head of Instagram. The discussion revolves around navigating and mastering the Instagram algorithm in 2025, offering invaluable insights for entrepreneurs, content creators, and business owners aiming to amplify their presence on the platform. Brock not only reacts to key segments of the interview but also addresses listener questions and provides his expert analysis on evolving social media dynamics.
1. Reaction to the Interview
a. DM Automation on Instagram
Brock initiates the episode by addressing a pivotal topic from his conversation with Mosseri: Direct Message (DM) Automation. He highlights the confusion surrounding its permissibility and functionality within Instagram's ecosystem.
Brock Johnson [09:00]: "DM automation is an absolutely essential tool for growing a business on Instagram... If you comment this word, you'll receive this automated message."
Mosseri clarifies the platform's stance, emphasizing that DM automation through approved partners remains permissible despite previous ambiguities.
Adam Mosseri [05:51]: "Using direct message automation through an approved partner is allowed and approved on Instagram."
Brock reflects on the importance of DM automation, especially as a strategy to maintain post engagement without pushing followers away by directing them off-platform.
b. Instagram’s Priorities: Supporting Creators
A significant portion of the interview centers on Instagram's commitment to becoming the premier platform for creators. Mosseri outlines key initiatives aimed at enhancing content discoverability and supporting small creators.
Adam Mosseri [05:51]: "We want to be the best platform for creators... one of their explicit priorities is that they want to help small creators break out."
Brock concurs, noting Instagram's strides to improve search functionality and SEO, which are crucial for long-term content visibility.
Brock Johnson [06:10]: "Instagram's search, Instagram's SEO is not great... They are working to improve it and there are already things that are being rolled out."
c. Evolution of SEO and Discoverability
Discussing the diminishing role of hashtags, Brock explains how Instagram's algorithm has advanced to interpret content more intelligently, reducing reliance on manual categorization.
Adam Mosseri [08:25]: "It's disproportionately looking at the caption relative to the video, relative to the audio, relative to the comments, in that order."
Brock Johnson [08:36]: "The algorithm can determine what your content is, so we have to do less work to tell it."
He underscores the transition from hashtag dependency to a more nuanced content analysis, advocating for organic keyword integration within captions.
d. Metrics for Increasing Reach: Watch Time, Likes, Shares
A critical takeaway from Mosseri’s insights is the prioritization of watch time, likes, and shares as the top metrics influencing content reach.
Adam Mosseri [12:52]: [Discussion on metrics]
Brock Johnson [13:09]: "The three best ways to get more views on Instagram... watch time, likes, and shares."
Brock elaborates on each metric, emphasizing that while watch time and likes enhance engagement, shares are pivotal for viral potential as they directly connect content between users.
e. Clarifying Shadow Banning
The conversation also tackles the contentious issue of shadow banning. Mosseri explains that while Instagram may limit the visibility of content that hovers in grey areas, it's a misinterpretation to label it outright shadow banning.
Brock Johnson [14:56]: "The majority of people who believe they are shadow banned are not... It's more about content in the gray area."
He reassures listeners that both extremist content and content in ambiguous zones face reduced recommendations, clarifying common misconceptions surrounding shadow bans.
f. Impact of Posting Activity on the Algorithm
Addressing listener curiosities, Brock discusses whether active engagement around posting times affects algorithmic favorability.
Adam Mosseri [20:17]: "Not directly."
Brock reflects on this revelation, aligning it with his philosophy of posting and ghosting—encouraging consistent posting without undue stress over constant engagement.
g. Disappointment Over Live Features
A surprising element from the interview was Mosseri’s admission of no new developments for Instagram Live in 2025, contrasting sharply with the advancements seen on platforms like Twitch and TikTok.
Brock Johnson [22:21]: "It was disappointing to hear that they have no plans for live in 2025."
Nevertheless, Brock remains optimistic about future enhancements and the potential integration of advanced DM automation features with Live.
h. The Decline in Reach: Supply vs. Demand
Brock presents data from a December 2024 Metricool study, revealing a substantial decline in post reach across various content types.
Brock Johnson [25:08]: "Reach from feed was down by 44% on Reels, Carousel's reach was down by 58%... a social media recession caused by a supply-demand imbalance."
He attributes this decline to the exponential increase in content creation outpacing user engagement, highlighting Instagram's staggering 857 million feed posts daily compared to other platforms.
Brock Johnson [25:18]: "857 million feed posts made per day on Instagram... compare that to YouTube’s 2.6 to 3.7 million videos daily."
This hyper-saturation underscores the necessity for creators to either elevate content quality, increase posting frequency, or adopt a hybrid approach to stand out.
i. Diverse Content Types on Instagram
Highlighting Instagram’s versatility, Brock praises the platform's ability to cater to various content creators, from long-form video enthusiasts to photographers and live streamers.
Brock Johnson [31:18]: "There are so many different kinds of posts that you can make on Instagram... a seat for everyone at the table."
He contrasts this with other platforms, emphasizing Instagram’s unique capacity to support diverse content strategies within a single ecosystem.
j. Partner Ads: A Future Avenue for Monetization
Mosseri introduces Partner Ads, a feature designed to facilitate collaborations between creators and brands, enhancing monetization opportunities.
Adam Mosseri [32:49]: "Partner ads allow you to create content as a creator and then have the brand use your creative for their own ads."
Brock sees this as a game-changer, enabling small creators to secure more transparent and lucrative brand deals akin to major YouTubers.
2. Addressing Listener Questions and Comments
Brock transitions to interacting with his audience, tackling a range of questions and feedback inspired by the interview.
a. Video Length: Long Form vs. Short Form
Listener Andreas Ruckert inquires about the demarcation between long-form and short-form videos on Instagram.
Brock Johnson: "If a video is longer than three minutes, it is considered long-form and less likely to be recommended."
He explains that content under three minutes qualifies as Reels, aligning with Instagram's push for engaging, concise videos.
b. Instagram Jail: To Start Fresh or Persist?
Seawolf13:30 poses a question on whether to create a new account if facing what users term as "Instagram jail"—a drop in post visibility without clear violations.
Brock Johnson: "There is no actual Instagram jail unless you have content violations. If you’re consistently not growing, consider starting a new account."
He advises using strategic criteria before deciding to abandon an existing account, linking to prior episodes for comprehensive guidance.
c. Hashtags vs. SEO
JBZ Rugs challenges the shift away from hashtags, arguing that specific hashtags aid SEO and visibility.
Brock Johnson: "The algorithm can determine what your content is, reducing the need for hashtags. Avoid keyword stuffing; instead, integrate relevant terms naturally within your captions."
He reiterates that Instagram's advanced AI now comprehensively understands content without relying heavily on hashtags, promoting organic keyword use over strategic tagging.
d. Nostalgia vs. Current Instagram Experience
Stephanie Roberts shares her sentiment that Instagram has lost its original charm, becoming overly competitive and less enjoyable.
Brock Johnson: "While Instagram has evolved, offering more advanced content opportunities, the essence has shifted to the attention economy. However, the platform still holds vast potential for creators and businesses."
He acknowledges the nostalgic yearning for Instagram's simpler days but emphasizes the platform's continued value in today’s digital landscape.
3. Overall Thoughts and Takeaways
Concluding the episode, Brock distills his reflections and actionable insights from the interview with Mosseri.
a. Maintain Composure Amidst Algorithm Changes
Brock Johnson: "Everyone needs to take a chill pill and focus on making higher quality content or increasing quantity to navigate the supply-demand imbalance."
He encourages creators to remain calm and adapt by enhancing content quality or scaling their output, acknowledging the challenging yet opportunistic nature of Instagram in 2025.
b. Genuine Understanding from Instagram’s Leadership
Brock commends Mosseri for his authentic and empathetic approach towards creators' frustrations, affirming that Instagram is actively seeking to balance business growth with user satisfaction.
Brock Johnson: "He seems like such a genuine guy, someone who is motivated by having a positive impact on the world through Instagram."
c. Embracing Instagram’s Versatility for Business Growth
Despite the challenges, Brock remains optimistic about Instagram's potential as a robust platform for business growth, emphasizing strategic content creation and leveraging new features like Partner Ads.
Brock Johnson: "I still believe that Instagram actually is the best platform for small business owners and content creators."
4. Final Thoughts and Encouragement
Brock wraps up the episode by reinforcing key strategies for audience members to thrive on Instagram:
- Enhance Content Quality: Focus on creating engaging, high-quality posts that naturally attract and retain attention.
- Increase Posting Frequency: Adapt to the platform's saturation by scaling content output to maintain visibility.
- Leverage Diverse Content Types: Utilize Instagram’s multifaceted tools—Reels, Stories, Live, etc.—to cater to varied audience preferences.
- Adopt Strategic Tools: Implement scheduling tools like Metricool to ensure consistency and optimize post timing.
He also promotes his Insta ClubHub, a resource designed to keep creators updated with Instagram’s evolving features and algorithm changes, offering a trial with exclusive benefits.
Brock Johnson: "Subscribe if you haven’t already. Happy Networking. Instagram is a beast... but with the right strategies, you can master it."
This episode serves as a comprehensive guide for navigating Instagram's complex algorithm in 2025, blending expert insights from Adam Mosseri with actionable advice from Brock Johnson. Whether you're a seasoned entrepreneur or an aspiring content creator, the strategies discussed provide a roadmap to not only survive but thrive in the ever-competitive landscape of social media.