Rogan Plays Footsie With Anti-Semites, Tim Pool Skatepark Fiasco

Summary

Bulwark Takes: Rogan Plays Footsie With Anti-Semites, Tim Pool Skatepark Fiasco
Release Date: March 19, 2025

In this episode of Bulwark Takes, hosts Sam Stein and Will Sommer delve into two pressing issues: the troubling alliance between influential MAGA podcasters and anti-Semitic figures, and the controversial skatepark project spearheaded by right-wing YouTuber Tim Pool. Through insightful discussion and critical analysis, Stein and Sommer unpack the implications of these developments on the broader socio-political landscape.

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1. MAGA Podcasts and the Rise of Anti-Semitic Conspiracy Theories

A. Joe Rogan's Platforming of Anti-Semitic Voices

Sam Stein opens the conversation by expressing concern over prominent podcasts like Joe Rogan’s giving airtime to individuals espousing anti-Semitic conspiracy theories. Will Sommer emphasizes the significant influence these podcasts wield, highlighting that their reach is often underestimated:

"If there was One lesson from 2024, it was that, you know, however much how, however influential you think these podcasts are, you're underestimating it."
— Will Sommer [01:02]

One such figure discussed is Ian Carroll, a Gen Z TikTok conspiracy theorist known for his provocative statements linking Jews to global events like the 9/11 attacks. Stein challenges Carroll's rhetoric, pointing out the inherent flaw in blaming an entire ethnic group:

"He's a stain on all people… But because he is Jewish."
— Sam Stein [02:34]

B. Theo Vaughn and Candace Owens' Anti-Semitic Remarks

The discussion shifts to Theo Vaughn, another influential podcaster who has recently featured Candace Owens, a right-wing commentator with a growing propensity for anti-Semitic remarks. Sommer notes Owens' troubling claims that "Israel and the Jews are blackmailing all these American politicians and that's why they control America," indicating a descent from fringe platforms like Stormfront into mainstream media:

"A few years ago, you have to go to Stormfront to find, and now we're finding it on these just like mega popular podcasts."
— Will Sommer [04:19]

C. Backlash and the Consequences of Platforming Hate

Stein and Sommer discuss the backlash from within the Republican Party, particularly from Jewish Republicans like Jeremy Boring, former CEO of the Daily Wire. Boring condemned the anti-Semitic content, labeling it "a catastrophe" and "a terrible day for American Jews":

"This is a catastrophe. This is a black mark. The idea that this anti-Semitism is getting such a wide audience."
— Will Sommer [05:53]

The hosts argue that platforming such harmful content normalizes extremist views and invites broader societal acceptance. Stein draws parallels with the mainstreaming of vaccine skepticism, asserting that giving airtime to conspiracy theories inherently increases their legitimacy and reach:

"Once you inject the stuff into the mainstream, once you have the biggest podcasters in the world platforming this stuff, it invites more people to think exactly like this."
— Sam Stein [06:03]

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2. The Epstein Files and Political Maneuvering

A. Pam Bondi's Controversial Claims

Transitioning to the Epstein files controversy, Sommer details how former Attorney General Pam Bondi claimed to possess Jeffrey Epstein’s client list, fueling speculation and frustration among Trump supporters. Stein notes the skepticism surrounding Bondi’s assertions, especially given Epstein's ties to prominent figures like Donald Trump:

"Trump has never, never been fully committal on the Epstein stuff."
— Sam Stein [10:22]

B. Speculation on Administration Motives

Sommer speculates that the Trump administration might be delaying the release of the Epstein files to divert attention from other scandals, such as the imminent release of the JFK assassination files:

"I think the JFK files are kind of like a distraction from the Epstein thing."
— Will Sommer [09:35]

Stein highlights the pattern of promised disclosures that fail to materialize, leading to disenchantment and distrust among supporters:

"It always seems to be a show. And when they promise some Epstein information doesn't like, it never materializes."
— Sam Stein [10:18]

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3. Tim Pool’s Skatepark Fiasco in West Virginia

A. Ambitious Project Meets Local Resistance

The conversation shifts to Tim Pool, a well-known right-wing YouTuber, and his ill-fated attempt to establish a skatepark in Martinsburg, West Virginia. Sommer recounts Pool's initial proposal to host a skateboarding contest in a local abandoned lot, offering $20,000 as an incentive:

"Tim Pool said, cool, I'll offer $20,000 so we can have a contest."
— Will Sommer [12:01]

However, local skaters rebuffed Pool’s overtures, leading him to secretly purchase the land without community support. When the project faltered, Pool accused anti-Pool vandals of sabotaging the park, ultimately surrendering the property to the city without having constructed anything:

"He was going to build this sickest skate park ever. You guys are all welcome."
— Will Sommer [13:08]

B. Confrontation and Public Relations Decline

Pool’s frustrations culminated in a public confrontation at a local Cracker Barrel, where he alleged being accosted over the failed skatepark initiative. Stein humorously questions the plausibility of such an incident, highlighting the unusual nature of the claim:

"Are you aware of a man wearing a beanie who got accosted in your Cracker Barrel?"
— Sam Stein [13:36]

The episode underscores the challenges faced by public figures like Pool when community projects clash with local sentiments, leading to damaged reputations and halted initiatives.

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Conclusion

In this episode, Bulwark Takes critically examines the intersection of influential media platforms and the propagation of anti-Semitic conspiracy theories, highlighting the risks of normalizing extremist viewpoints. Additionally, the discussion on Tim Pool’s skatepark venture serves as a case study on the pitfalls of public projects lacking genuine community support. Through thoughtful analysis and poignant commentary, Stein and Sommer provide listeners with a comprehensive understanding of these multifaceted issues.

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Notable Quotes:

• "If there was One lesson from 2024, it was that, you know, however much how, however influential you think these podcasts are, you're underestimating it."
  — Will Sommer [01:02]

• "He's a stain on all people… But because he is Jewish."
  — Sam Stein [02:34]

• "A few years ago, you have to go to Stormfront to find, and now we're finding it on these just like mega popular podcasts."
  — Will Sommer [04:19]

• "This is a catastrophe. This is a black mark. The idea that this anti-Semitism is getting such a wide audience."
  — Will Sommer [05:53]

• "Once you inject the stuff into the mainstream, once you have the biggest podcasters in the world platforming this stuff, it invites more people to think exactly like this."
  — Sam Stein [06:03]

• "It always seems to be a show. And when they promise some Epstein information doesn't like, it never materializes."
  — Sam Stein [10:18]

• "Are you aware of a man wearing a beanie who got accosted in your Cracker Barrel?"
  — Sam Stein [13:36]

---

This comprehensive summary encapsulates the critical discussions from the Bulwark Takes episode, providing readers with a clear understanding of the key issues addressed by Sam Stein and Will Sommer.

Transcript

[Sam Stein]

Hey, guys, what's up? It's me, Sam Stein, managing out at the Bulwark, joined by Will Sommer, who is fresh off his first edition of False Flag, what is widely considered the most critical newsletter of our time. The reviews are pouring in. The New York Times calls it indispensable. The. The Wall Street Journal said it is. All right, Will, thanks for joining us, as always.

[Will Sommer]

Thank.

[Sam Stein]

Subscribe to the feed if you're watching this, I want to talk about this first edition because I'm Jewish and this one's about MAGA bro podcasters playing footsie with anti Semites. It piqued my interest for obvious reasons. I guess I'm a little bit nervous about what's happening, and I'm. I don't know why it's happening, and maybe you can explain what the hell is going on here.

[Will Sommer]

Yeah. So, I mean, these podcasts we're talking about. I mean, we're talking about Joe Rogan, Theo Vaughn, kind of.

[Sam Stein]

These are like really serious podcasts. They have big audiences.

[Will Sommer]

This is the Roganiverse. And, you know, I feel like if there was One lesson from 2024, it was that, you know, however much how, however influential you think these podcasts are, you're underestimating it. And so, so now this idea that they have, you know, increasingly over just this month, started having some anti Semitic conspiracy theorists on his guests and people who will are not hiding it. I mean, they're on the show saying.

[Sam Stein]

Who are these people? Let's start with that.

[Will Sommer]

Sure. So. So one of them is a guy named Ian Carroll who has kind of like a. Like a mechanic's mustache, kind of a greasy mustache kind of guy, and he has sort of emerged on the scene.

[Sam Stein]

Why is the mustache important?

[Will Sommer]

I'm kind of trying to sit. The sense of. Yeah. That he kind of looks like, like a Gen Z type of guy, you know, Gotcha. And, you know, he's sort of emerged on the scene out of nowhere, which has provoked conspiracy theories of. And, well, just that he's, you know, an FBI plant or whatever. But that he's a. He's a. And, you know, him going on Robin doesn't help.

[Sam Stein]

Is he a fault. Is he Jewish? And this is all false.

[Will Sommer]

Well, I mean, how deep does it go? And so in his case, he's sort of a. Like, he's kind of like the Gen Z TikTok conspiracy theorist, and he kind of hits you with the, like, hey, what's up, fam? Like, you know, Jews did 9, 11, and so stuff like that. And so, so he went on. He went on Rogan and promoted a lot of like, Epstein stuff, saying that, you know, he said, jeffrey Epstein's a stain on the Jewish people. And so this is kind of heavy duty stuff.

[Sam Stein]

I think that's fair. Yeah, I'll take that one.

[Will Sommer]

I'll let you handle that one.

[Sam Stein]

He's a stain on all people. But because he is Jewish.

[Will Sommer]

Yes. It's not great.

[Sam Stein]

Where. How do these people get into Rogan's orbit? I'm sort of curious about that. Like, this guy you say burst out onto the scene called clearly, like, he's viral enough, has enough of an audience that Joe Rogan's like, we need to book that guy. But why?

[Will Sommer]

Yeah, I mean, well, look, I mean, Joe Rogan loves conspiracy theories himself. I mean, sometimes they're pretty harmless, like about UFOs. And, you know, other times, you know, he. I mean, he clearly loves these guys. I mean, he's chopping it up with them. He's saying, you know, he's referencing years of their work going back. So this isn't like a guy they just plopped in front of him. I mean, he. He's a fan.

[Sam Stein]

And then Theo Vaughn is the other one. And I was talking to someone who. Big Theo Vaughn fan. I like Theo Vaughn, but like, they were very disappointed in the platforming decisions that he made. What happened there?

[Will Sommer]

Sure. So Theo Vaughn. Yeah. Once on the Real World. Now this kind of like affable, you know, I hate to say dimwit, but like, sort of like sort of plays in spacey.

[Sam Stein]

Maybe he's like, he's the dimwit who's actually smart. Right?

[Will Sommer]

Yeah, I think that's a good way to put it. He kind of like an idiot savant, perhaps, Right.

[Sam Stein]

He's like, I'm just a simpleton. And I just actually had a really interesting and thoughtful and insightful comment. It's like, oh, yeah, Theo, good job. I think that's a good way to put it.

[Will Sommer]

So he had on Candace Owens, who is sort of a right wing talker. YouTube personality. Yes. Who has become that one.

[Sam Stein]

Didn't just pop up on the scene now.

[Will Sommer]

Right. And so she is becoming that one.

[Sam Stein]

Popped off the scene.

[Will Sommer]

And so last year, actually a year ago today, as we're recording this, she got the boot from the Daily Wire, Ben Shapiro's company over her. Like, really, like she was getting very into anti Semitism, basically. And so in this case, the least.

[Sam Stein]

Yeah.

[Will Sommer]

She goes on Theo Vaughan and she's saying, well, Israel and the Jews are blackmailing all these American politicians and that's why they control America. I mean, this is the kind of stuff that a few years ago, I mean, you have to go to Stormfront to find, and now we're finding it on these just like mega popular podcasts.

[Sam Stein]

So what's the explanation? I mean, I guess in theory this is like, well, you know, we just went through a year or so of them being like, we should just, you know, unleash the hounds on free speech and if you can't take it, you know, get out you. And then obviously this is what we've, you know, sewed. Right. Like this is, this is exactly the outcome. But at the same time though, I think to a person, people probably thought, well, they wouldn't like platform anti Semitism. Right. Um, so I don't know, maybe that's what's happening here. Maybe they just need to be controversial and keep stirring the pot.

[Will Sommer]

Well, I have a couple theories about it. I mean, I think on one hand it's, you know, a lot of these podcasts, really, their bread and butter was sort of the blue haired SJW outrage of the day, trans issues things. And that was how they sort of stood, stood out as like kind of contrarian or like a little like different.

[Sam Stein]

Right. They were common sense, but they were just common sense telling it like it is and maybe just raising a few questions here and there about medical science.

[Will Sommer]

Right, exactly. And so now obviously a lot of that DEI type stuff is on the retreat. And so I. And it's sort of the. So I think they're looking for something that will continue to get attention. And the reality is it certainly did get attention. I mean, I wrote about it. A lot of people.

[Sam Stein]

What, yeah, what's the, what's the. So is there's backlash obviously to this.

[Will Sommer]

It's interesting. Yeah. A lot of particularly Jewish Republicans were, were offended by these appearances. Jeremy Boring, the now former CEO of the Daily Wire, came out and said, you know, after the, the Ian Carroll interview, I thought, I mean, he was, he took it like very seriously, which was interesting to me. And he said, you know, this is a terrible day for American Jews. You know, this is like a black mark. I'm paraphrasing here, but essentially this is a, this is a catastrophe. This idea that this anti Semitism is getting such a wide audience.

[Sam Stein]

You know, I'll speak sort of on a personal level, but I kind of in, in agreement, honestly. I just, I guess it doesn't seem, if you look at this from far, you're like, well, what harm Is it. They're just having a conversation. Doesn't mean people have to listen to it. But I think the platforming is itself a problem, because once you inject the stuff into the mainstream, once you have the biggest podcasters in the world platforming this stuff, it invites more people to think exactly like this. And, you know, obviously, anti Semitism. Anti Semitism has been around forever, but we saw a version of this, like, with the. With the vaccine stuff. Right. It was forever. It was like, well, don't platform it. Don't platform it. Don't give it audience. And then it start getting more and more platforms, and now we're in a place where vaccine skepticism is fairly mainstream. So I think there is proof to the concept that if you give things platforms, they will take grips among certain people.

[Will Sommer]

Yeah, I think that's right. I mean, I think once these ideas are sort of injected into the discourse, it becomes a story about, you know, censorship or, you know.

[Sam Stein]

Right. And that's the flip side is, like, if they were to, you know, if people come down hard on Rogan, all he's going to say is what? You're trying to censor conversation?

[Will Sommer]

Yeah. You know, we're just asking questions, and particularly, like, you're trying to, you know, stifle discussion about Jeffrey Epstein or, you know, what have you, or Israel, you know, and. And it's. It sort of gets away from the. The original topic.

[Sam Stein]

Can we talk a little bit about Epstein? Divert a little bit, but, like, there's obviously a lot of anger happening on the. On the maga, right, over the fact that these files have not been released. I know you wrote about what happened with Bondi and Loomer, but, like, what's the status here? Are they. Are they just dropping or are they still pounding? We have Bondi for how she handled it.

[Will Sommer]

Yeah, I mean, this is an interesting one. I mean, so before the. Like right at the start of the administration, Pam Bondi said, I have the client list on my desk. So you would think. And, you know, all the genuine Epstein experts who are around say there is no client list, or they'd be very surprised if there was. So now she's saying, well, I got the client list right here. And so you're like, oh, boy. And, you know, the anticipation here is. Is that it's, you know, a lot of Trump supporters have been basically led to believe this is gonna say, like, Oprah, Tom Hanks. I mean, it's gonna be this kind of like Oprah. Yeah, Oprah. I was surprised, too. That's gonna be your reaction when the files come out.

[Sam Stein]

Yeah, Oprah.

[Will Sommer]

Yeah. And so they think it's gonna be all, you know, you see these, the fake flight manifests circulating and it's like, well, that guy would have been eight years old with this, you know, it's like that guy wouldn't have been palling around with Jeffrey episode.

[Sam Stein]

Some of these don't comp.

[Will Sommer]

Yeah. You know, like some Liberal, you know, 20 something.

[Sam Stein]

So they, they, they do this and like Timothy Chalamet. That doesn't make sense.

[Will Sommer]

And so of course the, the binder. You know, so basically this fascinating thing where the, these right wing influencers were going to the White House on unrelated, you know, thing. And Pam Bondi reportedly was like, this is my chance to get some clout. You know, she does this the. As far as what's going on with it now. I mean she said cash, you know, I want the FBI files on my desk that, you know, less than 24 hours from now. And that was two weeks ago at this point. So, you know, as far as we know. I mean, I kind of think. Can I speculate a little bit? It's some interesting speculation.

[Sam Stein]

Yes, of course.

[Will Sommer]

So, so I.

[Sam Stein]

Speculation.

[Will Sommer]

My speculation is, and this is maybe like a little like to like 5D chess.

[Sam Stein]

Just don't get us sued, that's all. Well, speculate responsibly.

[Will Sommer]

But, but I think, I think the Trump administration is. And as we're talking here, the JFK files are supposed to come out today.

[Sam Stein]

Right. Right. This is for just to be clear, 4:30pm We've been promised the JFK files today.

[Will Sommer]

Yes.

[Sam Stein]

It's getting a little late.

[Will Sommer]

And so I think the JFK files are kind of like a distraction from the Epstein thing in that like they're. Because Trump's saying, you know, the one, the stuff people are most excited about is the JFK files and that might be a generational divide as well where I think perhaps boomers. This is kind of like the JFK assassination looms larger. But, but I think there is kind of this thing where it's like, well, I don't know, we do have the JFK files. You know, we can drop.

[Sam Stein]

Trump has never, never been fully committal on the Epstein stuff.

[Will Sommer]

Well, why would he be?

[Sam Stein]

He's friends with Epstein. Yeah. And so the idea that he was always like, yeah, we're going to release jfk, mlk, rfk. And we're like. And yeah, we're going way back.

[Will Sommer]

The Teapot Dome.

[Sam Stein]

We're blowing it all up and keep going, sir. And so, yeah, but. So I, I guess it's the whole sort of like, do they just fall for it and like, does it go away? Because this has happened several times now and day porn I was talking about, it always seems to be a show. And when they promise some Epstein information doesn't like, materialize. But in this case, Loomer seemed really aggrieved and angry and was on like a real rampage against Bondi. I guess at some point you just tie, right, and you just leave it alone. But, um, is that, is there any sense that that's happened? That they're just ready to move on?

[Will Sommer]

I'm. I mean, I think, I think they're still ready, they're still there. And, and I think that, like, you know, if another week passes or something, I think we'll get some more outrage. I mean, you know, one of the things.

[Sam Stein]

How much outrage can you continue to muster over this? It's like three weeks. Is that, is that sustainable?

[Will Sommer]

One of the big, you know, one of the complications is after the original Pam Bondi release, one of the, one of these right wing figures said this was a huge debacle. For one thing, Trump's names were. Name was in the files.

[Sam Stein]

Did he not know? There's literally video evidence. Come on, man, you gotta keep up. All right, last bit. Tim Pool.

[Will Sommer]

Yes.

[Sam Stein]

You wrote about this skate park in West Virginia, very hip, very cool, but it's not actually going well. So explain exactly what's happening.

[Will Sommer]

Yeah, so this has been a passion project of mine for a little while. So Tim Pool, popular, very popular right wing YouTuber.

[Sam Stein]

Yes. You might know him from the Beanie.

[Will Sommer]

The beanie? Yes, the emblematic beanie. And he, he has like some compounds out in West Virginia and Maryland. And he's also very into skateboarding. And so two years ago he. There was a. There's this. Basically it's like a patch of. It's just like concrete. It's like a concrete slab in this town called Martinsburg, West Virginia that he lives near. And the skaters there had. It was basically abandoned property that they skated on. And Tim Pool said, cool, I'll offer $20,000 so we can have a contest. And they said, oh, Tim Pool, we want nothing to do with you.

[Sam Stein]

What kind of contest? Like, who's the better skater?

[Will Sommer]

Who's like, who does the sickest, you know, Ollie, whatever. I mean, I'm going to get roasted by a skateboarding.

[Sam Stein]

I'm not, I'm not pretending to know anything about this shit.

[Will Sommer]

So. So they said, tim, you know, we don't want to associate our skateboarding with you. And so then he secretly went and buys the land. And now I will say he, to his credit, he sort of seemed to be more interested in co opting the local skate scene because he's like, I'm going to build this sickest skate park ever. You guys are all welcome. And now cut to now where he says, I'm surrendering the skate park to the city. You know, the city.

[Sam Stein]

Did he build anything or.

[Will Sommer]

No, no. And so he claims anti Timpool vandals were destroying it. And so basically the city took it over. The city says they don't know what he's talking about. And I guess the final beat here is that he, he claims he was accosted at Cracker Barrel. He said he was going to get catfish and he walked in and someone said, you stole my skate park. So look, I mean, things are heating up.

[Sam Stein]

Do we know which Cracker Barrel?

[Will Sommer]

I assume the Martinsburg Cracker Barrel.

[Sam Stein]

Did you call up the Martinsburg Crackle?

[Will Sommer]

I should have. I should have. Was there a showdown at your Cracker Barrel?

[Sam Stein]

I would call them up and just say, one, do you serve catfish? Then we would, you know, that could just break the story wide open right there. Two, are you aware of a man wearing a beanie who got a costume in your Cracker Barrel? And if so, can you provide any videotape? That is a wild story. I, you know, Cracker Barrel, I don't hate on Cracker Barrel. I'm, I'm all for it, but I've never seen someone get a accosted over a skate park.

[Will Sommer]

It is just, it's just funny. It's a funny phrase. And when he's saying. And why do I know what is the problem here? Someone accosted me at the Cracker Barrel. You know, you expect someone maybe about 40 years older to be saying that.

[Sam Stein]

Again? I'm not going to hand on a Cracker Barrel like the chicken and dumplings. All right, Will Summer. Doing God's work. The New York Times review was fantastic. Can't wait for more for the New Yorker to do its review of this newsletter.

[Will Sommer]

New newsletter.

[Sam Stein]

Everyone should subscribe to it. It's false flag. Everyone should subscribe to our YouTube page. It's the best in the biz, in my opinion. Thank you for tuning in.

[Will Sommer]

Talk later. Hey.