Too Crazy for Kash Patel! New FBI Conspiracy Theory Blows Up

Summary

Podcast Summary: Bulwark Takes

Episode: Too Crazy for Kash Patel! New FBI Conspiracy Theory Blows Up
Date: September 28, 2025
Hosts: Sam Stein (The Bulwark), Will Sommer (False Flag newsletter)

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Episode Overview

This episode of "Bulwark Takes" dissects the latest right-wing conspiracy theory claiming the FBI was actively involved as agent provocateurs during the January 6th Capitol attack. The episode unpacks how these theories evolve, the key roles of media figures like John Solomon, the uneasy fact-check from Kash Patel, and Speaker Mike Johnson’s embrace—even as the fantasy is debunked by Trump’s own allies.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Rekindling of the FBI January 6th Conspiracy (00:30–02:03)

• Sam Stein and Will Sommer review the recent surge in right-wing media and political circles suggesting undercover FBI agents orchestrated violence on January 6th.
• Speaker Mike Johnson references supposed new information about "274 FBI agents" in the crowd, implying possible provocation or setup.
• Mike Johnson claims, "Did they spur on the crowd? Did they open the gates to allow them in? I don't know. These are questions, but they should be answered." — [01:10]

2. Origins and Evolution of the Theory (02:03–03:23)

• Will Sommer outlines that, almost immediately post-January 6th, Trump supporters sought alternative explanations, pinning responsibility on "agent provocateurs" like Ray Epps.
• The central narrative: plainclothes FBI "tricked Trump supporters into doing this."
• Will: "That was unfounded. And then there was just kind of this general idea… maybe doing the first punches or otherwise trying to trick Trump supporters." — [02:30]

3. John Solomon’s Role and Media Manipulation (03:03–04:41)

• John Solomon, a former mainstream journalist, publishes a story claiming newly disclosed documents prove that 270+ FBI agents were embedded in the January 6th crowd.
• Will highlights Solomon’s "sleight of hand" tactics: leading with explosive claims, quietly walking them back buried in the text.
  • Will Sommer: "He does this thing where he kind of… he does a sleight of hand… There’s a suggestion they’re agent provocateurs… but then Cash Patel has to come out and say, no, actually, these were FBI agents [for crowd control]." — [03:23]

4. Trump Amplifies, Kash Patel ‘Corrects’ the Record (04:43–06:12)

• Donald Trump seizes on Solomon’s story, attacking FBI Director Chris Wray and reviving threats to prosecute him.
• Kash Patel, closely tied to Trump, issues a statement clarifying these agents were tasked with "crowd control," not infiltration—carefully avoiding direct contradiction of Trump or explicit deployment of the "false flag" term.
  • Sam Stein: "Imagine being in Kash’s position… It must have been really difficult to figure out what the hell to do." — [05:19]

5. Cash Patel’s Pattern of Damage Control (06:12–07:15)

• Sommer notes this isn’t Patel’s first time mediating right-wing spin vs. factual record, referencing similar cases with FBI agents and the Epstein case.
  • Will Sommer: "I think we've seen Cash have to do this once or twice before… then he has to come out and say… this person is in good standing at the FBI." — [06:21]

6. Mike Johnson’s Spreading of Discredited Claims (07:15–08:39)

• The conversation shifts to Speaker Mike Johnson’s history; though not previously known as a "January 6th truther," he now entertains these baseless narratives on national TV.
• Stein and Sommer express concern about Johnson’s willingness to mislead, even when the facts have been publicly clarified by trusted Trump allies.
  • Sam: "And Mike Johnson couldn’t bring himself to just trust Cash Patel… It strikes me as really irresponsible." — [07:21]

7. John Solomon’s Reports Debunked by Their Own Sources (09:00–10:09)

• Sommer describes his amusement at finding "Easter eggs" in Solomon's stories: agent complaints supposedly about "wokeness" at the FBI were actually the opposite.
  • Will Sommer: "…as you might expect, it’s actually an agent saying, we were too pro, we’re too conservative. We were too trusting of Trump supporters. We didn’t think they would do this. So he’s completely twisted [the narrative]." — [09:50]
• Additionally, complaints cited as proof of bias actually reflect fringe views within the FBI itself.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Mike Johnson (paraphrased by Sam Stein):
  "There's new information… Apparently there were 274 FBI agents in the crowd on January 6th." — [01:10]
• Will Sommer:
  "He [Solomon] does this thing where… you say, oh, okay, so, like, this is about, you know, these people being… agent provocateurs or somehow we’re up to no good. But in fact, as you said, Cash Patel then has to come out and say, well, no, actually, these were FBI agents." — [03:23]
• Sam Stein:
  "Imagine being in Cash’s position… it must have been really difficult to figure out what the hell to do." — [05:19]
• Will Sommer (on FBI complaints):
  "…as you might expect, it’s actually an agent saying, we were too pro, we're too conservative. We were too trusting of Trump supporters." — [09:50]
• Sam Stein (on Johnson’s irresponsibility):
  "And Mike Johnson couldn't bring himself to just trust Kash Patel… it strikes me as really irresponsible." — [07:21]

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• 00:30 — Introduction to theory and Speaker Mike Johnson’s Fox News appearance
• 02:03 — Origins of claim: "agent provocateurs" and Ray Epps
• 03:03 — John Solomon’s article misrepresenting FBI documents
• 04:43 — Trump’s amplification & Kash Patel’s damage control
• 06:12 — Internal FBI perspectives & the pattern of Cash Patel’s corrections
• 07:15 — Examination of Mike Johnson’s role and media responsibility
• 09:00 — Will Sommer exposes John Solomon’s misleading reporting via original sources

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Recap and Tone

The episode delivers a sharp, critical rundown of how debunked conspiracies are recycled at the highest political levels—sometimes spiraling so far that even the most loyal Trump operatives (like Kash Patel) must rebuke them. Sam Stein and Will Sommer blend exasperation and humor, clearly frustrated by political irresponsibility but motivated to expose the mechanics of misinformation.

In summary: The hosts demonstrate how a fringe conspiracy rapidly mainstreamed into congressional talking points, despite being too far-fetched even for the likes of Kash Patel. They highlight the ongoing danger of unserious leaders fueling national distrust for partisan gain.

Transcript

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[Sam Stein]

Hey guys, me, Sam Stein back with Will Sommer, who is the author of the False Flag newsletter. Will, over the weekend there was a couple iterations of what is now sort of a fairly standard conspiracy theory on the right, which is that in fact, the FBI was involved in January 6th. They were part of the crowd. They're egging them on, ostensibly to set up some folks and to, you know, make Trump look bad. So I bring this up because today, this is Sunday. We're recording on Sunday. Speaker Mike Johnson was asked about this with Jake Tapper, and he said this.

[Mike Johnson]

Does the rule of law have to apply to people who stormed the Capitol on January 6th? Well, I'm glad you brought that up. There's new information over the last couple of days about that as well. Apparently there were 274 FBI agents in the crowd on January six. Oh, no, no. I think that Cash. But Cash Patel, Cash Patel just, just brought some enhancement, enhanced understanding to that. They were sent there to do crowd control because of everything that was going on. They were, it wasn't a false flag operation as President Trump suggested. Well, well, Jake, wait a minute. Hold on, Jake, how do you know that? Right. There's a lot going by what Cash Patel, brand new questions about. Well, and I'm telling you that there's videos and there's, it's always been disputed what involvement some of those persons, you know, engaged in, what involvement they had. Did they spur on the crowd? Did they open the gates to allow them in? I don't know. These are questions, but they should be answered.

[Sam Stein]

Look, there you have, you have the speaker of the House who's basically embracing this idea that the FBI may have in fact been undercover on January 6th. Can you explain? Let's start with the origins of this idea. And, and then let's get into the most recent back and forth which involves, I believe, John Solomon, Donald Trump, Kash Patel, and now Mike Johnson. But let's start with the origins of this theory that the FBI was involved somehow in January 6th. Sure.

[Will Sommer]

So pretty soon after January 6th happened, Trump supporters tried to come up with this idea that it was a. Somehow the mob there was sort of induced to do it by agent provocateurs. And so part of this was focused on people like Ray Epps, or they'd say, like a guy who's kind of whipping it up. They would say, oh, that guy. Maybe that guy's an FBI agent or something. That was, that was unfounded. And then there was just kind of this general idea that, you know, there were, there were plainclothes FBI who were, you know, maybe doing the first punches or otherwise trying to basically trick Trump supporters into doing this.

[Sam Stein]

John Solomon gets into the act this week with an article that says there's about 270/ FBI agents that now it's been disclosed that Chris Wray sent them in there. And in fact, it's, you know, presented as proof that this conspiracy, in fact was real. But it's not true. It's just a wild misrepresentation of the documentation of the doc, of the documents. Right.

[Will Sommer]

John Solomon is very interesting figure. He's, he's, he's, he's, he's a lot. He used to be kind of a mainstream media reporter. I think he was at the Post for a point. But since then, he's become, he's sort of a favorite. He's kind of like a quasi journalist at this point. And he sort of is, he gets a lot of scoops, I would say, handed to him by the Trump administration, national security side. And he's very interesting on one hand to follow because you can really see, like, what direction. Direction they're going. They kind of tip their hand about the comey charges to him. But so basically, in this case, there's been this question, and Republicans on the January 6th committee wanted to know long ago they would say, you know, how many FBI agents were undercover at January 6th. And so last week, he runs this story saying there were 274 FBI agents at January 6th. But he's sort of, he does this thing where he kind of slighthand. He does a sleight of hand and, you know, like, he'll, he'll like, kind of set something up. And I will say, as his former co worker at the Hill, like, you know, this is something I've followed for a long time. And so there were. He, he'll sort of like, make a claim up top, and then a couple paragraphs down, he'll say something and you say, oh, okay, so, like, this is about, you know, these people being. There's a suggestion that they're Agent Provocateurs or somehow we're up to no good. But in fact, as you said, Cash Patel then has to come out and say, well, no, actually, these were FBI agents.

[Sam Stein]

You're jumping ahead of things.

[Will Sommer]

Yeah.

[Sam Stein]

Because he writes this piece, and then Trump posts as one does on social media. My God, now it comes out and he's like, Chris Wray, shady character. And then he, of course, has to take a dig at Chris Christie for proposing that Chris Wray be the FBI director. And there's this whole promise that maybe Chris Wray is gonna be thrown into jail or under the bus or prosecuted like Comey. So Trump was the one who really gave it life.

[Will Sommer]

Yeah, this was really an explosive claim on the right last week when it came out. I mean, if you think about 274 FBI agents, the idea that these guys were undercover, someh whipping up the crowd, I mean, that would be a lot.

[Sam Stein]

It'd be crazy. And you would think that that would leak at any point between when it happened and now. You think someone might have been like, actually, yeah, like, here was a directive, or, you know, they were trying to, like, make Trump look bad. But obviously that's not the case. They're there for crowd control. So then we get into. And I don't feel bad for Cash, just. I just want to be clear. I don't feel bad for Cash, but he did have to put out a statement being like, actually, no, these people were there for crowd control. And his statement, notably did not ment Donald Trump, obviously, because he, Cash, cares about his career. But, like, imagine being the. Imagine being in Cash's position. It must have been really difficult to figure out what the hell to do.

[Will Sommer]

Yeah, I mean, he clearly had to say, you know, there's this misconception. People are going after the FBI. I'm not going to name those people. Or, you know, if it's the president. And so I think he had to then give a story to Fox News to kind of like, correct the record here.

[Sam Stein]

And they put out a tweet and it was the same thing. But what do you think the internal conversations were among FBI leadership around this? Like, yo, Cash, I got to do something.

[Will Sommer]

I think we've seen Cash have to do this once or twice before on a kind of a smaller scale when, like, someone in the right wing media will target, like, an FBI agent or something, and then he, Cash, realizes he really has, like, no actual reason to go after this person. So then he has to come out and say, you know, in fact, this person, you know, is in good standing at the FBI. And so obviously with Trump is on a much bigger scale. But, but I think there is this sense of like, you know, it's. I've got a. I can't risk just totally alienating all the agents.

[Sam Stein]

Yeah, I know. And he's. But he's, I guess the bigger scale he did, it was around Epstein where he went out there and was like, actually, no, there's nothing here. And then of course, that didn't go very well for him. So this brings us, I guess, back to Mike Johnson, which really kind of like, ticked me off a little bit. Although I guess I should have done a little bit more homework. He's like, Mike Johnson, as far as, you know, Is he like a January 6th truther? Is he like, has he, has he said stuff like this before?

[Will Sommer]

You know, as far as I know, I haven't seen him like, really be out there in terms of saying like, you know, it was a false flag operation or something like that.

[Sam Stein]

Okay, yeah. So here you have the guy who is the speaker of the House, whose members, I mean, we know that Mike Johnson was pushing, he was on the amicus brief pushing for Trump to overturn the election, you know, the election, things like that. But I'm not really familiar with him ever saying the actual riot that day was a false flag operation. But here you have him basically telling Jake Tapper after the FBI head Kash Patel says, no, these people are there for crowd control. Tell Jay Tapper, we don't know. We just don't know. And it's just so irresponsible to say something like that. Like, the guy who would know. And Cash Patel's not Chris Wray or James Comey. He is Trump's guy for sure. Like, has just said 12 hours ago, this is not. These were not plants. Right? Like, these people weren't there riling people up. And Mike Johnson couldn't bring himself to just trust Cash Patel. I mean, I don't know what the incentives are for him to do this shit, but it strikes me as really irresponsible. Maybe he hadn't seen Cash's statement, but I have to imagine he had.

[Will Sommer]

Well, you know, Mike Johnson, historically, I think he's developing this thing where he kind of like gets his own talking points or kind of comes up with them. I mean, you know, we think about when he said Trump was an FBI informant against Epstein.

[Sam Stein]

Oh, right. I don't know about that.

[Will Sommer]

He's just like missing some emails or what's going on, but he's kind of Getting out over his skis repeatedly here.

[Sam Stein]

I totally forgot about that. Yeah, maybe that's it. But, you know, it's like your members, your colleagues were there that day. Like, it was, you know, it wasn't a minor thing. And to, like, dabble with this shit, to flirt with these conspiracists is really bad. We expect that from Trump, but not from Mike Johnson, I guess. I don't know. Any other thoughts, Will?

[Will Sommer]

Well, if I could just share, like, kind of something that's amused me about this whole John Solomon aspect of it. But as I said, there's always, like, little Easter eg buried in his stories that basically often undermine them. And so in this case, he had. In this story, he also had a report from. It was like the FBI feedback report. How did we do on January 6th? And so he made it out to be like that. Everyone was like, oh, we're too woke. You know, this is why we missed it. And so then he published all the complaints. And so I was going through them, and there was one he said, because of our political bias, he said agents complained about wokeness and the specific phrase was political bias. We weren't prepared for January 6th. And I thought, I wonder and I look that up and. And as you might expect, it's actually an agent saying, we were too. We're too pro, we're too conservative. We were too trusting of Trump supporters. We didn't think they would do this. So he's completely twisted.

[Sam Stein]

He totally twisted it.

[Will Sommer]

And then I will say another one. He jumped on that that said, you know, the FBI is too anti conservative. This is why January6 happened. I read the full complaint, and it was an agent saying, like, you know, we didn't go after the stolen election of 2020, which he left out. You know, it might have exposed the agent as a bit of a crackpot.

[Sam Stein]

The idea of the FBI is just too woke is hilarious to me. All right, man. Well, there's so many good John Solomon stories. I feel like maybe that should be a False Flag newsletter one day.

[Will Sommer]

I'd be more than happy to.

[Sam Stein]

Okay, cool. Well, we'll wait for that one. Everyone subscribe to Will's False Flag newsletter. Everyone subscribe to our YouTube feed so you can get elevated content like this. Thanks for watching. We'll talk to you soon.

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