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- [00:00]
A
Hey guys, it's Lauren Egan here at the Bulwark. I have Oregon Attorney General Dan Rayfield here with me. We're going to talk a little bit about the situation going on in Portland today. Before I get started, I just want to read a truth social post that Donald Trump posted over the weekend. He wrote that he was directing Secretary of War Pete Hegseth to provide all necessary troops to protect war ravaged Portland and any of our ICE facilities under siege from attack by antifa and and other domestic terrorists. I'm also authorizing full force if necessary. Thank you for your attention to this matter. Okay, so Dan, let's just start with what does the situation look like in Portland right now? Are you seeing an increase in federal troops in the city?
- [00:47]
B
What do things look like not in the present moment? So it's a very early on in the process. This is before the US Military has arrived in Portugal, Portland. And the way to think about this for folks that are outside, right, you normally don't use the US Military on citizens. Right. There's certain things that you need to accomplish. The President has made and formed an opinion on social media and that's basically how he's deciding how to interact in this world, which is not the best basis to provide leadership to a country via social media. And you have, as you're thinking on the ground here in Oregon, a disagreement about what the reality is, what the President sees on social media and what we're actually living. And you're seeing that manifest itself on videos from members of Congress. You have videos from community leaders really kind of trying to tell the President, hey, this isn't the reality that you think it is. We've even had the Governor reach out and talk to the President trying to talk about that, but it's the early stages. They've sent a letter to the Governor saying, hey, will you please voluntarily mobilize the National Guard to help out. The Governor has responded, no. And the President in his letter says, if you do not federalize the National Guard, I'm going to do it for you. And that's kind of where we are right now.
- [02:05]
A
Is it similar to the situation that we saw in Los Angeles earlier, earlier this summer? Like, talk to me about kind of like some of the parallels between the two.
- [02:14]
B
Yeah, the exact same theories that they mobilized in Southern California is what's going on here in Oregon. We feel that the facts on the ground are even stronger than what you were seeing in California. We have what we call our Portland Police or Oregon State Police and a wonderful district Attorney in Multnomah county that is focused on keeping the community safe and has been doing that, incredibly successful. And so the facts on the ground are just vastly different. The theories with which the Trump administration would federalize the National Guard is the same that they used in California. And obviously, we provide an amicus brief in the case, led by Attorney General Rob Bonta, Governor Newsom, and they were successful in California. And if the Trump administration moves forward here in Oregon, we'll do the exact same thing.
- [03:05]
A
Talk to me about what it was like for you to see that tweet. He posted that on Saturday. You and I are speaking on Sunday, but, I mean, before we hit record, I was talking with one of your staffers who was like, look, we were just doing normal fall activities this weekend. Like, this is so divorced from reality of what people are actually experiencing in Portland right now. But, like, what was that initial reaction, sort of like, for you?
- [03:30]
B
But, you know, in this job, like, since the president has been inaugurated into office. Right. We always have to look at what he says on social media platforms and things like that. And he says a lot of things at press conferences. There's always some time where you look at it and say, is this lightning or is this thunder? Right. And you need to assess those facts before just immediately react. However, this is something mobilizing the US Military against citizens. He's talking about this before he was even in office. We were prepared on day one on the inauguration for this. We had done briefings. We've got legal pleadings. In fact, I had told our attorneys here at the Oregon Department of Justice, when this happens, when they start moving, I want to be in court within 12 hours to prevent it from occurring if we possibly can. So it was incredibly poignant that we saw that tweet coming, that we saw the actions that they were taking, and then that has ripple impacts. Right. There are attorneys at the Oregon Department of Justice, staff members of the Oregon Department of Justice, myself included, that we're canceling their weekend plans to make sure that we were ready on behalf of all Oregonians that should. And when this occurs, we're ready, and we can file a lawsuit to make sure that we can test these actions, because what's going on in Portland is not what the president thinks.
- [04:47]
A
So it's Sunday. Like, what. How do you think this is going to play out next week? What are sort of the next steps that Trump might take that you guys might take? What can we expect for the coming days?
- [04:58]
B
Well, we're prepared to file our lawsuit here in Oregon, should the President continue to move forward? I know that our governor has been trying to make sure that the facts as we know them, the reality that we have here in Oregon is at least being presented to the federal government. Whether they choose to listen, that's going to be an interesting question. Should they move forward, we will file a lawsuit and we will seek an immediate temporary restraining order, which for folks who aren't kind of steeped in legalese, that basically is an order from the court saying, hey, you got to pause, you got to stop, you can't move forward. If we receive a temporary restraining order, that gives us time to then seek a preliminary injunction, which is again an order that pauses the federal government's action, which temporarily puts them on hold until you can eventually get a ruling on the merits about whether the President has reached the threshold to be able to use the United States military. And again, for folks that are thinking about when are those conditions that you can use the United States military pretty common sense stuff, right? If there's a rebellion, if there is an insurrection, if for some reason the President can't effectuate the laws. So pretty pretty simple terms that Congress has given him authority to do so. None of those conditions have been met here in Oregon.
- [06:15]
A
Why do you think he is targeting Portland?
- [06:19]
B
You know, this is a president again that formulates his opinions and decisions more based upon what he sees on social media posts and what's going on. To me, if you really wanted to help public safety, because that's what this is all under the guys, hey, we'd to help you with public safety. If you really wanted to help with public safety, you know how you do that? You pick up the phone, you have a conversation and you know what? I know that cities and states across this country would love a collaborative relationship with the federal administration on how to solve our communities and our state's greatest challenges. This is not one of them. This is going to be the National Guard, US Military troops sitting on their butts in Portland doing nothing. And you know what we really need? We need other help. We need help with behavioral health services, with health care, you know, with victims of crime, money. So this is really the antithesis. And to me what it feels like is it's a political end just merely to get a social media contest so we can bombastically say, hey, I'm doing stuff, you know what? But if you're going to do stuff, do the right stuff, actually work with us and not against us. And frankly, these actions only serving to divide Americans when in fact there's so much that we could do to these comments would bring people together. So it is such a waste of effort purely for a political aim.
- [07:39]
A
Yeah. And to that point, I mean, we know that Trump kind of likes or wants to get a reaction out of people. That seems to be some of the motivation with this. Like he wants to recreate a made for TV sort of spectacle. Presumably he'd love nothing more than for antifa or whoever it is to come out and fight back and turn this into some violent situation. Have Oregon leaders, have you guys been reaching, reaching out to activist groups, to civil society, to sort of make sure everyone stays restrained and non violent? Because that's ultimately what happened in la. And it seems like Trump sort of just like got bored with the whole situation and moved on.
- [08:18]
B
Yeah. Leaders in Oregon have been incredibly consistent. We want people to exercise their freedom of speech. We want people, if they feel the need, that any issue in society is important. You should feel comfortable and protest. And that is a good thing to do. But you still got to follow the laws in the state. You got to follow the laws of our country. And there have been people who have crossed the lines. It's generally the minority of folks that have crossed the lines and done things that are against the laws. And when they do, we have a district attorney, we have the Portland Police Department, the Oregon State Police, that holds people accountable. And so we've had this unified message from our political leaders, elected officials and appointed leaders, hey, exercise your rights, exercise them lawfully. But if you don't, there is going to be accountability in that arena. And so far, again, if anybody has stepped above and beyond, it's been the minority of folks. I think a lot of the reports and things that you'll see during the day, I mean, you have religious organizations or nonprofits that are just monitoring the activities of what's going on at the ICE facility so that we can be better informed. There are certain circumstances, again, where someone might step over the line, break a law and under those circumstances are held accountable.
- [09:33]
A
Yeah. And you know, in his tweet he mentioned ice facilities. Obviously there was that horrific shooting at a Dallas ice facility last week. What has sort of been the protests around ice facilities in Portland and in the larger Oregon area. Like, talk to me about what that's kind of looked like over the past few weeks. Have there been any actual threats to ice facilities in Portland?
- [09:59]
B
Yeah, I think if you take the whole tone and tenor of what has gone on in Portland at the ice facility, you've seen a decrease in activity over since June, I think, is the appropriate time. I think you've had roughly a little bit more than 24 people that have been arrested and held accountable under the current laws as they're being enforced right now. I think what I have been told and kind of through what you gather, there's roughly 24 people, a couple dozen, maybe little bit more, a little bit less, that periodically are at that facility, Carrie, in that facility and say obviously not. These are things that we can capably and have capably handled with our local police and our state police.
- [10:45]
A
Portland has kind of become this, like shorthand in GOP circles among Republicans for like a Democratic governed city that is lawless and out of control. You mentioned that there's other things that Trump could be helping out with, like addressing the homeless crisis, things like that. What do you think Democratic leaders could be doing more of or doing a better job at to make sure they're not exposed to that kind of criticism from Republicans and from Trump?
- [11:13]
B
Well, I don't think there's anything you can do that's going to prevent President Trump from inciting rhetoric. That is his brand. That's what he does. And he looks for isolated incidents in an imperfect society to put a magnifying glass on to then make a political point and joust in a way that is not helpful in bringing our country together. So I think that is part of our reality. What we have to do as Democratic leaders is show a vision for what we want our communities to be. And we have to work at that vision and then be successful. Walk the walk. What I will tell you is that Portland, there's no state or city that is perfect. And we're all working to make sure that we're moving in a better direction. And I'm incredibly proud of our leaders in Portland, our legislature and our governor, and how we have really started moving our state in a good direction. Is it perfect? Absolutely not. But we're going to work towards that together in cooperation. Very different than what you're seeing at the federal government. What the president is doing, almost all the actions are divisive. You have a president that's leading through fear, not bringing people together. That's not what this country needs. And at the same time, they're yanking healthcare benefits, right? They're passing or not passing, but implementing. The president is implementing tariffs, which are a regressive tax. And then instead of actually helping and collaborating with states, you're dividing them and mobilizing the US Military against it. It's just very the antithesis of what you would want in a leader to move our country forward and to move our states forward.
- [12:46]
A
Attorney General Dan Rayfield, thank you for being here with us. Really appreciate it.
- [12:50]
B
Thank you.