Republicans Found Fauci’s Diaries. Where’s the Smoking Gun?

Summary

Bulwark Takes – Episode Summary

Podcast: Bulwark Takes
Episode: Republicans Found Fauci’s Diaries. Where’s the Smoking Gun?
Date: July 29, 2026
Host: Jonathan Cohn (with Kevin Fry, Dr. Deborah Howery, and others)

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Episode Overview

This episode centers on the latest Capitol Hill spectacle: Dr. Anthony Fauci’s testimony before a Senate committee led by Republican Senator Rand Paul. The purported “smoking gun” is Fauci’s recently obtained government diaries from his time leading the pandemic response. The Bulwark panel examines both the political theater and the substance (or lack thereof) revealed by this latest Republican effort to implicate Fauci in criminal wrongdoing during COVID-19.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

The Return of Fauci vs. Capitol Hill

• Repeated Hearings:
  • Senator Rand Paul again calls Dr. Anthony Fauci to testify about the COVID-19 pandemic, specifically rehashing old accusations that Fauci misled the country regarding the origins of the virus, masking, and therapeutics.
  • Quote: “Haven't we had hearings like this? Haven't Fauci and Paul already squared off in Congress?” – Jonathan Cohn (01:00)
• The Lab Leak Theory:
  • Rand Paul continues to push the debunked lab leak theory—accusing Fauci and the US government of abetting risky research at China’s Wuhan Institute of Virology.
  • Cohn notes the majority of scientists reject these claims, yet they remain a political obsession for Paul and allies.

"New Information" – Fauci’s Diaries

• Acquisition of Government Diaries:

  • Republicans claim to have uncovered Fauci’s private work diaries left on government computers, but Cohn emphasizes there is no “smoking gun”—just personal insights with little relevance to the conspiracy theories at hand.
  • Quote: “These diaries, they do not appear to have any kind of smoking gun, although they do provide some interesting insights.” – Jonathan Cohn (01:24)

• Political Prosecution:

  • There is a recurring theme from Republican senators (Ron Johnson, Tommy Tuberville) calling not just for condemnation but for the actual prosecution of Fauci—amplifying a vindictive strain in the hearings.
  • Fauci’s legal counsel advised him to plead the Fifth Amendment at the hearing to avoid self-incrimination, which led to a bizarre spectacle on the Hill.
  • Quote: "Prosecution was what hung over all of this. Republicans have said repeatedly they think actually Anthony Fauci is criminally liable. They want to throw him in jail." – Jonathan Cohn (01:56)
  • Memorable moment: Fauci repeatedly invokes the Fifth in response to legalistic and speculative questions.
    • “On the advice of counsel, I respectfully decline to answer based upon my rights under the Fifth Amendment.” – Dr. Fauci (04:42)

Substance vs. Political Theater

• Quality of the Questioning:
  • Cohn is asked if any senators asked questions worth answering, referencing Senator Lankford as raising fair concerns.
  • Ultimately, Cohn argues that while retrospective examination of the COVID-19 response is important, this hearing is more “show trial” than fact-finding:
    • Quote: “The problem is that that is not what this show is. This is a show trial. This is Rand Paul deeply invested in this narrative that there was a conspiracy.” – Jonathan Cohn (05:48)
  • The real motive, according to Cohn: to “extract vengeance on him and put him in jail” rather than improve future pandemic response.

Fauci’s Humanity and Media Reception

• Personal Reflections in the Diaries:
  • Critics seized upon Fauci’s personal musings—such as excitement about meeting celebrities like Julia Roberts—to imply vanity or distraction.
  • Cohn counters that Fauci was simply reacting as any person might within such intense, chaotic circumstances.
  • Quote: “Anthony Foushee is a human being…he’s like, ‘wow, I got to meet Julia Roberts.’ …But, you know, the main takeaway from all these diaries is that he was deeply serious, invested, trying to figure out the science.” – Jonathan Cohn (07:15)
• The Real Chaos:
  • For much of the pandemic, there was overwhelming uncertainty and little clear guidance. Fauci, like all decision-makers, had to react dynamically—and was often in an administration actively sowing misinformation.
  • Quote: "Don't forget, in an administration where the President of the United States was a chief source of misinformation, chaos. And trying desperately to deny the problem purely because he thought it might hurt his chances for reelection." – Jonathan Cohn (07:45)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• [01:00] Jonathan Cohn: "Haven't Fauci and Paul already squared off in Congress? Yes, this has happened before."
• [01:24] Jonathan Cohn: “These diaries, they do not appear to have any kind of smoking gun, although they do provide some interesting insights.”
• [01:56] Jonathan Cohn: "Prosecution was what hung over all of this. Republicans have said repeatedly they think actually Anthony Fauci is criminally liable. They want to throw him in jail."
• [04:40-04:45] Dr. Fauci (to Rand Paul): “On the advice of counsel, I respectfully decline to answer based upon my rights under the Fifth Amendment of the Constitution.”
• [05:48] Jonathan Cohn: "This is a show trial. This is Rand Paul deeply invested in this narrative that there was a conspiracy…"
• [07:15] Jonathan Cohn: “Anthony Foushee is a human being…he’s like, ‘wow, I got to meet Julia Roberts.’”
• [07:45] Jonathan Cohn: "Don't forget, in an administration where the President of the United States was a chief source of misinformation, chaos."

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Important Segments & Timestamps

• Intro & Context: [00:00–01:13]
• History of Fauci-Paul hearings: [01:13–01:56]
• Fauci’s diaries & prosecution rhetoric: [01:56–03:56]
• Live scene from hearings: [03:56–04:48]
• Panel Analysis: The hearing's real agenda: [04:48–05:38]
• On legitimate Senate questions: [05:38–06:47]
• Fauci’s human side & misrepresented diary entries: [06:47–08:09]

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Conclusion

This episode delivers a pointed critique of the ongoing Republican campaign against Dr. Anthony Fauci, contending that Capitol Hill’s latest spectacle is less about truth or accountability and more about political vengeance and distraction. Jonathan Cohn repeatedly urges listeners to remember the immense human and scientific uncertainty at play, and he sharply distinguishes genuine public health reflection from partisan showmanship.

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Transcript

[Jonathan Cohn]

Hey, everybody.

Welcome back to Bulwark Takes. I am Jonathan Cohn, author of the Breakdown newsletter, where we talk about policy and health care and who. Boy, do we have a lot to talk about today. That is because Anthony Fauci was on Capitol Hill. Senator Rand Paul called him to testify, wanted to go over what Fauci did and said during the COVID 19 pandemic. In particular, Paul wanted to press Fauci on whether he had misled the American public about the state of the virus, masking various findings on different therapies. In addition to that, Rand Paul very famously is a proponent of the lab leak theory. This is the idea that COVID 19 emerged from Chinese virology experiments as opposed to making the jump from animal to human, which is the theory that the majority of scientists still believe. Rand Paul has long held that it was really this Chinese research, which in turn had been backed or funded by the US Government in part because of decisions that Anthony Fauci made. He wanted grill Fauci about that. Now, you may be wondering, wait a minute. Haven't I heard this all before? Haven't we had hearings like this? Haven't Fauci and Paul already squared off in Congress?

Yes, this has happened before.

We've done this before many times. This is an ongoing cause. Rand Paul says, hey, wait, we have new information. He was able to obtain some diaries that were on HHS computers with the federal government that when Fauci left office, Trump administration was able to get their hands on them. Now, these diaries, they do not appear to have any kind of smoking gun, although they do provide some interesting insights. But they gave Republicans a chance to really wail on Fauci and not just Rand Paul. Ron Johnson, who has his own conspiracy theories, he used the hearing to expound on those theories and to attack Fauci. Tommy Tuberville said he was gonna go after Fauci, that in fact he was gonna talk to people in Alabama and the state officials there if there was some way to bring Fauci testify there and maybe prosecute him there for crimes of some kind of deception during the pandemic. And prosecution was what hung over all of this. Republicans have said repeatedly they think actually Anthony Fauci is criminally liable. They want to throw him in jail. And of course, this being the Trump administration, it's a serious threat, and it's why Fauci took the Fifth Amendment throughout the hearing, creating this really bizarre spectacle on Capitol Hill. I got a chance to talk about all of this and what was in the diaries today. On Ms. Now with Antonia Hilton. Here's how that went.

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[Kevin Fry]

on the Hill right now, Republican senators fixated on GRILLING One man. Dr. Anthony Fauci. The former top infectious disease expert is testifying right now in front of the Senate Homeland Security Committee under a subpoena that was ordered by Republican Chairman Rand Paul of Kentucky. Paul used today as an opportunity to try and catch the decades long disease expert committing perjury before Congress, which would be a crime and an offense that would not be protected by former President Biden's preemptive pardon for Fauci before he left office.

[Jonathan Cohn]

Dr. Fauci were the scientists at the Wuhan Institute of Virology capable of inserting a furin cleavage site into a coronavirus.

On the advice of counsel, I respectfully

decline to answer based upon my rights

under the fifth Amendment of the Constitution.

[Kevin Fry]

All right, let's bring in Ms. Now, Capitol Hill reporter Kevin Fry. We also have with us senior National Correspondent at the Bulwark, Jonathan Cohn and former Chief Medical officer at the CDC Dr. Deborah Howery. Jonathan, I want your take first on what we've heard from the lawmakers who've had the chance to ask him questions this morning. None of them have really been answered, but do you think any of them asked serious questions or would you say that the majority of this has been about scoring political points. I ask because Dr. Ven Gupta was on with my colleague Stephanie Rule just a little bit ago, and he said that, for example, Senator Lankford had some questions that he thought were actually interesting and fair. And so I wonder if you can basically help us cut through the noise here, separate sort of fact and from fiction and from drama.

[Jonathan Cohn]

Yeah. So, I mean, look, there are a few questions that are legitimate. And, you know, looking back over the pandemic, I mean, I think a lot of us have said for a long time it was a, you know, it was a once in a century challenge. We did some things right, we did some things wrong. Human beings were making decisions. We should continue to look back and say, have a sober examination of. Of what we got right, what we got wrong, so we could do better next time. The problem is that that is not what this show is. This is a show trial. This is Rand Paul deeply invested in this narrative that there was a conspiracy? Is Ron Johnson deeply invested in this narrative that scientists are misleading the country? Is Donald Trump deeply invested in taking out vengeance on Fauci, who he thinks helped ruin his first term? And that is what this is all about. And, you know, and that is why Fauci doesn't want to answer questions and because he fears legitimately. The real purpose of this is not to get to the. Not to have a careful, thoughtful retrospective on how we handle the last pandemic and do better next time. It is an effort to get him, you know, extract vengeance on him and put him in jail.

[Kevin Fry]

Jonathan, what would you say to people who are picking apart these sections that have to do with his own reflections on his fame, the celebrities that he called to answer questions for them during the pandemic? A lot of. Of hay being made from that piece. Do you see that as sort of wholly separate from the question of the science and the actual public health realities that we lived with, are living with now? Or do you think there are real challenges there?

[Jonathan Cohn]

I think my takeaway is that Anthony Foushee is a human being. You know, he's in the middle of this storm, all this chaos going on, and he's like, wow, I got to meet Julia Roberts. Well, you know, what if I got to meet Julia Roberts and talk to her? I'd say, wow, too. She's Julia Roberts. But, you know, the main takeaway from all these diaries is that he was deeply serious, invested, trying to figure out the science and what Dr. Howery was just describing. I feel like people forget it was chaos. For the first few months, nobody knew how to deal with this. It was overload on all systems, health care providers, at the level of government. Everybody was trying to figure out what was going on. Fauci was doing his best. He made some mistakes like everybody did, but he was trying to follow the signs, trying to do the best job possible. And don't forget, in an administration where the President of the United States was a chief source of misinformation, chaos. And trying desperately to deny the problem purely because he thought it might hurt his chances for reelection.

[Kevin Fry]

Jonathan Cohn, Kevin Fry and Dr. Deborah Howery. Good to see all of you and thank you.