Dan Bongino Gets Heated After Heckler Calls Him a “Coward” | MAGA Mondays

Summary

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Bulwark Takes: Dan Bongino Gets Heated After Heckler Calls Him a “Coward” | MAGA Mondays

Podcast: Bulwark Takes
Episode Date: March 23, 2026
Hosts: Sam & Will

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Episode Overview

This episode of Bulwark Takes' MAGA Mondays dives deep into the recent public heckling of Dan Bongino, structural rifts inside the MAGA and right-wing influencer communities, and comedic tales from the world of conservative online drama. The hosts, Sam and Will, bring their trademark irreverent, razor-sharp analysis to incidents involving Bongino, Turning Point USA, James O’Keefe, James Fishback, and more, exposing the mounting infighting and spectacle among MAGA “stars.”

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Key Topics & Discussion Points

1. Dan Bongino Heckled in Florida (01:15 – 10:12)

• Incident Recap:
  • Dan Bongino, formerly a popular right-wing podcaster and brief deputy FBI director, was heckled at a Florida event by January 6th participants and Proud Boys.
  • Notable heckle: “Don’t be a coward, Dan... Don’t be afraid of Satan!” (03:31, Drew McIntyre).
• Event Context:
  • Bongino faces anger from MAGA grassroots for "not going after the Epstein associates" or "fighting the deep state."
  • Will breaks down how Bongino, despite trying to out-MAGA MAGA figures, is now caught in the “crosswinds” of the movement, attacked by extremists for not being “pure” enough.
• Online Fallout:
  • Proud Boys leader Enrique Tarrio mocks Bongino online: “My insider says Dan Bongino just got mog.” (05:32, Will).
• Analysis of MAGA Careers:
  • Sam asks if anyone comes out of Trump’s orbit "better off." Will argues only those who become critics (e.g., Miles Taylor) escape with reputation intact; loyalists end up “used up.”
  • Bongino's podcast relaunch is struggling, facing declining rankings and loss of MAGA support.

2. Why the “Trump Allies” Always Get the Blame (08:11 – 11:02)

• Right-wing extremist grievances (like lack of mass arrests) are projected onto Trump’s staffers, not Trump himself.
• Will posits it's psychological: “These guys...almost went to prison over their devotion to Trump. It’s hard for them to be like, ‘He’s a pedophile protector.’”
• “Everywhere he goes, we will call him a pedophile protector for the rest of his life. Which is not something you want.” (09:07, Will quoting an online comment).

3. Bongino’s Response & MAGA Infighting (10:12 – 12:02)

• Bongino's Retaliation: He claps back at critics by posting “buffoonish” edits of his hecklers (e.g., making them look like Santa’s elves).
• Trying to ‘Clean Up MAGA’: Bongino has openly opposed “the crazies” like QAnon and Nick Fuentes.
• “He’s a real, like, hater...I'm going to clean this MAGA movement up.” (10:24, Will).

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4. Turning Point USA Afterparty and the Family Values Schism (12:28 – 18:39)

• Controversial Video:
  • A resurfaced clip shows a bikini-clad woman with an American flag dancing in a cocktail glass at a TPUSA afterparty—sparking claims of hypocrisy and biblical “immodesty.”
  • Will attributes the party to James O’Keefe’s “bourbon bastards” strain of conservatism, distinct from Turning Point’s current “evangelical turn.”
• Online Complaints:
  • Former staffer Matt Tuccioroni tweets: “A half naked woman...Straight up flag code, disrespect and total cultural compromise. Where’s the biblical modesty?” (15:42, Will quoting tweet).

5. James O’Keefe’s Partying & Project Veritas Backstory (17:22 – 19:24)

• O’Keefe responds that people are mad about “fun” at his parties—he’s infamous for musical theater pursuits and “choreographed” party routines.
• “Famously, he got in trouble...because they said, why are you spending all our money on, like, your choreography? He starred in the musical Oklahoma...” (18:12, Will).

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6. James Fishback’s Fast Food Drama & Debt (22:14 – 28:30)

• Fishback—a fringe Florida gubernatorial candidate and self-styled provocateur—was refused entry to Mar-A-Lago, then live-tweeted trips to Taco Bell and other fast food as “protest.”
  • “I was denied entry to Mar-a-Lago tonight...Next stop, Taco Bell.” (22:22, Sam quoting Fishback).
• Minions & MAGA Social Clout:
  • Will notes the proliferation of right-wing “minions” (paid underlings sent to heckle or viral-storm rivals).
  • “Back in my day, Laura Loomer did her own loomering. Now...it’s a status symbol...” (24:26, Will).
• Fishback’s Massive Debts:
  • Owes over $2 million in legal judgments and unpaid advances (including legal fees, repossessed Teslas, campaign cash).
  • Fishback’s own lawyers quit: “Now the debts keep piling up. As far as I know, he doesn’t have lawyers anymore.” (26:13, Will).

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7. Fishback’s Populist Appeal—And Worries (28:59 – 31:18)

• Fishback’s racial/nationalist themes do resonate: “He comes up in these focus groups that we’ve done...especially young people. The people looking, like, you know, that guy’s got some good ideas.” (29:59, Sam).
• Will: “Our moderator will ask...‘who’s someone in the media you like?’ and they say, I love James Fishback. I love that he wants to tax OnlyFans creators at 50%...”

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8. MAGA’s Dueling Moods: Religious Zeal vs. Wild Party Vibes (31:18 – 34:25)

• Will notes Nick Fuentes’ comment: “I want to hang out with normies because they’re cool, but then they get mad at me for being racist. But I don’t want to hang out with all these chuds, these right wingers, because they’re a bunch of losers.” (31:18, Will paraphrasing Fuentes).
• Ongoing tension between moral strictness (“no cocktails, biblical modesty”) and old-school “party hard” right activism.

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9. Erica Kirk & the “Alo Yoga” Scandal (34:25 – 37:50)

• Online crowd (fanned by Candace Owens’ circle) attacks Erica Kirk for “shopping for yoga pants” the day after her husband’s assassination, based on a leaked Alo Yoga purchase.
• Will: “The argument from the Erica camp, which I find pretty believable, is...No one had time to pack a change of clothes. And so Erica gave one of her associates a credit card and said, go buy clothes for X number of people at Alo...” (35:29, Will).
• Sam: “Who gives a shit?...Congrats on your Pulitzer. Who cares?” (36:43, Sam).

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10. Candace Owens: The Central Instigator

• Candace Owens’ audience now “craves” only drama about Charlie and Erica Kirk—not bigger issues like Iran (37:26–37:50).
• Will: “Once...she’s got to get back in line and talk about what the audience really craves.”

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• On the Bongino Heckling:
  • “Don’t be a coward, Dan.” —Heckler at Bongino event (03:31)
  • “You can see there, he just looks...I mean, he’s a husk of a man.” —Will (06:08)
• On Turning Point USA Party:
  • “A half naked woman in a giant wine glass full of water...Straight up flag code, disrespect and total cultural compromise. Where’s the biblical modesty?” —(15:42, quoted tweet)
• On MAGA Careers:
  • “Trump kind of uses you up.” —Will (06:08)
• On Minions:
  • “Back in my day, Laura Loomer did her own loomering...Now, it’s a status symbol.” —Will (24:26)
• On Fishback's Debt:
  • “He’s in comical amounts of debt. This is a fun subplot.” —Will (25:20)
• On MAGA Mood:
  • “I think it sort of reflects the mood of the right-wing ecosystem...people are just getting into a lot of weird stuff.” —Will (32:28)

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Thematic Takeaways

• The MAGA movement is turning inward, with infighting and personal vendettas overshadowing broader political ambitions or unity.
• Allegiances to Trump remain strong among the grassroots, but blame for failures or unfulfilled promises is heaped on staffers, not the leader.
• The influencer ecosystem is fragmenting, with economic troubles, public scandals, and generational divides cleaving the movement.
• Petty dramas, online callouts, and spectacle now dominate the right’s online spaces, often eclipsing substantive issues—an observation echoed by both Sam and Will.
• The future for Trump's ex-allies is bleak: “There’s not much life after Trump. Dan, if you’re watching this...we’d love to have you on MAGA Monday.” —Sam (12:02)

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Segment Timestamps

• [01:15] – Show kick-off & overview of the Bongino saga
• [03:31] – Play/Debrief of Bongino heckling video
• [05:19] – Proud Boys’ online mockery of Bongino
• [06:08] – Discussion: Loyalty to Trump & fallout for allies
• [08:11] – Why Bongino, not Trump, gets blamed
• [10:24] – Bongino’s attempts to ‘clean up’ MAGA
• [12:28] – Turning Point USA afterparty controversy
• [15:42] – TPUSA criticism tweet read
• [18:12] – James O’Keefe’s party habits & Veritas drama
• [22:22] – James Fishback: Mar-a-Lago denial & fast food stunts
• [24:26] – Rise of “minions” in MAGA influencer culture
• [25:20] – Fishback’s mounting debts & legal woes
• [31:18] – Will & Sam on the party/vs/piety split in the movement
• [34:25] – Erica Kirk’s “Alo Yoga” faux scandal
• [37:26] – Candace Owens and the primacy of drama
• [39:34] – Closing remarks and programming note

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Final Thoughts

This episode offers a panoramic, often hilarious look at the messy state of the MAGA right and adjacent conservative influencers. From Bongino’s downfall to influencer drama and the endless churn of scandal, Sam and Will weave detail, mockery, and exasperation into a must-listen guide to right-wing internet culture in 2026.

Quote to sum it up:
"There’s not much life after Trump.” —Sam (12:02)

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Recommended for: Anyone curious about the inside drama, cliques, and absurdities of post-Trump MAGA-land—no prior listening required.

Transcript

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[Sam]

All right, we are back. I can't believe they're letting us do this again. The but the numbers are off the charts. Let's just be clear for Maga Mondays. This is the show. People are buzzing about it. People are jealous of it. The industry can't stop talking about how successful this program is that we are now starting Maga Mondays, me and Will every Monday talking about the weird stuff that happened on the Internet over the weekend. So welcome. We're here March 23, 10:00am Will, how you doing man? You good?

[Will]

Good. I. I'm glad to be back. It was a busy weekend for this beat. I was having so much fun. People seeing false flag. What the what the latest topic was. I was just digging in. I spent all my weekend nights doing it and I thought, God, funny, I thought, what a fun game. Like I was thinking about a new video game and I was like, it's not a game. You know, it was looking at court records. But that's. That's what there is out me I For folks who.

[Sam]

Who are unfamiliar, Will's social life is very sad. He spends a lot of his time on the Internet just talking to Thing, looking at things, trying to find weird stuff, and then he brings it to you, and you can reward him by being a subscriber to the bulk. All right, so look, I'm. I'm not going to, like, sugarcoat this. I don't want to, like, pretend like the stuff we're about to talk about is, you know, significant in any. Any stretch of the imagination. It's not. You could probably just sign off if you want to. We have, like, a war in Iran. We have a DHS shutdown. We have TSA shut down. We have lines at the airports. We have a crash this morning at LaGuardia Tragedy. Two people dead. All that stuff is serious and real. And we're not going to talk about it. We're going to talk about Dan Bongino is where we're starting. So I'll just. You know, for folks who don't know who Dan is, Dan is a podcaster extraordinaire who then went and served as the deputy director of the FBI. Not the, like, best tenure, I would say. I think it was pretty choppy. He left after about a year, and he just decided he's going to go back into the podcast game. But it has not been as smooth as probably he had hoped. And so let's play this video, and then when we are done, Will's going to explain the exact context here. So let's watch Dan Bongino getting absolutely heckled at some event.

[Drew McIntyre]

Don't be a coward, Dan.

[Sam]

Hey, you're gonna be trespassed. This might be.

[Drew McIntyre]

You might feel like you're God's watch. Remember what we sow. God's watching us go all out against the deep state. Don't be afraid. Don't be afraid of Satan, man. I'm telling you, I'm ready. I'm ready to be in Congress. I'm ready. I plan on it. I'm not afraid of Hillary. I'm not. God bless you, man.

[Will]

There's a second guy.

[Sam]

I'm.

[Drew McIntyre]

I'm here in love. D.

[Sam]

All right, what was that? Honestly?

[Will]

Okay, so this is some event in Florida. I haven't quite nailed that down, but, you know, gosh, Bongino, he looks tired, right? So obviously Bongino's, you know, people are mad at him because he didn't get the Epstein associates. He, you know, didn't take on the deep state as much as they might have liked. So you have there the first guy who confronts him as a J6 guy named Nate Tuck, who got in some fights with, you know, cops at January 6th and was convicted and obviously was later pardoned. And you can see him saying to Bongino, don't be afraid of Satan, man. And then Bongino. Bongino says, well, and he's done this before. He'll say, like, well, why don't you try it? And these people are like, the deputy FBI director, I guess I can't really. You know, it's sort of like he's trying to do a thing like, why don't you enlist? But it doesn't really work for the FBI, so. And then you can see there's another guy who I think was also a January 6th guy who starts yelling at him and uses some, you know, some slurs and things like this. And then. Then Bongino is just, like, so over it.

[Sam]

Well, let's put. I mean, clearly Bongino got the worst of this because there's a couple of folks out there who have been laughing at him, and one of them is Enrique Tarrio, who. Let's put up the tweet if we have it.

[Will]

There you go. I should say Nate Tuck, the January 6th guy, is also a proud boy. And so here we have the head of the proud boys saying, my insider says Dan Bongino just got mog.

[Sam]

You know, I don't feel bad for Dan Bongino, but I do think there's a larger lesson here about you don't come. You just don't come out of service to Trump looking good. Is there someone who. I'm trying to prepare a little bit more, but has there ever been someone who joined the administration or allied up with Trump in and ended up for the better for it, like, came out and was like, yeah, my career is just far superior.

[Will]

Well, I was going to say maybe people who then sort of abandoned Trump, like, like Miles Taylor, you know, people

[Sam]

who became like, Trump critics.

[Will]

Right. But, but, but, but, I mean, I think, like, in terms of, like, people who stuck with Trump. Not really. I mean, I think he kind of uses you up. I mean, Bongino looks like. I mean, number one, I will say his podcast, now that it's back, is not doing well. It's, like sliding down the podcast rankings. And a lot of his critics on the right have been making a lot out of that. You know, additionally, you know, you can see there, he just looks. I mean, he's a husk of a man, you know, and he's, you know, the. The thing where he kind of cryptically says, you know, like the. The January 6th guy says something like, don't be afraid or something. He's like, yeah, man, you can't be afraid. Like, like, like, he looks like. He's like, barely.

[Sam]

Therefore, let's, let's stick for the podcast rankings for a little bit. What do we make of that? I. I've seen Ben Shapiro's losing YouTube subscribers and, and kind of spectacular fashion. I wouldn't wish that on anyone. Even my worst enemies. Please subscribe to this. But Bongino and the podcast ratings, I mean, like, is there. Is there something larger to. To divine from that? Is. Is the appetite not there for that type of. I won't even call them, like, moderate podcasters because there's clearly maga. But what, what, what do you make of it?

[Will]

Yeah, I mean, you know, I think this is something that I, That I talk about at fall in False flag. Excuse me.

[Sam]

Oh, look at you.

[Will]

This is so. So this is something that I talk about. So the, you know, there is kind of this idea that I think this kind of insurgent group, whether it's Tucker, Candace, Nick Fuentes, anti Israel people, more anti Semitic, often, they have a lot more dynamism behind them and a lot more energy. I think Bongino and Shapiro are facing kind of two different challenges. I mean, I think for Shapiro, I think a lot of it does go back to a lot of that Israel stuff. And I think really defending this war is getting very difficult on the right for Bongino in particular. He just has this, like, you failed to get the Epstein guys. I mean, I think the January 6th people are mad because he didn't march out like Merrick Garland in chains specifically over their prosecution. But I think that they're kind of facing some. Some specific issues of their own. But kind of a broader kind of defending Trump, I think is becoming challenging.

[Sam]

But why is that? Why is this Bongino's problem? I mean, like, I get he was a deputy of the FBI, you know, but, like, why does Trump never get blamed for this? Right? So they want the Epstein files completely unsealed. They want Comey thrown in jail. They want Obama and Hillary arrested. And it's always that they failed to do or they've failed Trump in this pursuit. But clearly Trump's the one who obviously would demand it and get it. Like, why do they never go after Trump for this stuff?

[Will]

I mean, I think it's an emotional thing, right? I mean, these guys that. Let's take these January six guys. I mean, they almost went to prison over their devotion to Trump. And so it's hard for them to be like, he's a pedophile protector. Right. They have to blame the President's untrustworthy advisers.

[Sam]

But what do they want? What they really think that Dan Bongino could have gone in there and just arrested people?

[Will]

I mean, apparently, I think, you know, he took a lot of heat. I mean, admittedly, he was a guy, not like kind of these faceless FBI bureaucrats. I mean, he was the guy who was like, we're going to get to the bottom of Epstein. So I think that's why now he's in hot water. I saw someone say, everywhere he goes, we will call him a pedophile protector for the rest of his life. Which is not something you want.

[Sam]

No, it's not ideal. What does he do going forward? I mean, he's obviously going to do his podcast. But it's so funny, because if you do throw your hat into the ring and you want to go into service for Trump, you know that you're basically, you know, that's it. Like, look at Gates, for instance. Like, Matt Gates didn't even get a chance to be Attorney General, and he's now a News Nation. I think it's News Nation. Right? It's News Nation.

[Will]

Oh, oh.

[Sam]

And sorry. And like, I mean, fine, whatever. It's. It's a career. But it's like, that's not it. Like, that's not what he wanted. I mean, these folks, I find it odd. And are they just going to do this for, you know, a couple decades and right off into the sunset, Bongino is going to be haunted by this with his own people.

[Will]

Yeah. I mean, you know, Bongino is unique because he's a very pugnacious guy himself. And so the second part of the story is he's been retweeting unflattering edits of the guys who confronted them.

[Sam]

Oh, really?

[Will]

Making them look like Santa's elves or, like, other kind of buffoonish things. So. So that's how he's responding. And, you know, he's like a real, like, hater. Right. I mean, when he got out of the administration, he was like, I'm going to clean this MAGA movement up. And he wasn't naming people, but he was basically saying, like, I'm going to get Tucker. I'm going to get Nick Fuentes. You know, he famously hated QAnon. He's like, I'm going to get these psychos out of our otherwise respectable movement. And so, you know, he's. He's going to keep fighting. But. But I think these guys, you know, like, what Are you going to say, like some crazy J6 guys shouting at you? I mean, it's hard to engage with them. And so that's why Bongino just kind of starts shouting right back.

[Sam]

Well, it also raises the question, I guess, like, what happens with Cash, right? So Cash Patel's still there, obviously. Haven't seen, you know, there's rumors that he was going to be on the odds. Obviously that's not the case. There was a lot of grumblings, I suppose, among the podcaster types about how lame it looked that he was partying up with the hockey team. But if you're Cash, you look at this and you're like, what's my next gig after this? Right? Like, what do I go to after this? You could potentially just kind of be a Trump sycophant and just kind of hang around the administration and do that. And you could probably go into some sort of K Street business or influence peddling business or whatever. You know, launch a crypto firm, maybe a sneaker line. But, like, you're not going to be, you're not involved in politics after this, right? This is the last stop and Bongino is not going back into government service ever again. My.

[Will]

Yeah, I mean, if you're Cash, maybe you're like, gosh, I, I can't leave the FBI.

[Sam]

I can't.

[Will]

I got to hope President Newsom doesn't fire me. I got to.

[Sam]

Well, President Newsom will definitely fire you, but you just stay as long as you can because there's just not much afterwards, not much life after Trump. Dan, if you're, if you're, if you're watching this, and I assume you are, obviously, we'd love to have you on MAGA Monday, next Monday to discuss what happened here. And we'll be a little bit more receptive than those proud boys were to you. What was it? Don't fear Satan.

[Will]

Don't fear, don't. You can't be afraid of Satan, man. And he's like, that's so true.

[Sam]

Are you? Yeah, I am afraid of saying, I gotta be honest. Okay, hard pivot. TPUSA. So you were, you surfaced this 2024 video. It's been sparking drama on the Right. I guess it's because TPUSA is supposed to be family values of some sort, I guess. And then here's this after party video that is decidedly not. Let's play the video and then we could talk about it on the other side. Look at that. Is there no audio on this?

[Will]

Yeah, there's, there's no sound on this. Yeah. Va va voom. So you have a lady in. In kind of a bikini, dancing in a giant cocktail glass. She hasn't. She's draped in an American flag.

[Sam]

My question is, why did they put liquid in there?

[Will]

Yeah, that's. That makes it really gross. Right. I feel like otherwise it would be okay. But so you have it. You know, she's flashing it out. I know. First rose will get wet. And so it's kind of surrounded by this CR crowd and as a nightclub setting, desecrating the flag. Oh, and that's come up.

[Sam]

What is going on here?

[Will]

Yes.

[Sam]

And so doesn't look safe.

[Will]

Yeah.

[Sam]

Okay. So.

[Will]

So the backstory there is obviously after. Amid all the Candace Owens stuff, Turning Point USA is getting a lot of flack. And so this former Turning Point staffer said, you know, this organization is sick. For example, look at this America Fest afterparty I went to, you know, almost two years ago, and they had this lady in a cocktail glass dancing around. This is not a godly organization. Now, the caveat here is that this was a James o' Keefe after party. Now, James o', Keefe, you know, he's kind of a wild man. Famously, when he got kicked out of Project Veritas, they opened his safe and found a pair of women's underwear inside. I mean, so he's more of a. I was thinking about this kind of a, like, the whiskey and cigars, the bourbon bastards type of conservatism that has sort of fallen out of favor amid Turning points kind of evangelical turn. But. But now this. This video resurfaced, and people were saying, like, you know, this is a sick organization.

[Sam]

I suppose I have to have a disclosure at this juncture. When we discuss James o'. Keefe. He and I have a tiny bit of history. It was like 12 years ago or something like that. I was the first journalist that he targeted with his To Catch a Journalist series, where he. He did an undercover sting operation on my journalism professor at Columbia. This is a true story. People can Google this. He. He went on. He had someone pretend to be a prospective journalism student to ask the professor about me, because I had. I had written something about one of his other sting operations. And he got my journalism professor to say that Sam is a good reporter, and one of the things he likes to do is he likes to go out for drinks with his sources and get them drunk so they divulge more information. Which, yeah, I mean, I was fine. I was totally. I was totally fine with that. But I do Feel like I need to disclose this when talking about James o'. Keefe. Let's put. Let's put up the tweet from the XTP USA employee who was complaining that this was not biblical modesty, if we have it here. So who is this guy? Do we know? Is this just a rando?

[Will]

Yeah, this guy worked for. For tbusa. His name is Matt Tuccioroni. I guess kind of a random guy, but he's like, this is what went down. A half naked woman in a giant wine glass full of water grinding sex. She wraps our American flag around her like a cape. Straight up flag code, disrespect and total cultural compromise. Where's the biblical modesty?

[Sam]

Why do we. Why does he.

[Will]

James go keeps like, I'm trying to show you nerds a good time and this is how I'm treated. I mean, this is. We're at this point where the Turning Point brand, I think, is taking so many shots. Last week we saw the University of Arkansas chapter disaffiliate themselves and start kind of the, you know, Americans for National Renewal, you know, they are. I think the brand has been damaged in large part because of Candace's attacks on Turning Point. And so now all these random Turning Point people are coming out of the woodwork and being like, well, there was a lady in a cocktail glass once.

[Sam]

I mean, it's so ridiculous. But it does get to the point that there is a fissure here. Multiple fissures, I should say, happening with tpusa. I mean, it's like the public insistence that this organization has to be a beacon of modesty because they believe in family values is always faulty, obviously. Right. I mean, they throw the most insane over the top conventions. Even if you put aside the, you know, scantly clad dancers in martini glasses or whatever that is. I mean, it's like pyrotechnics all over the place. This is not a place of modesty. James o' Keefe did respond. I'm not sure if he took this one down or not, but let's grab the picture of his response.

[Will]

Yeah, so the backstory here is that James and some other kind of youtubers like Cam Pigby have been trying to prove like, that there's false voter registration in la. La. And so a perhaps homeless man tried to fight them last week. And so James is saying here. Yes. And so he's saying, my team was assaulted Friday while the blood.

[Sam]

Homeless man.

[Will]

Yeah, kind of a person on the margins of society. Someone who was. Who is supposedly doing, like, trying to get Bogus petitions signed.

[Sam]

Okay.

[Will]

While the blood on us was still drying, you post a hot girl dancing 2 years ago at my rave. Not TP USA Music and dancing are fun. We'll work to get people arrested this week for voter fraud, and then I'll DJ at the Miami Music Festival.

[Sam]

This is so ridiculous. This is so ridiculous. I gotta side with James o'. Keefe.

[Will]

I agree. I mean, it is funny. I mean, famously, he got in trouble. Look, this is a guy who loves to party. He loves to throw parties. That's why in Party got kicked out of Project Veritas because they said, why are you spending all our money on, like, your choreography? Yes, he did the. He starred in the musical Oklahoma. And in order to keep his operation, his work running, he, I think, paid for a bunch of people to go down there and sort of run Project Veritas out of the back of the theater.

[Sam]

Okay, so he was. He was. He was in Oklahoma. A musical production.

[Will]

Curly. I think. Yeah.

[Sam]

Okay. And because he was spending so much time doing Oklahoma, he had to pay someone else to run his Project Veritas. Is that how it went down?

[Will]

He had to relocate the staff to the site of the performance, so that.

[Sam]

Where was the performance?

[Will]

I think it was in Virginia or, like, West Virginia. It was off.

[Drew McIntyre]

Off.

[Will]

Off Off Broadway, you know, and. But. But I mean, but also literally, like, he'll spend money on. At these, like, Am Fest, these things. He often throws these after parties, and he'll often do, like, a choreographed dance. He did a big thing to the Prince song controversy where he'll wear, like, a bulletproof vest that says press. And he kind of does some pirouettes.

[Sam]

I guess this is the proper time to alert you to the fact that I got the lead role in Cats. Really? Yeah. The production is actually in Tennessee, and I'm relocating our Washington, D.C. bureau to Knoxville so I can take the lead. I'm just joking. It's Jesus Christ Superstar, not Cats. All right, time for an ad read. We're doing this kind of silly little thing. It's not silly. Got to pay the bills. But we have no. There's just complete non sequiturs where I actually have to read ads because Takes is popular enough that people want to advertise on takes. So this ad read is for Tempo Meals. I actually have done Tempo Meals. It's awesome. Here we go. This time of year, I'm trying to stay consistent with eating well. But between work workouts and commuting, cooking just isn't happening. Tempo gives me fresh, balanced meals ready in two minutes so I can eat the way I want without losing time. During the week, my schedule is non stop meetings, Little league practices, Little League games. Had two of them this weekend. Appearing in great takes like this one with my man Will. And healthy eating is usually the first thing that slips. Tempo keeps me grounded with real meals so I don't default to snack or takeout. Each meal is perfectly portioned for lunch or dinner and ready in just two minutes. That means real food. Means real food real fast without the sad desk lunch. I wish that were true. Or drive through regret. With 20 new recipes every week. Made from nutrient rich ingredients, Tempo keeps things exciting and helps you stay consistent with healthy habits. And with so many recipes, it's convenient but also flexible enough to fit the way you want to eat. For a limited time, Tempo is offering my listeners 60% off your first box. Go to Tempomeals.com BulwarkTakes that's Tempomeals.com Bulwarktakes for 60% off your first box. Once again, that's Tempo Meals.com Bulwarktakes rules and restrictions may apply. Again, I do actually have Tempo Meals, but unfortunately sometimes I do have them at my desk for a sad work lunch. Less sad, I suppose. Okay, let's switch topics a little bit here because this one kind of tickled me because he's an object of our fascination. James Fishback, for folks who don't know him. God, he's polling at 5%, maybe 6%. He's running for governor of Florida. He's insane. He. He has this kind of, of proclivity for going to food joints and getting kicked out or going to restaurants and not getting in and then making a big stink out of it. He likes to create controversy and then whip up some sort of viral video about it. Only this time he went to Mar a Lago, which was an odd choice because he didn't get in. He was not. He was not entry. It's a private club. What do you, what do you think? You could just knock on the door anyways?

[Will]

Well, he's been there before. He's been there before, I should say.

[Sam]

But is he a member?

[Will]

No, no, as far as I know. So, yeah, go ahead. Here.

[Sam]

Well, here's the tweet. He says, I was denied entry to Mar a Lago tonight for a dinner I was invited to last month. I would fact check that. I was told it was over my criticism of Israel in the Iran war. I would fact check that too. Next stop, Taco Bell. Well, that's A bad choice. Why does, why does he do this? I guess it's because we're talking about it.

[Will]

Well, you know, he, he ends up in these situations. You know, he tried to crash some Byron Donald's event, his gubernatorial rival. And they say, well, no, we don. Just let random people blunder in here. He goes, what on earth? They're keeping fish back out. We're going to Dairy Queen.

[Sam]

He always goes to another, like a fast food journey after.

[Will]

This guy is the scourge of Florida fast food restaurants. Because I think, I'm sure the Taco Bell does not want to associate itself with the griper cause or previously when he was banned from Waffle House. And then he kind of just went to ihop, right? Everyone, meet me at the ihop. Well, he, he, he, I believe, fabricated a DM from IHOP because they claimed, James, if Waffle House won't have you come by ihop. And then IHOP said that, no, we didn't send that. And he has a history of fabricating things. And so I believe it. So then you're right. So there is an interesting wrinkle here. Laura Loomer, who's very pro Israel, is naturally James Fishback's arch enemy. And she. Fishback was in town in D.C. last week, and she sent her minion, a guy, Charles Downs, and he went up and he was like, fishback, you're a pedophile. You're a pedophile, Fishback. And. And so that's kind of funny. But then. But basically, Laur claimed, you know, well, actually they banned you at Mar a Lago because you're a sicko who's been accused of this relationship with a high school girl. And she kind of used that footage. So the. They're fighting. All of our heroes are fighting. You know, when will they figure it out?

[Sam]

Well, the other. The other constant theme in addition to the fighting is that they all have minions that they dispatch to do their dirty work, right? Like the guy, you know, telling Bongino, don't be afraid of Satan. And James o' Keefe obviously has a million minions. And now Fishback and has his minions and Loomer has her minions. It's like, is there just like a, like a, like a farm system of conservative influencer minions who just go and do the dirty work.

[Will]

Back in my day, Laura Loomer did her own loomering. Now you got a symbol.

[Sam]

It's a status symbol to have, you know, and this is, this is the Jesse Waters arc too, right? He was Bill O'Reilly's minion. He went and did all those, you know, whatever they did man on the street and he became a star. So maybe this is like how you do it is you just go and, you know, latch on to someone and do their, you know, annoying dirty work and then you get big.

[Will]

Well, I mean, Loomer started working for James o', Keefe, so I think that's very real.

[Sam]

Do we do, do you need a minion?

[Will]

That might be a good idea. I mean, I, I, you know, I, I little will, you know, people. Sure.

[Sam]

Oh my God. We should totally get a little will just send them to all these conferences that you can't go to or just make them read the Internet at night so you can actually be a parent child. There was other things. So Fishback, what's the status on all the money that he owes?

[Will]

Yeah, so the other thing that broke last week was so Fishback, we, we love. He's in comical amounts of debt. This is a fun subplot. So on one hand he owes his suit. You know, once everything's sorted out, he's going to owe roughly $2 million to his former hedge fund employer. Now we find out, and by the way, they went 2 million because it's, it's initially he, he, when he worked there, he borrowed something like 200k as sort of like I think these hed you do kind of advances on your bonus.

[Sam]

Sure.

[Will]

However, so there's that. But then after he quit, right before he was fired, he did a bunch of little schemes against them and they sued him and so now he's on the hook for legal fees and it'll probably shake out to about 2 million.

[Sam]

Now that's insane.

[Will]

It's a lot of money. The only way, you know, the only way to escape it is if he becomes governor of Florida. He's going to sell them Disneyland, you know, and then he can get out from under it.

[Sam]

Has he said that?

[Will]

No. I mean, I do think this is partially like he's trying to avoid this, this judgment by becoming, you know, he's had one Tesla repossessed. They're trying to score the other Tesla trying to take his watches. We wrote about how they tried to repossess the couch or the campaign was concerned about that. Now, I should say they went to a judge last week and asked for permission to essentially kick his door down or have the U.S. marshal seize his property forcefully. The judge said, hold up, up. Let's give it a week, let's give it a little more time, but we'll probably do this now, Fishback's own lawyers, they said, we're quitting last week because he owes us 150k. So now the debts keep piling up. As far as I know, he doesn't have lawyers anymore, but he's come up with an innovative way to pay off the lawyers or not pay them off. He says if the lawyer doesn't win,

[Sam]

you don't pay him, which is not true. What happens if they do win?

[Will]

Well. Well, I mean, I will say to his lawyer's credit here, I think Fishback was not the ideal client. There was a lot of scheming going on, even in kind of like, the last moments of the case. And so. So this prompted harmony. Dylan, who. Let's go. Who's the head of our Justice Department Civil rights division, not the Twitter feuds division. And yet that's kind of what she seems to be the head of. So she says, siri, what is a contract? In response to Fishback saying he won't pay anyone, and then he says, you literally work for the doj. This is so rude. I feel like even bad saying it. Shut your filthy mouth until you and Pam Blondie arrest Epstein's accomplices.

[Sam]

I mean, first of all, folks, you will pay your lawyer regardless of whether they win or lose. That's not how it works. James Fishback has no idea what he's talking about. And secondly, Harmeet. Dylan, why are you on Twitter so much? Like, there's a lot of stuff going on. You got. You got other things to do. But she tweets so much. We wrote an early false flag about her habits, but she's just kept plowing forward. She just blocks people left and right. She's on it all the time.

[Will]

She also knits hats for conservative media personalities. And she. Oh, gosh.

[Sam]

All right.

[Will]

I feel like there's other things to be done.

[Sam]

You know, you can knit, you can knit. It's fine.

[Will]

The other thing I would add about the Fishback thing is the Taco Bell was mobbed. You know, I mean, they loved him at the Taco Bell.

[Sam]

Oh, let's play the video. We have the video of that. So he did go to the Taco Bell, and it was mobbed, I guess. Let's. Do we have it? Let's play it.

[Will]

Welcome. Hey, how you doing? How are you?

[Drew McIntyre]

Good to have you. Good.

[Will]

How are you? I'm casting. Anybody?

[Sam]

How's it going? Hey, guys.

[Will]

There we go. I think we're. Yeah. I mean, so you can see, you know, pretty big turnout.

[Sam]

Good advance work. I have A few thoughts on this one is it's, it. The bigger picture thing is that it's really kind of, I don't know, messed up in a way that this clear the charlatan, this groiper racist is like able to, to just kind of fake it till he makes it tight like this, right? Like he, he clearly has. He's running from the possessors. He's running from his lawyers. He's, he, he's like diluting these people and he's just using Internet virality to actually get a following. So that's, there's like, I know he's like a 5 or 6% and people are like, well you know, who cares? He's, he's a nobody. Like 5 or 6% is not nothing. Nothing. Okay? It's not like that. That's crazy. And the other thing I will say is that if you think I'm overstating it and maybe I am a little bit like he comes up in these focus groups that we've done where people are talking about like, especially young people. Like, I mean you've written about this. Like the people looking like, you know, that guy's got some good ideas, you

[Will]

know, without any, without any prompting, like our, our moderator will ask, you know, who's someone in the media that you believe or a politician you like? And they say, I love James Fishback. I love that he wants to tax only fan creators at 50. This is such a crucial issue in our society.

[Sam]

By the way, big only fans news this morning, right? The. The founder died.

[Will]

Yes, the founder died.

[Sam]

And I.

[Will]

This is going to spark a whole lot of conspiracy theories as suggests only fans looms very large in the right wing media ecosystem as sort of an object of hate. And so in particularly. And, and the founder, I believe was Jewish as well. And so they're, they're gonna, they're gonna latch on to this. I think there, there's more to come that there.

[Sam]

Well then this brings us back to the James o' Keefe party. There's like this weird dichotomy happening where it's like, yeah, some part of the Conserved movement wants to just like have hot women dancing in, you know, oversized martini glasses. And like they're totally cool with only fans and they're just kind of dudes. And then there's this other griper ish thread that's just like, absolutely not. And so you have this fissure. The other thing that I was going to say about a Fishback, which I guess I should pose as a question to you is like the choice of Taco Bell. I can't get over it. It's just, I wouldn't do it. I would just do like any other fast food joint. I probably would.

[Will]

Well, Sam, at this point, you know, Fishback's been banned from Waffle House. I mean, there are getting limited. You know, he can't go to that many places. I do. Just as we wrap up here, I want to point to you. Talk about the dichotomy there between this kind of like the religious aspect and the people who want to party. Nick Fuentes hit on this last week. He said, I want to hang out with normies because they're cool, but then they get mad at me for being racist. But I don't want to hang out with all these chuds, these right wingers, because they're a bunch of losers. And so I think that there is this, there are these elements that are, that people are facing.

[Sam]

Yeah, and then you throw like clavicular in there, who's just like out there partying all the time and like, you know, what's his place in that ecosystem? It's bizarre again, though, Taco Bell, like, what was the place that RFK Jr really loved because they put beef tallow in the fries. You know what I'm talking about? Right? Steak and a steak and shake. I think it was steak and shake. Steak and shake. That's where, I mean, that's the obvious one. Go to steak and shake. That's. That's Maha coated. So you got, you got that going for you. All right, let's. We got one more topic before we close out. This felt like a particularly frantic MAGA Monday. Like we are just bouncing from topic to topic. Why is that?

[Will]

I think it sort of reflects the mood of the right wing ecosystem. You know, with Trump kind of lost in the quagmire of Iran, I think people are, you know, are just getting into a lot of weird stuff.

[Sam]

I, I have another theory. I feel like, I don't know. You and I have been talking a bit about this behind the scenes. I'm not going to mention a potential future topic for false flag. People should subscribe to your newsletter. But there is this sort of. Something has kind of taken hold of a lot of these influencers where they're kind of profoundly skeptical about Trump's chances in the midterms, profoundly disenchanted with the way things are going, and more open to admitting that things have gone fairly far off the tracks. It's not necessarily reflected in the MAGA polling data. Right. Like you see all these numbers that MAGA self described, MAGA people are still with Trump, although I have my own doubts about the methodology on that stuff. But you do see this where it's like people are just like, man, then it's so corrupt. The Iran war is so bad. The polling numbers are so in the toilet. And it's like when you have that, when the big stuff is going really poorly and you have little hope for, you might probably just want to fight with everyone else around you about like

[Will]

the, well, it's, you know, the, the music slowing down and your musical chairs, you know, it's time to kind of figure out your plays before you get eliminated.

[Sam]

Yeah. And also there's just not a larger, more positive vision to work for right now. Right. Like it's easier when your guy is out of office and you want to get Joe Biden out. But when it's. When that doesn't happen, it just does. There's not nothing unifying that movement. So they just turn to infighting. Which brings us to our most ridiculous story. And I didn't even know about this until you came into my office about five minutes ago, but Erica Kirk is now in another made up controversy potentially about yoga attire. What is going on?

[Will]

Yeah, this implicates the very trendy yoga brand Alo. Alo. People may have seen people like Tom Sandoval from Vanderpump Rules wearing these clothes. A lot of like influencers love this, these clothes. And so this is, you know, Candace Owens and she has like a lot of minions. And a lot of people like minions or influencers. Minions. They're back. They're back. And so they're picking through her. Everything about Erica Kirk they can find. And late last week, a Tick Tocker said, I have Erica Kirk's customer history, purchase history at Aloe. Very random thing. And he said, you can see here, the day after Charlie Kirk's death, she dropped let's say a thousand dollars on clothes at Aloe. And so people were like, oh my gosh, you know, this horrible woman, her, her husband just got murdered and she's the, she's going on a shopping spree. And so this got like millions of views. This was a huge thing in kind of, of.

[Sam]

Let's play the tick tock, guys. Great. Put this into perspective. I'm looking it up here. Charlie Kirk was announced to be at 4pm on September 10th.

[Will]

Tasteful.

[Sam]

Not even 24 hours later, Erica went home, woke up in the morning and bought an Aloe tracksuit. No.

[Will]

Yes. And so the, this is being, you know, this Imelda Marcos type situation. I will say the argument from the Erica camp, which I find pretty believable, is that they had all flown up suddenly from Arizona to Utah after the assassination. No one had time to pack a change of clothes. And so Erica gave one of, you know, her associates a credit card and said, go buy clothes for X number of people at alo. You know, Nevertheless, I think this shows you this whole, like. Like, it's not just Candace Owens. Right? It's this whole world of people just feasting. And it's also weird that her customer data got out of ALO in the first place. Yeah. They made their Twitter account private amid all this because of this kind of, like, how did it leak? I mean, I have to imagine, you know, anyone who works at ALO could pull that information up. It's like a screenshot of an iPad, like you'd have at a store. So, you know, there you go.

[Sam]

It's weird that a leaked. It's weird that this guy's presenting this as some sort of, like, Woodward and Bernstein, you know, revelation. And also, who gives a shit?

[Will]

Even if it wasn't a tracksuit receipt.

[Sam]

Yeah. Oh, I busted it. Congrats on your Pulitzer. Who cares? I mean, like, honestly, even if it was that she was binge shopping the day after her husband was assassinated, it's like, fine. Why do people. People are just so obsessed with trying to find, you know, some way to portray this woman as a Lady Macbeth figure. I. I mean, I. I personally do not understand it, but maybe I'm not, like, you know, thinking in the dimensions that I need to be thinking about this stuff, but it just seems so crazy to me that people are going through her receipts on this yoga. But Candace has gotten people really badly on this stuff, for sure. How is Candace, by the way? We haven't heard from her in a little bit.

[Will]

Yeah, I mean, she's still going crazy. I mean, like, you know, you know, I. I think for. For our purposes, it's interesting. Veered briefly into speaking more broadly about Trump and Iran, and the audience was just like, we just want to hear about Erica, Charlie, Kirk. We're mad. You know, and once. And we've seen her try this before to talk about something else, and then, you know, she's got to get back in line and talk about what. What the audience really craves.

[Sam]

Damn. Okay. That's a big weekend of content from Will. I really love it. I'm pretty sure none of that's gonna. Well, we'll talk about your newsletter, which is coming out today, but we had talked about some other topics. Anyways, you guys should be subscribing to Falsify because all this stuff is covered in there. And more, much more. You guys should be obviously subscribing to us on YouTube where we do great stuff like this Bulwark Takes. This is the feed for it. We do this every Monday now at 10am I get a cup of coffee, get into the office and I just shoot the shit with Will about the craziest stuff on the Internet. It's great. Probably not healthy for you, but it's awesome. It's a fun conversation. Will, thank you for this. Before I go though though, programming alert. We actually are doing serious stuff on this feed as well. At 7:30 tonight we got command post with General Mark Hertling and Ben Parker. They're going to be talking about what's happening in Iran. The real news this morning was over the weekend Trump had given this 48 hours threat where he said if Iran did not open up the Strait of Hormuz, he was going to bomb the Iranian power infrastructure, starting with the biggest, biggest target possible. He has since kind of backtracked from that and said, actually we are having talks as of this morning. The Iranians are saying, no, we're not. Trump saying, yes, we are. Trump's talking about joint ownership of this trader moves. No one really knows what's going on. It's really hard to follow and process the implications of all this. But fortunately for you, we have two incredible experts who are able to do that. They're going to go live tonight at 7:30pm on this feedback, the takes feed, the YouTube feed. So you should tune in, bookmark it, watch it at 7:30 tonight. Till then, thank you all for tuning in. Appreciate it. We'll see you next Monday for another edition of Maga Mondays. Take care, Will.

[Will]

Thanks everyone.

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[Alex Canceroitz]

this is Alex Canceroitz. I'm the host of Big Technology Podcast, a longtime reporter and an on air contributor to cnbc. And if you're like me, you're trying to figure out how artificial intelligence is changing the business world and our lives. So each week on Big Technology, I bring on key actors from companies building AI tech and outsiders trying to influence it, asking where this is all going. They come from places like Nvidia, Microsoft, Amazon, and plenty of anymore. So if you want to be smart with your wallet, your career choices, in meetings with your colleagues and at dinner parties, listen to Big Technology Podcast. Wherever you get your podcasts.