So Much for Health! RFK's MAGA Steak ’n Shake Stunt

Summary

Bulwark Takes: So Much for Health! RFK's MAGA Steak ’n Shake Stunt

Released on March 14, 2025

In this episode of Bulwark Takes, hosts Sam Stein and Will Sommer delve into a controversial incident involving Robert F. Kennedy Jr. (RFK Jr.) and the burger chain Steak and Shake. The discussion navigates through themes of political stunt capitalism, dietary myths, and the intersection of politics with public health messaging.

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1. Introduction of Will Sommer

[00:00 - 00:30]
Sam Stein, the managing editor at The Bulwark, introduces Will Sommer, a new hire who is beginning his journey with the team. Will mentions that he has recently launched his own newsletter, aiming to contribute fresh perspectives to the platform.

Notable Quote:
Sam Stein [00:30]: “Welcome to Will Sommer, new hire. He's going to be helming his own newsletter, but to get him warmed up, he did the addition of morning shots today and will tell explain what you wrote about.”

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2. Steak and Shake’s Pivot to MAGA and Seed Oil Controversy

[00:31 - 03:01]
Sam and Will discuss Steak and Shake's strategic shift towards a MAGA (Make America Great Again) alignment. A significant part of this pivot is the company's announcement to replace soybean and canola seed oils with beef tallow for frying their french fries. This move taps into a growing sentiment among certain right-wing and online fitness communities advocating against seed oils.

Will Sommer [01:36]: “There’s kind of this growing movement over the past few years among like online fitness types and in particularly on the right to ditch seed oils in your diet.”

Sam questions the scientific validity of RFK Jr.'s claims that seed oils contribute to obesity and chronic diseases, highlighting the lack of substantial evidence supporting these assertions.

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3. RFK Jr.'s Appearance at Steak and Shake with Sean Hannity

[03:02 - 05:00]
The conversation shifts to RFK Jr.'s recent appearance at Steak and Shake alongside Sean Hannity. The duo was photographed enjoying burgers and fries, which RFK Jr. praised as "amazing."

Sam Stein [04:11]: “RFK went there with Sean Hannity, and they said, wow, these are amazing.”

However, critics from the MAGA and health skeptic communities are challenging the authenticity of Steak and Shake’s claims about eliminating seed oils. Reports suggest that the fries may still contain soybean and canola oils due to the complexities of supply chains and pre-packaged fry preparations.

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4. Examining the Actual Oil Used in Fries

[05:01 - 06:21]
Will scrutinizes the claim that Steak and Shake fries are fried in beef tallow. He explains that most fast-food chains, including Steak and Shake, utilize pre-cut and pre-fried frozen fries that are likely cooked in soybean oil before freezing. Consequently, the final frying on-site using beef tallow may not eliminate all seed oils.

Will Sommer [05:15]: “Basically every fast food chain pre orders with the Exception of five guys and perhaps a few others.”

This revelation underscores a discrepancy between Steak and Shake's marketing and the actual product composition, casting doubt on the health claims being promoted.

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5. Critique of the Stunt and Public Health Messaging

[06:22 - 09:05]
Sam and Will critique the stunt as a form of "stunt capitalism" where political figures use brand alignments to further their agendas without substantive public health benefits. They highlight the incongruity of a Health and Human Services secretary endorsing a fast-food chain during a measles outbreak, raising questions about the prioritization of image over effective public health action.

Sam Stein [07:51]: “But the evidence appears to be that basically every fast food chain pre orders with the Exception of five guys and perhaps a few others.”

Additionally, they discuss RFK Jr.'s conflicting actions and statements, where he criticizes vaccines while advocating for dietary changes, further muddying the waters of public health discourse.

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6. Broader Context: Politicizing Health and Capitalism

[09:06 - 10:40]
The discussion broadens to address how health issues are being politicized, with companies like Steak and Shake aligning with right-wing movements to maintain economic relevance. They touch upon the company’s engagement with cryptocurrency memes and other political symbols as part of their marketing strategy.

Will Sommer [09:37]: “The comparison here is, you know, you would think the if we're going to make America healthy again, are we going to vaccinate children? No.”

Sam emphasizes the superficiality of using such stunts for political gain, likening it to the Tesla event on the White House South Lawn—more about creating viral moments than fostering genuine policy change.

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Conclusion

Throughout the episode, Sam Stein and Will Sommer offer a critical lens on how political figures and corporations may engage in performative acts that prioritize image over substantive health initiatives. The case of RFK Jr.’s appearance at Steak and Shake serves as a focal point for examining the intersections of politics, health, and capitalism, highlighting the complexities and potential pitfalls of such alliances.

Notable Quote:
Sam Stein [09:37]: “A normal thing to do would go down to West Texas and get the vaccine. Right. Like that would. Like that would.”

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This episode serves as a thought-provoking exploration of the ways in which health narratives can be co-opted for political and commercial purposes, urging listeners to critically evaluate the motivations and implications behind high-profile endorsements and marketing strategies.

Transcript

[Sam Stein]

Hey, guys. Me. Sam Stein, managing editor at the Bulwark. I'm joined by Will Sommer. What's up, Will?

[Will Sommer]

How you doing?

[Sam Stein]

Hey.

[Will Sommer]

Happy to be here. First week at the Bulwark.

[Sam Stein]

Yeah. How's it? Well, we'll get into how it's going a little bit. We'll here to talk about seed oils and Steak and Shake and how this whole thing that this burger company has done may just be, what are we calling it, Prop capitalism or something like that?

[Will Sommer]

Stunt capitalism.

[Sam Stein]

Stunt capitalism, Yeah. I think that's a good term for it. First of all, folks, welcome to Will Summer, new hire. He's going to be helming his own newsletter, but to get him warmed up, he. He did the addition of morning shots today and will tell explain what you wrote about. It's this thing that's in the Zeitgeist. Robert F. Kenney Jr. Appeared at this burger joint with Sean Hannity. Give us the backstory here.

[Will Sommer]

Sure. So there's this chain called Steak and Shake. It's kind of in the name. What they make, I was not aware of.

[Sam Stein]

I don't get it. What do they make?

[Will Sommer]

It's a, it's Midwestern. They have a bunch of locations.

[Sam Stein]

Have you been to one?

[Will Sommer]

I have not. No. And, and, but, you know, maybe I will now that I know that what they're cooking. And so they've kind of been up and down. I mean, they've had their business struggles, but they've done a new pivot and they're kind of going in a very MAGA direction. And part of that is they announced recently that they're going to stop deep frying the french fries in seed oil, so soybean oil, canola oil, and instead in beef tallow or beef fat right now.

[Sam Stein]

Why?

[Will Sommer]

Yeah, so this is kind of a rabbit hole, but there's kind of this growing movement over the past few years among like online fitness types and in particularly on the right to ditch seed oils in your diet. And you know, for the story, I looked into what the scientific, scientific evidence is against seed oils. And there's not a ton that they're bad for you. I mean, yes, drinking oil of any kind is not good for you, you know, but so is eating beef tallow. And so, so, so basically like the, the truth is that it's often used in processed foods. And so it's like, yes, like many eliminate, you know, diets where you eliminate something you're going to be eating less and so you'll get healthier.

[Sam Stein]

So. Yeah, yeah. But this is this became a thing on RFK Jr. Was out there saying, well, you know, these seed oils are creating this, you know, obesity epidemic, chronic diseases that we just didn't have when we were kids because back then, our french fries were made with cleaner oil. And now everyone who eats french fries is getting fat and obese, and they're. They're having all these coronary diseases that we just didn't have back then. You're telling me that's not true?

[Will Sommer]

Yeah, well, they sort of treat french fries. Like, in the past, you know, this was like eating kale chips or something. No one ever said that on the machinity.

[Sam Stein]

He was like, ah, you know, back then, I ate as many fries as I possibly could. Well, yeah, I mean, like, I ate a lot more fries back in my youth, too, and I didn't get fat. Like, that's not revelatory.

[Will Sommer]

That really hits, like, the. The whole seed oil thing. A lot of it is really keyed in on the idea that McDonald's switched in in the early 90s into seed oils from beef tallow. And. But, you know, imagine there's.

[Sam Stein]

But they did like, they did, right?

[Will Sommer]

They did. They did. But. And I think there's a lot of, like, nostalgia for, like, America Diner, that kind of aesthetics or, like. And frankly, like, being a kid that like a lot of this play. And that's why it's so focused on the french fries. Like, you know, sweet greens menu this month is also ditching seed oils. And you don't see rfk, as far as I know, showing up there is.

[Sam Stein]

Sweet Green doing that because they want to get in good with Trump.

[Will Sommer]

I don't know if it's Trump specifically, but. But I think it's clearly like a nod to seed oil phobia. Like, I went there and they had the. It was like, no seed oil. Don't worry about it.

[Sam Stein]

Sweet. You know, but there is a big reveal in your newsletter.

[Will Sommer]

Yes. Well, this is, you know, sorry, Seed oil haters. So. So Steak and Shake made a big deal about this. As you said. RFK went there with Sean Hannity, and they said, wow, these are amazing.

[Sam Stein]

People are raving about these French fries. You t. Amazing.

[Will Sommer]

But a lot of Make America Healthy Again influencers who are very serious about their seed oils are saying that, in fact, there are seed oils in the french fries. And that is because the evidence for this. Well, so unfortunately, Steak and Shake didn't get back to me on the deal with this, but the evidence appears to be that basically every fast food chain pre orders with the Exception of five guys and perhaps a few others.

[Sam Stein]

Do you know if they're coated in any other oils or preservatives or is it just one ingredient? Frozen potatoes?

[Will Sommer]

Yeah, it's got quite a bit of.

[Sam Stein]

It does.

[Will Sommer]

It's got like a batter, mixtar, rice.

[Sam Stein]

Flour, things like that. Is there an oil on the fries too?

[Will Sommer]

Mixed vegetable, soybean, canola.

[Sam Stein]

Okay. So that's coated, but when you fry them, they're in beef tallow.

[Will Sommer]

Pre orders, pre cut fries from like a Cisco, like a restaurant supplier.

[Sam Stein]

Right, right, right.

[Will Sommer]

And in those cases, they are. They are almost always cooked in soybean oil. I talked to a guy who runs an app called Seed Oil Scout. So he takes this very seriously, and he said it is basically impossible to buy restaurant wholesale fries in beef tallow. It does not exist. They.

[Sam Stein]

But they're buying pre cooked fries and not cooking them on site.

[Will Sommer]

They're precooked and then frozen and then cooked again on site. To be honest, this story kind of turned me off of all french fries. The getting deep into the supply chain.

[Sam Stein]

And, you know, so we're getting double fried fries.

[Will Sommer]

Yes, at least. Yes, at least. And I mean, so as part of this, I mean, people have been showing up at Steak and Shakes and saying, you know, let me back there. Let me see how you're frying those. Or like, you know, show me other.

[Sam Stein]

Videos online of them trying.

[Will Sommer]

Oh, yeah, yeah. And they're. Well, they're saying, you know, let me see the ingredient list. I was wondering if there was any way I could see the beef towel that you guys cook it in. Just like a picture of it or something. Yeah. Thank you so much.

[Sam Stein]

Yeah. If I could just give you the picture.

[Will Sommer]

Oh, you can't give me the picture. No, you can tell me what's in it, though. Yeah. Okay.

[Sam Stein]

Awesome.

[Will Sommer]

Ingredients. Beef tallow, natural scp, all fry, rfk.

[Sam Stein]

Is he aware of this? Is he. Do we have any sense of whether the Maha, real Maha power brokers are like, you know, a little bit upset that they give us attention to Steak and Shake.

[Will Sommer]

I would be kind of surprised if he's not aware of it because a lot of the people who've been raising this are pretty big deals in Maha. This woman named Alex Clark who has like, I think 500,000 YouTube subscribers. Huge amount. And she. She was kind of feuding with Steak and Shake who said. She said, you know, this is not true. You haven't eliminated seed oils. And they sort of said they didn't explicitly say that it has the oils, but they Said, well, look, supply chains are complicated. You know, let's just leave it at that.

[Sam Stein]

I don't want it to get lost. Because it's first, there's like the absurdity of, you know, our seed oils in here on the first, you know, fry or the second. And then there's like the kind of larger context of RFK going to this place, sitting down, eating a burger and fries, like Hannity's ordering him like a big soda. Like if you had that every day, like, it's not healthy. Let's just be clear, that's one. And then two is they're there to talk about ostensibly his stewardship of the Department of Health and Human Services. And while during the interview they're talking about this measles outbreak that's happening in West Texas that's affecting, you know, predominantly, if not exclusively, the unvaccinated. And during this entire interview, he means like suggesting like cod liver oil and suggesting that the vaccines themselves actually may cause the measles. And like, if you're looking in the aggregate for, you know, whether the interview was moving in a healthy direction or not, I feel like it's fairly one sided, but maybe I'm not the right person to, to gauge that.

[Will Sommer]

Yeah, I mean, it's an interesting thing. I mean, I think a lot of the Maha stuff is very, I mean, in reality, like, the way to lose weight is just eating less food. Right. And yet we're showing up restaurant and.

[Sam Stein]

The, I guess I just don't understand like a fast food restaurant no matter what. Like, well, if you, even if you had like beef towel fries and burgers every day, like, that would not be good for you.

[Will Sommer]

And you can see in the interview that RFK is like absolutely disgusted. Maybe he's cool with the french fries, but everything else there, like, repulses him. And so Hannity says at one point, he said, this is my second hamburger because I, at one, right before we started, and RFK looks like before you.

[Sam Stein]

Got here, I already had a burger. So I'm having another. I'm, I'm breaking my diet.

[Will Sommer]

And then they bring, the waiter brings like a milkshake over and RFK goes, I did not order that. You know, I, I, that's not mine.

[Sam Stein]

They have pre diabetes. He did not order that. It looks great. But then again, and this is in your newsletter, it's like there's something discordant about the Health and Human Services secretary during a measles outbreak. Like taking the time to like hang with Handy at a burger joint and talk about Fries.

[Will Sommer]

Well, and he says, you know, users thinking maybe, maybe he'll say something and by the way, get vaccinated or something. And then he goes, well, as long as we're talking about measles, actually that vaccine is pretty bad for you. And.

[Sam Stein]

Oh, no, I just, I, I laugh because it's so crazy and absurd. But I mean, it is stunt. It's like you said, it's, it's stunt capitalism. And in this case, it's not even just capitalism when sort of stunt governance. Right. It's like taking these moments and trying to make some sort of larger picture message out of it. And it's like the same thing with the Tesla show on the White House South Lawn. It's just sort of like all it is is to sort of create memes and draw attention.

[Will Sommer]

I think that's right. I mean, I mean, the comparison here is, you know, you would think the. If we're going to make America healthy again, are we going to vaccinate children? No.

[Sam Stein]

Right. Like a normal thing to do would go down to West Texas and get the vaccine. Right. Like that would. Right, you would. Or yeah, like, you know, or like be with someone who gets the vaccine to like use the cameras and the attention you can get for some larger public health good. Instead you're eating fries with Hannity.

[Will Sommer]

Yeah. And I mean, you know, I should also add that, you know, Steak and Shake is also kind of maggot up already. I mean, they run, they run right wing Maxim, so you know, the. Well, they maximum. Not the maximum of, of your. Of my youth.

[Sam Stein]

No, no, no, no. The difference. But first of all, they don't run. It's the company that can. That owns Steak.

[Will Sommer]

Yeah. It's the same owner. Yes.

[Sam Stein]

I just want to be clear. The. The restaurant itself is not owning the magazine. Yeah. Well, it's all very interesting and I guess Steak and Shake recognizes that the one way to relevance or at least for economic stability is to getting good with a political movement.

[Will Sommer]

And they've been posting a lot of bitcoin memes and Maha, you know, the whole thing.

[Sam Stein]

Buy your, buy your fries with the Trump meme coin, I guess. 10% off. All right, well, it's such a pleasure having you on here. I knew when we brought you on we would talk about weird shit. I didn't realize how quickly we would talk about weird shit. So thank you for doing this, thank you for your service and thank you for watching us.