Bulwark Takes – "JD Vance’s Shutdown Talking Point Is a SHAM"

Date: September 30, 2025
Host(s): Tim Miller (A), Will Saletan (C)
Main Theme
A fast-paced takedown of Senator JD Vance's recent public statements, focusing on his misleading claims about the Charlie Kirk assassination, the James Comey indictment, and the upcoming government shutdown. The episode scrutinizes Vance's rhetorical tactics, his role in the Trump administration, and the broader trend of political opportunism and disinformation.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Vance’s Claims on the Charlie Kirk Assassination

• Vance’s Narrative: He implies without evidence that the left is somehow responsible for funding or motivating the shooter who killed conservative activist Charlie Kirk.
  • [00:33] Vance (clip): "If they had, Charlie Kirk might be alive today."
• Critical Response:
  • Tim Miller calls out the hypocrisy—Vance quickly assigns guilt to the left for violence but ignores violence from right-wing actors:
    • [00:56] Miller: "The degree to which the vice President has gone overboard... that's the most maddening for me of his lies."
  • Saletan highlights the opportunism:
    • [01:27] Saletan: "They're using it. They're seizing on it as an opportunity to try to implicate some broader network...who they, Trump and Vance, can then accuse of instigating violence."

2. The Indictment of James Comey

• Vance’s Spin: Claims the DOJ’s returned indictments against Comey demonstrate judiciousness.
  • [03:13] Vance (clip): "So I think they showed they were judicious."
• Deconstruction:
  • Saletan exposes factual inaccuracy and logic flaws:
    • [03:29] Saletan: "It's judicious because they failed to get the indictment. So first of all, he's bragging about failing on one of the counts ... There's no defense. The prosecutors come in without whatever evidence they have."
    • Notable analogy: "It's like in soccer, you know, shooting on a penalty kick with a goalie. Well, what happens if you take the goalie away? That's what they missed here."
    • [04:54] Miller: "It doesn't seem very judicious to run out the prosecutor who made a ... judicious judgment that this was not worth prosecuting."
• Motivations:
  • Vance dismisses the idea that the indictment is political; hosts strongly disagree.
    • [05:27] Vance (clip): "The idea that this is driven by politics, I think is preposterous."
    • [07:22] Miller: "Donald Trump just says it's driven by politics ... it's not even subtext ... you're just straight lying to our face."
    • [08:16] Saletan: "Vance's job is to be the conventional politician ... lie to you about this obvious fact that his boss is out there calling for revenge."

3. The Shutdown and ‘Illegal Aliens’ Talking Point

• Vance’s Message: Claims Democrats are threatening a government shutdown to secure "a trillion dollars for medical benefits for illegal aliens."
  • [09:06] Vance (clip): "The Democrats ... are going to shut down the government unless you give a trillion dollars for medical benefits for illegal aliens."
• Analysis:
  • Hosts ridicule the repetitive, fear-mongering language and debunk the substance:
    • [09:32] Miller: "Illegal aliens. Illegal aliens. Illegal aliens. Illegal aliens. Is that even the Democrats' point ... it is. It's just so fucking over the top."
    • [09:42] Saletan: "He says illegal aliens ... eight times [in two minutes] ... there were zero Democrats out there saying anything like we're shutting down the government ... so that we can fund healthcare for undocumented immigrants."
    • Data from Jonathan Cohn: at most, $28 billion in compensatory state payments, not a "trillion."
    • [10:31] Miller: "They're talking about the extension of Obamacare subsidies."
    • [11:59] Miller: "They are saying that because they want people's hard earned tax dollars instead to go to more masked ICE agents and to bail out the farmers ... that's what your hard earned tax dollars should go to."
• Wider GOP Messaging:
  • The rhetoric is designed for the base, potentially at the expense of real-world impact, like rising health insurance premiums:
    • [13:10] Miller: "It might work for Fox viewers ... [but in] the real world ... some people are going to their healthcare premiums are going to go up this fall ... If Democrats can message clearly enough ... then maybe they won't get away with it."

4. JD Vance’s Political Role and Persona

• Alignment with Trump:
  • Saletan sees Vance as the regime’s "slick" conventional liar, smoothing over Trump’s open talk of revenge:
    • [08:16] Saletan: "Vance's job is to be the conventional politician ... pretend that none of that is there. To be slick and smooth and look you right in the eye and lie."
• Shifting Populist Positions:
  • Miller notes how Vance had to drop his own supposed pro-working-class stances to fit Trump’s policies:
    • [12:12] Miller: "JD was trying to position himself in ... the Hawley camp ... [but] he's had to get rid of that talking point in order to align himself with Trump's actual policies."
• Personal Disdain:
  • Miller expresses intense personal dislike:
    • [14:29] Miller: "I can't find a single person that I find more detestable than J.D. Vance."
    • [15:02] Miller, half-joking: "High bar that he got past Donald Trump for me ..."
  • Saletan draws distinction between Trump as delusional and Vance as knowingly dishonest:
    • [15:30] Saletan: "I believe Donald Trump is delusional and ... J.D. Vance knows everything about what he's saying ... I think Vance is worse."

Memorable Quotes

• On opportunism:
  • Saletan: "They're using it. They're seizing on it as an opportunity to try to implicate some broader network." [01:27]
• On the grand jury indictment:
  • Saletan: "It's like in soccer, you know, shooting on a penalty kick with a goalie. Well, what happens if you take the goalie away? That's what they missed here." [03:29]
• On the indictment’s content:
  • Miller: "I've seen longer tweets from JD Vance than that indictment." [05:54]
• On Vance’s role:
  • Saletan: "Vance's job is to be the conventional politician and just pretend that none of that is there. To be slick and smooth and look you right in the eye and lie to you..." [08:16]
• On Vance’s invocations of ‘illegal aliens’:
  • Saletan: "He says illegal aliens ... eight times in two minutes … and three more on Fox News Sunday. So just like, it's pretty obvious what the talking point is." [09:42]
• On personal disdain:
  • Miller: "I can't find a single person that I find more detestable than J.D. Vance." [14:29]
  • Saletan: "I believe J.D. Vance knows everything about what he's saying. ... I think Vance is worse [than Trump]." [15:30]

Noteworthy Segments & Timestamps

• Slandering the Left Regarding Charlie Kirk’s Murder: [00:33–02:00]
• Fox News Judiciousness Spin – Comey Indictment: [03:01–04:54]
• Preposterous Claim Indictment Not Political: [05:27–08:16]
• Shutdown Rhetoric and 'Illegal Aliens' Talking Point: [09:06–12:00]
• Strategic Shift: Vance’s Political Evolution: [12:12–14:06]
• Personal Rankings: Vance v. Trump: [14:29–16:09]

Conclusion

This episode is a sharp, often scathing, examination of JD Vance's evolving role as a high-profile Trump surrogate. The hosts detail how he distorts facts, amplifies divisive rhetoric, and shifts his public persona to align with hard-right positions. The discussion highlights Vance’s use of baseless talking points on violence, prosecutions, and especially the government shutdown, and closes with a candid appraisal of his character and political utility in the MAGA movement.