Tim Miller (3:00)

Yeah, let's watch the video.

Sam Stein (3:01)

Okay. Watch the video.

Richard Karn (3:10)

Back up.

Sam Stein (3:10)

Sorry. Back up.

Tim Miller (3:12)

I won't make this difficult.

Sam Stein (3:13)

Sorry.

Tim Miller (3:14)

Back up, Back up.

Sam Stein (3:17)

Cause any problems, I will let go.

Richard Karn (3:18)

When you show me the judicial. Where is it, sir? I would like to see the warrant.

Sam Stein (3:26)

I would like to see the warrant.

Tim Miller (3:28)

And then I will let go.

Richard Karn (3:30)

I would like to see the warrant. You don't have the authority to arrest US Citizens.

Sam Stein (3:43)

Sir.

Richard Karn (3:44)

You don't have the authority to arrest US Citizens. You don't have. I'm not obstructing. I'm standing right here in the hallway. I have to see the judicial warrant. By asking for a judicial warrant, you don't have the authority to arrest US Citizens.

Tim Miller (4:00)

Asking for a judicial warrant.

Sam Stein (4:02)

All right, what are your thoughts on this?

Tim Miller (4:06)

It's, it's horrible. Like, it's, I, I and you know, again, like, so what had happened was later linked arms, I guess, with staff and with migrant who again showed up to court. Right. So, like, the thing that I. That always gets me in all these situations, well, number one is this masking issue, which I want to get to.

Sam Stein (4:23)

Masking is crazy.

Tim Miller (4:24)

It's crazy. So I want to get to that. But, but the other thing that gets before we do is like, there's this notion among the immigration hardliners and people in my social media, mentions on the right MAGA folks that are like, what you said earlier, what do you expect? What are you supposed to do? They broke the laws with them. It's like there are a million steps that are available to you between doing nothing and letting the country. Letting anyone into the country with no laws, having total open borders, John Lennon style, and, like, having masked thugs arrest and manhandle migrants in the country and elected officials that are advocating for them. Like, it's crazy. Like, there's no. There was no reason for this level of confrontation. Of confrontation. Right in the.

Sam Stein (5:12)

Unless. Unless you want the confrontation.

Tim Miller (5:15)

Unless you want the confrontation. Yeah. So there you go. Yeah, Unless you want the confrontation. So I guess that's my point. It's not about no one being above the law or whatever. Like, there are plenty of situations where people break the law and peace officers or cops, like, use their judgment on how to, like, handle it in that moment. And maybe you can be ticketed or be on probation or get an ankle monitor. Like, a gazillion things you can do besides, like, forcibly grabbing somebody and manhandling them and handcuffing them and sending masked agents into an immigration courthouse. Like, the fucking judge can handle this, like, in the court. Like, if the guy is supposed to be deported, you can get a letter that's like, hey, you're supposed to be deported in seven days, report to place X for your deportation. And if they don't show up to that, then you can fucking go to their house and handcuff them. Right. Like, there are a million options. You could do this in a humane way. They are doing this in the most escalatory way possible, the most fascistic way possible. And. And in a way that, like, it's not in the American tradition or spirit. And that takes me to the mask. But if you just talk about that.

Sam Stein (6:19)

Well, let's talk about the masks, because that's what gets me. And I'm having trouble sort of articulating why. But. But I think it comes down to the absence of deliberate. Absence of accountability, right? Yes, exactly. Like, you have a right to know who is doing this to you, or at least you should have a right to know who is doing this to you. And there has to be some level of accountability for law enforcement at every level, because we don't want a system in which there is not, and nor does law enforcement want a system in which there is not. I mean, law enforcement wants to have a system where they have integrity and trust of the people they are policing. And when you mask someone up, it erodes that trust. And I find it very unsettling to watch as an elected official. Yes, he was impeding and deliberately so, the arrest of a migrant. But I find it very unsettling to watch a masked federal law enforcement official come and just manhandle him. We don't know who this person is.

Tim Miller (7:16)

They didn't show him. He's shouting. That's one of the questions. He's like, who are you showing you. Yeah, yeah, who are you? That's arresting me. Show me your identification. Show me your badge. Like, if you're an ICE official. He's young. I'm an American citizen. Like, this is not in your jurisdiction.

Sam Stein (7:30)

It doesn't. And doesn't Lander have the right to know who's arresting him? I mean, maybe not by the letter of the law, but it's certainly in a ethical sense, I feel like he does.

Tim Miller (7:39)

Yeah. And this is like. And so we'll put this picture up on the screen. Like, his eyes are bulging out and like there's this evil guy in the evil Spider man costume behind him. And again, it's just imagery, but, like, it feels un American. Like it feels against, you know, the traditions. And being able to understand who your accuser is is get a. Get due process, get a court go in front of a judge. Like, it feels like something that's in a dystopia or in a fascist country. And like, even if that's not the intent, like, that is the aesthetic of it. And it seems to me that they are intentionally going for that aesthetic. And like, that just is not. Anyway, I find this picture to be really, really harrowing. And it would be harrowing and chilling if it was any person in this suit getting pulled away. But the fact that it's an elected official, they knew it was an elected.

Sam Stein (8:30)

Talk about that. Talk about that. Because that's the other element here.

Tim Miller (8:32)

Yeah. This is a report from the City, which is a local alternative news outlet in New York. But the reporter there said that they heard two agents, one agent say to another is the word they use. So I assume he's referring to ICE agents. But in the article it says one agent say to another, do you want to arrest the comptroller? Minutes before that encounter. So again, it's like they knew they made a choice to do it like this. Like, as opposed to the many other non escalatory ways you could have handled it. Like have sending one person up to the comptroller, casually Talking to a Mr. Lander, like, please, you know, I. Please, you know, remove your arms from this migrant. Like, we have this war here's the warrant for years to warrant to address this.

Sam Stein (9:17)

Mr. Lander, come into a room with the migrant. The judge is there. We will talk and explain what's going on.

Tim Miller (9:22)

Yeah, right.

Sam Stein (9:23)

Done.

Tim Miller (9:23)

Yeah. Or like, even in the first case scenario, it's like, I have this warrant. Here it is. This person is supposed to be under arrest. If you continue to resist, we're going to have to restrain you, you know, and like, warn him several, calmly, several times. There's like, no re like, again, the only reason to do it is, is that you want the confrontation.

Sam Stein (9:41)

Yeah. Now, I, I, the reason I wanted you to highlight that the fact that they apparently reportedly knew who they were arresting or handcuffing, I should say, is because we're not even like a week off of Alex Padilla getting, you know, pinned down by federal officials, agents and handcuffed in federal building in Los Angeles. And their excuse there was, well, he didn't identify himself. We didn't know who this guy was. He was barging at us. He's getting in front of a law enforcement operation or in this case, disrupting Kristi Noem. And you know, in this case, they don't have that excuse, apparently, because they knew who this guy was. And this is also in the context of a mayor getting into confrontation at a New Jersey detention facility. A sitting member of Congress being charged for disrupting ICE affairs at the same New Jersey facility. We now have a fairly decent pattern of this happening with Democratic officials and the Trump administration. And I keep coming back to the fact we're like 10, 10% in. I mean, this is just starting and these deportation proceedings are just ramping up. This could get really ugly.

Tim Miller (10:52)

Oh, right. It already is ugly, but, yeah, it could get even uglier. So there are two political things just worth mentioning. One is to this point, I mean, obviously our viewers already know that this was ridiculous, but we should just note that these guys all came in talking about depoliticizing the justice system. It was literally, that was what they. And so if you're talking to Republican senators or whatever, it's like I, these guys are all lied to. Like everybody, you know, that went into a confirmable position. You know, doj, dhs, all these offices, like, their big talking point was, oh, the justice system was so politicized because Donald Trump was indicted. Right. And so we are going to get rid of that. And, and like they've come in and in record time just immediately targeted their political opposition.

Sam Stein (11:37)

Yeah.

Tim Miller (11:39)

So anyway, the other, the other political sub. Sub story here is, is just that lander's running for mayor. You mentioned that at the top.

Sam Stein (11:47)

Of course.

Richard Karn (11:48)

Yeah.

Tim Miller (11:48)

And so I do think that some people on the right will be like, oh, this was a study.

Sam Stein (11:51)

Yeah, it's opportunity. I think it is opportunistic. It obviously is opportunistic.

Tim Miller (11:55)

Sure.

Sam Stein (11:55)

He did it. He wanted to create a moment. He got a moment. Yes.

Tim Miller (11:59)

But again, they didn't have to handcuff him and haul them and put masks on.

Sam Stein (12:04)

Yeah, yeah.

Tim Miller (12:04)

It could have been a nothing burger moment. Again, if they had acted appropriately, could have gone up to him and said, here's a piece of paper. Your, your person here needs to come to this office. But like they million ways to handle this is not a violent criminal. This is not an. This is not an issue of urgent security that like they needed to worry about. Right. Like, like all this is just. It's totally unnecessary, thuggish cop behavior. So, yeah, I think he wanted to and it might help him. I do think that it's. Who knows? Like, this race right now looks like it's coming down to Cuomo and Mandani, who I interviewed today. If you can check out on the feed. And like there's concerns with both of them and for very different reasons across New Yorkers. And, and Lander and Mandani have a kind of a little packed thing where it's like, if you rank me, you rank me. The other one, maybe Lander is a little bit more accessible.

Sam Stein (12:53)

This is Tim and I have this similar thing in the Bulwark office, by.

Tim Miller (12:56)

The way, where we have a pact on the ranked choice voting within the office where it's like, if you're going to vote Sam first on the ballot, you put me second and vice versa for YouTube rankings. Yeah. So anyway, there is some implication there, I think outside chance. It really seems like Zoron and Cuomo are the most likely there, but anything can happen.

Sam Stein (13:16)

Yeah. All right, well, we'll watch. Thanks, buddy.

Richard Karn (13:19)

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