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- [00:00]
A
All right. Hey, everybody, it's me, Sam Stein, back again with Will Summer. It's not a mega Monday, it's Tuesday. We are coming to you mere hours before what could be. I don't know what you want to call it. The wiping of the civilization of Iran off the map day. We say this because early this morning, Trump, Donald Trump bleeded. A whole civilization will die tonight, never to be brought back again. I don't want that to happen, but it probably will. However, now that we have the complete and total regime change, we are different, smarter, less radicalized minds prevail. Maybe something revolutionarily wonderful can happen. Who knows? Question mark. Question mark. So this is scary, obviously, and it's very rare for a president to talk like this. Never happens that they talk like this openly, but there's a lot of uproar in the sort of Trump angry maga. Right. Or previously maga. Right. And we're going to play a bit of this. The first actually comes from before this was posted. It's from Tucker Carlson and Will. Why don't you set it up? Because Tucker's got a show. Obviously, Tucker's having some issues with Trump. Tucker's not for the war, but I didn't expect him to go this far.
- [01:14]
B
Yeah, I mean, as you said, I mean, Tucker's been kind of walking his way up to finally criticizing Trump for even after the bomb started falling, he started saying, well, you know, maybe Israel tricked Trump. And then when Trump said, you know, maybe we'll leave the Strait of Hormuz, that's not our problem. Tucker loved that. So he's been kind of saying that, you know, Trump's being misled for the most part. But then on Monday night, he came out with this video where, I mean, essentially he starts arguing that Trump is the Antichrist. He starts saying, you know, Trump is trying to make himself bigger than God. He's this anti Christian figure. He, he didn't dare put his hand on the Bible to be sworn in. I mean, a lot of crazy stuff, or maybe not so crazy. I don't know these days.
- [01:54]
A
Okay, the Antichrist stuff was a little crazy, but the, the stuff that I saw was not that crazy. Right. Like when talk about the part where he's attacked Trump for going after Islam.
- [02:05]
B
Yeah, sure. So, so in, in Trump's post on Sunday where he said, you know, praise be to Allah, and he's, you know, open the straight. Are you maniacs? You know, Tucker, number one, he felt that this was very offensive to do on Easter for Christians. But also he Said, you know, attacking Islam is like, you know, attacking the idea of belief in general, and so it's also an attack on Christianity. So, you know, it's t. Tucker's clearly trying to pull in, I think, particularly, you know, Catholics. He's trying to pull them in and sort of make them anti Trump.
- [02:37]
A
Let's play the clip. I have some thoughts on the other side.
- [02:40]
C
Who do you think you are? You're tweeting out the F word on Easter morning. You'll be living in hell. Just watch. Praise be to Allah. So, obviously, you're mocking the religion of Iran. Okay, if you seek a religious war, that's a good idea. But by the way, no decent person mocks other people's religions. You may have a problem with the theology. Presumably you do if it's not your religion, and you can explain what that is. But to mock other people's faith is to mock the idea of faith itself, and we should never mock that.
- [03:25]
A
I found this remarkable. Well, I just feel like, look, I'm not going to. I don't want to praise Tucker because Tucker's crazy and he says conspiratorial things all the time, and he doesn't necessarily deserve to be treated necessarily as the most honest broker here. But at the same time, I found his argument compelling. That if you're going to face a entire religion, if you're going to mock it, but also if you're going to talk about in these theological terms that you are not acting as a normal, constitutional American president, that this is not what the country is founded on, that you have to respect the ability and the right of someone to practice their own religion, not mock it or wage war in it. And this is not just Trump, obviously. Pete Hegseth. Yesterday's briefing was talking about, you know, the. The rescue operation for the soldier as some sort of providential matter in which, you know, this person was, you know, saved on Easter Sunday and God is great and all these things, and they're talking in these incredibly theological terms. And. And I thought Tucker's anger at it, I mean, it was. I felt like it was legit Anger was valid in that moment. Um, maybe I'm a sucker for. For his compelling oratory, but it did seem, honestly, like he was angry. Hey, so this time of year, I'm trying to stay consistent with eating well, but between work workouts and commuting, cooking just isn't happening as much as it should. Tempo Meals, however, gives me fresh, balanced meals ready in two minutes, so I can eat the way I want without Losing time. Each meal is perfectly portioned for lunch or dinner and it's ready in just two minutes. That means real food, real fast, without the sad desk lunch or the drive through regret. With 20 new recipes every week made from nutrient rich ingredients, Tempo keeps things exciting and helps you stay consistent with healthy eating habits. Even busy athletes like Maria Sharapova swear by Tempo for balanced meals that help them stay on top of their wellness goals. And no matter your goals, there's a Tempo meal for you. So protein packed meals with up to 30 grams of protein, calorie conscious or even GLP1 balanced meals. It's convenient but flexible enough to fit the way you want to eat. For a limited time, Tempo is offering our listeners 60% off their first box. Go to tempomeals.com bulwarktakes that's tempomeals.com Bulwarktakes for 60. That's 6,0% off your first box. Templemeals.com. rules and restrictions may apply.
- [06:16]
B
Yeah, I mean, I think that's right. I mean, at one point he says, you know, this country isn't a theocracy, you know, and by kind of pulling in all this Christian language, you're tarnishing it by associating it with this war. You know, I, I do think he seems to, I mean, obviously Tucker has these, you know, nebulous ties to countries in the Middle east like Qatar. But I do think this is a problem.
- [06:38]
A
Yes, yes.
- [06:40]
B
But you know, and supposedly, you know, we also have to factor that he claims the CIA was investigating him for foreign ties. So I mean, there's a lot going on here. But I agree with you. I think the argument he was making here was compelling. And I think frankly, you know, this, as you said, this was before the destroy civilization tweet and I feel like more and more people are going to start to agree with him on the Right, you know, after that tweet.
- [07:02]
A
Definitely, definitely. You're seeing it already. Before we get to that though, I want to play the Tucker, the second Tucker clip where he's just basically saying this is a make or break moment. Lying in the same time, like if you feel like things are off the rails, you gotta speak up now. So let's play that clip.
- [07:20]
C
If you work in the White House or in the US Military, now is time to say no, absolutely not, and say it directly to the President. No. In case you're thinking about using some weapon of mass destruction against the population of Iran, in whose name we liberated Iran. We killed their religious leader for their Benefit. Do you remember that this was last month? Those people who are in direct contact with the president need to say, no, I'll resign. I'll do whatever I can do legally to stop this, because this is insane. And if given the order, I'm not carrying it out. Figure out the codes on the football yourself.
- [07:56]
A
Here he is, he's saying to. If you work in the White House or the military, now's the time to say, absolutely not. Time for resignations. Time to raise your voice. You know, I was talking about this, I think, internally the other day, because this is something we talk about a lot here at the Bulwark. And I, you know, it's, it's hard, right? Like, I mean, Joe Kent did it, but Joe Kent is a bit of a wild child. And Joe Kent was then subsequently maligned. And then I think there's an investigation into him. I mean, surely these things way over people who want to speak out, right? Like, they went and they, they targeted six senators, Democrats, for the crime of saying you don't have to obey unlawful orders. So, like, this is what happens when you have a presidency committed to retribution on all fronts, one that controls the Department of Justice, the FBI, and honestly, where they have a lot of allies and keep spots in the media that said, that said, there are people speaking out. And so you referenced this first. Let's talk about Alex Jones.
- [09:01]
B
Why?
- [09:02]
A
It's like we are, like, finding the most insane people to say, well, they got a point here. But here's Alex Jones this morning after that Trump leak.
- [09:12]
D
A whole civilization will die tonight, never to be brought back again. That is the definition of genocide. Not a war, not a defensive war, but a literal bombardment, like Martians, you know, attack us. We don't have a defense. And I want to be clear. I am proud. I've at trump the last 10 years. So much good happened. Globalism was absolutely discredited and dismantled. It's part of a larger wave worldwide. But this new Trump really started when Elon Musk got run out of there. The last eight months is a disaster.
- [09:56]
A
You know, he says a whole civil, whole civilization might die. He says he might die. Why is he filming?
- [10:01]
B
I was going to say, that man driving 70 miles an hour on the highway and filming himself is making a lot of sense. There's a fake Mike Lindell clip where it looks like he's, like, busy filming himself and going like 100 miles an hour.
- [10:13]
D
But.
- [10:14]
B
But that's a real.
- [10:16]
A
I would just not recommend that you shoot a video driving on the highway like that. You can pull over if you really need to do the video, or you can just wait. You know, don't need to post right away. You can wait. We'll get your thoughts later. But what do you make of Alex Jones?
- [10:32]
B
Yeah, you know, it's interesting. I mean, the backstory here is that Alex Jones, you can see he's kind of trying to, you know, walk this line or explain why he previously liked Trump. In the past, he's been very closely tied to Trump, even after, you know, these previous strikes on Iran, things like that, things that, you know, the guy who hates, you know, foreign quagmires, black helicopters, this kind of stuff, you would think Alex Jones wouldn't like. And he's taken a lot of flack from that for people on the right, kind of conspiracy minded people. But you can see here that he's making a break with Trump. And I think, you know, at his heart, and this sounds. Alex Jones pursues a sort of humanism, right? He is a guy who is like, they're making the frogs gay. They're putting chemicals in the water. They want to turn us into robots. I mean, these are things that he returns to. And so I think when you start saying, you know, we're gonna blow up a civilization, I think that is something that in, you know, for all his flaws, I think kind of strikes at the center of the Alex Jones ethos.
- [11:29]
A
That's humanism.
- [11:31]
B
Well, saying you shouldn't blow people, you know, blow up a civilization, I would say.
- [11:33]
A
Oh, I thought you were talking about the making the frogs gay.
- [11:36]
B
Well, yeah, I mean, well, the, the putting the, the chemicals in the water, you know, this kind of stuff. That, that.
- [11:40]
A
Yes, I was worried about the frogs. Sorry, I didn't realize that.
- [11:44]
B
It's frog side effects.
- [11:45]
A
It's frogism. Classic frogism here, right there. He's not alone. We have Candace Owens, of course, saying 25th Amendment needs to be invoked. She calls Trump a genocidal lunatic. Marjorie Sherlock green also saying 25th amendment. Exclamation point, exclamation point, exclamation point. She called it evil and madness. Look, we talked about this yesterday, like, so, on the one hand, Candace has undoubtedly incredibly big audience. Tucker has a massive audience. Their numbers are rising. On the other hand, we're sort of grappling with whether these things matter because you see in the polls that MAGA voters still like the guy. And, you know, Marjorie Taylor Greene left Congress. Right. Like, so I just have trouble weighing what the significance of this is. It's, it's fucking notable. Obviously I'm trying to think of a parallel on the left. Like what would be the parallel be like if, you know, during the Obama years, Jon Stewart was just saying, you know, this guy's, you know, out of his mind trying to pass Obamacare, get him out of office, but like, I don't know, 25th Amendment remotely close.
- [12:54]
B
Yeah, I mean someone like, yeah, Obama or Rachel Maddow or something. But again, I mean a lot of these figures, particularly someone like, you know, on the right. I think what's unique is that these right wing media figures really have so much more power than their left wing or liberal equivalents. I mean, a lot of these people are, you know, on, let's say MSNBC or whatever. I mean they could be rich and they have shows with an audience. But these someone like Tucker is like almost like an operative in unto himself and he goes to the White House and he does all this stuff. So I think it is a challenge figuring out how important this is for Trump's popularity. On the other hand, I think we can look at sort of anecdotal things like for example, there was just an article about the maga merch store that closed because after the war everyone stopped coming in. I mean, I think the polls can show a kind of like blind faith in Trump or sort of like, you know, as we see with Megyn Kelly, she'll say, I just hate those Democrats so much. You know, no matter what Trump does, he could drop a nuclear bomb and I would still support him. But on the other hand, I think a lot of that support for, I don't think there's a lot of like real like zest for the war and I think were something, you know, to happen. I mean, I think Trump was very lucky that the, the pilots were, or the airmen were rescued. I think if we start getting more casualties or casualties in Iran based on this sort of civilization ending plan, you know, I think we could start seeing that reflected in the polls.
- [14:15]
A
Yeah, let's play Megan Kelly because I think this is the, this is the nut of it. Like people are just going to go back to this type of thinking. But let's play what she said.
- [14:24]
E
Trump could drop a nuke. And I still vote Republican over those people because they want to avenue voter in some ways, I really am. But honestly they, what they want to do is nuke our own country. You know, it's like the open border, what they're doing to children. All that stuff is still that they would do it all if put back in power. And I, I think Most Republicans know that.
- [14:44]
A
What the fuck? Like, it's not even remotely on the same ledger. Nuke a civilization or, like, be kind to transgender athletes. Gotta choose, you know.
- [14:56]
B
You know, it's striking to me that a decade ago, you know, she was this, like, profiling courage for turning on Trump over a rude debate performance.
- [15:03]
A
She was on NBC talking about how, you know, being sympathetic to transgendered kids.
- [15:10]
B
And now she says, oh, who cares about a little nuke?
- [15:14]
A
But that's the thing. It's like, if you can get, if you can't get over, if, if nuking some population overseas is not aligned too far, then I just don't know what, what is. Like, at what point do you just have to say you're, you're. You're kind of cultist about it, Right? Like, that is kind of cultist. Jesus, it is so dark.
- [15:34]
B
If I would just add another reaction, we're seeing, I think, from people like Eric Erickson, the talk radio host, people that are kind of more mainline conservatives reacting to this. The, the idea of ending the Iranian civilization is. People are saying, you know, this is. Well, this is madman theory. You know, he's just bluffing. This is like when he threatened Kim Jong Un with fire and fury, and we'll have to see. But I think Trump is in this, you know, people are recognizing. I mean, he's kind of in this bind and he doesn't want to lose. He doesn't want to lose face. And so it just seems like it's going to keep escalating.
- [16:02]
A
Yeah. And it's. Whatever. I mean, obviously I'd be incredibly thrilled if he backed off. And, and there was some deal. I think the entire world would be thrilled if that was the case. And I'll even let these people say, ah, he's such a great negotiator. Art of the deal. He was so. He always knew this was going to be the outcome, and he just played the hand perfectly. Yeah, go, feel free. Say it. I don't care. But it's not like this comes without a cost. Right. Like you're, you know, scaring the living daylights out of people. We already have dead service men. Thousands of people in Iran are dead. The oil markets are spiked. The economic ripple effects are profound. We've burned every alliance that we cared about over this, and we're threatening to leave NATO. And if you get a sort of deal that gets you back to the stat previous status quo, like, that doesn't make you a master negotiator, just makes you an idiot, honestly. But if they want to say that he did it and he got great negotiation out of it. Cool. I'm happy for them. You know, I was thinking when we were talking about this, we were talking about, like, the sort of anecdotal stuff, like the metrics that you can tell if he's. If he's losing popularity. Have they been doing those, like, Ohio diner interviews on TV that were popular in 2017, 2018? Have you seen any of those?
- [17:19]
B
Not that I've seen.
- [17:20]
A
We should do those. We got to go back to the diner as a genre, a reporting genre. I'll send you there.
- [17:26]
B
Well, you know, someone just went to the diner where the Trump administration officials supposedly teleported to for the Times.
- [17:31]
A
But.
- [17:32]
B
But I think that's the new.
- [17:33]
A
The new genre wasn't a diner. There's a Waffle House. Get it right. Come on. Totally different. Yeah, that was a good story. I should. I should have thought about that one. I was a little jealous of that one. Okay. I got nothing else to add. I. I'm like, how are you preparing for tonight? I'm, like, nervous. I was nervous last night for, like, the Yukon Michigan game. This is a different type of anxiety. I gotta be honest.
- [17:53]
B
I think it's really grim. I mean, I think, you know, it's, you know, it's one of these situations where, you know, we. I think we felt this way a lot, whether it's January 6th, these other things under the Trump, you know, Trump's presidencies. But, you know, this really feels like really much darker, stark moment of sort of like, is someone going to do something?
- [18:11]
A
Yeah. No, it's bad. Well, I'm glad to hold hands with you and walk through it. Well, really appreciate your help for my emotional stability. Everyone should follow False Flag, subscribe to it, and subscribe to our YouTube feed, where you get really uplifting conversations like this. Talk to you soon.